Mafia 110: Mafia in Hell, Michigan (Tied.)

[DedicatedScribe]

Kerri is quick like lightening and seized the first post! Your hands must be made of motorcycles!

Vote: DedicatedScribe

because scribes are learned and learned people make fun of Cirno! I hope you all will help me rid the world of him!

:O

You know me so well!

Hey, everybody! Look at Cirno! Isn't he so pudgy?

Alrighty. Semi-random question incoming.

@Everyone: If you are a cop with a guilty on Day 1, do you out yourself and risk getting NK'd or do you wait until you have minimum risk of being killed?

Not a very good question. No, I'd rather have a higher chance of being NKed.

[DedicatedScribe]

Oh. I only read 1st page. /fail.

Alrighty. Semi-random question incoming.

@Everyone: If you are a cop with a guilty on Day 1, do you out yourself and risk getting NK'd or do you wait until you have minimum risk of being killed?

I don't like PR questions. I don't see how they serve a purpse to get reads on players.

my question to everyone:
What is your view on policy lynching?

Do you think scum or town lurk more?

How active are you here at MS?

Policy lynching is bad. The fact that they exist, and are sometimes put into motion is good. It's like the reason Punishments for Breaking Rules were created. They exist to deter others from breaking said rules.

The lurkiness is based on the player, not specifically the alliance; however, more scum lurk than town.

I get superactive, and then go inactive while I'm currently playing 2-3 mafias ^^.

Unvote. Vote: Cirno.

*Everybody ha-ate's Cirno*

Anyways.

vote Musher333

This is me voting and feeling that I won't need to unvote for the rest of the day.

My fair Musher, I'm taking that pbpa scheduled for tomorrow as a promise.

***

Horrordude, I have great belief, is town. But...there's not much suspicion or attention, for that matter, against him right now, so I guess saying this is useless. His newbie-ness provides that he is more revealing of his emotions. And being thankful for being voted for...is a towntell for me.

So you don't have to read that:

Horrordude seems townie to me because he is a noob, and noobs tend to be more emotional. His second post thus makes me come to the aforementioned conclusion.

***

Crypto seems a little spammy. He doesn't post anything of value, and only replies to things, in that intelligent way you know he do without showing any sign of actually looking for scum.

FoS Crypto

***

Cirno, why do you play mafia? For how long?

Also, how does peoples know/think Cirno is an alt?

***

Oh my God I love this game already.

Fos RichardGHP

Loving mafia is for nerds.

I wish I had fun people to look forward to strategizing about antagonizing the town with, too.

***

Welcome to Hell, ladies and gentlemen.

Vote: Netopalis

for bringing us all to Hell.

You're funny. I hope you're scum.

Are you?

***

Why the unvote? Something is better than nothing.

noted.

***

Sorry for longpost. I do that...a lot, especially when I come to the computer with 5 pages to read, and 20 min of time.

[DedicatedScribe]

jesus didn't realize this was page 5. haven't read. I'll go back and find reasons ace is scummy or die trying.

lol

so who's online to tolerate my presence...

If policy lynches are never actually used they won't deter anything. It's clear that they're not used enough.

So true. But the debate is moot for now.

I want everyone to stick a kick-me sign on the one person here they find the most scummy.

[DedicatedScribe]

EBWOP: this is mostly for those who have no vote, unless your vote doesn't have much thought put into it.

[DedicatedScribe]

I'm hoping to see everyone post before I vote.

But then things will go so much more slowly...we have to wait for that one guy who came here on impulse, and then left to get replaced...you know what I'm talkin about.

why the wait? Haven't enough people posted? If everyone posts, will it increase the likelihood that you'll pick scum to target? Or are you looking for the most viable target for a mislynch?

(why the rushing?)

Because time can't be wasted. We've got things to do, places to see, and scum to kill, and I tend to believe such things can be done right now. Especially right now.

Things can be done right now. If we needed to wait, it would be N0 or pregame, and the mod wouldn't have started the day.

[DedicatedScribe]

If it takes too long for everyone to post once we have a host of problems, the least of which is my lack of a vote. Trying to paint my desire to see one from each player as aiming for a mislynch is a

bit of a

stretch.

obviously. If I were serious, I'd have a FoS or vote on you by now.

Let's rephrase.

Who is scummy now? Why are they scummy? What can we do to find the scummy while we wait for everyone else to post? Why am I hyperventilating?

Gimme some ideas. I'm as nooby as I sound. I've only finished one game before, and that's because I died the same night I subbed in.

[DedicatedScribe]

Can we get a little insight into this play style of his?

You can't tell me you've never played a game with lowell???

I'm hoping to see everyone post before I vote.

But then things will go so much more slowly...we have to wait for that one guy who came here on impulse, and then left to get replaced...you know what I'm talkin about.

why the wait? Haven't enough people posted? If everyone posts, will it increase the likelihood that you'll pick scum to target? Or are you looking for the most viable target for a mislynch?

(why the rushing?)

Because time can't be wasted. We've got things to do, places to see, and scum to kill, and I tend to believe such things can be done right now. Especially right now.

Things can be done right now. If we needed to wait, it would be N0 or pregame, and the mod wouldn't have started the day.

This is wrong. Game's that go fast/quickly usually result in a scum win, at least in my experience. Yes we should obviously not just sit around twiddling our thumbs waiting for people to post... but trying to have everyone pick the person they find most scummy on page 5 is like asking a bunch of eight year olds who they are in love with.

You act like its a hard choice. You can change your mind. But I agree with the rest.

I don't want the game to go fast, I want it to progress. Maybe I just need to take a nap and wait.

I'm not asking for a lynch, but a discussion. Not even a vote.

[DedicatedScribe]

He doesn't post anything of value, and only replies to things, in that intelligent way you know he do without showing any sign of actually looking for scum.

Yeah this isn't terribly reasonable an argument at this point.

That's why I haven't voted for him ^^

And its not unreasonable. 5 pages isn't really that little. We got out of the RVS pretty quickly.

[DedicatedScribe]

Crypto seems a little spammy.

Yeah, sometimes it gets a little out of control . . .

He doesn't post anything of value, and only replies to things, in that intelligent way you know he do without showing any sign of actually looking for scum.

We're a few pages into the thread. A lot of players haven't even chimed in yet. There's very little solid content to go off, and most of the time I don't consider myself a fan of the clumsy surveys players use to try to get out of RVS. That said, I've drawn up three (tentative) town reads—I'll share them if you want; I love sharing!—and I've argued against adherence to Lynch All Liars. I'm also getting mildly scummy vibes from horrordude.

Ta-da!

If happy to do it, then why didn't you just do it?

Anyways.

vote Musher333

This is me voting and feeling that I won't need to unvote for the rest of the day.

My fair Musher, I'm taking that pbpa scheduled for tomorrow as a promise.

Scribe why do you say the above in regards to your vote on Musher

This strategy on the wikia told me to. I'd like to see how it works out before it is cited.

Ok here is the player by player analysis, any players missed out of it means either they haven't talked, have only said an "I'm here message" or i have no read on.

Crypto - His answers seem quite short and non engaging in the topic, although he posts quite often he doesn't seem to put much detail in what he says which to me gives a slightly scummy feel as if he is trying not to say much incase he gives away information he doesn't want to.

Cirno - Talks in an odd way, seemingly due to playstyle. Similarily to Crypto she doesn't seem to be posting in much detail however her answers also don't seem to be helping aid the discussion along which gives a scummy vibe to me.

FoS Cirno

.

Dedicated Scribe - Voted without giving a reason and said they feel they will have no reason to change their vote for the rest of the day. Without giving a reason this makes no sense to say so a reason would be nice.
Also talks about not waiting and wanting to get ahead with the day as soon as possible, rushing is never a good idea as it gives a bigger chance of a mislynch before we have gathered enough information.
Gives a slightly scummy vibe at the moment.

Ythan - Talks a fair amount and seems to ask the right questions of people, at the moment he gives a pro town vibe to me.

This hasn't included many players but it has included the players i felt i should comment on. If i have missed anyone out you want to know my feelings on ask and i'll write an analysis on them.

My whole vote on you is a based on a really bad itch, if you know what I mean. Your pbpa doesn't cure the itch, since it doesnt seem committed.

In fact...nothing you say seems to be committed. I scrolled up and typed this in after I re-read the thread. I'll restate it in a slightly smaller wallpost if need be.

I'm withholding my judgment on your analysis of Crypto, but the word you're looking for, contributing without actually contributing, is active lurking.

Why did you FoS Cirno but not Crypto?

The difference between the two, it seems to me, is that Cirno is more of a distraction.

EBWOP:
@Whoever said I was on thin ice: Way to post inane fluff. Though, it doesn't really bother me at all.

Players 4, 10, and 16 are on thin ice.

Attacking a case on you that wasn't even ever made and then saying it doesn't even bother you. I believe that you are scum.

vote RichardGHP

Now that you've voted before everyone posted, tell me more about your attack on Richard. I know this can't be the only point.

FoS: WRP_Beater

for his convenient and timely entrance.

In actuality, it isn't timely or convenient, as he's getting votes right now O.o

His join date kinda removes this point, however. Ill also

FoS WRP_ Beater

.

14. DedicatedScribe

- Got a good vote from his P113. Nothing particularly good about it. But I like the analysis (the serious bits. I do not condone insulting nerds.)

Yay, I matter.

Players 4, 10, and 16 are on thin ice.

inane – adjective
lacking sense, significance, or ideas; silly


fluff – noun
something of no consequence

EBWOP:

@Whoever said I was on thin ice: Way to post inane fluff. Though, it doesn't really bother me at all.

Well, if Ythan's post were really "something sily & of no consequence which lacks sense and/or significance," then you wouldn't bother to go look up which players correspond to the numbers he was looking to. Nor would you bother responding to the post once you realized it was referring to you. It was Ythan's post indicating players who in his mind were rather scummy. Basically you respond to a post which essentially had no case, (other than saying you were scummy) call it dumb, (at least that seems the most logical interpretation of "inane fluff") and then say you don't care about it. Then you continue to talk about not caring about it.

You see the problem there?

For that and also for post 193,

unvote, vote:RichardGHP

.

JB, why that specific non-poster?

Not exactly sure, I guess I wasn't really paying close attention and thought pretty much everyone else had posted.

Unvote. Vote: WRP_Beater.

Why, out of curiosity?

8. JBernier93

- I have a feeling our views are just going to have to differ Re: this. I personally find voting, and putting pressure, at an early stage not a bad thing.

It wasn't so much the timing as the fact that the act which horror voted for was, IMHO, not nearly scummy enough to warrant a vote. But, we shall agree to disagree.

It's always fun to use the dictionary to explain an attack. Now it makes perfect sense. or this one does, at least.

mushman, I might have to save you for later.

@crypto - Could you please explain your vote in Post 43? Was it about the whole alt thing?

Yes. It was a joke. My first serious vote was the vote for horrordude. That FOS sticks, but Beater needs to straighten up.

Your first serious vote was off of vibes? Really?

Fos: crypto

The only reason why I don't have a vote on you is because Richard is a lot scummier right now IMO

So was mine ^^.

The early serious votes tend to have this quality. I trust my vibes. As of such, that isn't a scumtell at all. Rather, this post could be a good example of a bad attempt at setting up a mislynch. so,

FoS Horrordude

.

But even though some others are scummy, I don't feel that big of an urge to vote you just yet ^^

Why, out of curiosity?

Asshattery. He has yet to post content and when he chimed in we were well beyond the brush-off-criticism-with-a-joke stage.

his join date is within the past 30 days, isn't it reasonable to think he has no idea what the hell he should say?
When I first started playing mafia, my posts where highly similar to his, in that they had no content in them and consisted of dumb things.

Lynch out to straighten him out.

Or we can try actually looking for scum?

Why do you assume newbs aren't scum?

Scum instantly have more information than vanilla townies as they know who is scum (and in a game with basic roles) who is town. This information can expose them if they comment on someone with something that makes it sound like they know the side that person is part of.

Meh. Scum can generate in-depth content just fine in my experience.

I think newbs have a different set of scumtells they periodically exemplify. I'm always a little scared to lynch a noob, b/c they slip when they ARENT scum, often, too.

Then one you're attacking for being based on a vibe.

How am I attacking him? I just said that I find it shady that he has a vote based on "vibes"

Lol. You said he was the second most scummy person alive this Day 1, and FoSed him. That is, in fact, the action we call "attacking".

@DedicatedScribe: Why did you feel the need to tell us you probably would not move your vote? Also, why do you feel you may not move it? (Please note, these

are

two separate and disctinct questions. Please answer both. Thanks!) Oh, and third question: Why the rush to lynch?

I can answer both succinctly. I said it, but didn't necessarily mean it. I said it because the wiki told me it would be a good idea to make the target feel like I'm his stalker. For the remainder of the game, unless I decide he's town, I will be his stalker ^^. I do trust my vibes.

You know, I've played in 6 mafias, 5 playing right now, 2 in MS. But I've never survived till the end . I know tactics, but if I'm scum I'm never able to resist pressuring. Believe me, if I was scum I'd do something wrong under pressure.

You sure would. I already FoSed you in this post I think.

Doubt he is scum, scum wouldn't be stupid enough to post something like that surely.

Nope, no townie vibes just yet

Richard and Mr. Beater are on my more realistic hitlist for today. Shall we?

unvote; vote WRP_Beater

I don't know why I'd rather vote Beater. Mainly because I feel the attack on him is more easy to understand, and the one on Richard could be sensationalized. I don't have enough time to look on that, so I'll go with the simpler choice.

The votes also piled on Richard more quickly. Some event on another website has brought me to always go with the slower very-viable wagon.

[DedicatedScribe]

Hmmm...I still want to say I see Richard as (bad) town. None of his mistakes seem major, but subsequent.

His first question is wrong to ask, but I can see a bad townie asking it.

As for the tunnel vision thing...could someone enlighten me on its scumhood?

My main question if you want my vote on Richard:

How long has he played this game? How good it he at it?

[DedicatedScribe]

Ythan finds ME scummy? How interesting.

I dont have time to rered right now, but I'll

V/LA THIS WEEKEND

I'll still try to be active during this time, as i have a [rather inadequate] mobile device.

[DedicatedScribe]

Hello, all.

Faulty wifi has rendered me inactive, but I`m back now. Lemme re-read the thread and come back to you.

[DedicatedScribe]

Richard's outdoing himself in the scum department.

Unvote: WRP_Beater. Vote: RichardGHP.

Alright this is the second time you flipped your vote with lack of reasoning and following.

unvote:
vote: SK

I saw you do this with WRP and now richard. It reminds me of opportunistic scum tactics I have seen too often. Jumping from one BW to the other.

Very good point.

FoS SK

If only you all knew how much my head is hurting right now after a huge collision with my palm.

Claim time.

<--------------------

Watcher

Everybody unvote now. kthxbai.

I'm sorry, but It'll take a while for me to believe this.

Scum-O-Meter

0.1 Ythan
0.1 Dedicated Scribe
0.2 Nobody Special
0.3 molestargazer
0.3 farside22
0.4 RichardGHP
0.4 jbernier93
0.4 Lowell
0.4 Rikenslope
0.5 RayFrost
0.5 Musher333
0.5 Cirno
0.5 Dr.Cyanide
0.6 pman5595
0.6 septL
0.6 ace5993
0.6 WRP_Beater
0.7 SaintKerrigan
0.8 horrordude0215

I'm finally doing okay, and then you give me a .1 rating? Why?

FoS: DedicatedScribe for this wiki gambit thing. I wrinkle my nose at you, Sir.

Tell me more.

If only you all knew how much my head is hurting right now after a huge collision with my palm.

Claim time.

<--------------------

Watcher

Everybody unvote now. kthxbai.

Why do you have be such an ass about everything you do?
It's not helping. at all.

The question is, does Mr. Richard do this consistently?

How safe a fake claim is watcher for scum?

Mildly creative. Any way we can test if he's legit? If not I am not inclined to remove my vote.

I have some ideas, but not sure if I shouldn't keep them to myself.

How is it role fishing when he's already claimed?

Someone else has to claim.

Not a very good question. No, I'd rather have a higher chance of being NKed.

Make this make sense.

why the wait? Haven't enough people posted? If everyone posts, will it increase the likelihood that you'll pick scum to target?

Or are you looking for the most viable target for a mislynch?

This wasn't explained satisfactorily.

Hmmm...I still want to say I see Richard as (bad) town. None of his mistakes seem major,

but subsequent.

What does this mean?

unvote
vote DedicatedScribe
HoS RichardGHP

Given the flimliest of excuses I will move my vote back.

Not a very committed vote.

1. The second sentence is sarcasm.

2. Bold part was just banter to get a interesting response. The idea is, "Maybe he wants to wait for everyone to post so that he can choose from the WHOLE player list for a townie to attack!"

3. His mistakes seem stupid, and numerous, but not scummy enough to get my vote with intent to lynch. I wonder if I'll turn out to be right.

Watcher is a normal role. I don't like how Ythan's pushing this lynch.

He isn't. He's just raging.

7)

fos scribe

. Just a thought. I guess I don't get the purpose of that long-ass post just to vote for the obvious candidate and FOS the other obvious candidate.

O.o I was just re-reading the thread and posting my thoughts as I go. I'm sorry that I didn't vote for someone juicy. I voted for who I thought was scum when I finished re-reading the thread.

suggest Scribe in the library with the candlestick

Tell me more. I certainly wasn't doing anything wrong in said library. I was only reading a few...graphic novels.

How interesting.

Explain.

It interests me O.o

I sure do, and I sure hope you're able to defend yourself while you're gone.

I think you've unvoted me by the time I've posted this. Your attack doesn't really convince me that I've done that terribly wrong thing that gets me mislynched every other game I play on MS.

I don't wish to indicate that Beater gives me any town reads whatsoever BUT that wagon has the most people on it and I'm hoping to get DS lynched today because I do get a scum read on him so here goes.

What was Beater done that was scummy?

I wanna know the scumread. Nao.

So, Ythan, you feel that DS is far scummier than Beater?

I also see that DS moved his vote from musher (rememebr the vote that he was "sure" he wouldn't be moving? Yeah.) onto Beater.

Potential scum-team? Dunno, thinking out loud here.

Thoughts?

(If you remember the post, why'd you ask the question? Uh oh. Was that one of those I-wasn't-supposed-to-answer things?)

I explained the musher thing very completely O.o

I get a scummier read on DS.

I don't see any indication that DS and Beater are scum together besides their individual tells.

Why did I ask what question? Why did I ask the Beater wagon what was scummy about him?

Really? I don't understand.

Alternatively, if anyone wants to join me on the musher wagon, there's plenty of room. To me he's the perfect D1 pressure case. He's relatively inactive, and when he is active he's been scummy. Don't be fooled by the fact that others post MORE and therefore have MORE scummy posts. Scum hide like whoa in big games like this, so you've got to see past the super-actives

swining

their dicks around.

swining? Oh, and itulduso.

Or maybe I'm town telling the truth about my role.

Well, I doubt this for several reasons. Let's analyze your claim:

<--------------------

Watcher

Not a bad claim. It's a normal role. However, it's a bit hard to prove, since someone lying could guess that someone hadn't been targetted or something.

If I was Vanilla Townie/any other town role, why the hell would I fakeclaim a power role?

I dunno. Regardless of how much sense it makes, people do it.

And if I'm scum, wouldn't I want to go for something more obvious like cop or doctor?

But then you'd be counterclaimed.

Also, sorry, but I don't do pressure votes, nor do I respond to them. If I haven't said much up until now a few votes, maybe even a large wagon, isn't going to make me contribute any more than I am at the moment.

Actions speak louder than words, and your actions certainly state this isn't the case.

I like you, these points, pizza.

Town fakeclaims in order to stay alive. Claiming vanilla townie won't save you from a lynch.

Watcher is one of the safest power roles to claim.

Why are you trying to lynch a Town PR?

obv he doesn't think he is.

Ray do you think scum was given a list of possible safe claims or do you think the watcher claim is fake?

Strange Q.

Okay, what vibes from me are scummy?

Smiley in this posts reads to me as attempt to reduce the impact of the case indirectly.

^^ I'm a fan of this tell actually.

I don't see townies less likely to do this.

Why, out of curiosity?

Asshattery. He has yet to post content and when he chimed in we were well beyond the brush-off-criticism-with-a-joke stage.

his join date is within the past 30 days, isn't it reasonable to think he has no idea what the hell he should say?
When I first started playing mafia, my posts where highly similar to his, in that they had no content in them and consisted of dumb things.

Lynch out to straighten him out.

Or we can try actually looking for scum?

BUT WHAT HAPPENS IF HE IS SCUM. Also your defense here is noted in my little red book.

richard's really fucking scummy btw.

I love these replacement guys we keep getting.

@WRP_Beater: You might be new, but you came in at exactly the wrong moment. Can you give us some thoughts on the game? Or mafia in general? Or, really, anything?

Yes, I'm new

here

. You know, I've played in 6 mafias, 5 playing right now, 2 in MS. But I've never survived till the end . I know tactics, but if I'm scum I'm never able to resist pressuring. Believe me, if I was scum I'd do something wrong under pressure, but don't misunderstand: I'm not forcing you to pressure me . So, I won't claim right now, even if I see I look suspicious.

Daykill WRP_Beater

YES! This is why WRP is scummy, not that stupid "convenient timing" thing.

Oh right there wasn't any night 0 O_O
Anyway Riddick, why did you day kill me without even asking once for a RC? Anyway, I am (or at least was) a VT. I win with the town. Also, I know now you can't cancel the day kill. Believe me, I'm a VT. Why would I lie when I am daykilled? You've just wasted a daykill.

Lol. I usually don't take Day kills seriously till they happen. I like how you use day kill so repeatedly/"convincingly here.

Oh right there wasn't any night 0 O_O
Anyway Riddick, why did you daykill me without even asking once for a RC? Anyway, I am (or at least was) a VT. I win with the town. Also, I know now you can't cancel the daykill. Believe me, I'm a VT. Why would I lie when I am daykilled? You've just wasted a daykill.

I think I've caught scum here, actually.

'Why would I lie when I'm daykilled' why did you even say that?

Vote Wrp beater

I'll see can I save my daykill for another time.

Lololol.

Between two scummy players, one of whom has a claimed a PR, I'd rather kill the other and let the scum use a NK on the claimer if he's real.

Two problems with that. The WIFOM of scum NK'ing Rich, and how your vote doesn't reflect this response.

The problem is that I have to weigh two possibilities. Lynch Rich or someone else. If Rich is scum as seems more than 50% likely to me, a lynch is good. We hit scum, we don't have to worry about WIFOM when he's alive tomorrow. If he's not, we kill a somewhat useful PR. If we lynch someone else and Rich is scum then there's that WIFOM when he survives, even if we do hit another scum player (which doesn't seem overtly likely to me at the moment). If he's town we keep the PR. Nobody else seems terrible guilty to me right now.

I hadn't even defended myself yet O.o

Something tells me that Riddick's daykill was a test on WRP. and needless to say, he failed miserably.

Vote: WRP_Beater

A test? I think it makes WRP seem more nooby. If he's scum, why does he continue to rely on this noob facet?

Thinking on this, I'll

unvote WRP_Beater

at this point. Don't call me contradictory.

EBWOP:

unvote; vote: WRP_Beater

I bet you're happy.

EBWOP:

unvote; vote: WRP_Beater

Ctrl+ F reveals no mention of this guy all game. Was the last few pages convincing enough to go from not worth a mention to vote worthy? What in particular stood out to you that you felt he should be voted.

This looks like an 'Anyone but me' situation.

Whether town or scum, I'd do this, too.

Point of interest, Kerrigan, Dude, and Richard are all on the Beater wagon.

Ok, I'll pay some more attention to horrordude after this post.

Wow

Lynch me if you want, you'll just be 1 less villager away from winning. Of course, I know crypto's been out for my blood since the beginning of the game, mainly without reason, and my lack of sleep when posting that just gave him an opportunity to go in for the kill

As for my defense, I can only claim noob. I still am getting used to the site and sorry if my strategy is flawed or whatever

Unvote

until I can get a chance to reread and see if anyone is particularly scummy.

I remember when I as a town once did this. I got lynched. Ima check your meta, too.

my lack of sleep when posting that just gave him an opportunity to go in for the kill

Lack of sleep is your excuse for saying, "Something tells me that Riddick's daykill was a test on WRP. and needless to say, he failed miserably"?

No, lack of sleep is my excuse for misreading the situation.

I don't feel like explaining myself to you anymore... It's not like it'll change your mind. I could claim cop and you'd still try and lynch me

I don't like the quip about cop claiming.

Did Farside just claim VT or just town?

Just town.

I think VT

You should stop talking.

XD

Did Farside just claim VT or just town?

Should you really be asking this question?

horror I expect an answer for my question

Richard don't think becuase you claimed watch you can slide by with that vote.

fos: richard

The answer is no, right? I didn't see anything that makes you to be vanilla.

FoS Ythan

A little weird during my departure..

[DedicatedScribe]

sigh. It won't let me do the pbpa on horrordude from my school's computer.

Horrordude, why aren't you trying to defend yourself?

[DedicatedScribe]

EBWOP:

Cirno, why is your vote on me?

[DedicatedScribe]

*yawn* I hate the end of a day.

I seem to be unable to read Horrordude's posts like I wanted to...

I ISO'd Crypto... my main suspect, and made a list of his actions.

ISO 1: Vote RayFrost - Random Vote, nothing scummy about that
ISO 5: Unvote RayFrost, Vote Cirno - Over an alt. issue... I'll let that one pass because I think it was probably a joke
ISO 13: Get's "midly scummy vibes" from me - I call bullshit on that one
ISO 14: Unvotes Cirno, Vote me - Based on the "Mildly Scummy Vibes"
ISO 21: Tries to convince Ythan to wagon on me
ISO 22: Ythan doesn't, so he reposts the same bullshit post
ISO 30: Unvotes me, votes Beater - Doesn't give a reason for it
ISO 31: Asks why saint unvoted me, when he unvoted me 1 post before that
ISO 41: Seems to be trying to rush the lynch
ISO 46: Unvotes Beater, Votes Richard - I like this move, but I think he did it because of the pre-existing bandwagon
ISO 49: FOS Ythan... no reason for that
ISO 57: FOS Saint... gives saint shit about bandwagoning when he is doing it as well
ISO 61: Unvotes Richard, votes me based off of his magic "Scum Chart"
ISO 75: FOS Cyanide for a dumbass reason.

And with that

Vote: Crypto

maybe he's distancing! (not very serious comment)

[DedicatedScribe]

EBWOP: oh nvm, it's here. Brb if I have enough time to get everything together.

[DedicatedScribe]

lol thanks for the vote!

Oh yea. I remember this. I called it a towntell.

However, I don't like that farside is avoiding the PR question... while it may not give us much to go on, anything is useful at this point.

Unvote and vote farside22

This shows horrordude to be inexperienced. Noted.

Um.. and I think this is about the only time in the game where premature votes are acceptable.

That's what I thought, although that could just be my newbiness talking

Ah, the ol' crying "noob" strategy. A thread should be pinned somewhere so new guys will understand its ineffectiveness.

Horrordude, why did you feel the need to explain that anything was better than nothing before voting?

I'm confused by the question... could you rephrase it please?

It seems that he said it so he wouldn't be persecuted for voting for such flimsy reasons.

EBWOP:

Unvote

Not scumtell, but noobtell...

I just did a reread, and right now I have a slight FOS on Richard. While I know I was encouraging people to answer his question (and I'm sure I'll draw fire for this), I find his question rather scummy, in hindsight. It seems like he wants to find out what would happen if a cop WERE to investigate him and get a guilty read.

I think horrordude learned something. This would explain the contradiction. I don't see him as scummy still at this point.

Okay, what vibes from me are scummy?

Smiley in this posts reads to me as attempt to reduce the impact of the case indirectly.

Or maybe I just like smileys!

Ythan, why do you believe this is a scumtell?

Btw, horrordude, gimme that link you offered.

EBWOP: Make that GHP, not GHIP.

Horrordude is very fond of smileys. Even when not related to an attack on him.

@crypto - Could you please explain your vote in Post 43? Was it about the whole alt thing?

Yes. It was a joke. My first serious vote was the vote for horrordude. That FOS sticks, but Beater needs to straighten up.

Your first serious vote was off of vibes? Really?

Fos: crypto

The only reason why I don't have a vote on you is because Richard is a lot scummier right now IMO

Then one you're attacking for being based on a vibe.

How am I attacking him? I just said that I find it shady that he has a vote based on "vibes"

Restatement: You attacked him: you FoSed him, and called him the second most likely scum in the game.

Richard is still my #1 suspect for scum right now, and his responses to the pressures on him seem to support my theory. As of right now, I think he's the best lynch

Horrordude, is this in reply to something?

He was suspicious and when Richard became the wagon, he votes, and then unvotes when called out AGAIN.

I was suspicious of Richard... I still am (slightly). However, I didn't unvote when called out, I unvoted when he claimed a PR... sorry if I don't like lynching important roles

Valid defense.

You still unvoted earlier in the thread when called upon

Please show me that post

Your original vote on Richard seems to me as an attempted distraction from your wagon.

I didn't pay too much attention to my wagon, because I didn't think that it would happen. (Just a feeling I had) My vote on Richard was legit

Also, why do you believe Richard's claim?

This has already been said by others. He seemed really eager to prove us wrong on his wagon, so his claim sorta makes sense. And it's more of a precaution than anything

Still valid.

y r u so skumy

I'm scummy because I temporarily took my vote off of a claimed PR? Are you trying to get me lynched?

Vote: Crypto

OMGUS?

Not OMGUS... I have a reason for voting for him

Not OMGUS...Ythan, really? I suppose it could be a disguised OMGUS. So no matter.

Wow

Lynch me if you want, you'll just be 1 less villager away from winning. Of course, I know crypto's been out for my blood since the beginning of the game, mainly without reason, and my lack of sleep when posting that just gave him an opportunity to go in for the kill

As for my defense, I can only claim noob. I still am getting used to the site and sorry if my strategy is flawed or whatever

Unvote

until I can get a chance to reread and see if anyone is particularly scummy.

my lack of sleep when posting that just gave him an opportunity to go in for the kill

Lack of sleep is your excuse for saying, "Something tells me that Riddick's daykill was a test on WRP. and needless to say, he failed miserably"?

No, lack of sleep is my excuse for misreading the situation.

I don't feel like explaining myself to you anymore... It's not like it'll change your mind. I could claim cop and you'd still try and lynch me

These both are terrible defenses, which is why votes continue to pile onto you. Understand? Even the weakest of attacks (and I'm not calling the attack weak, as I'm only reading the ones Horrordude has quoted) gain power if the defense against them is terrible.

Something tells me that Riddick's daykill was a test on WRP. and needless to say, he failed miserably.

Vote: WRP_Beater

Why do you think this?

Well looking back, of course I don't think this any more... I was half asleep when I read through, and I was an idiot and didn't read through again before I posted

Certainly idiotic (sorry). I dunno about this one. I'm sure votes came on you because of that attack.

If someone would be glad to explain the reason for the bandwagon on me, that'd be great.

There's an issue over a smiley that I used... I used it because he said that I was giving him "mildly scummy vibes". I asked the question and used the smiley because in my opinion, I hadn't done anything to warrant those vibes.

Horrordude, why aren't you trying to defend yourself?

I'm trying, but it's not working so well. I misread one situation and casted a vote on it, which I promptly unvoted because of it, and suddenly I'm more suspicious than anyone else. Basically, I know I'm about to be lynched, and it doesn't matter what I say, everyone's gonna gang up on me anyways.

I will however, make a case on Crypto in a minute.

Sigh. You seem to understand a big point of the attack pretty well, but not its scale.
And making a case on Crypto doesn't help...its outwardly trying to divert attention.

Re: Horror's Case

Iso. 5: A joke vote during RVS is not something you righteously "let . . . pass." It is, after all, a joke vote during RVS.
Iso. 13: Why? Gut reads are scummy? Congratulations! You've just condemned every player on this site who plays by any degree of gut at all whatsoever—which is nearly every person on the site.
Iso. 21: Yes, and your problem is . . . ? Why are you only opposed to wagons when they (attempt to) land on you?
Iso. 22:
Iso. 30: Voting without reason is not a scum tell. Nice try.
Iso. 31: I assume you are calling me a hypocrite—by implication, at least, because you apparently don't have the nerve to make the case outright. Huh. So I'm not allowed to ask someone why they did something, just because I did the same thing? You're not a big fan of scum hunting, are you?
Iso. 41: If you say so.
Iso. 46: Why do you like the move? What does your liking this specific move have to do with my alignment? Why do you think I just did it for the wagon? Was my reason not good enough? Why is doing it for the wagon a scum tell (in this situation)?
Iso. 49: That was a facetious FOS, and it was explained. Do your homework.
Iso. 57: I didn't wagon mindlessly like he did. I also didn't focus solely on players being wagoned, as you

just

proved by castigating me for voting for you: I was the only one who took that much interest in your scumminess.
Iso. 61: You don't think I have reasons?
Iso. 75: Why is it a dumbass reason?

Speaking of cases, reasons, and bandwagons, what the hell have you been doing all game? I'm looking through your iso. and I'm not seeing much.

HYPOCRITE!!1!

Even better is that you haven't done much until

now

. Waiting till you've got a rapidly growing wagon on you to make your case and then doing it on the guy who's been pushing your lynch all along . . . well, you know where I'm going with this.

ISO 5: I wasn't trying to imply that, so don't try and make it seem that way
ISO 13: I wasn't trying to say that Gut reads are scummy... I'm just saying that I hadn't done anything do deserve that read
ISO 21: I don't mind wagons on me most of the time... I was just saying it was a bullshit thing to try and say that Ythan is suspicious of me, when I didn't see any hint of it at all previously
ISO 22: What? It was a redundatant statement... I think that Ythan had saw it and then chose to ignore it.
ISO 30: It may not be a good scum tell, but it's not a very pro-town thing to do, don't you think?
ISO 31: I was calling you a hypocrite. Why you didn't ask yourself the same question, because if you did something and then asked a question of someone who did the same thing, why shouldn't you have to answer the question? (I think that question made sense... if not tell me and I can rephrase it)
ISO 41: "Why isn't he dead yet?" Nope, that's not trying to convince people to bandwagon, is it?
ISO 46: You ask a lot of questions.
1. I like the move because I think that Richard is scummy as well, and therefore I would support a Richard Lynch.
2. It doesn't have anything to do with your alignment... I probably should have left my feelings out of it.
3. I think you did it because you were going to try and get a mislynch (or you were bussing).
4. I didn't see you really give a good reason.
5. See number 3
ISO 49. Looking back, I agree with you there. Exclude that one from the list.
ISO 57: You took an interest in my scumminess? You admitted that you didn't have any evidence to go off of!
ISO 61: You haven't really explained any good ones
ISO 75: You immediately dismiss the possibility that you are scum because, well, it's you. I'm not buying it

I'll address this separately if I have to, since I don't have hours of time here, thus my wall posts.

***

Horrordude, take a lesson from this mafia on defenses. You need work on that.

I still have to decide whether or not you are scum. Sorry gais. I don't want to take momentum from a wagon on scum, so let me think hard on this.

[DedicatedScribe]

Am I incorrect in finding that requests for replacement tend toward scum?

Yes... there's a lot of reasons that someone would replace out, the least of which would be that they got a scum role.

For the Ythan quote...where do you get this stuff(, Ythan)? I don't see any reason to agree with that.

Horrordude makes my point.

Shouldn't you be distancing?

What are your 3 biggest reasons for your vote on horrordude, and surety of his scumhood? I don't completely understand.

I don't have to worry about anything like that because I'm obv. town

Heh.

[DedicatedScribe]

EBWOP:

ah, sorry. People are reading my too big post.

Somone teach me how to link to specific posts?

[DedicatedScribe]

Glad to/hope I help(ed).

And thx for the info.

Ythan, I asked for the top 3 reasons you believe horrordude should be lynched today.

I also asked why you thought smilies was a scumtell, especially since horrordude abuses them throughout most of his posts.

Horrordude, I also asked if one of those posts I quoted was in reply to something.

[DedicatedScribe]

Meh. I am not going to join the horrordude wagon...for now.

[DedicatedScribe]

i have some statistics on flakers, but not really helpful to town atm.

Ythan, my Q's?

I'll read ur isos once I am no longer mobile.

[DedicatedScribe]

Okay, what vibes from me are scummy?

Smiley in this posts reads to me as attempt to reduce the impact of the case indirectly.

I disagree with the assumption that the use of smilies by horrordude is a scumtell, as he always uses smilies.

Even more so, town can try to reduce case impacts just as often as scum.

Also, horrordude, I hope you learn to stop using smilies.

Or maybe I just like smileys! :Wink:

It's a very simplified defense to your attack <.<

I wasn't questioning H Dude for explaining his vote, but for framing it as less than completely serious.

Also, no pressure about smilies in general. Pressure about what I read (present tense, still do) as trying to undermine the case on him without really addressing it.

1st part, is valid.

2nd part, invalid.

OMGUS?

Yes, it was OMGUS.

Explain the post 142 attack on horrordude, please.

Your isos aren't enough for me.

Again, could you just sum up the 3 main reasons you believe so profusely that horrordude is scum?

I want to be sure before its too late and I have to wagon for fear of no lynch.

[DedicatedScribe]

EBWOP:

Anyone not voting for Dude, explain to me how a single bit of his argument holds up.

Already did...before the above post. Refute them all if you could.

Tell me how the use of smilies is a valid scumtell.

[DedicatedScribe]

Sigh.

In the mafia horrordude was previously in, his smiley usage during the time he's been in this mafia is currently 100%. I feel that is to help his smiley meta.

Other than that, he used 1 smiley, of a total of 6 posts. (1/6)

In this mafia, so far he has made 80 posts. 22 (I think) of these used smilies... (1/4)
I do believe you incurred him to use smilies even more often, for one reason or another.

And then...I look at his posts in the Mafia Discussion, where players post w/o fear of pbpa or metagaming.

These are the ones I found, by scrolling through:
http://www.mafiascum.net/forum/viewtopic.php?t=13372

No smilies, just his posts. So I'll attest some validity to that tell, considering horrordude.

I can't compare his activity in that game to this, due to the different situations that seemed to occur.

Hm...

[DedicatedScribe]

Yeah. Still don't agree with smiley theory.

Ythan, just...quickly convince me.

Mr. WikIMangagerguy- you have to get sober before getting on the internetz.

[DedicatedScribe]

Ythan and Horrordude- STFU. You guys are so annoying. And all Ythan is doing is distracting me from trying to get reads on people's alliance. DO you really think we'll lynch him because you keep on calling him mentally inept?

Dude, if all you're going to do is talk about how stupid everyone is just replace out so we can stop listening to you post inane bullshit for the next few hours before your lynch.

Scribe, If all you're going to do is say you're not convinced and tell me to do more you're going to stay disappointed. If you have any actual questions that's a different story but don't just try to ride other players to the finish line.

Where did this come from?

You said that you were going to do something...why do you change your mind?

What you call invalid is perfectly valid. I'll go look up that numbered post to simplify the other attack for you.

What I called invalid is invalid. And you said you were going to simplify the attack. Why not anymore?

He has and I have and make your own points rather than failing to use someone else's, scum.

Ahem.

Tell me how the use of smilies is a valid scumtell.

Again, could you just sum up the 3 main reasons you believe so profusely that horrordude is scum?

If you want to just leave it as is and see what the town thinks we can certainly do that. Are you sure?

This is good idea.

Well I know that I'm not going to convince you of anything, and quite frankly I'm tired of arguing with you. I'm fine with letting town decide, even if that means a lynch on myself.

Claim available on request. (Although I doubt you would believe me)

You claimed earlier O.o

If the player was any good they wouldn't be getting lynched day one and so there's no reason to forgo intelligent scumhunting to follow their half assed leads.

Sigh. This annoys me.

Do you know how to post anything other than spammy insulting inane bullshit? On the off chance that you are town I'd still prefer a lynch on you over anyone else in this game. Call it a get rid of the annoying jackass policy lynch.

Is your strategy to repeatedly post how stupid and annoying the attacked player is?

I think he broke the site.

Also my case was not about the smiley, that was one little piece he tried to conflate my attack with entirely.

Explain. Because it still seems as though its based on his use of smilies.

[DedicatedScribe]

Horror, you have to understand we have to lynch a vanilla claim right?

we don't have to >.>

Someone not Ythan, please, sum up the top 3 reasons you believe horror is scum.

Pman, you too?

[DedicatedScribe]

Damn. I think if horror is town, I'll be NKed.

Ythan and Horrordude- STFU. You guys are so annoying. And all Ythan is doing is distracting me from trying to get reads on people's alliance. DO you really think we'll lynch him because you keep on calling him mentally inept?

Yeah. And what's troubling you is that other players are not posting, not that we are.

Where did this come from?
You said that you were going to do something...why do you change your mind?

No I actually did it quite a bit ago.

Do you mean my post 142 in iso? He was just following a wagon with momentum without contributing anything of his own.

What I called invalid is invalid. And you said you were going to simplify the attack. Why not anymore?

Again you really need to provide something other than "No, no good." We're not mind readers you know. If you have a problem and it's real then detail it.

Again, could you just sum up the 3 main reasons you believe so profusely that horrordude is scum?

There's a point where even just repeating

references

to old posts where I did this is going to get old.

Sigh. This annoys me.

"When I die lynch this person" posts are probably the dumbest thing I have seen in my time on this site. Does anyone really think that we're losing out on a great analytical boon to town when he dies and that we need him to leave us some clues to follow?

Is your strategy to repeatedly post how stupid and annoying the attacked player is?

Strategy is over, scum has already been revealed.

Explain. Because it still seems as though its based on his use of smilies.

Are you serious. Just do this I'm not typing it up again.

Horror is my biggest read, the others have less evidence and more gut, so let's look at him for the moment and flesh out the cases on the others when he's dead. If it's not the least bit inconvenient iso me and look at posts 34, 36, 56, the bit of 92 about him, the bit of 105 about him, and the bit of 142 about him. It adds up. If you would like me to explain or elaborate on any little thing then by all means ask.

I said those weren't enough for me...

But if you insist that it should be, then I won't inquire further.

Again, could you just sum up the 3 main reasons you believe so profusely that horrordude is scum?

There's a point where even just repeating

references

to old posts where I did this is going to get old.

You listed a bunch of isos, none of which answered the question. I was looking for clarity. I asked again, because there wasnt enough clarity. Is this so hard to understand?

Is your strategy to repeatedly post how stupid and annoying the attacked player is?

Strategy is over, scum has already been revealed.

Yes, it's been revealed as you!

That's all I'm going to say on the matter. Now it's up for the rest of the group to decide who is the scummier party. I'll even admit that most people will probably vote for me for fear of NL, and I can accept that. I don't appreciate your constant attacks on my intelligence, however. Sure, I'm new and liable to make mistakes. However, don't treat me like I'm an idiot that doesn't deserve the air I'm breathing.

I signed up for this site because I wanted to have some fun playing the game of mafia. But people like you are the ones that ruin it for the rest of us, not basing your attacks on anything except that people are annoying and you don't want to hear them post any more. If you think I'm scummy, then just say it. Don't go on a 6 page bickering spree with me. And I know that I contributed my fair share to the problem, and I'm willing to apologize for that. However, I think that I deserve an apology from you as well.

That's all that I'm going to say. If anyone has any questions or comments for me, I'll be glad to answer them, but I don't want another repeat of the events that have occurred over the past few days.

Maybe we should just get this over with and see what comes of it.

If you're still trying to frame the case against you as being entirely about a smiley then you're not even doing your job as scum right.

In my opinion, you aren't doing well to counteract that. It really seems as though the smiley thing is the biggest point of your attack.

Okay post 34 is talking about the smiley - meh
post 36 more on the smiley and it can be taken also that he finds it funny that someone has scum vibes on him.

I wasn't questioning H Dude for explaining his vote, but for framing it as less than completely serious.
Also, no pressure about smilies in general. Pressure about what I read (present tense, still do) as trying to undermine the case on him without really addressing it.

I need an explaination on this. Please quote the vote this is in regards to. What case is he underminding if it's not the one from cryto on his vibes thing?

Post 105 is not OMGUS. I saw the comment stated and it was after horror unvoted so I see the question and the vote valid

92 I see more about the smilely issue. And I don't really understand this:

horrordude0215 wrote:
Sorta... I would've probably done the same thing if I were in your shoes, now that I know what your talking about lol
Despite the fact that you didn't know what I meant by attack you were still doing it so hanging onto this.

Reading the talks in regards to this post it's about your fos and what an argument is why is this something worth holding onto?

Where did he continue to do an argument? Was this in regards to crypto?

Most of this is basically what I've been saying.

How do you see that as distancing?

IC hat on

When ythan asked you about your reasoning you started to back down from it and then you said something was better then nothing, then unvoted like someone caught doing a bad thing.
He's talking about the actions you took and comments you made towards that vote.

Good point. Ythan, why can't you talk like this?

I asked for a sum up of your top 3 reasons, and you gave me a bunch of posts to look at. There's a difference.

There are answers he could give that would not put the issue to rest completely but would keep him from being such a huge target.

Meh.

***

Looking at the thing about the hammer...I'll end up voting for horrordude or NS, and then base tomorrow on the end result. Need to actually look at NS. If he doesn't seem valid, I'll just vote horrordude.

I got a lot from today..

6 days to deadline. We still have a good amount of time.

[DedicatedScribe]

I am NOT going to be like NS and vote horror just because I'm exasperated.

vote NS

[DedicatedScribe]

EBWOP:

That was pretty cool by NS, IMO.

Also, pman looks good recently. I guess I can see why folks find others besides horror scummy, but I'm having trouble understanding the objection to his death. He doesn't do much and fidgets like scum, so let's just do this.

He fidgets like scum? how?

[DedicatedScribe]

1. SaintKerrigan
4. WRP_Beater
6. RichardGHP

9. horrordude0215

Dude today, reevaluate cases on Kerrigan, Beater, and Richard tomorrow?

As much as it physically pains me to agree with Ythan, I do.

unvote

vote horror

He just keeps getting worse.

I'm not happy about Rikenslope's sudden jump onto the Beater wagon, either.

Okay.

unvote.

Vote: Richard

GPS

GHP

I think that HDude is just being too-newb. I don't think he's scum. (HDude: If you do flip scum, I will hate you. Forever.)

FoS: Ythan.

Too much attention being paid to HDude. Let's do Richard today, possibly StKerrigan (or maybe, just

maybe,

you!) tomorrow. Deal?

Here's the deal: I'm sick of the bickering.

Vote: horrordude

I read the forty-two-thousand pages of back-and-forth; I don't recall another vote besides farside's; she says he's at L-1, I think he's at L-2. Either way, if I'm hammering, so be it.

Guys, what do you think of this?

***

Farside, which vote? Can you link me to the part of the game you're talking about?

[DedicatedScribe]

I'll see what I can do, although you know you're asking me to not look at my 3 top suspects, right?

Yes, he does. Now go. Be convincing.

[DedicatedScribe]

i think we're on different wavelengths, Ythan.

[DedicatedScribe]

If you would please quickly.

So while I reread something, tell me, how horrordude's use of smilies is scummy, or about whatever is the most scummy thing he's done.

The way you are presenting it, I seem to be mentally lapsing it.

Explain one last time. Say what happened, how it was scummy, and be done with it.

One last try, please?

All I see is a few small things, and horrordude used smilies to undermine an attack.

I have some time. Lets discuss.

[DedicatedScribe]

If its as obvious as it seems, then my disagreement is not illogical.

Ythan, I don't trust you atm, if that's not clear. Just a note.

I read 84-95, and further. If I hadn't just entered the game, I might have fosed horror. No more.

And I remember horror "omgus"ed a bit.

And you insisted on calling horror's use of smilies a scumtell.

Am I missing anything?

[DedicatedScribe]

No, I am not going to do that yet again. If you are the one who seems to be continuously having trouble with in then take into account the fact that it might not be my fault after all.

Doubtful.

Though you urge me to vote horror, you remain strangely stubborn when I request a bit more than what you've already presented.

[DedicatedScribe]

I asked why he used the smiley and shared my interpretation. So yes you are.

I understand that, and disagree with your interpretation.

Am I wrong in believing that said interpretation is that he "used smilies to indirectly undermine your attack"?

[DedicatedScribe]

Don't get indignant when I don't repeat myself for the dozenth time.

I'm not asking for repetition, but clarification.

And hypocrites shouldn't talk about indignance. But lets not get astray. I don't want this devolving into another round of spam.

[DedicatedScribe]

I have no problem with you disagreeing with my interpretation. You're the one pushing this argument based on nothing more than our differing viewpoints.

Not an argument, a discussion.

Am I missing anything else? What, exactly.

[DedicatedScribe]

No, it would be best if hypocrites kept those thoughts to themselves.

Can't we just get on the same page?

This is taking longr than it needs to.

[DedicatedScribe]

I think it's time for you to ask another player to reexplain their cases to you. There's only so much active lurking you can direct at one player.

But I'm not done with you yet..

[DedicatedScribe]

Wow. Why is this so hard for you?

Since when is asking for clarification unconstructive?

[DedicatedScribe]

They are also very specific.

Yes/No, with just a bit of "repitition" mixed in.

Is dodging my Q's more constructive than answering them?

Will that help get horror lynched?

[DedicatedScribe]

Dude is an opportunistic idiot attempting to ride someone else's flimsy coattails and wagon me. Seriously he even admitted to lurking. Can we just lynch this awful guy already.

DS is not an idiot but simply does not understand that asking the same person the same question over and over again is going to reach a point where that person doesn't give a fuck what you think anymore.

I will not ask the same question over and over again, if you'd pay attention, unless you have yet to answer it.

Want me to repeat the ones you havent answered yet?

Getting bored with this. If you want, say no to the above, and I'll see how long it takes to get an answer from someone else.

Oh, and

vote horror

Werent you supposed to be doing something?

[DedicatedScribe]

Ythan, sorry for wasting your time. But the usage was so productive...

[DedicatedScribe]

Just give up horror. Ive been trying too hard.

You are a safe lynch. Best thing to do if you are town is allow us to observe the bandwagon tomorrow.

So no, don't self vote. Just focus on your other mafias. It was nice playing, I hope we meet again.

[DedicatedScribe]

That makes nine. Dude please vote yourself so that Rich can hammer you.

Sigh. Be patient.

[DedicatedScribe]

I have to say, today was fun.

Anyone who doesnt think horror is scum, vote for him anyway. As I said, he is a safe lynch, being VT, nooby, and [sorry to say] distracting. It is also D1.

[DedicatedScribe]

I have lost The Game.

And I'm not a hypocrite [when it comes to mafia, and not on purpose]

[DedicatedScribe]

I have lost The Game.

And I'm not a hypocrite [when it comes to mafia, and not on purpose]

[DedicatedScribe]

On further note, I think horror could be scum. I voted him because tomorrow will not be profitable if he is left alive, and probably tonight, also.

Furthermore, I'm 50% sure he is scum.

With this in mind, I find it necessary to lynch horror despute my doubt of his alliance. If a wagon began on someone else at this time, I would doubt its success, as the weekend is coming up. D1 would be a disaster, and we'd learn little from the wagon on horror, who is better off dead.

[DedicatedScribe]

horror, you are hurting the town atm.

[DedicatedScribe]

How am I hurting the town? Because I refuse to back down to the most idiotic reasons for lynching ever?

Basically.

You've already backed down. You arent trying to save yourself from being lynched.

And by being how you are, the hammer will have less meaning.

Horrordude, seriously; things will be dealt with tomorrow. You've done all you could, now don't undermine it.

[DedicatedScribe]

I understand that there are no real reasons for lynching me, and that you need go go soak your miserable fucking head in a vat of boiling acid.

There are, horrordude.

I wouldn't vote you and make 3 endnotes about it if there werent.

[DedicatedScribe]

horrordude, you've crossed a line.

[DedicatedScribe]

Horrordude, you've crossed a line.

Requesting modkill of horrordude, please, mod

No hard feelings. Just calm down, and PLAY MAFIA ANOTHER DAY.

[DedicatedScribe]

lol

I still call this a fun day.

But tomorrow can be funner.

Ythan, what were your thoughts on NS?

[DedicatedScribe]

oh sorry for that horror
i was typing as you guys posted.

[DedicatedScribe]

I need to give NS another read but I don't recall him being particularly noteworthy.

how about what I quoted?

[DedicatedScribe]

yeah. His voting pattern.

I have some thoughts, but might be best to wait till tomorrow to reveal them.

[DedicatedScribe]

Here.

I'll reread and post thoughts, then start my plans for today.

Cant superquote atm.

[DedicatedScribe]

dang. i have to do l8r.

[DedicatedScribe]

NS was my next suspect as scum but I need to look at crypto in isolation too.
By the way I think WRP may be town based on the comments that crypto jumped to with WRP.
I also had DS scum based on his switch after so long of defending horror he switch for such a little reason. It really is disturbing to me.

I spend 3 posts explaining my reasoning for horror-vote, and you are still disturbed?

Looking at cryto's scum o meter there is no reason I can find that NS was up so high. He didn't really stand out as anything special.
Going to look at mole next and something else I remember happening when I attacked cryto for his remark towards me when he misinterpreted the win condition of the town.

I don't understand the first part. He was too high on the scale, or too low?

Damn. I think if horror is town, I'll be NKed.

Why did you think that?

(Ok, I'll stop posting Ythan-style now.)

I can't particularly remember. I think it was because I was fighting the horror lynch so hard, and one of the unmentioned reasons I voted for him.

You're funny. I hope you're scum.

This is what you said about me early Day 1. Could you explain it for me?

From what I can see, it was a joke.

***

I'm sorry. I'm a little low on time for a while, and my type of posting takes a while.

I'll continue ASAP.

[DedicatedScribe]

Yes! I've got time. I'll post ASAP.

[DedicatedScribe]

I spend 3 posts explaining my reasoning for horror-vote, and you are still disturbed?

It was more odd on how you didn't believe he was scum to changing your mind as you did.

As for the second Crypto had NS very high on his list and from what I read there was not reason for it.

I didn't change my mind, exactly. I rationalized that it was best that horrordude was lynched today. Imagine him alive today. I had to think really hard about this. Also, it seemed very unlikely that Ythan would stfu and realize the weakness of his attack, and thus there would be few unvotes overall.

From yesterday, especially near the end, I learned that Ythan is stubborn to a point where sometimes it hurts the town (when he's wrong).

As for the second Crypto had NS very high on his list and from what I read there was not reason for it.

Why are you considering Crypto's list as anything but WIFOM?

It's something to look at that he posted.

Scum tend to put their scum buddies either at the top, middle or end.

There is always a reason this list had none and looking at everyone and who he put where is noteworthy.
NS in this case had next to nothing really said but was higher then me.
Now sure scum can use the list to misinform the town but I already have a belief that NS is scum.

Scum tend to put their scum buddies either at the top, middle or end.

Why do you think this? You think they put them all in the same place?

Dedicated Scribe

In my first big analysis post, I labelled this guy as being pretty town.
I don't understand this (ISO 8)

In actuality, it isn't timely or convenient, as he's getting votes right now O.o

His join date kinda removes this point, however. Ill also FoS WRP_ Beater.

Could you please exlpain? Seems like a little fence-sitting.

Richard and Mr. Beater are on my more realistic hitlist for today. Shall we?

unvote; vote WRP_Beater

I don't know why I'd rather vote Beater. Mainly because I feel the attack on him is more easy to understand, and the one on Richard could be sensationalized. I don't have enough time to look on that, so I'll go with the simpler choice.

This bit also rubs me the wrong way. It sounds like he just doesn't want to put the effort in to push a case he likes, but instead goes for an easy and 'simple' one. Surely that isn't how you catch scum?

A test? I think it makes WRP seem more nooby. If he's scum, why does he continue to rely on this noob facet?

Thinking on this, I'll unvote WRP_Beater at this point.

Don't call me contradictory.

Uh... well, um...
*Awkward pause*
Let's call it coming round to sense in a way that you, uh, wouldn't have been a particular fan of earlier?

In ISO 17, Scribe seems to defend horror quite a lot, and later votes. I can't really blame him, and I can't really work out if this is a scumtell or not.

I spend 3 posts explaining my reasoning for horror-vote, and you are still disturbed?

Could you please point me to these? To ease my laziness? I have been writing this post for around an hour now. Have pity. Please. You know you want to. It might help. Like, lots.

SCUM RATING: Moderate-Ish.

Sorry ^^. A few games back, I decided to stop prioritizing on looking like town, and focus more on doing whatever it is I'm doing.

I'll organize responses numerically.

1.

At first, I thought WRP was town. Right now, I'd like to think my gut read was right. I made a post saying that I thought WRP was town.

I was responding to someone saying WRP's entrance was "convenient". I found that ludicrous that someone would vote for someone for a "convenient entrance", when in fact, this entrance was not convenient at all.

And I made a point about the join date, because it could have been possible WRP was lurking, and posted b/c he's a noob like that.

2.

It's exactly how I find scum. Build pressure upon likely scum, and analyze the response. It's just one of my strategies, when I don't have the best lead/attack ever. Not my only, or best, way.

3.

I don't completely understand that.

4.

Sigh. You know I'm lazy, too, right?

post 52, 49, 45 (I was basically searching for a reason to either vote, or mount an attack on Ythan).

Post 52 is the biggest explanation. Speaking of which, I'ma talk about that horror wagon pretty soon.

Ok then.

WRP_Beater, is that all you've got to offer?

That was to not be prodded.

Oh, so he is actively lurking.

Actually, you know what?

unvote;

vote jbernier93

I like this vote better.

---

This looks like a way to obvious wagon hop.

---

I've never seen an appeal to emotion this bad.

HOS:horrordude

---

Obviously farside's whole argument against you just went over your head.

Anyway

vote: horrordude.

You obviously agreed with what farside was saying. If this was truly the case then one would think that you would be all over farside. Instead you vote horrordude saying that he was scummier for various things ["his AtEs, various posts, wishywashiness"].

AtE - null.
various posts - ???
wishywashiness - ???

I also find your deflections [iso post 32 and 33] to be scummy.

---

@SK: How does farside's comment make you jump to the conclusion that she is an SK? I do not see it.

Where the heck were you yesterday???

@SK: How does farside's comment make you jump to the conclusion that she is an SK? I do not see it.

Because she said she wished for a vig. To me, it seems like that means she knows there already isn't a vig. Since we had two kills last night, that leaves three possible options: two scumteams, vigilante, or Serial Killer. Since Crypto flipped simple Mafia Goon, that rules out two scumteams. Now that Farside said that she wished for a vig, it seems to rule out that possibility as well. Hence, a Serial Killer, and I'm betting Farside's it.

Very good point. I don't like you still atm, however.

@mole: Nah, I just got fast fingers

@SK: That makes no sense. I still do not see how that comment makes you think that farside is an SK. How does farside wishing for a vig = her knowing that there is not a vig = her being a SK?

Let farside defend herself, plz. The logic is:

farside wishes for a vig = he might know that a vig had not killed that night = he knows what caused the kill = he did the kill = he's an SK.

Now that I think of it, not a very good point. For all we know, he's the vig.

Odd thing to say, but last night was an odd night. You know?

Either stop blatantly breadcrumbing or come out with it, but what you're doing right now is not helpful.

I find this post funny. But I call it a nulltell.

There is no way you can spin that as anything but extremely blatant rolefishing. Or that you can avoid your lynch today.

SK, you're about to get Ythan-ed.

Once I get time, and if at this time I'm still thoughtful about this, I'll read a few potential sk's isos, and make some thoughts. But SK killed scum. And I'll focus on scum for now, and SK counts as scum, too. ^^

Since when did I say your breadcrumbing was a scumtell? I just said it wasn't helping the town. I don't like how you're trying to spin this as rolefishing, considering you about as good as stated that you had a role.
Seriously, stop breadcrumbing.

You might just want to stop.

Stop telling people to stop too early. You need to make your point first (SK IS UNDENIABLY AND INEXPLICABLY SCUM. IF YOU CAN'T SEE IT, I'M SURE SOMEONE ELSE WILL!!!)

Oh yea, I'm bitter. I shouldn't be. I'll try not to be. Oh, I'm so sorry...

the kill on the mafia is either vig or sk. I don't know which and I never assume.

Oh I just assumed SK with the kill not a vig. I don't know why.

Lol.

SK is acting extremely opportunistically here.

ino, rite? Still, its a nulltell.

And has anybody noticed how Farside's suddenly gone quiet once this discussion came up?

By the way I go to lunch around the same time every day. Between 12:40 or 1pm I start my lunch and I take an hour. This is a bit opportunist comment.

How am I supposed to know that? For that matter, how am I supposed to believe you?

Finally my last question to SK.

How did I know that crypto had misinterpted what the town PM win condition is. Unless you don't know what the win condition is??

You know...that's actually a good point.

Unvote: Farside22.

lol.

***

Now.

jbearner
SK
NS
Ythan

After I start my attack, I'll be following you guys like I'm on twitter ^^.

On a side note, my first attack/vote will be for

vote Nobody Special

.

Time is running out for me, but i should be able to get it in b4 tomorrow.

[DedicatedScribe]

Yes, it would be nice that there is a vig. Which is also why idc much about SKs at this point. I wait till a townie dies.

Also, opportunism is a (bad) method of attack, is all. So sure, I'll agree with you on this.

[DedicatedScribe]

1. SaintKerrigan
4. WRP_Beater
6. RichardGHP

9. horrordude0215

Dude today, reevaluate cases on Kerrigan, Beater, and Richard tomorrow?

As much as it physically pains me to agree with Ythan, I do.

unvote

vote horror

He just keeps getting worse.

I'm not happy about Rikenslope's sudden jump onto the Beater wagon, either.

Okay.

unvote.

Vote: Richard

GPS

GHP

I think that HDude is just being too-newb. I don't think he's scum. (HDude: If you do flip scum, I will hate you. Forever.)

FoS: Ythan.

Too much attention being paid to HDude. Let's do Richard today, possibly StKerrigan (or maybe, just

maybe,

you!) tomorrow. Deal?

Here's the deal: I'm sick of the bickering.

Vote: horrordude

I read the forty-two-thousand pages of back-and-forth; I don't recall another vote besides farside's; she says he's at L-1, I think he's at L-2. Either way, if I'm hammering, so be it.

These three posts are his only mention of horrordude yesterday ^^

***

Ythan, if you believe that about opportunism, why do you agree that it's a nulltell?

I have to defend opportunism because I do it. When I do it, unless I'm scum, I don't do it for lynches, but for info. I can't say SK's attack fits in thsi category, so I'm rambling. But the first part matters.

[DedicatedScribe]

Ythan, good to know you are in a thoughtful mood.

Do you know scum to talk like the 3 of us in thread NS?
What makes it so scummy?
I noticed you didn't look at who cryto could be scum with and you follow ythan who you called town and scum in the same post.

No, scum don't talk in-thread like that. It's an unknown situation to me, and I am afraid of the unknown. Unknown == scum.

Yeah, I have really mixed feelings about Ythan.

Loling at the part about unknown, let's focus on the bottom part.

What is your opinion on Ythan, NS? On a scale of 1-100, also.

[DedicatedScribe]

Now, about NS:

1. How experienced are you? I want links to your mafias, finished and ongoing.

2. At the point of your 4th post, did you think you had posted more content than those you said needed to say more?

3.

Ythan doesn't love me anymore.

@StKerrigan: What are your thoughts on lynching lurkers?

Depends on the type of lurking. Plain ol' lurking, do nothing about. Active lurking, on the other hand, is something I would consider lynching over.
Why ask me specifically?

FoS: WRP_Beater

for his convenient and timely entrance.

That's why. I wanted to know why you only placed a FoS on WRP rather than a vote. So, given what you said, would you consider lynching WRP? (I think you would; obviously, you're ready to lynch anyone based on how many times your vote has switched. )

Did you think SK should have voted for WRP?

4.

And the "Oh, and Vote: beater" is a reminder-vote because my previous vote had STILL not been counted.

Let's not count your vote for several pages and see how you feel.

My vote is currently on, and remains on, WRP_Beater.

Where was the previous vote? You never said much about why you voted Beater.

Glad the Richard issue was cleared up. And dead scum too!

Need to reread isos again in light of stuff.

Perfect tell, commenting on the obvious. You mostly appear town, but IGMEOY.

/agrees. Wow.

Do you know scum to talk like the 3 of us in thread NS?
What makes it so scummy?
I noticed you didn't look at who cryto could be scum with and you follow ythan who you called town and scum in the same post.

No, scum don't talk in-thread like that. It's an unknown situation to me, and I am afraid of the unknown. Unknown == scum.

Yeah, I have really mixed feelings about Ythan.

Where's the FoS?

And, to answer your Beater question: it was the opportunistic posting --

nine minutes

after you called him on not posting -- that makes Beater so scummy. Remember now?

Where's the vote?

[DedicatedScribe]

Mod, I voted for NS.

Yes, that fallacy that 1 bit of wrongness in a post makes its entirety incorrect.

You also ignored parts of my post.

[DedicatedScribe]

And you never commented on your voting pattern related to horrordude. Only 3 posts about him yesterday, a vote, an unvote, and then a vote again.

First, horrordude is terrible.
Then, he is defin town.
And then you vote him just because of annoying bickering.

And today, you fail to show any sort of commitment that comes with a vote, or even an FoS.
Even yesterday, you showed little commitment on your WRP vote once the Mod decided to add it to the vote count.

Your opinion on SK's opinion on WPR_Beater is also bad. If you believed what you said, why did you ask him why he FoSed instead of voting?

You seem to go after the lousiest "tells", despite your experience in Mafia, and seem to be playing much more different than those other games you've flipped town in.

I'm satisfied with my vote.

[DedicatedScribe]

Unvote Vote Nobody Special

too. WRP_Beater seems to be getting no support as a wagon but this is pretty good too.

Why do you think NS is a pretty good wagon? Who are your top 3 scum suspectes?

For the reasons/inconsistencies I've outlined but

To summarise them:
He was busy/lurked through day 1, no real difference which as it can't be proven but his lack of contribution is scummy.
Hopped on the horror wagon w/o ever mentioning him before hand. Said horror was getting worse and worse, despite having never expressed suspcioun of him before hand.
Came out saying he thought Ythan was town/had him as a scum read in the same post- Shows he's making things up as he goes along (imo a scum mindset) or has a bad memory.
Some of his scum-hunting has been bad (using a 7 minute simul post as the sole focus of his case(
Hasn't answered all questions levelled at him
Also the quote Ythan just showed was very interesting. Ythan is suspicious for something he himself did...that's just ridiculous.

WRP_Beater is my second choice, as previously indiciated (I thought I was voting for him, actually). Jbernier is 3rd on a gut scum read, plus her play lately has been bothering me.

After that

Lol. It's not that they both thought about the Day, but that NS called him scum for this.

NS, the list of your exploits is growing...

So, I want people to either vote for NS, or tell me why you aren't. That sounds like a good request.

[DedicatedScribe]

vote dedicated scribe

I'm going to work on another update post starting w/ D2.

Just briefly perusing the run-up to horror's lynch, posts 929 and 930 sit uneasy with me. Particularly, 929 looks like it was written by someone who had an idea about the lynch scene.

kinda vague. What do you mean?

Anyways, this doesn't seem like yesterday in the least. There is loads of valid evidence showing NS's inconsistency and scumminess.

I don't think its too early to request a role claim.

[DedicatedScribe]

So, I want people to either vote for NS, or tell me why you aren't. That sounds like a good request.

Last time ythan argued to lynch someone he was wrong

ooooo burn!!!!

Okay now that I got that out of my system. I know I had suspicion on NS but I don't want to let jb off the hook.

Mod vote count please!

I want to compare the votes on NS from the one's that were on horror yesterday for a moment.

That's a terrible reason. Lol.

I feel that NS is much scummier than JB, and it doesn't matter since we have D3 coming after today. However, I've kinda sorta been ignoring you, since you aren't focusing on NS, lol.

[DedicatedScribe]

I don't think its too early to request a role claim.

Isn't it standard for someone NOT voting me to request the claim?

No.

God today has been a day.

DS: do you really think my reason's for Jb as scum is terrible or the reason's I'm not switching votes yet is terrible?
Why?

Oh, I don't think its terrible. I just think I've been terrible not paying attention to other attacks. I'll do that ASAP.

Unsight, I feel the same way about fast wagons. Hm.

[DedicatedScribe]

Does this post make my butt look big?

[DedicatedScribe]

Pman, my man, I've just read your posts!

Could I get a link to all of your finished mafias? They could be in your wiki; I haven't checked yet.

Also:

What is the line between nooby and scummy? What is the point where a player's lack of skill explains his slips? What is the point where a player's slips outweighs his noobiness?

Ima bring this up slightly l8r in the game. What is your amazing strategy that allows you to pay only a little attention to the thread?

[DedicatedScribe]

so you don't suspect rikenslope as much anymore?

[DedicatedScribe]

directed at wikimanager

[DedicatedScribe]

DS isn't hunting.

Yes, I actually am

[DedicatedScribe]

Deflection.

How?

[DedicatedScribe]

I was ninja'd by your double post. Now you're not deflecting, but you're also still not hunting. Consistently not.

Right now I'm not, mostly b/c I'm chatting with you, but when you made that post, yes, I was.

What makes you think I'm not?

[DedicatedScribe]

I'm not distancing from crap. I'm learning from past mistakes.

I don't even feel as if I just jumped on it, since I helped build it, and planned it since yesterday.

[DedicatedScribe]

Jumped on the NS wagon while distancing from your vote. After that, it's hard to provide examples of what you're not doing.

Also, what does this have to do with me "not hunting"?

You mean to say that I'm only pretending to look for scum? Or that I should be saying more about the NS wagon?

Be clear, and hurry up. If I've done something you see as scummy, don't waste my time by being vague.

[DedicatedScribe]

I don't think you're genuinely hunting, how much plainer can I get than that. And save the false indignation.

Is that all?

Pman obviously isn't on the top of my scumlist, but it wouldn't do bad to go ahead and give him/her some of my attention.

But everything preceding that has had my heart in it.

And I can post with any sort of emotion I feel like, especially if I think it could help the town, thx vry much.

[DedicatedScribe]

I disagree. Emotion provokes responses. Sometimes revealing responses.

[DedicatedScribe]

Emotion is a revealing response.

That, too. ^ ^

It also helps get messages across.

I'm getting bored.

[DedicatedScribe]

ARGH. I almost went inactive again. I haven't read the thread yet, but I hope this isn't my bah post.

[DedicatedScribe]

You have ZERO votes. What makes you think you'd be lynched?

Shush. I could have been killed during the night.

I wish I had acted more thoughtfully yesterday. I procrastinated.

Ythan, for someone so intelligent, you seem to keep pulling duds. But, I suppose, so have I.
But still. Weird how the one who is night killed is the one you plan to have lynched the following day. First Richard, then Saint Kerrigan.

It can't be a coincidence, but WIFOM nonetheless...

NOW I start re-reading. I will spend 1.5 hours on this, or more. I WILL BE RIGHT@!

Oooh. Some votes on Ythan. I expected this.

[DedicatedScribe]

The fact that they were scummy is the point. Why would scum kill likely mislynches?

[DedicatedScribe]

Again, stupid question. No need to discuss.

[DedicatedScribe]

1557 (just noting the post I'm on)

Ythan, really?

I'm not talking about the lynches. I'm talking about the NK.

[DedicatedScribe]

unvote;

vote Ythan

I don't like the reasoning. I expected...more.

But Ythan's posts are terribly annoying to iso, I guess.(:P)

Vote: Lowell

• Little content / Lots of fluff
  
• Being too certain about various posters' alignment
  
• Giving "pro-town points" to 2 mafia members

1st depends on Lowell's meta. I'm thinking he always does that.
2nd is most likely like the first.
3rd is stupid. Sorry.

To add more to my Lowell lynch position, I just noticed something really funny:

Lowell believes Richard's claim but approves of Crypto's vote (in the same post)

297- crypto votes rich [+, bandwagons have trouble moving in this game]

1) I very very very much believe

richard

's claim, and very much encourage others to do so as well.

Lowell, why did you approve of someone jumping on Richard's bandwagon if you believed Richard's claim?

Still, not too good of an attack. Thanks for trying, though.

Page 61 and Konowa finds nothing better to vote for.

Really? Is this supposed to be protown?

Right, so I'm going to go back to

vote:Ythan

.

• Little content / Lots of fluff
  
• Being too certain about various posters' alignment
  
• Giving "pro-town points" to 2 mafia members

First two are just Lowell being Lowell, unfortunately.

That's better.

• Little content / Lots of fluff
  
• Being too certain about various posters' alignment
  
• Giving "pro-town points" to 2 mafia members

First two are just Lowell being Lowell, unfortunately.

Just to clarify this, you...

A) ...don't see those as scum tells at all.
or
B) ...are wanting to ignore those because it's Lowell.

It's both.

I agree; Rich is worse than Beater (narrowly). And this doesn't look like the frustrated townie strain of self-destruction.

Town points for Beater due to crypto qualifying him as only narrowly better to set up a move back later.

Vote: Crypto.

Reason: General scummy state of play.

Ray raplaced out, Ray replaced in. I believe their story, as weird as it is.

Town points for Ray. Dr. C came in bussing crypto hard immediately followed by the above post about Ray.

So you're saying that RFWM and Beater are pro-town based on those posts?

Um...overclarification, much? (AKA: duh?)

I said town points for each of them. What I did not say is that they are pro-town.

My, aren't you the careful one?

Vote: Crypto

maybe he's distancing! (not very serious comment)

Comment seems a bit out of the blue. Turns out crypto is scum after all.

I have to joke a bit so I can get active. I read a guide on that a while back, as I have a very big problem staying interested in games, even ones so awesomely hosted as this one (/butkisss).

Found scum.

vote DedicatedScribe

More detail when I get to him, I'm reviewing Mole at the moment.

You usually tend to focus on one person once you say you've found scum. But I'm special?

Like I said yesterday Ythan seems scummy to me. And the bullying brought up by Lowell is helping me thing him any less scummy.

Vote: Ythan

First I thought: reason?

But then I thought: Does he really expect his case to be strong if people need to go back to some unmentioned page/post to read it?

Your defense amounted to I didn't do it because I think your wrong about me. If think that being pompous is gonna make me think you did it any less you are wrong about that. BYW if it's such a weak case then why are 3 people voting for you right now clearly I am not the only one who finds you scummy. So I can't be horribly wrong if there are others who think the same way.

Lol, fallacy(/ies).

Jb, care to also answer

why

you find farside and DS townish? That's the important part if you didn't catch it.

Well why the heck do you find me scummy?

Both are legitimate Q's btw.

...

And then I find Ythan just waves Rickenslopes pointing out of this away???

And then instead of defending her own weak as hell case Rike does this. He continues this "You can't just say my case is illogical" bullshit even though it's a terrible case which he refuses to shore up in any way because that would cut into his whining about it time.

unvote vote Rikenslope

I'd rather kill constantly complaining scum than docile scum.

Ah. Now I'm scared to vote Rikenslope. lol.

Hey Ythan

OMGUS much?

ITS NOT OMGUS JUST BECAUSE YOUR VOTE IS ON THE PERSON VOTING FOR YOU.

Why can't 100% noobtells be as easy to find as 100% scumtells (sorry)?

I'm not here to spoon feed you. If you still can't understand what's going on here then try the road to rome next game.

How many people so far find you vague?

No, you asked it and there is plenty to discuss about your reasoning.

oh noes ythan has tarped me! Now he knows my evil plan to destroy the town by noting strange NK patterns!

I think DS is saying that being on legitimate mislynches is scummy and that being on poor mislynches is not.

Do you even read my posts, or just scan them to get the general gist of them.

Seriously though, methinks I need to talk more straightfowardly in all my posts. WHY DIDN'T ANYONE CALL ME SCUMMY ABOUT SOMETHING

VALID

, LIKE THIS???

My mistake. I thought you were working an entirely more ridiculous angle.

Yes. Definitely must talk more straightforwardly.

***

Well, people like when I come to closing thoughts after the end of my wall posts.

I want more from Konowa.

Ythan hasn't been serious about me. Wtf. Its good that you care about me, and my strange urge to be called scummy, but what I really want to hear is WHY. This, and other reasons, provokes an

FoS

for Ythan. You never even gave me one of thoSE@!

We've got a nice mix of noobs and expirienced players here for this game, don't we?

Comparing this with what I remember wall posts were like, I've become different over the course of this game (which is the only one I've played this long for, and made so many wall posts for).

I've lost a bit of my confidence for scumhunting (i coulda sworn i was better at it on yf), trust in my fellow gamemates, and a bit more, which I think is personal enough and unhelpful enough to keep to myself for now. Oh, and I've become a bit more hateful.
All of these, I feel, are positive growths.

I also think I realized something about mafia i haven't read before. I'll note that and say something about it in the endgame. No, it could help the town.

Townies (except perhaps those who make obv that they know what they're doing) make more BIG slips than scum. It's the small slips that seem to be more effective scumtells. Small and plentiful. Disagree if you will.

People of interest:
Ythan (He's on my ttoopp. He's also my personal Yoy. No, you don't get to know what that means)
rikenslope (the spell check says to call you glockenspiel ^^)
jbearner (because I have a habit of ignoring the low people on my list, who often happen to be scum)

I'll probably end up voting Ythan. First, I want to attempt to make an organized case against him.

***

farside, it's a veiled OMGUS, yes. But I find it hard to tell whether or not an OMGUS is veiled or not.

Also, yes. Ythan, it IS your job to be clear. If you're town trying to lynch scum, that is.

[DedicatedScribe]

ythan

I think

your vote on riken is OMGUS.

There. Picking up context is tech.

Wow. You know I considered sticking an "I think" into one of your quotes?

[DedicatedScribe]

Riddick defends Ythan.

Dedicated Scribe defends Lowell.

Notes worth reviewing if/when one turns up as scum.

Lol, I guess. But jbearner also defended Lowell. Why not mention this?

But I gave reasoning...while Riddick did not.

FoS

.

Ythan, a lot of us want you to validate your vote.

Ah. I wanted to say more, but g2g

[DedicatedScribe]

dang it. I have no time. V/LA -> Firday

[DedicatedScribe]

No time compared to what exactly? You no longer need to announce your absences when we've come to expect them.

Shush. School is a *****.

[DedicatedScribe]

Good news! I'll have time to post by tonight ^^

[DedicatedScribe]

Here I am, about to do my thing.

[DedicatedScribe]

I don't know why you can't.

Before I re-read, I just want to note that I loled at this.

[DedicatedScribe]

OMFG. All my pbpa got deleted...

[DedicatedScribe]

Sigh...I'll start over. Try going faster. Making it thinner.

[DedicatedScribe]

Stfu Ythan. I was halfway done when it messed up.

Lol, I guess. But jbearner also defended Lowell. Why not mention this?

Maybe I hoped you'd flounder instead of addressing the point like this?

Why did you want me to flounder?

1620, You find scummy VTs a safe lynch. Yes or no?

1625, what makes you find them good?

1649, why wouldn't he (try to get an obv noob into endgame)?

1652, dodge.

1654, no you weren't.

1658, made me mad. Bonus Q: what % is DS?

1663, Is second quote a bad point? Why is it there?

1670, sounds like a re-horrordude

***

Here, comment on this.

[DedicatedScribe]

DedicatedScribe

- What changed your view about this:

Horrordude seems townie to me because he is a noob, and noobs tend to be more emotional. His second post thus makes me come to the aforementioned conclusion.

Curiousity makes me ask this. Musher was the only person early on to do a PbPa. Why did you attack him instead of asking others their views?
DS: fos on horror is comical comment considering crypto's flip. I'm not sure why he says it's an attempt to set up a mislynch.
Dedicated vote on beater and reasoning is terrible. It's basically he is picking X player over Y player and not going further beyond that.

unvote; vote WRP_Beater

I don't know why I'd rather vote Beater. Mainly because I feel the attack on him is more easy to understand, and the one on Richard could be sensationalized. I don't have enough time to look on that, so I'll go with the simpler choice.

What has changed your view on beater?

really?

I am NOT going to be like NS and vote horror just because I'm exasperated.

vote NS

No not really

Dude is an opportunistic idiot attempting to ride someone else's flimsy coattails and wagon me. Seriously he even admitted to lurking. Can we just lynch this awful guy already.

DS is not an idiot but simply does not understand that asking the same person the same question over and over again is going to reach a point where that person doesn't give a fuck what you think anymore.

I will not ask the same question over and over again, if you'd pay attention, unless you have yet to answer it.

Want me to repeat the ones you havent answered yet?

Getting bored with this. If you want, say no to the above, and I'll see how long it takes to get an answer from someone else.

Oh, and

vote horror

Werent you supposed to be doing something?

My biggest issue with DS is that he hasn't done anything but follow others idea's and vote as they vote. He hasn't made a point that someone else didn't point out and his flip on horror is completely hypocritical. He doesn't look beyond what everyone else pointed out as scum or made views beyond the narrow scope.

YES! An attack!

1. Musher attack was random attack.

2. As a joke. Suggestion for thought. etc.

3. Wrong, I said attack on Richard seemed sensationalized.
I changed my mind because WRP made too many noob mistakes.

4. Agreed. I changed my mind. Not the only one.

5. Conclusion, first part: True. 2nd part: (p1)Disagree. (p2) True. 3rd Part: I'll work on that.

***

Basically, yea. I dun it. I'm not scum though.

This defense is terrible, but what can I say? I started playing this way, and it seemed to work well. I survived 3 days with minimal suspicion. I'm working on it, though. I really am, and have been.

I've been trying to make my play style fit my activity level. Analyzing attacks to attempt to prevent mislynches, and help lynches seemed like a good idea. I've always wanted to attack, myself, but I've terrible fears of being wrong.

I've been experimenting a while. I hope to get better without going inactive, making another alt, and trying again. It was vERY hard signing up for this mafia after getting subbed out for inactivity in 3 others.

I knew my horrordude vote would get some opinions, and my vote for NS on D2 was incredibly stupid, and even more hypocritical than my one on D1. I would say I was planning on unvoting, but could not due to a fast lynch, but I can't found that.

This was a really informative review of my playstyle.

[DedicatedScribe]

You didn't answer the question though...

1. is not a loaded question. What makes it loaded?

2. Mmmm.

3. Did I put the wrong #? It's about your disagreement about crypto's defense for WRP_Beater between farside.

4. What about what he said beforehand?

5. What makes it suspect? I haven't even made a case, yet. I haven't even posted my opinions on other cases.

6. Obv made me mad for a reason. Thx for response, though.

7. I'm confused about that now. What were you responding to?

8. It's hard, but I'll do it (make a case, i mean).

[DedicatedScribe]

Can mith see IPs?

Making new accounts is not illegal, my friend.

[DedicatedScribe]

Ah, a lot of people do!

I'll spend tonight on that. So sorry for making people confused about my alliance...

[DedicatedScribe]

You should know that owning up to scummy behavior and apologizing, while appreciated, does not aid you in your situation. Nothing personal. You still look scummy.

Yes...and I still don't want to be at fault for a third mislynch.

I guess now its too late to ask for your attack. I suppose you voted me so more people would pay more attention to me?

[DedicatedScribe]

Can mith see IPs?

Making new accounts is not illegal, my friend.

Mods deserve to know who's joining their games. If you had trouble getting into this one thanks to your anti-town behavior then yeah.

I had no trouble. Just felt guilty.

[DedicatedScribe]

Restore my hope in players who promise content.

I aim to do so.

Time to revisit suspects from yesterday. Below is a quick summary of their names and their 'Scum rating' from my ISO17.

horrordude0215 - 9 - pman5595, Ythan, Crypto, Lowell, ace5993, MoleStargazer, JBernier93, Nobody Special, DedicatedScribe, horrordude0215, RichardGHP - (LYNCHED)

Nobody Special - 9 - Ythan, Kison, DedicatedScribe, Riddick, Rikenslope, Farside22, Konowa, MoleStargazer, Unisght - (LYNCHED)

Discounting NS, who is dead,

ace/Kison:

Mild/Moderate (2)

Pman:

Low (1)

Ythan:

Mild/Moderate (2)

Lowell:

Mild (1)

Jbernier:

Moderate/Heavy (1)

Dedicated Scribe:

Moderate (2)

Bringing these together:
DedicatedScribe, Ythan, Kison/Ace all have been on both wagons and have a scumrating above Low/Mild. I definitely feel this warrants a little more of a look, but do not think that I'm abandoning my case on jbernier93. That will resume when I'm done.

DEDICATEDSCRIBE: Both Wagons, Moderate Scumrating Yesterday

Now, I never picked up his response to my comments/criticism in ISO17, as far as I can remember. Now, to ease everyone's pain in reading this, I'll be quoting my original point in ISO17, followed by his response, the full text of which can be seen HERE. Apologies for any confusion I may cause.

I don't understand this (ISO 8)

In actuality, it isn't timely or convenient, as he's getting votes right now O.o

His join date kinda removes this point, however. Ill also FoS WRP_ Beater.

Could you please exlpain? Seems like a little fence-sitting.

1. At first, I thought WRP was town. Right now, I'd like to think my gut read was right. I made a post saying that I thought WRP was town.

I was responding to someone saying WRP's entrance was "convenient". I found that ludicrous that someone would vote for someone for a "convenient entrance", when in fact, this entrance was not convenient at all.

And I made a point about the join date, because it could have been possible WRP was lurking, and posted b/c he's a noob like that.

Thank you for the explanation.
This still seems to me a lot like fence-sitting. You made post stating that he was town, and backed him up when someone criticised his convenient entrance, and yet still found something fishy enough to go for an FoS? I don't quite understand how his joindate could mean he was lurking, or how it can possibly remove your defence.

Richard and Mr. Beater are on my more realistic hitlist for today. Shall we?

unvote; vote WRP_Beater

I don't know why I'd rather vote Beater. Mainly because I feel the attack on him is more easy to understand, and the one on Richard could be sensationalized. I don't have enough time to look on that, so I'll go with the simpler choice.

This bit also rubs me the wrong way. It sounds like he just doesn't want to put the effort in to push a case he likes, but instead goes for an easy and 'simple' one. Surely that isn't how you catch scum?

2. It's exactly how I find scum. Build pressure upon likely scum, and analyze the response. It's just one of my strategies, when I don't have the best lead/attack ever. Not my only, or best, way.

I understand how pushing and placing pressure on a suspect is a good thing. What I'm asking for is why you chose the easy way of doing it instead of going after and putting pressure on Richard, who could just as likely be scum. It looks like you took the easy way out to try and secure a lynch.

A test? I think it makes WRP seem more nooby. If he's scum, why does he continue to rely on this noob facet?

Thinking on this, I'll unvote WRP_Beater at this point.

Don't call me contradictory.

Uh... well, um...
*Awkward pause*
Let's call it coming round to sense in a way that you, uh, wouldn't have been a particular fan of earlier?

3. I don't completely understand that.

I'm calling you Contradictory. First you said he was town but FoSed him, then you voted him because it's easy, then unvoted again for his newbiness.

I spend 3 posts explaining my reasoning for horror-vote, and you are still disturbed?

Could you please point me to these? To ease my laziness? I have been writing this post for around an hour now. Have pity. Please. You know you want to. It might help. Like, lots.

4. Sigh. You know I'm lazy, too, right?

post 52, 49, 45 (I was basically searching for a reason to either vote, or mount an attack on Ythan).

Post 52 is the biggest explanation. Speaking of which, I'ma talk about that horror wagon pretty soon.

Right, I'll go through each one of these.

To your ISO 51: Dammit.

On further note, I think horror could be scum. I voted him because tomorrow will not be profitable if he is left alive, and probably tonight, also.

Furthermore, I'm 50% sure he is scum.

With this in mind, I find it necessary to lynch horror despute my doubt of his alliance. If a wagon began on someone else at this time, I would doubt its success, as the weekend is coming up. D1 would be a disaster, and we'd learn little from the wagon on horror, who is better off dead.

You think, then are 50% sure, then are happy to lynch, then he's better off dead? You sound like you're trying to convince yourself.
Could you please explain why you thought tomorrow would be less profitable when he was dead? This doesn't really give much of a reason for lynching him other than wanting him out of the way.

Anyone who doesnt think horror is scum, vote for him anyway. As I said,

he is a safe lynch, being VT

, nooby, and [sorry to say] distracting. It is also D1.

You seem far too sure of him being VT.

Getting bored with this. If you want, say no to the above, and I'll see how long it takes to get an answer from someone else.

Oh, and vote horror

Werent you supposed to be doing something?

...
I've spotted no actual reasonings for your vote on horror other than wanting him out of the way to get D1 out of the way and to ease confusion.

Now, I need to analyse his play on D3.

Ythan, for someone so intelligent, you seem to keep pulling duds. But, I suppose, so have I.
But still. Weird how the one who is night killed is the one you plan to have lynched the following day. First Richard, then Saint Kerrigan.

It can't be a coincidence, but WIFOM nonetheless...

Mega fence-sit.

voting Lowell for (in part) giving 2 scum town points

...stupid. Sorry.

Could you please explain why you think this is stupid?

oh noes ythan has tarped me! Now he knows my evil plan to destroy the town by noting strange NK patterns!

...

Townies (except perhaps those who make obv that they know what they're doing) make more BIG slips than scum. It's the small slips that seem to be more effective scumtells. Small and plentiful. Disagree if you will.

Going to have to disagree, really.

People of interest:
Ythan (He's on my ttoopp. He's also my personal Yoy. No, you don't get to know what that means)
rikenslope (the spell check says to call you glockenspiel ^^)
jbearner (because I have a habit of ignoring the low people on my list, who often happen to be scum)

Could you please explain why (apart from jbernier)? A brief summary for both Ythan and Rik would be lovely.

I picked up far more than I thought I would. It seems as though I'm going to have to discard my earlier town-vibe. That WAS D1.

Summary

- Fence-Sitting
- Contridictions
- Seemed WAY too sure of horror being town.
- Little reasoning for suspicions, both horror and recently.

YTHAN: Both Wagons, Mild/Moderate Scumrating Yesterday

What makes Ythan so bloody difficult to ISO is that he alone has made

21 PAGES

of posts. So I'm blaming Ythan for why this game is so long.
Yesterday, I pointed out his aggression and fierce pushing on those he thought were scum.

He seemed overly concerned about the flavour first thing today, but I don't see that as a scumtell.

Page 61 and Konowa finds nothing better to vote for.

In response to Konowa's case on Lowell. I find this kinda slander a little pointless - at least a case is being made?

He claims he's "Found scum" on DedicatedScribe, but then later goes onto vote Rik.
@Ythan - Do you still think DS is scum?

I still think that desipte what he's doing, his scumhunting is inherantly pro-town.

I'm going to switch my vote to Beater for now because he's scummy and I have not gotten to my other suspects, or most players at all, yet in this round of rehashing old material.

unvote vote WRP_Beater

Put here for later reference - although by this point already you seem to have found a lot, particularly on DS who you made several posts criticising. I'm a little confused here.

His posting's quite difficult to read in ISO in that he rarely references who he's attacking.
Overall, my ScumRating on Ythan stays as it is. I think there's better targets to pursue.

ACE/KISON: Both Wagons, Mild/Moderate Scumrating Yesterday

Ace I already covered definitively (all 4 posts, if I remember rightly) in ISO17, which was what earned him this scumrating. Time to take a look at Kison.
My first thought when I clicked the button to view Kison in ISO was seeing his avatar and going "Oh, that guy". Seems fairly low-key, but I can't remember seeing anything particularly bad. I'll take a look.

DedicatedScribe looks good. Good vote on Musher333, good FoS on crypto. Active, posts are relevant. Need to do more thorough isolated analysis.

I agree with Ythan, I'd like an up-to-date viewpoint on these players.

Quite frankly, there isn't much I've seen up to ISO 10 that is comment-worthy. The case on NS he makes is pretty good.
In light of this, his new scumrating is MILD.

I was going to continue my case on Jbernier, but
- I really, really can't be bothered right now. Perhaps tomorrow.
- I've found a more likely scum.

Vote: DedicatedScribe

(Made big to hope the mod notices it in amongst the bolding in this post.)

As always, please point out any errors / problems in this post, I'm tired and cba proof-reading it.

Ah! Too much! Hm...

"This still seems to me a lot like fence-sitting. You made post stating that he was town, and backed him up when someone criticised his convenient entrance, and yet still found something fishy enough to go for an FoS? I don't quite understand how his joindate could mean he was lurking, or how it can possibly remove your defence."

I tried to stay unbiased, at that point. Later I realized you can't attack someone by being unbiased. Him being noob doesn't make him completely ignored, but I found it hard to lynch a noob for the attack on him at that point.

"You think, then are 50% sure, then are happy to lynch, then he's better off dead? You sound like you're trying to convince yourself.
Could you please explain why you thought tomorrow would be less profitable when he was dead? This doesn't really give much of a reason for lynching him other than wanting him out of the way."

I really tried to be VERY clear about my changing my mind about voting horrordude that day. Yes, was trying to convince myself. I had seen Ythan at his worst at this point, and felt he would repeat this tomorrow. This was not my envisionment of a good D2. I found horrordude's lynch inevitable. I was pretty careful not to say I thought horrordude was scum, despite the consequences.

"Mega fence-sit."

Fence-sit is not taking sides, right? That's bad (scum bad)?

"Could you please explain why you think this is stupid?"

I don't find this method of scumhunting useful, accurate, etc.

"..."

Lol, maybe I trusted myself too much.

Ythan has my attention because of how he pushes lynches too forcefully.

Rick had my attention because he had recently sent me some bad vibes. Ah, this is NOT specific enough...I think it had a lot to do with the bad attacks and reasoning. Again, I will start scum-hunting independently ASAP.

A little emphasis, but that was my attention list. Not scumlist. I'm bad at those (bad excuse. I WILL TRY HARDER!!!).

***

Gut read, then I decided to try out my new method which unfortunately never reached you because you're player 14 and we have enough for today and it's a major brain drain. You're not going to be lynched today, you are not the scummiest player.

Now I'm worried. Are you trying to take me off my guard, or are you back on placing me on your low priority list?

I guess most of the scumtells I've been groping for are based on the fact that I've decided to not to try super-hard to look protown, as this tends to be why people call me scummy. I'm going to keep doing this, but less, lackadisically.

So, I've been stupid. Maybe the future can fix it, and the fact that I'm working on explaining my thought process as I go, and defending myself.

[DedicatedScribe]

Kison, yours is pretty similar to molestar's. Could you reiterate that which you still want explained?

[DedicatedScribe]

You're scummy but you're not jb/beater/lowell scummy. Additionally, you don't need to try to look pro-town. As you learn and implement pro-town behaviors you're look pro-town.

I'll post my thoughts/vote tomorrow. And tunnel vision says you're buddying.

[DedicatedScribe]

Official Vote Count

Players needed to lynch: 8

DedicatedScribe

- 1 - MoleStargazer - (L-7)

Dragonfly13

- 2 - Riddick, Unsight - (L-6)

JBernier93

- 1 - Konowa - (L-7)

Lowell

- 3 - pman5595, Ythan, Farside22 - (L-5)

MoleStargazer

- 1 - Kison - (L-7)

pman5595

- 1 - RayFrostWikiManager - (L-7)

RayFrostWikiManager

- 1 - JBernier93 - (L-7)

Rikenslope

- 1 - Lowell - (L-7)

Ythan

- 1 - Rikenslope - (L-7)

Players not voting: DedicatedScribe, Dragonfly13

lol

[DedicatedScribe]

I'm also burnt out on isolation. Would you find anyone outside of those two preferable with the info you have now?

Gimme a chance to do some isoing. It'll be fun.

[DedicatedScribe]

Rickenslope:

He is a noob. Less outright than some others that I know of (but hopefully not less outright than me). His posts are more thought out, and wordy, than his nooby peers. Relatively inactive, but still active enough. Posts a lot of content. I like him.

0. Intropost.

1. A little hypocritical with the whole beater is noobclaiming thing. But, it becomes obvious in his reading that.

2-4. Pro-town posts.

5. Is close to what I should've done. However, he made it obvious that he was just going to sit back and watch.

6. Commentation.

7. Comments on the Night. Basically, the Night was good, but he wishes we hadn't lost a PR.

8. He attacks SK; seems to me to be trying to take advantage of what is almost a slip. Nulltell, at best.

He's highlights how inactive he is, at this point, as he's done for a while.

9. Exciting conclusion to "The Weak Attack on SK of Rickenslipe's 9th post"... or is it?

10. Misinterprets attack (on SK) as a defense.

11. Acknowledges misinterpretation. He's pretty active, this March 7th, Sunday.

12. Solid post. (+) He makes a little more obvious that he is a noob, here, however. A good noob, though. Not a confused one.

This is his "Top 3 Scum Right Now" Post. Day 2.

Notes dislike of jbearner, thinking that he had backpedaled. Personally, I disagree with that notion.

Notes dislike of Ythan. Enough of one to vote him.

Crypto FoSed Ythan, and then put him on bottom of list. WIFOMy argument, I think, mostly because Crypto probably put very little effort into that list of his.

He quotes a post about Ythan, and makes a weak attack about that.

"Everyone pay attention to the people going after SK. I think it's a stretch to follow it as hard as they are. I may be wrong or it may be scummy."

He misinterprets it. Again. Ythan was motioning the idea that SK was being bussed, but he saw it as a contradiction with how he was attacking SK now.

I'd have said it was fence sitting.

13. Doesn't realize that it was a weak attack. Thus, I have to assume by the truthful wording of it, he things it is a good one.

14. I have to read this in the thread.

15. This post is WIERD. He believes Ythan is suspicious, but that his posts are still relavent, and moves that the relevancy of one's posts has little to do with his scumhood. Then makes a more balancing notion that he has to figure out which posts are bullcrap, and which are protown (lol).

Gonna skip around now. As I don't have time to comment on EVERY post.

19. Funny. Because NS didn't comment on every Night comment, he must be scum! Why does he go for the stupid tell? And why wasn't I there to comment on it last Day?

21. He adds NS to his list of Top Suspects, changing 3 into 4.

24. He basically says, "Your defense is not good enough to make me like you again", without saying why he thinks this.

26. "Ythan is scum because he's a bully."

27. Ythan does seem to do this, doesn't he?

28. Now he explains why he thinks Ythan's defense is bad. Says that his attack on Ythan is not bad, because 3 people are voting for Ythan now. Not

good

logic. Not scummy logic, either. (He's trying to convince his target that his attack is valid)

29. Lol.

30. Comments on Ythan's not-omgus (at least not blatant) vote(calls it an OMGUS). I don't really see why Ythan voted him, though.

31.

33. We're waiting, Glockenspiel!

***

I get newbie town vibes from this guy now that I've read his iso. Really strong newbie town vibes.

[DedicatedScribe]

So...did I do it rite?

[DedicatedScribe]

Ah, I confused this guy with musher, than obvscum I wanted lynched D1 (just kidding about obvscum part; until I try isoing him).

Molestargazer (oh...Mole Star Gazer. Not Mo-les-tor).

1. Here, for future reference.

3. Nice little analysis. He hits right on the money and votes Crypto. Hmmm. I forget; who is he voting for right now?

5. Another batch of content.

7. Vote for Richard

10. Another another batch of uncontradictive content.

12. What made him start believing the smile theory?

17. more lots-o-content.

*skips to end*

He also looks protown. A good town. I want to grow up and be like him, even. Especially if he's scum.

Yeah, I'ma look at some people I'm suspicious of now, at this point.[/url]

[DedicatedScribe]

Comments on what Kison told me to look at:

1st part is valid(ish), but not enough to make me consider voting him, or even calling him scum.

2nd part is not. As he is STARTING to believe the smiley theory, that means he has CHANGED his mind.

[DedicatedScribe]

Looking at Lowell, now.

[DedicatedScribe]

Code: Select all

Says Richy is town & Beater is town. He believes so COMPLETELY.

"Uneasy" horror-vote
Then gives weird reasoning, and fully advocates horror-wagon

foses jbearner in hypocritical way

Mmmm...I need someone to sum up the attack on Lowell.

[DedicatedScribe]

1620, You find scummy VTs a safe lynch. Yes or no?

Loaded question. We don't know that scummy VTs are scummy VTs.

1625, what makes you find them good?

Unsight's points (thanks for making me look up when "them" means) were actually well-reasoned compared to other points raised before that time against Lowell.

1649, why wouldn't he (try to get an obv noob into endgame)?

"obv noob" was not a part of what I was talking about.

1652, dodge.

Not a dodge, I wanted to know if he thought I was scummy.

1654, no you weren't.

Your confirmation bias is highly suspect in the light of all the real cases floating around.

1658, made me mad. Bonus Q: what % is DS?

Did it make you mad for a reason or did you just want to include that? More than 50%.

1663, Is second quote a bad point? Why is it there?

It was answering a question. Context is tech. If you actually meant something here please explain.

1670, sounds like a re-horrordude

Explain the things you say if you're trying to build a case.

WAIT...you forgot one.

Why did you want me to flounder?

Ythan, why not just point it out for me? I'm re-reading as hard as I can.

I mean, I've got my attack. Lowell's lack of content (he posts the inane fluff that looks like valid fluff, except for the valid fluff that looks scummy), surety of alliance, uncommitted wagoning and subsequent hypocrisy make clear that he is scummy.

All I want to do now is to see if there was something else. But fine. I'll find it myself.

Lowell, why are you floundering?

[DedicatedScribe]

Aw. I was mocked.

Now, farside doesn't actually produce an attack on Lowell in all his posts.

Also, gdammit. Mafiascum won't load Ythan's posts for me, either. So I changed it to "Last 7 Days" and it worked (25 pages of fun!)

Also no summing up of the attack on Lowell. DO YOU KNOW WHAT SUM UP MEANS? I remember asking for this kind of thing about horrordude. Whatever.

So yea:

Lowell is scummy because:

A. Lowell's big posts are "the inane fluff that looks like valid fluff, except for the valid fluff which is actually scummy."

B. Lowell has some confidence in who he thinks is scum, and then in who he thinks is town.

C. Lowell was outwardly uncommitted when he first voted horrordude, then openly advocates it. Later, he hypocritically condones someone(s) for not acting committed to their own horrordude vote.

Lowell, just for reiteration: why are

you

floundering?

Its clear enough now, I hope.

[DedicatedScribe]

Is that not considered an attack because there was already a wagon on him?

[DedicatedScribe]

Trying to quote DS's insanse quote walls makes my head hurt.

The early serious votes tend to have this quality. I trust my vibes. As of such, that isn't a scumtell at all. Rather, this post could be a good example of a bad attempt at setting up a mislynch. so,

FoS Horrordude

.

But even though some others are scummy, I don't feel that big of an urge to vote you just yet ^^

Sigh. You [horror] seem to understand a big point of the attack pretty well, but not its scale.
And making a case on Crypto doesn't help...its outwardly trying to divert attention.

These are the two biggest points that I was referring to in my last post [concerning DS connections to crypto]. Definitely think that both of these posts are chainsaw.

unvote;

vote Dedicated Scribe

Less than a week people. Join.

This is fail.

First off, I don't find that chainsaw defending is even a remotely good scumtell, and second off, I haven't done anything of the sort.

The first quote, I need to see the circumstances. I know for a fact it isn't chainsaw, mostly because I dont remember defending crypto once this game.

However, the second, is not chainsaw defending: as I am not defending crypto. Horrordude should have obv put more focus on defending himself, not attacking others. This was the point I was trying to make.

[DedicatedScribe]

2nd part is not. As he is STARTING to believe the smiley theory, that means he has CHANGED his mind.

Of course he

claimed

to have changed his mind. The bigger, better question is whether or not you believe that that was in fact the case. Do you see any logical explanation for why someone would disbelieve the smiley scumtell, then, at a later time, when the wagon is conveniently hot, pull a 180 and decide it is, in fact, legit? Molestargazer never said, and as such, it looks horribly opportunistic.

Yes, and yes.

First off, as horrordude continued to defend himself, he continued to use smileys to an increasing extent.

Secondly, that wasn't the

only

reason molestargazer was voting horrordude.

Third, he doesn't make a strong show of his opinions on smilies throughout D1. This shows that he wasn't VERY opionated about smilies.

And his explanation checks through,

"If I remember correctly, there were still more posts attempting to defend himself which had a smiley tagged onto the own, which made me come round to the idea that they were being used to try and lessen the case on him.
The turn-around from earlier was purely due to the fact there was more of them since the original post in a similar context.
I don't have time to go and dig up the posts. As always, if you want them, I can go find them."

***

Does that explain why I don't believe that point much? There is enough evidence to support that he could have changed his mind.

Back in D1, Horror began to act increasingly, and increasingly, scummy/stupid, and used smilies even more often has the pressure built and built on him.

[DedicatedScribe]

@DS: Chainsaw is a definitive tell in my eyes. Perhaps you misunderstand what chainsaw defense is. You are not defending crypto directly. You are attacking those who are attacking him. Both of the quotes I posted are exactly that.

DS and jb are my two preferred lynches at this point.
I will settle on Rikenslope or Lowell to move the game forward.

Sigh. We can agree that horrordude was scummy, can we not? What makes my "chainsaw defense" "a connection with crypto"?

What else are you voting me for?

[DedicatedScribe]

I don't see why.

Attacking horrordude makes me scummy because he made a bad attack on crypto?

[DedicatedScribe]

That's the gist more or less plus loaded language.

loaded language?

[DedicatedScribe]

That's the gist more or less plus loaded language.

loaded language?

Loaded language.

Well wtf is loaded language?

[DedicatedScribe]

Whether or not the case was weak has no place in whether or not you were chainsaw defending.

What makes me more likely to have chainsaw defended crypto than someone else who attacked horrordude?

Why would I chainsaw defend crypto if the attack on crypto on horrordude was bad and miniscule?

Does the concept of chainsaw defending imply that I didn't attack horrordude consciously because he attacked crypto?

[DedicatedScribe]

Come onnn. Everyone post your favorite lynches for today in order in your next post plz.

molestargazer. Willing to settle for a Lowell lynch, though.

First off, as horrordude continued to defend himself, he continued to use smileys to an increasing extent.

Again, how does his increased exhibition of the same behavior justify the change of stance?

Secondly, that wasn't the

only

reason molestargazer was voting horrordude.

Besides the point. The point is that the vote was opportunistic. He provided one reason. That he now claims he had other reasons makes no difference.

Third, he doesn't make a strong show of his opinions on smilies throughout D1. This shows that he wasn't VERY opionated about smilies.

True, he never outright takes a stance against the tell, but I think it's fairly easily inferred.

@DS, do you think the smiley tell was a worthy reason for a vote?

1. The change of stance is because horrordude used LESS smilies when there was no pressure on him, and MORE smilies when there was. That made it seem as though there was a connection.

2. He provided other reasons, in other posts. I'm still new at this; what makes the vote seem opportunistic? Because he

3. Of course its obvious. But does that mean he had already taken a firm position on the matter?

4. It depends on what the voter thinks.

I'd be looking back at it with bias now, since horrordude turned out town, and now it is my belief that both scum AND town can and do show this same pattern with smileys, and there's no reason that scum would do it more often than town.

Back then, I believe, I didn't believe the smiley theory, and I didn't base any of my votes on the theory. After reading horror's other mafia, I decided that the smiley tell could not be refuted at the time.

5. I hate it when because I disagree about someone's scumminess, I end up making a bigger post than him defending him. I think this is the third time its happened to me; both came after a mislynch or two, in that mafia, or another I had been in.

@DS: Short answer short. You did it in response to horror attacking crypto.

Others were attacking horror, yes. You were the only one that I can see that did it in direct connection with horror attacking crypto. You even tell horror to "spend more time defending himself, and less time attacking crypto", which is horrible advice to town. The best thing town can do is make a concise case on who they think is scum. Pressure was also beginning to mount on crypto (via farside). Directing any further attention away from crypto is something I definitely think that a scumbuddy would do.

I addressed my lynches in my last post, but will repost it.
DS and jb are my two preferred lynches at this point.
I will settle on Rikenslope or Lowell to move the game forward.

But that was just a coincidence! And I disagree! You should always defend yourself first, and THEN make a concise attack!

Again, could you re-point out, or at least make a quick/vague list, of why you think I'm scummy, so I can further explain my position?

I'm not scum. I'm a little dissatisfied that I haven't been able to make a good point of this, but I'm also confident that by the time things become focused on me completely, I'll be able to.

Someone care to give a lesson on the qualities of a good defense? I find that just explaining the protown mindset you had with each action isn't good enough, and though it works for a while, being frank about one's mistakes isn't either. What am I missing?

Ythan: opinion of JB?
Kison: opinion of predecessor's play?
RFWM: are you an alt of RF?
DedicatedScribe: compare/contrast your views of SeptL with your views of Riddick.
pman: give me one player you think has played town most of the game.
Rikenslope: opinion of MoleStargazer?

Still not finished reading.

SeptL? He's been replaced by someone, but...ok.

[DedicatedScribe]

So yea:

Lowell is scummy because:

A. Lowell's big posts are "the inane fluff that looks like valid fluff, except for the valid fluff which is actually scummy."

B. Lowell has some confidence in who he thinks is scum, and then in who he thinks is town.

C. Lowell was outwardly uncommitted when he first voted horrordude, then openly advocates it. Later, he hypocritically condones someone(s) for not acting committed to their own horrordude vote.

Lowell, just for reiteration: why are

you

floundering?

Its clear enough now, I hope.

Dudes, I'm averaging like one post a day. What do you want? Also, 2039 is ridiculous, particularly the "floundering" stuff. Really idiotic. @DS- have you stopped being delibarately scummy? (see? stupid question)

I'm not floundering. My posts are decent and I'm awesome. Lynch someone who isn't here, not someone who is here, trying, and ridiculously as pro-town as I am.

Floundering was just a joke reference. Points have already been made about the quality of your posts; one of them was by Ythan earlier, go refute those; and you ignored C.

[DedicatedScribe]

I really don't like how people are pulling "connections with known scum" out of thin air and/or their butts. You're turning innocent actions into apparently voteworthy behavior. This is stupid!

In addition to my other response to Kison-post:

There was very little pressure on crypto at the time of my post, and I didn't really care for him anyways; I didn't find him scummy. I wasn't alone on this, as I was focusing more on stronger attacks, and finding some tells from those with suitable amounts of pressure on them. I've made note of this (my inattention to those low on my list) at least once when there was no pressure on me at all.

When I read your attack on me, (your 16th post from mine) (oh nvm its kison's post) (/notes to comment on this l8r)

OK! Now that ive read konowa's posts, I see he hasn't made a definitive attack on me, except for this connection. Is that really it?

[DedicatedScribe]

Oh, I'm not taking it personally; it just seems like a fun idea to colorize my vocabulary ^^

I'm not voting right now because I'm still making a choice. I'm also wanting Lowell to make one more try.

I'm gonna iso sum more so that my vote won't be as picky when deadline gets closer.

I'm annoyed that I had to defend mole for him. I mean, wtf. It may have been better if he had been the one giving answers like so.

I think we should go to the part where we debate on who is most likely scum, and more importantly, which one we should lynch today, so deadline doesn't ruin everything. This very helpful vig/sk probably won't hit scum a third time, and I'd really love to be part of a wagon on scum for once.

So...what do you guys think?

Also, wtf is Rick doing insulting Farside and

his

playstyle?

[DedicatedScribe]

Give him another chance to defend himself. I want to test another theory.

Also, if I go ahead and vote, the lynch could happen before I'm ready. I was...dissatisfied with D2 because of this.

Farside, about your meta analysis of Lowell- how much do you trust it?

[DedicatedScribe]

And again, can we have some conclusory discussion?

[DedicatedScribe]

Here's the promised continuation of my DS case.

I tried to stay unbiased, at that point. Later I realized you can't attack someone by being unbiased. Him being noob doesn't make him completely ignored, but I found it hard to lynch a noob for the attack on him at that point.

I don't understand - how did you try to stay unbiased? You state yourself you made a post stating you thought he was town, and then defended him about the entrance - but then you decided he couldn't completely ignored and FoSed?!
Still seems like serious fence-sitting.

I really tried to be VERY clear about my changing my mind about voting horrordude that day. Yes, was trying to convince myself. I had seen Ythan at his worst at this point, and felt he would repeat this tomorrow. This was not my envisionment of a good D2. I found horrordude's lynch inevitable. I was pretty careful not to say I thought horrordude was scum, despite the consequences.

So you didn't actually think he was scum? You tried to convince yourself onto the vote to get him lynched? Are you seriously admitting this?

Fence-sit is not taking sides, right? That's bad (scum bad)?

Not taking a side, fence-sitting is VERY scummy.
It allows you to try and remove any blame from yourself if you vote and then lynch someone. Taking a side allows us to read you when people you push on flip, and it also is pro-town in that you can push to lynch scum.

Ythan has my attention because of how he pushes lynches too forcefully.

Do you think this is a scumtell? If so, why?

Again, I will start scum-hunting independently ASAP.

It's D3, and you've done no independent scumhunting?

I would also like to direct you to several of my points you

didn't

answer. Could you please comment on your:
- Taking the easy way out to secure a lynch Re.WRP_Beater?
- Contridictory attitude regarding the same player?

Anyone who doesnt think horror is scum, vote for him anyway. As I said,

he is a safe lynch, being VT

, nooby, and [sorry to say] distracting. It is also D1.

This is a major point of my thinking you're scum.
You are STATING that horror is town, as if you know, but are perfectly willing to go through with it anyway.

@EVERYONE

- Do you think that this is a scumtell? Why?

The vast majority of my points still stand, all of which can be found in (and are summarised at the bottom of) my ISO 32.

Honestly, I didn't think fence sitting was a scumtell. I thought it was keeping my head clear. I also thought it would prevent a mislynch (of me). By unbiased, I mean, "Not too quickly becoming sure of his alliance". Like how Ythan acted like there was no possible way horrordude could be town.

Yes, I'm admitting this! I admitted this D1, during the action. I thought if I tried to hide my reasoning, it would be more scummy than the reasoning itself. But coupled with the unlikelihood that horrordude would not be lynched, and the thought that horrordude would make D2 as annoying as the second part of D1, (and also that Ythan seemed so sure that horrordude was scum, and my real unsurety in my abilities as a player at this game), I decided it would be a good idea to lynch horrordude, despite my great inclination that he was town.

I think force-feeding lynches is anti-town. As for scumtell...I don't know. I don't have enough expirience to reach that assumption.

I've done independant scumhunting, but only touch issues, rather than selecting a player, calling him scum, and pushing his lynch.

I never "take the easy way out". What do you mean?
Contradictory attitude goes along with my talk about unbias.

Again, I had hoped that my explaining why I was voting for horrordude, who I believed was town, in 3 posts, on D1, would make the attack on me about it less painful. I was surprised that there was little talk about this on D2.

***

Unsight, don't act like that was my only reason for not voting. And, I guess, I don't really see the point of voting right now, especially since I've recieved some pressure for not voting; if I vote now, a lot of the motivation would come from the pressure, and not my urge to vote. I'll vote when I feel like it.

[DedicatedScribe]

pman: give me one player you think has played town most of the game.

Ythan.

watch that come back and bite me in the butt.

lol

I'll switch to jb at deadline if needed. Rik looks worse with every post, though. Try a pbp look and see if you don't agree.

This isn't what I was looking for...but wasn't what I expected either.

[DedicatedScribe]

DedicatedScribe

- Good vote on Musher333.
- Makes the right call on horrordude(thinking he is town) early on Day 1.
- Also FoS's crypto for(what I consider) the right reasons.
- Seems eager to get things moving. This is a good thing.
-

In actuality, it isn't timely or convenient, as he's getting votes right now O.o

His join date kinda removes this point, however. Ill also

FoS WRP_ Beater

.

Don't understand this. What does his join date have to do with anything?

- FoS's horrordude, for disliking crypto's gut-based vote. But also calls it an attempt to set up a mislynch. That's a stretch.
- In post #279, lists WRP_Beater & Richard as two people he'd like to vote, but makes no real mention of finding Richard suspicious in either that post or the post before. He did FoS Richard in the prior post, but it was a joke FoS. So something about the way he says, "

Richard and Mr. Beater are on my more realistic hitlist for today. Shall we?

" just reeks of opportunistic bandwagoning. Ultimately, he goes with a WRP_Beater vote, which I actually do not, on its own, have an issue with.
- In this post he states that he thinks Richard is bad town, so that actually partially clears up the discrepency in the above point.
- Agrees with farside22's FoS on SaintKerrigan(where he doesn't explain his voteS).
- Disbelieves Richard's claim, but doesn't explain why. Seems inconsistent to me, as he was just saying that he thought Richard was dumb town.
- Unvotes WRP_Beater based on his reaction to the fake daykill. This is what I would have done.
- Votes Nobody Special, points out opportunistic votes against horrordude.
- Argues with Ythan over clarification for his horrordude case. Nothing noteworthy here.
- Votes horrordude for being the 'safe lynch.'
- States he's 50% sure he's scum, which is actually a fairly high percentage for how distraught he acts over feeling strongarmed into joining the wagon. Urges horrordude to vote for himself(bad).
- Requests modkill of horrordude. Ugh.
- Continues to defend his horrordude vote despite seeming to believe he is town.
- Day Two, votes for Nobody Special. No new reasons listed so I can only assume they are the same as before. He's first no the wagon, so it definitely doesn't look opportunistic.
- Seems honed in on Nobody Special. Poses a few questions to pman, but seems to be ignoring the threeo ther names listed in post #1225
- "

But still. Weird how the one who is night killed is the one you plan to have lynched the following day. First Richard, then Saint Kerrigan.

" Ugh, this is bad. Scum wouldn't go and kill the people they're trying to lynch. They'd save them as possible mislynches the following day.

All in all, I dislike more than I like. Particularly I don't like the insincere vote he placed on horrordude at the end of the first day, nor the push to have him modkilled. Basically, he appears to be overly eager to have the guy offed despite making it known that he thinks he will flip town. His Nobody Special vote during day two looks A-OK with me, but there's little diversity in his scum hunting.

This looks fun to comment on. Also a little wierd.

1. Join date = noob.

2 . Well, this goes with my basic assumption that there's more than 1 scum in each game. And I was trying to build pressure without actually using my vote. Oh. Now I see why people wonder why I haven't voted yet. (Side comment: It's because of my priority of defense over attack)

3. I explained why I disbelieved Richard's claim, through a series of comments on a series of posts.

4. I guess the reason it was 50% was because of that bandwagon fallacy. I was really wondering if I were just missing some obvious secret scumtell that Ythan wouldn't tell me about.

5. I didn't urge horrordude to vote himself. I urged the opposite. Don't blame me for something i DIDN'T do. That's just annoying.

6. Horrordude modkill would culminate into a more favourable end result than I expected.

[DedicatedScribe]

Sigh...No one is reading my response to the calling horror townie thing.

It WASNT a slip, I am fully admitting.

It was both a hypothetical reference to how horrordude was a safe lynch for the town, as well as a notion that it was likely he was telling the truth.

As for comment on "50%", when I typed it, I wasn't thinking the odds of his scumhood were high. I was expressing an "eh, he could be; maybe I'm missing something".

I prefered a modkill of horror because that'd be like lynching him without the day ending.

I've time for 1 last analysis. Lowell, what is wrong with our attacks on you?

[DedicatedScribe]

Ok. A few reflections, and then the progressive movement.

- post 2225, by Lowell. No. NO. That is definetly NOT the reason, definetly, why you are scummy. Wtf.
This just all goes back to my conspiracy theory that everyone had a meeting the day I joined the internet to not read my posts.

- Post 2227, Ythan, tell me more?

- 2228, that- thats completely beside the point, off topic, and, even worse, wrong. Are you reading the same thread as me?

omfg. I'm sorry.

vote lowell

. Even if I do get lynched, this mafia rubbed off on me good.

Now, lets get this show on the road. Lets lower perspective lynches by a bit.

***

We have:
bearner
Me (A dedicated scribe)
dragonfly
lowell
nachomama
mole
riddick
rick
ythan

Easy enough.
First off, we gotta unvote the new subs. They just got here and they can't make valid defenses for those they replaced. I say we wait and see if scummy behavior carries over to a replacement, and at that point, I won't be the only one for it.

So kindly unvote Nachomama and Dragonfly. If not, kindly explain why not. This should include an eloquent attack on the prospective scum in question.

Ythan isn't getting lynched today unless you can make a good attack on him. You'd have to do it fairly quickly. Seriously, pick a more valid wagon.

Now.
That's just 3 less people.

Everyone, if you'd cooperate, add anyone you must to this list, but also try reduce this list to 4 people.

This is a little more than a list of potential scum- A List of Potential Lynchees: scum who currently have a good enough case on them through which their lynch can and should occur today.

Could you?

[DedicatedScribe]

'Barely touches on question dodging' in that it doesn't touch on question dodging?

Other than misinterpreting the definition of 'barely', this post is moot. Wtf does it have to do with anything?

[DedicatedScribe]

First off, we gotta unvote the new subs. They just got here and they can't make valid defenses for those they replaced. I say we wait and see if scummy behavior carries over to a replacement, and at that point, I won't be the only one for it.

So kindly unvote Nachomama and Dragonfly. If not, kindly explain why not. This should include an eloquent attack on the prospective scum in question.

This is no way makes them any less a valid lynch. As for 2,227, what are you asking?

Right now it does; the subs' existences will confirm or deny the notion that the replacees' playstyles and/or expirience made them scummy, rather than alliance.

I think I asked you to explain a post?

[DedicatedScribe]

Lol, yes Ythan, I read well. Still, its moot.

You've dodged many a curious q. You can say that all these were meaningless, but they weren't. Examples can be cited.

You've rushed many a lynch, too.

Confirm or deny?

[DedicatedScribe]

I never said it makes them less scummy. I said it makes them less of a good d3 lynch.

[DedicatedScribe]

I like to think I'm helping to build pressure by backing Unsight up. It's not my attack.

So thats a deny?

[DedicatedScribe]

Ythan

less Valid lynch =/= less scummy player

[DedicatedScribe]

Sigh. You are so...argh.

If its opportunism to help a push along to see the response, that's fine. It isn't scummy.

So I'm making it up that you've been pushing lynches and dodging qs? ok. 1 sec.

[DedicatedScribe]

Ythan

less Valid lynch =/= less scummy player

You need to try harder to keep your argument straight between posts.

Lol. Right.

Now, I haven't posted any case against you; I'm reinforcing what Unsight said, and dividing fact from fiction.

Gimme 5 min of quoting without seeing a provoking post whenver I click quote, and I'll provide reason, fact, etc., showing you pushing lynches and dodging q's.

Oh, and the proper euphemism of what I was thinking is "egotistic", though not as accurate.

Just stop ragin and calm down.

[DedicatedScribe]

You've rushed many a lynch, too.

So I'm making it up that you've been pushing lynches?

Is this a typo or are you that bad.

repitition isnt bad. Interrogators do it all the time, for many reasons. I'm not that, but its fun to roleplay.

No need to rage b/c I ask something twice- just motion that you noticed it, and imply your rejection or approval.

[DedicatedScribe]

Before I start:

push: to move with force

rush: to urge to an unnatural speed

From now on, when I say these, this is what I mean.

[DedicatedScribe]

ahem. Good job at pointing out that discrepancy.

The words are nearly interchangable, as rushing a lynch is undeniably pushing it. I mean to find instances where you pushed a lynch to the point of rushing it.

On a side note, my browser has stated, for the first time ever, "This web page is too big to properly..." I can guess you may suffer from this as well, leading you to forget your lynch rushing earlier in the game. But that was rude, but I refuse to backspace it.

I believe ive found a solution to this issue, that by limiting theresults to a certain # of days, your posts can be viewed. Repeating this just in case someone ignored me the 1st time, and also since this will lengthen the time it takes to list a few post #s.

[DedicatedScribe]

Ythan, that's exactly what I just said. Again, thank you for clearing up the discrepancy. You get my shiniest gold star, and the assurance that I feel considerably demoralized, inferior, and depressed because I am completely-wrong-and-you-are-right, and I fail to voice my agreement with you that you-are-right-and-I'm-wrong sufficiently.

I have Opera. On a Nintendo DSi. Shortening it to a month doesn't work anymore. Hm...

[DedicatedScribe]

Also, I'd like to point out that my point is "Ythan rushed lynches, and dodged valid questions",using the past-tense, Ythan-accepted-in-this-thread version of the term "rush".

Furthermore, my larger point is not, "Ythan is scum"; closer to "Ythan is wrong in saying that he did not do these things."

[DedicatedScribe]

I still believe that Ythan is focusing too much on my uses of the words "push" and "rush". I have stated the reasning for this terrible mistake in my vocabulary, and begged His forgiveness for my lack of a perfect vocabulary. I do admit that I used google to clarify the definitions of those two words so that the problem would not persist.

[DedicatedScribe]

By proving my point, I hope to help continue the inquiry that is held on all players' alliances.

[DedicatedScribe]

Yes, I am scumhunting. Oh, and I'd like to correct you; I'm not making a case, but supporting one.

Goddamn it. I can't even limit it to 1 week. Hm...new plan.

Ythan, confirm or deny the following:

If DedicatedScribe came out and said, a considerable amount of time from deadline,"Quick! vote hjjgjdd! Now! Why are you going so slowly? We don't need more discussion!", this is rushing.

Also c/d:

This is a scumtell.

This is him either trying to make the town make a hasty decision, or bussing a scumpal.

Rushing the town is an antitown thing to do.

I'm going somewhere with this. I promise.

Oh, and consider hjj a moderately scummy, nooby player.

[DedicatedScribe]

Ythan, I'm focusing on the same point I started on when Unsight made an attack against you earlier tonight.

[DedicatedScribe]

Again: just because I'm not calling you scum doesn't mean I'm not scumhunting.

[DedicatedScribe]

Restatement/Clarification:

1. I am scumhunting.

2. I am not calling Ythan scum.

3. The two above do not contradict each other.

[DedicatedScribe]

Also, please answer on hypothetical event.

[DedicatedScribe]

Just consider these like "Do you like policy lynches" questions, and understand that I am attempting to establish a read on you by asking you questions, making a point, and then observing your response.

[DedicatedScribe]

By answer, I mean, play along. For once. Seriously, what's the worst that can happen?

I'll use your response and compare it with relevant opinionated posts. Is that what you want to know?

[DedicatedScribe]

Ythan, consider the possibility that it is not pointless. If you can show to me its pointless when I'm done, I'll never play mafia again. I don't even see how its any more pointless than a D1 Q of your policy lynch opnions.

[DedicatedScribe]

You'll have to point me to ehere you answered my post in the way I have requested (yes or no; feel free to include reasoning).

[DedicatedScribe]

Yes, I am scumhunting. Oh, and I'd like to correct you; I'm not making a case, but supporting one.

Goddamn it. I can't even limit it to 1 week. Hm...new plan.

Ythan, confirm or deny the following:

If DedicatedScribe came out and said, a considerable amount of time from deadline,"Quick! vote hjjgjdd! Now! Why are you going so slowly? We don't need more discussion!", this is rushing.

Also c/d:

This is a scumtell.

This is him either trying to make the town make a hasty decision, or bussing a scumpal.

Rushing the town is an antitown thing to do.

I'm going somewhere with this. I promise.

Oh, and consider hjj a moderately scummy, nooby player.

Im gonna go ahead and point out that I wanted more than one thing c/d-ed.

[DedicatedScribe]

Farside, meh:

1. Has Ythan rushed lynches?

2. Has Ythan dodged Q's?

I'm having issues citing these.

[DedicatedScribe]

Sigh. Ythan, thank you for cooperating, eventually, barely.

This would have gone better if I could do it myself, but I already explained why I could not.

I'll wait for computer access. I won't let you down after this arduous 30-60 min of commitment, but its late, and ds browsers suck and make me groggy.

I'll quote the dodging and rushing and pushing tomorrow. Buenos noches.

[DedicatedScribe]

ythan, there's evidence. A lot of evidence. I'm sure I could find a wall-post of mine to "barely touch" what I'm talking about.

I'm no liar. And you can check Ythan's posts to prove it, if you can get your compuer to load them; but I might do a whole 100 page re-read tomorrow anyway.

[DedicatedScribe]

Tied? wtf? Ah...sorry for missing out, guys.