New York 196: My Game, My Flavor Mafia (Mafia Win)

[podoboq]

Now I'll say something to you. Cut the setup spec bullshit. It's not helpful, you're softclaiming that you ~*know*~ things, and you've been at least better than mediocre lately. Just. Stop.

Not setup spec. I know things. This game has more negative town utility, who have not claimed.
I'm only claiming that because it matters that Mafia Neapolitan is NOT a heavily important PR. If they didn't know of the presence of so many negative town utility already, it could have actively worked as a detriment to the mafia team.


I agree that the Mirhawk wagon is shit. I still don't see the value in the kraska wagon. Performer was meh, and kraska seems good.

[podoboq]

UNVOTE:
A doctor and a jailkeeper, though?

True. I'm inclined to believe Jailkeeper, though, especially since the Doctor is even-night only.

[podoboq]

I can confirm that Mirhawk is a doctor.

Varsoon is my favorite.

Do you intend to explain by what logic you're confirming Mirhawk, or should we just move on? I believe you. I'm just asking if you have any more to add. You said you can confirm two players based on their claims, correct?

[podoboq]

I can confirm that Mirhawk is a doctor.

Varsoon is my favorite.

Do you intend to explain by what logic you're confirming Mirhawk, or should we just move on? I believe you. I'm just asking if you have any more to add. You said you can confirm two players based on their claims, correct?

[podoboq]

I smell a rat.

Lynch either Dunnstral or Titus.

VOTE: Titus

Can we just end this?

Why did it take this long?
VOTE: Titus

[podoboq]

An Odd-Doc is likely yet should remain quiet (why Titus seemed to want another PR to claim was odd)

"odd"
double entendres

No, but seriously, can we lynch this slot already?

[podoboq]

With his level of activity it's doubtful he could resist a fart in an empty stadium.

sorry, I couldn't help myself

[podoboq]

odd-night doc isn't likely if we also have a jailkeeper, by the way, how many protective roles do you guys think we have...?

Many, because I think protective roles are bad this game. Ask me why later.

[podoboq]

I am a backup Nurse.
I know there is a Nurse and a Doctor in the game.
I had thought my role told me they were a

town

nurse and doctor, but it turns out that they could be any alignment.
At the very least, I can confirm their claim, which is likely to be town, imo.

Wait, there's backup doctor and a backup backup doctor?
I believe Dunn asked us how many protective roles we thought were in the game......

[podoboq]

I HAVEN'T READ ANYTHING.
WHAT'S UP MY N-WORDS?
DON'T WORRY, I'M TOWN
I'VE GOT YOUR BACK.

Consider the crumbs now that you know I'm a back-up Nurse.

This is hilarious.

Hey Varsoon, fun fact, there are other roles in the game this might be able to confirm.

I think there's another role floating out there I might be able to confirm because of this.

[podoboq]

The self-aware version of Nurse (receives a Nurse or Backup Doctor Role PM), and only this self-aware version of Nurse, is considered Normal on mafiascum.net.

"Backup is an acceptable modifier under Normal guidelines on mafiascum.net, both with and without its primary role present. Nurse and Deputy are acceptable names for Backup Doctor and Backup Cop, although they are not required."

All backups are considered normal as long as the role they are backing up is also normal. Backup Nurse, albeit weird, is normal.

[podoboq]

I don't see how we can essentially have 2 protective roles and 2 backup roles

If anything, there is no nurse and the backup nurse is just for the mafia neapolitan which seems likely actually

maybe mafia does have a traitor?

If there are two docs, backup nurse seems possible. Also, Varsoon's crumb is 100% believable.

You see what I mean now about mafia neapolitan being a garbage role for the scum team.

[podoboq]

Yeah, Wake, s'why I brought more attention to it when faking masons.
It works though, doesn't it?


Also, yes, it literally says BACKUP NURSE and not BACKUP DOCTOR.


And I imagine that if the Nurse becomes the Doctor, they are no longer the Nurse, which means I don't become the Doctor when they die, if that makes sense.

I am simply a backup for the backup.

Wait, so there seem to be some questions about your role. I suggest you PM the mod and get back to us when you have answers.

1) Please clarify. Is Varsoon a backup NURSE, not a backup DOCTOR?
2) If a Doctor dies, and the Nurse replaces that Doctor, is the Backup Nurse still able to upgrade into anything in the future?

[podoboq]

I don't think there's an actual nurse. I think he's a named townie

There's an actual nurse. I would gamble real money on that.

[podoboq]

I smell a rat.

Lynch either Dunnstral or Titus.

I am not entertaining this or similar with responses. Thread is bloated enough.

Obviously quote the thing that isn't directed to you rather than the real accusations that are deserving of respect and a response. That's totally towny, right?

[podoboq]

2. I only replace a NURSE when they die. Based on the wording of my role, if a NURSE becomes a DOCTOR, then when they die, I will not back them up.
I'll ask the mod, I guess?

I would assume that's correct. It's what conventional wisdom and precedent would imply.

Still worth asking for clarification. It pretty heavily impacts the power of your role.

[podoboq]

I smell a rat.

Lynch either Dunnstral or Titus.

I am not entertaining this or similar with responses. Thread is bloated enough.

Obviously quote the thing that isn't directed to you rather than the real accusations that are deserving of respect and a response. That's totally towny, right?

The accusation that I am scum does not by itself require a response every time my scumreads say it.

Maybe not, but when Mirhawk, the biggest wagon, calls your play shit and says that you're sheeping, and when someone accuses you of rolefishing, yeah, I think that requires a response.

My case on Dunn has nothing to do with his claim other then the fact that I don't believe it at all. It's that he repeatedly claimed that he had Doc protection when there was no way it happened. How do I know? I'm a even night doctor, I sure as hell didn't save him. Even if I had been able to act last night I wouldn't have targeted him because he was useless and loud all day long yesterday. The only reason he would ever possibly insist that he had protection is to make himself look more towny. Which actual town DOESN'T HAVE TO DO.

Just because Titus calls him town doesn't make it true, she's playing like shit this game and has regulated herself to just sheeping other players instead of actually trying to do anything.

Very interesting. Especially the last sentence.

Is there any other even/odd night willing to vouch?

If you aren't comfortable ok, but if you are that would help if Mir is town.

It looks like you're rolefishing.

It's OK to react to these, Titus.

[podoboq]

Future posts will be noted and marked spam, so you know just how much I do not care.

Is this what passes for town? Honestly?

[podoboq]

I don't see how we can essentially have 2 protective roles and 2 backup roles

If anything, there is no nurse and the backup nurse is just for the mafia neapolitan which seems likely actually

maybe mafia does have a traitor?

If there are two docs, backup nurse seems possible. Also, Varsoon's crumb is 100% believable.

You see what I mean now about mafia neapolitan being a garbage role for the scum team.

Yes, and they are informed of all the claims at start and all the claims are town.

VOTE: podog

We're playing the pronoun game I see? Who is "they?" What does that statement have to do with what I said?

Also:

I don't know why podoboq's name is so hard for people, it's symmetrical

[podoboq]

Holy fucknuts people. Someone come in here and tell me this is NOT how you play Mafia if you are Town!

This is not how I play mafia, period? It's objectively antitown.

[podoboq]

Scum. You literally just supposed all the claims were true and scum would believe that, and that's a basis for saying scum Neopolitan is shit?

Sounds like you know all the claims are town.

1) We KNOW there was a town Macho.
2) I believe Varsoon, because the crumb makes sense, and I townread him before his soft claim, regardless of his backup nurse claim.
3) I am inclined to believe that beeboy is a Miller. It just makes sense to me
4) Other stuff I know which have not claimed confirms that there are more garbage roles for Mafia Neapolitan to sniff out.

Literally all four of those are things I've said previously. So you're either not reading, or you're just misrepping me intentionally.

[podoboq]

I was Sheeping. Town has a too many leaders problem. Mirhawk can judge that as shit.

It's not rolefishing to ask if a role is possible in the least damaging way.

These are both legit and understandable responses. People don't necessarily have to agree with them; town has a right to hear a response and an explanation. We shouldn't have to force that out of you.

[podoboq]

Scum. You literally just supposed all the claims were true and scum would believe that, and that's a basis for saying scum Neopolitan is shit?

Sounds like you know all the claims are town.

1) We KNOW there was a town Macho.
2) I believe Varsoon, because the crumb makes sense, and I townread him before his soft claim, regardless of his backup nurse claim.
3) I am inclined to believe that beeboy is a Miller. It just makes sense to me
4) Other stuff I know which have not claimed confirms that there are more garbage roles for Mafia Neapolitan to sniff out.

Literally all four of those are things I've said previously. So you're either not reading, or you're just misrepping me intentionally.

Also, 5) I believe the even-night doctor claim circumstancially. While Mirhawk's claim itself doesn't necessarily look town to me, I believe there's an even-night doctor because of 1, 2, and 4.

[podoboq]

I was Sheeping. Town has a too many leaders problem. Mirhawk can judge that as shit.

It's not rolefishing

to ask if a role is possible in the least damaging way

.

HOLD THE PHONE.

That's not what you did.

That's not what you fucking did.

Is there any other even/odd night willing to vouch?

If you aren't comfortable ok, but if you are that would help if Mir is town.

It looks like you're rolefishing.

You asked if there is any other Even/Odd Night PR willing to vouch.

The only one we know of atm is Mirhawk. Meaning, you're asking for someone out in the ether to step forward and vouch.

LYNCH TITUS.

I don't believe it was the least damaging way to ask for someone to confirm Mirhawk, but I believe it's plausible that a towny could see it that way. This isn't that damning in my opinion.

[podoboq]

To clarify, I believe Titus was rolefishing, but her explanation of "I'm just trying to get someone to confirm Mirhawk, and I don't think the means by which I was asking them to do so is that damaging" is meh to me.

[podoboq]

@Wake, Yes. I asked someone to claim "I am an even or odd night role".

You know why there's issues. Some jackass cries Lynch Titus after every post.

You know why there's issues. Some jackass cries Lynch scum after every post.
Fixed that for you.


Also, if someone claimed "even-night something," does that confirm Mirhawk to you in some way? How?

[podoboq]

podog

I don't know why podoboq's name is so hard for people, it's symmetrical

There's no g in my name.

Also, shannon, I'm totally sigging this when this game ends.

[podoboq]

@Almost50 i recall podokhkjfjkl also saying neoplotian is not a strong role way back, I don't see how he would know this if he were scum

Is not a strong role in this game****

Here's my first mention of Mafia Neapolitan in this game.

I'm gonna go out on a limb here and say that Mafia Neapolitan is basically useless. We have at least one macho and a miller. I can imagine bussing Mafia Neapolitan, because it's barely better than mafia goon.

[podoboq]

is titus cornered scum or just being ridiculous at this point?
thoughts?

Or annoyed that the same people who tried to mislynch wagon me failed didn't get the hint after Vedith flipped scum and I was a big part so they asked again, they were directly told NO and they wait and they still do a last minute push at deadline, based on the fact I cease responding to every inane mental fart.

That would piss anyone off.

At deadline? Do I need to bring in the confused guy at the baseball game gif again, because I fucking will.

We have over five days. We're not at deadline. Also, I wasn't voting you when we lynched Vedith. Just saying.

[podoboq]

Are you fucking kidding me? Backup nurse? I claim backup even-night bodyguard, why not.

Somebody is bullshiting in Varsoon/Mirhawk/Almost50/beeboy. Interesting how most of the claims are made by people who weren't on Vedith wagon. Wonder why.

I 98% believe Varsoon and Mirhawk. I'm about 70% believing Almost50. Beeboy's claim is kind of negligible to me right now. It has nothing significant to do with the other claims out there.

If you refuse to believe the protective roles in the game because it seems too powerful or something, vote me and make me claim. Or you can just trust that there's something going on with this setup that's super cute, and go with it.

[podoboq]

podoboq, do you have a special reason to trust beeboy's miller claim as well? Just wondering

1) I townread beeboy. Don't know why. Mostly gut.
2) Setup spec on my part. There needs to be a cop to justify Miller, though, so going down this PR rabbit hole has made the claim look a little worse.
3) The way beeboy claimed looks honest. Claiming a negative utility with no pressure on day 2 right after replacing in would have been a weird play as scum.

[podoboq]

Silence, fool
Can you like
pipe down and chair the symposium?
Podo has been crumbling pr for a while now btw

I mean.....no? Sure? Maybe?

I've been claiming

S

O

M

E

T

H

I

N

G

, which gives me reason to not only believe, but expect that there are many town PRs, and that something is based on information unique to my slot.

If we end up wagoning anyone who's claimed a protective role (like Almost50), I plan to explain that.

[podoboq]

I want to know implosion and podoboq alignments the most.

I'm town. Not sure about implosion.

[podoboq]

We have around 5 days left. This vote is probably pointless because he can just pop in and claim some crap.

That's the idea, yeah. If people want to lynch me, they're dumb, but if that's going to be the trend, then do it so I can claim, you can realize that I'm definitely town, and we still have time to redirect elsewhere.

[podoboq]

We have around 5 days left. This vote is probably pointless because he can just pop in and claim some crap.

That's the idea, yeah. If people want to lynch me, they're dumb, but if that's going to be the trend, then do it so I can claim, you can realize that I'm definitely town, and we still have time to redirect elsewhere.

I was talking about implosion?

By that logic, what wagon isn't pointless? One on somebody's who has already claimed?

[podoboq]

We have around 5 days left. This vote is probably pointless because he can just pop in and claim some crap.

That's the idea, yeah. If people want to lynch me, they're dumb, but if that's going to be the trend, then do it so I can claim, you can realize that I'm definitely town, and we still have time to redirect elsewhere.

I was talking about implosion?

By that logic, what wagon isn't pointless? One on somebody's who has already claimed?

Let's just rope somebody and get on to D3, my patience is running out.

Agreed.
VOTE: Titus

My read on Boem is getting townier, by the way. He's looking more and more new the more I interact with him, and I wouldn't expect newb scum to be comfortable bussing, or saying stuff like this.

[podoboq]

Yeah uh I didn't realize we were in role madness btw; everyone is either a pr or softing one it feels like or some negative utility role

I claim Vanilla Townie.

By the way, that's the third VT claim. Titus and shannon have also claimed VT, just to remind everyone.

Role madness isn't plausible, so I don't know where Dunn's comment came from.

[podoboq]

Podo according to VC you were already voting Titus? Was that vote for emphasis or did you just want to feel special?


I'm gonna need this Titus wagon to cease and desist

Emphasis :3

[podoboq]

podoboq, do you have a special reason to trust beeboy's miller claim as well? Just wondering

2) Setup spec on my part. There needs to be a cop to justify Miller, though, so going down this PR rabbit hole has made the claim look a little worse.

This is strictly wrong on mafiascum; miller without a cop is perfectly valid in normal games, specifically so that you can't infer the presence of a cop from the presence of a miller. See the above link. It also happens in practice.

I misspoke. There needs to be a Cop to Justify Miller, but we can have a Miller without that kind of justification, and it can act as just a named townie. I know Millers can exist without cops, (and nurses without docs, etc), but a Miller without a Cop is more suspicious to me, because I think it

is

less likely.

[podoboq]

@Boem, It's not. I spell by sound. I can't say his name.

I always hear it in my head like Poe-doe-bock. I've heard some people say Poe-doe-boke, though. It is pronounceable.

[podoboq]

[podoboq]

Silence, fool
Can you like
pipe down and chair the symposium?
Podo has been crumbling pr for a while now btw

I mean.....no? Sure? Maybe?

I've been claiming

S

O

M

E

T

H

I

N

G

, which gives me reason to not only believe, but expect that there are many town PRs, and that something is based on information unique to my slot.

If we end up wagoning anyone who's claimed a protective role (like Almost50), I plan to explain that.

lol

Good job, kids.

[podoboq]

Not claiming today since what's the point?

I'll claim it tomorrow if it becomes important, or scum can just NK me, and you can figure it out pretty easily after I flip. Either way is fine by me.


Oh, also, Peregrine probably town. Mirhawk is also still probably town.

[podoboq]

I've been claiming

S

O

M

E

T

H

I

N

G

, which gives me reason to not only believe, but expect that there are many town PRs, and that something is based on information unique to my slot.

If we end up wagoning anyone who's claimed a protective role (like Almost50), I plan to explain that.

I just realized I misspoke here. Should say
"...which gives me reason to not only believe, but expect that there are many town

protective roles

..."

I apologize for the mistake and apologize if it caused any confusion.

[podoboq]

Role madness isn't plausible, so I don't know where Dunn's comment came from.

Really? Look at all the random claims

Including yours

The following quotes from the wiki:

"Role Madness refers to a type of game where most or all of the players have power roles; that is, there are few to no true Vanilla Townies."

"The game must contain at least one Vanilla Townie (allowed names include: Townie, Vanilla Townie, Townsperson, Citizen). A sample Role PM for the Vanilla Townie must be included in the rules post."


In my opinion, true role madness requires there be no vanilla town at all, which inherently can't be normal.
It's likely that we have at least two VTs, which I definitely wouldn't consider role madness.

[podoboq]

Why do you believe there are town protective roles, as opposed to scum protective roles?

Does your role hint at the difference?

Town specific. There might also be scum protective roles, but I believe there is definitely an above average number of town protective roles.

[podoboq]

That's pretty much role madness man

Alright, then it's just a semantic thing and we can drop it.

Regardless, it is required that there be at least one VT. That's all we really know.

[podoboq]

No one seems to have an odd/even night role. That suggests Mirhawk is lying.

I'm ignorant about this stuff
Do they have to come together?

No, but they usually do.
However, Titus is wrong to assume that nobody else has an odd/even role. Mirhawk's wagon dissolved after his claim. Nobody else needed to claim odd/even in order to bolster his claim, so it's better for them to not reveal that information.

Titus is likely rolefishing.

[podoboq]

Quick thoughts -- Mirhawk might be lying. I'm not sure. I wonder why PV didn't claim doctor soon after Mirhawk did. He waited until L-1... 5 or 6 posts in to claim doc. Clearly I'll find that out soon.

According to PV, he didn't even see it. Someone else had to update him on everyone's claims.

[podoboq]

Would there really be a 2-shot mafia neapolitan with like 2 vanilla town

Yes Dunn. This is part of why I'm pointing out how bad that role is in this setup.

[podoboq]

Seems unfair from a mafia perspective tho if they have basic roles

......or something else is going on to offset the power of our power roles.

[podoboq]

Nurse would also inherit from a scum doc.

That being said B's right, there are too many protectives. I think fifty would have to be scum unless they have some serious power.

I protected podoboq last night.

Vote: fifty

I think our setup is light on full power roles hence the double backups, the half doc, and the one shot vig. I don't think the full JK sense with thus.

You're wrong about a lot of things.

I'm V/LA, so not really gonna get a big chance to engage until late tomorrow. That said, here we go.

I'm Macho.

WHAT THE FUCK IS HAPPENING

I thought the other large I played was chaos, but what even is this? We have two different mason pair claims, four macho claims (I think two were serious), and one of the masons is also macho? Like, do the other masons want to claim a modifier too while we're at it?

Are they all macho? Is every townie macho this game? Do our protective roles serve any purpose?

(This isn't a crumb, it's a train of thought. If you doubt the validity of my claim, please read my ISO and just go ahead and ctrl-f macho.)

I think our protective roles are offset by roles that can't be protected. We have at least 2 machos. I'm gonna guess that we have a (x-shot?) strongman mafia. Mirhawk just demonstrated why the doctors suck this game. He just tried to save a macho.

[podoboq]

I'm going to bed. Having too much fun in DC. See you in about 24 hours.

Hope I left you all with a fun nugget of information to chew on.

[podoboq]

VOTE: Mirhawk
Thanks for making this day super easy while I'm V/LA.

[podoboq]

I'm sigging this if nobody stops me.

"Podog" - Titus
"podokhkjfjkl" - kraska
"I don't know why podoboq's name is so hard for people, it's symmetrical" - shannon

[podoboq]

Podo - Obviously potential PR here and if he is a nurse, this is a big win as he'll be the doc now.

Eating bullets as negative town utility is the best.

[podoboq]

Too bad it didn't work, and they killed Titus instead.