I think clearly Izy's problem is that he spends too much time playing games to get his stories published. Fortunately I know just how to solve that problem.
NY 176: Completely Ridiculous Mafia (Game Over)
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I was curious if I had played with any of them before.
@TSO
Objectively speaking what made Bob better then Cabd at the time you placed the vote?
Unvote
Vote: Bob
I'm not a big fan of coincidences, the fact that you just happened to vote the person who voted you after missing the post he voted you in is kind of hard to swallow.-
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I can't actually think of one, I just didn't believe it was a coincidence.
In post 142, Bicephalous Bob wrote:
I did see his vote, but I'd already decided to vote him when I saw it
it's not that spectacular
I suspected as much, why didn't you say this when you were first called on it?-
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In post 154, Aeronaut wrote:Because he tried to cover up an OMGUS.
A better way to cover up omgus is to just not omgus.
If he knew what he was doing was suspicious enough to cover up why do it in the first place?-
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In post 54, Bicephalous Bob wrote:I actually read page 3 before page 2 and decided I'd vote you if no one had said anything scummier on page 2
the fact that it's a crossvote is a bonus though
In post 142, Bicephalous Bob wrote:
I did see his vote, but I'd already decided to vote him when I saw it
it's not that spectacular
Hrm I meant these two posts, though upon reading them next to each other I realize they don't actually say what I thought they said. For some reason I thought you said you didn't read his post in 54.-
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In post 230, Aeronaut wrote:Aren't you voting for him?
No I unvoted. My interest in his vote on Jimmy isn't enough to sustain a scumread seeing as how I was wrong about his responses to TSO.-
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In post 247, Aeronaut wrote:In post 244, Aegor wrote:In post 243, Toomai wrote:In post 235, Aegor wrote:[...] but I will continue voting for Toomai in order to push for his mislynch.- How is pushing for this mislynch pro-town?
- How do you know it's a mislynch?
- How do you expect to get others to join in what you state to be a mislynch?
I have no response to those questions.
....
Alright, well something shitty is going on here. I don't know if we're missing something, but someone who is pushing for a mislynch is obviously not helping us... I've seen Aegor's town game, even his cop game, and this isn't it.
VOTE: Aegor
Start providing real information, please.
This entire line of reasoning is ridiculous.
Unless someone can think of a reason for Aegor to publicly declare his intention to mislynch it's pretty obvious he was joking.
In fact I find Toon's questions kind of scummy. If you stop to think about them for a moment you'll realize that the answers to all of them are very obvious, so obvious in fact that they're almost non-questions. This begs the question of why did Toon ask them.
Vote: Toomai-
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In post 136, T S O wrote:bob beat me in a scumgames eons ago.
Possibly because this is the sum of your scumhunting?
What do you think of recent developments.-
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I have a minor scumread on Toon because I think his questions were unnecessary, as well as possibly being leading. But that's kind of tenuous.
I'm currently watching Bob as well, I want to know his reasons behind suspecting Jimmy. This isn't so much a scumread though as something I'm keeping an eye on.
I'm not saying I disagree with the read on TWIE, but I am curious as to your reasons for it.-
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In post 472, Aegor wrote:DJ is scummy for popping up as soon as he was mentioned and then still not reading the game.
This is pertinent.
Also his line of reasoning regarding who can or cannot answer questions is bizarre and feels like he's grasping at straws.
I find his posts kind of weird. I have it on good authority this is the technical term for this behavior.-
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Depends on the question really.
If the question is answered to my satisfaction and I wasn't asking to ascertain a specific players stance on a topic, then no.
As I see it the problem isn't that you wanted Ki-gi to answer the question, it's that you insisted that he should have taken exception to someone else answering it. Which I see as a strange stance to take.
Also seeing as how you want to talk to me how about you answer of mine.
Why do I have the impression you were actively lurking?-
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In post 432, Depraved Justice wrote:Explain to me why you think its ok for AP to interfere in our convo?
Shouldn't you be getting on reinoe's back or for answering your question for you?
Also that's a non-answer and you know it.-
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In post 513, Depraved Justice wrote:
no? I think Reinoe is clearly trolling and even if he's not then I don't really suspect him nor am I calling AP scum for answering a question/giving his two cents. (as you are implying) I only think he's scummy if Ki-Gi flips scum.
If your take away from my ki's convo is that I'm mad that he doesn't suspect AP then either I haven't done a good job of explaining why I suspect him or you are just flat out not reading and I'm going with door #2 here.
I also don't think I've been active lurking at all. I think I was inactive this game and then CABD lead the derpy charge that I was scummy for this and now everyone (including yourself) is piggybacking that argument.
You're door two option feels right for a reason. Mostly because I don't really care about what you and KI-Gi were talking about. My impression from that entire line of dialog was that you were pursuing a silly line of reasoning, and were trying very hard to make it look serious.
Your reaction to him not answering the question was also way out of proportion to the offense. I would have expected you to maybe ask him the question again, or ask if agreed with the other answer or something like that. Not go in all out attack mode and demand answers while simultaneously insinuating that it was scummy to allow others to "intrude" on your conversation.
I also don't like that you're distancing yourself from the lurking point. Calling it "Cabd's derpy change" is a soft discredit on what was a very valid point. You weren't posting, then you showed up to respond when you were mentioned. Claiming you hadn't read the game only makes this look worse as that makes it even less likely that you could just happen to notice the post you were mentioned in.
In post 514, Depraved Justice wrote:
if this was how you felt why did you wait to post about it and not say this in 451?
I was feeling snarkier then I had been in 514. Also I had to go back and dig up that quote of you demanding that Ki-Gi had to be offended by someone else answering his question.
Toomai's questions were scummy.
His questions were unnecessary and give me the vibe that he was trying to look like he was scumhunting while not actually doing it.
And if they were serious questions I see them as being even worse. Aegor probably couldn't have actually answered those questions without looking either foolish or scummy. Which makes me think that they were loaded questions, which is to say questions designed to make Aegor look bad. I don't just find that anti town, I think that's right out scummy.
As for TSO and reinoe, I'm nullish on both of them. Objectively speaking I find TSO scummier then reinoe, but that's kind of splitting hairs.-
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Not rereading is best. I already consider the last ten pages to be "the twilight zone", where good arguments go to die.
See what I don't get is what you were hoping to learn with those questions. Had Aegor answered them what would you have learned from his responses?
And yes that is a problem. Because if those were really serious questions then that means you think there was a possibility of Aegor telling you he thought pushing mislynches was protown, or that he could have had information about your alignment somehow, or that he had some magical plan that would make everyone vote for you.
I suppose there's a remote possibility of him being a daycop or something like that but even that would only make your question rolefishing.-
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In post 583, Depraved Justice wrote:I honestly don't understand how you (and apparently AP and Cephir) can't understand why I'm p suspicious of Ki-Gi. He made an accusation, I asked him to back it up, he couldn't and then stalled for several posts until finally sheeping Cabd's reasoning when all this could have easily been avoided if he had said "I'm just agreeing with Cabd on this" or something along those lines. Explain to me the town motivation there.
This whole thing that I demanded Ki-Gi to be suspicious of AP is pretty silly and I really really really hate how you are trying to make it about that and not about Ki-Gi not backing up his accusation.
I think my reaction to Ki-Gi in 416 was rather tame so I think you calling it "out of proportion" is rather weak.
"Claiming you hadn't read the game only makes this look worse as that makes it even less likely that you could just happen to notice the post you were mentioned in."
So your theory is that I'm scum and instead of going and reading the game or w/e I brought even more attention to myself by claiming I haven't read that game. Totes makes sense.
I'm not comfortable with the way you keep trying to drag this conversation into being a discussion about KI-Gi. My stance on the matter is simply that I think the way you reacted was out of proportion to the circumstances. If you find that weak that's your prerogative, but this has never been about whether Ki-Gi answered you questions or not for me.
Also drowning the fact that it looks like you were active lurking in wifom does not in fact excuse the fact that you're pretending that there's no scum motivation for a scum player to actively lurk.-
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In post 591, Depraved Justice wrote:Yes, I know that scum do lurk. I also know that nothing is a 100% scum tell and that I'm town. This "well you need to admit that there's scum motivation in lurking" is
Also to be active lurking I would have had to be posting....
So if you admit that scum lurk why were you insisting that Cabd's wagon was a derpwagon? It seems the people who doubted you had a legitimate reason for doing so.
Arguments such as "there's no such thing as a 100% scumtell" and "I know I'm town" are also bad arguments.
The first is glaring obvious, and it pretty much goes without saying that everyone who voiced concern about you lurking was doing so because they thought there was a good chance you were doing so as scum.
I don't think I even need to explain why the second is terrible.-
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I agree with AP. He doesn't say anything that make him look either more town or scum.
Even his strongest scumread doesn't have a reason attached for it other then a vague allusion that it may or may not be someone else's read.
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I think I might have some conformation bias but I like the way MVP interacted with DJ, in that it was logical and felt like a legitimate thought process. However pretty much everything else he says is ugh.
I doubt I would vote for reinoe or TSO today. In fact I rather they both push their secondary suspects.
Cephrir is not only trying to have no opinion on anything, but he's pretty much flat out saying that that's what he's doing. Nobody seems to care though.-
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This is swell, I like it.
If I switch to MVP now can I have Toomai tomorrow?-
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Yeah no, the entire thing looks terrible.
Cabd's question does suck. Any line of inquiry that would have come from it being answered would have been useless.
At best I think the question was rhetorical. If it was a serious question then I have no idea what he was getting at.
Reinoe's response sucks too. Mostly because it was unwarranted, and contained an implicit threat.-
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In post 936, Bicephalous Bob wrote:
why are you lining up lynches and using aegor's hyperbole as an excuse to vote MVP?
it's just three players with no useful connection except for the fact that they've all been wagoned
Because I'm coming to the realization that none of the people I really want dead are going to end up that way today.
MVP's and okay lynch, we could easily do worse. Besides if we leave him alive we're just going to have the same arguments to lynch him day two.
I'm not basing my scumreads on associations between players. Doing that before we have any flips would just be pointless guesswork.-
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In post 942, reinoe wrote:In post 940, Bicephalous Bob wrote:so what was the obvious thing cabd was doing
Cabd was seeing if everything Toomai says and does is just contentless reasonless garbage. Look at Toomai's ISO it's all apathetic crap that allows him not to take responsibility for anything. It's all..."I'm just not sure: we'll see what happens: I don't know what it does: I'm not confident in any of this...."
Toomai claims that my entrance put the game back in silly mode: that's horseshit and Toomai's 327 is gahdawfull.
I don't disagree with this, but why did you shut down Izy?-
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@DJ
My other options include you and Toomai.
Besides I already stated why I would be willing to vote MVP. Do you have a question about that?
@Toomai
I'm confused as to how that could be considered a part of your read on DJ.
Are you just using the post to illustrate that DJ was lurking? If so why didn't you just say that.-
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@DJ
You probably aren't a lynch candidate for today. I'm saying that I would be willing to lynch you.
You're my secondary scumread. I'm fairly certain I've stated this before.
I would rather lynch Toomai over you, but would rather lynch either of you over MVP.
But unlike you and Toomai, I think MVP is viable.-
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In post 993, Depraved Justice wrote:All of MVP is experienced enough to know what to do at l-1. I guess I can't really explain it well but I think that Mir immediately threatening to hammer (implied) with 4 days to dl when MVP isn't his #1 suspect just seems odd to me.
I am continually pissed off that people seem to think that having time remaining some kind of terrible thing.
Every lynch made in a games I've played recently that waited till the last minute was a shitty compromise.
We have four days left isn't a valid argument for anything unless you think we're going to make better choices when we're desperate.-
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In post 1002, Izariael wrote:
I didn't/don't think you're a possible lynch for today, so this statement is silly.I do, however, think you're scummy and would lynch you if I thought it were possible. Maybe on day 2, if I survive the night. Something to look forward to for both of us. It'll be fun.
I'm not seeing why this isn't possible today. I know for a fact that there's at least as many people with DJ in their scumlist as there are on the Bob wagon.
In post 1004, T S O wrote:I don't want to lynch Toomai. reinoe or MVP.
How do you feel about DJ? Also why not Toomai?
In post 1029, Depraved Justice wrote:
As for the hydra, we have been consulting. We have consulted but we disagree on things. The scumread we agree on (Mirhawk) is unlikely to be lynched. So we have agreed to put our vote where useful and reassess daily.
You know I was just ignoring the fact that you've been calling me your primary scumread all day since I know you don't have shit on me, but let's talk about it. It'll be fun.
Why am I scum, and why is whatever you're going to accuse me of scummy? Is there even a scum motivation for me to do this hypothetical thing?
From where I'm standing your case amounts to
"OMGUS! You just called me out on being a lurky dirtbag"!
In post 1035, AngryPidgeon wrote:
Why dont you think Toomai is viable? I know Aegor and I have been talking about that most of the game Day.
Because aside from you, me, and Aegor everyone seems to be reluctant to even so much as look at him.
I mean despite the fact that he's managed to spend the entirety of day one doing absolutely NOTHING.-
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In post 1096, Aegor wrote:Bob votes make no sense and are really, really bad. Surely scum would have PMed the mod about such questions? I PMed the mod about the GS results. There is no reason to post in-thread; it is null.
Agree.
"Bob is dumb so he posted a question highlighting his scumrole in the thread" is a terrible scumtell.-
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In post 1124, Depraved Justice wrote:
Just this whole idea that you and Mir are pushing that I need to "admit if something has scum motivation" is such a silly silly argument. You two are pushing a mislynch. There's scum motivation in that. So when I flip town that means you guys are scum right, I mean there's scum motivation there. What happens if Cabd and/or Reinoe flip town? That means you are pushing mislynchs and there's scum motivation in that. You are essentially chain lynching here and there's scum motivation in that. This argument is really stupid.
So you think I'm scum for pushing a lynch on someone you think is town? And that person just happens to be you?
You're argument in that post is a logical nightmare. I'm scummy for pushing for a mislynch? How on earth would I know it was a mislynch unless I was scum? Do you think I know it's a mislynch?
This is literally an argument so bad that you could cut and paste onto any player in this game, no matter who they're voting, and it would still have the same effect.
Also how is it you keep posting opinions on who we should lynch if that's all you have for your top scumread?
MVP's claim wasn't great and it very well could be fake. I don't feel strongly enough to pursue it though, and I get the feeling that's the general town sentiment. There isn't really any harm in letting it slide for now.
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A nice post from Toomai.
By favorite bit is the part with no analysis at all. You know, the whole thing.-
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Everybody's who either town reading or scumreading reinoe for meta related reasons should just stop. Seriously. This is stupid.
Just as stupid as thinking reinoe is scummy for answering that question about scum meta.
Just as stupid as reinoe answering that question.
And just as stupid as that question being asked in the first place.
It's stupid right through.
In post 1160, Depraved Justice wrote:
That post was a reply to Iz's accusation that I am scummy for not scum reading his biggest scumreads. His reply was that there was scum motivation in it and therefore scummy for it. Though to be fair, he did clarify that he wasn't going to push this unless Cabd/ren flips scum.
I'm clearly mocking him (and not talking about why I suspect you) 'cause this "admit there's scum motivation!" is a p bad argument.
But THIS is why I suspect you. I think you are butting in on things you'd don't understand and then being argumentative for the sake of arguing. You are doing it here and you did it when I was clearly fussing at flake alt ki-gi for not really backing up his earlier accusation. Its ignoring the gamestate and there's scum motivation in that so you obviously have to be scum.
Oh sorry, seeing as how youIGNOREDmy previous question about why you thought I was scummy I had to leap at the opportunity to actually talk about your scumreads.
Establishing motive is not a bad arguemnt. I don't even understand how you could possibly think it is. You tried to pretend that there was no way scum would have behaved as you did, thus making your behavior not scummy. When the reality was that there was a clear advantage to scum acting in that manner.
Your third paragraph there is so terrible I don't even know how it exists.
I'm not allowed to voice opinions on conversations in a game where doing so is required?
I'm ignoring the gamestate? Really? Are you going to in any way back that statement up?
I don't understand the things I'm talking about? Want to comment on that? What don't I understand? If I don't understand it how does that even make me scum?-
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That's bullshit and you know it.
We have just over two days left, it would be irresponsible to move my vote to a new wagon at this juncture unless I knew other people were willing to support it. Especially seeing as how I JUST SAID I would be V/LA over the deadline.
The wagon on reinoe sucks. TSO and Izy are voting reinoe for shitty reasons and the other two players on the wagon are scum.
Me cycling through everyone but reinoe is a flat out lie.
I've pushed you, Bob, and Toomai.
I publicly admitted that MVP was a convenience lynch, I never even voted him.-
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In post 1195, Depraved Justice wrote:
oh I see how it is. When Iz suggested that I was scummy for townreading his scumreads it was a good argument. But when I mock him (and show him how ridiculous) said argument is its a bad argument? I really hate you and Ceph buddying up to IZ like that.
What are you talking about? What does this even have to do with Izy? Are we talking about the same thing?
You could prob push the "there's scum motivation in what you are doing" on anyone. Its also not "establishing" motive 'cause you wouldn't know anyone's motives till they flip.
This is terrible. By this reasoning there's really no point in scumhunting at all, without looking for motive behind what players are doing we may as well be randomly lynching people.
Lets see. I was clearly fussing at Ki-Gi for not really backing up his statement that I was being "weird" and then you cherry pick and try to show that I'm fussing at Ki-Gi for not suspecting AP. And taking my response to Iz and trying to make it look like I was talking about you while simultaneously calling it shit reasoning but whiteknighting Iz.
Do you even understand why I think you're scum?
You were lurking, when people started talking about you you immediately showed up. You were called on this by more then one player,you then completely ignored this for pages. Then when you did acknowledge it, you tried to pretend that it wasn't scummy because scum wouldn't do it.
Sure there's a bunch of stuff since then, but that's just icing on the cake. This is where I started scumreading you.
Yeah fine whatever. This is extremely verifiable so I'm not going to push this further. I will however require a night in which you made a kill and a night in which you didn't make a kill to believe this claim in the long run. I suppose mafia vig is possible, but unlikely.-
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I'm going to stay on Toomai, it's the wagon I like best. It's also the wagon most likely to actually need my vote.
Bob's wagon isn't that bad. His attempt to run Ki-gi up for a lurker lynch with two days remaining was awful.
The people on reinoes wagon should get off it and decide between Toomai and Bob.-
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In post 1226, Cephrir wrote:This would never pass any sort of review whatsoever
I'll have to take your word for it. I've heard of mafia vigs, but I've never seen one.
@Bob
That's weak, why wait so late to bring this up?-
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Mirhawk Mafia Scum
- Mafia Scum
- Mafia Scum
- Posts: 2531
- Joined: June 7, 2010
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Mirhawk Mafia Scum
- Mafia Scum
- Mafia Scum
- Posts: 2531
- Joined: June 7, 2010
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Mirhawk Mafia Scum
- Mafia Scum
- Mafia Scum
- Posts: 2531
- Joined: June 7, 2010
In post 1443, T S O wrote:What possible reason could scum have for stopping his kill as well as killing him?
There's lots of reasons. So many in fact that we might as well save speculating on this point until we have some idea of the other PR's (scum and town) in the game.
I'm going to be rereading some bits before I form any more opinions, so that's all for tonight.
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