New York 181 -- Game Over

[Garmr]

confirming

[Garmr]

^No your softboiled

[Garmr]

well I didn't see the second page form lol.

[Garmr]

wait that's 18 isn't it

VOTE: TSO

[Garmr]

Look I'm omgusing

VOTE: Texcat

[Garmr]

Vote:Garmr

Reaplacing out just to get scot free after we caught you inexcusable

Someone Didn't read the after game I was getting annoyed because I really thought axle and boon skies (which I didn't mention) were opposing scum (axle because of his behavior, boon skies because he was the same role as me and I thought the opposing scum team had all the same roles.) You guys wouldn't touch them so I raged. Didn't think they would turn out town.

That aside I'm more curious as to why wake voted egg only to quickly shift it to shiro. Instead of making two competing wagons me and egg, He made It so we 2v3v2. It feels suspicious because he changed his vote only 2 mins after he voted egg. Someone would only do that if they were cautious of the rvs stage.

Serious vote.

VOTE: wake

[Garmr]

Fudge my preview for some reason only showed dragonspawns post. Wake jumped back onto egg I still don't like his voting pattern.

[Garmr]

That's a rather straight forward approach ika. How about I do the same with you? Are you scum?

I'm hungry. Maybe I'll get some donuts. What kind do you like? How about the rest of you?

god i want to think of something snarky to say to it but im drawing a blank.

no im not scum im town

I'm totally flattered but I'm not God.

Ha, that's funny. Donuts with chocolate icing are the best.

I remember when the crispy cream opened up here people lined up outside it for 3 days before opening for some free donuts(One years worth). Kinda sad really. Oh I'm the same as silver wolf Chocolate icing here and my fave icecream flavor is rum and raisins. (Normally I hate raisins through lol)

[Garmr]

if i had to put it into words, i guess i dislike that he said the 2v3v2 thing. his vote on wake looks like someone who spotted something odd and decided to do some digging to see how they could justify a vote.

Wait so you noticed that wake is acting odd as well (different than normal wake) and you feel no need to question him?

[Garmr]

You guys are killing me with that food discussion, take pity on the poor person who's on a diet

*cough*Waffles>Pancakes*cough*

VOTE: Nikanor

if i had to put it into words, i guess i dislike that he said the 2v3v2 thing. his vote on wake looks like someone who spotted something odd and decided to do some digging to see how they could justify a vote.

You're digging even harder than Garmr. So you agree with him that something's up with Wake?

watch this

[Garmr]

No.

I think I know what you're getting at. But I want to hear you say it.

[Garmr]

Garmr, pretty slick avatar you got going there.

Thank you

[Garmr]

if i had to put it into words, i guess i dislike that he said the 2v3v2 thing. his vote on wake looks like someone who spotted something odd and decided to do some digging to see how they could justify a vote.

Wait so you noticed that wake is acting odd as well (different than normal wake) and you feel no need to question him?

yup the rvs thing was odd. but you're trying to twist it into something scummy.
(i have no idea how wake normally plays, the rvs thing was objectively odd).
but the main thing i dislike is the fact that you brought up the 2v3v2 thing.

like how could that even be intentional on his part, nobody actually looks at the vote count and goes "hmmmm i think i want the wagons to look like THIS."

it looks like you're trying to take something that means nothing and turn it into something alignment-indicative.

Damn garmr you're awesome so freaking awesome

Scum do as they want to look for as many possible chances to mislynch someone as possible

Also let me point out how wake normally plays. He usually takes between 49 to 70 post to make one vote.

[Garmr]

Scum do, as they want to look for as many possible chances to mislynch someone as possible

yes, that is what i am saying, ty for the translation

Sorry forgot to put a comma in there.

[Garmr]

That aside I'm more curious as to why wake voted egg only to quickly shift it to shiro. Instead of making two competing wagons me and egg, He made It so we 2v3v2. It feels suspicious because he changed his vote only 2 mins after he voted egg. Someone would only do that if they were cautious of the rvs stage.
Serious vote.

vote: wake

The part about competing RVS wagons is silly, including the explanation given in 100, but the part about his cautiousness is right.

Dragonspawn does nothing but fluffing and so many players has gone along with him.

We should remember who was pushing the Wake-wagon and who was pushing the Garmmrn-wagon.

Egg?

[Garmr]

Silverwolf: I've never met Dragonspawn before.
I usually fluff a lot but I'm not fluffing Today.

Gammrnmhrm: what about him?

Oh misread what you said thought you said and was making a guess as to which player you were talking about.

[Garmr]

Vote:Garmr

Reaplacing out just to get scot free after we caught you inexcusable

Someone Didn't read the after game I was getting annoyed because I really thought axle and boon skies (which I didn't mention) were opposing scum (axle because of his behavior, boon skies because he was the same role as me and I thought the opposing scum team had all the same roles.) You guys wouldn't touch them so I raged. Didn't think they would turn out town.

That aside I'm more curious as to why wake voted egg only to quickly shift it to shiro. Instead of making two competing wagons me and egg, He made It so we 2v3v2. It feels suspicious because he changed his vote only 2 mins after he voted egg. Someone would only do that if they were cautious of the rvs stage.

Serious vote.

VOTE: wake

If anything, I'm curious about why you'd take joke votes so seriously, and apparently try to weave them into something they aren't.

Why

exactly do you think they were serious? I expect a damned good answer from you on this, Garmr.

I'm half dead been up all night but. If they were both rvs why not just stick to the egg wagon it just seems like a really cautious move.

[Garmr]

I still don't like his voting pattern.

You should explain this in detail, because in my opinion two non-serious votes aren't a pattern at all.

You don't vote this early for one. Through it has been almost a year since we played.

[Garmr]

Why do you think I can't take the pleasure of making two RVS votes in rapid succession? What are you trying to do here?

And you honestly don't know me too well, nor do you know current underlying circumstances, which affect my ability to play.

If I were able, I'd be amassing thorough, well-written reads on an occasional basis.

Just doesn't seem like you. I don't know you personally but I remember the games we played the drama you caused at the time and the way people talked and how I looked into you.

[Garmr]

also i will divine if elusive is town or not very early on starting with this:

elusive are you scum?

I'm town, yay.


However, this leads me into RVS Questions for Town (Scum Plz Do Not Answer So We Know Who U R)
1. Which do you like being more? Town or scum?
2. What is your second favoritest color?
3. Are you scum?
4. What is your spirit animal?
5. What are your favorite scum hunting strategies and how do they work?

Oh and bonus question for like the Truly Amazing:

Who is the most dangerous player (for either alignment) in this game's player list and why?

1.Scum it's easier
2.Blue
3.yes
4.Wolf
5.Making myself look like a idiot and easy lynch just to bam lynch two scum in a row with a awesome argument.

Most dangerous player other than me for being a wild card umm ika his more of a wildcard than me.

[Garmr]

Why do you think I can't take the pleasure of making two RVS votes in rapid succession? What are you trying to do here?

And you honestly don't know me too well, nor do you know current underlying circumstances, which affect my ability to play.

If I were able, I'd be amassing thorough, well-written reads on an occasional basis.

Just doesn't seem like you. I don't know you personally but I remember the games we played the drama you caused at the time and the way people talked and how I looked into you.

Hope you have a good understanding of what you're talking about, buddy, because your post here isn't making any sense.

I don't see what doesn't make sense through?

@Egg Just curious who are your top three scum reads.

[Garmr]

However, this leads me into RVS Questions for Town (Scum Plz Do Not Answer So We Know Who U R)
1. Which do you like being more? Town or scum?
2. What is your second favoritest color?
3. Are you scum?
4. What is your spirit animal?
5. What are your favorite scum hunting strategies and how do they work?

Oh and bonus question for like the Truly Amazing:

Who is the most dangerous player (for either alignment) in this game's player list and why?

1. Town power roles are my favorite.
2. Blue?
3. No.
4. Don't have one
5. If I told you that, they wouldn't work in this game.
Bonus: House. He's reckless and doesn't give two shits. And he's actually a pretty good player on top of that.

Wake, all I'm saying is that my major point against you in Fire and Ice where you were scum can now be applied to this game. I'm still open to the possibility that it's just a general thing for all of your games, but it's scummier than anything else in the first five pages.

Aneninen, I actually liked your old style. And I'm kind of worried that if you are town I'm going to mistakenly read you as scum here because limiting yourself to a specific amount of sentences can make your posts come off as fake or forced. It's better to post more naturally in my opinion. Not that being more concise is a bad thing. Just your system might be taking things too far.

Ika, why do you think it would be obvious that you prefer to be town?

Anen, you were acting like Gamr and Wake were the only wagons and ignored mine entirely in Post 104 when you said we should remember who is pushing Gamr and Wake. I find this even more interesting now that I realize you were voting me at the time that you said that.

Silver, all you did is repeat what you've already said. I get that you think Wake started this game differently than you're used to and I get that he had a scum game with a similar start. What I'm asking is specifically why Wake RVS voting rather than being cautious is scum motivated. Not everything that is weird is because the person is scum. Tell me what is going on in Wake's head that makes him lay RVS votes specifically because he is scum. To answer your question the fact that he doesn't want to be read is scummy because town should WANT people to know that they are town. Only scum should worry about whether people can read them or not. See above though. This might be something that he says all the time and not even alignment related. I haven't exactly decided how I feel for sure yet.

Gamr, I don't have strong scum reads yet, but top three as of right now: I guess Wake, Anen, and you.

Good enough I'm all down for a wake wagon.

[Garmr]

On a quick note I have a slight town read on dave even through he hasn't posted much. This one post just rings town to me.

I haven't played with Wake before. I did notice a post saying he changes style over time because he doesn't like being read. Not liking being read sounds odd to me, but probably more a personal preference thing.

Making note of who is making note of the change in Wake. SilverWolf, Garmr, Nikanor, House, and Egg, not in that order. I'd be really surprised if more than two of these are scum together. If Wake is town I might look in this list for scum, but it's entirely possible they're primarily town and the difference in Wake is indeed because he's scum.

You can really see him trying to figure things out which scum don't really need to do because they already know. It comes across as genuine and gives off some pretty town vibes.

[Garmr]

@texcat
I have no clue who your scum reading. Give some reasoning and thought thank you.

[Garmr]

liking House, texcat for town.
Wake, elusive, dragonspawn look scummy. elusive less so than the others, just one post is pinging me, where she got her back up over the sauron joke.
all my reads are conflicting though. like, probably only one of garmr/wake and one of dragon/elusive are scum. but i'm scumreading all four. it sucks.
whine whine whine

i also just skimmed five pages so my reads are prob shit

Like I said before I can't read tex cat as his post little content what makes him town?

[Garmr]

i'm too cool for quizzes.

i liked tex's answer to albert's question. she seems chill.

texcat, your analysis on the game state and the players therein, please.

LOL, the only conclusion I've come to so far is that there are a lot of players who are hungry for breakfast.

So you got a town read from fluff how??????

[Garmr]

Nikanor You totally ignored my question. How did you get a town read out of a joke. (even through i did have a chuckle at it).


UNVOTE: wake

VOTE: Nikanor

Nikanor is playing a game of survival. I didn't think much of the time because I was focused on wake but lets look over some of the events.

1.She voted me with a blank vote but only felt like giving a reason when pressed. Her reason was hypocritical and reaching. I feel like she wouldn't of even given a reason if not pushed. This shows she wasn't interested on pushing my wagon and was content with being on it.

2.

liking House, texcat for town.
Wake, elusive, dragonspawn look scummy. elusive less so than the others, just one post is pinging me, where she got her back up over the sauron joke.
all my reads are conflicting though. like, probably only one of garmr/wake and one of dragon/elusive are scum. but i'm scumreading all four. it sucks.
whine whine whine

i also just skimmed five pages so my reads are prob shit

If she was town I think she would factor we have two scum parties (4 mafia goons and 1 sk) and this is likely a slip in her thinking.

3.She seems to be dishing out some reads with out reasoning. Texcat is a good example she is just town reading her because of texcats joke and when I pressed forward on it ignored me completely. Looking through all her post they lack proper reasoning.

[Garmr]

hello are you guys just going to ignore my post on nik?

[Garmr]

@Silverwolf

What do you think of nik?

[Garmr]

@Klingoncelt

Just realized were I seen your name before you were the worst on my valentines list.

Klingoncelt:14.01% tsk tsk

[Garmr]

Nikanor can be town for his observation on wake even though I disagree with it being scummy. From my experience wake's posts are just fluffy and I do admit to not always reading the longer ones

House's reads are shallow. I don't see him analyzing intentions, just going after actions that in their current context that should be null.

This reasoning to read nik as town is just as artificial as niks town read on tex. Nik only really called wake scummy with little to no reasoning and then told wake to make his walls smaller. There is no conviction in her scum reads at all. Also have those observations actually contributed anything?

[Garmr]

Nikanor You totally ignored my question. How did you get a town read out of a joke. (even through i did have a chuckle at it).

uh no i didn't ignore your question, i said i thought she seems chill.

I meant I asked you why that would be considered a town read.

i'm too cool for quizzes.

i liked tex's answer to albert's question. she seems chill.

texcat, your analysis on the game state and the players therein, please.

LOL, the only conclusion I've come to so far is that there are a lot of players who are hungry for breakfast.

So you got a town read from fluff how??????

1.She voted me with a blank vote but only felt like giving a reason when pressed. Her reason was hypocritical and reaching. I feel like she wouldn't of even given a reason if not pushed. This shows she wasn't interested on pushing my wagon and was content with being on it.

I voted you on like page 3. give me a break

Doesn't matter it's the fact you reacted the way you did.

If she was town I think she would factor we have two scum parties (4 mafia goons and 1 sk) and this is likely a slip in her thinking.

i did factor that in. i figured the chances were negligible and i was gonna be wrong on at least one pairing anyway so i ignored it since the point of the post was to bitch anyway.

You show no signs of factoring just this person can't be scum with this person ect.

3.She seems to be dishing out some reads with out reasoning. Texcat is a good example she is just town reading her because of texcats joke and when I pressed forward on it ignored me completely. Looking through all her post they lack proper reasoning.

dw, my inscrutability means i'm town. i have reasons for all my reads, i just choose not to share most of them bc they'd sound like bs.

[/quote]
If even you think they sound bs shouldn't that tell you something? It comes off to me that you're dodging giving a valid reason.

[Garmr]

a) texcat seems relaxed in the face of questioning.
b) if you actually find a vote without a reason on page 3 scummy then i have no words.
c) i don't need to explicitly post everything if the intent behind the post (to whine) was clear anyway.
d) the scholar should be wary of declaring his discoveries, lest he be accused of witchery and hanged.

A) That's ok but there really isn't to much pressure on anyone at the moment the wagon haven't even been past 6 yet. So really that's null as scum probs don't have pressure with this situation.

B)That's not what I found scummy I found that you felt need to give reasoning only after being pushed scummy don't try to twist things please.

C)Yeh but you proceed to devalue all your reads, By saying stuff like I just skimmed these pages or all those were silly.

D)Yeh but if you don't throw anything out here how do you expect to get anywhere.

[Garmr]

a) whatever you say bub
b) ok so let's take a step back here. please explain why you find my reasoning hypocritical and reaching. and also explain why i should have to push a wagon based on one post on page two. i'm sure i could look through your past games and find a similar situation where someone has made a serious vote early without explaining what it was about until asked. have you attacked everyone who has done this? if not, what's different about this game, or what's different about the way i did it.
c) again, the intent was to bitch about having too many conflicting scumreads, not to provide scumreads.
d) i generally have to wait until my scumreads make a post that i can reapond to with buzzwords, otherwise people just brush me off. vOv

A.Others had said this to toots

B. Your basically saying I was reaching for a reason when you yourself had to reach for a reason after being pushed to explain yourself. The fact you actually felt a need to shows you want acceptance It was also obvious you took time to think of the reason after the vote not before by your post in between the vote and the reason. It's all the small things that add up to one scummy post You haven't really invalidated any of my reason. Also I don't think I have reacted the same way as town scrambling to find a reason after be asked why.

C. You were still posting game relevant information your point which included your scum reads so what if you were bitching? Also that a strawman argument as you taken this way far away from the original topic.

D.Why was it different then when you were pushed by dragonspawn. Why didn't you wait for one of these buzz words.

[Garmr]

Wow my spelling and grammar suck donkey dick at 3 am in the morning. Having a coffee while I read.

[Garmr]

hello are you guys just going to ignore my post on nik?

No and I think he's scummy, so give examples about him playing a game of survival, please!

Other than most of the things I said about being reactionary game being mostly responses with very little of her own initiative. When things are done off her own accord she discredits them as bitching or they have very little impact in the first place.(Wakes so called walls for example.) She's playing a very safe and flexible scum game.





Talking about wakes post after taking the time to read them again here's a short summary of some of them after a certain point. These are the ones that stood out to me.

There's a lot of ass kissing in 223

Wakes 251 scatter shot would be a lot better if it was a focus shot in my opinion. It's null through and I can't find anything wrong with it.

Wake 313 Basically saying post more I find you scummy and like a act? I don't know it just reads weird like his telling Deltawave to buck up instead of actually pressuring. Kinda null- scummy I guess more confusing.

My opinion of you hasn't really changed much.

[Garmr]

a) whatever you say bub
b) ok so let's take a step back here. please explain why you find my reasoning hypocritical and reaching. and also explain why i should have to push a wagon based on one post on page two. i'm sure i could look through your past games and find a similar situation where someone has made a serious vote early without explaining what it was about until asked. have you attacked everyone who has done this? if not, what's different about this game, or what's different about the way i did it.
c) again, the intent was to bitch about having too many conflicting scumreads, not to provide scumreads.
d) i generally have to wait until my scumreads make a post that i can reapond to with buzzwords, otherwise people just brush me off. vOv

A.Others had said this to toots

B. Your basically saying I was reaching for a reason when you yourself had to reach for a reason after being pushed to explain yourself. The fact you actually felt a need to shows you want acceptance It was also obvious you took time to think of the reason after the vote not before by your post in between the vote and the reason. It's all the small things that add up to one scummy post You haven't really invalidated any of my reason. Also I don't think I have reacted the same way as town scrambling to find a reason after be asked why.

C. You were still posting game relevant information your point which included your scum reads so what if you were bitching? Also that a strawman argument as you taken this way far away from the original topic.

D.Why was it different then when you were pushed by dragonspawn. Why didn't you wait for one of these buzz words.

a) the majority is typically incorrect bby
b) i) how was it reaching, i said your point was bs because wakescum would not specifically want a 2v3v2 wagon instead of a 3v3 wagon. ii) the fact that i felt a need to answer the guy shows that i'm not a complete asshole. iii) it was obvious i took the time to think about it when i said "if i had to put it into words". iv) "scrambling" lool v) you never showed me my supposed hypocrisy, pls amend.
c) it's not a strawman, i've said before that the reason i didn't mention the minimal possibility that i might be correct on one of my two dichotomies was because i wanted to sound like a puny little girl and considering that possibility would have been contradictory to my goal. ik you're just going to keep arguing that since i wasn't explicit it doesn't count tho.
d) i had

H

O

P

E

that this game might be different but guess what, the next two posts after mine included the usual brushoff so i guess that's just normal old hopeless life for you.

A)is going nowwhere I'll just accept you can't provide a good enough anwser.

B)i)You admitted yourself only scum think about wagon positioning. So it should be a tool to hunt scum with (even if it's just to break rvs.) Instead you attacked my reasoning even through you thought wake was scummy. ii)No it shows you are cautious of what others think of you. iii)It's not hard to say because of 2v3v2 thing looks like reaching I don't think you need like 40 mins for that. iv)Lol v)The hypocrisy was you accused me of reaching while reaching yourself.


C)I don't find your explanation valid and your going to stick by it and bring it full circle there is no point as I been caught in these circular arguments to many times before and I lost a game because of it.

D)Is more of a emotional response than a logical one.

[Garmr]

I see the case for elusive but I don't feel like she is to scummy for it personally more of a null. I would like to see her thoughts on peoples posts other than the quiz which she is starting to do but hasn't seemed to let go of that yet.

[Garmr]

@elusive
Isn't asking for more information about peoples just another way of saying give me a read ;/. I stick by my thought you haven't let go of that quiz.

Ika,

Spoiler:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Mo4cmTaEDIk

Since when have you known me not to be able to handle a little pressure? I've been in two Titus tunnels, I've yet to see anyone top that

I was in a Titus tunnel off site once and here in a game once. I was town both times. She thought I was scum. I sympathize.

SilverWolf, I am blocking some of the trauma now but it was hundreds of back and forth posts (long ones too). And the first time we were both town. The second time though she was scum and I was town and I turned off my instincts and she totally owned that game. Titus is the best and also most frustrating mafia player I know. I could go on and on about her, lol.

Flubber, are you speaking of a particular occurrence in the thread or being passive aggressive or castles in the sky? Be direct, it doesn't cost extra.

On a side note I have never ever been wrong about titus alignment in all of my forum games and out of the skype games I was wrong about 3 times out 50-70? she has always been wrong about mine on forum gave . I have been in a titus scum tunnel multiple times I always seem to come out on top.

I just finished a game where I got her lynched as soon as she replaced in. (tbf her slot was null to most except i was scum reading it when she came in.) Not only did she try tunneling me but it caused her teammate that was in a good position to be outed and he got lynched lylo because of it. (Well one of the reasons)


http://forum.mafiascum.net/viewtopic.php?f=2&t=60083

I think honestly it's my play style that puts titus off as I'm not a normal type of person. As fferylt puts it I have a scum mindset. (This was an excuse to brag)

[Garmr]

I answer all questions that come my way as only scum needs to be difficult.

I'm assuming you have experience on another site. The meta on mafia scum is different than other sites I looked at and from what I heard the site titus is on is extremely different. Due to the amount of elitist on this site it's more strict. There will be scum that answer your questions cause people have caught on to thinking like this ages ago.

While you consider titus the best player. On this site she is around average (some consider her below average due to her uniqueness) as am I (Through I feel like my scum game is typically above average I feel like I finally got my town on a level where it's suitable just needs to be less gambity so decided to pick a open set up where it be less tempting to gambit)


There are power houses like thor(scum powerhouse),fferylt(town powerhouse),Slandaar and desperado(to lesser extents). This isn't even mentioning the veterans that retired from mafia.

[Garmr]

Is anybody following nik vs. garmr right now because I really can't right now.

I also want to note that I stalled a discussion that almost got me pegged as scum once by responding to each line of someone's post by numbering/outlining it. If you're attacking the lines of a post you're probably not actually attacking the post itself.

garmr is really good at saying "i fundamentally disagree with the way you play mafia and i think you're scum for it" in incredibly circuitous ways.
me breaking it down into lines is the only way to show people that he's full of shit.

you've proved nothing other than you can't debate for shit. I'd like to point other people think your answers are inadequate as well not just me.

[Garmr]

@Klingoncelt

Just realized were I seen your name before you were the worst on my valentines list.

Klingoncelt:14.01% tsk tsk

I only answered about half the questions. Maybe I would have done better if I finished the thing.

If you got over 70% I would gave you a free town read

[Garmr]

inadequate != incorrect bby

inadequate = lacking the quality or quantity required; insufficient for a purpose

[Garmr]

inadequate leaves room for error, if i ask for a bright red room and you give me paint that is slightly too dull, you are inadequate but not incorrect.
but i was just joking anyway, the difference between the two words is insignificant.
but while we're on the subject of jokes, the fact that you've had to go back to "but other ppl agree w meeee" for a second time now is kinda hilarious.

It doesn't matter if your right or wrong on Texcat as town you would need a good reason to town read someone. You town read Texcat and when asked on the reasoning you gave fluff aka she's funny and confident.

Also talking about jokes trying to use word play to disregard my scum read because you got caught red handed is pretty funny.

[Garmr]

Also all your reads seem improvised nik. This isn't a town trait.

[Garmr]

like, you say in one breath that the people in this game are of below-average skill, then in another you try to pass it off as a good thing that they're agreeing with you. it's amazing.

p-edit: oh god he's doing the thing

@Nik talking about painting things scummy. In those sentences did I ever refer to anyone in this game? It was more off topic about players I respect and veiw as =. How meta can be different.

[Garmr]

like, you say in one breath that the people in this game are of below-average skill, then in another you try to pass it off as a good thing that they're agreeing with you. it's amazing.

p-edit: oh god he's doing the thing

@Nik talking about painting things scummy. In those sentences did I ever refer to anyone in this game? It was more off topic about players I respect and veiw as =. Also How other sites meta can be different from this one thus changing the way we hunt.

Edited for better understanding

[Garmr]

@Shiro

Hey, I just null read you,
And this is crazy,
But here's my call out,
So change it, maybe!

[Garmr]

@Shiro

Hey, I just null read you,
And this is crazy,
But here's my call out,
So change it, maybe!

Hey, I just read that
And this is crazy.
But I can't do that
So keep it, maybe


Funny songs aside, if you have any questions towards me feel free to ask

Ok a couple of questions.

1. Who's yah scum reads and what's the scummiest thing about them.
2.What's your thoughts on nik now?
3.Are you ready to vote yet and push a stance

[Garmr]

@Shiro

Hey, I just null read you,
And this is crazy,
But here's my call out,
So change it, maybe!

Hey, I just read that
And this is crazy.
But I can't do that
So keep it, maybe


Funny songs aside, if you have any questions towards me feel free to ask

I got one, whos do you suspect is sk? (yes there is a motive for my sk hunt)

Look hard at Egg, Garmr, and Wake. Tell me what you think.

Garmrs sexy.

[Garmr]

@ika Honestly? No idea. This is my first game with sk. I do not really know what to look for.

@Garmr
1.delta for being his whole fight with Wolfe is really bad IMHO. his you tell me why you aren't scum is pretty bs as well. Egg's point of bad town play why as scum yada yada is just meh as well

Nik but if you ask why I don't really have a this and that long. Call it gut
Egg but pretty mild I didn't really like his reads and I found some of his reasons kinda meh like,mine included. I haven't really done anything worthy of a slight town read.

2.Look above

3.No I am not ^_^ I don't really have anything that could even be called remotely called a case

@elusive
you still haven't told me what you gathered from the quiz reactions D:

Oh ok how much persuasion does it take to get your vote on the nik wagon. -bakes shiro a cake-

@NIK
hey nik

Nik but if you ask why I don't really have a this and that long. Call it gut

This is an example of what I was talking about and expected a town you to do or at least a competent scum you.

[Garmr]

^That last bit was a stab nik learn the difference

[Garmr]

@Garmr hmm I dunno maybe two cakes? But tgen again bribery seems like such a naughty thing. Let alone tgat the cake has a tendency to be a lie

So KC, what do you think about the fact SW rolled scum this game?

what makes you think so? I have been townreading her thus far.

No one and half cakes and that's my final offer.

[Garmr]

@Elusive
That's incorrect my reason was I was scum in a multi scum faction game and had a scum read on a guy(axle and lynching him was impossible. Axle had walls and walls and he did my head in. The so called thing I was caught on wasn't even correct. He implied i made a slip about knowing boon got shot. My faction didn't even shoot boon.

Also I wasn't even the biggest wagon at the time I left. Thor was at 5 I was at 4 With both my scum buddies already on it. It also took 9 to lynch. I had plenty of leg room to talk my way out of it. But axle was god axle gave me head aches I just can't deal with him as town or scum.

[Garmr]

I also hate multi faction games. (third party roles are ok as long as they aren't faction like.)

[Garmr]

actually it may of been 5/5 between me or thor. It was in between vote counts I quit and I can't be stuffed reading it all again and reading that guys posts.

[Garmr]

Thinks I got from the last two pages.

I think silver wolfs town from her reactions in this convo alone. I don't think she has the heart to fake a emotional response like that.

I think that klingons probably the sk. She seems to have gotten wrapped up about it and by pushing the sk label on silver I think she thinks it's actually her attempt distancing herself from the role in the future.

[Garmr]

"Things I got" I mean.

I don't know about house through I would normally scum read other people for what his doing but well it's house.

[Garmr]

"I think she thinks it's actually."

[Garmr]

Thinks I got from the last two pages.

I think silver wolfs town from her reactions in this convo alone. I don't think she has the heart to fake a emotional response like that.

I think that klingons probably the sk. She seems to have gotten wrapped up about it and by pushing the sk label on silver I think she thinks it's actually her attempt distancing herself from the role in the future.

If I were the SK do you really think I'd tell you how I play as the SK?

Wolf does this whenever anyone votes for her. Every. time.

No one has her permission to vote for her ever, especially when she's scum, or a tantrum will ensue. It gets old.

Yes and you'd probably tell me how you play sk as town as well. So I take that action as a null.

[Garmr]

Quick reads list if you want me to emphasize any reads just hit me. (trying a new spoiler thing to make it easier to read thoughts on specif people with less distraction.

Not Ordered

Town

Spoiler: Silver wolf

I already talked about her emotional response. Her reads are well explained and you can see the thought process that go's into them.

Spoiler: ika

He is obviously town. I've come to realize recently he's just one of those players that plays a shitty scum game who I swear plays against his win condition as scum on purpose. I don't see it in this game.

Spoiler: Anni

This game reminds me of masquerade difference in that game was I was scum. I actually like your bigger posts a little better than your new 3 style ones. Ironically he thinks like me as well. Because his post 154 has pretty much a lot my town reads already at a much faster pace. I don't see any scum motivation in his posts.

Spoiler: elusive

This girl just comes town. I like how she's come out all guns blazing now 739 is good (especially the bit on flubber not taking sides and egg for trying to push more information out of him.) and 602 is another post I like for the pushing.

Spoiler: egg

I feel like the way egg explained how I was town was sincere and well thought out. 397 Is well thought and one of my fav posts of this game. and after that his just seem to be obvious town.

Null town

Spoiler: dave

to not rehash any points I already done I'll just point out new things and answer a question I missed. I wanted to ask/explain him about a couple of things

1. The point about ratios of posts between me and nic is a point I never heard before. Is it something new your trialing? Just a heads up through I'm known to focus on one persons for extended peroids of time here I focus on FF till he was lynched I had even more post on him here than I did nik and latter on I focus pirate molly for days. 3rd party talk (I assume you mean fluff and not sk talk) is a give in, in any of my games town or scum.

2. Through I don't really agree with all dave reads I do like how his trying to push the game into a town environment. Post 593 for a direct example and others he are more implied like some of his conversation with flubber.

Spoiler: tso

This is more a gut feel from being one of the players I play with the most but I feel like his town.

Spoiler: dragonspawn

Can't really say to much at the moment(maybe latter on if you catch my drift) I like post like his interactions with nik

Spoiler: mika/drixx

I am going to be honest I liked Mika considering the fact she had a lot on her plate she seemed genuine for what she did post. I also liked Drixx entrance post

Null

Spoiler: house

House hasn't really done anything to push him into one alignment or another. I didn't like his interactions with silver wolf but well it's house and I can see him being dense when it comes to emotional stuff. On the plus side from him he has been very open

Spoiler: Texcat

a bit of a lurker she's amped up the information in her posts now I can't say I agree with everything she's saying but not agreeing doesn't = scum just in this case makes = whaaa also yes I would lump you in the same basket as delta

Spoiler: Delta

Same basket as texcat. He is either gusty scum or uncaring town hard to tell which

Spoiler: shiro

A lot of gifs but nothing to push her in the town or scum category playing it safe

Spoiler: freeko/art

I don't even remember anything art said but freeko's post 809 rang alarm bells to me but I don't know why Will be watching this player

Spoiler: Abr

I miss old abr that posted cases why do you play like this now abr

Scum

Spoiler: wake

Not bringing up the earlier stuff which still applies I didn't like his oh I'm going to get nked bs when it's pretty obvious his a viable wagon.

Spoiler: klingoncelt

Like I said before probably a sk but I don't see why people are ruling her out as mafia either.

Spoiler: nik

Do i really have to repeat this

Spoiler: flubber

I never been able to figure out flubber his just like rachmaire through this game he does seem a little scummier than usual. I don't mind lynching any of them in any game

[Garmr]

In between the cap is the words null in white.

[Garmr]

gap*

[Garmr]

Quick reads list if you want me to emphasize any reads just hit me. (trying a new spoiler thing to make it easier to read thoughts on specif people with less distraction.

No offense, but the spoiler thing just makes it harder when there is so little information for each player. If you had a wall per, then it would make sense to spoiler it all. I should have made this same comment when the previous player (elusive?) did it, but it's a work day and it slipped my mind.

Speaking of there being so little... can you explain the reads in more detail. Especially the scum reads. I know that people rarely like repeating themselves but bear with me on this -- even the Nik read if you don't mind. I'm especially interested in seeing whether anything has evolved.

I'm a bit lazy so I will compromise I will expand the scum reads but if you want a town read you have to ask for that pacific read.

[Garmr]

Let's start with Kling- She's been laying pretty low all game not really pushing hard. Her vote on tso seems opportunistic. I have had more games with tso than she has and I saw nothing wrong with it. Also It was her pushing on a viewpoint than doesn't really effect this game that much. She talks how much she likes the sk even through normally this a null she gets worked up in how silver wolf is the sk. She is the only player emphasizing the sk.

dragonspawn are you really going to come in here and make a whole bunch of observations on nothing and say nothing? Klingon-same to you.

Like anyone else is saying lots.

We have a million years till deadline, I'll have plenty to say soon enough.

She bags on the content everyone else is producing yet up till that point she has been worthless as fuck and hasn't done anything to improve the content.

Look hard at Egg, Garmr, and Wake. Tell me what you think.

If she wanted to know what she thought of me eg and wake she would of said what do you think. Instead she says to look hard implying that we are scum she is using word play to push what she wants people to scum read.

[

I got one, whos do you suspect is sk? (yes there is a motive for my sk hunt)

Not a question I was expecting to see you ask.

What does everyone think of ika's question about the sk?

Ika knows lots about setups & mechanics, if he thinks there's an SK, there probably is.

20 players; T:S ratio is usually 3:1, that's 15 Town and 5 Scum.

So:
1 scumteam with 5 members or
1 scumteam with 3 members, 1 scumteam with 2 or
1 scumteam with 4 members, 1 SK or
2 scumteams with 2 members each, 1 SK

I believe the slip is genuine but genuine for a sk. She seems to of accepted the fact there may be a sk in the set up way to easily before looking at night kills and list more scenarios with multiple scum teams aka mutiple kill scenarios. I think she was planning ahead for explaining the extra night kill.

There's also how she pushed the sk label onto silver and well the stuff that happened/still happening after I actually posted.

[Garmr]

wake is still scum btw

Inbewteen posting but agreed

[Garmr]

Wake

I still think his early rvs play was cautious and his reaction was a bit of a delayed omgus he waited till I layed off off him then was like defensive and even implied he wasn't reading me in his scatter shot when he asked texcat why she was vote mepost 251.

Then in post

@Wake-Who are you scumreading right now?

I'm thinking Garmr at the moment. He tried gunning for me, then I turned about to face him and he turned away. What does that mean?

There are feelings of trepidation regarding certain other players here, but nothing with any real weight attached to it. T S O can be a powerful Town player. I have not seen much from him yet, and would like to see more.

I also feel that some players are unwilling to engage me head-on, which makes me feel like I'm going to be killed. I am a catalyst, and I want players to engage.

He acts like I ran away because I found him to hard to vote. No that's not the case I found nik scummier I never said he wasn't scum. I felt like if he really did feel this way he would of said so earlier instead of waiting for the focus on him to die down. He then plays himself up to be townie jesus making the town play well and town needs himand It's like wtf


I also feel like he should place a ring on wolfie finger and ask her to marry him with all the sucking his been doing.

There are many things that pique my interest this game.

Ika's vote, Garmr's turnabout, elusive's quiz, deltawave's misplays...

Even if you are the Serial Killer,

you should have something interesting to latch your focus on.

Bounce some more ideas off me, why don't you?

We also have this great fucking slip. It should read even if you are scum but instead he says serial killer. Why because his scum and now that i think about it's obvious that if wake scum house isn't.

PEDIT:

I'm not buddying you, Silverwolf. I like you in general, and am pleased that both you and House—as well as others—accepted the invitation. If I WERE Scum, you can bet your bottom I'd buddy the ever-loving snark out of you—up to and including salted caramel treats and sweet nothings. I am a devilish angel and you

cannot

ever

be certain of my intentions. I will tell you that I like you, enjoy your presence, and—in this game at least—not Scum at all.

But you complimenting me repeatedly and giving me a townread is not buddying but just being friendly right?

Yer darn right!

Also this is cringe worthy.

[Garmr]

Man so much post between my post I'll be back min 30 mins maybe less and hopefully have the next read.

[Garmr]

Still policy lynching kling

Unwise.

Unfortunately you aren't making a good case for this

Okay. I'm all ears. What would make a good case?

Something more than unwise

Okay.

1)Policy lynching me is not fair.
2)I did not lash out because there were a couple of votes on me, that was someone else.
3)Punish the player that started the shit, not the one that finished it.

4)Further, I am 99.99% sure that wolf/her slot is Scum/SK.
5)Why should I not be allowed to vote for her/it/them/him?

1) boo fucking hoo, cry me a river. you forced an enjoyable player to replace out
2) yes cus she was transparently town and you are pushign her as sk.
-wanna see another game where this shit happened?
http://forum.mafiascum.net/viewtopic.php?f=56&t=59268
PM was pushed as sk so far that when she fucking broke garmr still didnt believe it. I have talk with mollie for days about that game scince then. so really dont even start that kind of shit with SW.
3) tbh you instigated it further by geting very personal
4) how so, plz tell me more about this "sk" fabrication
5) you can you just wont get support

seriously your whining already tells me you are no PR of any sort and that if you even try to claim that shit i will not take it for one second

Back and just one to note the case with pirate mollie was different than this one. I didn't attack her personally it was her attacking me. I actually believed she was scum and posted in game reasons only and did not attack her character. Only after she put me through a ton of verbal abuse did i push her over the edge and shattered her into a thousand pieces that she quit.

[Garmr]

Why flubber is scum


His posted a lot of nothing. This is a normal flubber trait but it's this post were I start to develop my read.

Is anybody following nik vs. garmr right now because I really can't right now.

I also want to note that I stalled a discussion that almost got me pegged as scum once by responding to each line of someone's post by numbering/outlining it. If you're attacking the lines of a post you're probably not actually attacking the post itself.

Also he was acting like nik was town before then he posts this bit what's up with that.

He seems to be trying to draw focus on me and nik but he isn't taking a stance on any

Is anybody following nik vs. garmr right now because I really can't right now.

Nice "information" but do you draw any conclusions from it? If not, why mention it?

To see if anyone can relate to the struggle I'm having with it and bring out my opinion that the format of the discussion is anti-town.

I skimmed a double ISO, did not stop to take notes. I find it odd that a high percentage of Garmr posts are either about Nik or replies to him. The percentage is lower for Nik posts about/to Garmr. It's also interesting that the context of a lot of the discussion is a 3rd party. I don't think it generated much in the way of solid reads, or advanced game state much. It puts both of them on the scum side of null.

What do you think about the motivation for the conversation? Setting aside the content which is difficult to follow, does one or both look scummy on motivation?

Because I've used to same tactic as scum to stall a case on me, I'm personally biased to say that's what's happening here but have no actual context to apply that assumption to.

Nothing pings me as scum on garmr and the best read I have on nikanor right now is "would wagon."

This implies he finds nik null now but before she was town.

Nikanor can be town for his observation on wake even though I disagree with it being scummy. From my experience wake's posts are just fluffy and I do admit to not always reading the longer ones

It's a weird interaction and I'm assuming his preparing for a bus in the future if he has to.

[Garmr]

Nik

First was that she placed a serious vote comming out the rvs with out listing the reasoning and only after she was pushed did she list it.

The fact she was shooting of reads with out having the ability to explain them

liking House, texcat for town.
Wake, elusive, dragonspawn look scummy. elusive less so than the others, just one post is pinging me, where she got her back up over the sauron joke.
all my reads are conflicting though. like, probably only one of garmr/wake and one of dragon/elusive are scum. but i'm scumreading all four. it sucks.
whine whine whine

i also just skimmed five pages so my reads are prob shit

and in the end comes up with this lame bs

dw, my inscrutability means i'm town. i have reasons for all my reads, i just choose not to share most of them bc they'd sound like bs.

You got to be fucking kidding me lets just skip ahead to when she did answer

texcat seems relaxed in the face of questioning.

I don't know why I bothered she obviously doesn't have a real one.

Is anybody following nik vs. garmr right now because I really can't right now.

I also want to note that I stalled a discussion that almost got me pegged as scum once by responding to each line of someone's post by numbering/outlining it. If you're attacking the lines of a post you're probably not actually attacking the post itself.

garmr is really good at saying "i fundamentally disagree with the way you play mafia and i think you're scum for it" in incredibly circuitous ways.
me breaking it down into lines is the only way to show people that he's full of shit.

I don't know why she posted this and in every point she just avoided my answers.

egg, how many of garmr's posts have you read, and which ones do you think are townish?

Ok this bit is fine but

Egg, thanks for the Garmr iso but I have no idea how you took the exact opposite thing that I did from each of his posts.
dragon's posting is getting worse and worse. ik nobody is gonna lynch garmr with me today but it's getting tougher and tougher to decide whether i wanna change over to ika, davesaz or dragonspawn.

Basically in this post she like fuck I can't get lynch garmr and this rate I'm going to be lynched instead lets throw some names out their and see if I can get a wagon.

Vote: dragonspawn.

another blank vote and i experimented this time I wanted to see if no one pushed her on it if she would actually try to push the person she was voting for.

Egg, thanks for the Garmr iso but I have no idea how you took the exact opposite thing that I did from each of his posts.
dragon's posting is getting worse and worse. ik nobody is gonna lynch garmr with me today but it's getting tougher and tougher to decide whether i wanna change over to ika, davesaz or dragonspawn.

How am I getting worse? Does me asking questions make you uncomfortable? If so. Why?

your questions are generally either useless or framed to make people look bad (like the above). i can find a couple of bad statements too, for example your accusation against T S O that he did nothing that page, and you asking why people are townreading Egg because you've never played with him.

This is like the fucking only post and it's just belittling him. No reasoning why his scum no explaining the scum motivation she's just trying to keep low and hope no one throws a noose around her neck.

Why is texcat town?

i have texcat as null-scum for her ika vote, i wouldn't wanna lynch her today though, the cat avatar would make me feel too guilty.

Now she has tex cat as null-scum for voting someone. She tried so hard to keep from saying a reason on tex cat and provided a pathetic reason why tex cat was town. But now she's like nah she's null scum. Niks just throwing reads out she has no real reasoning for them.

meh, silver was always probtown.
house too.
ika why do you think that klingon cannot be mafia?

631

also her defense of "you know how i play as sk" (hint for kling: that was MM not sk) is eerily similar. where she just kinda talks about random stuff and doesnt really solve the game

if 631 excludes her from being mafia then it should exclude her from being sk as well, since the first setup she suggests does not include an sk. do you disagree?

thats besides the point? im not judging her on "well heres the setups that can happen"

im basing it on how she went about the sk. i dont really get your angle

if anything i think she's more likely to be using the "well i'm not

this

type of scum" defense, where she knows you're wrong about her being sk so tries her best to disprove that one thought.
although she could just as easily be town doing the same thing.
i dislike her vote on SW but otherwise have no problem with her, she actually is the only one agreeing with me on garmr afaict so i can't very well vote my only friend

She's just gave a point as to why she could be scum but then is like well she could be also town (add bs reason) oh also because she doesn't like garmr.

[Garmr]

LOL

[Garmr]

Ok is there anyone on the wagon who doesn't think kilng is scum but doing it for a policy?

[Garmr]

Just checked everyone voting her. Everyone has presented/or sheeped reason to think she is scum sk/mafia why was this called a policy lynch?

[Garmr]

@egg ika also has a scum read on her as he says in his earlier post.

[Garmr]

now you want o be useful to me and tlak about your scum/town reads or not?

After KlingonCelt is dead one way or the other, sure.

If people want me to participate, they'll get rid of the player that damaged the game. As far as I'm concerned, this game is frozen as long as she's still in it.

After rereading the kling sw thing. I don't think we should be making kling to be a villain personality wise. Sure kling is scum and probs the sk as signs are pointing to it but all this attacking her character is souring the game and ruining it. It's obvious there was probably tension from other games going on between them and they let it out now.

So lets not go on about how horrible of a person she is and more to the reason why she is and isn't scum(depending on your view point).

[Garmr]

VOTE: Klingonkelt

To much flail.

[Garmr]

Scum/Leaning Scum -
Garmr
Egg
freeko

Any thoughts to go with the reads?

Not much, just impressions I'm getting as I read the posts. I'm moving Egg to Null at this point, and House to Scum.

House's push is something I'm not at liberty to discuss, but I can say that it's Scummy.

What was your reasoning for thinking egg was scum in the first place.

[Garmr]

Elusive eat a snickers. . Try and make this game fun again with me please.

[Garmr]

kling is still scum

[Garmr]

@Nik

Can you please provide actual content thank you.

[Garmr]

I disagree.

Care to enlighten me?

You may of missed my big post but I will list a short . point summary.

.She tried to push the sk label on sw instead saying she is scum. Distancing attempt right here.

.The suits a sks logic more than a town. She was already buddying up to ika a little i feel like in case she thought ika had a role that screwed sk over like fbi agent.

.At a certain point she was discussing sk more than her actual reads.

.She gets defensive in post 676 with a wifom defense post.

[Garmr]

@nik if you want to get a wagon me today right now would be the best bet.

[Garmr]

VOTE: garmr

Look how opportunistic this vote is.

[Garmr]

flubber obviously scum. His not the type you leave end game.

VOTE: flubber

[Garmr]

To be completely fair, I intended to vote for gamr last night but was too tired so I placed my vote today. His push was terrible and scummy and I don't trust him at all.

how so?

[Garmr]

VOTE: garmr

Yea not once did you say you scumread garmr what up with that naked vote ?

Alberts was also bad but I am already voting him so..yea

New wagon should change the hostile gamestate.

Also I refuted his scum read on me and he ignored me

Umm

quote="In post 934 , Flubbernugget"]

Why flubber is scum


His posted a lot of nothing. This is a normal flubber trait but it's this post were I start to develop my read.

Is anybody following nik vs. garmr right now because I really can't right now.

I also want to note that I stalled a discussion that almost got me pegged as scum once by responding to each line of someone's post by numbering/outlining it. If you're attacking the lines of a post you're probably not actually attacking the post itself.

Also he was acting like nik was town before then he posts this bit what's up with that.

He seems to be trying to draw focus on me and nik but he isn't taking a stance on any

no shit I wanted attention to that I was struggling to understand it.

fwiw nik actually gave a (biased) summary while you're just scumreading me for not parsing a wallwar.

Is anybody following nik vs. garmr right now because I really can't right now.

Nice "information" but do you draw any conclusions from it? If not, why mention it?

To see if anyone can relate to the struggle I'm having with it and bring out my opinion that the format of the discussion is anti-town.

I skimmed a double ISO, did not stop to take notes. I find it odd that a high percentage of Garmr posts are either about Nik or replies to him. The percentage is lower for Nik posts about/to Garmr. It's also interesting that the context of a lot of the discussion is a 3rd party. I don't think it generated much in the way of solid reads, or advanced game state much. It puts both of them on the scum side of null.

What do you think about the motivation for the conversation? Setting aside the content which is difficult to follow, does one or both look scummy on motivation?

Because I've used to same tactic as scum to stall a case on me, I'm personally biased to say that's what's happening here but have no actual context to apply that assumption to.

Nothing pings me as scum on garmr and the best read I have on nikanor right now is "would wagon."

This implies he finds nik null now but before she was town.

Awesome so my read changed. I'm scum because??

Nikanor can be town for his observation on wake even though I disagree with it being scummy. From my experience wake's posts are just fluffy and I do admit to not always reading the longer ones

It's a weird interaction and I'm assuming his preparing for a bus in the future if he has to.

Nononono you don't just say weird and call it a day why is it weird?[/quote]

1.You didn't really refute anything here. You gave no reasoning for a read change going on just saying my read changed so what. You played devils advocate just pointing shit out with out offering to further the state.

2.You never explained why you went straight to third parties instead of asking us if you wanted to understand this is just a lazy attempt to try and look town.

3.you never explained why someone you found so town become scum and you hinted at her being scum while I was smashing her in a debate.

4.It was a weird interaction going from a town read to a scum read so fast. It makes it look like a bus

5. If you looked through my iso it took time for me to respond to other post sometimes a couple of days especially when emotional shit is going on. So I don't see your point?

[Garmr]

VOTE: garmr

Yea not once did you say you scumread garmr what up with that naked vote ?

Alberts was also bad but I am already voting him so..yea

New wagon should change the hostile gamestate.

Also I refuted his scum read on me and he ignored me

Umm

Why flubber is scum


His posted a lot of nothing. This is a normal flubber trait but it's this post were I start to develop my read.

Is anybody following nik vs. garmr right now because I really can't right now.

I also want to note that I stalled a discussion that almost got me pegged as scum once by responding to each line of someone's post by numbering/outlining it. If you're attacking the lines of a post you're probably not actually attacking the post itself.

Also he was acting like nik was town before then he posts this bit what's up with that.

He seems to be trying to draw focus on me and nik but he isn't taking a stance on any

no shit I wanted attention to that I was struggling to understand it.

fwiw nik actually gave a (biased) summary while you're just scumreading me for not parsing a wallwar.

Is anybody following nik vs. garmr right now because I really can't right now.

Nice "information" but do you draw any conclusions from it? If not, why mention it?

To see if anyone can relate to the struggle I'm having with it and bring out my opinion that the format of the discussion is anti-town.

I skimmed a double ISO, did not stop to take notes. I find it odd that a high percentage of Garmr posts are either about Nik or replies to him. The percentage is lower for Nik posts about/to Garmr. It's also interesting that the context of a lot of the discussion is a 3rd party. I don't think it generated much in the way of solid reads, or advanced game state much. It puts both of them on the scum side of null.

What do you think about the motivation for the conversation? Setting aside the content which is difficult to follow, does one or both look scummy on motivation?

Because I've used to same tactic as scum to stall a case on me, I'm personally biased to say that's what's happening here but have no actual context to apply that assumption to.

Nothing pings me as scum on garmr and the best read I have on nikanor right now is "would wagon."

This implies he finds nik null now but before she was town.

Awesome so my read changed. I'm scum because??

Nikanor can be town for his observation on wake even though I disagree with it being scummy. From my experience wake's posts are just fluffy and I do admit to not always reading the longer ones

It's a weird interaction and I'm assuming his preparing for a bus in the future if he has to.

Nononono you don't just say weird and call it a day why is it weird?

1.You didn't really refute anything here. You gave no reasoning for a read change going on just saying my read changed so what. You played devils advocate just pointing shit out with out offering to further the state.

2.You never explained why you went straight to third parties instead of asking us if you wanted to understand this is just a lazy attempt to try and look town.

3.you never explained why someone you found so town become scum and you hinted at her being scum while I was smashing her in a debate.

4.It was a weird interaction going from a town read to a scum read so fast. It makes it look like a bus

5. If you looked through my iso it took time for me to respond to other post sometimes a couple of days especially when emotional shit is going on. So I don't see your point?

Fixed

[Garmr]

VOTE: Klingonkelt

To much flail.

I voted Gamr for this post. Completely scummy. Unacceptable.

Have you been reading the game. I had produced a lot of reasoning before this post why I thought why kling was scum. In fact I was the first one to point out her sk like behavior.

[Garmr]

The wagon itself is probably a good thing (town needs information and wagons are thus good in general), but the way people are handling it is not. If they're town and not giving reasons, we lack the information to distinguish them from the scum.

No, the Gammrn wagon is bad. Also, wagons can give information to the scums too: if they manage to push one hard enough, they can force townies to claim.

I wouldn't of been quick lynched anyway reading the general mood of the people and flow of the game. Even if I was quick lynched some people would have to improvise reasons as to why I would be a scum read and town could look from there on my wagon.

The wagon itself was a good thing because people it stopped the stale game state kling/sw made also we gained information and it brought Flubber to the spotlight.

[Garmr]

@house and elusive.

Stop arguing about who's at fault it will make the game stale again.

[Garmr]

@house&elusive

What do you hope to achieve by continuing this and keeping the game in a stale state?

@Elusive can you do that after the game not during it?

[Garmr]

@house&elusive

What do you hope to achieve by continuing this and keeping the game in a stale state?

@Elusive can you do that after the game not during it?

Justice.

Save the piteous justice till after the game.

[Garmr]

Gamr: because of his bad and opportunistic push on klingon.

Opportunistic would of been placing my vote when the emotions where highest. Can you tell me what you think is opportunistic about my vote.

[Garmr]

Felt like you were pulling a fast one.

I feel like you haven't been reading all my posts if you got that conclusion ;/

[Garmr]

Someone answer me why a third vote for Garmr is opportunistic, but not Garmr's vote on Klingon who already has 7 votes. Which is more opportunistic to you?

Well for one one thought had reasoning one did not. One was already scum reading the person the other was not. If numbers are your only indicator abr your going to have a bad time.

[Garmr]

So, here's the deal:

Initially, I read and re-read the two players in question in iso and together in double-iso and came to the conclusion that with one player of the two replacing out that the drama would therefore go away and the game would get back to normal.

Silly me.

Klingoncelt, as you clearly are unable to let go of the situation, I have no choice but to force-replace you.

Please do not post in this thread again

or I will modkill your slot. If you simply

must

discuss this further, my PM inbox is wide open.

TO BE CLEAR: The drama is now Officially Over.

Klingoncelt and SilverWolf may only be referenced in regard to their respective slots in this game. Any other mention of them -- from

anyone,

for

any

reason -- will lead to force-replacement and possibly modkill.

Let's return to mafia now, shall we?

What about plays that indicate their alignment that happened during the argument. Like I'm pretty sure that kling dropped a sk tell.

[Garmr]

Oh misread that slots in the game. Never mind.

[Garmr]

[Garmr]

That should be a page. Anyway peoples thoughts on flubber?

[Garmr]

@egg

What flubber produced was a omgus vote with out any legit reasoning at all.

A vote on big wagon which I was already scum reading. Not even mentioning that some people had already sheeped my reasoning to actually vote the wagon. That's not what I would consider opportunistic. We have to build wagons otherwise we would never get lynches.

I'm kinda offended that it was called opportunistic as their was way better and less suspicious times I could of layed my vote which could of led into a emotional lynch. I made sure that wouldn't happen before I placed my vote.

[Garmr]

Thanks, Aneninen.

I voted davesaz because I think he needs pressure and also to get people talking about other things but that didn't quite work.

If ABR is scum then KC probably is scum, that flip would tell us a lot.

Does Dragonspawn even have a V\LA or has it just been AWOL?

Texcat pinged me because of the difference in style from his or her previous games on here to this one.

Shiro is being pleasant and that always makes me think scum or {}.

The role of a VT is to interrogate and aggravate as much as possible so that the scum are pissed enough to take you out rather then a PR. VTs who don't play that way are wasting the freedom that not having an ability gives them in that they can purely scumhunt without fear.

Garmr Vs. Nikanor is an interesting 1 vs. 1. Has Nikanor burned you before as scum, Garmr? Or why so focused on it?

Nope never burned me as scum before or even played with me. I'm not just focused on nik even through I pushed her most early game I have been addressing others as well. (Wake,Nik,Flubs and slot B Kling as scum reads)

@Dave
You seemed to have forgotten about me didn't you want to ask about certain town reads and why I think they were town.

[Garmr]

1.You didn't really refute anything here. You gave no reasoning for a read change going on just saying my read changed so what. You played devils advocate just pointing shit out with out offering to further the state.

2.You never explained why you went straight to third parties instead of asking us if you wanted to understand this is just a lazy attempt to try and look town.

3.you never explained why someone you found so town become scum and you hinted at her being scum while I was smashing her in a debate.

4.It was a weird interaction going from a town read to a scum read so fast. It makes it look like a bus

5. If you looked through my iso it took time for me to respond to other post sometimes a couple of days especially when emotional shit is going on. So I don't see your point?

Fixed

I'm not asking what if so I can't be devil's advocate. I'm changing the state by wagoning you. I don't know what you mean by third parties; I'm not sk hunting. I'm waffling on a nik read and stop trying to fluff your case on me by saying this different ways with loaded language. Thank you for responding and stop fucking fisking people.

Also I'm very concerned that you haven't seemed to complain about reading me like you normally do which heavily implies you already know my alignment.

This also proves your not actually reading the game or any of my posts

I never been able to figure out flubber his just like rachmaire through this game he does seem a little scummier than usual. I don't mind lynching any of them in any game

Third parties in this case means asking players outside the debate what they think of it before going to me or nik. Also that was a answer to all your questions and it could be answered through similar means so can you actually read the game thank you.

[Garmr]

Can I ask why people think flubber is town and why there isn't more pressure on this slot?

[Garmr]

@texcat

So when do you start shelling out reads?

[Garmr]

This game kinda sucks not the fault of the mods just the atmosphere we created. :/

[Garmr]

I don't really agree with the ane wagon and def won't be voting my wagon lol. I will vote abr but as a compromise lynch as I would prefer to lynch a scum read. Even through the kling slots a scum read lynching a unfilled spot doesn't really get any information.


In short I'm frustrated With this player bases views since there radically different to mine and this post is here to bitch.

[Garmr]

Nice of you to join us SK. You can kill Freeko tonight. Let's lynch A or texcat

Still believe the sk is Klingoncelt slot. There is heaps of evidence pointing to this I have listed why I have thought this. I also really have to disagree with your vote count analysis. Since I don't think A is scum. You were a little quick to jump to that conclusion which I think is strange.

[Garmr]

People who rely on VCA as a strong tool for finding scum tend to jump to conclusions Garmr. I have no idea why people insist on applying a large scale probabilistic observation to individual cases. The context and timing of events is much more useful for finding scum than VCA, especially if the scum know about VCA and feed in results that are indistinguishable from random.

As for ABR ... I've gotten a scum vibe off of him for awhile now. Now that he's back it may be a good time to push him a bit and see?

For the moment, I'm waiting to see if ARS settles down and does a thorough analysis of the game or if we're gonna get this hyper rush to judgment indefinitely. Hard to gauge a fresh replace in who has 1500 posts to catch up on.

I'm going to be honest This seems like Abr's new style. I miss old Abr the one I first meet a year ago. This one's cringe worthy.

[Garmr]

People who rely on VCA as a strong tool for finding scum tend to jump to conclusions Garmr. I have no idea why people insist on applying a large scale probabilistic observation to individual cases. The context and timing of events is much more useful for finding scum than VCA, especially if the scum know about VCA and feed in results that are indistinguishable from random.

If you have limited time, VCA can be extremely useful in giving you fewer people to look at.

Later in the game it can point directly at scum like a guided missile. I've lost track of the number of scum I've nailed specifically from VCA. Especially the ones who look town otherwise.

But I do agree that there are times and places where it is next to useless, if not actively harmful.

I only find vca useful after a flip. They get better the longer you go.

[Garmr]

@Drixx -- Read initial from that post.

Initial.

Still reading but so far looks like everything is holding up.

Can I ask what post the initial post was?

[Garmr]

text, either build a case or kindly shut the fuck up.

its going to take a lot of convincing to prove shes scum

What

The

Fuck?

Someone please tell me why ika defends elusive to the end of the world?

I dun know? Is Elusive cute or something?

[Garmr]

On a serious note elusive comes off as very town. I can see partly why Ika would defend her but I don't think it's wise to hardcore defend someone personally.

[Garmr]

Wake or House would be excellent lynches today. I think we should focus on those two.

They are practically the same personality, I can't tell the difference. Stern logical types, serious about scumhunting, both want to be doctors.

I latched onto Wake. Then shortly afterward, House jumped in and said that freeko is "scum as fuck"...but then immediately voted me. When I call him out on this inconsistent behavior, he backpedaled instantly and voted freeko after only a handful of posts. I'm calling it now, Wake and House are scum. House tried clumsily to defend Wake but then backed off once he realized it made no sense.

Now Wake himself is pretty scummy too. We've been in this game for two weeks and the only votes he's made were RVS votes at the start of the game (literally his first two posts.) It's not like he's inactive. I haven't done the math but quickly glancing at the "activity overview" for this game, he's slightly more active than average. Yet all he's doing is making generic comments without taking a stand. He's clearly trying to keep his head down while more dramatic fights are breaking out.

Lynch either of them today but I would prefer Wake.

VOTE: Wake

This plus my earlier reasons.

Wake wagon please.

[Garmr]

caught up
only thing interesting that's happened is House's bizarre vote and unvote of freeko. kiiinda looks like bussing if only because it seems like House was really uncomfortable on freeko.
but i don't have any sort of concrete scum read on either, would still much rather lynch garmr or david.
will probably end up lurking until we get a flip honestly, i'm pretty done with this day.

don't really get the anenimoose wagon, he's a tad weird but not exactly scummy. i think people said his scum reads lack effort but really what do you expect on d1, an essay? garmr's read list was 10x worse and nobody said shit about that.

I did say a short reads list and if you wanted to know more ask about a specific read which Ironically dave did ask and I delivered. What's really bad is you missed this and we are both your so called scum reads. Also could be worse through could be this pathetic shit.

elusive, flubb, albert, silverwolf, klingon, ika are all probtown, pls do not lynch.

davesaz is definitely scum, we should lynch him today probably. like, he has no reads. he provides two posts recently where he says "these guys might be town! we should read more to confirm!" and then nothing else, no follow-up. tbf he's still waiting on more from drixx but what he says about klingon is inexcusable for somebody voting her:

So, defending Klingoncelt. I do agree that it is worthwhile to ask what makes her scum other than the drama. I'd need to review, and expect some others would need to as well.

Looks like davesaz is coasting on the klingon train hoping it goes to lynchtown before he has to follow up.
garmr is scum too but you'll have to lynch him by yourselves in lylo as he'll definitely nk me before then. i've explained myself to death already and if you can't already smell the stink on his posts then i can't really help you unless you're interested in a rhinoplasty party.
texcat is giving kind of an sk vibe, looks very detached and not interested in scumhunting too deeply. her reasons for voting are really superficial.
dragonspawn.. dunno. i misread a post that a had an issue with so now it's not AS bad. plus people are saying this is his town play. i can't get over a few posts that look like mudslinging but vOv it could be personality. willing to give him a pass for now.
shiro i think is town actually, after rereading his iso it's not too bad.

basically my three big scum reads are davesaz, garmr and texcat.

Unvote. Vote: davesaz.

I really encourage everyone to take a look at the iso of davey, it's really really not nice.

[Garmr]

I did say a short reads list and if you wanted to know more ask about a specific read which Ironically dave did ask and I delivered. What's really bad is you missed this and we are both your so called scum reads. Also could be worse through could be this pathetic shit.

you know, when i said "nobody said shit about that" what i really meant was "nobody called garmr scummy for it" which should be obvious in context to anyone but the feeble-minded.
the sad thing is that the rest of the town is actually buying the act where you consistently call me a shitty player to discredit my reads without actually talking about them.
which is another reason why this game is starting to lose its lustre. like, nothing against you, i realise you're playing to your win con, but it's super depressing that the rest of the town is myopic to the point where they can only see the fruit hanging directly in front of them.
vOv c'est la vie vOv

You haven't exactly talked about my reads either while discrediting them. But I do agree on one thing through that Aniennen read list was could scummy when others including myself have post quick reads list like this. I don't understand this.

[Garmr]

was called dam spell check.

[Garmr]

Wow, I'm still alive in this game?

That's the real tragedy.

[Garmr]

ok game still bores me, still thinking about checkign wake, maybe drixx/ABR

How about we lynch wake today?

[Garmr]

ok game still bores me, still thinking about checkign wake, maybe drixx/ABR

How about we lynch wake today?

get him to l-1 and i will glady hammer

I will try my best .

[Garmr]

You know Ika claimed cop right?

[Garmr]

he also claimed doc

I forgot about that. But still I don't think it would be wise for scum to claim a power role day 1.

[Garmr]

Well I don't believe it.

Don't believe he is town or is town and not a power role?

[Garmr]

Sneaking in to ask

@Dragon How often is Abr mislynched cause he is pretty damn scummy. Can people vouch that his town play is scummy?

I was really thinking of moving in on flubbed cause his play here is pretty equally bad plus I can't shake the feeling that this is the same play as masquerade.

@Garmr a

ny input on the above about flub or is it just me?

@Abr So you are willing to lynch someone that might be a pr. I get that you.might not believe it but why look there day1 and risk it? Why? What do you gain from this?

Tbh I don't understand the question can you please explain in a simple way for me?

[Garmr]

Sure

I think flubber is playing exactly like he was playing in masquerade
Say nothing of significe,easily fade in the background and forgettable, null by everyone, empty votes.

I am asking u if you are seeing those similarities as well and what you think about it since he was mafia there.

Yeh I agree. That's why I am scum reading him :p.

[Garmr]

@egg
yes I have


Still think his scum through. He wasn't afraid to make a stance on people 1v1 unlike he did here he was less omgussy and just was less opportunistic than this. THere's subtle differences but they are there and even if he does some how flip town it wouldn't hurt to lynch him anyway.

[Garmr]

-

Garmr, I don't know what to do. ABR is so mean to me all the time. It hurts my gentle, sensitive soul. What should I do?

Burn him back and then bring me a pack of cookies to share .

[Garmr]

Garmr,

What does burn mean? How do I make a burn? I don't want to set anyone on fire, that seems really really mean.

Burn means to insult something someone says but in a sly and funny way. Like what abr did to you.

[Garmr]

I thought ABR was empathizing with my pain. He was really trying to be mean?

I took it more as a joke to lighten the mood but ask him yourself. Tbh through it's not to game relevant.

[Garmr]

http://www.urbandictionary.com/define.php?term=burn

I don't mean the smoking weed kind either. Weed sucks anyway does nothing alcohol is better and tastier.

[Garmr]

Gamr, *shrug*. Flubber's posts seem like he is taking stances to me. Pretty clearly, actually. Which posts read as OMGUSy to you?

The vote on me after I scum read him where he showed no indication he thought of me as scum.

http://www.urbandictionary.com/define.php?term=burn

I don't mean the smoking weed kind either. Weed sucks anyway does nothing alcohol is better and tastier.

appeal to authority

[Garmr]

I think until ABR actually acts like he cares about the town he's probably scum.

this is a horribly poor method of finding scum on this particular site, fyi.

This I don't like about this site if what you say is true. If town always acts in a manner beneficial to scum we might as well just give them the game. How is this okay? People should be encouraged to help out the town and find the scums and root them out. It's the point no?

Depends on your def of pro town in this game

http://forum.mafiascum.net/viewtopic.php?f=2&t=60083

I was town and faked a emotional crash and claimed my role as hider except I only claimed a one shot hider instead of two. It caused scum to think I wasn't a threat and a easy mislynch they let me live. That was a big mistake as I lynched 2 scum in quick secession

[Garmr]

Moral of the story day 1 can be viewed as a muck around day by some. People have different views on whats town and what's anti town. Also not in the story scum can be good at seeming pro town.

[Garmr]

Look up expressions before you murder their spelling, holy crap ._.
"Je ne sais quoi"

Elusive murdering the language .Edward Wortley Montagu, English traveler and writer died in 1776. Illuminati formed in 1776

Illuminati confirmed.

[Garmr]

VOTE: Garmr

Spending a lot of time talking about irrelevant minutiae and fluff.

Even taking out the off topic stuff that in still posted more than you. Also I'm not the only one who's posted off topic stuff. If you don't know how to have fun house you can go fuck yourself.

[Garmr]

@elusive
Happy with the flubber wagon

VOTE: Flubber

[Garmr]

i really think garmr is scum and even i think that's bs reasoning.

My vote was based on a passing review of the page I posted it and want particularly serious, as few of my d1 votes ever are (I hop around a lot on d1).

It was Garmr's reaction that convinced me that I made the right decision.

So me going wtf to shitty reasoning is scummy. Riiiigghhhhtt.

[Garmr]

i really think garmr is scum and even i think that's bs reasoning.

My vote was based on a passing review of the page I posted it and want particularly serious, as few of my d1 votes ever are (I hop around a lot on d1).

It was Garmr's reaction that convinced me that I made the right decision.

So me going wtf to shitty reasoning is scummy. Riiiigghhhhtt.

Is it scummy shitty reasoning ie towny shitty reasoning?

If you say scummy, your post better include a vote.

If you haven't caught on by now after this many games that I constantly make jabs at you. I view you as idiot so I don't really know.

[Garmr]

Sorry I will put in a nicer way. I have judged you as lacking in skill as a player and that's why I make comments like this.

"Things I got" I mean.

I don't know about house through I would normally scum read other people for what his doing but well it's house.

You can find comments like this littered through our games. I think you skill you lack is the ability to see things in more than one way as shown in this post.

i really think garmr is scum and even i think that's bs reasoning.

My vote was based on a passing review of the page I posted it and want particularly serious, as few of my d1 votes ever are (I hop around a lot on d1).

It was Garmr's reaction that convinced me that I made the right decision.

So me going wtf to shitty reasoning is scummy. Riiiigghhhhtt.

Is it scummy shitty reasoning ie towny shitty reasoning?

If you say scummy, your post better include a vote.

My answer to this is neither at the moment as I can see you doing it as both alignments and I'm unsure what you are. The answer to your question is neither of the options you put up. Also your pushing your own behaviors onto with the vote thing onto me I am not you I will react different I play different I have .

Because you lack the ability to think outside black and white and your own behaviors. You end up saying stuff that normal players wouldn't and push on the stupidest stuff while limiting the responses to stuff you can comprehend. This makes it hard to tell if your being genuine or not.

That's putting it in the nicest terms I can think of and explain my low opinion of your game. I could state why my opinion of your character has dropped during this game but the mod has forbidden for me to do so.


@drixx
I have put content through in fact I even put content on the same page house said that -_- I just mix it in with fluff to keep the game fun this is just how I am through all my games.

[Garmr]

That's what she said

Then she cracked up laughing

[Garmr]

If today ends in a nolynch I'm replacing out

[Garmr]

Hey royal are u a alt or is this your first time on this site

[Garmr]

Elusive if your reading this I like you and all because you're a fun person but it's not that hard to refer to texcat as she -_- Also trying to get mod kill sours the experience and I want to play with you again.

Tbh I really don't mind the voting situation at the moment because none of my town reads are on the chopping block.

[Garmr]

Busy right now but up for a wake wagon. Also drixx being scum is surprising I had him as a town read. Welcome titus your probably scum.

VOTE: Wake

[Garmr]

Titus the people from your site have been a little naughty they are good kids(adults) but they need a little spanking.

[Garmr]

Titus the people from your site have been a little naughty they are good kids(adults) but they need a little spanking.

Which ones and why?

house,kling and elusive. Why we been forbidden to talk about the first thing and elusive because of the fact she was modkilled for continuing to talk after she replaced out. Through I can see some of elusive side still should of replaced instead of trying to get mod killed.

[Garmr]

Titus the people from your site have been a little naughty they are good kids(adults) but they need a little spanking.

Which ones and why?

house,kling and elusive. Why we been forbidden to talk about the first thing and elusive because of the fact she was modkilled for continuing to talk after she replaced out. Through I can see some of elusive side still should of replaced instead of trying to get mod killed.

b/c the dicussion about it is pointless and not scum hunting. its post-game crap that needs to be delt with.

if you want to talk about it wait for post game where she/ns/others can respond proper

texcat i'm sorry your avatar is super cute but if you make one more post like that then i'm gonna have to vote you.

@ika: yes

though tbh i don't have hair

-.-

I'm straight.....

Also how do you not have hair?

pedit: just drink the poisoned goblet and all your troubles will go away

;/

[Garmr]

those 2 are diffrent garmer.

the issue you want to talk about are drama and had to have mod intervening.

the things me and nik has were more non-chalant and interactions

im not going to get into a smatic debate about it but if you want to talk about that shit go right the fuck ahead, jsut be aware that i think a good chunk of us will be ignoring you on it

Your now making the drama matey not me I was saying it in a joking way (which is why I included the spanking bit) and wasn't intending to have a giant convo about it maybe 2-3 post at most.

[Garmr]

those 2 are diffrent garmer.

the issue you want to talk about are drama and had to have mod intervening.

the things me and nik has were more non-chalant and interactions

im not going to get into a smatic debate about it but if you want to talk about that shit go right the fuck ahead, jsut be aware that i think a good chunk of us will be ignoring you on it

Your now making the drama matey not me I was saying it in a joking way (which is why I included the spanking bit) and wasn't intending to have a giant convo about it maybe 2-3 post at most.

-.-

whos scum and why?
whos your top sk pick right now and why?

Mafiso
numero uno :/ wake same reasons as yesterday plus even with the new posts it's more of explanation of events and what not. Also this association tell.

get it if others don't feel as strong about these two as me. That said, I've seen scum coast into end game WAY too many times.

2.) House, DeltaWave, Wake, KC slot - There are pretty decent scum cases for each of these.

Wake can drop himself out of my focus today if this coming big post does a couple things I'm looking for.

Obviously, I'm not going to tell him what he needs to do to satisfy me ahead of time. Someone remind me if I forget to say so afterward please.

numero deux Titus Nik was scummy as fuck yesterday got really defensive and seemed to be focused more on survival i seriously don't know how people could town read the slot.

To the lighter scum reads

Numero tres Flubber- Pretty much the same reasons as yesterday also Davey was pushing hard on him and he ended up dead.

numero quatra House- His votes been pretty bouncy and most of his reasoning has been pretty weak.

SK
Probs kling/pisskop
klings slips and the fact that who ends up dead but one of the people pushing herKling/himPisskop that idn't really jump out all to much aka slipping under the radar.

[Garmr]

Titus the people from your site have been a little naughty they are good kids(adults) but they need a little spanking.

Which ones and why?

house,kling and elusive. Why we been forbidden to talk about the first thing and elusive because of the fact she was modkilled for continuing to talk after she replaced out. Through I can see some of elusive side still should of replaced instead of trying to get mod killed.

Elusive is not one of mine.

What's your deal with House and Klingon

Elusive was talking about you all game and how awesome you were so assumed. Titus read the game and you'll know why.

[Garmr]

prod dodge post something tomorrow can't think and tired will look over this again because my effort into this game hasn't really been 100%.

[Garmr]

Ok after looking I kinda doubt that a royal saint would be scum since I had such a town read on silver wolf. Through I don't understand what his doing some of the times he hasn't done anything that jumps out saying I'm scum.

[Garmr]

My motivation for mafia is not the best at the moment and that can been seen every where I would prefer to be playing dnd and making the next big plague with my ratfolk alchemist character.

Thoughts

I also don't really care for the annienen vs rs thing as I think it's a tvt as I have town reads on both. The abr wagon is alright I guess but in the past events happened and they make me hesitant to lynch abr. Pisskop replaced klingoncelt and I doubt his mafia after drixx jumped onto him. Might be a sk slot but even so I'm quite happy to keep pisskop around. Eggs thoughts are completely different to mine.


But I guess to engage can I ask what are players thought on titus at the moment. I still have a scum read on her from nik and she has done nothing to change it. But I'm curious if anything has changed for anyone else.

[Garmr]

@ars Heads up any game I am in and there is a sk I am doomed to lose to the sk. I'm trying to change that fortune

[Garmr]

Would also like to point out that wake's activity is dying with his wagon

Hmmm you were saying I was scum yesterday yet you have no hesitations to jump on the wagon I pushed hard yesterday and am on today and you gave no prior indication to as why wake would be scum.

Actually now I look back you dropped your scum read and gave me a town read for no explanation why?

I have town reads on everyone except house, wake, dragonspawn, and dramonic

[Garmr]

VOTE: Flubber

[Garmr]

Would also like to point out that wake's activity is dying with his wagon

Hmmm you were saying I was scum yesterday yet you have no hesitations to jump on the wagon I pushed hard yesterday and am on today and you gave no prior indication to as why wake would be scum.

Actually now I look back you dropped your scum read and gave me a town read for no explanation why?

I have town reads on everyone except house, wake, dragonspawn, and dramonic

beause I got into an argument with you and realized I was wrong

Why didn't you say you were wrong.

[Garmr]

Hey Ap your the house slot right I have a mild scum read on that slot any thoughts on the scum that flipped?

[Garmr]

Titus your not being subtle about it but it looks like your trying to be perceived as subtle. The last two times you acted like this you were scum.

http://forum.mafiascum.net/viewtopic.php?f=56&t=59268
In this game you did something similar till Ika called you out on your claim and you ended up mislynching a town.

http://forum.mafiascum.net/viewtopic.php?f=53&t=60083

In this game you tried to say that there may be a dr in the game and softclaimed it to try and mislynch me but failed miserable.

[Garmr]

Ninjaed

[Garmr]

VOTE: titus

I have been saying this slot was slot was scum

[Garmr]

VOTE: titus

VOTE: titus

I have been saying this slot was slot was scum

Talk. More. Now.

Titus=nik

I have been saying niks been scum day1 and Titus hasn't changed a thing only proven my point if you aren't paying attention start playing or fucking quit

[Garmr]

VOTE: titus

VOTE: titus

I have been saying this slot was slot was scum

Talk. More. Now.

Titus=nik

I have been saying niks been scum day1 and Titus hasn't changed a thing only proven my point if you aren't paying attention start playing or fucking quit

Wrong. Wake is the biggest solver of the game. He actually asked questions to dechiper.

@Texcat look at the captain's log. The proof is there.

Wrong both you and wake suck and your both scum

[Garmr]

Now was this one of title's town gambit or is she scum? That's difficult to figure out

She's done this in the last two bloody scum games she never fucking learns

[Garmr]

Hmmm I wonder what Aneninen/Delta Wave will do? *intrigued*

I am holding off my vote to sleep on things to make sure I find the truthteller.

RS, tell me what is the town motivation for titus to doublecast my cop claim? she did the same shit in "you could be anyone" and guess what shes scum in that

That's not even the most recent time she's done that she did it in zars holiday bash as well. Tried to soft claim that there was a dr then tried to go back on it.

[Garmr]

Some thoughts:

1. ABR, give me some detailed reasoning for something or I'm going to vote you.

2. Why is Titus scum? They've been acting pretty pro-town today.

3. FUN FACT: Welcome to Page 110 of New York 181, and

WAKE STILL HASN'T VOTED ANYONE OUTSIDE OF RVS.

Nice sidelining bro. I swear this guy just sits on the side while we all battle it out.

UNVOTE: A Royal Saint
VOTE: Wake88

4. ADDITIONAL FUN FACT: 88 is a neo-Nazi code for "Heil Hitler" because the eighth letter of the alphabet is H. From this I can infer that Wake is a nazi who needs to go today.

5. It does feel like there are some loose "groups" right now -- and I really do mean loose. Feels like Egg and pisskop generally hang out together, as well as ABR/Gamr/{House/AP}. This ought to be looked at a little further.

There's tons of evidence from people who know titus suggesting this is her scum game and you town read her with out no reasoning. Mind is blown.

[Garmr]

I think I got the thread locked because I suggested that Wake was a neo-Nazi. Sorry guys.

Anyway...

There's tons of evidence from people who know titus suggesting this is her scum game and you town read her with out no reasoning. Mind is blown.

Titus has basically done two things today, which were to call out ARS's badcase against me and to push for an ABR lynch; two totally reasonable and pro-town things to do. ARS case is objectively bad, and ABR does nothing but push wagons in a seemingly random or anti-town way. I don't see a scum motivation here.

You're basically telling me that I have to surrender my independent assessment of Titus on nothing more than the word of a few players, or in other words, to give up a read based on logic so that I can take up someone else's completely subjective assessment. Not going to happen, especially because I'm not happy with how ABR is pushing that wagon. He's said twice that he wants to do it to "teach Titus a lesson" (2561 and 2566) and that it's more or less a policy lynch.

On the other hand, it's indisputable that Wake has still refused to commit even though we're a month in this game. Look at how he sidelines. LOOK AT IT :O

Wow So evidence that she has done this in her past two scum has been ignored, the fact she replaced nik who was obvious scum and i laid out multiple case's has been ignored, She also got caught writing a narrative which has been ignored. Also let me say this the people who take the lawyer approaches in mafia scum tend to fail. You are a investigator not a lawyer. But that being said I do agree with the wake read and would happily place my vote on him if you can get his wagon going.

[Garmr]

Wow So evidence that she has done this in her past two scum has been ignored

What specifically is "this"?

I funking linked them and gave examples even ika brought them up seriously.

Titus your not being subtle about it but it looks like your trying to be perceived as subtle. The last two times you acted like this you were scum.

http://forum.mafiascum.net/viewtopic.php?f=56&t=59268
In this game you did something similar till Ika called you out on your claim and you ended up mislynching a town.

http://forum.mafiascum.net/viewtopic.php?f=53&t=60083

In this game you tried to say that there may be a dr in the game and softclaimed it to try and mislynch me but failed miserable.

[Garmr]

Well ika brought up one of the examples and two more of his own.

[Garmr]

I don't like how delta wave is ignoring evidence and cases on titus yet claims there's nothing on her.

[Garmr]

I don't like how delta wave is ignoring evidence and cases on titus yet claims there's nothing on her.

Lawyers know meta is shit. Also there's no reason to abandon my VCA as scum.

But hey you can take you paranoia fest elsewhere.

There's no reason as scum to keep it. But hey you can write your narratives in a novel and not in a mafia game that would make them more believable.

[Garmr]

Unvote

Titus, why didn't Drixx vote House or Flubber?

Gamr, what is the case on Titus? That she was wrong?

Vote Wake

That she does stuff like this to try and mislynch town shown by the history I posted are you even reading my posts, The way she doubles back after a narrative is another example she's trying to push through a lynch. God everyone is so frustrating making me fucking repeat myself over and over and its fucking different people to people need to fucking learn to read I swear you guys aren't even fucking playing the fucking game.

[Garmr]

The issue isn't that I didn't read it. It's that this push feels just like this Titus town game:
http://forum.mafiascum.net/viewtopic.php?f=56&t=58247

She went all out against the friendly neighbor claim AND the player who claimed to get the friendly neighbor message. They were both scum. Even the "short bus" crumbing feels just like the ascectic (or however the fuck you spell it) crumbing in that game.

Basically, I'm treating the Titus-freeko-ABR thing as null.

The situation there is way different from the situation here. Multiple other factors include being in a hydra, She's debating it's a scum gambit not trying to say that there is a cop guilty on someone and trying to bait out a role. She is more confident there and not trying to work around things with things like avoiding saying who the cop is(which probably had the intention of trying to making the cop out himself to deny or confirm the investigation.) Avoiding questioning ect.

Your example was no where relevant to this game.

[Garmr]

Gamr, let me ask you this. Do you think that Titus believed freeko to be the cop?

No I don't think she did otherwise she wouldn't said go find the cop yourself the way she crumbed it just like her scum self would do.
Also she took her time mentioning it I feel like she was fishing hard for what might pass off as a cop crumb also that would confirm someone as not a cop.

@Delta
Titus is scum if abr or titus is scum the other is not the same alignment thus abr must be town.

[Garmr]

That logic is pretty circular though. Titus is scum because she wants to lynch ABR, who is town because Titus is scum.

Also nik was scum and I have presented reasons why nik was scum it's not just based on titus alone.

[Garmr]

Also that's a fucking huge misrep for my argument.

[Garmr]

Gamr, so what was she trying to accomplish? Wouldn't it be obvious she was lying/wrong the second freeko posted?

I feel like she was fishing hard for what might pass off as a cop crumb also that would confirm someone as not a cop.

So she was trying to confirm that someone she didn't believe to be the cop wasn't the cop? Why go through all of that just to confirm a non-cop read on a single player?

It had the potential to out the cop as well. Ika outed himself.

Also that's a fucking huge misrep for my argument.

It's still an associative tell based on your read of a living player which is kind of BS.

My argument is not based on that alone and what else is kinda bs is people refusing to take my arguments (from nik to titus) As whole and just like to pick bits out with refusing to deal with the obvious scum side it makes me want to rip some peoples heads off.

[Garmr]

I'm getting frustrated I'll be back latter

[Garmr]

What's the theme just curious because all i see is a thrown together reads list.

[Garmr]

None of his thought processes make sense to me with that list.

[Garmr]

Well I'm up for a wake lynch as well. I don't really have anything new to add.

VOTE: Wake

[Garmr]

that's cute.
@Shiro: You don't need more reads though. Wake is pretty obviously scum, we'll recheck tomorrow to see which fruitcakes were so bloody resilient to the lynch.

@Freeko: You think as scum I wouldn't try to get Titus lynched?
Christ, she's like the easiest player to mislynch since joining the site.

How do you know Titus is a mislynch?

Scum is more careful about how they behave. More calculated or whatever.
Titus is a complete trainwreck.
This isn't even low-hanging fruit territory, at this point she's a potato.

W

[Garmr]

that's cute.
@Shiro: You don't need more reads though. Wake is pretty obviously scum, we'll recheck tomorrow to see which fruitcakes were so bloody resilient to the lynch.

@Freeko: You think as scum I wouldn't try to get Titus lynched?
Christ, she's like the easiest player to mislynch since joining the site.

How do you know Titus is a mislynch?

Scum is more careful about how they behave. More calculated or whatever.
Titus is a complete trainwreck.
This isn't even low-hanging fruit territory, at this point she's a potato.

Would like to point out titus is a train wreck no matter her alignment.

[Garmr]

I'm back and done with the 4-day stretch of work for now. At the hospital yesterday a gun-wielding kidnapper/idiot came into our hospital and kidnapped a coworker in the RCC section, thus causing the hospital to go on lock-down. You can read about it here: http://journaltimes.com/news/local/crim ... f6280.html . I was smack-dab in the middle of that crap, and am still a bit disturbed by it. Work went well today, and I'm hoping to play the game more tomorrow before and after blood donation at same hospital.

As for reads, maybe it's true that I shouldn't be playing Mafia for now, because there's just no time for it. Truth be told I joined because of the players, because I played this exact game awhile ago. And I haven't replaced out because I told NS that I wouldn't, and I don't want to be known as that dude who keeps replacing out. It's sort of like a commitment. Anyways, you guys want reads from me, and if I were in your shoes I can certainly understand that, because it's been a really long time, and it's not cool when a player stays in the game but doesn't really come up with reads or make a commitment on who's what.

I'm in a dilemma, guys. I don't wanna replace out, but I'm really struggling here. It's definitely a time issue. But I think, to some extent, it's also a brain-energy issue. Works leaves me brain-drained. There's so many things to juggle, and so many responsibilities that you must deal with. It takes a lot of brain-power to scum-read someone. For me it is, because I'm typically very careful, and second-guessing myself. If I scumread say, Garmr, because he's hopping on wagons and not really providing much if any reason for it, how do I know if he's actually scum? I don't, and I can't. So what do I do, and what do I do if I do succeed in getting him lynched, but he flips Town? Do we even have a standard for what's actually scummy, and what isn't?

My method for scumhunting involves searching for people who use hyperbole, or those who try to twist words or actions. A lot of things that people try to say are scummy really isn't, and much of it is just conjecture. Blather. So, what? Do I have to put a disclaimer at the end of each post every time I scumread someone? I just don't like sloppy and reckless scumreads, and it sucks seeing players get mislynched over and over. I get that in Mafia there's going to be a ton of mislynching, but I should be allowed the self-determination, at least on my part, to be more careful than the rest, right? If you were in my shoes here, on all of these issues, what would you guys do? Can you help me out here, please? You might do me a world of good here.

Right I have had scum reads on both you and titus since the start of the day and explained a lot yesterday as well and I don't much reason on you? Get on your bike mate that's pathetic your reaching as hell for that read.

[Garmr]

With your situation through it sounds like you need a break to help sort yourself out. You also seemed to have over worked yourself as well by the sounds of it.

[Garmr]

Don't get the dracomic votes and nothing really is interesting me about the recent posts.

[Garmr]

It felt like one of titus or wake was scum maybe both as no one would budge from there position and if they were both town I think scum would of dived on the one that needed just a little more to get lynched or stayed on it. Instead they both fizzled out or are currently fizzling out.

[Garmr]

Wake is more invested in making us feel thing than playing. thats scummy; even for a pressed player. When you pursue the elicitation of negative emotions to the exclusion of positive ones or actual material, its scummy.

#can'tholdthefeels

[Garmr]

Guys, some info on my V/LA. My fiance's mother was prescribed Valium, a muscle relaxer, and sleeping pills and way too much of all three. She took it as directed, overdosed, and is now unresponsive. I heard the word "coma" used, but I don't think they officially said that's what it was. Either way, I'm not going to be very focused on this unless the pace stays slow because I have all of this going on and am working doubles all weekend. I may just blow off mafia completely until Monday, but I'd like to try not to do that.

I wish your wife a speedy recovery valium is a hell of a drug and the side effects still make me cringe at the memory.

[Garmr]

Now I can say I why I was hesitant on abr. Because nerocain fake copped him in another game that just finished and abr flipped town. I was hesitant to lynch him this game because he was acting similar to the way he was in that game.

[Garmr]

I don't really feel a royal saint is scum silver wolf was extremely Towny.

[Garmr]

Let just lynch wake now nothing has really changed. His points are that I'm trying to jump on convenient wagons is also laughable and unless I am psychic and can predict the future I have had a scum read on him and Titus since day 1 before they both became viable wagons.

[Garmr]

i got pordded?

shows how much i care about this gaem right now.

im still for wake lynch

Jump on the wake wagons with me.

[Garmr]

Looking back at Drixx's iso, I saw that he was soft bussing Wake:

It feels a lot like you're mailing this in, if you get the expression. What you're saying doesn't really line up with how frequently you have posted. Something isn't adding up.

FOS

@ Wake.

Wake ... it's not that I don't read you scummy. In fact, I kind of do. It just has been light scum and I'm not gonna bandwagon onto a vote I'm not convinced of unless I have to.

Let me be REALLY clear. If this post you're making isn't persuasive and impressive ... you aren't winning any points.

But when the Wake wagon was gaining some support and Delta jumped in with his let's just lynch Wake now, Drixx started a chainsaw(or so it looks to me now) defense of Wake by attacking Delta hard. Drixx claimed at the time that it was because Delta wanted to lynch Wake

now

, without waiting for Wake's post. But with the Drixx flip, it could easily be that he just saw an opportunity to defend scum buddy Wake and took it.

This and so much more.

[Garmr]

Pisskop is the Sk

[Garmr]

Still kinda bitter about the fact the sk was the one who wrecked better half the mafia team but good game

[Garmr]

You hammered RIP. That was good.

yeah that was a good move in hindsight. Though if wolf had been alive still I would have been flashlynched. I've actually done that as my one SK role.

Doubt you would of got it through before we killed you. I had a high opinion of you so you were on my kill list after we killed the power roles. (notice how I eliminated everyone but 4 players as power roles and 2 of them were correct :p.)