Large Normal 132: Desert Mafia (Over!)

[Kublai Khan]

ohshit.. mastin2? *HEAD DESK*

Vote: Khan Man. For old time's sake.

(Fun fact: I've been in two games with Khan.
In Both Games, Khan was scum.
I am in this game.
Khan is in this game.
Therefore, Khan is scum.

My logic is flawless! )

Flawless logic, indeed. You are not claiming roleblocker and you are still alive. Ergo I'm not scum.

And I'm obviously not a delayed action vig; though I agree with you on the definition--I think we'll see a minimum 2 bodies tomorrow (Empking+scum) assuming no blocking, etc.

Still, how much does Empking hate you? I'm trying to decide to either policy lynch you for excessive posting or ignore you and let nature take it's course.

I am the Jailkeeper. I can target people and block night abilities used on them and that person cannot use night abilities. I chose my first target at random, so I need the town to lean me in the right direction of who to use it on N1.

What the eff--? You don't seem to have any completed games here on mafiascum.

Do you understand any of the basic principles of playing mafia?

Scott Brosius' vote is horrible. So is Mana_Ku's vote. She (?) should justify it soon.

I played a game as a scum with mastin, and overall, he is our best chance at winning the game.

No talking about on-going games. (I didn't see any completed games in your meta.)

hmm

Vote: Scott Brosius
FOS: Mana_Ku

[Kublai Khan]

DeityKabuto-

No, a game is completed once the mod says it's over. If you are dead in an on-going game, then it's still an ongoing game and you don't talk about it except to say it's ongoing.

[Kublai Khan]

Okay, ongoing, I am in 11 ongoing games, happy?

No, my happiness is contingent upon town power roles doing the best they can to stay hidden.

I think you're too dumb to be scum, so I'm going to ignore you for a few days and see what happens.

[Kublai Khan]

I'm trying to decide to either policy lynch you for excessive posting

That's NOT GONNA HAPENNNN

It should. If you idolize mastin2, then you're an idiot.

Also, when responding to a single line within a big post. Just quote the single line (as above) instead of editing my text.

Users browsing this forum: mastin2, Reya Cookiebringer
^What it was. I checked multiple times. Also saw Reya posting somewhere on the forum as the last post in one of 'em.

Users browsing this forum: mastin2
^What it is, now.

I approve of this.

You approve of scum-hunting based on looking at "users browsing forum"? Are you not aware that people can hide their online status?

Delayed Action Vig?

Or maybe he'd have to send it in twice.

Huh? (I'm guessing at what specific part of mastin2's entire post you're talking about, BTW. Clarity helps town. Learn to edit, then post.)

[Kublai Khan]

If you couldn't tell, I'm generally portraying Scum 1 as semi-newbish (but possibly with some experience--probably off-site, but potentially one or two games on-site), Scum 2 as relatively new but somewhat experienced, and Scums 3&4 as experienced. Khan in this situation as either 3 or 4 would essentially do what he did in Emerald City:

*If a previous scum player brought up the option of killing mastin*. "I wouldn't be afraid of him. He's a pushover if you know how to touch on his buttons. He's arrogant and has an easily exploitable ego. I've done it before. He's not a threat to us."

Why do I think this is what Khan did?

*HEADDESK*
I know exactly why you think that. It's because you're still playing Mafia 96 - Murder in Emerald City. Here's the short list of everything everyone should know about mastin2's case on me...

1) When M96 started, mastin2 made a short list, declared several scum on it for no reason.
2) Because he had played a game with me before and I was scum, he concluded that I must be scum again. (Sound familiar?)
3) Despite the fact that there were 3 night-kills on Night 0, he theorized that since he roleblocked me and I've been scum before, he MUST have prevented a fourth kill.
4) Stuck to that theory no matter what. For the rest of the game he was alive. In the Dead QT thread. In the post-game. Today, probably.
5) mastin2 was, in fact, scum in Mafia 96 (different scum-team).
6) mastin2's current theory about how I must be scum 3 or 4 and quote about how I claimed I could manipulate mastin2 were taken directly from the beginning of Mafia 96 Vermillion scum thread (Link - Post 6).

Now I did semi-joke about policy lynching mastin2. I know it's not going to happen, but if you read Mafia 96 you can watch as he literally sucked the fun out of the game for me with his massive repetitve walls. His logic is so horrible that I can't help but be drawn into a stupid debate with him. I play mafia to win, yes, but mainly I play for fun.

If I had any ability to kill mastin2 during Night 0, I absolutely would have done so with ZERO HESITATION.

tl;dr - mastin2 is literally calling me scum in this game because I was scum in another game. And is using my actions in that other game as the reason for calling me scum in this game.

I'm pretty sure his threatened wall will be recappable with the same two sentences once you strip away the repetitive bullshit he will festoon his arguments with.

[Kublai Khan]

Khan, no offence but I care not for your previous issues with Mastin therefore I request that you two deal with your personal hatred for each other in private messages and not let it effect the game. I believe I've asked this already however I'll restate it on the off-chance you skimmed my previous post, what are your thoughts on everyone thus far?

Yeah, I'm sorry about my attitude towards mastin2. I typically try to remain cool and logical during games, but mastin2 is one of the very few who pierces that calm demeanor with his razz-emoticon tipped illogical sword.

Also, I didn't skim your previous post. I just didn't have the time necessary to write-up an in-depth post as I was defending myself for meta-reasons. Plus I felt that Page 4 was a little early for a rundown. Page 8 gives me more to consider..

@mod - Could you gently prod inHimshallibe & Reya Cookiebringer to remind them the game started?

Will do.

[winger] - No vote, claims to have re-read the game on Page 7, but has yet to offer up very little beyond "DK is probably town". Afraid to take strong stances or even ask mild questions. Looks like he's settling in to actively lurk until he can pounce on wounded prey (Scummy)

DeityKabuto - Dumb-town. I inferred that he must have jailblocked mastin2 based on his first post.

@DeityKabuto can you confirm?

.

mastin2 - He's useless as he's currently stuck in a Confirmation Bias logical fallacy mindset. I'm willing to ignore him pending the outcome of Night 1.

Silver1337 - He's so green that I feel he should be checked for moss. I meta'd his only competed game. He's consistent with his weak town meta. If he's scum, he'll probably slip up eventually. Though his last post (185) is horrible. It either reveals that he's not reading the game or that he's trying to smear DeityKabuto.

Skyquiem - Ugh. Hydra. Your schizophrenic mystery posting makes you a very tough read. Head Two is clearly scummier than Head One. But I'm basing that on just generic tells.

RisingPhoenix - Was kinda iffy until post 174. He's taking clear positions, asking concise questions, he's not hiding his cards. Strongest non-DeityKabuto town read currently.

gorilla - I'm actually reading him pretty scummy at the moment.

Hiraki - I've got a mild town read on him.

Scott Brosius - Scum read. At first I thought he might have been making a mountain out of the no-reveal hydra thing, but once he started spouting town platitudes about wanting more info, I'm decently sure of scum.

Mana_Ku - Still waiting for her to justify her Skyquiem vote. The longer I wait, the scummier it is. Note that I'm leery of thinking that she's scum together with Scott Brosius. I'd say with a strong degree of certainty that one of the two are scum.

Ranmaru - I think the current case on him is a little trumped up. Neutral read right now.

--
Goddamnit, I just can't help myself. Sticking to only relevent things.

6) mastin2's current theory about how I must be scum 3 or 4 and quote about how I claimed I could manipulate mastin2 were taken directly from the beginning of Mafia 96 Vermillion scum thread (Link - Post 6).

Quite intentionally, I might add. That was kinda the point.

The rest I'll be addressing in my future post.

(But to answer Ranmaru who just ninja'd me, they pretty much confirm my read. Brief reason as to why, is that Khan's trying to degrade the quality of my play and convince OTHERS that I'm full of BS. Rather than convince ME that I'm wrong. There's far more to it than that, of course, and I'll be elaborating in the case.)

I'm absolutely galled by the fact that you are accusing me of trying to undermine your credibility immediately after you admit you were busted trying to intentionally trying to undermine mine.

Also, missed this earlier:

Khan would obviously be 3 or 4 in this scenario, because Khan's one of the most experienced players here--even a lot of people present now who consider themselves vets would look up to Khan. Who here is even close to being Khan's on-site age?

False and misleading. Check my accurate wiki. I've only got 22 completed games (+1 mod abandonment). I'm hardly the most experienced mafia player in the game.
--
PREVIEW EDIT - Good lord, a second roleclaim? Good job, doofus.

If you are a vanilla townie, and annoyingly I think you are, then you've made it easier for scum to PR-hunt. Your job as VT is to not get lynched and to draw scum NKs towards yourself so that town power roles can live and win the game for town. That is Mafia 101.

It makes

ZERO

sense to claim vanilla townie out of nowhere. All it does is increase your personal chance of surviving until endgame because scum have

ZERO

intention of wasting their NK on a nobody like you. Now we're going to waste a bunch of time and energy dickering about whether or not to policy lynch you. Which means no scum-hunting. Way to go, jerk.

*HEAD DESK*

[Kublai Khan]

I think puppies are cute.

I don't care for your fence-sitting on puppies. You aren't taking a strong stance on them. My theory is that you hate puppies because I saw you twice walk past a puppy and not pet it. The very WORDS you use to describe your opinions about puppies is scummy.

We get it, mastin2. I'm scum no matter what I do. Either put it all in spoiler tags like the junk it is or don't even post about me until Day 2.

_________________________________________________________________

Vote Count

• Scott Brosius: 2 (Kublai Kahn, Skyquiem) L-6
  Skyquiem: 2 (Scott Brosius, Mana_Ku) L-6
  Silver1337: 2 (DeityKabuto, Hiraki) L-6
  
  gorilla: 1 (Ranmaru) L-7
  Ranmaru: 1 (RisingPhoenix) L-7
  Kublai Kahn: 1 (mastin2) L-7
  
  Not Voting: 5 (inHimshallibe, [winger], Silver1337, gorilla, Reya Cookiebringer)

With 14 players, it takes

8

to lynch.

Deadline countdown timer:

(expired on 2011-06-17 18:39:00)

[Kublai Khan]

Actually, KK, that's pretty accurate. I'm just waiting for someone to do something scummy, then pounce on them.

Funny story. You know what's a great strategy for scum? To say as little as possible until someone else messes up, then they can jump on the bandwagon.

unvote
Vote: [winger]

@Skyquiem - Explain your gorilla town-read.

Your posts are consistently failing to show me any signs of being pro-town, which is worse than pretty much every single other suspect of mine.

ANYTHING I post would fail to show you any signs that I'm being pro-town. Because you're tunneling.

Also, my post of reads (requested by Skyquiem) was not intended to be scum-hunting. It was intended to be a post of reads. You actually realize that right?

Explain your Hiraki read a bit further please.

@Everyone: Which of you have played with Empking before? Which of you all KNEW who he was?

I've played with town-Hiraki before. He's not done anything out of character.

I am playing and have played with Empking.

[Kublai Khan]

KK - how does that distinguish me from being scum or a lazy townie? Where is the distinction there that makes me scum?

Because you still haven't seen anything scummy in 10 pages of play? When are you going to pounce? Endgame?

I don't like how I get an Anti-town feeling from your posts.

What's wrong with you? When you vote for someone, have a reason. If that reason is something vague like "I get an Anti-town feeling", then quote something I said that was anti-town.

Also: Could you actually answer my question about who you roleblocked at some point? You can even refuse to answer if you want, just make me feel like you're actually reading the game.

Khan, my gorilla town-read comes mainly from his first post stating he had to go re-check his role PM, it reads as geninue and I'm willing to bet that mafia were talking in their QT throughout the night meaning I don't see any possible way he would forget his role as scum.

Seriously?

This might be a revelation to you but... *whispers* scum often lie.

Walking into the game before anyone else (even the spastic mastin2) and saying "I almost forgot my role. Hyuk Yuk" isn't, and should never be, a town-tell.

[Kublai Khan]

It reads as very geninue. It's not the sort of gambit that he would pull as scum and I know gorilla very well. We've hydra'ed together in multiple games.

Fine. I've never played with gorilla so I'll take your word on it.

@mastin2 - Post a fucking case or fuck off. Your braindead "if Khan votes for them, they must be a mislynch" auto-read strategy is bullshit.

[Kublai Khan]

@Khan: Why are you taking Reg's word, shouldn't you base your read on Gorilla's actions in-game? (Unless you have a town read on Sky, then that must be why you trust him)

If RegFan is sticking his neck out for gorilla. So..

gorilla-scum/Skyquiem-town pairing is very, very unlikely
gorilla-scum/Skyquiem-scum pairing is unlikely
gorilla-town/Skyquiem-scum pairing is possible
gorilla-town/Skyquiem-town pairing is possible

So gorilla isn't likely scum.

[Kublai Khan]

Good lord. Hey.

Hey. Thanks for joining Mastin Mafia. Apparently we're scum-partners.

Skyquiem - Ugh. Hydra. Your schizophrenic mystery posting makes you a very tough read. Head Two is clearly scummier than Head One. But I'm basing that on just generic tells.

By which head do you mean here?

Um.. I don't understand the question. Since RegFan is Head Two, you must be Head One, right?

Why is everyone ignoring the fact that Ranmaru has done basically F-all besides ask questions?

Because it's still more than what [winger] has done. You should vote for [winger].

My main FoSes atm are Deity and Kublai. They seem to have a fixed view on things... too fixed.

You claimed Vanilla Town on Day 1 with almost no pressure on you. Quit pretending like you know how to play mafia and sheep someone that knows what they are doing. Vote for [winger].

@everyone - How about we quit pussy footing around and get a wagon going?

[Kublai Khan]

If RegFan is sticking his neck out for gorilla. So..

gorilla-scum/Skyquiem-town pairing is very, very unlikely
gorilla-scum/Skyquiem-scum pairing is unlikely
gorilla-town/Skyquiem-scum pairing is possible
gorilla-town/Skyquiem-town pairing is possible

So gorilla isn't likely scum.

Can you explain how each scenario isn't/is possible? I don't really know anything about Reg so need your help.

Okay.. losing a little faith in you, Ranmaru. I'm feeling like I'm slipping into IC-mode here.

I posited a theory about gorilla being scum and lying about the "I almost forgot my role" thing. RegFan stepped up and put his reputation on the line to say that he knew gorilla well enough to know that gorilla-scum wouldn't perform such a gambit.

So if RegFan/Skyquiem is town, chances are he's honest and forthright about his read. The accuracy of the read could be wrong and we can revisit that later in the game in necessary, but right now it's strong enough for gorilla not to be the Day 1 lynch.

If RegFan/Skyquiem is scum, then the chances that they would stick their neck out and tie themselves to a fellow scummate this early into the game is pretty slim. But it's possible that they are buddying up to gorilla-town.

So overall, gorilla is more likely to be town then scum at this point. Got it?

[Kublai Khan]

You claimed Vanilla Town on Day 1 with almost no pressure on you. Quit pretending like you know how to play mafia and sheep someone that knows what they are doing. Vote for [winger].

First of all, I do know how to play mafia lol. I can find evidence, it's just that I have a hard time describing what I find.
Also, why vote for winger? How do I know that you're not really good scum either? :\

Read [winger]. Tell me why you think he's unworthy of a vote.

The fact is I'm not really good scum. I've only ever survived to win in endgame once as scum.

@Slaxx -
mastin2 (on Slaxx entry into the game): "Stalker "
Slaxx - "I have no meta on Mastin."

^ Why do those two quotes not make sense?

And how am I misguided?
Do you have a history with gorilla?

No, I did not. I am trying to compromise with Mastin because he is being dense.

BWAHAHAHAhAHAHAHAHAHahahhahHHHAHAH! *Gasp* HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA!

----------
inHimshallibe really needs a content post. More than one, really. Soon.

Also, I like how mastin2 knows there are 4 scum.

[Kublai Khan]

Read [winger]. Tell me why you think he's unworthy of a vote.

I'd like you to show me why I'm vote-worthy.

Actually, KK, that's pretty accurate. I'm just waiting for someone to do something scummy, then pounce on them.

Funny story. You know what's a great strategy for scum? To say as little as possible until someone else messes up, then they can jump on the bandwagon.

15 pages in and... you've "pounced" on me (OMGUS) with the reason of "following the obv-town".

So, to recap, you're OMGUSing, active lurking, & sheeping.

What's the town motivation for your actions? And who is the obv-town? mastin2?? Explain that read.

[Kublai Khan]

@mod: I seem to have access to my edit button in this thread. You might want to inquire about having that disabled.

[Kublai Khan]

Okay. So it's not final. It's not cemented as strongly as I would like. It makes more assumptions than I am comfortable with.

Khan, Hiraki, Ranmaru, and Slaxx seems like the only scumteam which makes sense in my head, with my notes compiled all together.

I'm feeling a little soft in the head right now, so...

How much of your scumreads on the other 3 depend on the (faulty) premise of "Khan is scum"? (i.e. in the event that you do flip town, how much stock should I actually put into your reads?)

@Slaxx - You didn't answer my other 2 questions.

[Kublai Khan]

And how am I misguided?
Do you have a history with gorilla?

[Kublai Khan]

I don't remember calling you misguided, but you are because your vote isn't on Ran. I don't know how people can ignore a case like that.

I'm not sold on the Ranmanu case. It seems like the case is based on style and not substance. But I'll re-read and see what I can see.

That said, Khan does have a lot of connections with the other three, connections I'll be pointing out. I didn't use them to form the conclusion for my scumteam, but I very easily could have.

Glorious, mastin2. Some people are just content to tentaively fence-sit and hope no one notices. You went and built yourself a throne on that fucker with giant neon signs.

@Mastin: How succesful have you been in calling scum teams on D1, Mastin? I fear that your call may not be accurate. I even still am iffy about your Khan read. You stallin?

Of course you fear my call might not be accurate, you're on the freakin' scumlist. My team makes perfect sense to me, but of all the names, Khan's the MOST mafia. I'm not stalling; simply have been preoccupied elsewhere. Slaxx, maybe Gorilla as well, will likely confirm.

Shit.

I think mastin2 caught something I didn't. mastin2 calls Ranmaru scum and she "feels it may not be accurate"? Shit. That may be an honest-to-goodness old-fashioned scumslip.

Shit. Shit shit shit. That may have been a game-changer comment and I may need to look past my mastin2 hate for a moment.

I can see Scott, mastin2, Ranmaru, and Khan as scum atm.

Mastin2 and Ranmaru have been tunneling eachother.

WTF? Are... are you trolling this game?

15 pages in and... you've "pounced" on me (OMGUS) with the reason of "following the obv-town".

So, to recap, you're OMGUSing, active lurking, & sheeping.

What's the town motivation for your actions? And who is the obv-town? mastin2?? Explain that read.

Town motivation is pretty simple here:

1) I started working my summer job, so I'm lazy, but I don't want to replace out, which explains the active lurking.
2) I'm not really OMGUSing as much as I am voting you because I think you're voting me for shit reasons.
3) I'm sheeping mastin2 because of #1 (which means I have little time to actually get reads) and because he's the most townie in my opinion.
4) mastin2 has been derailing wagons instead of joining them, which seems like a lot of work for scum to go through. He could've easily joined nearly any wagon by now and not gotten a second glance, but he didn't.

1&3 - If you just want to read along and are too lazy to contribute. Could I reccomend books? Nobody will vote for your and force you to post in a book.
4 - Really? You don't think that mastin2 would get a reaction of "HEY WHY ISN'T KHAN YOUR MAIN SCUM READ ANYMORE" if he moved his vote?
2 - That is OMGUS.

5? - Why are you voting for the Jailkeeper?
6? - You attack DeityKabuto for having shit reasons to vote, chastise Scott Brosius for expecting novel vote reasons, yet you think sheeping isn't a shit reason?
7? - What's your read on Ranmaru?


Also, I like Mana_Ku's case on Scott Brosius. It's solid.

Also KK, just resist the urge to edit your posts. Honor system plz. (by the way if I catch you editing your posts consequences will be dire. So...you know...just doublepost instead)

But.. Button is so... SHINY!

(yeah, yeah.. don't need to be told, just helping you out. Give us a vote count, though.)

[Kublai Khan]

Course I know he isn't accurate about me. I just fear he is inaccurate of CALLING THE WHOLE scum team like that with confidence on D1. That was my point. I don't care if he has me on his scumlist, he isn't looking for individual actions at all.

I have a really hard time believing this.

If he's wrong about you, why would you be worried about him being wrong about the others?

I know mastin2 is wrong about the scumteam. He's a braggart who has predicted half the game as being scum at one point or another. But the first time you are on that scum list, you worry that it's not 100% accurate instead of calling it bunk like a pro-town player.

DAMMIT NO.
I JUST OUTTED MY "LOL I AM NEWB" ALT.

LOL! LAL! LOL!

His meta in this game is a 180 degree change

...says the guy who just stopped pretending to be a newb on this very same page.

Shit, xRECKONERx,.. What am I supposed to with you? You did something stupid and illogical in the last game I played with you, but you turned out to be town. Now you reveal yourself to be faking a newb-alt for no reason other than to break the meta-funk you were in.

Now, a lot of my scum-read on you was based on the fact that you weren't reading as sincere lazy-newb-town. Now you've come clean and you're giving two contradicting message.

1 - Whoops! wasn't reading the game closely! Forgot DK Was JK! LOL!
2 - RisingPhoenix is scum!! I won't say why, instead let's see who is reading the game as closely as I am!

What the fuck.. it's like you're racing Ranmaru for the right to be lynched first.

P.EDIT:

Ranmaru just screams easy mislynch to me… but he’s a mislynch that can actually put up a fight and thus not make an attack/tunnel on him look like a big scummy lion eating a wounded gazelle (which is what the DeityKabuto lynch would look like).

So.... You think DeityKabuto is a really easy mislynch that scum would push and you were voting for him because....?

Spoiler: Cliff Notes for mastin2's tunnel

Scum-Khan is bussing one of his partners! Possibly both!

[Kublai Khan]

Just checking in on phone. Vacation is over. Travelling back by car from beautiful Delaware to crappy Florida. Expecting about 20 hours travel time then read/catchup/post.

[Kublai Khan]

hey. i'm back.

Vote: inHimshallibe

Scum.

Now, I'm all read up on the game, I'm not going to comment on every little relevent thing like I usually do since that would create a giant wall. So just ask what you want my opinion on and I'll give it.

Who is the MH part of the Skyquiem hydra?

[Kublai Khan]

Welcome back!

Thanks.

People

Scum and misguided town think that you should be the lynch for today, Kublai Khan.

Fixed.

[Kublai Khan]

xRECKONERx stole my of my thunder by posting the core of the reasons.

Re-read the end of Day 1 and focus on inHimshallibe's posts. (Note: All quotations are my paraphrasings)

- "Let's lynch Ranmaru!" (398)
- "RisingPhoenix is interesting, but let's lynch Ranmaru!" (488)
- "Hey Hiraki, don't you want to lynch Ranmaru?" (498)
- "Reck's case sounds like crap, but you guys are going to lynch RisingPhoenix anyways" (502)
- "Slaxx, aren't you opposed to lynching RisingPhoenix?" (504)
- "Hey Mastin, vote Ranmaru" (507)
- "Hey everyone, isn't Ranmaru scum for this?" (528)
- "Ranmaru is flailing scum" (563)
- "Don't wanna vote for RisingPhoenix" (570)
- "Don't wanna vote for RisingPhoenix" (572)

* xRECKONERx claims Mason with Ranmaru

- "(silence from inHimshallibe for over three hours)"

* xRECKONERx reveals it was a gambit, Ranmaru reveals a power role

- finally votes RisingPhoenix (691)

- starts pushing a case on me before the day is done
Note that inHimshallibe's case on me is crap. First, it's based on projection (i.e. he's ascribing to me the actions that he's done), second it's based on the fact that he can try for a speedlynch since I'm V/LA (can't defend myself) and can count on the support mastin2 (convincing him to move his vote off me was a Herculean task, so why not go along with the flow and blame mastin2 for the mislynch later?).

To anyone that thinks inHimshallibe isn't scum, answer me these two questions:

1) Why did he find my reaction to xRECKONERx's RisingPhoenix push notable (488) if he didn't already know that RisingPhoenix was scum (especially given his reluctance to vote RisingPhoenix himself)?
2) What town motivation exists for his piss-poor attempt to sully xRECKONERx's obvtown status in this game with his "Reckanoia" posts? (967, 985, 986)

[Kublai Khan]

People

Scum and misguided town think that you should be the lynch for today, Kublai Khan.

Fixed.

I'm still going to need that case from Mastin, but this is enough to warrant my vote. Not a Town response to a wagon, nope nope nope.

Hi. You must not know me.

(And add Mafia 96 to the list of games where scum-Mastin keeps promising a case, but never delivers it.)

[Kublai Khan]

^To clarify my 1033, that is OMGUS writ large, with little attempt to qualify or explain the counter-accusation or acknowledge any of the legitimate reasons those "misguided Town" might have for their votes.

PE: Actual responses have started, my vote may already be obsolete. I'll wait for KK's full reactions before removing my vote.

What "full reactions" are you waiting for?

inHimshallibe is voting me for scummy reasons (as outlined). mastin2 is voting for me for Mastin reasons. DeityKabuto is voting for me for Mastin reasons, but he's a claimed Jailkeeper (who has apparently failed to jailkeep anyone two nights in a row, so now he's giving me a headache). And Scott Brosius is voting me for scummy and vague "stuff that happened" reasons.

Am I missing anything?

[Kublai Khan]

I said that before reading 1034 fully. Looked mostly about Reck, so I was waiting for subsequent posts about others.

Still not fully caught up, but I've got a strong sense in my gut that {mastin, KK} is not Town vs Town. KK, since return, is being more helpful and forthright.

WTF?

Why are you voting if you're not fully caught up?
And (not that I'm looking for votes here but) when did helpfullness and forthrightness become town-tells?

[Kublai Khan]

So...Khan...you think I'm town? That what I'm seeing from your posts?

You've been evasive, unhelpful, spammy, dense, thick-headed, wrong, wrong, wrong, short-sighted, scatterbrained, malicious, slanderous, obtuse, dim, etc..

But you're not on my scumlist atm.

What do you think of inHimshallibe?

[Kublai Khan]

@mastin2:
Wow. Before I answered your question I asked myself "mastin2 couldn't be so simple-minded that he would make a logical fallacy argument, could he?"

Well, I guess I was wrong and I can add "simple-minded" to the list of things you are. Probably "pathetic" too.

So all I have to do is post one example of multiple people being wrong about something and you'll unvote, right? I mean, you have a case besides that right? It is Day 2, and you still haven't posted anything of substance beyond ten million different "these people are scum together" posts and "I have notes in my QT, let me tell you about how QTs work!" posts.

[Kublai Khan]

Additionally, Khan strawmans the argument:

So all I have to do is post one example of multiple people being wrong about something and you'll unvote, right?

The point is, multiple people believe Khan and I contains one scum. And I'm going to make DANG sure that those who have expressed said opinion,

follow that through

. No inHim distractions. No ScottBro excuses.

[/size=125]All the people who said that {Khan, Mastin} contains one scum are to follow through with it,

NOW

, or be called scum!

[/size]

First, you don't understand the meaning of the word strawman.
Second, WTF? Was that your plan this whole game? Continually antagonize me by calling me scum until you get enough people to say "well, they can't be scum together", then you jump into action and say "Ah-HA! If we're not scum together, then Khan must be scum alone!"?

That's... not scum-hunting. That's vindictive meta-punishing.

Third, what happens when I flip town? Do you have a mastin3 account lined up? (Because I'd love to be the one to cause you to have to activate it)

[Kublai Khan]

Third, what happens when I flip town?

You won't. But IF (and I repeat, this is a big "if") you did, I'd take full responsibility for it and accept the consequences of my misread.

So it's a personal vendetta then.

If it's not, then you'd post a case based when you first accused me of scum/voted me

Aw, fuck it. I'm generous. Here is your first post where you've become certain of my scumminess after I've actually posted something. Where is the case from that. You've fully coasted from that to this ultimatum. This antagonism between us is your design, not mine.

And for fuck's sake open your damn eyes from your narrow confines of your personal meta with me. I'm a dick to people who show poor logic whether I'm town or scum. You are not some special snowflake that gets some sort of individual attention from me. I can provide the links to prove it.

[Kublai Khan]

wrote:
So it's a personal vendetta then.

No, not at all.

It isn't?? He calls me scum before I post, then says my first post is scummy and links to it. No other commentary.

Who is antagonizing who, exactly?

[Kublai Khan]

What?

mastin2 built nothing up. His whole case is that he create a false dilemma between me & him because I embarrassed him as scum in a previous game.

This isn't fucking mafia at all.

[Kublai Khan]

Cases posted against inHimshallibe: 2
Cases posted against Kublai Khan: 0

Pine, it's Day 2 and page 44 and deadline's just around the corner. mastin2 isn't the lynch for today. Make a compromise.

[Kublai Khan]

What the fuck then?

Why did everyone say "No Wait! Let's wait for Khan to return! We need to hear his thoughts!" if you guys were just planning on stringing me up without giving a crap about what I say?

I've asked nicely several times for people to list exactly what they wanted to hear, but all I get is apathetic feelings. I 100% guarantee there is scum on my wagon. Silently whistling away and not trying to say too much before a hammer (any hammer) drops. The town on my wagon needs to start clearing themselves by posting a fucking case or any fucking content right now.

Because xRECKONERx will probably die tonight for being so obv-town and right and then this town is fucking doomed.

[Kublai Khan]

Hey, Khan, was 691 actually your first game? >_<
(Or was that 648--and if so, then why is 648 listed after 691?)

Um..

*headscratch*

.. I forget why. There doesn't seem to be any good reason. I guess just a general lack of strong adherence to chronological guidelines.

[Kublai Khan]

*headdesk*

I swear to God DeityKabuto, unless you're changing your claim then that means mastin2 is 50% scum.

The possible scenarios are thus..

If mastin2-town was the night-kill target, then I was being setup as the auto-lynch for today.
If mastin2-scum was the mafia killer, then I'm angry I couldn't bust him as such.

[Kublai Khan]

@ DeityKabuto -

vote: mastin2

That puts him at L-2.

[Kublai Khan]

I will probably be more prone to massclaim tomorrow if we hit scum today or stop a kill tonight (or both) in which case we can possibly confirm DK as town (as much as it pains me to do that).

I support this.

[Kublai Khan]

Oh, goddammit. I just noticed that mastin2 is V/LA until the 28th.

I'm going to re-read and go after secondary suspects.

[Kublai Khan]

For the record, nine alive tomorrow with 3 of them being scum means that tomorrow is the day before lylo. Khan's a free 'mis'lynch. Even if he's town (he's not), he needs to die tomorrow, because let's face it:
There's no way he'll ever be considered completely town.
In other words, IF he was town, he'd ALWAYS be right there, on the verge of being lynched, potentially costing the town the game. Hence, he should die tomorrow.

It occurs to me that the only reason that I'd never be considered town is because you've kept repeating "Khan is scum" in every second post in your meta-smear-campaign. You've never posted a case against me despite me & others asking repeatedly, and apparently you're now self-voting to try to get out of your obligation.

You've never considered for one second that we could be having a town v town dispute, you've only replied with certainty that one of us is scum. Which, in retrospect I should have picked up as your "noble, never lying" way of announcing that you're scum.

If (super small if) you are town, then this is by far the worst game you've ever played.

[Kublai Khan]

I like how mastin2 integrates none of the thinking of "why would mafia kill mastin2?" into his commentary.

It really helps divert attention away from the "apparently mastin2-scum thought he was safe making a kill" line of thinking.

So, yes. Since mastin2 is here. Let's turn the game focus about Slaxx, like he's suggesting. Because he's totally not pulling a diversion-ploy.

[Kublai Khan]

Town: We could always do this, my idea:

We Lynch Kublai Khan today, I target Mastin2 over the night and if noone dies, mastin is scum.

Are you mastin2's scum partner?

That is seriously the most retarded plan of action I've ever heard of. I feel dumber even having to explain it to you.

If you target mastin2 tonight, one of his partners will make the kill. Meaning that you'll clear mastin2 even though he's scum.

[Kublai Khan]

MASTIN2 - CASE ON ME. WHERE IS IT?

[Kublai Khan]

@DeityKabuto - Have you figured out how stupid your plan is yet?

P.Edit - Nevermind, follow Hiraki's advice.

[Kublai Khan]

The Khan case should be clear as day when I flip town, pretty much self-evident.

Because we are of opposite alignments? Yeah, I'm okay with that conclusion.

Contrast Khan. Who voted me in an opportunistic way. Who then continued to flail on about me being scum, an essential reversal on his opinion yesterday. His Motive is to get me dead, as quickly as possible. His Tone is scum, his Motive is from a scum viewpoint, he bleeds off scum in his every post.

Yeah, it's weird. It's like we have a near cop-guilty on you.

[Kublai Khan]

I'm smarter than DeityKabuto. My vote should count more than his. I hate this communist setup.

[Kublai Khan]

72.

That's the number of times that mastin2 called me scum. Seventy-fucking-two times. 3 of them were before I even posted in this game.

Did anyone bother to read the content of mastin2's posts? The read-through was worse than I originally remembered. He brought up a scumchat scenario based on his reading of how my scumchat went in a previous game. Some people noted that "Hey, it's really unlikely that both of those two are scum together", so he seized on that and insisted that this means I'm scum.

Because regardless of what mastin2's role was, his goal was to get my lynched in this game as a means of revenge.

So, Reck, Pine, whomever else... If you want to lynch me, then do because you think I'm scum. Not because "mastin2 kept calling him scum and he turned up dead, so Khan must be scum", because I'm damn sure that must have been the plot all along.

[Kublai Khan]

Late to the party...

setup was a bit townsided regardless

Yeah, I thought so too.

"If Reck hadn't been posting from a bullshit alt account, I might have been able to manipulate him properly from the get-go instead of getting caught with my fucking pants down. What a cheap fucking trick."

u mad KK?

I was at the time. If I knew you were in the game, you'd probably be the N1 Kill instead of Empking. Would have been a whole different game.

"xRECKONERx
- Damn good.
- Town Leader.
- Extremely hard to lynch.
- High priority NK target
- There's no useful strategy to counter Reck in this game except to stay off his tunelling gun sights."

<3

I have a lot of respect for all the town, actually (except DK). But you're stunt was amazing. Credit given where credit is due.