Between the Mastin and magnus_orion argument, I find magnus_orion to be on the right side of things.
Nowhere in the rules does it mention that Shinigami lose or don’t lose the game if they lose their Death Note.Mastin Post 40 wrote:But, uh, [Shinigami] kinda lose if lynched. Lose their death notes, lose the game.
(magnus_orion points this out in Post 45)
(Mastin addresses this in Post 49 by quoting the rule mention, but omits bolding the part “if they possess one” which could suggest that not all Shinigami are initially in possession of a Death Note. Conversely, in Post 40 he also says that he does not have a Death Note to his knowledge, but know we know the assumption he makes that Shinigami all have Death Notes. He knows that he claimed Shinigami and if he thought all Shinigami would have to have Death Notes, as per his Post 49, therefore must believe that he claimed having a Death Note, yet denied that in Post 40)
(magnus_orion touches on this in regards to Mastin’s assumption in Post 51)
(Mastin poorly refutes in Post 56. Mastin mentions role fishing when the supposed role fishing in question is only intended to fish for an anti-town role or knowledge in helping find anti-town roles. If Mastin believes this to be bad role fishing, he is also doing worse by asking magnus_orion speculative questions about roles)
(magnus_orion correctly points out in Post 58 that his accusation of role fishing is a misrepresentation)
(Mastin uses a craplogic defense in Post 59. The only role we know to have information about the Shinigami are the Shinigami, anything else is speculation. Endless speculation is not good for the town as it creates confusion among the town players where people takes sides of arguments that have no bearing on alignment, only different points of logic that are argument players can easily make from any alignment.)
(Mastin, in Post 93, says that magnus_orion’s reactions are scummy. I find his reactions to make sense, be logical and fall in line with the town win condition. The quickness of changing opinions is directly relevant to the occurrences in the game. In the early stages of the game it is much easier for opinions to rapidly change. This can be explained by the theory of relativity in that each post at the beginning of a game makes up a relatively larger percentage of the total game than later in the day when a single post makes up a much smaller percentage of the total game. This makes it more likely for a few posts to cause a greater change of opinion in the first few pages of a game and is not an unusual circumstance.)
(Mastin jumps to conclusions in Post 105. Not knowing who are the scum is not at all the same thing as not having suspicions. Town doesn’t ever know for sure who the scum are, someone who does know isn’t town. Also there is a false assumption Mastin makes in Post 105 that having a Death Note is indicative of being scum, when it is clear that Shinigami can also be in possession of Death Notes and are not scum. In Post 117 you don’t seem so sure of yourself in the same way you criticize here.)
(magnus_orion in Post 106 responds by pointing out how responding on bit by bit leads to misinterpretations, which I find to be true, and especially true of Mastin as he asks questions that are answered in other parts of the posts his is snipping apart, ignores sections of the post when addressing other and splits up sentences that combine to form an idea when neither half represents that idea on its own.)
(Mastin Post 110, your “scum trap” isn’t ensnaring players who are scum, it is ensnaring players who don’t agree with you, which is not a scum tell. Players voting for you or disagreeing with you does not make them scum.)
(Mastin jumps to more conclusions in Post 112. Magus_orion never said he was afraid of being bandwagoned, nor did I even get that implication from magnus_orion’s post, but Mastin is sticking those words into his mouth. Mastin also jumps to the conclusion that “It’s safer” automatically implied the person saying it, when I the more logical deduction was that his trap is safer because it is less likely to catch town in it, making it safer that way as in less likely to hurt the town; again putting words into magnus_orion’s mouth.)
(Mastin, in Post 119, mentions ignoring a player to be a scum tell. I agree with this, but I think it is inaccurate in regards to Lamont_Cranston as he believes that you have claimed an anti town rle and I see no reason to ignore someone who claims not to be playing for the town as anything they say can’t be trusted and only leads to people second guessing themselves later.)
I read magnus_orion as pro-town as of this post.ZEEnon Post 55 wrote:magnus_orion is quite the scummy player, jumping on every vote quite rapidly.
What motivation would scum have to kill an unkillable player to remove a potential Death Note? Getting rid of all the Death Notes is the town win condition and I don’t know why scum would help us with the town win condition. If a player claims Shinigami, we should lynch them as that is the only way town can be sure to get rid of the potential Death Note.ortolan Post 78 wrote: or he gets killed by the mafier and we end up in quite a pickle don't we.
ZazieR begins making good points when she joins the game.ZazieR Post 143 wrote: At this moment, I say it has failed. Of the players who discussed it when I wasn't present, Magnus is the most town.
And I'd like to know why you didn't give any comments regarding Lamont's mod-kill question until Kai started discussing it.
(ZazieR points out a lot of Mastin’s hypocracies that I had been typing up, so I won’t bother to restate them unless Mastin ignores them or diverts in his response to them.)
-I’ve stopped writing comments as I continued reading, as trying to catch up all at once has burned me out slightly. I have read to the current post, but will have to go back soon with a clear mind to get a better idea about some of the more recent pages.