Election! | GAME OVER

[Datisi]

DECLARE: SHERIFF

owo whats this

[Datisi]

DECLARE: SHERIFF

owo whats this

this is a lol scumclaim

k

DECLARE: SHERIFF

owo whats this

this is a lol scumclaim

k

[Datisi]

i will vote for whoever promises to vote for me :3

[Datisi]

I will check who datisi votes for.

interesting, why me?

[Datisi]

DECLARE SHERIFF

Datisi we are rivals now

nooooo how am i supposed to call you scum and campaign against you when your new avatar is so cute

[Datisi]

okay i have townleans on two (2) people based on very stupid reasoning

i go back to crying over didactics now see y'all later

#datisiforsheriff

[Datisi]

wait I just came up with a really cool plan for winning this game

Spoiler: Don't Click on this if You're Scum

Spoiler: lol made you look

1) Give Datisi Sheriff
2) Let Datisi fake innos on his teammates
3) Profit

i would literally never do this as scum

[Datisi]

I find it odd that that role is

relatively more useless to town

and yet the most popular

huh?

[Datisi]

I don't think a cop shot is that valuable, I think securing a town treasurer and probably mayor/council member is more important than town sheriff. Datisi I'm also curious to hear why that was your choice especially given HoD

i feel like your perception of that game is coloured based on the fact you ultimately ended up winning, and you don't notice just how much damage a scum cop did to that game. robbed you out of 2 results (which are essentially 2 straight flips) (or was it 3? i don't remember), blocked you from yeeting scum, almost won the game alone if dannflor hadn't lurked out.

even if such mechanics aren't in play here, a cop in town hands is essentially an extra free flip every cycle (unless they get killed ig). i was honest at the start of HoD when i said that i think it's a massive loss for town if the cop falls into scum hands.

[Datisi]

anyway enchant is probably scum this game

[Datisi]

scum treasurer is bad in theory, but in practice i don't think they can like, do much damage with the funding without scumclaiming in the process. so i'm not toooo worried about that.

[Datisi]

k

[Datisi]

cause my point is that you did all that damage and yet town still was able to bloc together and win

and my point is that a scum cop turned a game where all scum were being heavily suspected into a game that was almost mechanically autowin for scum.

Otherwise even a clear isn't going to be strictly confirmed info until the sheriff's alignment is resolved

but it *is* going to be strictly confirmed once the cop dies. which is an extra alignment revealed, aka an extra flip.

Don't you think your team in HoD would have done better if you were King and not Cop?

well, yes, because i would've made sure that the cop never fell into town hands.

anyway i'm bored of this discussion so i'd like to cut it short if you're not getting anything from it too.

got any pings yet?

[Datisi]

pooky's speech didn't call me scum once, i'm not voting for him

[Datisi]

Spoiler:

[Datisi]

I need more from GL first

do you have a read on pooky already

[Datisi]

i find guiltylion's current approach to ausuka... concerning?

98 is meh because i don't think ausuka was trying too hard w jokes, because she mentioned board of elections twice and in only one of those posts would i even consider that to be a "joke" (92) and i have had many more joke-y posts than ausuka has so i'm not sure what it is scummy about her jokes but not about my jokes.

114 gives me the vibe of trying to look smart in the early game but just not really succeeding. i also found it really weird to be asking so much about why someone would run for cop (not necessarily scummy in itself because the explanation for that is plausible), and i think there's obvious value in asking why someone is stuck on something seemingly unimportant or unproductive. so i do empathize with what she's asking.

sidenote, the new update not showing post numbers for quoted posts is REALLY fucking with me here >_>

[Datisi]

TOWNIEST BEAR TO EVER TOWN

you haven't tried to run me into the ground yet

are you aware i am town this game, pooky? :3

[Datisi]

i know you haven't tried to kill anyone yet but that hasn't stopped you before

since when has being nicer STOPPED ANYONE FROM TRYING TO KILL SCUM

[Datisi]

two questions is two too many about it imho

but - i'm not trying to say you're pushing the conversation in that direction, or that that's scummy. as i said in the post, i think your explanation for why you asked is *fine* and NAI and i don't care. my issue is you taking issue with ausuka's 97. because i think it's very reasonable that someone is trying to understand your thought process there by asking you about it.

[Datisi]

like specifically Datisi why did you phrase that as me being "stuck" on this cop point?? where do you think I was "stuck" on anything?

i know this is gonna be annoying to explain so i sighed with a bit too much force and my nose started bleeding again LMAO sorry i'm back

i phrased it as such because it seemed to me that ausuka is operating from that point of view. like, the way i see it is that you're asking about why we're trying to get cop when to her (and i think most other players) the answer is a very simple "cop good role". so the fact that you are not seeing it that way can potentially be seen as "stuck" on it, thus why i think her question is valid

[Datisi]

so something being reasonable means it's not scummy?

no, but rereading the post i see i used "reasonable" when i really meant "understandable from a town perspective" so yeah sure

[Datisi]

two questions is two too many about it imho

also frankly this is silly lol

the phase is literally centered around us declaring our candidacies for different positions. you think asking people why they chose to declare for a particular position is unproductive or hard to understand?

dude that's a brand new sentence, i didn't say that LMAO

i meant that askign questions like "wow cop is not that good, why y'all going for it, datisi you saw scum lost a game where scum got cop why do you care about getting it" when like. those things are like... very false from my pov so every question with that mindset is lole (not scummy! don't put words in my mouth)

[Datisi]

Datisi: *declares for cop*
Datisi: nobody is allowed to ask me why I did this

pls tell me this is a meme so i don't have to kill you for it

[Datisi]

maybe Datisi is town because if he was scum he wouldn't get nosebleeds

i've never gotten a nosebleed midgame when i was scum

i've gotten it once as town before

much to think about

[Datisi]

i mean we have like
treasurer that probably can't fuck up that much if held by scum without getting blasted for it
joats with mysterious info that are probably worse than cop
a tracker
a vote checker whatever the fuck

and a literal extra flip per cycle role, if in town hands

maybe i am a simpleton but it seems pretty clear to me

[Datisi]

i say this as i am putting my clown wig on: i *still* don't like guiltylion's approach to ausuka but 160 feels like a post scum-him would have at least some hesitance typing out and hitting submit on

pain and suffering

[Datisi]

yet it feels like you're interpreting my behavior as proactive instead of reactive

because that's how it feels to me? ausuka asks a question that seems to come from a town pov, your response is to try to suspect her over it by framing her question as unreasonable.

[Datisi]

Datsai

this is one i haven't heard before

[Datisi]

UNOwen is town for 222 tho

why

feeling like cakez is townie

i am rapidly losing interest in this phase when i cannot kill anyone yet

@sleepykrew, which people in this game are you familiar with mafia-wise

[Datisi]

This is the basis for my strongest read so far, Enchant town

what makes enchant specifically town for that

[Datisi]

if y'all have to use head gear to refer to me, at least call me beanie guy

i think that comment is very much not outside scum-enchant range and the read itself is garbage

how much experience do you have with scum-enchant, furtive?

[Datisi]

And like votes are great and all but we still have the threat of being able to kill people in the near future

logically i agree but without the threat of Possible Death it feels difficult

maybe it's just me

[Datisi]

how much history is there between bingle/guiltylion? more specifically, is there any history that would make sense for why bingle thinks guiltylion is this sorta mech genius as town or whatever?

[Datisi]

Don't worry Bingle, it's your internet skills that are failing not your memory.

owen, what do you think about guiltylion?

[Datisi]

(yeah I've played with some of the people here before but I'm assuming you're asking to see if I have meta reads on anyone. I don't and I won't)

no, i was wondering how much you knew about pooky and guiltylion... but i'mma keep it real, i forgot where i was planning to go with that

[Datisi]

i have a somewhat silly reason to townread bingle

which is annoying as it's irrelevant for this phase

anyway my gut instinct is that we should not be revealing who we vote for because giving info to scum, but also i'm not sure if they'll be unable to figure it out from people's reads so uh

[Datisi]

i have like 13k less than you wtf

[Datisi]

i think we should have consensus on who should win each role - if our votes are divided it makes it too easy for scum to just do hidden shenanigans

Except that this (scum doing hidden shenanigans) is something we should absolutely be encouraging.

can you explain the Optimal Strategy for the (not) hidden voting pls

if we all agree to vote the same way, there's literally no way the mafia can vote as a bloc to overthrow democracy

ya i'm thinking about that

the obvious drawback of this is that all the PRs are publicly known

[Datisi]

i was typing out a post saying how i am leaning to agree with pooky, but then i did realize one possible benefit of hidden voting

it feels like one of those situations with no clear best answer though

[Datisi]

i alrdy explained the read

i think your read makes sense if guiltylion is town because that read of his similarly felt TMIy to me

i don't see why town!GL's read there has to be correct though, unowen's question felt like a whatever question that's not town-indicative, and the fact that he didn't mention that when saying his read on GL rubs me the wrong way

[Datisi]

lmao i mistyped

if gl is scum, it makes sense

if gl is town, i don't think gl's read on unowen is necessarily correct because i don't think unowen's question was towny at all (in fact i think he didn't even intend what gl attributed to him there) and owen's awkward read on gl is pinging me

[Datisi]

i think datisi + ausuka + guiltylion + ????

aight bet

put me on council and we'll kill that list lol

is pooky townie to you? if so, why? if not... why this

[Datisi]

oh no, pooky is town

[Datisi]

but my joke made sense to her because she knew the context of the joke and the reason she knew the context is cuz datisi probly said in the scum PT "yo im gonna run for cop again cuz i'm a scumfuck and

it worked out so great last time

"

did we read the same game LMAO

i don't have a read on ausuka. she seemed fine in the back n forth with GL but i don't think she said anything that's out of range for her

[Datisi]

owen's awkward read on gl is pinging me

can you elaborate on this

your 403 is an enormous reach. my immediate thought was "TMI?", and if that kind of read were aimed at me, i would absolutely be grilling the person about it. unowen didn't have a reaction, and his read on you (424) is basically "lol idk he's fine i guess". which feels like scum seeing a townie with a bad townread on them and not wanting to challenge it.

i don't think the interaction is s/s because i don't think you make up such a convoluted townread on a buddy early game for no reason, so.

[Datisi]

anyway, with the consensus seeming to be outing votes (and by consensus i mean bingle) i will be figuring out my votes tomorrow morning. i'm prob gonna be around for some 20 minutes or so so if anyone has anything real-time to ask me now's the time

[Datisi]

@Datisi Enchant still scum to you, yes?

i saw he made some posts in the thread so maybe not. i'll look at him in a bit.

reads on meowth, Bloodb0t, SirCakez

idk, town, town?

Datisi I'm fine with calling the read a reach but it's not convoluted at all, UNOwen pressed Bingle on a read I thought was particularly suspicious and to me that demonstrated townie intent. Why do you refer to that as "convoluted"?

i feel like i'm back in croatian literature class in high school where the teacher is asking us to divine meaning from a work where i see no deeper meaning at all.

that is to say - i don't think you can determine intent from unowen from that singular post. maybe he thought bingle was suspicious for having that read, because bingle showed that scummy pattern. maybe he thought bingle was suspicious for that read for some other reason. maybe he just wanted to see a different perspective for his own read on dan. not to mention, "why is x town" is one of the easiest questions to ask as scum to appear like you're doing something.

so to take 222 and to conclude "i think bingle is prob scum because his townread on dan fits this specific pattern, and unowen asked one question about it that he hadn't even followed up on since bingle hasn't even responded, that must mean unowen noticed the exact same thing i did and therefore is likely town for it" is convoluted. and i think a townie on the receiving end of that read would notice that and react to it.

[Datisi]

i saw he made some posts in the thread so maybe not. i'll look at him in a bit.

i want to make it clear - "in a bit" means when the sun is out and i'm not on the verge of passing out. i.e. tomorrow.

[Datisi]

okay, time to pretend i know how to play mafia

the treasurer vote is kind of difficult because all of herta's iso feels like noise and lld is giving me both townie and scummy pings. i think the way she handled cakez was townie, and rereading that segment (while paying attention to timestamps) does make the read make sense and it feels like a townie observation. but something pings me weird about 571. maybe it's because i'm on that list, but uh. meanwhile, herta iso is just nothing.

i am slightly leaning towards voting lld, but i'm open to feedback here.

mayor, i'm voting for pooky. the way he treated me and ausuka feels very similar to how he usually treats me in mafia and sees literally everyone as my partner. his theory on me/ausuka is lmao but i don't feel like scum-pooky makes up something like that because it feels easy to get calle dout on. and i feel like? loudly pushing for the voting strategy is something that scum-pooky would be slightly less likely to do too.

absolutely not voting for unowen. i had an early mindmeld with dan in 104, as bloodbot was one of the two townleans i talked about at the time. and the rest of his content feels p townie, though this is probably partly due to his thoughts being similar to mine. meowth is a hair north of null for the argument with pooky about unowen, but this isn't really that strong (and scum-meowth would have a reason to push back against unowen townreads anyway) so i'm voting dan here.

i really think sircakez is town because i highly doubt scum-cakez enters this game screaming how he's the trash man or whatever. and besides, i'm not a huge fan of furtive this game, the read on enchant was highly premature (and possible tmi) and furtive ignored my later request to actually back the read up with meta so yeah idk. def voting cakez here.

[Datisi]

i still owe an updated read on enchant, so:

i don't know. he's definitely not lockscum anymore but i haven't yet seen the effort from him that i recognize as definitely town-enchant and i think he's not out of range currently.

ok I did Enchant and Unowen instead GOODNIGHT

why is unowen your second choice here

[Datisi]

How can I give a meta case on someone like Enchant? It's a read.

i didn't ask for a meta case, i asked for which games you played with him.

meowth is a hair north of null for the argument with pooky about unowen, but this isn't really that strong (and scum-meowth would have a reason to push back against unowen townreads anyway)

Why did you like it, even if not strongly?

because i agree with it and i think it's a pro-town thing to do there.

[Datisi]

@ausuka can i get the why on AD

[Datisi]

these are the people I am voting for:

Treasurer: Herta
Sherriff: Datisi
Council Member: actiondan
Trash Collector: sircakez
Board of Election: bloodb0t

can you sell me on why you're voting for herta

and why you're voting for me, considering your earlier comment

[Datisi]

iirc, it went from suspecting me to "has pinged me a few times but could be town ig" which didn't exactly strike me as A Townread

and also i don't know your thoughts on enchant

[Datisi]

@guiltylion

i think it would be helpful if this 1v1 between you and ausuka went on a break for a little bit. i can't say i townread ausuka, but i don't think this behaviour is impossible to come from town-her, and if she is town, this is not the way to find her i think, not right now.

i'll give a second look to your interaction w herta

[Datisi]

i'll give a second look to your interaction w herta

okay i did this and i found nothing there to townread herta on

Council Member: actiondan

booooooooooooo

PSA: this is scum who doesn't know how to react to guiltylion's vote switch

[Datisi]

okay i did this and i found nothing there to townread herta on

you don't think the doubling down in 663/664 is pure? I didn't detect any self-consciousness about being sussed. if they're scum they were smart enough to commit to the bit

not really. i think it's not exactly difficult for scum to double down at their own mech musings, because what else is there to do, really. if herta is a player with zero scumrange like pooky suggests, then i guess it's +town as they didn't just freeze, but /shrug

[Datisi]

anyway i am kinda thinking ausuka is town now lole

more specifically, 805 is a post that is very... representative of ausuka's personality, in a way that i don't remember her being in that large normal we played. like, when ausuka is scum, she knows she's bullshitting and i don't think she's very likely to shut down like this or fake it as a strategy. at least i don't remember seeing that in that game and i just ctrl+f'ed "sorry" in half her iso and i didn't find any instances of that. i think this is ausuka that's honestly like, self-doubting in a way that only town-her does

[Datisi]

herta doesnt post when he's scum lol

can i see an example for this

[Datisi]

i don't think you're trust-telling? i just think this sorta passivity / stepping down is a towntell for you idk

[Datisi]

-_-

[Datisi]

why do you see cakez as scum being contratian as opposed to townie with such reads, or even town being contratian

[Datisi]

i think dan has become one of my "i would be really sad if this person were scum" reads

[Datisi]

i think dan has become one of my "i would be really sad if this person were scum" reads

were we reading the same posts

i don't know, were we

871 is goodposting because i genuinely do not understand why anyone is townreading unowen or enchant, i'm actively scumreading unowen and furtive who is one of those pushing enchant but the case is "lol meta but i'm not linking anything lole" and it's a good observation. the only read of his that i'm meh on is the read on you, but i can understand it as my townread on you heavily relies on knowing your personality out of game

what is your issue with him

[Datisi]

My main issue with it is that all of his scumreads are really easy and he claims to be townreading literally everyone outside of that group which i find to be pretty implausible at this stage of the game. I also think the implication that this is literally the scumteam is pretty wild during the middle of d1. Is your reason for townreading it just that you don't townread unowen or enchant?

no, as i said i don't even agree with all of those reads. this kinda *overarching take* on the game is something that i see come from town much more often than scum. and it's a promise for later effort that he will have to deliver on if he's scum. and also like... those people are supported by pooky, who's being pretty loud about it. if dan is scum are those are townies he's trying to shut out, i don't get why'd he support pooky while also opposing his choices like this.

i think "i have some sort of townread on a lot of people" is a townie thought process because i go through it a lot in some early games

and i don't think his scumreads are easy. maybe scumread on your slot could be considered easy, but both enchant and unowen have been collectively town to arguably controversial, and i don't remember anyone scumreading sleepykrew. why do you consider these scumreads easy?

[Datisi]

To be precise, I don't think Datisi's strong TR of Dan is warranted

okay
what does that mean for my alignemnt
for dan's alignment
are you gonna actually do something with it or are you just throwing shade from the sidelines without engaging

[Datisi]

wait, the positions are public, i thought they were gonna be hidden x_x

anyway i ended up voting for lld, everything else was the same as i've said i will

i need to look into votes for furtive methinks

VOTE: unowen

[Datisi]

datisi's ballot choices d1:

t: lld
m: pooky
cm: dan
tc: cakez
boe: bot

@guiltylion, have you explained why you went from townreading unowen to voting dan for council?

[Datisi]

awesome

what do you think of the idea that unowen's reaction to that information was Scummy and Deserving Of A Vote

[Datisi]

i forgor to answer this

why would his reads as scum revolve around pooky that way

i'm assuming your thoughts are that he's scum pushing on town lhf players, right? it's like, if he's scum whose goal is to push (potentially try to yeet) those players, why does he townread the person that townreads them and is very loud (pooky) when that makes his like more difficult. it feels counterintuitive.

unowen is an "easy" scumread i guess, but it's not popular. i have seen very few people actually vocally say that they think unowen is scummy, and there are plenty people defending him like pooky or you or guiltylion and some voted for him.

the feeling i get is that your definition of "easy scumread" is "person who is easy to justify a scumread on", because like. SK or enchant (especially enchant, even barring the fact he won cop) don't feel very easy to push. ok maybe nobody does right now because 4 days of no actual votes, but i feel like a bunch of people telegraphed they're gonna vote enchant as sheriff so there's no way he gets to actually push them.

[Datisi]

yeah

why

[Datisi]

ok I did Enchant and Unowen instead GOODNIGHT

hi can you respond why you voted for these

[Datisi]

bc i'm thinking about my read on you and your reaction to the election is part of that

okay

what are you thinking about

[Datisi]

Datisi you are exactly correct about my definition of easy scumread? I think even if you think the way you described, the average scum player is trying to play in a way that allows them to get by without making any obvious mistakes or red flags because in most cases if you do this town will kill townies for you and trying to control the town is more difficult than trying to evade the force of nature that is the mind of a townie

bleh, maybe. the way i see it though, i'm not sure if dan's intention was to get by and let townies kill each other without him raising suspicion, that he'd be efforting this much? if that makes any sense

idk i could be wrong and i'm not married to this read, but if he is scum i really don't think i'll see it right now

[Datisi]

bean guy tmi 2 scummy-town imo (dan/frog), or at least the theory is

why are my townreads on them TMI, as opposed to town making those reads, or even theatre?

here he's just kind of taking it easy and stuff and its >??? to me.

i'm trying to not stress about mafia anymore.

i did find the enchant townread weird.

my impression is that enchant is a polarised player and this leans to his town meta

can anyone be more specific than this? can you give an example post from this game that wouldn't come from enchant scum?

im not trying to be difficult, im open to the read, i just genuinely don't understand having not played with enchant before as far as i can remember

i could do this as i remember a few of his towngames where he got locktowned really easily, but i have a gut feeling we shouldn't be talking about this right now. if he's town, we should probably make scum decide whether to kill him or not without showing them what kinda behaviour from him will get him townread.

[Datisi]

i think 979 is really townie for meowth. it calls out furtive's disonance with his enchant read, where he's both calling him town and claiming he's gotten good at reading them, but also like. (still!!) refusing to make a case or even just link games, and claiming others are overreacting for questioning him about it and asking for an update.

[Datisi]

Datisi

why am i scum to you?

[Datisi]

Could someone clue me in on the hotd sheriff thing?

viewtopic.php?t=90102

kind of similar mechanics, except this was a monarchy instead of a democracy

i was scum that game, tried my best to get assigned the cop, got assigned the cop, almost single handedly put the game into an autowin position for scum (we were in unknown-to-town mylo like 3 days early or smt but then one scum lurked out and got yeeted and we all died), had a mental breakdown and took a hiatus from playing mafia

[Datisi]

Datisi

why am i scum to you?

It is partly trying to become Cop again - I feel like psychologically as town this game you'd want to get away from the HotD experience

are there any... other parts, or are you shoving me into your scumreads solely because of a failed attempt to psychonanalyze me

@bloodbot you got any scumgames on this site? can you link them?

[Datisi]

For reference, how long of a site break did the game cause?

i exited that game on december 17th. on january 10th, i played in a white flag game under a public alt for like a week, but then i repped out due to both still feeling too burned out to play, and the uni exam season. hadn't played since until this game.

why does it matter'

[Datisi]

just to spite you

[Datisi]

i love your new sig, ausuka

[Datisi]

help im being buddied

Spoiler:

[Datisi]

I'm not so sure on Datisi anymore

hi

do you mind talking through your thought process about your read on my slot throughout this game, because as it stands i do not understand it (yes you talked about HoD but you said it was only partly and why the change of heart now)

[Datisi]

i like unowen for 222

bingle seems okay?

why (the unowen part)

[Datisi]

(:

[Datisi]

having played some with both gl and std, their posts there seem pretty null to me...?

why did you end up voting for me for sheriff, lld?

[Datisi]

meh, fair enough.

did you ever have a read on me? i ask because you agreed to help pooky kill me if you made the elections or wtv

[Datisi]

to... get others to do what you want?

[Datisi]

ah ok nvm Bingle I see you meant UNOwen's 956

Meowth vote pivot is generally appealing I may do that if I decide STD is townie enough for me to move my vote

tldr/link on meowth? i've generally liked the slot so far

[Datisi]

In essence I say shit, whether I mean it or not, to solve the game.

okay

did you get any reads from saying that (not trying to be snarky here)

and if you actually wanted me to be sheriff, why didn't you say anything prior to the election

[Datisi]

this is my main thing, I don't see the town mindset to post 1042, dismissing another player's wagon like that unless you are actively townreading the wagonee

i can see myself posting something like 1042, if i hadn't already known your affinity towards wagoning nothing slots. i have more to say here, but i don't want to potentially be feeding meowth answers, so i can circle back to this later.

as for what i liked:

i think 979 is really townie for meowth. it calls out furtive's disonance with his enchant read, where he's both calling him town and claiming he's gotten good at reading them, but also like. (still!!) refusing to make a case or even just link games, and claiming others are overreacting for questioning him about it and asking for an update.

and 775.

also i'm not sure why scum-him keeps trying to lowkey push enchant when enchant is obviously not getting yeeted today, but /shrug.

fwiw 618 seems like a *fine* post to me, but maybe that's because i am biased

[Datisi]

@Datisi

Don't worry Bingle, it's your internet skills that are failing not your memory.

owen, what do you think about guiltylion?

Ok. Some of the energy is awkward but could be early game kick start attempt stuff. I don't think he's done anything that's unlikely as either alignment.

Why is this post scummy? Non-committal sure but why is that a problem in context - what’s “bs” about it?

I’m very doubtful that meowth thinks that everyone else has solid opinions on the whole player list one way or the other yet (and def not at that stage).

(Ignore your take that I should have considered GL’s post about 222 in my read since meowth doesn’t appear to have been considering it crucial either)

i mean, you're telling me "ignore why you think this post is scummy, what else is scummy about it".

i *can* think of different reasons for why someone might see that post as scummy, though. and i don't know which one of them (if any of them) meowth actually thought about.

why are you asking me about this? why not question him about it?

[Datisi]

We already know why meowth thinks it’s scummy, he said that in his post. “Non-committal”. Not a good reason.

i find that usually there's more thought for people's reads then purely what they said in the thread, but sure -- even if the reason is solely "the post is non-committal, therefore it's scummy" there can be multiple reasons why someone could think that that post itself is scummy for being non-committal. like, again, i don't wanna be putting words in his mouth, but i don't think "he said it's non-committal, therefore he excepts everyone to have a read on everyone by that point in the game, that's unreasonable, therefore he's scum" is a good conclusion to take from it. it feels like you're trying to take the worst implication from it.

[Datisi]

and inb4 "i didn't say he thinks everyone should have a read on everyone by that point" i know. but it is the only potential solution you're putting forward in 1142

[Datisi]

Meow thing doesn’t expect everyone to have a firm opinion but therefore there’s no reason for that specific non-committance to be scummy.

that is not how mafia works but i am not going to be making answers for him

[Datisi]

datisi moves down a little bit towards page 41ish i feel like he's just asking people why he's being scumread instead of actually doing anything

why is that not doing anything

and do you think those reads of me were reasonable / understandable

[Datisi]

yes you noticed it good job

i fail to see why it's alignment-indicative in the way you're claiming it to be

@std

[Datisi]

not doing anything but defending yourself and not hunting for scum is not alignment indicative?

asking others to explain their dubious reads on me is not hunting for scum?

[Datisi]

is it? who's scum

unowen
maybe furtive and maybe you

evading noted tho

[Datisi]

because you made a claim that i'm scummy for asking others to explain their suspicions on me and claimed that that's not hunting for scum, without actually looking into it at all

when i tried to get you to actually think about it (i.e. WHY am i asking them, do you think i should've understood their suspicions, etc etc) all i get in response is "well who is scum tho" completely evading my question

[Datisi]

Is it literally just the Enchant read that you scumread me for

no

i think your read on me througout this game doesn't follow a coherent thought process and you can't properly explain it

[Datisi]

i don't think you're scummy for it, i think you move down my list a little

if you don't think it's scummy, why are you moving me down your list

[Datisi]

why are you moving me down your list

[Datisi]

std why are you going around this conversation with ausuka instead of actually giving reasons for scumreading/voting her

[Datisi]

that's an interesting question, can you point me to where you explained your vote on mr

is this not asking for it or am i misreading

[Datisi]

VOTE: meowth

@gl understood on meowth, i'll try to give him a second look once he returns to the thread

do you find std townie?

[Datisi]

fwiw i also agree with this game Being Not Fun so i don't think it's just you

[Datisi]

my opinion on things related to this game is the same as last night

slightly townier on guiltylion, because i think it's pretty evident this town is utterly lethargic and going nowhere and i'm not sure why he tries to like, actually do things if he's scum here

unless he's scum with specifically unowen, which. meh idk i don't think it's particularly likely

also i think the thing that would help this game a lot is a flip and a night phase so if the people with no votes could actually vote someone that would be very pog

[Datisi]

not doing anything but defending yourself and not hunting for scum is not alignment indicative?

asking others to explain their dubious reads on me is not hunting for scum?

Got scum pings from this post. This feels like the kind of defensive BS I post when I get pushed as scum.

do you think that std *wasn't* misrepping me there?

like, do you think that nono and furtive's scumreads on me were reasonable / understandable? and that i shouldn't have asked about them?

[Datisi]

HotD

speaking of - you got to unowen's alignment in that game p quickly. are you townreading him here?

[Datisi]

I don't think there was anything wrong with you questioning bad scumreads on you but I do find it questionable that it feels like you are not doing much else besides that and riding the this game is a bummer train.

moving the goalposts...

ypu said you mindmelded with pooky about this earlier. pooky specifically said that i'm not playing like tryhard town or tryhard scum. what does that tell you? why is that scummy?

[Datisi]

But I don't play on meta so.

that's fine. i was hoping you were gonna have Thoughts there though, would've been helpful.

[Datisi]

just tell me what you want to say here you obviously have something in mind

you're pointing out my low engagement as scum-indicative. with the idea being - townies have high engagement, scum has low engagement.

i have been known to tryhard both as town and as scum. so that nice and clean dichotomy is not applicable to me.

so i am asking your thoughts on my slot, with that info in mind.

[Datisi]

Why are you playing this way?

because in the last few games, i've consistently been losing my shit, and i'm trying to chill this game?

[Datisi]

still thinking nothing actually productive comes from pushing/poking ausuka this way

[Datisi]

still thinking nothing actually productive comes from pushing/poking ausuka this way

Not what I intended to do

it wasn't aimed solely at you either

[Datisi]

Can we just kill Ausuka then? Because I don't want to have to be in a game with this.

she's more likely town than not and it's not a pro-town thing to be limming her slot right now

[Datisi]

earlier this game, i took another look at the large normal where she was scum and i didn't really find that she was quick to concede or yield as she has been this game

i'm not saying she *can't* be scum here. of course she can, anyone can at this point. but knowing ausuka's meta and knowing her from outside of game, i think (1) she is more likely to react in this passive of a manner when she's town than when she's scum - as scum, she's aware she has to be the antagonist so there isn't any "guilt" attached to being attacked or defending herself, while as town there would be, (2) if she is town, she's going to just shut down if you keep shitting on her and you're never going to find her, and that's a potential misyeet that could've been avoided by giving some air

[Datisi]

One breathe you say "nothing comes of sorting Ausuka this way" and next breath you're very confident she's town?

Where did this magical town read come from, Datisi?

you'd have known why i townread her if you read my posts.

"i currently think she's town" and "y'all won't be able sort her correctly this way" are not mutually exclusive statements.

[Datisi]

"how do we sort ausuka" idk maybe by giving her a bit of space and letting her do her own thing without antagonizing her whenever we mention her. if she keeps being so underwhelming, then sure whatever.

[Datisi]

I literally for the first time expressed my desire to see this slot pressured TODAY.

yeah, first time YOU did. are you reading the game? how many times others have done it?

[Datisi]

I won't accept this narrative that we've pushed this slot too hard and now this player is upset and can't play. It's false.

i'm assuming you don't know her like i do.

but i am telling you - approaching her in "bad faith" and antagonizing her is not going to get her engaged you want her to.

[Datisi]

I literally for the first time expressed my desire to see this slot pressured TODAY.

yeah, first time YOU did. are you reading the game? how many times others have done it?

Why the fuck does it matter what others do in this circumstance when her response to my suggestion I want votes and pressure there is to fucking flip out on me and insult me and make the game completely unfun for me, Datisi?

It feels tactical.

oh, what the fuck does it matter if she's already upset that other players are antagonizing her? i don't know??

[Datisi]

Ok should I remove all emotion and say

"this looks like Datisi scum is chainsawing a townie that he has TMI on"

and just kill you instead?

go right ahead? i know how ausuka works. i know nothing good comes from this if she's town.

ok but the only way this meta read would make sense if you can even do meta off one game is if you saw how she handled an early push in that game and it was "to not yield/concede"

it's a different mindset. she's had arguments with other players that game, she actually stood her ground and tried to convince people of her own worldview. it was unapologetic. this play is different

[Datisi]

bad faith my ass

i put bad faith in quotation marks because it's not the exact word i'm looking for, but i can't think of a better one.

"lack of benefit of the doubt" is probably more accurate

Antagonizing her in WHAT WAY?

In the way that they think she's scum? And are PLAYING MAFIA?

i think it's pretty clear that if you include her in a post where you kinda talk about her being scum but don't mainly push her and don't go anywhere with it and don't properly engage her, it's gonna seem antagonizing. i would've read it the same way.

I get this is your personal friend and all but I am the LAST person you want to do this shit with because it's not like the fucking rage inside ever died, I just feed it and keep it away from everything because it's not healthy.

But I can feel my fucking blood pressure rising right now

i didn't want to "do" anything "with" you here. i wanted to help you read someone that i think i have more knowledge on how to read than you do and for whom i think your approach will be hugely ineffective and maybe even counterproductive.

i didn't mean to make you angry. i'm sorry if i said anything you found insulting.

i'm getting upset by this, so i will take a break from this game now.

[Datisi]

Ok and do you have an example of her doing this as town?

i can look for it later if you want.

but even if i don't find concrete examples, i think i'm not likely to change my mind. i think a person's personality is more likely to authentically come out when they're town than when they're scum. i think town ausuka would be more likely to react this way than scum ausuka would.

[Datisi]

okay i didn't say you're not allowed to do it, i'm pointing out how it looks like from someone's pov who's already getting scumreads.

i thought it meant "i don't make reads based on meta" not "i ignore literally everything that someone else says that's related to meta" but whatever

[Datisi]

stop capsing

furtive no offense but what the fuck is the point of this post

[Datisi]

cool cool fucking off from this game now

[Datisi]

sorry for leaving you, team, my heart was really not in mafia nor in this game at the moment. glad to see i was able to pocket guiltylion from the spec thread, tho

[Datisi]

glad to see i was able to pocket guiltylion from the spec thread, tho

can we be town together again next time?!? stop rolling scum!!

i want to but mods keep giving me stinky scum role PMs!!!