Grand Idea GPick [Game Over]

[Looker]

UNVOTE:
reading

[Looker]

This is taking longer than I thought. I don't know wtf this is. I'll try to have something by tomorrow evening.

[Looker]

Double post: bingle is confirmed not-mafia because borning checked him night 2 with a one shot cop ability.

Still scrubbing through to find claimed night actions.

Morning picked 293 and got Town Green Glass Door.
Picked Alien ReroLLsympathiser: no aliens exist in the game: rerolled
Landed on Werewolf Jack-of-All-Trades
The Town Green Glass Door made us a Town Werewolf JoaT.

1 shot doc unused
1 shot RB unused
1 shot cop used night 2 on Bungles
1 shot vig used night 3 on Drew.

also, in case it got lost in the shuffle (lol) I did NOT get a card last night AND "[my] special actions can only be used once more" from morning message.

[you mean boring picked 293 and got town green glass door, i assume]
[Why did hellbooks see you as an alien sympathizer then, and why did Bingle not motion detect you?]

[Interesting that she did call that you were an alien sympathizer at some point -- but why did she see you as one now?]
[She couldn't have faked seeing it because there was no way of knowing that you were once one, as far as i can tell. Say if she were a scum rolecop, she couldn't have learned about the alien sympathizer bit, i wouldn't think]

[funny that boring claimed to have a green card, this would be an extremely convoluted fakeclaim wouldnt it? I'd believe it if two different players didnt have guilties on you -- i dont quite get those parts yet.]

Sorry, but I'm still trying to make sense of this setup. I'll be quoting things to make it easier for me to reread.

How are people so blind sighted?
Titus was once the top wagon but Titus single handily eliminated the Town alignment players against them.
(With the help of Farside)

[Titus

must

be a pheromone seeder. Her lovers work exactly the same as the pheromone seeder mechanic, lasting only a day and sharing a PT, then closing.]

[With this in mind, there is only one pheromone seeder: on page 37. Titus claims to have picked page 314, her birthday, and gotten "Townie", which gave her the pheromone seeder role to use.]

[The only possibilities with regards to Titus' role that i will consider involve her being a Pheromone seeder, almost certainly as a reroll. The fact that the page of Grand Idea which is her birthday contains a reroller role suggests to me that this is the most likely way she got pheromone seeder.]

Incorporating the concept of rerolled and convoluted roles means simply scumhunting and VCA isn't going to cut it. I'm assuming i have to bounce claimed roles against the GIM thread and guess which page they picked? What has been the strategy here for finding scum?

Spoiler: claims

Morning - Town 1-shotizer
Iconeum - Friendly Neighbour (Cleared by Ircher)
Battle Mage - Post restriction (Cleared by TSE)
Titus - Town Pheremone Seeder (Townie + Pheromone Seeder Reroll role)
farside22 - Town Effort Saver - Role changed N3

TrueSoulEnergy - Knowledgeable Townie (Claims BM is clear)
hellbooks - Anti-Weak Rolecop (Has investigated Starbucks)
Bingle - Self Motion Detector (Claims never been visited)

Porkens - Town Werewolf JoAT (idfk)

Pigman - Unclaimed
ManateeDude - Unclaimed
Chateau Lobby - Unclaimed

Starbucks/Quick/dsjster - Hellbooks claims “3p Bomber”

So, so far Ico is cleared because Ircher is dead and flipped town. And BM can only be scum if TSE is scum?

this game is so lost on me can someone debrief me

[i was bored and i made a more detailed breakdown of the claiming situation, if you're interested:]

Spoiler: Claims

Iconeum used a 1-shot friendly neighbour on Ircher and it was confirmed by him. By this logic Iconeum should be town.


Battle Mage posts with 5 or more post restrictions from the Grand Idea thread. I cannot find a role that gets multiple Grand Idea post restrictions. Additionally, BM cannot tell us what his role is, but he has asked us to find it. TSE claims that his role confirms BM as town.


Titus rolled Townie (role up to mod discretion), at the top of the Grand Idea page with her birthday. The role she claims to have gotten is Pheromone Seeder, a role that lets her make two people fall in love for the next day/night cycle, giving them a PT. This works differently than say, a Mafia Cupid would, and it has been confirmed by multiple players throughout the course of the game to work as she has claimed.

Titus has loverized
N1 - Farside & (Ircher?)
N2 - Ircher & Starbuck (Quick)
N3 - Iconeum & Starbuck


Farside claims the Town Effort Saver, a role that prevents any roles that end the game when they win from winning before D2. But these roles are given Deathproof until D2 to compensate. This supposedly caused Quick’s D1 lynch to fail, although it doesn’t exactly make sense because Quick’s role, 3p bomber, doesn’t end the game when it wins, exactly.

Farside has claimed D3 to have been changed into a VT.


TrueSoulEnergy has claimed the Knowledgeable Townie, a town member that knows the identity of one townie. He claims that Battle Mage is town aligned. He has been annoyed with Titus/farside for pushing BM earlier, ignoring this claim


Hellbooks has claimed the Antiweak Rolecop, a rolecop that dies if they investigate a town member. So far, she has investigated:

N1 - none
N2 - Starbuck “3p Bomber”
N3 - none


Bingle has claimed the Self Motion Detector, a role that learns when someone visits it basically. He has claimed to have never been visited N1/N2/N3, which conflicts with Pork’s account of copping Bingle N2.


Porkens (strap-in for this one) has claimed the Town Green Glass Door turned Alien ReroLLsympathizer turned Werewolf Jack-of-all-Trades, ultimately becoming the Town Werewolf Jack-of-all-Trades. He claims these actions:

N1 - none
N2 - Cop Bingle (not mafia)
N3 - Vig Drew (killed)


Looker, aka Pigman, has not claimed yet.


Chateau Lobby has not claimed yet.


ManateeDude has claimed to be incapable of claiming his role.


Starbucks is almost certainly a antitown role, but they have claimed Vanilla Townie. Hellbooks investigated them to be a “3p Bomber”, which functions as so:

“Each night, you may place a fuse on a player, they will not be informed. If anyone with a fuse attached to them is killed, the bomb will start. The town has three days following the lighting of the bomb to lynch the bomber, or the bomb will blow up, killing everyone except the bomber”

Spoiler: What I derive from them

Iconeum is confirmed town.

Battle Mage is confirmed town so long as TSE is, and I believe he's pretty likely town although I cannot find his role.

Titus is virtually confirmed a Pheromone Seeder unless I can find a similar functioning role. She must be an Alien Pheromone Seeder or a role that has the role rerolled independently from alignment. Seeing as there is a townie role that does this on her birthday page, I think this is the most likely scenario.

Farside’s claim doesn’t exactly work in the context of Quick's role, but it would be a pretty shot in the dark fakeclaim, plus if the win condition for the Bomber were to be written more clearly it could make sense. I like her 422 as being genuine as well, suggesting that it is indeed her role.

TrueSoulEnergy is probably town, I’ve heard that he’s more emotional/passionate as town (?) and he seeeeems like it here. About the claim though, claiming to have an innocent very early on would be a bit risky to do as scum, although perhaps he figured out BM was town through the post restriction and saw his chance.

Hellbooks has rolecopping ability, almost surely. The antiweak part remains to be seen as Hellbooks hasn’t investigated anyone other than Starbucks.

Bingle’s role is not really verified yet. He claims he has no reason to lie about how Porken has seemingly not visited him ever.

ManateeDude is a mystery to all. I might search for his role sometime.

Porkens role is hard to approach. There was an interesting part where boring claims to have gotten a green card, which may have been crumbing at glass door, which is very interesting. However, boring/Porkens didn’t use their role on N1 (?), and Bingle did not see Porkens investigate him. Odd all around.

Looker, aka Pigman, has been a fairly inactive slot. I suspect we’re going to force out a claim sometime in the near future. Wouldn’t be at all surprised if this slot is scum or town.

Chateau Lobby has felt like scum at times, I don’t like his contribution to the Ircher wagon, and he hasn’t claimed yet. On the height of his D1 wagon, ManateeDude, boring, farside22, Doctor Drew, and Hoctac were voting for him, two of which are flipped town.

Starbucks I’m pretty sure is antitown even if they aren't a 3p bomber. Just makes the most sense that way.

Still building data; sorry for the clutter

---

• I apologize for being so far behind, but this place is nuts.
  
• How many confirmed town are in {Morning Tweet | TrueSoulEnergy | Farside22 | Bingle |
  Iconeum
  | ManateeDude}? VCA would lead me to believe that, if boring/Porkens is scum, their partner is in there.
  
• With current wagon dynamics, I'm willing to claim if both hellbooks and Starbuck request it
  
• I don't know why Chateau Lobby would feel the need to push a "quantity over quality" dichotomy when we still have 5 days.

VOTE: Porkens Two mislynches wanted you dead.

[Looker]

[why would mafia give Pork a blue card? isnt that the one that gives us a bonus lynch?]

[i definitely agree with Bingles last paragraph about known scum roles.]

[Is there any problem with having Looker claim now rather than later?]

VOTE: Looker

Can you explain these cards? I don't see anything on the wiki. I also don't see anything about my role, which is why I was trying to get more clarification.

---

• Sorry I couldn't contribute more before I died, but PoE is Porkens and then one of {Morning Tweet | TrueSoulEnergy | Farside22 | Bingle |
  Iconeum
  | ManateeDude}.

p-edit: wtf

[Looker]

[here is exactly how the card game cheater works: viewtopic.php?f=5&t=59348&p=8151425#p8151425]

Yeah, my role has nothing to do with that. I'm an Orange Townie. I don't know what that does. I thought it was related to the colored cards, but it's not.

We are forcing the unclaimed to...claim

ManateeDude and Chateau Lobby?

[Farside, Looker's slot hasnt claimed and has mostly not talked all game. how can you call it the wagon bad? at worst its neutral.]

[he still hasn't claimed despite being L-1'd. I suppose Pork and Chateau being on it is a minor bummer, but it seems like if Pork is scum, he's an alien/werewolf so Looker can still be scum just fine.]

Is there no hypocrisy of Chateau Lobby being on my wagon despite not claiming himself? Is my wagon just a claim-hunt or a lurker lynch?

With current wagon dynamics, I'm willing to claim if both hellbooks and Starbuck request it

Why is this a thing? You're at like L-2. Just do it.

+1 to this though -- why am I being asked about this

Because, at the time, my PoE implied you and Starbuck were least likely to flip scum. I feel Morning Tweet could be partners with Porkens, as she's in the group of people where I can't find that they were pushed at any point in the thread. I also didn't want to flip unnecessary information if my role related to this card thing.

---

• I don't see how my lynch helps confirm the "pseudo conftown".

I should have more time to post this weekend; sorry I've been so busy. I wouldn't mind being hammered - I feel like this is more frustrating than fun.

[Looker]

[i still think we should pair starbuck off with someone in the PoE, then lynch the PoE player to off them both. Today though im not sure which lynch is right yet]

I have to find Starbuck's role in the Grand Idea thread

Should squeeze claims out of the rest of the unclaimed now

I feel this game was honestly stalled despite being 76 pages and Day 4. I feel there's a wide swathe of players whose reads are contingent upon their claims. I'm not seeing anywhere where {

Chemist1422

Morning Tweet | TrueSoulEnergy | farside22 |

Saladman27

Bingle |

Iconeum

| ManateeDude} were sorted.

---

• What does ">>rand" mean?

[Looker]

• Is there a town advantage to faking post restrictions that I'm not seeing?
  
• Does ManateeDude's not being able to claim also mean he can't vote?
  
• Does Bingle have a secondary suspect if I flip town? I don't know how to rebut that he and Pigman are friends and that he
  knows
  Pigman is scum.
  
• Is Starbuck a vanillaizer or a bomb?
  
• I'm confused by Bingle's "I'm just more interested in lynching the roles we KNOW are scum" statement. Which of the roles do you all "know" are scum? The only role with werewolf in it is Porkens' (Town Werewolf JOAT from 1740), so how is any of this making sense?

[Looker]

[Lynch Manatee/Porkens/Looker/Chateau today. -> force hellbooks to investigate an unclaimed tonight, loverize two PoEs with each other -> lynch a PoE tomorrow]

[Is hellbooks a showstopper lyncher then perhaps? explains a lot of discrepancies]

Why not just get Chateau to claim.

I have a soft serve townread on manatee..

What is this based on?

---

• Some of the claims that were written down aren't even fucking real. Please forgive me if I doubt everything that was told to me.
  
• At what point is ManateeDude expected to participate?

[Looker]

Mostly avatar I guess

How does ManateeDude's avatar make him more likely to be town in this game?

[*]Some of the claims that were written down aren't even fucking real. Please forgive me if I doubt everything that was told to me.

[that is a real role.]

Town Neapolitan Vanillaizer

The abilities are linked: you vanillaize your target, and learn whether or not they were a VT before you vanillaized them.

I know what Starbuck said was a real role, but what was written down as her role (3p Bomber) was inaccurate. I don't understand why there's such a comfort with claims when they're proving to be unreliable.

Just tell me where to vote and I will vote there. This message applies to anyone who cares.

Vote Porkens

If anyone expects me to be the one to figure this game out, I appreciate the confidence but its all shooting in the dark fmpov.

Does this ignorance mean we shouldn't hold you accountable for mislynches?

VOTE: Looker

Is there a reason for this?

As an aside manatee is starting to hard ping scum to me. Lurking to replacement and then. Oning back only to ask that someone does a summary is ...

Also chateou is doing the same with their “just tell em who to vote” idgaf

You've gotten a claim out of neither. I thought that that was important to you.

I'm so tired this game is just one big roleclaim excel spread sheet

This I agree with. What I don't understand is why accepting fakeclaims has taken the place of scumhunting. I don't see why Porkens hasn't been lynched already.

[Looker]

Im considering Starbucks as confirmee not town

Not caught up btw

Some thoughts/guesses from confirmed town would be helpful.

I dont think I've ever been more confused by a game... im getting that alongside an alien faction there is still a 3p bomber even though a result on Starbuck was false.. I also saw BM claiming a guilty on me which is very confusing bc I dont see any follow up on the matter. All in all im very confused, worn out and tired from this game. if someone could figure out my role that'd be great

What page? Or page range? Also, did you feel hellbooks's lynch was imminent at the time of your hammer?

---

• Is it safe to say that two members corroborating a fakeclaim could be aliens at this point?
  
• I have to ignore Porkens for today because I'm attached to him. I have to move to the next most likely anti-town.
  
• I don't think anyone's afraid of Titus's loverize; I think it's moreso a roleblock mechanic. We haven't been claiming the card colors.
  
• If Starbuck wants me to claim my card, I will.
  
• If Titus is alien, I don't see her being alien alone. My guess is Chateau Lobby or ManateeDude.

VOTE: ManateeDude

I don't see why this would be expected to be fun.

[Looker]

Spoiler:

Im considering Starbucks as confirmee not town

Not caught up btw

Some thoughts/guesses from confirmed town would be helpful.

I dont think I've ever been more confused by a game... im getting that alongside an alien faction there is still a 3p bomber even though a result on Starbuck was false.. I also saw BM claiming a guilty on me which is very confusing bc I dont see any follow up on the matter. All in all im very confused, worn out and tired from this game. if someone could figure out my role that'd be great

What page? Or page range? Also, did you feel hellbooks's lynch was imminent at the time of your hammer?

---

• Is it safe to say that two members corroborating a fakeclaim could be aliens at this point?
  
• I have to ignore Porkens for today because I'm attached to him. I have to move to the next most likely anti-town.
  
• I don't think anyone's afraid of Titus's loverize; I think it's moreso a roleblock mechanic. We haven't been claiming the card colors.
  
• If Starbuck wants me to claim my card, I will.
  
• If Titus is alien, I don't see her being alien alone. My guess is Chateau Lobby or ManateeDude.

VOTE: ManateeDude

I don't see why this would be expected to be fun.

Why don’t you say anything in our lover chat? And why do you think Titus is a roleblocker?

I'd posted in the private PT two hours before this post. I don't know if Titus is a roleblocker, but there being a roleblock mechanic makes more sense than someone being afraid of a loverizer. Especially when it's been concluded that the loverize takes effect the next day. That's two sentences and two misreps from you.

---

• Starbuck's saying my Activity Report is "abysmal", but she's overlooking some things:
  • I'm a replacement.
  • I don't spam-post ANYWHERE on mafiascum
  • She didn't say that there was something I missed that she'd like me to address.
  .
  
• Does anyone know why Bingle is so "confident" that I'm scum? Guessing cards between me and Porkens is potentially smart, but I don't get the fixation.
  
• I don't like that there are so many anti-town factions. What exactly
  is
  Titus?
  • And why is her being anti-town so blatant?
• I'm leery of players who accuse/scumread me for "saying nothing", but then don't ask me any questions. I can only comment on what I think is pertinent until you ask me something.

VOTE: Chateau Lobby ManateeDude, Chateau Lobby, Titus - those are the ones that don't make sense to me.

[Looker]

• What "good conversation and hashing things out" would anyone like me to participate in? I'm all ears.

[Looker]

The case you made 1400 posts ago? Same one?

that doesnt invalidate the fact I've scumread him-

2281 is confusing to me.

Chetau Wagon is going nowhere, but I think

VOTE: manateedude is close to consensus.

You went from a 4-person bandwagon to a 4-person bandwagon.

VOTE: ManateeDude

I'll play ball but I still get the feeling I'm being manipulated somehow.

Manipulated by who?

[Looker]

Oh shit there’s a wolf faction what up my brothers

Did I miss something? Did you claim werewolf already?

So titus loverized starbuck and battlemage? You h oh maybe they redscum made contact with the aliens somehow

How do you know this? You seem to always be pretty confident in assumptions. Wasn't it just yesterday you proclaimed me to be scum with titus???

Knowledge of night actions makes me suspicious as well. I'm confused why, if Porkens' Green Glass Door claim is to be believed, the possibility of him being a Mafia Green Glass Door isn't. They're all on the same page.

TSE, MT, and Pork in that order for my preferred lynch order.

53% Porkens | 18%

Ico

, Farside, or Morning Tweet | 15% Chateau Lobby | 14% TSE

---

• Why did farside22 say that Chateau Lobby had claimed when he hadn't?

VOTE: Porkens Titus had a point - lynching Porkens and me would have been optimal play for scum if we were both town.

[Looker]

Ok so yeah unless Farside is a Neutral role that can choose their own abilities then yeah they are Town.

I guess this game boils down to reading the Grand Idea Mafia thread? Twice the homework for the price of one.

What role/which page?

Oh Looker isn't on any wagons... I didn't consider that type of positioning when I threw this list together.

What does this mean? You didn't take a stance on it, so I don't know if you're expecting a response.

[Looker]

Oh Looker isn't on any wagons... I didn't consider that type of positioning when I threw this list together.

What does this mean? You didn't take a stance on it, so I don't know if you're expecting a response.

As to what it means, I don't have a strong feeling one way or the other atm. But it is for sure notable and for sure it pings me.

How does it "ping" you if you "don't have a strong feeling one way or the other" about it?

[Looker]

I wish I had had the guts to just ask for coordination in that PT. Looker would you have gone for that if I had confessed and asked to coordinate?

Lol, that would have been hilarious. I would've gone with it.