Doubles Mafia Day 2/ Day 2
-
-
Vecna Survivor
- Survivor
- Survivor
- Posts: 11118
- Joined: June 15, 2016
-
-
Vecna
-
-
Vecna
-
-
Vecna Survivor
- Survivor
- Survivor
- Posts: 11118
- Joined: June 15, 2016
-
-
Vecna Survivor
- Survivor
- Survivor
- Posts: 11118
- Joined: June 15, 2016
Bit of an odd statement to make when he's finally about to do a catchup.In post 3507, RadiantCowbells wrote:LR is the only lynch I am even slightly considering over Vecna btw
Also nice to see that im worth lynching over if I disagree with your read on LR, but now he's suddenly a fine lynch.
Progression ftw-
-
Vecna Survivor
- Survivor
- Survivor
- Posts: 11118
- Joined: June 15, 2016
-
-
Vecna Survivor
- Survivor
- Survivor
- Posts: 11118
- Joined: June 15, 2016
In post 2246, Baezu wrote:
TH- I keep flip-flopping on this slot...some things they say are town and some are scummy as I recently pointed outIn post 2235, Trojan Horses wrote:
Can you give me your own reads on Cakez, and after that, on everyone?In post 2233, Baezu wrote:RC, could you please give me your reads on cakez?
WANH- oka is spamming, FB is his town silly self. I dont think they would do this if they were scum. It draws a lot of attention to that slot
GIF- I thought Bernie was town, haven't played with her so I dont know her meta. If Gif gets in here and posts, I should be able to solidify this read
RC, gobbles- town
Jjh- seems town to me but what do I know
Mastina- another slot I've flip-flopped on. Atm I think she's town because I dont think she loses it like that if she's scum
Farside/amrun- not enough on this slot. Farside should be readable with enough content
Suichi- I've thought he is town. Some of you know his meta better...
NSG - not sure what to think here. I know her and Mastina are not both scum so when I think Mastina is scum then NSG is town and vice versa
Bbmolla - town
Lie Ren- seems town to me
Wonderwall I still think is scum. Ali normally posts lot more when they are town. They have no passion for this game and in their case I think it is AI
Vecna- town and a very likely mislynch. I think because of the jormun slot that didn't post much it would be easy thing for scum to get behind
Elmo- leaning scum because of PoE and their lack of posting
NM- fuck I dont know. They are so good as scum but FWIW I did not think DDL was scum when they left. Truly lost on this one
Cakez- I just think hes scum. I mean, nothing personal. I love the player but too many red flags for me in their ISO
What changed from here Baezu?
Walk me through it please-
-
Vecna Survivor
- Survivor
- Survivor
- Posts: 11118
- Joined: June 15, 2016
I mightve been pocketed by Mastina, but I indeed think she's more likely town here.In post 3524, SirCakez wrote:The fact that Vecna doesn't want to push mastina is another thing linking them also
I think TH asked me about that earlier
At the same time, I wouldnt put it past her scum ability to come up with the shit that would hit home with me and rouse my suspicions on RC. She said all the right things.
You think that entire dialogue/monologue of her trying to influence my shit was scum theater?-
-
Vecna Survivor
- Survivor
- Survivor
- Posts: 11118
- Joined: June 15, 2016
Same way I wouldnt put it past her to try do the ballsy thing and lolhammer JJH and try to get away with it.
But ive also been having a rather hard time to stay up to date with actual votecounts this game. Not a very high votecount:pagecount ratio in this game (like when I was suddenly at L1, didnt have a clue)-
-
Vecna Survivor
- Survivor
- Survivor
- Posts: 11118
- Joined: June 15, 2016
-
-
Vecna Survivor
- Survivor
- Survivor
- Posts: 11118
- Joined: June 15, 2016
Id really like an answer to my question at the pagetop.In post 3530, Baezu wrote:
Why are you still hung up on this?In post 3514, SirCakez wrote:My request to lynch Bazeu was aimed at the general thread, not RC FYI
In some detail so I can see your thoughtprocess.-
-
Vecna Survivor
- Survivor
- Survivor
- Posts: 11118
- Joined: June 15, 2016
Yeah it was a bit of a dick thing to do, im a bit prickly atm.In post 3533, SirCakez wrote:
???Baezu wrote:
Why are you still hung up on this?In post 3514, SirCakez wrote:My request to lynch Bazeu was aimed at the general thread, not RC FYI
I made a post about it last page and Vecna acted like I was asking RC's permission to vote
I want my candy but I cannot have it-
-
Vecna Survivor
- Survivor
- Survivor
- Posts: 11118
- Joined: June 15, 2016
And the other 2? Mastina and TH?In post 3536, Baezu wrote:
You started posting. At first I thought you were busy or catching up. But once you started posting, seeing how passive aggressive you're being and picking a fight with RC, etc. You're not being very townie imoIn post 3525, Vecna wrote:In post 2246, Baezu wrote:
TH- I keep flip-flopping on this slot...some things they say are town and some are scummy as I recently pointed outIn post 2235, Trojan Horses wrote:
Can you give me your own reads on Cakez, and after that, on everyone?In post 2233, Baezu wrote:RC, could you please give me your reads on cakez?
WANH- oka is spamming, FB is his town silly self. I dont think they would do this if they were scum. It draws a lot of attention to that slot
GIF- I thought Bernie was town, haven't played with her so I dont know her meta. If Gif gets in here and posts, I should be able to solidify this read
RC, gobbles- town
Jjh- seems town to me but what do I know
Mastina- another slot I've flip-flopped on. Atm I think she's town because I dont think she loses it like that if she's scum
Farside/amrun- not enough on this slot. Farside should be readable with enough content
Suichi- I've thought he is town. Some of you know his meta better...
NSG - not sure what to think here. I know her and Mastina are not both scum so when I think Mastina is scum then NSG is town and vice versa
Bbmolla - town
Lie Ren- seems town to me
Wonderwall I still think is scum. Ali normally posts lot more when they are town. They have no passion for this game and in their case I think it is AI
Vecna- town and a very likely mislynch. I think because of the jormun slot that didn't post much it would be easy thing for scum to get behind
Elmo- leaning scum because of PoE and their lack of posting
NM- fuck I dont know. They are so good as scum but FWIW I did not think DDL was scum when they left. Truly lost on this one
Cakez- I just think hes scum. I mean, nothing personal. I love the player but too many red flags for me in their ISO
What changed from here Baezu?
Walk me through it please-
-
Vecna
-
-
Vecna Survivor
- Survivor
- Survivor
- Posts: 11118
- Joined: June 15, 2016
-
-
Vecna Survivor
- Survivor
- Survivor
- Posts: 11118
- Joined: June 15, 2016
-
-
Vecna Survivor
- Survivor
- Survivor
- Posts: 11118
- Joined: June 15, 2016
-
-
Vecna Survivor
- Survivor
- Survivor
- Posts: 11118
- Joined: June 15, 2016
-
-
Vecna Survivor
- Survivor
- Survivor
- Posts: 11118
- Joined: June 15, 2016
-
-
Vecna Survivor
- Survivor
- Survivor
- Posts: 11118
- Joined: June 15, 2016
What type of shitpost is this?
-
-
Vecna Survivor
- Survivor
- Survivor
- Posts: 11118
- Joined: June 15, 2016
You know you couldve also chosen not to fight me for once right?In post 3555, RadiantCowbells wrote:When me and NSG are both dead kill TH and Lie Ren and if that doesn't win Halloween congrats on being a town so bad that two consecutive paragons couldn't prevent you from losing a town sided setup-
-
Vecna Survivor
- Survivor
- Survivor
- Posts: 11118
- Joined: June 15, 2016
The fact you act so clueless that you pretend to not even grasp that RC loves to claim fake guilties - fake guilties that are mechanically impossible to have even gotten a result, and that you wanna run with it really makes me want to insta lynch youIn post 3558, SirCakez wrote:it's not rocket science lol vecna-
-
Vecna Survivor
- Survivor
- Survivor
- Posts: 11118
- Joined: June 15, 2016
-
-
Vecna Survivor
- Survivor
- Survivor
- Posts: 11118
- Joined: June 15, 2016
Its not obviously, im just fucking fuming with this constant barrage of bullshit by a person with an overinflated ego that wants to ruin everyone else's fun constantly just to feel better about himself.In post 3564, SirCakez wrote:
if you're aware RC fakes guiltiesIn post 3548, Vecna wrote:Cool, can we lynch him now that he's openly scumclaiming?
how is this an open scumclaim
The fact he's not even playing the game in a way that takes anyone else's into consideration, refuses to explain anything, and has the only answer of "lol im so much better than you, youre unworthy" yet continues this fucking deathtunnel -that is completely wrong-.......yeah annoys me and results in my replies not being completely calculated all the time.
That was not what you were doing though. And that was not something that impacted your judgement there.
You just saw another reason to try and run with it and mislynch me.
im a fucking town PR. RC already fucked up by making me claim it with his bullshit. But it just continues.-
-
Vecna Survivor
- Survivor
- Survivor
- Posts: 11118
- Joined: June 15, 2016
-
-
Vecna Survivor
- Survivor
- Survivor
- Posts: 11118
- Joined: June 15, 2016
-
-
Vecna Survivor
- Survivor
- Survivor
- Posts: 11118
- Joined: June 15, 2016
-
-
Vecna Survivor
- Survivor
- Survivor
- Posts: 11118
- Joined: June 15, 2016
You mean by NK or by lynch?In post 3581, gobbledygook wrote:
It’s okIn post 3580, Vecna wrote:Yeah sorry for my shit, this crap really has a tendency to make me overreact and bring out the worst
Spoiler: spoiler-
-
Vecna Survivor
- Survivor
- Survivor
- Posts: 11118
- Joined: June 15, 2016
-
-
Vecna Survivor
- Survivor
- Survivor
- Posts: 11118
- Joined: June 15, 2016
Youre both wrong.
And once again, a motion detector can be verified easily enough, unless youre somehow scared im gonna take the right guess on every single person I visit. And scum will kill it regardless.
Lynching me, if youre still incapable of reading me correctly, is just doing scums work for them.-
-
Vecna Survivor
- Survivor
- Survivor
- Posts: 11118
- Joined: June 15, 2016
Also, his claim was a lie dudeIn post 3586, gobbledygook wrote:
Lynch. I’m not really feeling the motion detector claim in light of RC’s claim and if you didn’t think he was town before his replacement, he’s definitely town nowIn post 3584, Vecna wrote:
You mean by NK or by lynch?In post 3581, gobbledygook wrote:
It’s okIn post 3580, Vecna wrote:Yeah sorry for my shit, this crap really has a tendency to make me overreact and bring out the worst
Spoiler: spoiler-
-
Vecna Survivor
- Survivor
- Survivor
- Posts: 11118
- Joined: June 15, 2016
Because im town.In post 3594, gobbledygook wrote:In post 3591, Trojan Horses wrote:
RC had a post that townpinged me and there was of course TM, where he faked a guilty on bleeding obvtown Duckling.In post 3427, Trojan Horses wrote:
I'd prefer Sushi. Nancy doesn't want me to hardpush RC and thinks his play is NAI (specifically, tunneling obvtown) for him. I had a conversation about Bayesian inference but stillIn post 3422, Vecna wrote:If on the other hand you have a functioning BULLSHIT RADAR, can you all please join me in lynching this obvscum?
She has however authorized me to defend you :3
-Stuxnet
How do you know?In post 3589, Vecna wrote:
Also, his claim was a lie dudeIn post 3586, gobbledygook wrote:
Lynch. I’m not really feeling the motion detector claim in light of RC’s claim and if you didn’t think he was town before his replacement, he’s definitely town nowIn post 3584, Vecna wrote:
You mean by NK or by lynch?In post 3581, gobbledygook wrote:
It’s okIn post 3580, Vecna wrote:Yeah sorry for my shit, this crap really has a tendency to make me overreact and bring out the worst
Spoiler: spoiler
And in case youre doubting that, riddle me this: has your night phase already ended for him to have received a result?-
-
Vecna Survivor
- Survivor
- Survivor
- Posts: 11118
- Joined: June 15, 2016
-
-
Vecna Survivor
- Survivor
- Survivor
- Posts: 11118
- Joined: June 15, 2016
-
-
Vecna Survivor
- Survivor
- Survivor
- Posts: 11118
- Joined: June 15, 2016
-
-
Vecna Survivor
- Survivor
- Survivor
- Posts: 11118
- Joined: June 15, 2016
-
-
Vecna Survivor
- Survivor
- Survivor
- Posts: 11118
- Joined: June 15, 2016
-
-
Vecna
-
-
Vecna Survivor
- Survivor
- Survivor
- Posts: 11118
- Joined: June 15, 2016
while browing through my old games I actually encountered one where Baezu was hydraing with RC.In post 3680, Trojan Horses wrote:
Why does RC getting force replaced make him definitely town..?In post 3586, gobbledygook wrote:I’m not really feeling the motion detector claim in light of RC’s claim and if you didn’t think he was town before his replacement, he’s definitely town now
@Kylo Ren: Vecna's "can we lynch him" post was directed towards RC.
@Baezu: Can you point me to instances from your games with RC where you scumread people for "picking fights" with RC? Nancy tells me that the last time she saw you in a game with RC you were very suspicious of him, and throughout this game it feels like you're trying to pocket him.
If Baezu can't produce instances of doing so, then I think she's a great wagon.
-Stuxnet
Made for me to go, huh, after he acted so surprised by all the shenanigans.-
-
Vecna Survivor
- Survivor
- Survivor
- Posts: 11118
- Joined: June 15, 2016
Is it really too much to ask to make up your own mind?In post 3732, We are not helping wrote:I kind of just want to sheep RC knowing his slot is most likely town.
How many votes are on Vecna?
-bitmap
If you really cannot see that his read wasnt even genuine but just based on frustration then I dno what to tell you.
Heck in his last posts he was even calling out different people as scum-
-
Vecna Survivor
- Survivor
- Survivor
- Posts: 11118
- Joined: June 15, 2016
-
-
Vecna Survivor
- Survivor
- Survivor
- Posts: 11118
- Joined: June 15, 2016
Also, I really do not see how this is AIIn post 3731, We are not helping wrote:
this slot is now 100% townIn post 3725, Eve wrote:hmm maybe i should sheep my predecessor's reads
-bitmap-
-
Vecna Survivor
- Survivor
- Survivor
- Posts: 11118
- Joined: June 15, 2016
-
-
Vecna Survivor
- Survivor
- Survivor
- Posts: 11118
- Joined: June 15, 2016
-
-
Vecna
-
-
Vecna Survivor
- Survivor
- Survivor
- Posts: 11118
- Joined: June 15, 2016
Also really interested in this......In post 3811, gobbledygook wrote:
Can you explain this for me?In post 3800, Lie Ren wrote:I figured out Almost50 from the Not_Mafia interactions-
-
Vecna Survivor
- Survivor
- Survivor
- Posts: 11118
- Joined: June 15, 2016
Im very close to it but want to give the slot a wee little bit more time to catch up to be certain. That acceptable to you? This also allows the rest of the replacements to settle in and do stuff as well. Id really like us to get to a stable gamestate with a bit more of a solve. Not a lot of time mind you.In post 3857, We are not helping wrote:vecna
olive branch?
come with me to paradise and lynch lie ren ty
As for my own reasoning to add a few more points to the discussion:
The preceding catchup posts from Lie ren:
-Question people over attacking me for my slot salvaging comment.
-Wants to see SirCakez reaction to me calling out the buzzwords.
-Then sees I was scumreading the slot a long time back.
Suddenly likes the Sircakez reasoning for scumreading me. 50% of that reasoning was my entrance. The other half was his comment about "long catchup walls are usually scummy". Two arguments here. GE has played with me a lot. He knows I always do long catchup walls when I replace in (unless the game really is astronomically long, but that happened like once). Second argument, Ive seen Gamma Emerald do long catchup walls as well. Heck he's doing them himself to some extent.
So what where you agreeing with in the SirCakez logic? And did you like his "I use buzzwords to reply faster?" Because that shows very little actual engagement with what you were apparently interested in before.-
-
Vecna Survivor
- Survivor
- Survivor
- Posts: 11118
- Joined: June 15, 2016
Yeah, lets not go there. I can confirm -this- to be true at least. Catch him in the genuineness of what he does post (which to be fair, aint great, but im not 100% there yet to call it scum).In post 3867, Lie Ren wrote:No I really am not. I have had effortful scum games and effortless town games. Don’t make me have to pull up examples of this for what might be this first time in over a year.
-
-
Vecna Survivor
- Survivor
- Survivor
- Posts: 11118
- Joined: June 15, 2016
He claimed himself he had a lot of faith in those reads from NSG.In post 3877, We are not helping wrote:ok but tbh why does rc care about nsg's read on you nancy
ur nancy and its rc, his reads on you should be like a divining rod
...yeah, I also didnt believe shit from that comment and it felt like he just wanted me to insult NSG to get more people to turn against me.-
-
Vecna Survivor
- Survivor
- Survivor
- Posts: 11118
- Joined: June 15, 2016
Lmao, wtf? I was the only one posting for a long time just like 10h before this post.In post 3915, SirCakez wrote:Just the fact Vecna has disappeared since RC, his main pusher, was replaced out is suspicious
I live in a different timezone. Youre really gonna be surprised im "disappearing" while its between midnight and 8am where I live?
fucking hell youre desperate to lynch me-
-
Vecna Survivor
- Survivor
- Survivor
- Posts: 11118
- Joined: June 15, 2016
Ok, im going to make my post describing in full what I think is happening this game. Youre all gonna call it Titus-levels of moonlogic, but stick with me please. I have some reasoning behind it, and some past "evidence" and experience that might back it up.
The premise of this episode of conspiracy theories is this:Spoiler:
A smart scumteam would realize that to win this game, you need to crush one side and dominate the other side. If you setup in such a way that one side of your scumteam pushes the other side to lynch one of your partners, itll make you look good and like the town leaders. This will set you up to win that side by controlling town actions. You make the designated bus target HARD PUSH the two scum members on the side that are meant to dominate. Youre not going to dominate both sides as scum, and you want to refrain from having a scum member in danger of a lynch on both sides. So you divide and conquer. Its a simple logical and strategic conclusion. After giving this some thought, Id predict any of our potential scum suspects could come up with this plan and would try to execute it after some internal discussion. Disclaimer: this theory is fully dependent on scum day chat.
So lets put the pieces in place. What have we had happen so far this game? Mastina has been playing really scummy this game. Like, truely, impressively scummy. Her initial shit was just wtf levels of scummy. It would almost fit her normal town-game how bad her reads were. The only thing she kept parroting was * SQUAAAAWK RC IS SCUM SQUAAAAWK *. But then, after a while, her posts suddenly started making sense to me. Like, she started talking to me with a purpose, a goal, and some clear-mindedness that is probably easy to miss if it is not directed at you. All the shit felt sensible to me. I could see all the things she pointed out make sense. Her claims that RC was manipulative early game were not true. He wasnt back then. Theres a reason everyone townreads him. He was pretty towny. But when I started talking about my Ren lie and Shuichi scumread he suddenly made a turn and started focussing a shitload of attention on me. Mastina started addressing me after this as well with her weird directed communication. Shortly after this she lol-hammered JJH. Completely uncharacterismatic as well, even for her as scum.
Im sure by now you can see the signals on the wall. Mastina has been designated as the fall guy. To make the other side look good. She saw she could even get a free mislynch on JJH, so obviously she took it, because it would ensure town would mislynch her the next day guaranteed - which was exactly the plan. Well, maybe she wasnt even on board with it, but RC has a way of making these plans even with unwilling volunteers as teammates. Regardless, the plan needed to be sold. RC normally isnt so aggresive and constantly hostile unless you really push him. We all witnessed the drama between Mastina and RC. They even went too far because they probably have drama in their scumchat going on, emotions got high. The mastina communication towards me had two intentions. Both to make RC and the teammate look good, and to make me look bad after she would be lynched and flip scum.
I present evidence part 1: viewtopic.php?f=56&t=76395
Cliff notes of this game: RC and Mathblade, both scum, bus eachother from the get go. This game was toxic on another level as well. Constant insults between them, even though they were teammates. Mathblade did not want to get bussed, but tough luck.
This is how players like Mastina and RC play as scum. They look at the setup, formulate a plan to victory, and take the steps needed to get there. They know how their actions will influence people. He said so himself several times this game.
Mastina claimed everyone on halloween was obv-town iirc. He just pointed to the two scum in RC and Shuichi (need to go back and read if this is actually true).
RC was laid back towards everyone, except Mastina. The intended patsy. Who needed to be destroyed in order for him to look good. Shuichi is also scumreading Mastina. I didnt see any devellopment there, but thats ok. THe scumread is obvious, after all. Mastina is obv-scum to pretty much everyone except people that were already suspicious towards shuichi and RC. Those two were targetted specifically, even though Mastina at the time did not know it would resonate with TH as well. Surprise, surprise, it worked and me and TH townread her for her posts. The plan probably wouldve worked. Mastina would get lynched, RC would be obv-town to everyone, and me and TH would be lynched.
The laidback attitude changed when people started interfearing with his plan. Both me and TH got suspicious of Shuichi and started pushing there. At the time it was two people, and Ren lui was also including in my pool of suspects. Along with Sircakez. Suddenly TH needed to get lynched (this mightve started a bit earlier). Suddenly I needed to get lynched. This seemed easy enough, since plenty of town were still suspicious of me. That is when the push on me started. He didnt state clearly that he scumread me. But he kept gently pushing people to vote me.
And then the force replace happened. That is the biggest flaw in this "wacky theory" really. Shuichi reported Mastina and RC (amongst others probably, but still). Maybe Scumchat also was toxic and she just had enough? Maybe the strategy wasnt fun. Maybe it was pushed way too far and the game was indeed made unfun. Maybe im a confbiasing idiot seeing flying saucers and planets colliding.
This ends todays episode of fanfic with Vecna. I mightve just solved the game. I mightve just made you all laugh out loud and decide it really is time to lynch me now. But goddamn, do all the pieces fit quite alright in a meh type of way.-
-
Vecna Survivor
- Survivor
- Survivor
- Posts: 11118
- Joined: June 15, 2016
Also, this missing night kill should give us pause.
Crosskilling is not stated to be impossible in the setup
The mod refuses to answer questions regarding whether scum can kill cross faction.
What if: Scum has the ability to NO KILL to receive a crosskill as a reward?
Would open up a lot of new scum strategies, so I think I could totally see Jingle adding something along those lines as option.
Which means scum would only need two mislynches in one faction-
-
Vecna Survivor
- Survivor
- Survivor
- Posts: 11118
- Joined: June 15, 2016
-
-
Vecna Survivor
- Survivor
- Survivor
- Posts: 11118
- Joined: June 15, 2016
Scum would need some pretty high powered shit to counter shit like doc and motion detectors in a small game like this.
The split game is already a major gimmick here. Dont think the setup would need a lot of "additional PR shit" to manage properly added on top to make for an interesting setup.
Also, my role pm gives me the impression that my role is one of the few things to count on as town to help us out.-
-
Vecna Survivor
- Survivor
- Survivor
- Posts: 11118
- Joined: June 15, 2016
Another alternative to consider: What if the scum members from the other side couldnt enter a NK?
No kill due to absence something worth to consider? We know Mastina's slot wasnt around. Not_mafia has been away for a long time. Elmo and a bunch of others have been very absent (although I think I saw elmo online yesterday)-
-
Vecna Survivor
- Survivor
- Survivor
- Posts: 11118
- Joined: June 15, 2016
-
-
Vecna Survivor
- Survivor
- Survivor
- Posts: 11118
- Joined: June 15, 2016
-
-
Vecna
-
-
Vecna Survivor
- Survivor
- Survivor
- Posts: 11118
- Joined: June 15, 2016
So lets talk about this Cakez. Has that post changed your read on me?In post 3981, SirCakez wrote:would I be insane if I said Vecna's moonlogic theory sort of makes sense?
I don't know if it's right but it's theoretically possible
I find it hard to believe mastina and RC are buddies though
P-edit: I want to see Shuichi respond to the case first
And GIF is getting replaced-
-
Vecna
-
-
Vecna Survivor
- Survivor
- Survivor
- Posts: 11118
- Joined: June 15, 2016
Christmas honestly feels like a waste of effort atm to try and read
Theres 2 slots that are like, town. Then 1 slot thats interesting because its mastina.
The rest is just completely unreadable lurkers. BBmolla was mildly towny early game but I know that those posts are not really AI for the slot, and I feel it couldve come from scum just the same.
Lynching there atm is just a damn black hole, and we shouldnt do it. Im even afraid of lynching Mastina after that auspicious no kill because.....scary-
-
Vecna Survivor
- Survivor
- Survivor
- Posts: 11118
- Joined: June 15, 2016
-
-
-
-
-
-
-