Mafia 55: Yakuza - Game over!

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Vote: Rich

. Because he was annoying in our last noob game together.

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Blatantly OMGUS [bunvote, vote ubertimmy[/b]

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unvote, vote ubertimmy

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Twito, just because I caught you in a trap that outed you as scum in our last game does not make me annoying, it just makes you dumb.

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It's called random voting. This is exactly why you're annoying.

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Guys. Richscum is more annoying than twitoscum.

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lynch all self voters.

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You type with your feet?

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Otaku, I think ignoring riches playing style is probably a good idea. He tends to lurk, and then show up to make a dumb statement every now and then. In other words, he's not bad, he's just a n00b, and I don't understand why he's in this game, but I am willing to get rid of him.

[shamelessmetagaming]Am I right in guessing that the twito wagon is just random pressure? In which case, I'd rather pressure twito than rich, because I think we might get something of use out of twito, whereas rich would just get overdefensive, ping peoples scumdar, and we'd probably end up lynching him, which would be a bad move considering he does that as town too.[/shamelessmetagaming]

unvote, vote twito

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klebian and coron are one person?

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2, actually, Rich. Plus I play on other sites, and in scum chat every night for about 3-4 games. So please know what you're talking about before you start talking.

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Uh...I never said anything about you sticking up for yourself being wrong. I said you doing so with wrong information is wrong.

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Rich. Go read BJs games.

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In terms of BJ, his style is to post hardly any content. This is good in the sense that he's unreadable really, and bad in the sense that he's unreadable. If he's town, he's usually good to have around, because he's good at reading, but we don't know ever if he's got a read, is fucking around, is scum, or may even have a cop result. I'd say on day one it's best to just ignore him.

[Thestatusquo]

Unvote, vote Shadowlurker.

That was a brilliant mistating of what I said.

I said:

In terms of BJ, his style is to post hardly any content. This is good in the sense that he's unreadable really, and bad in the sense that he's unreadable. If he's town, he's usually good to have around, because he's good at reading, but we don't know ever if he's got a read, is fucking around, is scum, or may even have a cop result. I'd say on day one it's best to just ignore him.

Lets paraphrase that for the thinking impaired (aka you):

Bj posts relatively nothing but unfounded suspicions in the early game....

THEREFORE IT IS BEST TO IGNORE HIM ON DAY ONE.

DAY ONE.

DAY. FUCKING. ONE.

There is nothing in my post that says we should ignore him indefinitely, or that is contradicted by your statement that 'he does post content in the late game'

Stop missrepresenting me in order to place a vote. What I said was in no way scummy, which is enough to make me very happy moving away from my sexy pressure vote onto a "Wow that was scummy." vote.

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There is one ad hom in my post, and it's not an ad hom in the falacious sense, because I do not base an argument off of it. Again, if you plan on being in an argument with me, it makes sense to not be ignorant.

There was no OMGUS in my post at all. I was not voting for you because you voted for me, but instead because you took my words, twisted them around into something I had never said, and then saying it's scummy.

Twito, your attempt to deflect your band wagon is noted. There was nothing scummy in that post.

As to your points, I am basing my judgements off of a couple (10+) games I have read which BJ is in. His playing style seems to be, especially on day one, about forming random bandwagons and pushing them hard.

Now, you continue to misrepresent me. I never said his suspicions were definitely unfounded, I said

If he's town, he's usually good to have around, because he's good at reading, but we don't know ever if he's got a read, is fucking around, is scum, or may even have a cop result.

clearly telling you that yes, it's possible that it's not random, but because he acts the same way all the time, we cannot get a read on whether he does or not, so we should therefore ignore it, and go by our own suspicions day one. Your continued misrepresentation of my point is noted.

You're acting like there is never anything to go on on Day 1, first of all, we can even pick up scumtells from discussion and posts.

NO. I am not. But again, nice misrepresentation. I am talking in regards to a specific player who acts the same way every day one. So no, you cannot get scum tells from him. As for the other players, of course you can get scum tells. Too bad I was never talking about them so you're just making crap up to make me look scummy.

Second of all, we started with night so how do you KNOW he does not have any info?

Already addressed this. I never claimed that he didn't. I said it was immaterial because we have no way of knowing/discerning.

Also, you may note, that my original post was just as attempt to give advice from a more experienced player to a less experienced one. There was nothing nefarious, and at worst, I am guilty of a bit of metagaming, which most people in this site engage in. For you to base a vote off of it is totally preposterous, and your follow up post/questions demonstrate that you do not understand at all what I was claiming in my original post, or that you're deliberately misrepresenting it.

Care to post some more bullshit, Jathan?

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As to your points, I am basing my judgements off of a couple (10+) games I have read which BJ is in. His playing style seems to be, especially on day one, about forming random bandwagons and pushing them hard.

Once again, I would like you to prove they are random.

I will say it again:

You're acting like there is never anything to go on on Day 1, first of all, we can even pick up scumtells from discussion and posts.

I am acting like we never have anything to go by on baby jesus day one. Which is true. I don't have to prove that they're random, I just has to prove that he's done the same thing every game I have ever seen him in, and that it would be impossible for him to be 'reading' or having information every time, which means I have just proved the link to randomness enough to warrant my point that they can be random, which is all I was saying in the first place. The impact of this is that we CAN'T MAKE A JUDGEMENT off of his actions day one, because they are the same every time.

You taking advantage of someone's newbieness and telling them to ignore a player is not beneficial to the town at all. You say we should go by our own suspicions Day 1, but that is extremely poor play. Does that mean we should completely ignore other people's suspicions? If BJ has suspicions, for you to assume they are completely unfounded looks to be like you want to wave those possible suspicions away by waving the "BJ Wand" you're nicely laying out right now.

Again. You say I'm trying ignore him completely. I'm actually saying that because on day 1 his suspicions are as likely to be random as true (in fact more likely to be random...But I don't need to win that to win the harm) HUGE difference. And then you missrepresent me again, and say that I am now saying we ignore ALL players d1, something I flat out contradicted.

Me:

As for the other players, of course you can get scum tells. Too bad I was never talking about them so you're just making crap up to make me look scummy.

Then you continue to harp on the wrong point that we ignore BJ completely which I never said, and then you talk about me waving the BJ wand. In fact, I said he was good to have around as town, because he's good at reading, but this early in day 1 (and as I said pretty much all of day one...) has a possibility of being random, and therefore it is not worth it to follow him blindly, which is in fact what you're suggesting.

TURN: According to your advocacy, we should follow BJ at all times, which means that BJ would always win as scum. Since this is not the case, you're performatively contradicting yourself, and we can see you're manipulating this whole scenario in an attempt to make me look scummy.

Too bad I was never talking about them so you're just making crap up to make me look scummy.

Please find one thing I'm making up. Thanks.

. For you to base a vote off of it is totally preposterous,

I will choose what to do with my vote thank you very much, I don't need you to tell me what I want to do with my vote.

I'll find several. 1) You missrepresented my point that we should disregard BJ bandwagon attempts day 1 as "We should ignore BJ all the time."

then 2) You misrepresented "The possibility of randomness, and uniform play style day one make not following him a good choice" into me saying "There is no possibility of babyjesus having info or a read."

3) You missinterpreted "We should ignore BJ because he does the same thing every day and therefore is not readable, and use our own suspicions." Into me saying "We should ignore all players all the time and only base things off of our suspicions."

All three things are HUGE missrepresentations of what I was actually claiming, and seem pretty damn scummy to me.

Of course you can do whatever you want. Doesn't make it smart. I didn't say you couldn't vote for me based off of this, I said it was "preposterous of me to do so. This is missrepresentation 4, and also 5, because you convieniently left out this part of my quote.

nd at worst, I am guilty of a bit of metagaming, which most people in this site engage in

which makes it sound like I'm saying it's preposterous to vote for you, which I am not saying, obv. I'm saying voting for me based off of meta is silly.

and your follow up post/questions demonstrate that you do not understand at all what I was claiming in my original post

If you really want to think that, go ahead, but "for you to base a vote off of it is totally preposterous

LOL.

Misrepresentation number six. If you had bothered to check, that was not my justification for voting you, it was in response to your arguments having more holes in them than swiss cheese. My reason for voting you is

because you took my words, twisted them around into something I had never said, and then saying it's scummy.

Clearly, you're attempting to mock me here, but you just come off as stupid, because mine was in response to an actual point of your vote, whereas yours was just a parting shot with little or no relevance.

I guess you did want to post more bullshit. Three times the charm, right Jathan?

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heh. I'm done arguing with you about this. You just proved to everyone reading this thread that I'm right.

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Dude. I want to respond to you, but nothing in that post has not already been addressed. Quit being a dumbass, please.

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Aye Aye Aye.

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I'm really happy with my twito vote atm.

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Good point. STD, I know I'm sexy, but I don't think I can vote three times. If it matters, I'm reasonably sure I'm voting twito.

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What was I supposed to do, ignore his blatant misrepresentation of my point, and his chatagorization of me as scum based off of my perfectly reasonable comments about BJ. I do not see exactly what was over the top about it? I pointed it out, and then he attacked me for the defense, so of course the argument started.

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I think we should continue lynching jathan.

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Fine. We should continue lynching shadow lurker.

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Twito, that question was asked before you claimed. If you haven't noticed, theres been some loss of data.

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I can not answer for you, I was merely pointing out that

a) There was a perfectly reasonable reason that this post is near the newest in the thread right now.

b) I find the fact that you keep OMGUS attacking anyone who mentions your name unsettling.

[Thestatusquo]

Unvote, vote bogre

My read on illumina is a confused townie, who I do not think has played very much with BJ, or read any of his games. I think it's pretty obvious that what she did was not a scum move or a town move, but rather a WTF move, so I don't think that it in and of itself is a reason to vote for her.

Looking at the rest of her posts, I see that the only other reason I could possibly find for voting her is the fishing, which I think she is correct about in her defense. Like, honestly, with twito saying "BJ is definitely town" it's not unreasonable for her to say "Hmm...WTF is he saying that?" Especially if she is considering voting for him. At that point, he's not breadcrumbing, he's not joking, he's just making brash statements attempting to get votes off a person.

Now, on to twito. I'm like...72.3% (yes that number is pulled out of my ass.) sure that he's scum, but I am willing to let the cop claim lay for now, until we have a better idea of the mechanics of this game.

I do not think the lack of a counterclaim makes him innocent for two reasons. One, this is day one. A cop is much more useful for the town not counterclaiming, and getting several innocent/scum results later on. So I think a cop playing well would not counterclaim. Also, the mechanics in this game may be to the point where there is no cop, maybe several tracker type roles and such. We don't know, so no claim of the specific cop role does not clear twito. In fact, it's just the type of claim I'd expect scum to make day one. Eventually he'll be killed by scum if he's telling the truth, or he'll slip up. Either way, he will not be around much longer. (thank god.)

On my vote. Go read every post by bogre. I mean. Every one. Seriously. It won't take long.

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Did you read my post at all, rich? I specifically stated that it would be a poor play for a cop to counterclaim day one, which is precisely why scum would claim it. Win win for them, either people believe them and leave them alive, or they out the real cop woth a counter claim.

What you just said was incredably stupid. (except for the agreeing with me part.)

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Yes. That's it. :rolleyes:

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I think it's obviously superior to getting killed without outing the cop, which was what I was claiming it was better than. Why don't you stop attacking everything I say, especially when they're truisms.

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Has anyone read bogres posts yet?

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Illumina: Let me clarify. I agree that we should leave the cop claim until later.

I see several things about bogre that give me pause.

1) I see the fact that he has made a grand total of 6 posts in this thread, and more importantly, a grand total of 131 words to this thread, a number that will probably be eclipsed in this one post.

2) Look at the tension between his first ad second posts on 'view all.' He first tells rich that he does not agree with a FOS on twito from Rich because a 'dick move' doesn't warrant suspicion. Rich comes back and explains that he's voting based on essentially glorified OMGUS, and then Bogre comes back in the next post and tells us that it's 'good enough for him' and votes Twito off of essentially nothing. Convieniently joiining the first major bandwagon. Putting it at six. He then jumps off of it as soon as it becomes expediant to do so, and casts suspicion on people still on it "I think twito claimed cop" making me think that they're scumbuddies.

3) He then jumps on the next wagon (illumina) again late, and again with no apparent reason, except the cryptic "I think twito said he got innocent on BJ" Which assumes that twito is telling the truth, which is problematic, and, also casts suspicion on anyone who is voting, or suspicious of twito.

Summary: He has 6 posts. In those six posts he has 2 bandwagon jumps with no reason. I don't like his twito defense. And I do not like
the fact that he pushes the illumina lynch in his next post without any other content.

As suspected, this post more than doubles bogres word count for the thread.

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Twito. Stop being dumb plz. I'm trying to hunt scum. You're just being a moron.

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Clearly having longwinded and multiple posts make you not scum.

=Craplogic

Hey bogrescum, you missed the multiple other things I posted about you that gave me pause.

You strawmanned me, my comment was that when you have very few posts, and those posts have very little content, than it is suspicious to me. Your snarky "I'm so cool and you're wrong" post does almost nothing to answer this.

2) Look at the tension between his first ad second posts on 'view all.' He first tells rich that he does not agree with a FOS on twito from Rich because a 'dick move' doesn't warrant suspicion. Rich comes back and explains that he's voting based on essentially glorified OMGUS, and then Bogre comes back in the next post and tells us that it's 'good enough for him' and votes Twito off of essentially nothing. Convieniently joiining the first major bandwagon. Putting it at six. He then jumps off of it as soon as it becomes expediant to do so, and casts suspicion on people still on it "I think twito claimed cop" making me think that they're scumbuddies.

3) He then jumps on the next wagon (illumina) again late, and again with no apparent reason, except the cryptic "I think twito said he got innocent on BJ" Which assumes that twito is telling the truth, which is problematic, and, also casts suspicion on anyone who is voting, or suspicious of twito.

This goes stone cold non responded to.

But I see your point. I can see Illumina just being confused. Still, I believe the bandwagon on Illumina is going to present some very good and controversial points. Controversy=goodness.

Yes, but by you putting her that close to lynch with a) Little reasoning, and b) Then push hard on that lynch is not a protown play, no matter how much controversy it generates.

I think you're scum. Please die now.

confirm vote: Bogre

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So like, can we do something here?

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Nice mod simul.

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Ah, I didn't see that he was only the third vote. My reasoning however, still stands, as that was only a minor point in it.

I would like to lynch twito just because he's annoying me and not being helpful, but I still we'd best leave him for today. I say bogre is the best play for the time being.

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Bogre, the twito comment was a joke, way to notice that I said I still think we should keep him around, again, your quasi defense of twito is noted.

It was a minor point WHERE you jumped on, the point is the only thing you have done this game is jump on the two major wagons we've had without much reasoning. Can you answer that?

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No. It bugs me when people make random assertions repeatedly with no backing whatsoever, then when everyone notices how damn scummy they look, falls ass backwards into a cop claim, and uses it to throw suspicions on other people again with no reasoning, with the assumption that he's safe just because an experienced player (BJ) is pushing in the same direction he is.

But that's just me.

Here, settle this twito, investigate me tonight if you want to. It's ok, I know I'm innocent. I know that, and if you try to tell the town I'm guilty, and they run me up, then you'll be gone the next day. That's a trade I'm willing to make for the town. If you continue to push this claim and find me innocent, because you know, in your little mafia heart that I am, eventually it will become expediant for the cop to come forward, and you will die that way.

Either way, you will not be living to end game.

[Thestatusquo]

Also, twito:

Why do you think Illumina is a better lynch than Bogrescum?

[Thestatusquo]

Also, twito:

Why do you think Illumina is a better lynch than Bogrescum?

Coz you are defending Illumina so strongly.

But in the end it's pretty much the same for me which one goes today. I'm fine with anyone from my scummy ppl list. Meaning Illumina, Bogre, rich and you if I remember correctly.

Still looking for more ppl to add that list btw. We must have more than 4 scum in this game. If you are interested claim scum or gimme obvious scumtell.

1) Well, I don't think I'm defending illumina so much as I don't see the case against her. I am not of the opinion that she is definite town, and I am certainly not unwilling to ever vote for her, but I think the case against her at the moment is weak at best, and completely fabricated at worst, so it's my job, to point that out, no matter how much fire that draws to me. I want to avoid a misslynch, which you do not seem to be worried about at all.

2) I think the case against Bogre is much more damning and much stronger than the case against illumina, so I would much prefer a bogre lynch.

3) I'd like you to tell me what you have against each member of your 'list of scum' that makes you think they're scum. From what I can see, you just seem to be saying anyone who disagrees with you is obviously scum. If that's not true, prove me wrong by posting cases against all of those players.

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You don't know how happy I am that someone is willing to post.

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2) I think the case against Bogre is much more damning and much stronger than the case against illumina, so I would much prefer a bogre lynch.

heh: 'my case is better because I say so'

I jumped on Twito because his responses to that pressure were weak and scummy.

I think you're just trying to implicate me by exaggerating the circumstances under which I voted. Also, I don't really like the way you say 'You won't live til endgame' to Twito. He's confirmable, yet you still would like him dead before endgame? He must die if he's not confirmed, of course, but not just because.

1) my case is better a) because I actually posted it, and b ) because it's fairly fucking strong.

2) Yeah, too bad you never said that before, and too bad it took you so long to say it, and too bad that's not enough to put someone that close to lynch that soom.

3) I have not exagerated anything. It is you that has exagerated what I have been saying to the point of strawmanning the shit out of it.

4) How the hell is a cop confirmable? Stop being dumb. Again I'm noting your quasi protection of twito

5) Mafia 101, 9/10 a day one claimed cop will not live to end game.

6) mafia 102, feelings and actions are more important than claims. I am getting a decidedly scummy feeling from twitos actions, and that supercedes his claim. Anyone can fake a claim, it's not so easy to fake your actions.

[Thestatusquo]

FOS: Otaku

There is no deadline on us, and conversation is actually high right now. Why do we need to rush to a lynch, we're only on page 10.

[Thestatusquo]

Please explain how a cop isn't confirmable. Thanks.

Uh, well as scum you know everyones alignment, so you see, scum can just keep giving innocent results and maybe even throw in a little busing gambit. I think cop is one of the easier roles for scum to fake.

Please don't be so conscending with your responses especially when they're wrong. If someone claims Mason with someone else, are you going to lynch them?

That's not what I'm saying. Obviously when a claim is directly confirmable (we still should not immediately stop all suspicion of masons either, because it's a more dangerous and hence less likely, but still possible scum gambit.) supercedes all else, but I'm saying in the case of a claim, and a read that are conflicting, one should trust their read over a claim, because no one is going to be like "I CLAIM SKUMZORZ." I think that's pretty much a truism.

Also, I don't see why people doubt Twito's claim. First of all, that was a quick bandwagon with no reason behind it because Twito was scummy at all. Second of all, I'm suspicious of the people who doubt Twito's claim yet don't want a counterclaim. A counterclaim will confirm a cop, kill a mafia member, and chances are we have a doc who can protect the real cop while he can give us all his results immediately which he can't do if he doesn't claim. Obviously, a cop counterclaiming if Twito is lying is the best way. That way, we can be sure of Twito's alignment rather than not knowing, kill him if he's scum, and have him give us results immediately if he's not and get a doc to prevent him from NKs.

I think I've already explained why I disagree with this. You're welcome to your own opinion. I just hope the cop does not share it if in fact twito is lying. A cop is much more useful not using up our doc in the begining of the game and getting results under the radar.

[Thestatusquo]

Well, thats the thing. Couple of innocent results, one bus, couple more innocents, that scum starts to look pretty damn well the same as if he were an actual cop. That's why I'm saying that role is easiest to fake.

Also, bussing as a gambit can be beneficial to scum.

I agree with that position, SL. That is why I am not voting for him, but I am still wary of him, as his actions do not seem pro town to me at all.

[Thestatusquo]

Would you care to post your reasons for thinking either of them are scummy?

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I see nothing except

1) MoS hasn't been productive, and is voting twito

2) Illumina is putting claims in somones mouth, which I think it a huge strw man of what she said.

[Thestatusquo]

I'm still here.

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Brian, I was listing the two 'cases' that otaku had supposedly posted, by way of showing her how weak I thought they were. Stop being a skimmah.

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Unfortunately, twito, saying "there are reasons" is not akin to having reasons. Post them , or shut up.

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Yes. I don't see twito as pro town at all.

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Two things; As to not thinking like you: Thank god. I think if I were that dumb, I would cry; I already explained my position on you. I'm willing to let your cop claim stand for now, especially when bogre is clearly scum.

[Thestatusquo]

Stop being a skimmah, and read 189.

[Thestatusquo]

Guys. I have made up my mind. I do not care about Twitos role claim at all. I can not see the way he's acting this game as anything but anti town.

Unvote, vote twito

[Thestatusquo]

Yes Twito. That's exactly what I'm doing.

[Thestatusquo]

Reads are more important than reads, BJ, and I see no way that twitos behavior is pro town.

Also, I don't think someone who has a stated policy of lynching claimed docs can talk about stupid.

[Thestatusquo]

Reads are more important to claims. Obv.

[Thestatusquo]

Why are those two statements connected?

[Thestatusquo]

How exactly do we figure out if he's telling the truth?

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I think that giving up the chance to catch scum day one outweighs the fact that he will eventually die anyway. I'd like to avoid a misslynch, and I would also like to avoid outing anyone else, so I would say a twito lynch is the best plan either way.

[Thestatusquo]

twito must die.

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Twito. I find the fact that you consider people voting for you either 'childish' or 'scummy' not only stupid, but also really really troublesome from the point of a pro town player. Shut the fuck up or actually defend yourself. Attacking anyone who disagrees with you does not count.

[Thestatusquo]

I've said them several times, but fine. Tonight, when I come back from class I will post every single piece of evidense from this thread which makes me feel like me read of you over rides your claim.

[Thestatusquo]

TSQ was writing a 15 page paper last night. Cut him some out of game slack. I have nothing to do thurday and friday, so expect to be ground into the dust around that time.

[Thestatusquo]

CTD, if you watched my play at all and werent fucking skimming like a motherfucker, you would have noticed that I attempted to move on and form a wagon on a player other than the counterclaimed cop, and I was pointing out holes in logic, from a lynch I feel is bad, and I have still not seen reasons for in illumina. Twito convinced me that there was no way he could be town with his subsequent behavior, and I highly doubt I will be moving off of him unless someone basically claims scum. Either that or a bogre wagon gets going.

[Thestatusquo]

Excuse my sailor language. But I am driunk as a mother fucker.

[Thestatusquo]

Hmm....

vote: bogre

[Thestatusquo]

Thats a good point, but I also have a feeling that twito is aggressively bussing a team mate here. I see no reason as to why we wouldn't leave him alive if he keeps feeding us mafia.

[Thestatusquo]

No. I'm going to lynch the shit out of him.

[Thestatusquo]

I will be very interested to hear it.

[Thestatusquo]

No. Bogre dies today.

[Thestatusquo]

I want a claim, bogre.

[Thestatusquo]

unvote, vote twito.

[Thestatusquo]

unvote, vote twito

[Thestatusquo]

You don't counterclaim vig...You just vig him in the night if he's vig...

[Thestatusquo]

I'm not willing to look past lynching twito for now.

FOS: MBF

After we know his alignment (scum LOL) we can look at others players much more clearly through that lens.

[Thestatusquo]

Vote: STD?

[Thestatusquo]

I would actually prefer not to claim today, as I can check some of the claims.

[Thestatusquo]

I think he just claimed some sort of mason.

[Thestatusquo]

No, I mean indirectly.

[Thestatusquo]

MBF...Are you sure you're in the right game? This is New York. There should not be any special mechanics in this game.

[Thestatusquo]

I'm the gunsmith...I don't know whether or not that falls under your umbrella, otaku/mbf.

[Thestatusquo]

I don't know if my role is dependant on a boss. It was not explicitly stated in my role PM.

[Thestatusquo]

I check to see if people have guns or not.

[Thestatusquo]

No, that's not the point at all. The point is that having six confirmed innocents as soon as a mass claim happens is bullshit, and not something that StD woul put in the game. He knows balance, and would not fuck over a scums claim in that way. Combine that with the two masons, and almost half of this game is confirmed innocent by one person or another. I don't think he'd do that. That means one of three things to me:

1) Either he didn't make all pro town roles have bosses, in order to not let the town break the game.

2) Either MBF is lying.

3) The masons are lying.

Theres no way I can reconcile in my mind the mason claim with the boss claim.

Furthermore, look at this town. There are many people who have guns, many of them are pro town. This is exactly the kind of set up that a gunsmith would be used in. Saying that I am scum merely because I do not have a boss is stupid, because it assumes this game is way more breakable than StD would ever make it.

[Thestatusquo]

I meant to add: I am most suspicious of MoS and (SV, MBF, Otaku) OR the masons.

MoS is a constant. I've never been a fan of RB claims.

[Thestatusquo]

My thought process is not that the town is over powered. My thought process is that it doesn't matter HOW powered the town is if the scum players are just sitting ducks from a mass claim, because it ensures the town can pretty much lynch right every day after a mass claim.

[Thestatusquo]

I think I like a MBF better.

[Thestatusquo]

Because, MBF, since I have two groups I am unsure of, I think the best course of action is to determine which one is lying. And the act between otaku and MBF seems a little bit too pat to me.

[Thestatusquo]

From the wiki "Miller

Opposite of a Godfather. An innocent player that appears guilty to investigation."

[Thestatusquo]

Who's a miller? (AND MY POINT IS NOT THAT THE GAME IS UNBALANCED.)

[Thestatusquo]

Why, because you're scum?

[Thestatusquo]

Ooh. Yes. That put's a huge krink in your theory. I didnt even notice that. There was a miller. Who was his boss? It makes no sense in the context of your theory. I'm going to go with a tentative

vote: mikeburnfire

for now.

[Thestatusquo]

Because, MBF, since I have two groups I am unsure of, I think the best course of action is to determine which one is lying. And the act between otaku and MBF seems a little bit too pat to me.

For those that aren't reading the thread. Apparently MBF is among them.

[Thestatusquo]

I've seen police chief before.

[Thestatusquo]

Well, I have a theory, which would explain why we have all these enabling roles. The people are claiming their role, but they own that role in addition to being scum.

This would make the most sense for me, because STD would not break his own game in the manner that any other possibiility I see would. So, it is very possible that you're all telling the truth about your roles, but are still scum.

Now, from this, it follows to me that the people who are most likely, in this scenario, to be scum are the ones who are heavily pushing to use this apparent confirmness to string up someone they know is a townie. This is because they would have all the pieces, but the town would not.

This theory would obvious implicate, most strongly, mikeburnfire, and voidybuns, and otaku because they have been the ones most opportunistically pushing lynches based off of 'game breaking information' when they all know full well that STD is way too good a mod to break his game like 8 confirmed innocents would.

I am voting MBF. That, I do not think, will change.

[Thestatusquo]

What's the justification for nightson?

[Thestatusquo]

I'm pretty sure I'm happiest with a MBF lynch, out of your 4 candidates.

[Thestatusquo]

No. I believe that the enabling roles are not indicative of alignment. And I believe that the people who were pushing for lynches of the people not having enabling roles are the ones most likely to be scum. Since you did that the most, I am most suspicious of you.

[Thestatusquo]

The issue of 'enablers' not being pro-town is understandable. That's actually a good issue. I took Otaku and SV at face value and didn't doubt that they were pro-town when they claimed. They could be pro-scum enablers for all I know. You know what? I'll think about this tomorrow, after we've killed Jules.

First, I would like to say that my original theory was proved wrong. That's what happens in mafia games. You create theories, and then they are either proved right, and you win, or proved wrong, and you revise. My theory has been proved wrong. So I revises. How in the name of fucking the olsen twins in the mouth does that make me scum?

Second, this is my whole point. If my theory is a valid one, then why doesn't it make sense to determine which of them is scum based off of who is pushing it, rather than being cautious like one would expect a townie to be? Jules could be scum, MoS could be scum, and MBF, you sir, are certainly scum. We'll cross the other bridges when we get there.

[Thestatusquo]

And the act between otaku and MBF seems a little bit too pat to me.

This theory would obvious implicate, most strongly, mikeburnfire, and voidybuns, and otaku because they have been the ones most opportunistically pushing lynches based off of 'game breaking information' when they all know full well that STD is way too good a mod to break his game like 8 confirmed innocents would.

I believe that the people who were pushing for lynches of the people not having enabling roles are the ones most likely to be scum.

These are the only reasons I could find for why you think I'm scum.

[1]Otaku and I look like we're conspiring.
[2]STD wouldn't put 8 "confirmed innocents" in a game.
[3]I wasn't trying to lynch SV, Otaku, or myself.

[2] has since been debunked, I've explained [3] twice now, and [1] is very weak.

1) I still think you are.
2) No it hasn't. My whole point is that he wouldn't. Therefore, I do not believe that those roles are confirmed. You're deliberately missrepresenting something.
3) I never said that...

The main reason I think you're scum is an extension of my theory (2) that the people who are scum of the 8 'confirmed innocents' are the ones being the least cautious about a possible broken game when they know that STD is an experienced mod, and are attempting to lynch those who are not 'confirmed' by this 'game breaking mechanic' This HEAVILY implicates you, because the way you reacted to it is not a pro town reaction.

The fact that you keep deliberately missrepresenting what I'm saying, and claiming I have not made a case about you, when I have made a very strong one just makes me all the more suspicious of you.

[Thestatusquo]

STD. If there are 8 confiurmed innocents in this game, you know I will kick your ass, right?

[Thestatusquo]

I think that's BS, and wifom too. Being a confirmed innocent is way better for the scum then having a dead buddy with a non functioning doc.

[Thestatusquo]

No. See, it's posts like that that make me sure you're scum.

[Thestatusquo]

Said the two mafiates who know that we're in LAL

[Thestatusquo]

Not mine.

[Thestatusquo]

Actually, it's only on you, with slight suspicion on otaku and spectrumvoid, who were at least a litte cautious about pushing the town when we are probably in lylo.

[Thestatusquo]

To be honest, what desrepencies have I been accused of?

[Thestatusquo]

I want MBF today. Nothing else. I will address his post later today (around 6ish) if it doesn't come by like 11, feel free to vote me for not doing it.

[Thestatusquo]

Haha. Let's just say MBF just fell into a trap.

[Thestatusquo]

Funny.Being trapped is evidence. I'll explain when I get out of class.

[Thestatusquo]

I've asked to be replaced.

[Thestatusquo]

May I remind you, TSQ is no longer in this game, so he would appreciate not being referred to in the present tense.