NY 160: Terrible Melodrama Mafia (Game Over)

[Senjai]

VOTE: PiggyGal15 last time I ate ham I got food poisoning. AKA she's up to something... ObvScum

[Senjai]

VOTE: Toon Fighter Obv buddying me.

[Senjai]

VOTE: Senjai Obv Chainsaw, you obnoxious teenager

VOTE: JS FOR CALLING ME A TEENAGER. That hurts man. For real.

[Senjai]

I think you guys have a loose wheel. Let me fix it for you after I read my Nothing Matters here paper.

VOTE: Senjai obvscum because Plan B said so.

[Senjai]

The better question, is.. Why not? It's first page.

[Senjai]

Senjai, why do you change your vote every post, selfvoting even?

Oh, and I typed it wrong

vote: senjai

Now that's right

The better question, is.. Why not? It's first page.

The better question, is.. Why not? It's first page.

Not sure what that means, or why it matters. Help me out?

P_edit:

@ theamatuer

Why default to RVS? Any comment on this Senjai situation?

[Senjai]

EBWOP: Oh, I'm a situation now, looks like we're leaving RVS.

[Senjai]

He asked, Why change your vote every post, even selfvoting. I responded, Why not? It's the first page...

Many people havent even posted yet, and the first page doesnt really matter. It's a bunch of flailing about and RVS.

I'm a master flailer.

[Senjai]

He prob means it's just the first page, his votes don't matter much

I don't like when players try to stay in the RVS and dismiss 'situations' like this, like Senjai did. My vote on him is 'real'.

A real vote on second page. Wow. I'm glad my flailing about made someone take it so seriously to take us out of RVS so quickly. So in fact would you say that I helped take us out of RVS? hmm.

I have no issue with prolonging RVS by a few posts or even a page, we have two weeks. Tons of time to get through everyones bullshit.

[Senjai]

we have two weeks. Tons of time to get through everyones bullshit.

you do know that this is logic that usually comes from scum right?

Then why havent you voted me? Perhaps it does in your scenario, maybe you missed my point, the first half hour of the game REALLY doesn't matter.

Page 2 real vote?
I'm tempted to actually confirm my vote...

So you think its impossible to find scum during RVS?

I dont mean to be rude but I'd like to comment. Unless you have a particular players meta down pat, yes it is. In MY opinion, to reliably find scum without knowing their meta

intimately

is unlikely.

[Senjai]

EBWOP: to reliably find scum in RVS without knowing their meta...

[Senjai]

No, Senjai is town because of the quick agreement (and it became serious) of his lynch. His reactions come from town, hands down. That's not a meta thing, that's a "exactly what I do in that situation as town" thing.

Toon is just scummy cause he's always scum and made his vote real on page 2.

I cant give any scum reads atm. Wouldnt say he's town though.

[Senjai]

Lurkers be lurkin'

Lets get the show on the road!

[Senjai]

Are we really going to argue about RVS?

*snip*
I want bacon

Thanks for pointing out the hilarity here.

*snip*

Lurkers be lurkin'

Lets get the show on the road!

Who do you think is lurking?

Anyone who hasnt posted yet. Obviously. Of course they may have just not had time to post yet, but they be lurkin till they do

And statistically wise, yes

it's very much possible

that you'll find scum during RVS.

Is it plausible?

No.

Not really

we have two weeks. Tons of time to get through everyones bullshit.

you do know that this is logic that usually comes from scum right?

Then why haven't you voted me? Perhaps it does in your scenario, maybe you missed my point, the first half hour of the game REALLY doesn't matter.

I agree. Though 30 mins=//=2 weeks. Though town should take however mych time is needed to scumhunt and shouldn't ever waste it 'cause "there's still time"

My vote isn't on you 'cause your a 12' join date but if you really want it there I'd be more than happy to oblige.

vote:Senjai

Page 2 real vote?
I'm tempted to actually confirm my vote...

So you think its impossible to find scum during RVS?

Unless you have a particular players meta down pat, yes it is. In MY opinion, to reliably find scum without knowing their meta

intimately

is unlikely.

No. no. no. GOD NO!!! Meta is nice and all but its not the say all be all of scumhunting.

Only scum can actually have legit "scum" reads this early because well, they know who town are and know who exactly they should mislynch.

lol no. Playes can have scum reads as early as they can if there's a post that's off or whatever.

This is foolish. Let me explain. You can

ONLY

RELIABLY

GENERATE SCUM READS IN RVS BY KNOWN META

there is a keyword in there, figure it out. Scum can say their scum in RVS and it won't matter. If you play with Person X for three years, you get a very good idea on how he acts in RVS when scum versus when town. Your saying, this guy is scum because he didn't capitalize after the third period in his paragraph. You find scum by testing their consistency, and catching them lying or going against arguments previously made. None of this can happen in RVS.

Also, nobody mentioned join date. It sounds to me like your having trouble justifying your vote on me. I'm happy to lend a hand and say walk were you talk. But make sure you come up with an actual reason for doing so. Voting me without explaining why would have been a stronger vote then saying: It's not because your a 12 join date. Which begs the question, why vote then? Because I told you to? How useful will you be for town as a sheep throughout the game? You cant blame me for wasting time when not all players have made a proper conclusion. Noise between the lines of major arguments is noise. lol.

I didn't like Piggy's chainsaw defense of Senjai. ME thinks there is something worth investigating in there

Glad you think so. I think you're just upset because she shut your argument down. You completely sidestep #28-#30 and ignore the fact that your basis for a real vote is almost nonexistent. She saw VI and called it. Simple as that. I'd like to hear you come up with other reasons for your vote against ME right now. Since I'm the current topic of discussion. (Swag dat wagon ego).

i would say mre piggy is probably nervous town than scrum but so far there really has not been enough to say either way with any sort of uncertainty

[/quote]

Contentless post. Looks to me like trying to buddy the only person who called town on your target.

Things I'd like to know:

#1 -

Plan B

in #38 you came to an understanding with Piggy about something, though it's unclear what. Can you go into further depth on this.
#2 - I'd like Toon to actually sit on his chair and think of a valid reason for voting me When obviously people like Cletus and Demon COre can see its nonsense and are still RVS'ing.
#3 - I'd like to hear JS's arguement for voting me.

Wagons are good. I always get wagonned first. It doesnt really matter who it is that gets wagonned. The fact that the wagon is on me gives me all loads of hints about you other scummies

You should have been there my first game mr 'join date 12' were I legit thought it was a good idea to No Lynch D1. O boy wagon up.

[Senjai]

Anxiety, you always call me Naive Town... It hurts bro. Really

[Senjai]

I didnt say I had a read on Piggy at all. In fact I'm rather neutral to her. But now we're still in RVS, See NC' and DC's posts, and Anxietys. So obviously your point really isnt valid. I just feel like you want a quicklynch. I'm not buddiyng someone when its

obvious

your attacking them because they didnt agree with your attack on your target.. conflictofinterestmuch. You have stated no other reasons for doing so.

Let me excerpt from the wiki.

The purpose of random voting (and the so-called Random Voting Stage or RVS) is to spur the game into action by causing players to act in revealing ways. For instance, a wagon on someone may cause them to panic, or a player may become a

bit overeager in wanting to put votes down on players

, or a player may suggest a Policy Lynch on another one (with some players agreeing and some disagreeing), etc. In this way, events of significance can come about. The first time many players find something they seriously want to lynch someone over, they will remark that their vote is "no longer random".

I think the slip up most people look for was in your real vote post. But it would appear that many here dont even take that seriously, because your reasoning is completely mutt.

But I feel like learning something today. What is the necessary time period for RVS in your case? Should it end on the first page or the fifth. Since this is so important to you, I'd like an exact answer.

[Senjai]

JS as per #52 question 3, I'd like to hear why you still have your original RVS on me and your argument for it. Please and thank you, with 2.5 cherries.

[Senjai]

Here are my reads thus far.

ToonFighter: Slight

town

read. After some reflection in the shower I think he's just stubborn. Scum aren't likely to go all out on someone and make themselves that vulnerable to scrutiny this early on IME. Though I would like to know, given his reasoning why he doesnt have issues with #41, #43, and #58. Among others I missed.

Nero Cain: Slight

scum

read. Decided to seriously vote me without any valid reason, commenting on my post count and my desire for him to walk were he talks. Seems to me he was just looking for any reason to jump on a bandwagon and move for a QL.

Unipod Tripod:

scum

read, hasnt commented on anything since page one and is still RVS'ing. This goes for Cletus and DC and anyone else who doesnt feel like commenting on anything that has happened thus far.

Everyone else: neut.

That is all. Time to go interview for a job, wish me luck. Be back in a bit.

[Senjai]

EBWOP: VOTE: Nero Cain

[Senjai]

This is foolish. Let me explain. You can ONLY RELIABLY GENERATE SCUM READS IN RVS BY KNOWN META there is a keyword in there, figure it out. Scum can say their scum in RVS and it won't matter. If you play with Person X for three years, you get a very good idea on how he acts in RVS when scum versus when town. Your saying, this guy is scum because he didn't capitalize after the third period in his paragraph. You find scum by testing their consistency, and catching them lying or going against arguments previously made. None of this can happen in RVS.

No. It doesn't take "meta knowledge" for someone to have a scum read. As an example its a somewhat common scumtell for a player to keep or try to keep in "RVS" after discussion has started. That doesn't take "meta". I've been in many many many games where myself and other random townies think player X is scum for whatever reason. According to your logic that's impossible to do since it requires "meta". Just stop. Your argument is wrong.

I'm not looking for agreement. I'm

sexy

right and I know it. If someone can say their scum, barring obvious scumslips like roleclaiming and mentioning a qt, and that can or could not be a scum tell it's up in the eye of the perceiver. Perception != truth. Getting your perceptions correct reliably requires knowledge of the player and his personality. End of discussion. If you disagree, thats fine.

But now we're still in RVS, See NC' and DC's posts

For sanitys sake, this guy needs death soon.[/quote]

I was referencing APPARENT RVS votes, apparently DC's was serious, but it looked like RVS at the time. Chill out.

Then, I came to the conclusion that the join date reference was the reason Nero Cain had not voted for Senjai, yet. As if to say that inexperience was an excuse for what Senjai was doing.

This. Though excuse isn't the word I'd use. More like "s his scumminess 'cause he's new or 'cause he has a scum pm?"[/quote]

I am how I am. I always talk and act this way. This is why meta plays a part. You can perceive what you want, perception becomes more akin to truth the more you know somebody. Some expd mafia player can come and correct me, but this is common sense. Common sense > mafia traditional perceptions.

Sounds like your angry all of a sudden because your my #1 scum read. It's okay, life goes on.

[Senjai]

How useful will you be for town as a sheep throughout the game?

If you are town, wouldn't you want a second vote?

Overall, you place a lot of emphasis on meta. I disagree that meta helps because most players are actively trying to be aware of their own meta and fix it. However, this is merely a difference of opinion.

Demon, why vote nero cain?

I understand. I was only talking about during the RVS stages. Not throughout the mid and late game.

[Senjai]

I just do it to get people to post. If you've seen it a lot then obviously people place some measure of importance to them.

[Senjai]

your scumreads are post suggestions? that particular scumread was a posting suggestion?

also way to reading comprehension. I called it a "bullshit" scumread, implying that it's not one that actually tells you anything.

k

[Senjai]

EBWOP: In the meantime, do you have anything else to add?

[Senjai]

Hey guys, on a side note (not sure what timezones you all are in) I'd like to wish everyone a happy and

safe

Halloween.

[Senjai]

I <3 My wagon. It's different than when a wagon is on someone else. You have two unknowns, what that persons role is, and what the people wagoning him are. I know who I am, so I get the priviledge of getting lots of juicy intel from others when they react to my posts. I said in #52 wagons are awesome.

Still not liking some Sejai's posts, but he's looking better.

Secondind N, what do you think about the wagon on you, Senjai?

Agree with DoomYoshi about jacob, still being undecided looks bad. Make a statement, have an opinion, even if you have to change it later on.

Being undecided doesnt look bad at all. Changing your statements makes you look bad.

Here are my reads thus far.

ToonFighter: Slight

town

read. After some reflection in the shower I think he's just stubborn. Scum aren't likely to go all out on someone and make themselves that vulnerable to scrutiny this early on IME. Though I would like to know, given his reasoning why he doesnt have issues with #41, #43, and #58. Among others I missed.

Nero Cain: Slight

scum

read. Decided to seriously vote me without any valid reason, commenting on my post count and my desire for him to walk were he talks. Seems to me he was just looking for any reason to jump on a bandwagon and move for a QL.

Unipod Tripod:

scum

read, hasnt commented on anything since page one and is still RVS'ing. This goes for Cletus and DC and anyone else who doesnt feel like commenting on anything that has happened thus far.

Everyone else: neut.

That is all. Time to go interview for a job, wish me luck. Be back in a bit.

Now, when I gave these reads I was lying. All of my reads stand except the one on Toonfighter. Toonfighter has been the most obvious and stubborn in supporting my lynch while not scumhunting anybody else. As quoted he doesnt respond to any of the other posts, nor imo does he try to reliably scumhunt anyone either than me.

So this is what I attempted to do.

I would make a post saying that he's a town read. I'd expect him to back off of his position as scum. Because he knows that two people consider me town, by associating himself with me or backing off he could get some cheap towncred with those two people. While in later times he could argue he was scumhunting the wagon, was satisfied, and went with my reasoning. I changed my vote to Nero Cain (dont get me wrong NC, I still think your scumtastic) and expected him to hop on. Had he have done this I would make it my lifes desire to have him lynched.

But he only went partway, and that was backing off his position (again with no explination). He didnt do this when I attempted to reason with him (among others like theamatuer and Anxiety) but only when I stated that I had a slight town read. This is SCUMMY. Though not as scummy as if he hopped on with me, I wont vote him yet. but...

FOS: ToonFighter

[Senjai]

His question to me did seam like he was trying to find someone to band wagon with, and his refusal to move his vote was a little odd. Not scummy but odd.

^This is your description of your top scum read (assuming your reads are in order).

And you conveniently left post 67 (which details my "random vote") out of your little dossier there.

Would you like to try again?

Wagons are good. I suggest we run up on NC next

[Senjai]

Senjai, what do you think of your wagon? What about what you were up to L-2?

As long as theirs a wagon its cool. Great for scumhunting. If someone quicklynches that quickly then I dont want to be a part of this town. Also it was technically L-3, as I was one of those votes.

[Senjai]

Happy Scumday TF

[Senjai]

Yea but I don't care about 'looks' .. Sorry :/
The way you put it your right. I meant saying 1 person is 100% scum then switching and going back on it without any significant evidence is scummy.
May have not been the best gambit or w/e but I thought I'd try something out so.

[Senjai]

stop multiposting like that to make yourself look active.

All within 3 minutes makes me look active? Sorry, I usually edit my posts on forums that allow it, for obvious reasons cant do that here. And If I am posting often I am active, there is no 'looking' at all.

[Senjai]

If ya'll really have that much of a problem with multiposting, you're going to be in for a hell of a game.

this^^ I post a lot, that doesnt mean im scum and it doesnt mean im town, it just means i post alot. If anything scum lurk more often then trying to stay active. I have time on my hands this week.

What does anyone else think?

I think your list is incomplete. It has a notable lack of N, Untrod Tripod, theamateur, and Plan B (all of whom have contributed significantly to this game). Now, I know that you have no problem with telling us that you have a null read on someone, so you must be leaving these people out for some other reason. What is it?

I'd also like some explanation on your Nero Cain read. What do mean by "wanting to avoid a mislynch"?[/quote]

Yea I saw that. I thought NC was trying TO quicklynch. From #46

[Senjai]

TF: What are your reads on NC, DC, Plan B, and Anxiety?

[Senjai]

Hey JS I wanted to wait till you replied. I also was waiting for you to mention #46. Him voting without a valid reason is not trying to avoid a mislynch, its trying to lynch. Without much merit. So I don't understand your thinking on that, maybe you can help me understand. I wouldnt call blindvoting cautious. And he still has that vote on me. You said that there is nothing worth moving your vote to in #46 and its good you stuck to that story, but that was over 50 posts ago, nothing has changed?

JS: I want to hear you explain your thoughts on NC in more detail.

[Senjai]

JS & NC are scum. Discuss.

[Senjai]

don't get why he'd move the vote to jacob without mentioning him. Want more explanation on that part

That's not entirely true. I did get after him for that awful PiggyGal15 "read".

Aside from that is that he made that post right after the Vote Count which showed Senjai at L-2, and didn't feel compelled to even mention it or move his vote, but later on disclaimed any responsibility for that vote by saying he just didn't have a better place to put it.

After my vote, continued scummy behavior with what has already been pointed out as an "incomplete list". It makes absolutely no sense to not comment on me as I was the first player to vote for him, without giving any explanation. Feels to me like he just doesn't want to engage, whereas a more natural Townie reaction would be to take issue with something like that.

Senjai

Having lots of difficulty reading him, hes not standing out other than that he posts a lot, I would call him a null currently

So overall If I had to choose a top 3 I would say:
Anxiety, Demon Core and Cleutus.

What does anyone else think?

That it makes absolutely no sense for you to still be voting Senjai with the following justification:

Second of all, I havent moved my vote because currently there is nothing worth moving it too.

Basically, you just admitted that your "reads" were entirely made up and not even worth

you

paying attention to. Which means you posted that for the sake of giving an appearance of contributing.

Which makes you scum.

So, I think you should swing from a rope.

Agreed

VOTE: JS

Theamateur, My top scum read was TF, but as of late I'm not so sure anymore. His response after my gambit was pretty solid and he handled it pretty well in my opinion. Even if my gambit wasn't the best. You say NC isnt scum? I want to know why you don't think so. JS and NC were the last on my wagon, both with illegitimate reasons. If JS flips scum i'd say he slipped up and was trying to defend NC (which isn't really possible given his reasons for my vote) and or wagon with NC.

[Senjai]

Dont pick at my nomenclature NC. You're just raging right now. I think the pressure is getting to you. Now your saying you are agressing me because of my join date, I'm totally LOVING YOUR AD HOMINEM ATTACKS. Makes you so reputable. Using join date as an excuse in argument = scummy, keep your red herring fallacies away from me.

Mafiascum isn't the only site for mafia. I played mafia on teamliquid.net for ages, and in clubs irl. There are other people who disagree, not just you. I have my opinion you have yours, i even said I'm not looking for agreement, so why are you still whining about it. Need meta to be reliably right in rvs, keyword is reliably, or consistently. Not always. Which I stated in one of my previous posts.

It wasnt a lie, it was a gambit. Well a lie for the sake of scumhunting.

*snip*

Now, when I gave these reads I was lying. All of my reads stand except the one on Toonfighter. Toonfighter has been the most obvious and stubborn in supporting my lynch while not scumhunting anybody else. As quoted he doesnt respond to any of the other posts, nor imo does he try to reliably scumhunt anyone either than me.

So this is what I attempted to do.

I would make a post saying that he's a town read. I'd expect him to back off of his position as scum. Because he knows that two people consider me town, by associating himself with me or backing off he could get some cheap towncred with those two people. While in later times he could argue he was scumhunting the wagon, was satisfied, and went with my reasoning. I changed my vote to Nero Cain (dont get me wrong NC, I still think your scumtastic) and expected him to hop on. Had he have done this I would make it my lifes desire to have him lynched.

But he only went partway, and that was backing off his position (again with no explination). He didnt do this when I attempted to reason with him (among others like theamatuer and Anxiety) but only when I stated that I had a slight town read. This is SCUMMY. Though not as scummy as if he hopped on with me, I wont vote him yet. but...

FOS: ToonFighter

How is that scummy? I thought you knew what you're talking about mr 2009.

[Senjai]

You're wrong, that's actually a scumtell.

But I'd have to be scum for it to be a scumtell. And I'm not so...

If JS flips scum, lynch this with fire.

[Senjai]

@Piggy

What is your read on DemonCore?

@Everyone on the JS wagon.

Why is JS scummy for calling somebody "nervos town" but 4xn skates by for doing something similar?

Read #115. Also lets here what you think about everyone else, when you cool off that is.

[Senjai]

@MOD: Where is Number Six?

He hasnt posted yet. And adorkable hasnt posted in forever.

[Senjai]

JS you give me a headache.

[Senjai]

It's okay, I'll go get some rope from the store. Brb

[Senjai]

I love this Senjai guy.

Im not sure but im pretty sure that I can be sure that your sure to be sarcastic when the word love is in your sentences.

[Senjai]

Jacob, you are the last, along with Nero Cain, LEFT on my wagon right now. is what I meant. Will post more later.

[Senjai]

N from #146, I think scum-JS is more likely to defend a buddy. Scum-NC is more likely to buddy a town.

[Senjai]

ObvScum #1 - JS
ObvScum #2 - NC

#148 seems suspect from Cletus, unless he can provide more analysis than he already has, he's simply trying to hop on a wagon.

Untrod thanks, but you should know in my transperancy I'll pick on everyone too. According to your posts here: Click me

Almost 100% of your posts are IIOA. This bothers me and leans towards a scum read. I'd like to see some analysis from you. What do you think of the JS wagon? What do you think of Plan B and Anxiety?

N is also suspect for the same reason. He has asked questions and I like that he is doing so. After all of his questions he has yet to provide any analysis or reads. Even though he promised to so here:

um, derp, yes you did answer it. What do you think of the last chainsaw accusation (by Toon Fighter)?

N, what's with the no vote? What do

you

think of the Senjai wagon?

I'm sorry >.< I have nothing left to say

Nothing at all? Senjai gave some reads, does this make him scum?

I would trim this down so I'm oink only replying to the but concerning me, but I'm on my phone.

Why do I need to have a vote down? And I'll wait until Sendai replies before I answer.

Anxiety and Theamateur. I'd like to here some additional analysis from the both of you as well.

Oh and adorkable is a slight scum read too. #138 is horrible and doesnt have any reasons behind it. Though he promises to sift through the 'longer posts' later. It seems possible he just hasnt had time to read the thread. Seeing as though he has so few posts. Without some concrete analysis from him I'll add him to my scumdar.

In short:

NC and JS are scum.
I'm worried about N, Untrod, and Cletus.
and I'd like to see more from anxieety and theamateur.

And of course, we must wait and see what is to become of Number Six.

[Senjai]

EBWOP: add Addorkable to the worried list and DoomYoshi to the want to see more list.

[Senjai]

Is that from looking at their meta?

No, I havent played with them before. Just an opinion. As I argued that JS's defence of NC's scumminess was scummy.

[Senjai]

V/LA for 4-5 hours most likely. Not a formal V/LA, but that for me (as NC will readily remind you) is a long time away from mafia. just to let yall know.

[Senjai]

Gambits are for idiots isnt ad hom. Saying things like reinforcing #138 to show your 'greater intelligence' over me is ad hom. And doesnt strengthen your argument at all. You do it because you can't make a strong argument in the first place. I'll be taking pot shots at you all game. Your scum, face it. As soon as we lynch your buddy ol' pal your on the block next. Since when did I have this power to read minds? Do you know what you're talking about?

Literally all you can come up with is:
Senjai is stupid.
Senjai joined in 2012
Senjai thinks he knows everything

I want to hear a legitimate case for you to still have your vote on me. Kthnx.

JS defended you for absolutely no reason, and now your defending for absolutely no reason claiming 'selective scumhunting' as your reason. TF was selective scumhunting me for the majority of the early game, does that mean he's scum? You and JS are scumtastic together.

@Adorkable. If you dont want to be criticized on your opinion, dont voice it. If your going to make a statement, back it up when your asked to. I'm not going interpret what I think when you say this player is bad because of #13323. I don't care what I think if it were me. I care about what you think and why. Saying a person is bad without explaining why is.. silly. Contrary to popular belief I cannot read minds, nor will I try, I prefer accuracy over guessing.

Also if you vote someone and I think your an idiot for doing so, I'll mention it. Even if the person your voting already has. It's not scummy at all.

[Senjai]

Kan we lynch JS nao?

[Senjai]

Also, from #118

That is so cute. A 2012 player thinks he knows more about the happenings of this site then someone that’s been here for that last two years. So are you an alt and pretending to be new? I’ll let you “win”. I don’t really care but you aren’t right. And you took the whole conversation and turned it on its head. Piggy was all “oh only scum can call people scum this early!!!” Which is an obvious load of manure. Your “well she’s wrong but she’s also right…’cause they gotta know meta to be right!” is pretty dumb and doesn’t have anything to do with what was being discussed at all.

Thats when your ad hom comes into play. Just thought I'd FTFY

[Senjai]

unvot,vote: Piggygal

You know I'm going to ask. So spare me?

[Senjai]

N why arent you voting JS, he's obvscum.

[Senjai]

EBWOP: N you should have a vote down by now. Your using the same reasoning as nero, except 150 posts later. Thats not good.

[Senjai]

Mod: I take it N6 has acknowledged his prod? Or no?

[Senjai]

Piggy may seem scummy, but JS is much worse. Kill him.

[Senjai]

TBH Piggy is a neutral read until i see this long post she promised. but JS is scum, so kill him. Also did you see my #163 Untrod?

[Senjai]

mmm, kay I'm sold on piggy. I want to hear Untrods response to #163 though.

[Senjai]

Nero asked you specifically about Demon because AT THAT TIME, demon was the only one voting him lol.

I don't think we should jump the wagon. Demon Core Untrod and Anxiety would have to persuade me. Piggy has a collection of the most infrequent and IIOA posters in the game. If she flips town, likely two of them at least are scum. (as the wagon sits now)

JS has scumslipped enough. Though I'd say piggy is slightly buddying me (copying a lot of my reads instead of simply just saying she agrees with me) a JS lynch would tell us LOADS more than a piggy lynch. As town that's what we need. Lynching JS would tell us the following:

If Scum: Nero is also likely scum.
If Town: Nero is much more easily exonerated.

If we lynch piggy we dont find out anything. Except that some of the people on her wagon are scum if shes town (but we dont know who) and if she's scum she hasnt really hinted at who might be her scumbuddies (except perhaps me via buddying)

A townpiggy lynch would also raise suspicion on the more ominous posters like Adorkable, Anx, C+b (though theamateur is fairly ominous too. (if JS is town I'd move against him or piggy next)

[Senjai]

EBWOP:Piggy has a collection of the most infrequent and IIOA poseters on her wagon in the game**

[Senjai]

To sway my vote, I'd like to see someone prepare a detailed contrast (as if piggy and JS were the only two possible choices) showing how piggy is more scummy than JS. If someone is able to do that I'll switch my vote.

[Senjai]

By my count JS is L-2 and Piggy L-3

[Senjai]

Information Instead of Analysis.

[Senjai]

Can you explain why you support a piggylynch DC?

[Senjai]

Still haven't heard a valid analysis for a piggy lynch. Welcome RC

[Senjai]

Ikr, I've been waiting for someone to do a contrast. Also you can answer my question DC xD

[Senjai]

I feel persuaded by Doom and Anxiety. Piggy is panicking and it's obvious.

HOWEVER

I want to hear from RC before we lynch.

[Senjai]

EBWOP:

UNVOTE

[Senjai]

if Piggy flips scum I expect the lot of you to join me on JS next round.

[Senjai]

DC, would you be wiling vote JS?

[Senjai]

Why not DC, you do not agree he is scummy?

N why don't you have a vote on JS or Piggy? They have the consensus that at least one of them are scum. Are you trying to take attention away from them?

[Senjai]

Who on his wagon is scum then? Yes it's possible, but it could very well be poor scum play as well, I wouldn't count that out.

[Senjai]

I'm not disagreeing with you at all DC. I believe both are scum. I however just think if it were my choice, I'd lynch JSscum over Piggyscum that's all. I was simply trying to understand yours and everybody elses thoughts as to why piggy would be a larger and more important target than JS. What about C+B along with adorkable? They were considered by some to be opportunistic as well.

[Senjai]

It can be possible JS is VI. I'll be satisfied I guess at what a Piggy lynch would tell us.

VOTE: Piggy[/b]

[Senjai]

EBWOP: VOTE: Piggy EPIC FAIL... its 4:45 am here at this time.. lol.

[Senjai]

I wanna hear more from UT, PB, and my favorite (theoneandonly Nero Cain) before a lynch happens though.

[Senjai]

So, if player X thinks player Y is town why should he not say so? What was TF accusing you of that another player did?

Are you trolling me? Because you said defending another player who can defend himself is scummy.

I don't think I'm a hotshot, I just think you're an idiot. WTB legitimate reasons instead of adhoms. If you feel that this is too hard for you to do, I suggest you stop playing mafia, and perhaps avoid roles in life where you have to make strategic decisions. You'll find that 95% of people won't give into your reasoning when your reasoning is: Durr, he's an idiot, he doesn't know anything.

THERFORE

I'm right.. Durr, simple logic bro. Notice how I havent even mentioned your intellect until... just now? or your mental capacities. That's because even though you are perfectly obvious in your dinky ways, it won't strengthen my argument in the eyes of others and would likely just make everyone hate me.

Life lessons <3

DC stop stallin the lynch yo.

[Senjai]

So, if player X thinks player Y is town why should he not say so? What was TF accusing you of that another player did?

Are you trolling me? Because you said defending another player who can defend himself is scummy.

I don't think I'm a hotshot, I just think you're an idiot. WTB legitimate reasons instead of adhoms. If you feel that this is too hard for you to do, I suggest you stop playing mafia, and perhaps avoid roles in life where you have to make strategic decisions. You'll find that 95% of people won't give into your reasoning when your reasoning is: Durr, he's an idiot, he doesn't know anything.

THERFORE

I'm right.. Durr, simple logic bro. Notice how I havent even mentioned your intellect until... just now? or your mental capacities. That's because even though you are perfectly obvious in your dinky ways, it won't strengthen my argument in the eyes of others and would likely just make everyone hate me.

Life lessons <3

DC stop stallin the lynch yo.

[Senjai]

NC is my #2. VOTE: NC

[Senjai]

TF NC has been my #2 Scumread all game, feel free to read back. Will an NC lynch tell us the same? Not sure, I'll have to catchup and determine if it would. I don't think so, though. Remember that post when i said I had to go out for a job interview? Yea I got it, and its taking a lot of my time.