Weird Dreams Mafia Redux [Finished]
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usesPython They/ThemMafia ScumThey/Them
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VOTE: Save The DragonsPlural | Nameless (They/He) and Alice (She/Her) and C (They/Them) and more-
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HURT: usesPython
HURT: Doctor Drew
HURT: Aureal
HURT: Enchant
HURT: MerlynPlural | Nameless (They/He) and Alice (She/Her) and C (They/Them) and more-
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Nightmare doesn't need to be full town when I can probably talk one of them into voting with me and trust Enchant to just hammer whateverIn post 13, DragonEater70 wrote:
That is a really weird statement. Care to explain how you got all these townreads?In post 11, usesPython wrote: HURT: usesPython
HURT: Doctor Drew
HURT: Aureal
HURT: Enchant
HURT: MerlynPlural | Nameless (They/He) and Alice (She/Her) and C (They/Them) and more-
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What's stopping us from adding every living person to the Nightmare every night other than me not wanting to type out everyones names?Plural | Nameless (They/He) and Alice (She/Her) and C (They/Them) and more-
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Fair enough, handing out an Innocent Child invention whichIn post 22, DragonEater70 wrote:
Probably nothing, but if I interpret the OP correctly we can only use vig with 5 players in the nightmare. Unless actually it's 5 minimum and we get more powers with more players? In which case vig is OP.In post 17, usesPython wrote: What's stopping us from adding every living person to the Nightmare every night other than me not wanting to type out everyones names?
with the Normal Invention is better than a Vig shot thoughAs an unmodified passive ability: The moderator will confirm your alignment.Plural | Nameless (They/He) and Alice (She/Her) and C (They/Them) and more-
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If you ask a scum mason if they're a scum mason they have to tell you, it's like the lawIn post 39, Save The Dragons wrote: my guess is it's a jokePlural | Nameless (They/He) and Alice (She/Her) and C (They/Them) and more-
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VOTE: WhemeStarPlural | Nameless (They/He) and Alice (She/Her) and C (They/Them) and more-
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You're too late, we already meched on why giving Innocent Child inventions with the Normal Invention is optimalIn post 46, Doctor Drew wrote:
This is a scum claim, I was town in the OG game.In post 12, DragonEater70 wrote: I was in the middle of pushing Doctor Drew when suddenly D1 was ended fue to scum powers, and then the game was compromised D2.
So now I finally get to VOTE: Doctor Drew
But you will be dealt with later.
VOTE: python
Kill them before someone brings up mech talk and maths.Plural | Nameless (They/He) and Alice (She/Her) and C (They/Them) and more-
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If it's given to non-town then it's not normal and would presumably fail/we get told it's not normal which would do the same thing as successfully giving it to scum? It depends on how the rule is interpreted actually when it comes to Town/Scum/SK exclusive rolesPlural | Nameless (They/He) and Alice (She/Her) and C (They/Them) and more-
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In post 53, usesPython wrote: If it's given to non-town then it's not normal and would presumably fail/we get told it's not normal which would do the same thing as successfully giving it to scum? It depends on how the rule is interpreted actually when it comes to Town/Scum/SK exclusive roles@mod can we get a ruling on handing out inventions that are normal only for specific alignments?Plural | Nameless (They/He) and Alice (She/Her) and C (They/Them) and more-
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Oh cool so Innocent Child invention is still optimal. We can also give a Cult Leader Enabler to someone scummy and kill them to stop recruitmentPlural | Nameless (They/He) and Alice (She/Her) and C (They/Them) and more-
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HEAL: prior proposal
HURT: everyone
I think handing out a Cult Leader Enabler to someone scummy n1 and limming them d2 is probably the optimal play and for that everyone needs to know who the Enabler is. There's likely Cult due to Cult rules being in the setup specific rules so stopping that'd be pretty good. After that just handing out IC inventions to turn the game nightless is probably best
That's not how IC works actually, IC mod confirms your alignment regardless of your alignment (so a scum IC is mod confirmed to be scum)In post 69, Ranger wrote:
It'd be best to clarify with the moderator if the role would function as advertised and only work if the player using it is town.In post 29, usesPython wrote:Fair enough, handing out an Innocent Child invention which
with the Normal Invention is better than a Vig shot thoughAs an unmodified passive ability: The moderator will confirm your alignment.
We don't want to operate under any false pretense of scum being unconfirmable only for the mod to announce the scum player as a town IC.
From the first iteration, Ibelievethe IC should work as town-only. It's best to confirm 100% though.
As an unmodified passive ability: The moderator will confirm your alignment.
If ICs are confirmed at the start of the game then an Activated IC invention would still work and would be even strongerIn post 120, Rautherdir wrote:
Once we have a dedicated town core then I believe trying to only put the town core into the Nightmare would be the best choice.In post 81, Ranger wrote: HEAL: prior proposal
HURT: Ranger, usesPython, Doctor Drew, Save The Dragons, Abnegation, Aureal, Merlyn, camelCasedSnivy, Titus, biancospino
But we don't have a dedicated town core yet.
And hear me out, but there's going to be something keeping us from just using the vig invention from the nightmare as a second elimination. Scum having a doctor or such, rendering it unusable in that case if scum are in the nightmare. (If perhaps semi-confirming the targeted player to be scum.)
Giving people IC sounds like a good proposal since even scum that knows about it can't fake that... unless it's ruled that in this game Normal ICs are only confirmed at game start as opposed to confirm on request as both of those variations are Normal-valid. In which case it's then useless. Let me do a look over the other bits and see what I can figure out though...
So with that in mind
@Korina: If there are multiple variations of a role that are normal valid, would we be able to choose which variation to give as an invention? And if not, which variation of IC would be given to a player if it is picked as an invention?
Having said all of that though.
HURT: Abnegation
Right now I think having everyone in the nightmare and just... a plan where it doesn't help scum to know what will happen from the nightmare is best.Plural | Nameless (They/He) and Alice (She/Her) and C (They/Them) and more-
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It'd be very odd to not have any Roleblocker/Ascetic/Rolestopper/Alien/Commuter/etc.In post 141, Radical Rat wrote: Loyal Fruit Vendor is only really better than an IC assuming that there are no blocking/interfering roles, which... would be very odd in role madness I think?
Bulletproof is considered a Modifier on the Normal page and a Passive Role on the Bulletproof page so best to get a ruling on that
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In post 146, Rautherdir wrote:
Kind of depends on if we can even specify variations of roles or not outside of adding modifiers.In post 143, Radical Rat wrote: Cult Leader Enabler is interesting, but I don't think it works unless we know the name of the cult leader role?An Enabler is linked to a specific role (such as Doctor), not types of role (such as protective); the Normal version of an Enabler is self-aware (and knows which role they enable). When the Enabler dies, all players lose the role that they are linked to, e.g. the death of a Doctor Enabler will cause every Doctor in the game (and every JOAT's Doctor ability) to become useless.
There is no requirement that the role being Enabled actually exists within the game.Plural | Nameless (They/He) and Alice (She/Her) and C (They/Them) and more-
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It's achievable but Activated IC/Bulletproof IC inventions are strongerIn post 150, Morning Tweet wrote: i see the nightmare changed..... my first reaction is "Add everyone, use the vigilante as a second elimination" -- let me know if that is not achievable, I didn't read it all
Not sure there's an advantage to excluding people really
If we're handing out IC inventions then it's theoretically optimal to exclude scum so they don't get shot but getting a correct towncore of 7 people's probably impossible so yeah better to just put in everyonePlural | Nameless (They/He) and Alice (She/Her) and C (They/Them) and more-
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How is CL-Enabler not a normal role? Enabler's considered a Normal roleIn post 157, biancospino wrote: p-e: CL-Enabler is clearly not a normal role, why are we even talking about itPlural | Nameless (They/He) and Alice (She/Her) and C (They/Them) and more-
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Look just because Implo wouldn't let us run it doesn't mean it's not Normal by the rulesIn post 161, biancospino wrote:
Do you really believe that if you designed a game with a [non-normal role]-Enabler Implo would let you run it as a normal?In post 158, usesPython wrote:
How is CL-Enabler not a normal role? Enabler's considered a Normal roleIn post 157, biancospino wrote: p-e: CL-Enabler is clearly not a normal role, why are we even talking about itPlural | Nameless (They/He) and Alice (She/Her) and C (They/Them) and more-
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Weird Dreams Mafia is a conspiracy by Implosion to make Normal-legal bastard roles so they get patched in the next set of Normal rulesPlural | Nameless (They/He) and Alice (She/Her) and C (They/Them) and more-
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JOAT is a modular role so would a JOAT (IC, Fruit Vendor) be legal?Plural | Nameless (They/He) and Alice (She/Her) and C (They/Them) and more-
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I'd see it as 1-shot JOAT giving you 1-shot of the JOAT action (so JOAT (IC, Fruit Vendor) can either IC and lose the Fruit Vending or Fruit Vend and lose the IC)
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Entire playerlistIn post 187, DragonEater70 wrote: I mainly didn't understand what you meant by this post. Are you nominating the entire playerlist? Or only people who posted? Or?Plural | Nameless (They/He) and Alice (She/Her) and C (They/Them) and more-
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Strictly worse than Activated IC since Cult cant recruit them until they use the IC and scum will still nightkill them. Just force the person to IC or get limmedIn post 189, Rautherdir wrote: Yeah. And I mean. We could even make it compulsive IC actually.Plural | Nameless (They/He) and Alice (She/Her) and C (They/Them) and more-
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Like yeah we got your compulsive IC right here, it's called VOTE:Plural | Nameless (They/He) and Alice (She/Her) and C (They/Them) and more-
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Hand out Activated IC's to people who'd still get limmed by ELo but aren't on the chopping block yet so that we get like 2-4 IC's going off at once?In post 203, Rautherdir wrote: I will say, keep in mind we probably (almost certainly) have a cult to deal with as well.Plural | Nameless (They/He) and Alice (She/Her) and C (They/Them) and more-
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No reason to specify the day instead of just having it be activated and telling everyone when to use the IC but yeah that'd probably be really strongIn post 212, Rautherdir wrote: Hmm.... day 4 ICs maybe?Plural | Nameless (They/He) and Alice (She/Her) and C (They/Them) and more-
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This is either Town or Cult
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Actually does Cult even matter when it comes to giving out IC's? Like even if they get Culted scum/third party is just gonna shoot them unless we only have one groupscum and no third partyPlural | Nameless (They/He) and Alice (She/Her) and C (They/Them) and more-
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Gonna wait until d3 before commenting more on this if Bulletproof is okay'd as a Modifier instead of a Passive RoleIn post 221, Radical Rat wrote: That's what the Bulletproof is forPlural | Nameless (They/He) and Alice (She/Her) and C (They/Them) and more-
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9 pages of figuring out how to give people Bulletproof Innocent Child inventions with the Normal Invention nightmare thingy. On the bright side the mech's pretty much overIn post 225, Flea The Magician wrote: Oh jeeze 9 pages.
I aint playing catchup.
Tldr da beef for me?Plural | Nameless (They/He) and Alice (She/Her) and C (They/Them) and more-
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If we're handing out Bulletproof IC inventions does it even matter if scum are in the Nightmare? Like even if we somehow got a full towncore in the nightmare either we give it to town in which case everyone knows what just happened or we give it to scum in which case everyone in the nightmare knows what happened and everyone outside it can pretty reasonably guess what happened when everyone who was in it decides they should all lim a specific person after there was a big hubbub about Bulletproof IC inventionsIn post 227, Kyoko Kirigiri wrote: I work more on mech later when i have more time and can be actually invested in game. I honestly think the invention talks must wait till night phase and be in the nightmare itself and for now everyone must just focus on nightmare team to be as close as it can be to all town to be voted regarding that mechPlural | Nameless (They/He) and Alice (She/Her) and C (They/Them) and more-
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The only situation I could see where it matters is asking people to claim their IC invention so that it's like it's 2-shot instead of 1-shot (since if non-town gets picked for the IC invention then they don't get told) if we're 100% confident on the nightmare being town, but that seems like it'd be pretty risky if we're not confident on who town is?Plural | Nameless (They/He) and Alice (She/Her) and C (They/Them) and more-
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Ah ok using it as a n1 hood makes sense
Put me in the hood I have mech stuff to talk about that I'd rather scum not seePlural | Nameless (They/He) and Alice (She/Her) and C (They/Them) and more-
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Worst case scenario 1-shot Activated Innocent Child is Normal legal and completely sensible. The Bulletproof part is rules-lawyering from it being considered a modifier on the Normal page but a passive role on the Bulletproof page, we're waiting on a ruling for itIn post 234, Kyoko Kirigiri wrote: game is bastard and there might be cults and other stuff so it matters who you targeting with ic (even more if it also has a bp)
the night discussions in nightmare can be really important - and not just for invention - there are many things in this game that might be an important topic to discuss in n1
also did mod confirm a bp IC is a valid invention or not? IC is like passive on its own and can be considered modifier.
Honestly I think this is something the nightmare group better discuss in private at night phase and check with mod instead of publicly discussing here what we intend to give away right now. Based on details that can come up in a nightmare topic they might change decisions.Plural | Nameless (They/He) and Alice (She/Her) and C (They/Them) and more-
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If we put someone in the nightmare and then lim them the same day I'm assuming they can't post/vote for actions in the nightmare?Plural | Nameless (They/He) and Alice (She/Her) and C (They/Them) and more-
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No, also you can't fake it with Reflexive Vigilante because Reflexive also isn't NormalIn post 241, Radical Rat wrote: ... Are PGOs Normal?Plural | Nameless (They/He) and Alice (She/Her) and C (They/Them) and more-
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What happens if we give a 99-shot Fruit Vendor Invention, do they get 1-shot or 99-shots?Plural | Nameless (They/He) and Alice (She/Her) and C (They/Them) and more-
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Disloyal Universal Backup that turns into a PGOIn post 245, Radical Rat wrote: Fair enough.
Had a brief vision of Disloyal PGO, which would be very spicy, and potentially change how I wanted to approach this whole thingPlural | Nameless (They/He) and Alice (She/Her) and C (They/Them) and more-
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Wait no this wouldn't workIn post 248, usesPython wrote:
Disloyal Universal Backup that turns into a PGOIn post 245, Radical Rat wrote: Fair enough.
Had a brief vision of Disloyal PGO, which would be very spicy, and potentially change how I wanted to approach this whole thingAs a passive ability with a modifier: You will inherit the role of the nth faction power role who dies OR faction power roles who die on day n, losing this ability in the process.Plural | Nameless (They/He) and Alice (She/Her) and C (They/Them) and more-
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VOTE: RautherdirPlural | Nameless (They/He) and Alice (She/Her) and C (They/Them) and more-
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VOTE: WhemeStarPlural | Nameless (They/He) and Alice (She/Her) and C (They/Them) and more-
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Serious Vote btw
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Not sarcasm, it's a legit vote
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Let's be real here, there's like 3-4 people who are interested in mech and the rest are just waiting for it to be over so they can start playing the gamePlural | Nameless (They/He) and Alice (She/Her) and C (They/Them) and more-
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Can we do something more interesting like wagoning Star?Plural | Nameless (They/He) and Alice (She/Her) and C (They/Them) and more-
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Can we just policy the next person to keep talking about mech today?Plural | Nameless (They/He) and Alice (She/Her) and C (They/Them) and more-
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I changed my mind, I want 7 townies in the Nightmare
HEAL: previous proposal
HURT: usesPython, Titus, DragonEater70, Radical Rat, Aureal, Kyoko Kirigiri, Abnegation
Abnegation I'm not sure about so that part's subject to change but the rest's in our townblock so good enough for nowPlural | Nameless (They/He) and Alice (She/Her) and C (They/Them) and more-
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We're still talking about mech?
VOTE: RautherdirPlural | Nameless (They/He) and Alice (She/Her) and C (They/Them) and more-
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Even C is better than C++In post 291, camelCasedSnivy wrote: i continued to vote python for their lack of meaningful contentand not using c++but at least they're anti-mech so
only other scumlean I have is bianco since they just voted me and started talking about mech
Also wdym no content? I know it's diluted from hyperposting but we've made our reads pretty clear and even bothered explaining some of themPlural | Nameless (They/He) and Alice (She/Her) and C (They/Them) and more-
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VOTE: WhemeStarPlural | Nameless (They/He) and Alice (She/Her) and C (They/Them) and more-
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We're pluralIn post 296, camelCasedSnivy wrote:
...who's we?In post 294, usesPython wrote: Also wdym no content? I know it's diluted from hyperposting but we've made our reads pretty clear and even bothered explaining some of them
also who else is scum/scumlean to you OTHER than wheme?
Also Rautherdir's a scumlean just less than Wheme, which hopefully should have been obvious given that we voted there before we even talked about policying anyonePlural | Nameless (They/He) and Alice (She/Her) and C (They/Them) and more-
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usesPython They/ThemMafia ScumThey/Them
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And also that's more scumreads than 50% of the playerlist when we were townhunting so idk why you uniquely expect so much from usPlural | Nameless (They/He) and Alice (She/Her) and C (They/Them) and more-
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usesPython They/ThemMafia ScumThey/Them
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Who do you think is town?In post 301, Rautherdir wrote:Yes because I'm realizing that putting everyone in the nightmare is potentially a bad idea/suboptimal to a severe degree, and giving the explanation as to why.
Plural | Nameless (They/He) and Alice (She/Her) and C (They/Them) and more-
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usesPython They/ThemMafia ScumThey/Them
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VOTE: RautherdirPlural | Nameless (They/He) and Alice (She/Her) and C (They/Them) and more-
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usesPython They/ThemMafia ScumThey/Them
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I mean we literally speedran the mech and came to the conclusion by like page 8 that we should give BP IC inventions if it's legal and Activated IC if it's not, any further mech talk is literally pointless and shouldn't have been going on for another 5 pages especially because like 75% of the playerlist is lurking because of it and I just want to play the damn gameIn post 320, Doctor Drew wrote:
I am not used to this python.In post 281, usesPython wrote: Can we just policy the next person to keep talking about mech today?
I like it, but not used to it.Plural | Nameless (They/He) and Alice (She/Her) and C (They/Them) and more-
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usesPython They/ThemMafia ScumThey/Them
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idk who said it feels like town!dragoneater from a previous game but I'll second the fact that this is just how he talksIn post 328, sheepsaysmeep wrote: ok I read the game
dragoneater70 - originally I found them the scummiest tonally. they felt very performative/LAMIST, such as with lots of literally saying "let's do something game-advancing now" (no one says that when doing something game-advancing now). but then someone said this felt like town!dragoneater from last game. and I sort of just believe that maybe that way of writing that I found scummy is playstyle. so now I no longer want to push it and it's a potential townread pending me one day skimming the game in questionPlural | Nameless (They/He) and Alice (She/Her) and C (They/Them) and more-
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usesPython They/ThemMafia ScumThey/Them
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Only reason I'm not sring snivy rn is cause I don't think scum go balls to the wall "highest poster has done nothing" and then "oh you have no reads" as a deliberate strategy cause it just destroys cred for 0 gain. Like I can see it being done thoughtlessly as either alignment but that's not a reason to drop an SR thereIn post 339, Doctor Drew wrote: I actually feel like Snivy is itchy trigger finger towny(my new term), ready to butt heads when someone calls them scummy.
I definitely have been there lol.Plural | Nameless (They/He) and Alice (She/Her) and C (They/Them) and more-
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usesPython They/ThemMafia ScumThey/Them
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Game's big enough that you'll burn yourself out trying to get a read on literally everyone, just try to sort like 3-7 people that you can reasonably sort and then sheep them on reads they've sorted if you think they're townIn post 360, KatyKimFanClub wrote: Haven't played a game with this many people before. I have some initial thoughts written out but hopefully I can make a list of reads (with a top 7) tomorrow.Plural | Nameless (They/He) and Alice (She/Her) and C (They/Them) and more-
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usesPython They/ThemMafia ScumThey/Them
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Should be 4. Rat, Python, Drew, AurealIn post 363, Abnegation wrote: how many votes does rauth wagon even have?Plural | Nameless (They/He) and Alice (She/Her) and C (They/Them) and more-
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usesPython They/ThemMafia ScumThey/Them
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Aureal being consistently on our wavelength with scumreads and the explanations for them makes me think she's townPlural | Nameless (They/He) and Alice (She/Her) and C (They/Them) and more-
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usesPython They/ThemMafia ScumThey/Them
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- Joined: January 28, 2023
- Pronoun: They/Them