War in Heaven II - Spirit of Vengeance (Over!)

[populartajo]

I told people I had a test today and I would catch up after the test...it is likely I won't get anything up of substance until tomorrow because I won't be able to catch up. Stop threatening to kill me and just do it if you are going to. If you are I won't catch up. There is so much attitude in this game I really don't give a shit if I get killed or not.

This for example. Scum would provoke people like that?

Missed a question mark.

[populartajo]

Alright, I'll be willing to lay off of Juls(as I'm somewhat convinced, though I still wish she would at least defend herself a little better) if you can name another viable suspect right now that I can hurt.

We might start to heal people that shouldnt be in that list. Rage points are a potential problem right now.

[populartajo]

So, Juls is scum why?

I'll be delighted to explain it once more. I'll increase the level of detail.

In her first 12 posts, she starts off participating, but mostly IIoA, chiming in lightly on strategy, nothing deep. She quickly zeroes in on Xyl (who leans town in my book), and Kinetic (who leans firmly town in my book). She says nothing else on any other player. She's very stingy with her opinions and suspicions. She's not a carefree scum hunter, she's calculating each move to give herself out as little as possible.

In keeping with this strategy of not giving oneself away one iota, and meekly pushing non-cases against the wrong players, she switches gears in post #13 and she becomes ABR's zombie. This relieves her of any responsibility in her hurt choices, and completely obliterates any possible scumtell on her, that doesn't also taint ABR, and taint ABR to a greater extent than it does her.

So. If ABR is town, she made herself into ABR's Kuato (Total Recall movie reference), and intends for him to take the fall while she plays innocent follower. She may also try to avoid attracting ABR's attention in a negative way at the same time, so if ABR is town, she's hitting two birds with one stone. Maybe ABR is being Kuato'd by Juls, haha. I like that. It's a new verb.

If ABR is scum, then my theory is that they've had some tiff in the QT, and she decided to obey him under threat.

Regardless of ABR's alignment, she's scummy all the way. More so than ABR.

I understand this but all this behavior is also ext possible to come from a player that has no time.
Let her catch up and not treat her to hurt her. If she is scum, it would become too obvious. Trust me.

[populartajo]

Xyl, Kinetic, zwet and Firestarter should NOT be on this list.

Im thinking that Juls shouldnt be in this list also.

I'm thinking you don't want anyone lynched, hahahhaha.

LOL, you have no idea how many mislynches I have prevented.
Sometimes I get wrong, though but I have an outstanding good record.

[populartajo]

I understand this but all this behavior is also ext possible to come from a player that has no time.

No. I've seen plenty of players that are busy and post scantily. That's not what they do. They don't Kuato other players (I had to use it again ), and they express more opinions. They spend less time complaining about being persecuted.

As I said, let her catch up. Im not saying she is obv town. Im only saying that there is nothing that indicates obv scum behaviour. It will become obvious if she is scum when she catches up. Trust me.
For the record, I though Shinnen was scum. Im evaluating Techi right now and would like to hear him once he comes back in Sunday(!). WLC and q21 are next on my list. Im still disliking viqles for some reason.

[populartajo]

Intent to Heal: Kinetic

Do it please.

I will unless roflcopter actually lays out a convincing case in the next 3 hours.

i'd prefer you lay out a convincing case for why kinetic is town, because you're suddenly switching your modus operandi in this game and its really weird.

We shouldnt prove why someone is town. We should prove why someone is scum. Im with Xyl here.

[populartajo]

The problem with killing Rofl is how he's almost confirmed town at this point. I would love to kill him for his play but killing a nearly confirmed town power role would be amazingly difficult.

If I am to die and you learn nothing from my death, learn this:

ROFL IS NOT, AND NEVER WILL BE, CONFIRMED TOWN.

At BEST he has a 50% chance of being town and being scum.

Right now there is 4 total claimed seraphim, one who is dead and scum. There is debate, could there be two scum seraphim and two town seraphim, or is it 3 town seraphim and 1 scum seraphim?

There is no other choices. That means, WHILE THERE IS A CHANCE ANOTHER SCUM can be Seraphim, there is a CHANCE Rofl is scum. There are 2 possibilities available, and in one of the Rofl not only can, but most likely IS SCUM.

I'd also like to point out how late Rofl was on the Shinnen bandwagon... Mayhaps his was the bus?

LOOK at Rofl's place since Walt revealed as Seraphim. He's made a DRAMATIC change. He went from confirmed town, acting aloof, to a raging LUNATIC!

God -.-;;;;

Actually Shinnen was attacking him also. They could have coordinated but I dont find it that likely specially knowing how Shinnen attacked him.

[populartajo]

Let the Rabid dog run free of his chain then and kill you all.

You may as well use your scumhunting techniques to find obvscum target soon. Attacking rolf, that I think has small probs of being scum, is not the way to go.

[populartajo]

roflcopter, tell you what. I will not heal kinetic if you will promise that

you will not hurt anyone else until Kinetic is dead

.

I'm fine with you being a really slow vig, even if you're wrong. But you have to stick with it. And I am not going to help you.

that was my plan at this point

Rolf besides Seraphim, Kinetic and me, do you have another target in mind? Maybe we could all get a consensus before hurting each other.

[populartajo]

Let the Rabid dog run free of his chain then and kill you all.

You may as well use your scumhunting techniques to find obvscum target soon. Attacking rolf, that I think has small probs of being scum, is not the way to go.

If you haven't realized it yet I'm not caring anymore about this game. I've done everything I can and yet the town is still letting one player just kill me with no recourse, no case, and nothing.

So whatever you want.

If the town grows some balls I'll actually care again. Until then I've resigned the fact that it doesn't matter.

You are basically telling the town to go against someone the majority thinks is town. its not going to work.
It sucks to be attacked for no reason but you are not doing you any favor. If you are town, find another way to prove you are.

[populartajo]

I'd also like to point out how late Rofl was on the Shinnen bandwagon...

Mayhaps his was the bus?

Im not an English native speaker but am I wrong if I say that in this sentece Kinetic admits that there was a bus in the Shinnen wagon?

[populartajo]

I think the biggest question for Juls is why she thought ABR was the most protown player. Sure, he wasn't attracting much suspicion then... but most protown?

I thought they played in a game together before. Right?

[populartajo]

I'd also like to point out how late Rofl was on the Shinnen bandwagon...

Mayhaps his was the bus?

Im not an English native speaker but am I wrong if I say that in this sentece Kinetic admits that there was a bus in the Shinnen wagon?

Admits? That's a stretch. And its not something I can confirm or deny, I'd have to be scum to know the answer to that.

Merely an observation that if there was a bus (of which I am far from the first person to bring that up), it can certainly be concluded that Rofl was the one driving it.

Kay, I was only asking. It just seems that with "Mayhaps

his

was the bus?" you are saying that you know that there was a bus in the Shinnen lynch. Thing you would only certainly know if you were scum.

[populartajo]

Xyl...care to heal me back since I healed you?

I'm not getting as negative a vibe off of Kinetic as some of the rest of you but maybe just a firing off bad ideas vibe.

I get pretty good feelings from tajo and ABR. Although it is a bit disingenuous to call people lurkers so early tajo. For future reference, I have no access at work on M-F but occassionally get a lunch time post in here and there. I am pretty active on weekends.

Would they be too obvious so early?
Im still thinking that Juls liked ABR playstyle and choose him for afinity reasons.

[populartajo]

I'm just throwing this out there: I don't have anything concrete yet but I wonder if there's anyone willing to back me up on an ABR hurt.

Juls first, then either ABR or Rolf (depending on how Walt flips,

if

he flips). A town Walt makes Rofl more likely to be scum; I think a 2:2 Seraphim setup is safer to assume than a 3:1. Although the ABR/Juls hydra and Rofl have been acting in tandem lately, I consider Juls to be the scummiest. A pro-town Juls should have requested a replacement, rather than seeking an excuse to empower another player in the game.

For the purposes of hurt backing, I'd like to count ABR and Juls as a single entity. There's no independent thought coming from Juls; her backing is equivalent to ABR double-posting support.

I do not endorse hurts on Kinetic, Xyl, or Firestarter (pending his post).

Actually, Im thinking that 2-2 Seraphim is more possible than I thought.
Lets look at some numbers.
Scum could have, assuming max number 5:
2 Seraphs (scum with so-so PR)
2 Arels (scum with weak PR)
1 Cherub (goon)

[populartajo]

Actually, Im thinking that 2-2 Seraphim is more possible than I thought.
Lets look at some numbers.
Scum could have, assuming max number 5:
2 Seraphs (scum with so-so PR)
2 Arels (scum with weak PR)
1 Cherub (goon)

You missed the Ophen.

Anyways, this is why Walt's apparent trust of Nuwen/roflcopter didn't fit with his Seraph claim. Having four claimed Seraphs makes it much more likely that two of them are scum.

Im pondering how likely would there be an scum Ophan?
I dont think he trusting Nuwen/rolf is a negative point of his claim considering 3-1 Seraph is also likely.

[populartajo]

Im pondering how likely would there be an scum Ophan?

Pretty likely, even if it's not too useful.

I dont think he trusting Nuwen/rolf is a negative point of his claim considering 3-1 Seraph is also likely.

Here's my guess for what WaltWishbone was thinking would happen...

WaltWishbone: "We should trust roflcopter and Nuwen, they're confirmed because they claimed Seraph!"
Everyone: "Yes! roflcopter and Nuwen are confirmed town!"
WaltWishbone: "I am a Seraph too!"
Everyone: "Yes! WaltWishbone is confirmed town!"
WaltWishbone: "Yes! I am confirmed town! Everyone hurt Xyl for attacking a confirmed town!"
Everyone: "Hurt: Xyl!"

There wasnt a scum Ophan in the other game.
About Walt, I think its extremely possible he could OMGUS you and all his attackers as town since eveyrbody was attacking him for the weakest reasons ever.
You still think Walt is scum?

[populartajo]

most likely seraphim scenario is 3-1, if it were 2-2 i can't see nuwen claiming when shinnen-scum was the one who was clearly about to get lynched, as two seraphim in the scumgroup would almost certainly lead scum to conclude that there are at least two seraphim outside the scumgroup.

I don't follow.

i was the first seraph claim

shortly thereafter, shinnen claims seraph

we now know shinnen is scum. suppose there are two scum seraphs, one of whom is still unclaimed at the point when shinnen and i had claimed, for the sake of argument. the scum know they have two seraphs. the logical conclusion for the scum to make based on this is that there must be at least two town seraphs. so it would not be a good place for a second scum seraph to claim, because it won't make them seem confirmed, as there will be another seraph out there somewhere to claim as well.

this is why i think the timing of nuwen's claim argues strongly for nuwen town.

Well, nobody thinks that Nuwen is scum. I think that if a Seraphim has to be scum, it would be you.
3:1 against 2:2. The mini had 1-1 Seraphim distribution, just like in the Marathon game. But, 2 Seraphims maybe its too much, considering Flay thought he had to make scum less powered.
Blerg, I really dont know.

[populartajo]

for posterity, lets list some appeals that kinetic has been making recently

appeal to emotion
appeal to fear
appeal to authority

there's probably more fallacies going on, but those are the ones that really pop out

Speaking of fallacies, I really dislike your earlier misplaced burden of proof:

Intent to Heal: Kinetic

Do it please.

I will unless roflcopter actually lays out a convincing case in the next 3 hours.

i'd prefer you lay out a convincing case for why kinetic is town, because you're suddenly switching your modus operandi in this game and its really weird.

With this statement, you're attempting to hit two independent birds: Xyl's tactical shift from mathematically lynching to informed lynching, and Kinetic.

Hurt: Walt

-

Flavor containing the word BLADE, for God made Latin and saw it was not good.

I realize the most support for Walt's death has crumbled, but I still think his flip as a Seraph will help determine Rofl's alignment. If he turns up scum, I'll feel slightly more at ease with Rofl's erratic play. If he's town, as most people seem to now suspect, my next hurts are hitting Juls, then Rofl.

Did you just kill Wishbone?
/facepalm.

[populartajo]

see, suddenly all my faith in nuwen has evaporated, because she's now setting up lynches based on killing someone and them flipping town

I said the same thing earlier.

I'm just throwing this out there: I don't have anything concrete yet but I wonder if there's anyone willing to back me up on an ABR hurt.

Juls first, then either ABR or Rolf (depending on how Walt flips,

if

he flips). A town Walt makes Rofl more likely to be scum; I think a 2:2 Seraphim setup is safer to assume than a 3:1.

Yes, yes but Walt WAS SO FUCKING OBVIOUS TOWN.

[populartajo]

Did you just kill Wishbone?
/facepalm.

Absolutely. Given the choice between a probability game and using psychological reads, the former is much more appealing.

No, Walt was not obvtown. His claim came conveniently after a long series of "OMG SERAPH = TOWN" posts, he has completely tunneled Xyl and every piece of his contribution to his game has been in response to pressure in his direction -

zero

active scumhunting.

Dont you know to analyse people's reactions when they think they are dead?

[populartajo]

Hurt: Juls

HAMMER. SQUEAK!

You havent read what I think of her, have you?

[populartajo]

NEWS BRIEF

Poptartajo's scumdar is broken. The parts are back order until October 2014.

Actually so far in this game I have been right with Shinnen and Hoopla. I think Im right even before Walt's flip.

[populartajo]

I don't recommend healing Walt. We need to see his flip, and I'm proposing this as a new policy. Everything up to now would be exempt.

That said, when hurting, a person would have to provide a list of at least 5 players who would support the action beside the name, and if one objects, they'd heal the hurt done.

This way, we can have a stronger majority within the town, and regulate the loose cannons.

For example: *Using Vote is intentional. I can't hurt Juls yet*

Vote: Juls (Supported by A, B, C, D, and E)

If any objects, they'd heal, and the point would be moot. I find this a nice system to reinstate some order in this game, and to defactionalize the town.

DONT COPY MY IDEAS, YOU LURKER.
/Just kidding.

[populartajo]

THE VOTING SYSTEM NEEDS TO BE REVIVED TO BRING ORDER TO THIS CHAOS.
THE VOTING SYSTEM THINKS IN YOUR RIGHT TO LIVE IF YOU ARE NOT A FALLEN ANGLE.
THE VOTING SYSTEM CAN TAKE CARE OF THE FALLEN ANGELS. IT WOULD BE NOT AS FAST AS HURTING ANARCHY BUT IT WOULD BE ORDERED.
VOTE VOTING SYSTEM NAO.
GOGOGOGOGOGOGOGOGOGO.
YES WE CAN.

[populartajo]

THE VOTING SYSTEM NEEDS TO BE REVIVED TO BRING ORDER TO THIS CHAOS.
THE VOTING SYSTEM THINKS IN YOUR RIGHT TO LIVE IF YOU ARE NOT A FALLEN ANGLE.
THE VOTING SYSTEM CAN TAKE CARE OF THE FALLEN ANGELS. IT WOULD BE NOT AS FAST AS HURTING ANARCHY BUT IT WOULD BE ORDERED.
VOTE VOTING SYSTEM NAO.
GOGOGOGOGOGOGOGOGOGO.
YES WE CAN.

Bumping this in first post so everyone sees it.
YES WE CAN.

[populartajo]

THE VOTING SYSTEM NEEDS TO BE REVIVED TO BRING ORDER TO THIS CHAOS.
THE VOTING SYSTEM THINKS IN YOUR RIGHT TO LIVE IF YOU ARE NOT A FALLEN ANGLE.
THE VOTING SYSTEM CAN TAKE CARE OF THE FALLEN ANGELS. IT WOULD BE NOT AS FAST AS HURTING ANARCHY BUT IT WOULD BE ORDERED.
VOTE VOTING SYSTEM NAO.
GOGOGOGOGOGOGOGOGOGO.
YES WE CAN.

Put a sock in it and stop trying to disrupt scum-hunting with fifty-page-old discussion. A voting system would cripple the town with one guy playing catchup and another V/LA until next Sunday. Originally, the voting had equal merits and pitfalls to the buddy system. Pushing for it now is just retarded.

Just like hurting to death someone that was so painfully obvtown?
It was a joke. Relax.

[populartajo]

q21, what exactly makes you so comfortable with lynching a claimed Ophanim?

This.

[populartajo]

I'm an angry drinker.

Why when you are wrong all of you use the drink excuse?
Why did you hurt Wishbone when he was obv town?

[populartajo]

q21, what exactly makes you so comfortable with lynching a claimed Ophanim?

Doubt that all three claimed Ophanim are town and the fact that I feel you're the most likely to be scum.

You think there is a Scum Ophan in this game?

[populartajo]

Am I dead in this game?

I just want to know before I waste time reading it.

Juls, ask for a replacement. You are hurting your team, whichever it is. You are not playing to win.

[populartajo]

Please answer the question...am I dead? If I am not I will reread...if I am then I won't.

Yes you are dead.
Ask for a replacement.
You know you are hurting your team. Since I think you are town, you are hurting my team.
Please do it and play some Marathon Games.

[populartajo]

THE VOTING SYSTEM NEEDS TO BE REVIVED TO BRING ORDER TO THIS CHAOS.
THE VOTING SYSTEM THINKS IN YOUR RIGHT TO LIVE IF YOU ARE NOT A FALLEN ANGLE.
THE VOTING SYSTEM CAN TAKE CARE OF THE FALLEN ANGELS. IT WOULD BE NOT AS FAST AS HURTING ANARCHY BUT IT WOULD BE ORDERED.
VOTE VOTING SYSTEM NAO.
GOGOGOGOGOGOGOGOGOGO.
YES WE CAN.

So now hurting anarchy is bad again? After you've been completely unwilling to take action on people hurting without support because it was ok now we killed a scum? Man, my head hurts.

The Buddy System isn't being used. How can we enforce it?

Hurt Zwet or Kinetic. They're the ones who hurt without making a case or waiting for support. THE WHOLE BLOODY POINT OF THE BUDDY SYSTEM IS TO REQUIRE PEOPLE TO MAKE CASES AND CANVAS FOR SUPPORT BEFORE THE HURTING STARTS.

q21, what exactly makes you so comfortable with lynching a claimed Ophanim?

A claimed Ophan. Ophanim is the plural. But sure, why not? There are scum seraphim. There's likely a scum ophan.

That said, my middle of the road scum detector is starting to ping on Q21. I'm not going to call the hurt yet, because I need to re-assess, and there are other players i'm suspicious of... but i thought i'd point it out.

When did I think that damage anarchy is good?
Its just that why should I waste time when no one listens.
Catching SHinneN D1 its not a direct consequence of damage anarchy. It was just luck.

[populartajo]

Damnit Tajo do you not read? I won't be HURTING my team if I can catch up. I am doing that BEFORE I play any marathon games. Now will somebody just answer the damn question...am I dead in the eyes of the mod or not? Two games with you is enough to make someone pull all their damn hair out!

Lol, I always have this effect in women.
You are not dead, Juls but you'll need to be active all the time if you manage to survive. Since you work all the week and specially knowing that you want to play Marathon games. this weekend, well, I think you NEED A REPLACEMENT.
Its not about you. Its about the speed of the game. You dont have enough time for this.

[populartajo]

@Fons- I'll be instituting my policy on this game once we have a flip on Walt, and I can reevaluate my scum opinions. You can expect me to act on people who don't use the Buddy System or my system. Those in favor of my system should use it, those in favor of the Buddy System should always use it. It'll catch on faster.

@Juls- No, you're not. To the best of my recollection.

WE NEED ONLY A SYSTEM, DA.
You think Walt can come up scum?

[populartajo]

pop sure knows how to annoy the hell out of people. *dodges*

hypocrit

[populartajo]

I'm an angry drinker.

Why when you are wrong all of you use the drink excuse?

i dontk' think rofl and walt used drunkenness as an excuse, but rather an explananation. there's a divergence between excuse, which admits culpability in intent, and misguided or -illaffected action. the former is inherentlyu scummy and will appear so, because it's offfered as an explanation to remove suspicion rather than an extension of clarity. the

walt just started using archaic contractions of 'it is' and 'it was.'

i don't remember what rofl didn, but it didn't seem like slipdrunk wriggling. i'll use my backreading time machine to confirm.

LULZ.

[populartajo]

Im V/LA until tomorrow, maybe Monday.
I skimmed the last pages. Guys, if something is going to lose the game is THE FUCKING EGOS you all have. GET OVER IT.
Both Kin and ABR are town.
Xyl lost town points like shit. I need to reeavaluate him.

[populartajo]

Im back.
I plan to reread what I missed again but after a decent skim I think this is pretty obvious.

Hurt: WLC..

[populartajo]

I'm surprised and upset at Fonz's attempt at making me render my watch completely useless by claiming who I'm watching

MASSIVE MISREP. Never said anything of the sort.

Fonz, zwet is town.

[populartajo]

Also, I dont get this new system Fonz is proposing. Can you clarify?

Firestarter become obv town in the last pages. Seraphim is still town.

Xyl and rolf are starting to worry me. The rabbit is convincing in his "Xyl should be lurkerhunting if town". Again, Im a little biased since I feel Xyl is town but after MS3 I should think twice before peggin him so quick.

Now if there is a scum in Nuwen-rolf it would be pretty much the rabbit if it werent for Nuwen's killing of obvtown Walt.

Basically we should decide between one of them since 2-2 Seraphims is a probability we shouldnt discount and that I stupidly discarded earlier. Nuwen needs to come back asap.

[populartajo]

Rofl, what's your fucking problem? You can only vote one player at a time in a normal game.

but you can be vocally suspicious of multiple players. i believe in common parlance its called an "FoS".

Rabbit, you think Nuwen is scum?

[populartajo]

Rofl, what's your fucking problem? You can only vote one player at a time in a normal game.

but you can be vocally suspicious of multiple players. i believe in common parlance its called an "FoS".

Yes... but a hurt is stronger than a normal vote. So you need more backing than normal, not less. You can have a secondary suspect if you want, but you need to concentrate your fire on no1 (or rather, the most viable wagon you can bring yourself to support).

You know that votes would work awesome in this situation?

[populartajo]

No, it is to stop random damage and consolidate wagons. You don't have nukes because you want to use them.

You know that votes would work excelent in this siatuation. (consolidatign wagons)

[populartajo]

Rofl, what's your fucking problem? You can only vote one player at a time in a normal game.

but you can be vocally suspicious of multiple players. i believe in common parlance its called an "FoS".

Rabbit, you think Nuwen is scum?

most likely. between killing walt and setting up a string of lynches based on the fact that walt flipped town (something she set up BEFORE killing walt i might add) i would be very supportive of any momentum to see her dead. however, she has 12 hp, and i can't effectively kill her on my own without taking more than a week to do it.

SO why are you going with xyl and not with nuwen that has more probs of being scum from your POV?

[populartajo]

roflcopter: populartajo's L-1 idea was worse.

I HAVE TO FIND A WAY TO MAKE IT GOOD.
I would have left Walt in L-1.

[populartajo]

Same system it was from the start, except that a) mimimum number of people on a wagon is now three and not two and b) we've put together a dedicated squad to kill anyone dealing out what you call random damage.

Why do you have seraphim as town? His is the Shinnen hurt that looks most bus-like.

Gut. Answers to Rolf's accusations. It could change if both are scumbuddies, though.

[populartajo]

Rofl, what's your fucking problem? You can only vote one player at a time in a normal game.

but you can be vocally suspicious of multiple players. i believe in common parlance its called an "FoS".

Rabbit, you think Nuwen is scum?

most likely. between killing walt and setting up a string of lynches based on the fact that walt flipped town (something she set up BEFORE killing walt i might add) i would be very supportive of any momentum to see her dead. however, she has 12 hp, and i can't effectively kill her on my own without taking more than a week to do it.

SO why are you going with xyl and not with nuwen that has more probs of being scum from your POV?

did you miss the part where i said she has 12 hp and it would take me more than a week? because the unspoken second part of that is it will be quicker to kill xyl.

and nowhere there did i say she has a higher probability of being scum than xyl.

But does she have to be scum from your POV or do you think she still can be town?

[populartajo]

But votes, Tajo, require too much consensus and stall the game.

That is a big problem but we can fix it like a normal game. Deadlines. If we dont get a consensus, the player with more votes is dead.

I mean, the only objective of this strategy is to AVOID people hurting like shit. If you suspect someone, vote for him/her. SUpport your case and you'd likely get the support of any reasonable mind.

We can spot bussing and sincere scumhunting in this scenario.

We AVOID people hurting like horses.

[populartajo]

But does she have to be scum from your POV or do you think she still can be town?

when did you stop beating your wife?

she could be town. i don't think its likely. xyl could be town too. but if so, he should probably just go back to irc and stop trying to play forum mafia.

You are not answering the question. WHo has more probs of coming scum: Xyl or Nuwen?
HP bullshit is not the answer.

[populartajo]

Same system it was from the start, except that a) mimimum number of people on a wagon is now three and not two and b) we've put together a dedicated squad to kill anyone dealing out what you call random damage.

Why do you have seraphim as town? His is the Shinnen hurt that looks most bus-like.

Gut. Answers to Rolf's accusations. It could change if both are scumbuddies, though.

seraphim's answers to my accusations have been complete bullshit

No. It makes sense from a townie point of view.

[populartajo]

But does she have to be scum from your POV or do you think she still can be town?

when did you stop beating your wife?

she could be town. i don't think its likely. xyl could be town too. but if so, he should probably just go back to irc and stop trying to play forum mafia.

You are not answering the question. WHo has more probs of coming scum: Xyl or Nuwen?
HP bullshit is not the answer.

they're equally likely to be scum as i believe they are both scum. therefore the "hp bullshit" is the answer, because i can kill xylthixlm sooner, and that is why i am hurting him.

NO, FUCK.
WHO IS MORE SCUM: XYL OR NUWEN?

[populartajo]

When did you realize that Nuwen was scum?

[populartajo]

walt is pretty obviously town

most likely seraphim scenario is 3-1, if it were 2-2 i can't see nuwen claiming when shinnen-scum was the one who was clearly about to get lynched, as two seraphim in the scumgroup would almost certainly lead scum to conclude that there are at least two seraphim outside the scumgroup.

What do you think of this quote, after walt become obv town?

[populartajo]

most likely seraphim scenario is 3-1, if it were 2-2 i can't see nuwen claiming when shinnen-scum was the one who was clearly about to get lynched, as two seraphim in the scumgroup would almost certainly lead scum to conclude that there are at least two seraphim outside the scumgroup.

I don't follow.

i was the first seraph claim

shortly thereafter, shinnen claims seraph

we now know shinnen is scum. suppose there are two scum seraphs, one of whom is still unclaimed at the point when shinnen and i had claimed, for the sake of argument. the scum know they have two seraphs. the logical conclusion for the scum to make based on this is that there must be at least two town seraphs. so it would not be a good place for a second scum seraph to claim, because it won't make them seem confirmed, as there will be another seraph out there somewhere to claim as well.

this is why i think the timing of nuwen's claim argues strongly for nuwen town.

And this one.

[populartajo]

i missed that detail while i was deciding how likely a 3:1 vs 2:2 was, if i had seen you setting up my lynch ahead of time earlier i would have been a lot more uneasy

Maybe your all case against her is OMGUS?

[populartajo]

When did you realize that Nuwen was scum?

when i fucking said so after she killed walt and decided based on the fact that walt was town that both juls and i also had to die.

So, this is a lie or this post is still too old to bring it back?

[populartajo]

tajo, i don't even get what the fuck you're doing here, but its not helping anything

Ill give you a last chance.
Why do you think Nuwen is scum and when did you realize that?

[populartajo]

tajo, i don't even get what the fuck you're doing here, but its not helping anything

Ill give you a last chance.
Why do you think Nuwen is scum and when did you realize that?

ITS IN THE FUCKING THREAD ALREADY AS YOU JUST POINTED OUT.

No, no, say it one more time.
And chill. Nobody is yelling.

[populartajo]

But votes, Tajo, require too much consensus and stall the game.

That is a big problem but we can fix it like a normal game. Deadlines. If we dont get a consensus, the player with more votes is dead.

I've explained this problem. The only way this works is if you get reasonably close to a consensus, and convince those on the 'losing' wagons to stick to it. If you've got, say, 5-4-4, and a really badly divided town like this, it can't work.

Yeah, but you are giving an extreme example to prove that it would not work all the time.

Why dont we give it a try? Also, the last people dying were hurt not by the majority of the town . They were hurt by the people who supported their deaths (5-6), kinda like it would be with a winning wagon.

Look, my proposal can be modified. My only objective is to AVOID PEOPLE RANDOMLY HURTING. I know there can be town in these hurting but it also is giving scum the perfect cover to hurt with no order Rage points is a real threat now.

Your system hasnt worked that well with so much anarchy and possible scum leading hurts or hiding behind intents to hurts. The Shinnen lynch was not a product of the Fonz system, FYI. All the townie deaths prob are. Specially Kinetic.

[populartajo]

uh oh, you gave me ONE LAST CHANCE and i didn't do what you asked, what are you gonna do now?

Wrong answer. Im going to propose people hurting you. I have a bad feeling about you. and your sudden Nuwen is scum because she is attacking me (that is the logical option if you are a Town Seraphim and the other is a Scum Seraphim).
In the best scenario, we get rid of an antitown ass.

[populartajo]

Your system hasnt worked that well with so much anarchy and possible scum leading hurts or hiding behind intents to hurts. The Shinnen lynch was not a product of the Fonz system, FYI. All the townie deaths prob are. Specially Kinetic.

THat's completely untrue. I've explained how it was.

Kinetic died because people randomll hurted him, specially rolf. If he is scum, he is using the "intent to hurt" plan to kill him. If he is town, scum just used him to finish a player that only 3-4 thought he was scum.
The same happened with Waly and Xyl, with the exception of rage points.
You make the analogy.
Shinnen died becuase basically there had to be at least 1 scum between Rolf and SHinnen. Not for your plan.

[populartajo]

uh oh, you gave me ONE LAST CHANCE and i didn't do what you asked, what are you gonna do now?

Wrong answer. Im going to propose people hurting you. I have a bad feeling about you. and your sudden Nuwen is scum because she is attacking me (that is the logical option if you are a Town Seraphim and the other is a Scum Seraphim).
In the best scenario, we get rid of an antitown ass.

no, asshole, nuwen is not scum because she is attacking me, nuwen is scum because she lined up lynches based on somebody flipping

town

when she killed him.

and yeah, thats awesome, keep up the idea that killing me is ok even if i'm town, it really makes you look good.

Think whatever you want. You think there has to be scum between Nuwen and you. So your objective as town should be a)show why Nuwen is scum and start hurting her or b)sacrifice yourself so that town can lynch the fallen angel.
It should be c) hurting someone who has less probs of being scum.
For God's sake.

[populartajo]

*It shouldnt be c)hurting someone who has less probs of being scum.

[populartajo]

you're an idiot

Ad-hominem FTW.
Just think I catched one here.
And as I said, in the best scenario, we get rid of an anarchist.

[populartajo]

i can't wait til tomorrow when we get to find out if the retaliation team has the balls to actually go through with it

Are you referring to a plan of finishing off Xyl?

yes. tomorrow when my recharge is up, i'm hitting xyl again.

and again 36 hours later.

and again 36 hours after that.

until he'd dead

Fail. You are just trying the most of players you can before it becomes too obvious that one of you and Nuwen are scum.

[populartajo]

Kinetic died because there was RANDOM HURTING in him, specially cortesy of rolf.
Walt died in the same way.
This wouldnt have happened if we used voting instead of hurting like monkeys.

[populartajo]

Your system hasnt worked that well with so much anarchy and possible scum leading hurts or hiding behind intents to hurts. The Shinnen lynch was not a product of the Fonz system, FYI. All the townie deaths prob are. Specially Kinetic.

THat's completely untrue. I've explained how it was.

Kinetic died because people randomll hurted him, specially rolf.

Which you're trying to claim is due to the plan, when in fact it's in direct contravention of it.

Fonz, but what is preventing scum for not joining the plan and start hurting like monkeys?

[populartajo]

Which you're trying to claim is due to the plan, when in fact it's in direct contravention of it.

This is an answer to what?

[populartajo]

Fonz, but what is preventing scum for not joining the plan and start hurting like monkeys?

Tajo, but what is preventing scum from not voting and start hurting like monkeys?

Nothing but WE DONT HURT PEOPLE.
See the difference?

[populartajo]

Being clearer, we avoid people hurting like monkeys the person that is not in the winning wagon.
Which is that basically is happening right now. The damage is spreading like shit in a wall.

[populartajo]

No. I don't.

My point is that you're suggesting that the problem is caused by scum 'hurting like monkeys.'

My plan prohibits hurting like monkeys. So does yours. The action to prevent it would be the same- threat of hurt as a sanction.

Yeah.

In this example rolf is the monkey.

If scum, he is hiding behind the "Intent to hurt" plan to kill his targets. He only has to be convincing, find a scummy player and some people will join him.

If town, scum are using him to hit players.

If we had votes instead of hurts, rolf's monkey powers wouldnt be as devastating as they are, like they were with a player like Kinetic.

Tell me Fonz, what analysis can you get of Kinetic's death?

Would it have been better if we had more votes or "hurts" instead of numerous blades of monkey rolf and some prob lambs in the wagon?

[populartajo]

No. I don't.

My point is that you're suggesting that the problem is caused by scum 'hurting like monkeys.'

My plan prohibits hurting like monkeys. So does yours. The action to prevent it would be the same- threat of hurt as a sanction.

Your plan is a little late and I dont like it since it can be controlled by scum.

[populartajo]

Also, Fonz, why are we punishing people hurting like monkeys with more hurting?
Im not a hippie, but why shouldnt we solve the problem by avoiding it or finding a way to control it when its impossible to avoid?

[populartajo]

No. I don't.

My point is that you're suggesting that the problem is caused by scum 'hurting like monkeys.'

My plan prohibits hurting like monkeys. So does yours. The action to prevent it would be the same- threat of hurt as a sanction.

Yeah.

In this example rolf is the monkey.

If scum, he is hiding behind the "Intent to hurt" plan to kill his targets. He only has to be convincing, find a scummy player and some people will join him.

Again, this describes pretty much any wagon anywhere. Find someone who looks scummy and be convincing.

If town, scum are using him to hit players.

Tell me Fonz, what analysis can you get of Kinetic's death?

Would you rather the same thing happened, but took forever? THAT'S waht the Tajo plan means.

You are associating my plan with slow decisions. I talked about deadlines not much ago.

[populartajo]

The Kinetic wagon would have been more beneficial to town if it had been decided by a substantial amount of players and not only by rolf.
Basically what Im saying is that there is no NEED to hurt someone you think is scum. You could be wrong. Thats why voting fits the same objective with LESS PROBS disastrous scenarios like we have seen so far.
And in case voting gives us a wrong decision, we HAVE something to analyse. The wagon. Not only a rabbit that thinks he, if town, is so cool being a slow vig. Also we avoid different people being hurt, pretty much like we are right now.

[populartajo]

So this is my plan. Feel free to improve it.

PLAN
- No more hurtings. No more healing unless someone becomes obv town.
- We fakevote people we suspect. Feel free to generate a case in case you think its obvious that player is scum. You would likely get support to "lynch" your scummy player.
-Deadlines: 3-4 days.
-If a majority hasnt been reached, the player with the most votes is "deadline" hurt to death by EVERYONE. This isnt negotiable.

PROS
- We avoid people random hurting and spreading damage like shit.
- We get a decent read of every wagon. (people in the wagon, people off the wagon). Analysis of wagons is an excellent strategy for scum hunting.
- People dont have low HPs so that scum cant finish them with rage.
- You can vote whoever you want. If you want, you can vote maxim 3 times. You can also unvote in case anyone becomes less suspicious with no damage involved.


CONS
- Anything?

[populartajo]

Shorter deadline please? I feel 2 days is better.

Prob.
Who do you think is scum?

[populartajo]

Firestarter and zwetschenwasser have 4 damage each.

We need to heal these players.

[populartajo]

Right, just read up on the last 5 pages and it saddens me that there was no ABR hurt. If all I get is half-arsed verbal support and have to hurt him to death myself, I will, but it would be much better if everyone who suspects him (lots of people, IIRC) gets behind hurting him to death.

I don't like pops most recent attack on rofl. I don't, in general, agree with rolf's approach, but he offered the explanation that he thinks Xyl and Nuwen are equally scummy and he's picked on and is hurting them. That was a valid answer to most of the questions thrown at him in that period, yet pop refused to hear it.

Second tarnish on pop's reputation for this game.

WTF?
Listen.
There are big probs that one of rolf and Nuwen is scum. If rolf were town, he would think that Nuwen should be scum for

the previous reason

and not for OMGUS. Basically Im waiting for her approach to decide the most likely target. Rolf can still be town ass, though.
The most important thing is that he decided to go against someone that

can

be town: Xyl. Why not going for someone that has to be scum from your POV? Nuwen has too many HPs? WTF?
q21 why did you agree with my pacific strategy before and then you have joined the brutal forces of monkeysquad?
And finally do you agree with rolf hurting Xyl, basically implying that you think Xyl is scum?
................
Who hurt Firestarter with no basis at all? I think those should be the one healing him.

[populartajo]

Firestarter and zwetschenwasser have 4 damage each.

We need to heal these players.

If no-one agrees on firestarter, sure.

Zwet is scummy.

He is an Ophan and I really dont think scum have Ophans.
In case scum have Ophans, scum will have to kill them sooner or later since they can be dangerous.
We shouldnt hurt any of them.

[populartajo]

My brain stopped at post 830 something...

Currently I'm clearing Rolf, Tajo, Fonz.

I still hold my position that Xyl and DGB can be scum, although I am very unsure that they are buddies.

Man you are slow.

[populartajo]

By agrees, i mean seriously suspects right now.

Still disagreeing with the voting strategy?

[populartajo]

Dammit guys. How easy do you want to make it for scum?

These might well be my final words, but at the moment I think the scumgroup is among Seraphim, Firestarter, and Xyl. I'm not sure about ABR and The Fonz at the moment, but those would be next on my suspicion list.

Hurt: Seraphim.

Reasons pluz.

[populartajo]

hurt: xylthixlm

blade

STOP FOR GODS SAKE.

[populartajo]

Hurt: Weyounslastclone

Enforcement time!

Future Fonz: Dude, I'm you.

Me: You're me?

Future Fonz: Yeah, it's kinda complicated. But you gotta hurt WeyounsLastClone.

Me: OK wait. If you're really me, what hurt method am I thinking of?

BOTH: RIGHTEOUS FLAMING AXE OF FURY, DUDE!

Does Future Fonz know WLC alignment?

[populartajo]

By agrees, i mean seriously suspects right now.

Still disagreeing with the voting strategy?

[populartajo]

This question to present Fonz.

[populartajo]

Yes.

For starters, i need to know how you'll enforce it. I mean, you say you don't want to enforce not-hurting by hurting. Well, then you've got no effective sanction.

Kay, you are right. Sanction is death.
Anyhting else?

[populartajo]

Well, doesn't that commit me to killing Rofl for one violation? I don't think he's scum. If Nuwen's scum, killing Rofl could be catastrophic.

You still have the problem that if you set the deadlines short enough, then there's going to be nothing close to a consensus and you'll be mandating everyone to masshate on the basis of the votes of perhaps as few as four players.

Isnt this what "intent to hurt supported for four players" does?
Look, we have a problem here. People hurting like monkeys. We have to find a way to solve it and at the same time having a decent and relatively quick consensus on someone to kill. I can think in anything but fakevoting.

[populartajo]

I can think in anything but fakevoting.

We could have a 24 hour period where everyone voices the 3 players whose hurt they'd approve. We can act on it in the following time period.

Would that work, or is it too stupid to consider?

this is basically voting for 3 players
i approve.

[populartajo]

Actually, the fix for my vote system is to MAKE people vote and decide in a short amount of time. With 3 possible options, consensus can be achieved really fast.
DGB, you are a genious.

[populartajo]

Allowing people to vote multiple times makes them less attached to their votes, though.

3 votes maximum. Only a retarded townie player would find only 1 suspect in this game.

[populartajo]

i'll use all three of my votes on xylthixlm. there, look, i've reached the threshold and he's fair game to hurt. nya nya nya.

naughty naughty

Now I have to make up a new rule that your 3 approvals are on different players.

3 votes?

[populartajo]

i refuse to conform.

anyone who would like to can count me as supporting hurts on the following people, in whatever system you all end up deciding on after you stop wasting everyone's time arguing over systems instead of scum hunting -
xylthixlm, dgb, nuwen, seraphim, tajo

i am counting the following people has having supported my hurts on xyl: walt wishbone, juls and tenchi

/pain.

[populartajo]

HURT: WeyounsLastClone

Im not going to be around until about 10PM tomorrow evening (28 hours from now), I can then sanction a hurt on the latest offender due to the rulings we set up yesterday.

But Im going to use this hurt on who I suspected last time, and has plenty of support on. I do not want to let it waste.

Guys, why is so hard for you to grasp the concept of the 3 support rule??

Its fairly easy to understand.
It does not require a mass concensus, thus doe not waste as much time as a fake votecount.
It requires at least 3 players to support hurting.
And any factions containing scum will be easier to spot. Seriously, with rage points, this is the only method worth using.
I like the idea of a fake votecount, but as pointed out earlier to me, time does not allow this to be effective.

There are too many lurkers, too many people stalling, and scum are laughing up their sleeves.

Rofl, you've critisced this plan for the last 9 pages or so, and we now have Q21 and Tenchi poking their heads in to again change the current plan.

This is the real fuck up if you ask me, the real stalling on the game.

My advice is to get a fucking case together, present it, and if it is a good case, it will recieve more than just the 3 players needed.

So far, there are players only arguing about the system being used.
And NOT trying to build a case.
Its purely anti-town, no more and no less.

So again, for the ones wanting to ignore/stall/do anything but want to catch scum/build a case..

BUILD A FUCKING CASE!!!
The only restriction is you need 3 players in total for support.

This is not mutually exclusive with the fake votecount idea.

[populartajo]

I think hurting Rofl equally with the unsupported hurt he dishes out is the best deterrent.

not unsupported

two dead people?
yeah right

[populartajo]

Hehe. Well, i suspect basically everyone.

But making people stick their necks out for one particular lynch is much more informative.

Tajo, how about this. Once WLC, is dead, we give your system a try. Split phases. First two days, people vote for whoever. Third day, we require people to choose between the top two wagons (or the first and however many are tied for second, if there is such a tie). End of third day, masshurt.

heck, if we do this, there's even time to massheal Firestarter before we need to masshurt.

i can dig this, basically the bold part

[populartajo]

Look I don't give a flying fuck about your stupid systems. I'm going to kill Weyouns and then move on to Seraphim after I present my case on him. If you're not happy with that then you can try to kill me.

ABR, you realize that your position can easily be abused by scum?
Please, you are better than this, and I think you are town, so dont be fool.

[populartajo]

I think hurting Rofl equally with the unsupported hurt he dishes out is the best deterrent.

not unsupported

two dead people?
yeah right

yes, exactly, two people killed by scum, and in the case of walt, who died telling us we should kill xyl. good luck to town if they totally disregard anything said by the no longer living.

i wouldnt trust anything juls or walt said. Walt was blinded with OMGUS and Juls well, she had no idea of anything here.
Dont use necrophilia as a way to promote your lowers instics.

[populartajo]

So this is the plan. Feel free to improve it.

PLAN
- No more hurtings. No more healing unless someone becomes obv town or someone is hurt with no more support..
- We fakevote people we suspect. You HAVE to vote for at least one player, maximum 3. You cant vote twice for the same player.
- You can fakevote in the following format.

Hurt approval

Player 1
Player 2
Player 3

I will have a votecount when convenient.
- Feel free to generate a case in case you think its obvious that player is scum. You would likely get support to "lynch" your scummy player.
- Deadlines: 2 days.
-If a majority hasnt been reached by the end of deadline, the top 2 players with the most votes at "deadline" are voted again for the final lynch. You ALL have to vote for this. When this has been decided, the elected player will be hurt to death by EVERYONE. This isnt negotiable.


PROS
- We avoid people random hurting and spreading damage like shit.
- We get a decent read of every wagon. (people in the wagon, people off the wagon). Analysis of wagons is an excellent strategy for scum hunting.
- People dont have low HPs so that scum cant finish them with rage.
- You can vote whoever you want. If you want, you can vote maxim 3 times. You can also unvote in case anyone becomes less suspicious with no damage involved.

[populartajo]

SINCE WHEN BEING TOWN MEANS BEING RIGHT?
Rolf is not making sense at all. AT ALL.
Why do you think he is town?
He is throwing shit the fastest he can with no support at all.

[populartajo]

Towns in general are too fast to dismiss dead townies as idiots.

Walt was an idiot. Your point?

[populartajo]

SINCE WHEN BEING TOWN MEANS BEING RIGHT?

[populartajo]

Is it just me, or do we have something approaching a consensus on seraphim?

Please vote accordingly. I dont think Seraphim is scum but please play along the new rules.

[populartajo]

SINCE WHEN BEING TOWN MEANS BEING RIGHT?

SINCE WHEN DOES BEING DEAD MEAN BEING WRONG?

SINCE THE DEAD PLAYERS ARE NOT PRECISELY THE BEST SCUMHUNTERS IN THIS GAME.

[populartajo]

Thing is, Tajo, we've only really got you, me and DGB agreed to them. It doesn't matter how fast a system works if we have to argue for four days about it before it's even implemented.

I have support for many players that havent read the strategy yet.
I think it should be implemented before DAMAGE ANARCHY starts again.
Oh, you were against it, riight?

[populartajo]

SINCE WHEN BEING TOWN MEANS BEING RIGHT?

It means having no ulterior motive for what they're saying.

Yes, but it doesnt mean they are right. I would only reread anything if a player like you or Xyl, even rolf, were dead and came up town.
Not from Juls or Wishbone.
Come on.

[populartajo]

SINCE WHEN BEING TOWN MEANS BEING RIGHT?

SINCE WHEN DOES BEING DEAD MEAN BEING WRONG?

SINCE THE DEAD PLAYERS ARE NOT PRECISELY THE BEST SCUMHUNTERS IN THIS GAME.

CONGRATULATIONS, YOU JUST AD HOMMED THE DEAD TOWNIES.

YOU ARE ACCUSING ME OF AD HOMMINEM? YOU, ROLF? GO FUCK YOURSELF. YOU KNOW IM RIGHT. YOU SHOULD BE DEAD.

[populartajo]

Thing is, Tajo, we've only really got you, me and DGB agreed to them. It doesn't matter how fast a system works if we have to argue for four days about it before it's even implemented.

I have support for many players that havent read the strategy yet.
I think it should be implemented before DAMAGE ANARCHY starts again.
Oh, you were against it, riight?

Say what you like, but a group of four people who have the same top suspect masshurting him is not damage anarchy.

Please play accordingly to the rules.
If you have support of 4 people, then its likely Seraphim would be a leading wagon.
If we are not playing by the rules, then scum can easily do this and hide behind your support group.

[populartajo]

Tajo... given that you called Shinnen obvscum in retrospect, why did you not hurt her?

I tried to but it was too early.

[populartajo]

yes, tajo. what you did was actual ad hominem. you are discounting what they said based on a perceived aspect of their person (not good at mafia) instead of anything they actually wrote.

Why should I listen someone that I think was OMGUSing and why should I listen someone that WAS NOT READING THE THREAD.
They could hav decent points, but being town doesnt mean you are right.
The problem here is that using opinions of people and call it support when they are likely to change in a very changing game like mafia is FUCKING SCUMMY.

[populartajo]

as the only person here who has hurt on the hour literally every time i have been capable, i take offense to the accusation of stalling

From a general POV, yes, it is more stalling, because your current way of playing the game is the main hold up.

You've dismissed every plan devised so far, and in fairness, you've helped majorly in the assassination of 4 townies.

Yes, you've hurt, big deal...

That does not mean you aren't stalling the game.

Alot of players have argued the plans, but your the most consistent, and most non-compliant.

I stated it earlier, Order is towns friend.

the people who are stalling the game are the people who are doing things like: healing people i'm hurting, forming hit squads to hand out retribution instead of hunting scum, arguing endlessly over which plan to enact instead of hunting scum, and spending the last 50 pages slandering me until they feel they have enough support to start hurting me, which i'm surprised hasn't started happening yet.

I bet you are going to be in the most voted section in 48 hours.

Intent to hurt
rolf
q21
3rd to come

[populartajo]

Poptartajo is like a metropolis of towniness all by himself.

i was convinced when you did this in the first ten pages of the game, but no longer.

maybe you were convinced of that too when i wasnt attacking you, rabbit?

[populartajo]

Guys, dont miss the fact that there has to be a scum between rolf and Nuwen. We should take care of this today not when its too late.

[populartajo]

vote: xyl, dgb, nuwen, seraphim, tajo

whichever three of those five garners the most support in this silly new voting system are the ones my votes go on

please pick 3. i would randomize (accordingly) your vote decisions if you dont do it.

[populartajo]

Guys, dont miss the fact that there has to be a scum between rolf and Nuwen. We should take care of this today not when its too late.

NEWSFLASH - THERE DOES NOT IN FACT

HAVE

TO BE SCUM BETWEEN US. 3-1 IS AS REASONABLE A SETUP AS 2-2. USING THIS AS EVIDENCE TO GET ME KILLED IS BOGUS.

So Nuwen is scum WHY?

[populartajo]

vote: xyl, dgb, nuwen, seraphim, tajo

whichever three of those five garners the most support in this silly new voting system are the ones my votes go on

please pick 3. i would randomize (accordingly) your vote decisions if you dont do it.

no. you want to keep track of the votes, then when the votes are in you put me on the three people i listed who have the most votes otherwise.

no

[populartajo]

Who fucking made you returning officer, Tajo?

me, you want my job?
everybody wants order, im giving you order. somebody has to take the order angels squad.

*flies and shines*

[populartajo]

Guys, dont miss the fact that there has to be a scum between rolf and Nuwen. We should take care of this today not when its too late.

NEWSFLASH - THERE DOES NOT IN FACT

HAVE

TO BE SCUM BETWEEN US. 3-1 IS AS REASONABLE A SETUP AS 2-2. USING THIS AS EVIDENCE TO GET ME KILLED IS BOGUS.

So Nuwen is scum WHY?

Killed an obvtown player without any support?

why didnt she use rage instead of doing an obvious retarded play as scum?
i think that she had to prove the 2-2 idea. she only took a bad decision.

[populartajo]

So this is the plan. Feel free to improve it.

PLAN
- No more hurtings. No more healing unless someone becomes obv town or someone is hurt with no more support..
- We fakevote people we suspect. You HAVE to vote for at least one player, maximum 3. You cant vote twice for the same player.
- You can fakevote in the following format.

Hurt approval

Player 1
Player 2
Player 3

I will have a votecount when convenient.
- Feel free to generate a case in case you think its obvious that player is scum. You would likely get support to "lynch" your scummy player.
- Deadlines: 2 days.
-If a majority hasnt been reached by the end of deadline, the top 2 players with the most votes at "deadline" are voted again for the final lynch. You ALL have to vote for this. When this has been decided, the elected player will be hurt to death by EVERYONE. This isnt negotiable.


PROS
- We avoid people random hurting and spreading damage like shit.
- We get a decent read of every wagon. (people in the wagon, people off the wagon). Analysis of wagons is an excellent strategy for scum hunting.
- People dont have low HPs so that scum cant finish them with rage.
- You can vote whoever you want. If you want, you can vote maxim 3 times. You can also unvote in case anyone becomes less suspicious with no damage involved.

[populartajo]

Votecount

Albert B. Rampage 1 (DGB,
Firestarter
DrippingGoofball 1 (Tenchi,
Giuseppe
Nuwen 1 (Fire)
populartajo
q21 1 (Tajo,
roflcopter 1 (Tajo,
Seraphim 3 (Fire, ABR,DGB)
Tenchi
The Fonz
vIQleS
Xylthixlm 1 (Tenchi,
zwetschenwasser 1 (Fire)

Please everyone vote before deadline, 48 hours from now.

[populartajo]

i really, really disagree with anyone who thinks viqles is scum. just re-read shinnen's absolutely crap attacks against him and you'll see why.

I have an inkling that vIQles is scum... Im not sure yet however
I played the original, and he played this way, then.
After our next targets have been reduced to mere ashes, I will inspect vIQles further, and in particular, Shinnens attacks.

i feel the same way but viqles is prob also an ophan.

[populartajo]

Why do so many people think Seraphim is scum?

[populartajo]

Votecount

Albert B. Rampage 1 (DGB,
Firestarter
DrippingGoofball 1 (Tenchi,
Giuseppe
Nuwen 1 (Fire)
populartajo
q21 1 (Tajo,
roflcopter 1 (Tajo,
Seraphim 4 (Fire, ABR,DGB, Fonz)
Tenchi
The Fonz
vIQleS
Xylthixlm 1 (Tenchi,
zwetschenwasser 1 (Fire)

Not voting: Giuseppe, Nuwen, q21, rolf, viqles, Xyl, xwet

Please everyone vote before deadline, 48 hours from now.

[populartajo]

Uh, because he's really scummy?

yeah yeah, Juls was scummy, Walt was scummy. gimme something new.

[populartajo]

Shinnen was scummy.

she was obv scummy. gimme somethin new.

[populartajo]

Shinnen was scummy.

she was obv scummy. gimme somethin new.

and not only fonz, i want the voters to support their vote with an explanation

[populartajo]

Shinnen was scummy.

she was obv scummy. gimme somethin new.

and not only fonz, i want the voters to support their vote with an explanation

is this too much, fire?

[populartajo]

Votecount

Seraphim 5 (Fire, ABR,DGB, Fonz, Xyl)
Albert B. Rampage 4 (DGB, Xyl, viq, giuseppe)
roflcopter 3 (Tajo, viq, giuseppe)
Xylthixlm 2 (Tenchi, viq)
DrippingGoofball 1 (Tenchi)
Giuseppe 1 (Xyl)
Nuwen 1 (Fire)
q21 1 (Tajo)
zwetschenwasser 1 (Fire)
Firestarter
populartajo
Tenchi
The Fonz
vIQleS

Not voting: Nuwen, q21, rolf, zwet

Please everyone vote before deadline, 48 hours from now.

[populartajo]

Vote:
Giuseppe
Seraphim
Albert B. Rampage

geez what a turnaround you've made on seraphim

this is interesting. Xyl?

[populartajo]

I repeat

Firestarter and zwetschenwasser have 4 damage each.

We have to heal them.

[populartajo]

DGB, XYL, TAJO - STOP PUSSY FOOTING AROUND AND JUST START HURTING ME ALREADY, YOU'VE BEEN BUILDING UP TO IT FOR-FUCKING-EVER

SHUT UP.
WE HAVE RULES FOR SOME REASON, DUMBASS.

[populartajo]

Viq, I correct myself. I would be ext suspicious of any Ophan making it to endgame. Thats why we shouldnt be trying to kill them since its likely scum will take care of all of them before the pool becomes reduced and their powers become relevant.

[populartajo]

Votecount

Albert B. Rampage 5 (DGB, Xyl, viq, giuseppe, Seraph)
Seraphim 4 (Fire, DGB, Fonz, Xyl)
rolfcopter 4 (Tajo, viq, giuseppe, Seraph)
Xylthixlm 2 (Tenchi, viq)
DrippingGoofball 1 (Tenchi)
Giuseppe 1 (Xyl)
Nuwen 1 (Fire)
q21 1 (Tajo)
zwetschenwasser 1 (Fire)
Firestarter
populartajo
Tenchi
The Fonz
vIQleS

Not voting: ABR, Nuwen, q21, rolf, zwet

Please everyone vote before deadline, 48 hours from now.
_________________

[populartajo]

q21, zwet and tajo have been ignoring each other all game.

I cant speak for others but I havent ignored q21 and zwet. Zwet is prob an Ophan and you all know what I think about of them. Q21 is giving me bad feeling lately. In fact, Im waiiting him to answer some questions.
They probably have ignored many people since they havent posted as much as the average.
Get your facts right. This is the second time.

[populartajo]

Hmmm. Giuseppe is a good spot, actually. Not as good as Seraphim, though.

Im neutral about him.
Giuseppe, who do you think is town, who do you think is scum and who neutral?

[populartajo]

Interesting analysis. So I am scum for hurting townies?
Can you find the scum in the following wagons?
# Hoopla - Hurt by: Albert B. Rampage, roflcopter x2, WaltWishbone, Albert B. Rampage, WeyounsLastClone, Juls, Seraphim, Juls, WaltWishbone (9) Healed by: (0)
# Kinetic - Hurt by: roflcopter, roflcopter x2, Juls, roflcopter x2, Albert B. Rampage, ????? x3 (10) Healed by: Hoopla, DrippingGoofball, DrippingGoofball (1)

[populartajo]

i'll answer my own question then - they were all killed mostly by the scum:

# WaltWishbone - Hurt by:

DrippingGoofball

,

Xylthixlm, Nuwen, Xylthixlm

, WeyounsLastClone,

Nuwen x2

, zwetschenwasser, q21,

Seraphim

, vIQleS,

Xylthixlm

, zwetschenwasser,

Nuwen x2

(14) Healed by: vIQleS, Kinetic (2)

# Juls - Hurt by:

Xylthixlm

, zwetschenwasser, vIQleS,

DrippingGoofball

, Giuseppe,

Seraphim, DrippingGoofball, Xylthixlm

, zwetschenwasser, Giuseppe, Kinetic (10) Healed by: zwetschenwasser (1)

# WeyounsLastClone/Cybele (-1 HP) - Hurt by:

Xylthixlm, Seraphim

, Albert B. Rampage, Firestarter,

populartajo, Xylthixlm, Seraphim

, Albert B. Rampage, The Fonz, Firestarter (9) Healed by: q21 (1)

There is some merit in this analisys, regardless rabbit's closed mind. There has to be at least one scum in these wagons.

[populartajo]

Interesting analysis. So I am scum for hurting townies?
Can you find the scum in the following wagons?
# Hoopla - Hurt by: Albert B. Rampage, roflcopter x2, WaltWishbone, Albert B. Rampage, WeyounsLastClone, Juls,

Seraphim

, Juls, WaltWishbone (9) Healed by: (0)
# Kinetic - Hurt by: roflcopter, roflcopter x2, Juls, roflcopter x2, Albert B. Rampage,

????? x3

(10) Healed by: Hoopla, DrippingGoofball, DrippingGoofball (1)

you're scum for other reasons, you're highlighted on my list because you're scum

also yes i found the scum

explain why i am scum
kaythxbay

[populartajo]

Tajo. Of the four townies who were wagoned all the way to death (excepting Kinetic, who was finished by rage) Seraphim is on every one.

Yeah, Ii read him as town (Xyl's read on him also helped since they were both scum in MSIII) but this fact is damning.

[populartajo]

Interesting analysis. So I am scum for hurting townies?
Can you find the scum in the following wagons?
# Hoopla - Hurt by: Albert B. Rampage, roflcopter x2, WaltWishbone, Albert B. Rampage, WeyounsLastClone, Juls,

Seraphim

, Juls, WaltWishbone (9) Healed by: (0)
# Kinetic - Hurt by: roflcopter, roflcopter x2, Juls, roflcopter x2, Albert B. Rampage,

????? x3

(10) Healed by: Hoopla, DrippingGoofball, DrippingGoofball (1)

you're scum for other reasons, you're highlighted on my list because you're scum

also yes i found the scum

explain why i am scum
kaythxbay

not my style

maybe "other reasons" dont exist? or "other reasons" means OMGUS?
w/e rolf. Its pretty obvious that you started attacking me since I attacked you.

[populartajo]

Well, I do confess my activity is a bit under the level I would normally like it to be, but I see my job in this game as something a bit different than in a normal, smaller game. Not everyone can be a leader, not in a game this large. Right now, I'm thinking a lot more than I'm posting, so that my actions, although few, will allow the more active members to gain the benefit of my opinion which is unmarred by feelings gained in the game in the heat of the moment, and my reading of the game is done in a perspective of the past, so that I can detach myself from the game, and look at the facts objectively.

So, to respond to Tajo, here's my read on the game.

In no particular order within their subclasses...

Most Town

Tajo
Fons
Firestarter

Neutral

Xylthixlm
DrippingGoofball
Tenchi
q21
vIQleS
Nuwen
zwetschenwasser

Most Scum

ABR
Roflcoptor
Seraphim

Yes, I believe that's everyone. I tend to believe that those most adamantly for the latest system are those who are most pro-town, and that those who are raging against it are scummier. The exception is Seraphim, whose consistent hurting of Townies is too scummy to ignore. I think I'll be adopting him as my third vote for mass hurting.

Vote: Seraphim

Does that help, Tajo?

I like your list but do you think that Seraph and rolf are scum together?

[populartajo]

Tajo. Of the four townies who were wagoned all the way to death (excepting Kinetic, who was finished by rage) Seraphim is on every one.

Yeah, Ii read him as town (Xyl's read on him also helped since they were both scum in MSIII) but this fact is damning.

xyl's read has been a ridiculously stupid meta argument with blinders on

here, let me break it down for you: "seraphim is town because he's posting lots"

xyl town would draw his town conclusion based on content, not just the fact that he was posting every day

what convinced me was that xyl hunted for quotes trying to find Seraphim content. and he did it again when he was asked for that affirmation. He really couldnt see Seraph as town.

[populartajo]

*as scum.

[populartajo]

does anyone else notice the circle jerk going on between xyl, seraphim and tajo?

all game xyl and seraphim have been saying the other one is town based on meta from having been scum together, and now tajo is vehemently trying to stop me from hurting xyl while at the same time claiming seraphim is town based on xyl's read of him

im not preventing any hurts on xyl.
its just weird that xyl scum would protect someone as Seraphim.

[populartajo]

Guys.

Roflcopter is obvobvobvtown.

im not sure. i would really like to call him that but i just dont feel it.
where is nuwne?

[populartajo]

Votecount

Seraphim 6 (Fire, DGB, Fonz, Xyl, Giuseppe, zwet)
Albert B. Rampage 6 (DGB, Xyl, viq, giuseppe, Seraph, zwet)
rolfcopter 4 (Tajo, viq, giuseppe, Seraph)
Xylthixlm 3 (Tenchi, viq, zwet)
DrippingGoofball 1 (Tenchi)
Giuseppe 1 (Xyl)
Nuwen 1 (Fire)
q21 1 (Tajo)
zwetschenwasser 1 (Fire)
Firestarter
populartajo
Tenchi
The Fonz
vIQleS

Not voting: ABR, Nuwen, q21, rolf,

Please everyone vote before deadline, 48 hours from now.

[populartajo]

sweet justice more xyl support

Im free to think whatever the fuck i want.
haha

[populartajo]

Votecount

Albert B. Rampage 7 (DGB, Xyl, viq, giuseppe, Seraph, zwet, q21)
Seraphim 7 (Fire, DGB, Fonz, Xyl, Giuseppe, zwet, rolf)
rolfcopter 4 (Tajo, viq, giuseppe, Seraph)
Xylthixlm 4 (Tenchi, viq, zwet, rolf)
zwetschenwasser 2 (Fire, q21)
DrippingGoofball 1 (Tenchi)
Giuseppe 1 (Xyl)
Nuwen 1 (Fire)
q21 1 (Tajo)
populartajo 1 (rolf)
Firestarter
Tenchi
The Fonz
vIQleS

Not voting: ABR, Nuwen.

Please everyone vote before deadline, 36 hours from now.

[populartajo]

hopefully everyone is aware by now, but for the record i am finishing off xyl before i start on seraphim. i encourage everyone else to kill him in the meantime, that would be a much more economical use of the town's time.

NO, YOU PLAY BY THE RULES. IF YOU DONT PLAY BY THE RULES, FONZ AND FRIENDS WILL KILL YOUR SOUL.

[populartajo]

Actually, given that with only two not voting, there's no way anyone can catch ABR and Seraph, should we just start the runoff?

I would have liked both opinions but we can start with it.
Totally not seeing the case on ABR.

Vote: Seraphim.

[populartajo]

Rolf, what about if Seraph comes up town? Wll it cange your Xyl perspective?

[populartajo]

The anarchists are trying to play my game.
There is something wrong here.

[populartajo]

I'm actually terribly worried that the town will lose like the first game, which the town lost because they killed people who 'broke the rules' and opposed the voting system, rather than scum.

People who are dead are not dead beacuse they were agaisnt the voting systeme. Some or dead (and some close to) because of disorganized damage.
Now are you saying that you are scared of killing rolf?

[populartajo]

I'm actually terribly worried that the town will lose like the first game, which the town lost because they killed people who 'broke the rules' and opposed the voting system, rather than scum.

People who are dead are not dead beacuse they were agaisnt the voting systeme. Some or dead (and some close to) because of disorganized damage.
Now are you saying that you are scared of killing rolf?

I don't want to kill him, because he's obvtown.

I don't mean this game. Check out the last game, where the town lost not because of 'disorganized damage' but because the people doing it were town, and the rest of the town went along with the scum in killing them for it.

Shouldnt that be a reason to punish this kind of behaviors?

[populartajo]

Im going to get a lot of shit for this but Seraphim's last posts strike me as town about to die.

[populartajo]

The game was lost big part because of MM. The voting system there was a failure since it was a joke and badly implemented. Its not a reason why town lost.

Yeah, we could also agree that town lost because the town was divided in factions. There were players that liked an agressive stance and there were players that liked a pacific stance. Scum abused and used the agressive ones as a way to bring chaos to the game. Pacifics obv would go against anarchists.

What I am saying is that if we know that scum have an advantage with players playing Chuck Norris, why are we promoting and not punishing this behaviour? Even worse what is preventing scum to hide behind an agressive stance knowing this?

[populartajo]

Scum used and hid behind the pacific faction to eliminate the aggressive ones, who were town.

you are saying that being aggressive means being town?

[populartajo]

Scum used and hid behind the pacific faction to eliminate the aggressive ones, who were town.

there were a lot of things happening there but in the end we come to the same conclusion: aggression is not the way to go.

[populartajo]

Scum used and hid behind the pacific faction to eliminate the aggressive ones, who were town.

there were a lot of things happening there but in the end we come to the same conclusion: aggression is not the way to go.

if we know that scum can abuse this, why for god's sake are people still considering this a viable strategy?

[populartajo]

Im going to punch my nose if rolf turns out to be right.

[populartajo]

7 rage points. Seven.

[populartajo]

viqles is an odd choice. why now?

[populartajo]

Lynch votecount

Seraphim 3 (Tajo, rolf, Fonz)
ABR 0

Not voting (Albert B. Rampage, Firestarter, DrippingGoofball, ,Giuseppe ,Nuwen ,q21 ,Seraphim ,Tenchi ,Xylthixlm ,zwetschenwasser )

Please vote until 24 hours from now.

[/b]

[populartajo]

Lynch votecount

Seraphim 3 (Tajo, rolf, Fonz)
ABR 0

Not voting (Albert B. Rampage, Firestarter, DrippingGoofball, ,Giuseppe ,Nuwen ,q21 ,Seraphim ,Tenchi ,Xylthixlm ,zwetschenwasser )

Please vote until 24 hours from now.

[populartajo]

7 rage points. Seven.

What is this referring to, pop?

Viqles was with 1 hp low in the last Flay count. Ophans have 8 hps, therefore scum wasted 7 rage points in him.
This outweights my previous calculations.

[populartajo]

Ophans have 7 hps, see first page. So it took 6 points of rage damage.

Which is still more than the scum should have at this point.

Agreed.

Heal: Firestarter.

[populartajo]

Hey look, I recharged.

vote: Seraphim

hurt: Seraphim

hammer. SQUEAK!

Normally I would hate you for this but I dont think counterwagon on ABR can win this. I want everyone voting, though.

[populartajo]

WIFOM based on who was killed says that either Nuwen is scum, or the scum want us to think that Nuwen is scum.

Explain. Actually I dont think Nuwen is scum but Im waiting your explanation.

[populartajo]

To help you out. I really like Tajo. I subscribe to his voting system philosophy and I think he's Town.

I think Fonz and Rolf are town also, despite their disagreements with Tajo on theory.

SO WHY THE FUCK DID YOU HURT XYL?

[populartajo]

Should I say who probably didn't do it, in other words, reveal WHO I was watching?

Prob.

[populartajo]

If he's town, as most people seem to now suspect, my next hurts are hitting Juls, then Rofl.

That's because the Juls wagon was the one active and alive, and it would have been a waste of time to push for the lynch order's reversal? I

never

said that Walt's alignment reflected on Juls in any way.

Are you trying to avoid double lynch now? Twenty pages ago, you seemed willing to trade deaths. I still think a 1:1 exchange is good for the town. Did you not expect me to take you up on your bluff?

I think its time to deal about this. One of these players need to die. Dont know who yet.

[populartajo]

Lynch votecount

Seraphim 4 (Tajo, rolf, Fonz, Xyl,)
ABR 1 (q21)

Not voting (Albert B. Rampage, Firestarter, DrippingGoofball, ,Giuseppe ,Nuwen ,Seraphim ,Tenchi , )

Please vote until 12 hours from now

.

[populartajo]

Hmmm...

Pop, no reaction to my last post???

Opinion please...

Its possible. I really dont know what to make of this amount of rage so quick.
Besides this, I have a bad feeling about Tenchi and Giuseppe. It just feel they have been lurking and then went crazy after rage.

[populartajo]

Should I say who probably didn't do it, in other words, reveal WHO I was watching?

Prob.

[populartajo]

So right now there are some things bothering me. The player involved please answer.

1. Why did you vote ABR, q21?
2. Fonz, no more comments of the current situation?
3. Do you ALL think that we have to solve the Nuwen-Rolf situation? I think Tenchi is also a Seraph? Please confirm.
4. DGB, any reason why did they pick viqles and zwet over you?
5. Scum used rage in DGB and Nuwen. What are they trying to do?

[populartajo]

Your rage theory sounds like complete rubbish, but the players that were in the previous versions of this game will have far greater insight than me.

Revealing who I watched may clear that player to some extent, though perhaps not completely, depending on the RP mechanics. Again, players that were in the previous version of the game will better be able to make calculations and draw conclusions than me.

Say it.

[populartajo]

VOTE: Tenchi

Hmmm...

Pop, no reaction to my last post???

Opinion please...

Pop..?

No, no, only Seraphim or ABR.

[populartajo]

PLEASE VOTE ACCORDINGLY. PICK ONLY ONE OF SERAPHIM AND ABR.

[populartajo]

4. DGB, any reason why did they pick viqles and zwet over you?

Unless my memory fails, ViQles already had one hurt on him. The scum used 6. Maybe 6 is the maximum they can use at a time. Also, I was then using hurts/heals so they may have felt safe that I wasn't watching.

5. Scum used rage in DGB and Nuwen. What are they trying to do?

I can't back this up with hard data, but I think that the scum is trying to push me down into kill range. If I don't get heals, I'm next to die, this is certain. I have few HPs, and I'm dangerous.

Nuwen was at HP +1. Maybe they're taking him down a notch.

Yes, but why didnt they save it? They are trying something here.

[populartajo]

So this is our current list and a short opinion of each one.

Albert B. Rampage - fierce at the beginning, has lost steam since Shinnen lynch. Think he is prob town for playstyle but Im going to call him Neutral.

Firestarter - solid town player. Against chaos that is a sign of pacific town. Theorizes about the possible rage mechanic. Town.

DrippingGoofball - ophan. I really want to call her obv town but I cant. If you are town, girl, we need to break this game, please find some scum. Neutral, slightly town for being aparently the only Ophan left.

Giuseppe - lurker. Part of the hurt squad. Have a bad feeling about him. Needs to participate more. Neutral, slightly scummy.

Nuwen - seraphim. I really like Nuwen but rolf is a heavy player. Hammer on Walt is the breakpoint. I cant decide wether she or he should die first. Neutral. But has to die.

populartajo - *flies and shines*, fallen ones, you cant touch me!

q21 - had a town read from him at the beginning but it has vanished. if there is someone i need to reread is this player. semilurking. neutral, pendind reread.

roflcopter - seraphim. Totally hate the way rolf is playing the game. Agressive but polemic. Either scum are using him or he is scum hiding behind his agression. Neutral. But has to die.

Seraphim - blerg. Xyl pegging him as town and Xyl hunting for quotes to prove made me think these both players couldnt be scum. Seraphim's answer to rolf's agression sealed it for me. But Seraphim being in EVERY dead town wagon is damning. Not much reasoning after that and no reason to peg him as obv town. Neutral, slightly scummy. Should die.

Tenchi - lurker. Bad feeling about him. More bad feelings about him after all this Xyl argument. Supported the voting strategy but hurt Xyl, after rolf approved him. WTF? Prob scum.

The Fonz - different stance than mine but solid town. Finally convinced him after all the loyal angels death. Not much to say about him other than if he is scum, he deserves to win. Town.

Xylthixlm - Xyl was acting protown at the beginning of the game. After that he went downhill with weak cases against Walt and Juls. If there is a player Id never trust is him. Neutral. Prob related to Seraphim.

[populartajo]

Say it.

I watched Xyl (may or may not still be watching), whom I've been vocal in supporting, but suspected like mad, he's been a mega IIoA all game. So I hoped that he would feel confident that I wasn't watching him to make a move, and I was certain to catch him.

He is NOT on the last two cycles of scum hurts reported by Flay.

Cool. Heals plz kthxbai

Xyl why did you hurt Seraphim?

[populartajo]

Say it.

I watched Xyl (may or may not still be watching), whom I've been vocal in supporting, but suspected like mad, he's been a mega IIoA all game. So I hoped that he would feel confident that I wasn't watching him to make a move, and I was certain to catch him.

He is NOT on the last two cycles of scum hurts reported by Flay.

Cool. Heals plz kthxbai

Whatever outcome, we know DGB and Xyl are of the same alignment: they're either scum together or both town.

Prob. Since DGB is prob town due to the fact that she is the only Ophan left, and using the premise that scum used ALL their rage points, I think this clears also Xyl.
Which at the same time puts Tenchi in a bad position.

[populartajo]

PLEASE VOTE ACCORDINGLY. PICK ONLY ONE OF SERAPHIM AND ABR. ARE YOU BLIND?

[populartajo]

Lynch votecount

Seraphim 4 (Tajo, rolf, Fonz, Xyl,)
ABR 1 (q21)

Not voting (Albert B. Rampage, Firestarter, DrippingGoofball, ,Giuseppe ,Nuwen ,Seraphim ,Tenchi , )

Please vote until 12 hours from now

.

[populartajo]

Say it.

I watched Xyl (may or may not still be watching), whom I've been vocal in supporting, but suspected like mad, he's been a mega IIoA all game. So I hoped that he would feel confident that I wasn't watching him to make a move, and I was certain to catch him.

He is NOT on the last two cycles of scum hurts reported by Flay.

Cool. Heals plz kthxbai

Xyl why did you hurt Seraphim?

I don't like waiting when I'm fully recharged. He seemed to be leading the vote count.

You realize you likely need to die, right?

[populartajo]

I really should say "if the next person to die is town".

From my iPhone

Then why the hell are you not playing to prove you are town?

[populartajo]

Thoughts of Seraphim, q21?

[populartajo]

I am not a lurker. <3

If you are town, Im going to be pissed with you.
Answer the questions posed, please.

[populartajo]

Thoughts of Seraphim, q21?

He's one person who I won't complain if he gets lynched before ABR (the other is Tenchi should he prove to be a seraph).

His hurt on Shinnen looks like it could be a bus, especially when he seemed so confident that Shinnen was the fallen Seraph out of him and rolfcopter. His hurt on Drench/firestarter is also pretty damning. His attempt to qualify lurking into categories isn't good either.

Like ABR for scum more though.

Why ABR?

[populartajo]

You were lurking. And now, after the last round of rage, you're suddenly all up in Xyl's face.

Vote: TENCHI

Also,

Heal: DGB

Did you even check my case on him? And our discussion? Why attack me on being "against all ip in Xyl's face" and not tell me whats wrong with the merits of my case against him?

Its a terrible weak case.
ARE YOU A SERAPHIM?

[populartajo]

It's not your case that's the problem: it's the fact that you've suddenly out of the woodwork, all guns blazing against a single player after being passive the entire game AND after the latest round of rage. This bothers me A LOT.

Why did you heal DGB?

[populartajo]

All angels of the same type start with the same HP right? <3

FUCK ANSWER THE QUESTION.

[populartajo]

It's not your case that's the problem: it's the fact that you've suddenly out of the woodwork, all guns blazing against a single player after being passive the entire game AND after the latest round of rage. This bothers me A LOT.

Huh? When is participating and scum hunting bothering Townies? Would you ratherm me "lurk" like the last time?

You are ignoring me why?

[populartajo]

It's not your case that's the problem: it's the fact that you've suddenly out of the woodwork, all guns blazing against a single player after being passive the entire game AND after the latest round of rage. This bothers me A LOT.

Why did you heal DGB?

wants to look town and/or is dgb's scumpartner

i think its close enough to endgame for a dgb/xyl scumteam to try to pull off a fake ophan result gambit

Its probable but I dont think DGB would have given a result like that knowing that Xyl has to die before endgame.

[populartajo]

To help you out. I really like Tajo. I subscribe to his voting system philosophy and I think he's Town.

I think Fonz and Rolf are town also, despite their disagreements with Tajo on theory.

SO WHY THE FUCK DID YOU HURT XYL?

[populartajo]

Its probable but I dont think DGB would have given a result like that knowing that Xyl has to die before endgame.

Why do I have to die before endgame?

You are scummy?

[populartajo]

Its probable but I dont think DGB would have given a result like that knowing that Xyl has to die before endgame.

Why do I have to die before endgame?

You are scummy?

*shrug*

I'm curious what you think I should be doing differently.

Damage is done, Xyl. If town, scum will never kill you. If scum, you have already done the damage.
Maybe if you were scumhunting instead of just "being here", it would help. You are usually a lot more reasonable.

[populartajo]

To help you out. I really like Tajo. I subscribe to his voting system philosophy and I think he's Town.

I think Fonz and Rolf are town also, despite their disagreements with Tajo on theory.

SO WHY THE FUCK DID YOU HURT XYL?