NY 174: Oldy Mafia 2 (Game Over)
-
-
Save The Dragons He/HimProtection unnecessaryHe/Him
- Protection unnecessary
- Protection unnecessary
- Posts: 21829
- Joined: April 26, 2004
- Pronoun: He/Him
- Location: WA, USA
Oh man I'm super excited to start. But it's been a long time...I barely remember how to play.
Clearly suspicious retaliatory Vote: Untrod Tripod-
-
Save The Dragons He/HimProtection unnecessaryHe/Him
- Protection unnecessary
- Protection unnecessary
- Posts: 21829
- Joined: April 26, 2004
- Pronoun: He/Him
- Location: WA, USA
LML: I was sad when you didn't vote for yourself. I totally would have.
Internal Monologue wrote:Oh man, who's number 14? It's himself! hee hee...-
-
Save The Dragons He/HimProtection unnecessaryHe/Him
- Protection unnecessary
- Protection unnecessary
- Posts: 21829
- Joined: April 26, 2004
- Pronoun: He/Him
- Location: WA, USA
What the heck is up with the whiteout votes?
VOTE: Oh. Hey. I figured it out.
That's actually kind of cool. It must make it easier to see the votes as long as no one abuses this.-
-
Save The Dragons He/HimProtection unnecessaryHe/Him
- Protection unnecessary
- Protection unnecessary
- Posts: 21829
- Joined: April 26, 2004
- Pronoun: He/Him
- Location: WA, USA
-
-
Save The Dragons He/HimProtection unnecessaryHe/Him
- Protection unnecessary
- Protection unnecessary
- Posts: 21829
- Joined: April 26, 2004
- Pronoun: He/Him
- Location: WA, USA
Careful. If your finger of suspicion gets too close to my inner monologue, you'd be picking my brain.-
-
Save The Dragons He/HimProtection unnecessaryHe/Him
- Protection unnecessary
- Protection unnecessary
- Posts: 21829
- Joined: April 26, 2004
- Pronoun: He/Him
- Location: WA, USA
It's weird but I kind of like it...it's no fun getting killed night 1 especially for a game you really want to play.In post 42, Tigris wrote: Although, I still find starting with day instead of night somewhat odd.
UNVOTE: whatever
VOTE: MafiaSSK-
-
Save The Dragons He/HimProtection unnecessaryHe/Him
- Protection unnecessary
- Protection unnecessary
- Posts: 21829
- Joined: April 26, 2004
- Pronoun: He/Him
- Location: WA, USA
this game is harder than I remembered.
I like this one the best now.
Unvote, Vote Seol-
-
Save The Dragons He/HimProtection unnecessaryHe/Him
- Protection unnecessary
- Protection unnecessary
- Posts: 21829
- Joined: April 26, 2004
- Pronoun: He/Him
- Location: WA, USA
unvote, Vote: undo
If you're going to pick up on any one thing in this discussion, that seems like a weird one.-
-
Save The Dragons He/HimProtection unnecessaryHe/Him
- Protection unnecessary
- Protection unnecessary
- Posts: 21829
- Joined: April 26, 2004
- Pronoun: He/Him
- Location: WA, USA
Awwww yeah there's that terse, several paragraph posting I remember.
Why, I'm so glad you asked. Tbh I was waiting for undo to come back and say something but what the hell.In post 106, MafiaSSK wrote: Wait, how are you literally seeing anything scummy from that post? This looks like such a piss poor excuse for a vote.
And now, STD presents: an abridged history of the game so far!
There was a wagon on Glork: I think this was just random.
There was a wagon on Tigris: against the rhetoric that 3rd vote on a wagon is scum.
There was a wagon on MafiaSSK: because of that third vote and post 45 and stuff
There was a wagon on Seol: because of (well, I like him for scum because of opportunistic wagon jumping. I'll get to this further.)
So that's 4 wagons. There's a lot of votes in between. Other stuff happens. And MafiaSSK says this:
That's an odd thing to say, considering this could possibly apply to several people in the game. I guess it depends on how satisfied you are with people saying things like "XXXX = townread," "not feeling XXX," and whether someone's vote would qualify as an opinion. To be fair, I suppose it would, but I wasn't thinking about that at the time. I was thinking about players like Dripping Goofball, Cogito Ergo Sum, that Save The Dragons jerkface, Untrod Tripod, etc, and of course just one posts people: MrBuddyLee, oh hey undo, who have given little to no explanation for their opinions.In post 85, MafiaSSK wrote:
Any chance there could be an actual opinion coming from you, ABR?In post 72, Albert B. Rampage wrote:When did Shanba sign up for this?
FoS:ABR
It seemed to me like you were trying to stir the hornet's nest for some reason, but not commit to it. The jury is still out on you, but I think it unlikely you are scum for a reason I'll get to later.
Then undo comes along. He blazes over the (again to be fair, only 3 legitimate) wagons and his eyes narrow to the aforementioned post like a teenage boy starting at a pair of boobies and having the rest of the world just dissapear around him.
So why is his vote still in the RVS? Perhaps I just want him to elaborate on his motives.
Now here's the tricky part:
(At least) one of this set { petroleumjelly, Seol, Porochaz, Green Crayons }In post 75, Patrick wrote:MafiaSSK (6) -- Tigris, Save the Dragons, petroleumjelly, Seol, Porochaz, Green Crayons
is highly likely to be opportunistic mafia. You can toss LoudMouthLee in there for the FOS.
I started that list at petroleumjelly because it was his reasoning that seemed to get people on board, less so Tigris's. Thus that leaves Seol, Porochaz, Green Crayons, and LoudMouthLee. I believe one of them is likely to be mafia.
Thus I would be down with lynching any one of those people. At this point of the game I will be willing to join any of these wagons.
But rather than just sit tight on Seol, I was kind of hoping to swing my sweaty vote around and put pressure on people because
Inner Monologue wrote:Hmm...1 to 2 scum in a 22 person town just seems imba...-
-
Save The Dragons He/HimProtection unnecessaryHe/Him
- Protection unnecessary
- Protection unnecessary
- Posts: 21829
- Joined: April 26, 2004
- Pronoun: He/Him
- Location: WA, USA
If this is true, why is your vote still on your choice of random vote?In post 115, undo wrote: To sum up, both wagons are 'meh' to me and I'd really rather look into other players (this should also address STD's disquiet).
Up until this point, your only opinion was that Albert should be more opinionated.
If anyone else is interested in turning the heat up on undo, let me know, otherwise I'm going back to Seol.
undo: vote: undo, redo: vote: Seol
wait, that's not right.
Unvote: undo, Vote: Seol-
-
Save The Dragons He/HimProtection unnecessaryHe/Him
- Protection unnecessary
- Protection unnecessary
- Posts: 21829
- Joined: April 26, 2004
- Pronoun: He/Him
- Location: WA, USA
-
-
Save The Dragons He/HimProtection unnecessaryHe/Him
- Protection unnecessary
- Protection unnecessary
- Posts: 21829
- Joined: April 26, 2004
- Pronoun: He/Him
- Location: WA, USA
I'm not going to lie, I'm really eager/scared to see who makes VitaminR's list of "weak" players.
In any case I'm not feeling VitaminR. Honestly I wish I were because then I could be all like
HE'S LEADING US ALONG!-
-
Save The Dragons He/HimProtection unnecessaryHe/Him
- Protection unnecessary
- Protection unnecessary
- Posts: 21829
- Joined: April 26, 2004
- Pronoun: He/Him
- Location: WA, USA
tbh I'm more curious about the list because I want to know what PJ hopes to accomplish with it.
I need to find something to do while I'm waiting for specific people to respond.-
-
Save The Dragons He/HimProtection unnecessaryHe/Him
- Protection unnecessary
- Protection unnecessary
- Posts: 21829
- Joined: April 26, 2004
- Pronoun: He/Him
- Location: WA, USA
Do it. It's good for the soul.In post 137, Cogito Ergo Sum wrote:I think we need some more Seolvotes.-
-
Save The Dragons He/HimProtection unnecessaryHe/Him
- Protection unnecessary
- Protection unnecessary
- Posts: 21829
- Joined: April 26, 2004
- Pronoun: He/Him
- Location: WA, USA
In post 142, Tigris wrote:I don't recall you being quite this amusing Dragons, but then again has been a few years.
You asked for it!In post 142, Tigris wrote:I do find it slightly interesting that you are looking at the later players on mafia's bandwagon, but not a similar examination of the other two bandwagons that reached 6. I'm positive that you'll reply in detail whether I ask for it or not...
...or not...
Glork reached 6, but I assume you're not talking about that since that was ridiculous.
The wagon on that Tigris person had a lot of this
and a little of this
and I think there was this
As I'm working on this, UT popped up and decided to play oldschool now so it's really hard for me to comment on his previous posts when he keeps posting. MrBuddyLee for all I know was using his "free random first" vote to jump on the Tigris wagon. Not sure what to think of chamber yet. To be fair I am biased towards older playstyle, I know that people who did things like "vote: x end of post" were usually hounded (by me if not others. *shakes fist at PeaceBringer/BabyJesus/others*) Since then I have accepted that it's part of meta and at times I have tried to adopt that playstyle. But I like to fucking write so that bottle came out of the genie...or...something like that.
What was the point?
In my opinion, I felt that that while erroneous, the jumps onto Tigris were either justified by a pro-town motivation to tack onto someone who seemed suspicious, or did not give enough information for me to really read. I also don't really know what a glipglop is.
The MafiaSSK wagon started with you (Tigris) voting for the reasoning that got you wagoned. I hopped on board mostly due to the OMGUS-y response. I think PJ's vote is justified.
I feel like Seol just basically wrote out what PJ was implying. I feel like Porochaz just basically wrote out what PJ was implying. I feel like GC just basically wrote what PJ was implying. I think LML just quoted pj, then said why he though Tigris was suspicious, then added an FOS. There's nothing wrong with chiming in and adding your own opinion, but it would certainly be easy for scum to be like "PJ's right! bam!"
I mention this again (I guess in a little greater detail) because I suspect at least one of those 5 people of begin scum, probably Seol, possibly LML, least likely PJ. I haven't really turned an eye to see who's on the Seol wagon and why. Excuse me a moment. ... I seem to recall that CES has determined from his first post that Seol is scum. I'm still not sure what to make of chamber. I suspect Sotty and Shanba had similar reasons for voting Seol as I did.
Well, I think that's all of them. I encourage you all to vote for Seol. Or LML. Or if you wanna go punk and really piss off your parents by being non-conformist, I wouldn't mind going after undo.-
-
Save The Dragons He/HimProtection unnecessaryHe/Him
- Protection unnecessary
- Protection unnecessary
- Posts: 21829
- Joined: April 26, 2004
- Pronoun: He/Him
- Location: WA, USA
Why not and where do you want it?
-
-
Save The Dragons He/HimProtection unnecessaryHe/Him
- Protection unnecessary
- Protection unnecessary
- Posts: 21829
- Joined: April 26, 2004
- Pronoun: He/Him
- Location: WA, USA
I wanna see who steps in it.In post 147, Untrod Tripod wrote:which I guess is similar, but I just want to make it clear
like I said in the earlier post, I'm trying to get back into my older, wordier playstyle. the kids today like "^scum" type posts more than long explanations. you know how it is.
scum V-
-
Save The Dragons He/HimProtection unnecessaryHe/Him
- Protection unnecessary
- Protection unnecessary
- Posts: 21829
- Joined: April 26, 2004
- Pronoun: He/Him
- Location: WA, USA
-
-
Save The Dragons He/HimProtection unnecessaryHe/Him
- Protection unnecessary
- Protection unnecessary
- Posts: 21829
- Joined: April 26, 2004
- Pronoun: He/Him
- Location: WA, USA
In post 156, MafiaSSK wrote:STD, I don't think you can actually just dismiss the Glork wagon.In post 20, Sotty7 wrote:Vote: Glork
I can't believe he hasn't caught any scum yet. Clearly one of them.In post 24, CrashTextDummie wrote:Good things invariably happen when Glork gets waggoned.
Vote: Glork
If you want the town to win, vote Glork.1. joke
2. joke
3. joke
4. joke
5. seems disinterested. I'm not sure why he thinks Seol is scum at this point in the game, but it seems like he's jumping on Glork as a lark.
6. i dunno what weasel mafia is supposed to mean.
Unless it's more like
1. joke
2. joke
3. serious belief that 21 posts into the game glork is the best wagon
4. joke
etc...
Perhaps I don't take much credence from the RVS. I'm not seeing it. I really kind of expected this kind of behavior, especially early day 1. And even if I did, any one of those 6 people could hide behind "oh haha day1 rvs funtimes string up glork yay happyfun." Thus scum or town could be on that wagon, I can't tell.
What does he have to gain by buddying with CTD, if they are both scum?In post 156, MafiaSSK wrote: But a real nail in his coffin? Is his most recent post and the complete and utter buddying that goes on with CTD:-
-
Save The Dragons He/HimProtection unnecessaryHe/Him
- Protection unnecessary
- Protection unnecessary
- Posts: 21829
- Joined: April 26, 2004
- Pronoun: He/Him
- Location: WA, USA
The (I think) first time I played with you I random voted you for that reason and I think your response was something like *headbangs*In post 167, VitaminR wrote:
Haha, somebody remembers that song!In post 125, Save The Dragons wrote:I'm not going to lie, I'm really eager/scared to see who makes VitaminR's list of "weak" players.
In any case I'm not feeling VitaminR. Honestly I wish I were because then I could be all like
HE'S LEADING US ALONG!-
-
Save The Dragons He/HimProtection unnecessaryHe/Him
- Protection unnecessary
- Protection unnecessary
- Posts: 21829
- Joined: April 26, 2004
- Pronoun: He/Him
- Location: WA, USA
I pretty much believe the exact opposite of everything you think about the glork wagon.In post 173, MafiaSSK wrote: Yeah, sure all of that behavior might be expected during Day 1, but it's the way that the behavior is implemented that I think is actually really telling. It's when scum is least prepared to put on whatever face they will. It's when you get to see the basis of the playstyle that they'll carry over. Did you not see this in my post? Do you disagree with my analysis?-
-
Save The Dragons He/HimProtection unnecessaryHe/Him
- Protection unnecessary
- Protection unnecessary
- Posts: 21829
- Joined: April 26, 2004
- Pronoun: He/Him
- Location: WA, USA
How would you compare this to how I have categorized the voters on MafiaSSK's wagon?In post 179, Green Crayons wrote: - Vitamin's response to Yosarian in Post 167, which explains how Vitamin acts when scum, reads as if Vitamin is outright explaining why he acted the way he did in this game. That is: (1) Vitamin-scum is "overly concerned with 'leaving a paper trail,'" (2) "One of the ways of <leaving a paper trail> can be to leave a FOS or to call out a specific post, so you can refer back to it later when you actually switch your vote," and (3) in Post 65, Vitamin left a paper trail for developing suspicions of all of the MafiaSSK voters, while targeting one in particular (LML).
- Although I recognize Sotty reacted in a similar way as Vitamin (Post 58), her particular word usage is more than a difference in degree: it looks like Sotty is saying that she finds the reasons for voting MafiaSSK were bad, whereas Vitamin is saying that he finds the voters voting MafiaSSK were bad/scummy.-
-
Save The Dragons He/HimProtection unnecessaryHe/Him
- Protection unnecessary
- Protection unnecessary
- Posts: 21829
- Joined: April 26, 2004
- Pronoun: He/Him
- Location: WA, USA
VitaminR:
"Feels like a bunch of strong playersgoing for an easy target."
STD:
"highly likely to beopportunisticmafia."
The bold is equivalent, the only difference (just from the quoted texts) that is immediately visible to me is I said "mafia" where he said "strong players". I suspect that mafia was implied.
If there is some suspicion with the way he chooses to use the phrase "strong players" then that would be the difference I see. But I'm not exactly sure what's ticking people off about that.
In post 127, Save The Dragons wrote:tbh I'm more curious about the list because I want to know what PJ hopes to accomplish with it.
Other than that (and to be perfectly fair, VitaminR's discussion on LML's meta that I cannot vouch for nor particularly care about) ...yes?In post 184, Green Crayons wrote:Do you think his rationale is comparable to yours?-
-
Save The Dragons He/HimProtection unnecessaryHe/Him
- Protection unnecessary
- Protection unnecessary
- Posts: 21829
- Joined: April 26, 2004
- Pronoun: He/Him
- Location: WA, USA
-
-
Save The Dragons He/HimProtection unnecessaryHe/Him
- Protection unnecessary
- Protection unnecessary
- Posts: 21829
- Joined: April 26, 2004
- Pronoun: He/Him
- Location: WA, USA
But then you'll miss out on all theIn post 200, Natirasha wrote:Yeah I don't really feel like reading the thread.annoying, banal, and totally notfunny stuff I said...
Since I'm not a mind readerIn post 206, Glork wrote:
A thousand points* to whomever can point out the giant red flag in this sentence.undo wrote:Honestly, I was willing to give you the benefit of the doubt about that RV-wagon theory, but you just keep on coming out with some outlandish reasonings I frankly wouldn't expect from an oldie.yet mwa ha hahere would be my guess:
The fun part is that Seol plays the "he's either stupid or scum" card too:In every post he makes because it's his title, Glork wrote:Burdened by Proficiency
One of the broad generalizations I remember from my time here is that on day 1 people often lynched a pro-town player because people were arguing against the theory of what they said. Intent > content.In post 162, Seol wrote:Because it favours scum. Either you're wrong or you're scum (with an inclusive or), and in a game full of experienced players, I give less credence to being wrong.
I'm going to go one step further from a previous statement and say there is very little that MafiaSSK has posted that I agree with.Swimming past the bullshitthat is just a gross metaphor. Let me try again.Putting aside all the fanfare, I suspect that MafiaSSK's actions are efforts to find scum.
But it's just so weird! MafiaSSK basically says we should all vote for Glork to gain information and then votes for Tigris for starting a different bandwagon, thus starting a different bandwagon.
If MafiaSSK turns out to be scum, it also kind of ruins my theory that scum decided to parrot PJ (or is PJ) and jump on the wagon.
I'd be more than happy to join the LML wagon if you could explain why he's a better choice than Seol.In post 217, Albert B. Rampage wrote:I don't like the Seol bandwagon.
I also really want to know who the villains are (for my own curiosity, not for anything game related). I think there's a ton of villains that I've met over my time that are absent from this game.-
-
Save The Dragons He/HimProtection unnecessaryHe/Him
- Protection unnecessary
- Protection unnecessary
- Posts: 21829
- Joined: April 26, 2004
- Pronoun: He/Him
- Location: WA, USA
oh but I don't know if I'm ready. my body's saying yes, but my heart is saying yes...
Wait a minute.
Vote: LML-
-
Save The Dragons He/HimProtection unnecessaryHe/Him
- Protection unnecessary
- Protection unnecessary
- Posts: 21829
- Joined: April 26, 2004
- Pronoun: He/Him
- Location: WA, USA
In post 113, Save The Dragons wrote: (At least) one of this set { petroleumjelly, Seol, Porochaz, Green Crayons }
is highly likely to be opportunistic mafia. You can tossLoudMouthLeein there for the FOS.-
-
Save The Dragons He/HimProtection unnecessaryHe/Him
- Protection unnecessary
- Protection unnecessary
- Posts: 21829
- Joined: April 26, 2004
- Pronoun: He/Him
- Location: WA, USA
I also kind of want to know how he feels about my rational for chasing after undo.-
-
Save The Dragons He/HimProtection unnecessaryHe/Him
- Protection unnecessary
- Protection unnecessary
- Posts: 21829
- Joined: April 26, 2004
- Pronoun: He/Him
- Location: WA, USA
@ PJ:In post 249, VitaminR wrote: I refrained from doing so for a reason. I gave you the answer that was behind my reaction to the MafiaSSK wagon (strong at theory, with reputations = you, Seol, LML; not so = MafiaSSK, Tigris). I don't see how it's a useful exercise for me to say who I think isn't that good at mafia. (Not that I even really have particular people in mind.)
I know that it might defeat the purpose of asking your question, but I'm really not sure what you hope to accomplish by having him target out "weak" vs. "strong" players.
I'm also super jealous that you haven't asked me a question yet.
Back in my day, as I was joining mafiascum.net and waving to one of the dinosaurs outside my window because dinosaurs ruled the earth (seriously. A lot of people don't know the Jurassic Park movies are actually documentaries) when we replaced in, we took the time to read the entire thread, even if it was tens of pages long. And our posts weren't just one liners, we were pretty monstrous about our verbosity. The first dozen pages of this game are pretty tame.In post 246, undo wrote:
Natirasha is a new-school player, that's just what they do. I guess he's going through culture shock here. Amirite Nati? ;Dpetroleumjelly wrote:This is insulting. If you don't want to read the game, please replace out. There are others who would be happy to take your slot.
Go on. We'll wait for you.
Why half-joking?In post 276, CrashTextDummie wrote: I'm actually only half-joking when I say that wagoning Glork is good for the town.
I think he has you there, UT.In post 276, CrashTextDummie wrote:
Have you actually done any of that?In post 166, Untrod Tripod wrote:I love being town. Figuring stuff out is fun. Dissecting arguments, finding motivations, skewering liars, etc. It's a great time.-
-
Save The Dragons He/HimProtection unnecessaryHe/Him
- Protection unnecessary
- Protection unnecessary
- Posts: 21829
- Joined: April 26, 2004
- Pronoun: He/Him
- Location: WA, USA
Hey, I was on that MafiaSSK bandwagon before it was cool, not on the coattails. And to continue this unfortunate hipster comparison, I jumped off when it became popular. Popular with scum! Ohhhhh!In post 278, LoudmouthLee wrote: StD has tried to right the coattails of not 1,
You are right. I totally did not give any warning as to why I wanted to jump ontoIn post 278, LoudmouthLee wrote:not 2, but *3* different wagons on day one
Oh wait!
Post 113 kinda sorta basically definately spills my guts as to why I think that LML and Seol bandwagons are awesome. If there was a Green Crayons or Porrochaz wagon at the time, I'd have considered it. Did I write a scathing expose on all those people? No, you're right. I simply saw what I believe to be a tell and I've run with it. I suppose if you ignore the fact that I accused several people of a scumtell because I thought they were being scummy, I can understand how it may look like I'm just sitting here,
yeah, yeah, but...In post 278, LoudmouthLee wrote:without truly doing any sort of scumhunting at all.
I'm voting undo...for funzies? Because I secretly have a crush on undo and want to get his attention but don't know how? That arrow avatar is pretty dreamy...In post 98, Save The Dragons wrote:unvote, Vote: undo
If you're going to pick up on any one thing in this discussion, that seems like a weird one.
I'll admit that statement I made wasn't exactly the most transparently clear of statements. And it's such a shame I never clarified what I meant.
Oh wait!
Post 113 kinda sorta basically definately spills my guts as to why I think undo's lack of commitment is suspicious.
Did...you...even read post 113?
Clearly not, because in your post storm of quoting me, (which for some reason includes my random vote and also seems to utterly miss any posts that have content in them) you missed this one:
(the he is you).In post 237, Save The Dragons wrote:I also kind of want to know how he feels about my rational for chasing after undo.
Did...you...even read any of my posts?
Okay now I'm just curious. What is my meta?In post 278, LoudmouthLee wrote:Although I would expect this from someone like AbR or DGB, StD's meta doesn't seem to corroborate this.
What is the meta from how I played this game 5 and a half years ago? Damn, now I feel sad, I had to research how long I've been off of the site. I was...let's see...20. Wow. When I think of all the alcohol that's passed through me from that date to this, it's astounding. I've had a girlfriend and had that end, I visited 2 countries, have been a student at 5 different schools, had 3 jobs, wrote 5 novels, but, no...you're right. I'm sure I play exactly the same.-
-
Save The Dragons He/HimProtection unnecessaryHe/Him
- Protection unnecessary
- Protection unnecessary
- Posts: 21829
- Joined: April 26, 2004
- Pronoun: He/Him
- Location: WA, USA
?In post 257, Yosarian2 wrote:DGB and Albert also feel like they're playing within their normal day 1 pro-town meta, leaning town on both of them.
Both of them have metas that take little effort to fake.
I'm not convinced that your insistence on following this line of questioning is helpful. To me it seems more like an attempt to damn VitaminR/cause chaos. I feel like he's answered your question, or even if he hasn't (in your mind) I not sure what you're expecting him to say.In post 297, petroleumjelly wrote:2.)In response to VitaminR's Post 249, my concern is that you are drawing a poor distinction between strong and weak players in an invitational game filled with players who have generally each been playing mafia for over five years. I do not plan on underestimating players.
Even assuming Ididbelieve there are a few "weak" players in the game, then if a "weak" player is scum, pretty much the only way they are going to get lynched is if they are attacked by the other "strong" players.
But I take it you also think there are only a few "strong" players? Mind sharing whothoseare, if you are not willing to divulge who you think the "weak" players are?
I don't particularly like the fact that what LML has accused me of I have rebutted and I get no kind of response other than "I still think he's scum." Tbh i'm having trouble separating the emotional "What? I'm not scum! How dare yee!" part of things.
Post 316 is pretty much an amazing post.
294 is somewhat informative towards your headstate, MBL, but methinks the mike drop was a little premature.
I also have no idea what a Travlorkian is.
I will answer your question, though!
I'm not certain he's town.In post 294, MrBuddyLee wrote:@STD, your belief that MafiaSSK is town is the lynchpin of your worldview. Can you please explain why you're so certain he's town?
At the time, I saw a behavior I found suspicious. It seemed to me that a group of people regurgitated the same reasoning and hoped on a wagon.
This only makes sense if MafiaSSK is town. If he's scum, then that means a bunch of people saw PJ's justification and bam bam bam bam laid down the hurt on MafiaSSK.
In fact, if we found out MafiaSSK's alignment, I suspect it would either confirm my suspicion or work to dispel it (I don't know if scum would be so eager to hop on a partner's wagon).
This, of course, is before finds a ton of evidence on the glork wagon (which seems more like an attempt to legitimize his stance), calls CTD's random vote damning evidence and connects CES to CTD as scum partners because CES needed to inform CTD about chamber's alignment.
I still think he's town, I think his arguments seem both equivocal and genuine. That being said, I may have erred in the sense that I clung to this "worldview" while ignoring other possibilities.-
-
Save The Dragons He/HimProtection unnecessaryHe/Him
- Protection unnecessary
- Protection unnecessary
- Posts: 21829
- Joined: April 26, 2004
- Pronoun: He/Him
- Location: WA, USA
I have one vote. Regardless of the person I find the most suspicious I'm not sure I have to put my vote on the one that I find the most suspicious.In post 326, MrBuddyLee wrote:@STD, why is the FOS on SSK the "bam" that you found most suspicious?
I don't know who amongst the legendary set of names I listed is scum. Hell, for all I know I suck at this game and they're all town.In post 326, MrBuddyLee wrote:What's changed since you posted:
You said you needed to be persuaded:STD wrote:I suspect at least one of those 5 people of begin scum,probablySeol,possiblyLML
But rather than wait for Albert's response, you jumped ship when UT gave you reason "gut" and gave you some cover to switch.STD wrote:(to Albert)I'd be more than happy to join the LML wagon if you could explain why he's a better choice than Seol.
I think wagons lead to information. If people were more interested in putting pressure on LML, I was more than happy to join. My statement to ABR was a misguided effort to get some rationale from him. I am curious what it was LML did that Seol did not do (or the other way around) since from my vantage point I think they're likely to be scum for the same reasons. It would have been nice to hear a reply but I wasn't really going to hold my breath.
I think suggesting that UT's post suddenly convinced me that LML is teh scummiest of teh scums is a bit of a stretch.
Still waiting for a mike drop worthy post.In post 326, MrBuddyLee wrote:Sup.-
-
Save The Dragons He/HimProtection unnecessaryHe/Him
- Protection unnecessary
- Protection unnecessary
- Posts: 21829
- Joined: April 26, 2004
- Pronoun: He/Him
- Location: WA, USA
DAMN YOU TIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIGERS!
Tirgis is fine.-
-
Save The Dragons He/HimProtection unnecessaryHe/Him
- Protection unnecessary
- Protection unnecessary
- Posts: 21829
- Joined: April 26, 2004
- Pronoun: He/Him
- Location: WA, USA
In post 371, LoudmouthLee wrote: [*]UT has been on 3 of the major bandwagons, the most out of any player (tied with StD)Unvote, Vote: Zorblag
I'm number 1!
It's easy to ignore the fact I was on MafiaSSK before it was wagon-worthy if you ignore the fact that I was on MafiaSSK before it was wagon worthy. If you want to get technical, I was the second vote, but since I have not yet received that real magic mail-order crystal ball I purchased (6 easy payments of $19.95!) it would be remiss to suggest that I was oppurtunistic. But since you seem to ignore the fact that I was on MafiaSSK before it was wagon-worthy, I don't know why I didn't just save my wrists the hundred or so words closer they now are to metacarpal tunnel syndrome.In post 374, LoudmouthLee wrote: If you would call the MafiaSSK wagon the VI wagon, the player who was on the most wagons AND the VI wagon was StD. I'm still okay with EITHER of them.
I do actually agree with you that the Nat wagon was an easy way to pile on votes, but I also think chamber's right and if the scum were expecting a lynch from that they're fooling themselves.
----
Since he was observing the game as town, all he has to do is dump his suspicions and it looks like he's made a big contribution. If he's scum, it takes 5 minutes to edit if he's nailed his scum partners, and that's even if he wants to. He certainly doesn't have to.In post 369, DrippingGoofball wrote:Zorblag is town.
Since he included his replacee in his assessment, it is clear to me he made these notes with a town mindset (before he replaced). Now he has a pro-town artifact that may or may not be damning to scum.
His barf post, while an interesting read, does little to tell us about his alignment. I suppose if he were scum he could have not posted it, but I don't really see a reason not to.
----
Since scum know who the town are, doesn't it make it easier to say XXXXX is town when you're scum?In post 327, Yosarian2 wrote:Not really. When someone has a meta of making short, declarative statements about who is town or scum without explaining, it can actually make them easier to read; you just have to look at the timing of the statements and figure out why they're making them at those moments and what they're trying to do. The key is to not try to look at the posts in isolation; it's to look at them in context.
If we're just going to get into a theory-based argument where we end up having a differing of opinions I'm willing to shut up about this, but see my above comment about DGB.
I do too. This reminds me of something I was stewing on before the Great Tiger Attack of 2014...In post 370, Shanba wrote: I find myself disagreeing with much of what Yos says this game. This is a little upsetting.
While I completely agree with the last sentence, the more I read into the argument between them, the less I like it.In post 242, Yosarian2 wrote:I'm getting some weird vibes off of Undo's posting so far this game. Kind of wishy-washy. Kisses up to everyone in first post, votes DGB "as homage". ? Says MafiaSSK's post #45 " doesn't look right", but then hedges that read, and doesn't vote. Takes off random vote on DGB without voting anyone else. Then later votes SSK.fos:UndoPosting and voting pattern so far looks overly cautious.
Dropping a random vote without explaining why is suspicious? This entire section seems like a stretch.In post 255, Yosarian2 wrote: In general, your play thus far looked overly cautious for day 1, like you were trying extra hard to stay on good terms with everyone. If there's any point at all to random voting, it's to try to create pressure or get something moving early in the game, but you placed your random vote in such a way as to make sure it didn't create any pressure, and the you dropped it without explaining why and without voting anyone else, at a time when no one else was voting DGB.
Point goes to undo.In post 258, undo wrote:
You are referring to my post 115, where IYosarian2 wrote:You seemed to imply that you thought SSK was suspicious, but would rather vote for nobody then vote for himneverimplied I thought SSK was suspicious. When I said "it didn't look right to me", I was saying I didn't agree with his theory -- his theory didn't look right to me -- but that defending one controversial theory about RVS was not enough for me to find him scummy.
Yosarian2 wrote:you then voted for him eventually, but you seemed hesitant to do so, and joined the wagon fairly late. (In fact, i would say that SSK actually looked less scummy when you voted him then he did when you declined to do so)
I'm not sure what to think about MafiaSSK, but I think the whole magic CTD-CES connection made him look worse.In post 203, undo wrote: Just to make it clear, in your view, CES saying "I agree with CTD that chamber's alignment is fairly obvious at this point" right after CTD's posts (and even though CTD didn't make it clear he thought chamber was obvscum) is adiscreet wayof showing agreement to a scum partner.
----
I also really don't like anything about this:
In post 244, petroleumjelly wrote:7.)In post 232, Albert B. Rampage wrote:I need both of you to trust me. Right now, okay? Please just work with me here, and I promise I will explain everything later, okay?FoS: Albert B. Rampage. May switch my vote soon.
I don't follow why this wasn't just a vote, considering with nothing new changing you were willing to vote. If you wanted to keep pressure on MafiaSSK, why would you switch (with no new content), and if you didn't, why wouldn't you?In post 297, petroleumjelly wrote:1.)
I originally had switched my vote while writing my post, but as I pared it down I downgraded to a FoS. Albert B. Rampage's post was so outrageously out of place that I could see myself just switching my vote the next morning even without more content being added.In post 245, chamber wrote:Why did you feel the need to telegraph a potential vote change?
Given Albert B. Rampage was apparently just quoting something, the FoS is retracted.
I'll admit it was a silly thing for ABR to say. But it was said in a rapidfire of weird posts (that I didn't get the reference to either). If you think he was faking breadcrumbing a power role, for instance, it seems like a weird way to go about it, especially when there was only a little pressure his way.
----
The way I see it, bandwagoning is the only way we can lynch scum. With 12 votes to lynch, I need to agree with 11 other people. With several scum out there, if I elect to vote for people I think are more likely to be scum, that gives me, in my opinion, a better chance of lynching the scum.
I plan on jumping on bandwagons this game, not on random people, but on people I find suspicious.
So here's my list of people as of this moment.
Would vote
4) Untrod Tripod
6) DrippingGoofball
8) undo
11) Petroleumjelly
14) LoudmouthLee
20) Yosarian2
21) Seol
Might vote
2) Porochaz
3) CrashtextDummie
5) MrBuddyLee
12) Cogito Ergo Sum
13) MafiaSSK
16) Green Crayons
15) Albert B. Rampage
17) Zorblag (replacing Natirasha, who replaced farside22)
22) Tigris
Won't vote
1) Chamber
7) Shanba
9) Sotty7
10) Glork
18) VitaminR
Vote: PJ
If later in the day we all decide to lynch LML, please, please, please don't be surprised if I jump on that wagon hardcore.-
-
Save The Dragons He/HimProtection unnecessaryHe/Him
- Protection unnecessary
- Protection unnecessary
- Posts: 21829
- Joined: April 26, 2004
- Pronoun: He/Him
- Location: WA, USA
If in her next post she decides that Zorblarg is now scum without sufficient explanation I would be miffed. If on Day 5 she decides that Zorblarg or anyone else she's declared to be town as scum, I don't really see it as damning.In post 380, Yosarian2 wrote: Also, frankly, declaring this many people town as scum is likely to screw you over in the long run. It's not a good scum strategy to have as many town reads as she does, because you'll probably have to go back on some of them eventually in order to get enough lynches to win.
Time will tell.
Douchy question: do they really?In post 380, Yosarian2 wrote: Maybe it's more a theory dispute then anything, but random votes are there both to generate pressure
Better question: have they in this game?
Do random votes often/ever lead to a lynch?In post 380, Yosarian2 wrote: and because it's theoretically better to lynch someone at random then to lynch no one at all;
I was about to bark at you some more, but I assume that you are suggesting that not voting anyone is scummier than unvoting a random vote.In post 380, Yosarian2 wrote:you don't drop them for no reason, you drop it if you have somewhere better to put your vote, or maybe if you think the person you're voting for looks town.
One's a disease and one's medicine?In post 386, Sotty7 wrote: What's the difference between STD and VitR?
For full disclosure, I was voting him as a joke to jump onto yet another bandwagon. I think Zor's post is not very telling of his alignment and I am concerned about people who saw the wall of text and read it as town. For fuller disclosurer, CES's post helped me come to that conclusion (but since CES's post is public record I fail to see why others wouldn't).In post 386, Sotty7 wrote: I was completely fine with Zor's entrance into the game until I read STD's reasoning for voting him and the pretty excellent point of including his own slot in his run down. Not quite willing to condemn Zor for it, but also not willing to put him directly in the town pile like I was going to.
My vote is on PJ.-
-
Save The Dragons He/HimProtection unnecessaryHe/Him
- Protection unnecessary
- Protection unnecessary
- Posts: 21829
- Joined: April 26, 2004
- Pronoun: He/Him
- Location: WA, USA
@MBL: Besides the fact that Sotty's ait, (I'm assume you mean that she seems pro-town, not ait at like cooking or shooting people or something), any thoughts?
----
Yes! I got a (shrug) from Yos! All I need is a question from PJ and I get meta bingo!In post 397, Yosarian2 wrote: (shrug) Not very often.
----
Pretty much exactly how I treat RVS. Usually the vote is dropped, imo, because a better target is found. Replace "it's what the cool kids do" with "nothing better to do" and you pretty much have my understanding of it.In post 397, Yosarian2 wrote: I just have a pet peeve with people who think there's a "random vote phase" where you vote people for no reason and then you drop the vote later for no reason. If you're going to random vote, you should have a theory/strategy reason for why you're doing it, it shouldn't just be because it's what the cool kids do.
I dunno. Like when MafiaSSK tried to convince me there was magic on the RVS glork wagon it looks like someone trying to attribute scumminess when it's not there. MafiaSSK's play this game has pretty much been exagerating everything. You, on the other hand, look like you're trying strawman an argument to put blame on undo.
----
To be perfectly honest, while we are both suspicious of undo for similar reasons, I couldn't look at yos's attack on him without my rusty, cobweb-infested scumdar going ping!. I am more perturbed by his ignoral of events. If I recall correctly, he spent most of the first part of the game not really voting anyone and has since spent a lot of time arguing with chamber, etc., not really doing much.In post 399, LoudmouthLee wrote: Oh! That's cool, Yos! Find an inconsistency and call it protown? That's the weirdest thing you may have ever said.
Yos, in my opinion, built a shoddy argument. I'm not really that satisfied with his response, so I'm willing to vote him if the tides turn that way, but I'm holding off for now because there are better targets and I'm worried I'm spending too much time debating theory with him.
Yos attacking undo doesn't clear undo but it does make me wonder.
----
I'm still pretty happy with PJ. The whole "weak" vs. "strong" doesn't sit well with me. The other problem is the whole ABR thing. I completely agree that "give me X days" or "trust me" is a scum tell. A lesser point is that there was more going on there, it wasn't just that. It was clear ABR was doing something weird (which turns out to be quoting Breaking Bad). If it were just that, I'd leave it alone. But the greater point is that he played chicken with his vote.
On the other hand, I'm not particularly enthused by LscumL's sudden decision that he wants to build cases on his targets when he targets PJ.
----
I think jumping from wagon to wagon is jumping from wagon to wagon. I don't particularly think it's scummy when I do it because I'm town (please don't misread that, I'm making a point that the question appears obviously loaded, not that I think it's scummy otherwise).In post 479, Bookitty wrote:@SaveTheDragonsWhat did you think of LML's justification for taking his vote off you and putting it on UntrodTripod? Do you think that jumping from wagon to wagon is more scummy or not scummy?
As for his justification I strong suspect LML is scum but there's a wave of pro-town mania seeming to surround him. It's hard for me to be unbiased when I saw him attack me with shoddy logic, didn't rebut the holes I made in his arguments, and watched him claim his almighty VCA was the key to finding teh scums. The truth is I can see either PJ or UT as scum (UT for reasons entirely different than LML's magic crusade on wagoning, mind you).
I suppose you could look at it this way. If I'm town, and I think, ScummyMcScummerFace is scum, if I'm afraid I'm going to get targeted because ScummyMcScummerFace already has 6 votes, then ScummyMcScummerFace will never get lynched.
The reasoning is more important than the actual votes itself. I think LML has been kind of phoning it in, so to ultimately answer your question, well...he kind of just stated a fact (the sky is blue, the cake is a lie, UT was on X amount of wagons) and added a bit about voting for Nat. I don't really know how I feel about the Nat wagon, for me the towniness and scumminess kind of cancel and its a null tell.
I'd be remiss if I didn't point out that while Seol didn't really have much to say D1, your content thus far doesn't exactly instill me with confidence that you are innocent.
----
I am very, very concerned about this. The first several pages MafiaSSK could barely keep his wackiness contained.
-
-
Save The Dragons He/HimProtection unnecessaryHe/Him
- Protection unnecessary
- Protection unnecessary
- Posts: 21829
- Joined: April 26, 2004
- Pronoun: He/Him
- Location: WA, USA
Dear MafiaSSK,
Several pages ago and prior to the Great Tiger Attack, you voted CES because you claimed that he was scumbuddies with CTD. I don't think I can find a single person that truly agrees with this sentiment. While I do find his tunnel vision noteworthy, it hardly seems damning.
In the several pages that followed, am I to understand that above anything else that has happened, this is still the number 1 most interesting event and most likely tell of scumminess?
If you still think CES is scum, what else you got, and if not, what now?
Also, what is your opinion on Seol/Bookitty?
Sincerely,
STD-
-
Save The Dragons He/HimProtection unnecessaryHe/Him
- Protection unnecessary
- Protection unnecessary
- Posts: 21829
- Joined: April 26, 2004
- Pronoun: He/Him
- Location: WA, USA
@bookitty
I'll admit in 498 I kind of wander around with the ball a bit and kind of leave the stadium behind. LML's justification for switching seems to be
1) UT's bandwagony
2) UT jumped on nat.
I don't really think the first part is a scum tell. I've been pretty friendly with my vote myself. Therefore I find your second question to me a bit silly.
I suspect he is willing to vote for someone bandwagony, and picked up on the VI thing. Voting me probably didn't have a lot of traction so I'm guessing that may have something to do as well.
The part that you seem to ignore is the fact that he didn't just post that excel sheet, said "look at dem facts" and switched his vote. From his post voting for UT has something to do with UT's voting for Nat.-
-
Save The Dragons He/HimProtection unnecessaryHe/Him
- Protection unnecessary
- Protection unnecessary
- Posts: 21829
- Joined: April 26, 2004
- Pronoun: He/Him
- Location: WA, USA
Unvote, Vote: Bookitty
There's something I'm quite eager for you to respond to so I'll bite my tongue for now.-
-
Save The Dragons He/HimProtection unnecessaryHe/Him
- Protection unnecessary
- Protection unnecessary
- Posts: 21829
- Joined: April 26, 2004
- Pronoun: He/Him
- Location: WA, USA
-
-
Save The Dragons He/HimProtection unnecessaryHe/Him
- Protection unnecessary
- Protection unnecessary
- Posts: 21829
- Joined: April 26, 2004
- Pronoun: He/Him
- Location: WA, USA
In post 551, Green Crayons wrote: - I look forward to Bookitty's responses to questions.-
-
Save The Dragons He/HimProtection unnecessaryHe/Him
- Protection unnecessary
- Protection unnecessary
- Posts: 21829
- Joined: April 26, 2004
- Pronoun: He/Him
- Location: WA, USA
The thing I'm looking for will be in your next post(s).
I voted for MafiaSSK, not Tigris, so technically Seol and I weren't on opposite sides when I voted him.-
-
Save The Dragons He/HimProtection unnecessaryHe/Him
- Protection unnecessary
- Protection unnecessary
- Posts: 21829
- Joined: April 26, 2004
- Pronoun: He/Him
- Location: WA, USA
I believe the use of the term erroneous here is an opinion. It may not be clear since I used terms like "I felt" and "In my opinion", but in my opinion, I feel like that implies an opinion.In post 566, Bookitty wrote: I agree with Sotty7 in Post 144. Not so much with StD in Post 150; this I really didn’t like:
“In my opinion, I felt that thatwhile erroneous, the jumps onto Tigris were either justified by a pro-town motivation to tack onto someone who seemed suspicious, or did not give enough information for me to really read.”
Wait, did we see a Tigris flip? I don’t remember that. When did that happen?-
-
Save The Dragons He/HimProtection unnecessaryHe/Him
- Protection unnecessary
- Protection unnecessary
- Posts: 21829
- Joined: April 26, 2004
- Pronoun: He/Him
- Location: WA, USA
Bookitty is scum because:
A) Seol was suspicious.
Seol jumped on an easy wagon hiding behind a rhetoric reason that seemed like low-hanging fruit. I've beaten this point to death, and I still feel like some of those people are scum.
Seol then posts next to nothing. It's early enough in the day. He evades detection. The wagon fizzles. whether he just completely crapped out or whether he wanted to lie low, I can't really say.
Stuff like this:
is simply justification to grab that low hanging fruit: "the theory he's spewing is bad, but since he's supposed to be smart, his bad theory is likely due to him being scum."In post 162, Seol wrote:
Because it favours scum. Either you're wrong or you're scum (with an inclusive or), and in a game full of experienced players, I give less credence to being wrong.In post 67, MafiaSSK wrote:So I'll ask a seemingly useless question right back at you as you did to Tigris: Why is my (mostly theory based) opinion on bandwagons scummy enough to warrant a vote?
But to be honest, in the same post he points out the following about MafiaSSK
Which is accurate. At this point I don't agree that MafiaSSK's behavior is scummy, but it is a bit out there and I can see both scum hungry for the easy lynch and townies falling into that trap.In post 162, Seol wrote: The arguments against CES are super,superstretching: he hasn't said nearly enough to read in that level of intent, and taking what he has said at face value is just disingenuous.
That's bad, but particularly so in that the theme of 156 is "this is why pushing RVS wagons is good: look at all the info we can get from it" - but that info is nonsense. It feels like artificial suspicion, like he's decided he needs to attack the people who were late on the wagon and then, given that, constructed reasons to suspect them.
Overall I don't think it's damning but I am leaning towards Seol being scum.
In 466 Bookitty basically defends LML. (This is bad because LML is scum too but I know not everyone agrees with me yet so I won't dwell on that).
Then there's this post.
For me the disconcerning part is that she seems to think I'm suspicious because:In post 510, Bookitty wrote:
LML is a null-leaning-scum read for me. The scum part is:In post 507, Sotty7 wrote:Is LML a town read for you at this point? I'm getting the real feel of having your cake and eating it too so I would like you to clarify your opinion on him.
He pulls his vote off STD and then votes UT for the EXACT SAME thing. His VCA actually shows that. I realize he's only got one vote, but why switch it at the point he does and then blame it on his VCA? That's not reading honest to me. STD ducked my question on that, but I would be interested to know how STD sees that move. To me, it was the scummiest thing LML did all game and it made me look hard at STD as a result.
The town part is:
I've read the game several times over the last few days. I still don't have it down, but I guess that's normal for a large game. But I notice that LML is the target of choice for a lot of people with not a lot of reasoning. I hadn't thought about it the way Glork did, but the truth is that Glork is a better scumhunter than I am. (I'm sure those who have played with me before will back me up on this.) I just gave my reason for thinking he might be scum; so far as I recall, I'm the only one who noted that exact thing. (I could be wrong on that, but I don't remember reading anyone on LML's wagon and saying, AHA, you think what *I* think.) The reasons given aren't as good as that one in my eyes, which makes me think that some of the people on LML's wagon are scum without real motivation except finding a convenient wagon. Which, in turn, makes me think that LML might be town after all.
(at this point I don't think she's going to answer so I'm going to stop biting my tongue).In post 525, petroleumjelly wrote:4.)Why, if LoudmouthLee's switch to Untrod Tripid was scummy, did LoudmouthLee's Vote Count Analysis "make you look hard" at Save the Dragons as a result? Were you looking for potential LoudmouthLee and Save the Dragons connections?
She seems to imply guilt by association, then removes the scumminess off of LML. She then spends some time in her PBPA to build a case against me, even though she no longer thinks LML is scum, so I'm not sure why she thinks I'm scum. The case she builds on me is highly inaccurate to fact.
From my point of view, she seemed to want to decide I was scum and attack me before constructing evidence for it, which makes me quite curious.
Another reason she seems to think that LML and I are scum together is because of the way LML stopped voting for me (which again is weird if she thinks LML is town). The thing about that is it selectively ignores LML's argument about UT jumping on the Nat wagon. Had she outright dismissed it, then maybe I would be less irked, but she mentioned that the reasoning LML voted for me and for UT was exactly the same, when in his post, it's clear that it isn't.
I don't know. To me it seems like she picked a target and then tried to justify it, which I think is pretty much the same reason PJ is voting for her (except for how she did it to PJ).
Honestly, take your pick of reasons to vote for Bookitty.-
-
Save The Dragons He/HimProtection unnecessaryHe/Him
- Protection unnecessary
- Protection unnecessary
- Posts: 21829
- Joined: April 26, 2004
- Pronoun: He/Him
- Location: WA, USA
You seem to spend a lot of time protecting the people I think are scum and not a lot of time explaining why they're not. Your argument that everyone else is town because PJ is scum doesn't really do anything for me.In post 612, Albert B. Rampage wrote:I don't care that you're still fine lynching Bookitty. She's town and you should feel bad.
----
The beginnings of a rebuttal are 400 posts overdue.In post 601, LoudmouthLee wrote: 6) StD's pro-town meta showed a stubbornness as town that did not seem to be shown here. I don't have links right now, and unless I get bored and have time, you probably won't get them from me now.-
-
Save The Dragons He/HimProtection unnecessaryHe/Him
- Protection unnecessary
- Protection unnecessary
- Posts: 21829
- Joined: April 26, 2004
- Pronoun: He/Him
- Location: WA, USA
This town has had trouble getting it up.
I feel that's pretty much been across the board, except for Bookitty's wagon. I don't recall any above 6 or 7 votes. I'm not sure if that's due to a cautious town or people just not being able to come to a consensus.-
-
Save The Dragons He/HimProtection unnecessaryHe/Him
- Protection unnecessary
- Protection unnecessary
- Posts: 21829
- Joined: April 26, 2004
- Pronoun: He/Him
- Location: WA, USA
The case against Seol doesn't disappear just because he gets replaced.
Telling me I suck at mafia isn't really going to get your point across any better, it tells me that you don't have a good reason so you have to resort to ad hominem.
Am I wrong?-
-
Save The Dragons He/HimProtection unnecessaryHe/Him
- Protection unnecessary
- Protection unnecessary
- Posts: 21829
- Joined: April 26, 2004
- Pronoun: He/Him
- Location: WA, USA
LML's gone off the deep end.
Claiming VT may not be the best of plays, but Bookitty didn't come into this game fresh, she replaced someone who hadn't said anything for a long time. If she's scum, she didn't have a month to think of a strategy, and her hail mary could simply be to act as townie as possible (which in this case may be doing the less smart play now to live another day). To me it doesn't seem impossible for her to claim VT if she hopes that it will drive people off her lynch. Based on other factors, I'm not convinced she isn't scum, and her claim doesn't change my earlier opinion of her.
The heat that mathcam is getting for VT being a safe lynch I disagree with personally, it seems to me like some real old school theory: clear some townies out if you have to, since they're just townies. I remember liking that theory when I was younger. I can see the merits in it and I don't know if it's necessarily bloodthirsty or an attempt at further strategy.
If that were the only thing going for Bookitty, I'd stop voting for her, but again I'm not convinced that this absolves her of guilt and I'm not sure that she wouldn't do this as scum.
That being said, I think PJ might be scum, and I think Bookitty might be scum, but not both. I think that might be one thing that her lynch would help determine (at least for me).-
-
Save The Dragons He/HimProtection unnecessaryHe/Him
- Protection unnecessary
- Protection unnecessary
- Posts: 21829
- Joined: April 26, 2004
- Pronoun: He/Him
- Location: WA, USA
I think at this point, I would be happy to place my vote on Bookitty, PJ, or LML.
There's a couple other people I could see myself voting, but I'm more suspicious of the three I've mentioned and don't think people would go for anyone else anyway.
If we are not doing Bookitty, thenVote: LML-
-
Save The Dragons He/HimProtection unnecessaryHe/Him
- Protection unnecessary
- Protection unnecessary
- Posts: 21829
- Joined: April 26, 2004
- Pronoun: He/Him
- Location: WA, USA
No.In post 734, DrippingGoofball wrote:Let's do this:
VOTE: Untrod Tripod
Iso him and find your own reasons!
At this point I'd rather vote for you than him, tbh.-
-
Save The Dragons He/HimProtection unnecessaryHe/Him
- Protection unnecessary
- Protection unnecessary
- Posts: 21829
- Joined: April 26, 2004
- Pronoun: He/Him
- Location: WA, USA
In post 621, Save The Dragons wrote:This town has had trouble getting it up.-
-
Save The Dragons He/HimProtection unnecessaryHe/Him
- Protection unnecessary
- Protection unnecessary
- Posts: 21829
- Joined: April 26, 2004
- Pronoun: He/Him
- Location: WA, USA
In post 761, Porochaz wrote:
Glad you are posting effectively.In post 760, DrippingGoofball wrote:More Untrod Tripod votes please.-
-
Save The Dragons He/HimProtection unnecessaryHe/Him
- Protection unnecessary
- Protection unnecessary
- Posts: 21829
- Joined: April 26, 2004
- Pronoun: He/Him
- Location: WA, USA
Seriously? I'm voting LML because I think we can lynch him. I jumped off Bookitty because way too many people are saying "BOOKITTY'S TOWN I'LL NEVER VOTE HER!" I'm not convinced that enough people will jump onto it in time, so I decided to try another of my top suspects.In post 773, Shanba wrote:Actually, contrary to my previous post its now LML 6 Bookitty 8. I'm sure she was closer not so long ago. If Bookitty ever turns up scum at some point, the people who unvoted and made a no lynch incredibly likely deserve to die.
You're going to blame people who are trying to get a lynch on someone over people like MBL and DGB who are hopelessly clutching at targets that don't have time to be lynched, or like ABR/Glork who are trying to start a brand new wagon in the 11th hour, or people like Kubla Khan who have promised content but have yet to park a vote? If we get a no lynch, that's where the hell I'm looking, people who are pussyfooting around instead of jumping onto the wagon of the person they find the most scummy.
I'm starting to think that DGB is scum but I don't dare vote her yet, because that would be ridiculous. I'm not going to bother posting a case on her yet nor voting her.
If the Bookitty wagon picks up some steam, I'll happily place my vote there. If PJ's wagon picks up steam, yeah, I'll deposit my vote there. I'm perfectly happy getting one of these three lynched.-
-
Save The Dragons He/HimProtection unnecessaryHe/Him
- Protection unnecessary
- Protection unnecessary
- Posts: 21829
- Joined: April 26, 2004
- Pronoun: He/Him
- Location: WA, USA
You make a compelling argument.In post 778, DrippingGoofball wrote:
You forgot to vote UT.In post 774, Save The Dragons wrote:In post 761, Porochaz wrote:
Glad you are posting effectively.In post 760, DrippingGoofball wrote:More Untrod Tripod votes please.-
-
Save The Dragons He/HimProtection unnecessaryHe/Him
- Protection unnecessary
- Protection unnecessary
- Posts: 21829
- Joined: April 26, 2004
- Pronoun: He/Him
- Location: WA, USA
And I actually did this and was not convinced. I'd be willing to double check, but not today since nothing jumped out at me.In post 775, DrippingGoofball wrote:
So clearly, you haven't bothered iso'ing UT.In post 751, Sotty7 wrote:I just found DGB's UT vote to be pretty bad which is why I questioned that read in particular.-
-
Save The Dragons He/HimProtection unnecessaryHe/Him
- Protection unnecessary
- Protection unnecessary
- Posts: 21829
- Joined: April 26, 2004
- Pronoun: He/Him
- Location: WA, USA
Just want to make sure you're aware that all three players that I'm willing to lynch have been people I've made cases against.In post 786, MrBuddyLee wrote:
protip: voting all four of the biggest wagons of the day doesn't make you protown in and of itself, it makes you a good Left4Dead player.In post 779, Save The Dragons wrote:You're going to blame people who are trying to get a lynch on someone over people like MBL and DGB who are hopelessly clutching at targets that don't have time to be lynched
In my passion/rage I may have exaggerated the point, it's not necessarily scummy to have a target that no one agrees with. I was merely upset at the notion that what I did was furthering a no lynch when I believed my actions were trying to prevent it.
But...at the same time DGB's case on UT for example "look at his ISO! Then you'll see! You'll all see!" isn't doing much for me. Anyone who's commented on it (which I think is just me, Porochaz, and UT) haven't suggested they are impressed, and anyone who hasn't (which I think is 18 other people) haven't jumped in line. Tigris wasn't a scumread for me. Since I find several other people scummy, Khan's absence hasn't convinced me one way or the other, either.
Do you think this is a common occurrence and that with this town we can be expected to come up with a viable lynch with less than a day to go from nothing?In post 786, MrBuddyLee wrote: In the last Oldy game, D1, all ten votes on Mert arrived in the 24 hours prior to deadline. Your hyperbole rings somewhat hollow.
...so you agree with me anyway?In post 786, MrBuddyLee wrote:That being said, it may be time to shit or get off the pot.-
-
Save The Dragons He/HimProtection unnecessaryHe/Him
- Protection unnecessary
- Protection unnecessary
- Posts: 21829
- Joined: April 26, 2004
- Pronoun: He/Him
- Location: WA, USA
There's like nothing there. So, uh...I don't know? I kind of wish he posted more, but at the same time there's plenty of scum to catch and not enough time to do it. I certainly think that it's plausible KK was kind of toeing the line, seeing how far he could get without posting, but I'm not convinced that that's what happened. I'm not wowed by his content, either. Maybe he's scum, maybe he's not. He's null, and under a time crunch I'd happily go for one of my scum reads over a null read. Not on a time crunch, I'd happily go after a scum read over a null read. He'll have plenty of time D2 to speak.In post 800, MrBuddyLee wrote:
What do you think of Khan's posting?In post 794, Save The Dragons wrote:Khan's absence hasn't convinced me one way or the other, either.
That is not to say he shouldn't say anything today if he can.
I'm also not particularly confident of the towniness of the last few people to jump onto the wagon.-
-
Save The Dragons He/HimProtection unnecessaryHe/Him
- Protection unnecessary
- Protection unnecessary
- Posts: 21829
- Joined: April 26, 2004
- Pronoun: He/Him
- Location: WA, USA
Your posting has deteriorated as the day had dragged on.In post 829, Glork wrote:Mehhhhhhh. Better than a Bookitty lynch, except that's going to be a distraction for a while probably. I'm not super convinced this will flip scum, unless LmL's slip is actually a scumslip.
FTR, KKscum directly implicates STDscum at this point. The bold, but undeniable protection is a solid link, esp if both LML/Boo are town.-
-
Save The Dragons He/HimProtection unnecessaryHe/Him
- Protection unnecessary
- Protection unnecessary
- Posts: 21829
- Joined: April 26, 2004
- Pronoun: He/Him
- Location: WA, USA
Glork:
Eh, I wasn't trying to attack your character or anything, so if that's how it was perceived, I apologize.
I think your posts towards the beginning seemed more pro-town, and then there's a sudden emotional shift which strikes me as odd. Say what you want, I greatly dislike the KK wagon, I think it was a distraction. I think your attack on CES was weak, I think your attack on CTD was weak.
...but I'm not going to waste time trying to get you lynched with less than 12 hours to go, especially since I don't really find you more scummy than LML. In fact, you went from town and dropped a couple slots, which I suppose puts you in null territory.
But don't tell Glork, because he might assume that me not voting for you means were scumbuddies.-
-
Save The Dragons He/HimProtection unnecessaryHe/Him
- Protection unnecessary
- Protection unnecessary
- Posts: 21829
- Joined: April 26, 2004
- Pronoun: He/Him
- Location: WA, USA
Almost everything VitaminR says ever I agree with.
I, too, like all those options, (as well as PJ). Not sure if a BooKitty wagon will garner any new information, but if we want to lynch BooKitty I'd be for it. As a professional courtesy, I'm going to try to bring a case against DGB and Glork before I decided to move my vote there. So for now,In post 877, Sotty7 wrote:Going to review a little this weekend but right now my top picks are Bookitty, Glork and DGB.Vote: PJ
Out of curiosity, ABR, and I'm sure I'm not going to get an answer to this, but do you think PJ is town or do you just think there are better targets?-
-
Save The Dragons He/HimProtection unnecessaryHe/Him
- Protection unnecessary
- Protection unnecessary
- Posts: 21829
- Joined: April 26, 2004
- Pronoun: He/Him
- Location: WA, USA
The wagon I'd like to look at personally is the KK wagon of T minus 24 hours.
Yeah, yeah, I know. I don't know if KK is scum, and if he is, then it's all moot. But if he isn't, I'm not convinced that it was helpful to basically use your vote to try and get someone to produce content with so little time left in the day.
There seems to be movement in a DGB-wardly direction, so I'll start there.
DGB: