Large Normal 245 | Game Over

[Flavor Leaf]

VOTE: Random Nurse
no more bulletproofs for you

I claim BP

[Flavor Leaf]

I’m VLA yesterday and tomorrow then I’ll come spice up the game and disappear after

[Flavor Leaf]

Y’all stop being so right so early, let them live

[Flavor Leaf]

Y’all stop being so right so early, let them live

you really like taking the longest paths for the win huh

Depends on the perspective

[Flavor Leaf]

I’m getting gut pinged by Snivy this game, dunno why

I’ve never gotten scum pinged by them before and i never have seen them as scum, so it’s weird.

[Flavor Leaf]

i have 2 scum games where one was a rep in into a bus and the other was a rep in ELO into free win

sucks to suck

What is this relevant towards?

I said I’ve never seen you as scum before, so I’ve never gotten to read you in real time when you were scum.

I think there’s merit to it here. It feels like you have a drastically different energy than I’ve seen you with here, and it already feels performative

[Flavor Leaf]

Noted.

[Flavor Leaf]

I usually don’t even try to play this early, but i wanted to pressure Sniffles there after they pinged me

[Flavor Leaf]

It was a combination of the celeb is town post + the “really like taking long way to win”

Kinda combo of possible conditioning the gamestate and social control.

It was enough for me to want to pressure and see where it goes, so it’s like def a Page 3 read so take that what you will.

First and only true feeling about a slot this game

[Flavor Leaf]

Snivy obv scum

[Flavor Leaf]

But maybe we can lettem live a bit

[Flavor Leaf]

Snivy obv scum

remember the last time you thought this

I’ve never thought this.

Only time i misfaded you was to make sure we cover all bases, and the play worked in the long run anyways, so this is a misrep

[Flavor Leaf]

Hu Tao trying to get a defense teammate going by defending the Sniffles.

[Flavor Leaf]

They team building

[Flavor Leaf]

Not a good luck for Naerys thus far

I’m just shooting the shit all game until something starts to click

[Flavor Leaf]

it was a meme wagon

UNVOTE: Hu Tao

VOTE: Flavor Leaf

the only reason i didnt vote you earlier is because i have this notion that scum!you will always town read me because i haven't really made an effort to scumcase you in our games (which hasn't backfired yet!)

Naive of you to think you know where im leaning on Page 6

[Flavor Leaf]

Guarantee you there is scum in Snivy, Naerys, STD

[Flavor Leaf]

I’m actively laying down honey traps.

[Flavor Leaf]

Guarantee you there is scum in Snivy, Naerys, STD

Why

Honey traps, Hu Tao

Honey

[Flavor Leaf]

Guarantee you there is scum in Snivy, Naerys, STD

Interesting, is there a common thread or no?

Yes.

[Flavor Leaf]

Damage controlling me

[Flavor Leaf]

The scum in them, could be multiple, are threatened by my troll posting and trying to halt any momentum i could build and making sure i don’t get town read for it.

[Flavor Leaf]

I’m just saying shit to say shit with a hint of truce.

It pinged. It’s really that low.

How does it ping? Idk. Could town then ping? Yeah, but I’m getting a hell lot more out of reads seeing how out of proportion people pushing with it and taking a side to and for.

I’m sure some are absolutely political. In fact, I have no doubt.

[Flavor Leaf]

The scum in them, could be multiple, are threatened by my troll posting and trying to halt any momentum i could build and making sure i don’t get town read for it.

Not even mighty flavor can be always correct. Your previous statement was at the very least 33% incorrect.

ill call it as a win if im even a 33% correct

[Flavor Leaf]

VOTE: Heipizhuh

[Flavor Leaf]

I’m just saying shit to say shit with a hint of truce.

It pinged. It’s really that low.

How does it ping? Idk. Could town then ping? Yeah, but I’m getting a hell lot more out of reads seeing how out of proportion people pushing with it and taking a side to and for.

I’m sure some are absolutely political. In fact, I have no doubt.

So it has nothing to do with previous experience? Which is what I understood from that post?

I mean that’s part of it that i hadn’t ever got pinged by them before

But again, i think people acting like i scum read them more than i do

I never even voted them

[Flavor Leaf]

It was like…an rvs stage gut ping, didn’t even get me out of troll mode

[Flavor Leaf]

Heipz has

[Flavor Leaf]

I’m almost ready to play for real

[Flavor Leaf]

I feel like i been trolling and got more reads than most of yall

[Flavor Leaf]

My brain been mush the past 5 days dealing with some real life projects, i technically self considered myself VLA. But VLA ends tomorrow.

[Flavor Leaf]

And someone gonna get it

[Flavor Leaf]

I have an actual theory for it too.

So outing it, Smiley, Dannfloor, Snivy, and I are in a neighborhood.

Look at Heipz question to Snivy

[Flavor Leaf]

Thank, Alianna!

slight town leans on flavor leaf and ccs, i see where fl is coming from on ccs but i also think snivy's posting feels forced because he's the first slot to try to bring the game out of RVS?

i don't particularly like 68, it feels a little scared to put down a vote

"slight" pings of "potential" pocketing

and then the assurance that you're only voting there for the time being

I use that language cause I'm feeling somewhat conflicted on that slot right now. I'm a bit dissatisfied of 33 as an answer to 32 as it feels like a pocket-y answer to me, though it's also weirdly stubborn in a way that feels + town. I'm hoping that by placing some pressure on CCS I can get a better read of their intentions.

Agree with this post here, I'm also getting conflicted read on CCS as well. The early posts he made pings me as a town moving the game out of rvs (like what I was doing in Normal Idea Mafia), but his later posts feel like, idk, posting as often as he could do to farm post counts?
Gonna park the vote on him until some more quality posts are made though.
VOTE: ccs
@ccs What's your read on smilely, FL and Dannflor?

This makes me feel Heinz is scum with someone in the neighborhood, and they naturally grouped us together because they knew who was in it.

How many scum games does Heipz have on site?

[Flavor Leaf]

Also, Snivy tried getting me to stop shading them in main thread in neighborhood. Idk if that is scummy but it was sketchy and odd considering they vote me but I’m not voting them. They said it after too

[Flavor Leaf]

Early town read on Gamma based on the Snivy positioning

[Flavor Leaf]

@Snivy - literally like pre-game you stated, and I paraphrase, is there a reason we shouldn’t immediately out this neighborhood?

I know there was also talks of us all 4 voting for lulls on the same person recently, but you pushed it like a joke.

I would argue outing was the best way to get my Heipz reasoning out, and explain a bit more why I’m suspicious of Snivy.

I don’t 100% think Snivy is scum here, but they’re acting like they should be seen as squeaky clean, and it’s just not the case.

I’m in the neighborhood bubble with them, and people coming at me because they don’t know about that stuff

[Flavor Leaf]

And Hu Tao thought it would be nice if I really played, so how bout that for really playing yaga

[Flavor Leaf]

Thank, Alianna!

slight town leans on flavor leaf and ccs, i see where fl is coming from on ccs but i also think snivy's posting feels forced because he's the first slot to try to bring the game out of RVS?

i don't particularly like 68, it feels a little scared to put down a vote

"slight" pings of "potential" pocketing

and then the assurance that you're only voting there for the time being

I use that language cause I'm feeling somewhat conflicted on that slot right now. I'm a bit dissatisfied of 33 as an answer to 32 as it feels like a pocket-y answer to me, though it's also weirdly stubborn in a way that feels + town. I'm hoping that by placing some pressure on CCS I can get a better read of their intentions.

Agree with this post here, I'm also getting conflicted read on CCS as well. The early posts he made pings me as a town moving the game out of rvs (like what I was doing in Normal Idea Mafia), but his later posts feel like, idk, posting as often as he could do to farm post counts?
Gonna park the vote on him until some more quality posts are made though.
VOTE: ccs
@ccs What's your read on smilely, FL and Dannflor?

This makes me feel Heinz is scum with someone in the neighborhood, and they naturally grouped us together because they knew who was in it.

How many scum games does Heipz have on site?

How do you look at this post and not have any reaction towards it?

Like even if it does end up being a coincidence, i don’t feel it warrants zero reaction from that a newer player asked you about your exact 3 neighbors.

[Flavor Leaf]

You ask for the flavor you getting the spice

[Flavor Leaf]

My way too early solve incorporates multiple of Naerys, Snivy, Heipz, and like Afrayed Not.

Either I am being damage controlled or Snivy is town, and scum are trying to keep Snivy vs FL alive.

[Flavor Leaf]

Flavor Leaf is actually making good points about things unlike the last game I played with him where he was scum? Maybe he flipped town this time?

Smiley I could see going either way

Snivy is playing like he has something to hide

What a great scum game. Glad i got to be scum with Alianna.

[Flavor Leaf]

This Holdsteady-Heipz-Snivy triangle has legs, never in a they’re all scum type of way, but in a, i kinda wanna make some popcorn, and see how the gamestate goes and what people’s takes are and where people push after this past page kinda way if that makes sense

[Flavor Leaf]

Ccs, why haven’t you reacted towards Heipz asking you your reads on every single one of your Neighbors?

[Flavor Leaf]

Prior to the reveal

[Flavor Leaf]

Yeah, i incepted into Heipz dreams and got them to mention to Snivy all 3 of the Snivy’s neighbors so I could push them for that exact reason

[Flavor Leaf]

he's two votes away from shadow realm i wanna hear from him

He claim that he isnt neighbor
so for this day its basically fl claim or heip claim

Why do you keep acting like it’s one of the other or like I’m doing something?

What is it do you think I’m doing?

Because the neighborhood is literally confirmed, it’s not a ‘FL claim’

[Flavor Leaf]

I feel like it’s worth pressuring, Naerys is acting like it isn’t. If Heipz is scum, that 100% confirms scum is in the neighborhood, I would say

[Flavor Leaf]

Smells like flavor shenanigan

I also wants this explained please.


What exactly is a flavor shenanigan here?

[Flavor Leaf]

he's two votes away from shadow realm i wanna hear from him

He claim that he isnt neighbor
so for this day its basically fl claim or heip claim

Why do you keep acting like it’s one of the other or like I’m doing something?

What is it do you think I’m doing?

Because the neighborhood is literally confirmed, it’s not a ‘FL claim’

how i am supposed to know that its truth? cant read ur mind,sorry

Supposed to know that what is the truth?

[Flavor Leaf]

Smells like flavor shenanigan

I also wants this explained please.


What exactly is a flavor shenanigan here?

Honey traps.

Oh sure. That’s all shenanigans. I was openly trolling and not paying attention to the game at the time really

[Flavor Leaf]

Supposed to know that what is the truth?

the stuff you claimed

What stuff

[Flavor Leaf]

Supposed to know that what is the truth?

the stuff you claimed

What stuff

the neighbour one
after certain stuff i have hard time to believe any claim at all tbh

alright then, that means you dont believe Snivy, Dannfloor, and Smiley either.

Not just a Flavor thing, dont act like it's just me.

[Flavor Leaf]

im going to claim that x, titus, naryes, and i are all in a neighborhood and that heip is just good at outing neighborhoods

if this is true, naerys is scum almost always here.

[Flavor Leaf]

I really don't see comprehension of what's happening in the game with Naerys in regards to my slot specifically. They're hiding behind "they're good scum" to blanket discredit, and they kinda avoid any full answers.

[Flavor Leaf]

I don't think I'm gonna get anymore out of this so I'll just say now

there is a neighborhood with me/FL/Snivy/Smiley

I was lying not FL

I lied to see if I could get anything out of Naerys

I didn't really get anything useful from Naerys specifically but I think Gamma looks unaligned with anyone in the neighborhood

Whoa a lot happened on that last page . Agreed on Gamma, also like Celeb's 273 in the midst of this, feels like a logical thought process.

I think Celeb comes out looking better than Gamma even.

As far as Day 1 goes, anyways. As the game goes on, I wanna see how Celeb's mind works a bit more, but for now, i'm feeling good.

[Flavor Leaf]

I really don't see comprehension of what's happening in the game with Naerys in regards to my slot specifically. They're hiding behind "they're good scum" to blanket discredit, and they kinda avoid any full answers.

where did i try to discredit?

it's your entire energy. if you tryna act like you aren't, then idk, probably an uphill battle.

[Flavor Leaf]

did we really solve this already as heip + smiley or danfloor? it's never really that easy, is it?

Never that easy.

I’m thinking more Heip + Snivy or Smiley myself. Don’t see it as Dann

[Flavor Leaf]

All 3 of the other neighbors are kind of avoiding going onto Heip while keeping it open. Snivy pushed to Holdsteady, Dann to Naerys, and Smiley with Snivy.

Out of the 3, Dann’s the towniest.

This is purely associative, though.

If we’re wrong on Heipz, and it somehow is a coincidence, then idk. I don’t think there has to be scum in the neighborhood in that scenario, which imo, makes Naerys a bit scummier.


This is a juicy game so far, I can’t like confidently say for sure it’s any of them, but there’s threads for each. Just as easily could be getting played by scum manipulating my push.

This game was pretty slow until I came in, and even when I hadn’t come in yet, people were like revolving around waiting for me to make a move it felt.

So i feel scum are trying to warlock me here

[Flavor Leaf]

My only defense for Heipz on an objective level.

But their lack of direct defense means scum probably is trying to protect them without tying themselves to them in case they go down.

[Flavor Leaf]

Scum using warlock magical powers to turn a townie into a Demon that runs rampant.

Right now, the main slots I’m wanting to look into more is Heipz, Holdsteady, Naerys, Snivy, Smiley.

[Flavor Leaf]

Can you explain the neighborhoods?

idk nothing really happened in there aside from me asking FL to stop shading me because FL was pretending it was the scum PT

I mean who is in what hood.

Smiley, Snivy, FL, Dannflo

Only neighborhood legit

[Flavor Leaf]

UNVOTE: Heipz

Consider me still on them, but not ready for day end.

[Flavor Leaf]

They are Vanilla, though, so it’s in a worst case scenario, we go to Day 2 with scum having close to zero info, so they’re not that bad of a fade.

[Flavor Leaf]

I'm down to just end day on Heipz and avoid any more info coming into the day. They're high scum equity, and worst case scenario, they flip Vanilla, and we go to day 2 without any other claims.

[Flavor Leaf]

VOTE: Heipz

if it flips town, ill just blame Hu Tao.

[Flavor Leaf]

VOTE: Heipz

if it flips town, ill just blame Hu Tao.

Kidding

[Flavor Leaf]

no way all four people in the hood are town.

this is just neighbor WIFOM, if Heipz is scum, then yeah, i would say there is always scum in the hood.

Defending Heipz + pushing no way all four in hood are town isn't a good look.

[Flavor Leaf]

everyone gets obsessed with neighbors for setup reasons, but you have to just read neighbors like they arent in a neighborhood because on a setup level Neighborhoods are there to WIFOM you.

[Flavor Leaf]

VOTE: X formerly

[Flavor Leaf]

now compared to later

why does this matter? vote them when you think they're scum. you're minimizing the game, and it looks like you're TMI'ing Heipz town.

[Flavor Leaf]

I don't mind your vote, I already pushed some suspicion on Smiley myself. Interesting you're trying to make it about Smiley.

[Flavor Leaf]

just looks like you're trying to get ahead of the heipz wagon, and then find a reason to plow through neighbors, which is like 75% or 100% filled with town.

[Flavor Leaf]

now compared to later

why does this matter? vote them when you think they're scum. you're minimizing the game, and it looks like you're TMI'ing Heipz town.

maybe you're tming heip town by saying we are because you know or something. to answer: we doing this cos heip felt sort of decent. chances are high there's scum in your hood otherwise it'll be just bad design. that's as simple as it gets.

I have already said in my neighborhood that I think there's a chance Heipz flips town, but I was still willing to vote there to limit info coming out, so it's a really garbage way to do so if so.

I'm generally down to fade a Vanilla claim when there's no other claims on the board.

[Flavor Leaf]

I don't mind your vote, I already pushed some suspicion on Smiley myself. Interesting you're trying to make it about Smiley.

well that's the most recent thing we've done, voting smiley, that doesn't fit the general game pattern so 4 scum 11 town with 2 scum in a hood has crossed our mind.

we'll see if your vote is a mere reaction test as things roll along.

to be fair, i wasn't even paying attention at all to where your vote was, but you keep bringing it back there.

[Flavor Leaf]

VOTE: X formerly

Didnt you just say you wanted to end the day on heip?

before X f was TMI'ing it, yeah. Still might go back, but I think pressure on the X f slot is fine.

[Flavor Leaf]

just looks like you're trying to get ahead of the heipz wagon, and then find a reason to plow through neighbors, which is like 75% or 100% filled with town.

well i did say i'd love to plow through the neighbours. otherwise this is starting to feel like propaganda from you and whether from town or scum i don't play that game

Alright, then I shall become a Neighborhood defender then.

[Flavor Leaf]

Town has to sort everyone, not just the people in the hood.

[Flavor Leaf]

and at the end of the day, we're more likely to implode from within than anything.

[Flavor Leaf]

your mentality on it seems like a scum tactic, but we'll see what your reads are on people outside the hood over time, I guess.

[Flavor Leaf]

VOTE: Heipz

That's fair. You picked the right 2 in the neighborhood to shade anyways.

Alright, im ready to end the day, I think that back and forth was worth it.

[Flavor Leaf]

UNVOTE: Heipz

Take some time. I dont mind about deadline really, moreso about the natural game flow. I think there's merit in going on Heipz for the possible slip + Vanilla claim with no other claims.

Because end of the day, you'll be here tomorrow anyways bar you getting night killed.

[Flavor Leaf]

i've felt like Smiley is the background player in the neighborhood 4, so i dont feel like THS's analysis on this being their scum game with that meta feels accurate.

My reasoning for possible ScumSmiley was exactly the opposite, like I said, that they were the background player in the 4, possibly hiding and avoiding full confrontation.

[Flavor Leaf]

Might fuck around and hammer, but it’s juicy rn

[Flavor Leaf]

heipizhu might actually be onto something with hu tao/snivy

If and it's a big if Heipz flips town I think you could be scum. Seems like you're trying to set up. But you could just be misguided right now.

I’m starting to lean this more than Heipz scum right now

[Flavor Leaf]

I fell asleep or I would have hammered

[Flavor Leaf]

Oh i woke up just in time,

Did somebody say E-1?

VOTE: Heipzu

[Flavor Leaf]

Was i the tunneler or the savior?

And were you a Seraph Knight?

[Flavor Leaf]

Was it that Fire Emblem Fates game in like 2017

[Flavor Leaf]

Oh i woke up just in time,

Did somebody say E-1?

VOTE: Heipzu

Here is to hoping he's actually scum. If not I'll feel bad since he's new.

It was too coincidental with the way they asked Snivy. The slot got compromised because of that. And then they happened to be Vanilla.

Celebloki’s post about why it could have happened coincidentally is why I started to back off a bit, especially because imo, X is super scummy and TMI’d, but the slot had to be flipped.

[Flavor Leaf]

Their defense of Heip + incessant “has to be scum in neighborhood” mentality doesn’t add up for me.

Like yeah, Snivy or Smiley is probably scum, but it’s not like a certainty just because of a neighborhood.

I have modded plenty of games with all town neighborhoods, and that’s like the scum thing to push when a neighborhood is an all town neighborhood.

[Flavor Leaf]

Oh, you’re 2016.

[Flavor Leaf]

Loyal Vig.

I got a guilty on a neighbor

[Flavor Leaf]

youre claiming the kill?

Lack of kill

[Flavor Leaf]

interesting

wanna share?

Do i

[Flavor Leaf]

Well, we're back. I think good topics for discussion for today are Naerys, Snivy, and Smiley. Also, Hu Tao is to blame for heip, they said they'd take the heat

While I’m sure scum took advantage of it, it was a wild coincidence with Heip, but i brought up in the neighborhood that your reasoning probably makes sense on how it happened.

It gave me pause near the end.

[Flavor Leaf]

I shot at Smiley last night.

Snivy claimed BP in neighborhood, though, so that’s something, but I think we always just go Smiley here today.

[Flavor Leaf]

Like claimed after I claimed.

VOTE: Smiley

[Flavor Leaf]

I was originally gonna try and act like Snivy was my shot to see how Smiley reacted towards it, but it’s like obv Smiley is scum here.

[Flavor Leaf]

I shot at Smiley last night.

Snivy claimed BP in neighborhood, though, so that’s something, but I think we always just go Smiley here today.

He claimed it after you claimed vig on him?

I didn’t claim to vig on them.

I was gonna, but things just happened in a way where I think it’s kinda obv Smiley is scum.

[Flavor Leaf]

And i don’t see them as aligned, so it’s like…i would almost say 100% sure Smiley is scum here.

There’s like little possibilities they aren’t, but i don’t think they’re worth getting into over just fading them

[Flavor Leaf]

It will become apparent as the game goes on.

The cool thing about claiming vig early is that if your shots dont line up we'll kill you for being an SK before endgame

I’m gated

[Flavor Leaf]

Also, if I was a SK, all my kills would line up too much and that’s why i would be caught out not the other way around.

[Flavor Leaf]

Hopefully we get someone active in RN’s slot

[Flavor Leaf]

Dannfloor and I both had a guilty on Smiley. Smiley being scum, they obviously told their partners before they died.

I claimed I had guilty first neighborhood post of Day 2.

[Flavor Leaf]

I targeted Hu Tao last night.

I’m N1 N2.

I think it’s likely i got blocked, though.

[Flavor Leaf]

Yup. I decided to vote you anyway.

On a serious note, I agree you likely got blocked.

I’m interested to see what Gob can bring to the table.

That slot is essentially blank.

[Flavor Leaf]

I would imagine there’s a scum on the back end of that Smiley wagon. Davesaz, Naerys, or Gamma, based purely on VCA.

[Flavor Leaf]

Naerys, Gob, STD/Pisskop is a potential solve.

[Flavor Leaf]

With one of them being possible SK, if Snivy isn’t, but if there’s a SK, then I imagine we for sure would have gotten a 2nd night kill by now.

I’m leaning toward 4 scum based on 15, but 3 strong scum PR’s is possible.

[Flavor Leaf]

I’m down to open wolf in a bit. I’ll do some VCA first, though, when i got some time

[Flavor Leaf]

I’m confused why Dann died over CCS, unless the hood tells a different story than the main thread

Dann had a claimed guilty on Smiley. Dann didn’t claim role until after Night fell, so Scum didn’t know Dann’s role, but they knew they had a guilty.

We double guiltied, that’s why we were like super positive that it was scum.

And I’m sure it came out to the scum team, but Snivy claimed BP in Neighborhood after I claimed Loyal Vig.

I would have thought that was suspicious if we didn’t have like for sure scum on Smiley.

[Flavor Leaf]

The 3 i mentioned were purely on VCA from Smiley. I forgot who Dave replaced, but they replaced X?

Eh, i thought X was scummy, but they look good on Smiley’s flips.

Dann was gonna target Naerys last night.

[Flavor Leaf]

I’m confused why Dann died over CCS, unless the hood tells a different story than the main thread

Dann had a claimed guilty on Smiley. Dann didn’t claim role until after Night fell, so Scum didn’t know Dann’s role, but they knew they had a guilty.

We double guiltied, that’s why we were like super positive that it was scum.

And I’m sure it came out to the scum team, but Snivy claimed BP in Neighborhood after I claimed Loyal Vig.

I would have thought that was suspicious if we didn’t have like for sure scum on Smiley.

So you dismiss the possibility of 2 scums in the hood?

It's possible, im not thinking it's more likely than 1 scum, though. I'd say like 65-35 probs, so it's a solid chance. I talked about Snivy possibility still. I'm leaning town on them, right now, but their BP claim is decent SK or traitor potential. Could even be a fake claim. I'm not wanting to fade them simply because of neighborhood and think that's silly overall. lim on play.

[Flavor Leaf]

but snivy is still in the pool, but to say i think they're scum, they do have a defense of i have to think 2 scum are in neighborhood WIFOM.

Not where my focus is at right now at all

[Flavor Leaf]

Thank you pisskop.

Based on D1, I'd be suspect of people not on Heip. I think scum knew he was town and avoided the inevitable wagon and pushed elsewhere. Hu Tao is likely town then.

Pushing a partner when it's known someone else will eat rope is great distancing.

There’s only 3 unflipped off of Heipz. With likely 3 scum left, i doubt it’s all on the off.

I don’t necessarily agree with this.

I see it more likely as 2 on, 1 off or 1 on 2 off, but never 3 off, not with where the rest of the flips are.

[Flavor Leaf]

idk, i could even see all 3 on heipz frankly.

[Flavor Leaf]

i dont even know who im town reading at this point.

[Flavor Leaf]

It feels like we're at a reset, which is fine. Scum are probably reassessing strategy right now and waiting.

i think my immediate focus is on Naerys or Hu Tao. Pisskop is playing alright, but i can see them as scum. I can't really make a case for Pissk, just a feeling, but i'm paranoid of Pissk here. Stems from yesterday and feeling like they were trying to find a way to turn it to me, or at least plant that seed.

[Flavor Leaf]

What are people's thoughts on Celebloki calling out a reason why Heipz could have called out every neighbor like that?

[Flavor Leaf]

naery would be my choice. somebody get a cop on Hu or something

I mean, Gunsmith is dead, and I didn't get a kill on Hu tao.

how much more investigative power you think we have?

[Flavor Leaf]

My issue with Naerys now is that she was initially unbelieving of your neighborhood claim. Now that we know Smiley's alignment and that he was in the hood, surely the rest of scum knew from the start about the hood. I'm not sure Naerys would have argued back and forth with you over your claim in that case. She seemed genuinely confused to me. Not like it was an act to pretend not to have TMI.

it was already confirmed basically, though, wasnt it?

[Flavor Leaf]

seemed genuinely confused to me. Not like it was an act to pretend not to have TMI.

it was already confirmed basically, though, wasnt it?

Fighting against something as easily proved as a neighborhood claim from 4 people is silly. Theatre-esque

i know, that means it was fighting for fighting sake, something I know I do a lot as scum, which is my point.

[Flavor Leaf]

I talked in the neighborhood a bit about how I feel Celeb is genuine, but im worried they're a lot scarier scum than they seem, and I can see them TMI'ing Heipz, and either TMI'ing or defending partner Naerys here.

[Flavor Leaf]

And even more interestingly, its not alignment indicative as a claim, and it doesnt actually progress the game to debate over it

I disagree, I think we debated plenty enough on it, and it was getting towards my next Celebloki case.

[Flavor Leaf]

Ok, I will just go ahead and say what I am thinking. I didn't want to say this earlier because I didn't want heip to just parrot this and think I'm on his side. I'm not.

I will preface this by saying I don't regard this as a good defense by him and his lack of trying to explain himself at this point is more telling than the actual slip. I agree with Hu Tao that he's frozen scum.

...

Wait, how did I miss out the neighbor claim. My bad though.

I grouped smiley, Dann and FL out because they are the one of few guys who were actually posting game-relavent content

, so I thought it would be appropriate to ask snivy about the 3 reads. And a wild guess here, is STD, x, Titus and Narey in the same neighborhood and they have decided to wagon on me together?

If you do read the first few pages, the only people talking outside of RVS are Snivy and Smiley regarding Snivy's "Celeb's post is town" posts. FL and Snivy going back and forth about FL's gut ping on him, and again Dannflor and Smiley talking about me again. So up to that point on page 4, only the neighborhood was really talking. I still think it's a pretty wild coincidence if it was just a coincidence.

I only bring this up now because I was waiting to see if heip would try and fight this angle more. His lack of doing so so far is as much of a red flag to me as the slip itself. If he tries and use this argument now, the ship has sailed as far as myself being swayed by it. I am perfectly happy with his wagon and could be a final vote. I am also suspicious of Snivy, I think the mod has miscounted my vote on him. I think what I felt off about his posts make more sense after hearing about the neighborhood talk.

@Mod: I think you're pissing a vote from me on Snivy in 138

Wow, heip just keeps teetering on the brink. I still think he's likely scum. His defense didn't really sway me. There has been a lot of good info by keeping this in Day. In the hood I'm of the belief that at least FL and Dann are town. There's at least 1 scum between Snivy and Smiley. I'm still leaning towards Snivy. Outside of the hood I am still of the opinion that Naerys is likely scum and I am dubious of X. They seems like they've been trying hard to derail heip, but also appear to still be on board with it. I think if heip does flip town, we have some good leads for tomorrow, so it wouldn't be a hard loss.

Since we seem to be having trouble getting that last vote I'll add mine to the mix.

VOTE: heipizhu4

this pair of posts.

[Flavor Leaf]

I initially thought the first one was super townie, but in hindsight, it's not. it's a really great observation and it turned out IS likely exactly what happened.

[Flavor Leaf]

They leaned SnivyScum over Smiley too, and leaned on Naerys, which is a slot they pseudo defended a second ago.

[Flavor Leaf]

if scum dont have a blocker, then Hu Tao is guiltied scum.

should we mass claim? Or at least if anyone got blocked on Night 1, they should claim.

It's hard for me to ignore them living.

[Flavor Leaf]

if scum dont have a blocker, then Hu Tao is guiltied scum.

what did I miss?

i shot at Hu Tao last night.

[Flavor Leaf]

Hu Tao doesnt feel like scum to me, tbh

hu tao gets universally town read when scum, and i dont think they look good after the combination of day 1-2.

when i only town read people off tone, i typically get worried, it's why i shot there. i didnt decide until late, though, my mind was not with this game over the night, and they were kind of my placeholder/security action i used in case i didnt come up with another slot.

but then they make a move where i can read em in the moment, so i imagine theyd be weary of me at this point.

IF scum have a blocker, though, I was most likely the blocked for the potential fake guilty unless scum were cocky enough to think id shoot town.

I rarely miss as Vig.

[Flavor Leaf]

but im okay leaving Hu Tao a bit, but they shouldnt end game unless a scum blocker flips.

with that

VOTE: Naerys Ill join the other suspect.

[Flavor Leaf]

i was gonna shoot Naerys, but i told Dann they were a good check, and they said theyd check there.

[Flavor Leaf]

Dann was gonna check Titus, but I opened my mouth and got rid of my main suspect as a target

[Flavor Leaf]

even if i was blocked, still doesn't make Hu tao town, though

[Flavor Leaf]

if anything, i think it's better to err on the side that Hu tao is scum rather than err on them being town.

Like same level as Naerys/Pisskop/Dave at the least.

[Flavor Leaf]

they are, and Hu Tao could have been protected.


hu Tao can still be scum who got docced, though.

im more just advocating for this as a possibility so it doesn't get lost and something comes out and auto towns Hu Tao and they coast. hu Tao is slippery. Don't let them slip if they are scum.

I think there's merit to Hu tao scum, but just spending some time making sure that point gets across so we dont get to like Day 5 and go 'oh hu tao got docc'd, must mean town' cuz it doesnt auto make them town in that scenario.

[Flavor Leaf]

like a town doctor targeting ScumTao the same scenario happens.

I feel like for some reason Hu Tao's getting a pass, and on a gamestate level, that just feels off to me.

if anything they should be neutral, not a free pass.

[Flavor Leaf]

hilarious possibility: scum doctor protected town hu tao. lol

[Flavor Leaf]

but - if youre a loyal vig then what are they doccing from?

Dannfloor

[Flavor Leaf]

Snivy BP claim, if true, town doesnt really need a Doc, might be rough for a scum team unless they have a strongman.

i would say if scum have a doc that targeted Hu TaoTown, they didnt mean to protect Hu Tao town. They just did it for security's sake on a track or something.

[Flavor Leaf]

Just a yes/no for now -- was there any discussion in the hood about N2 targets?

yeah, talked about it earlier. Dann was going to go Titus, I thought Naerys was a better choice, basically it.

[Flavor Leaf]

and thats why i didnt shoot naerys

[Flavor Leaf]

like a town doctor targeting ScumTao the same scenario happens.

I feel like for some reason Hu Tao's getting a pass, and on a gamestate level, that just feels off to me.

if anything they should be neutral, not a free pass.

Yes. It's null.

exactly, on that level of it. Now, when I think about play wise, I dont have reasons to town read Hu tao other than tone, so that leans scum.

I'm biased cuz I chose to shoot there, of course.

I'm also kind of using it as a clutch to see where people choose to sit on that fence. we were hard stalled, so thought it was as useful as anything else right now.

[Flavor Leaf]

Case wise, I think the Celebloki case holds the most weight.

[Flavor Leaf]

Right, but was your target discussed? Trying to check if scum would know that blocking you could give a fake guilty.

Comparing to a recent scum game Hu seems really different to me.

I didnt discuss my target, so Snivy couldn't have known if scum.

[Flavor Leaf]

Right, but was your target discussed? Trying to check if scum would know that blocking you could give a fake guilty.

Comparing to a recent scum game Hu seems really different to me.

Do they?

In both games, Hu Tao helped support and push the push I was pushing, in that game on Leek, and this game, I pushed the Heipz slip potential.

And Day 2, they had a scum guilty as well, and Hu Tao bussed, which I called out Hu Tao for doing directly. I feel it makes sense for scum Hu Tao in this game to not bus Smiley because of that.

[Flavor Leaf]

VC 2.FINAL

Votecount 2.02 (FINAL)

SmileyDude1 (7):

Flavor Leaf, Dannflor,

camelCasedSnivy, Gamma Emerald, Naerys, davesaz,

SmileyDude1

[HAMMER]

Not Voting (6):

Hu Tao, Save The Dragons, pisskop, Celebloki, Titus, Random Nurse

Personally, I feel without a doubt there is scum on the back end of the Smiley wagon. At least One, I would almost say exactly 1 since Smiley hammered, but it could be 2. I think never 3. I'm leaning town on Snivy, and haven't really been pinged by Gamma. Case is there for dave, but dave talking has been strong, and scumDave is lurkier imo.

Leaves Naerys.



Means 2 or 3 scum on the Not Voting.

[Flavor Leaf]

1 or 2 scum on the Not Voting, more likely 2 on 2 off.

Celebloki, Naerys, Hu Tao is a possible solve.

[Flavor Leaf]

it also would keep me as technically unconfirmed since it made it so i didnt get a kill so people can still push Flavor Scum paranoia.

[Flavor Leaf]

it also would keep me as technically unconfirmed since it made it so i didnt get a kill so people can still push Flavor Scum paranoia.

That's where I get the three steps ahead.

We flip Hu. Hu is town. (High odds mathematically.)
Scum get a nightkill.
Scum then push Flavor as lying to make sure Snivvy didn't fight or some nonsense.
At elo minus 1 day if we didn't have an explanation, Flavor would be eliminated.

Not how I'd like to play it.

If scum have to bet on eliminating me to win the game, i think that's a fine situation.

If we figure it's 8-3 right now, then tomorrow would be 6-3 on a misfade, if that situation happened and i got eliminated tomorrow, it's 4-3. Say we go Naerys today, worst case scenario, they flip town, then we still have Hu Tao. people like to let things resolve as game goes on, but it's like dealing with the inevitable.

This leaves out dealing with slots like Pisskop, Celeb, and You. I think it's always a mark in favor of fading Hu tao, whether it happens or not today.


I would be okay if scum tried to push me, though.

[Flavor Leaf]

whats going on

Please double your slot's post performance in the next 15-30 minutes. (unless you have RL conflict in which case later is fine)

Yea I am way too busy for that shit.

you're half way to doubling as is

[Flavor Leaf]

I have lost a game before because a SK wasn't able to get their shots out legitimately through BP/Block shenanigans until all scum were dead.

[Flavor Leaf]

STD is in this game too

[Flavor Leaf]

STD is well outside prod range, and from an iso dive could use a poke with a pitchfork too.

night acts like a buffer, so 48 hours from day start probs

[Flavor Leaf]

whats going on

Please double your slot's post performance in the next 15-30 minutes. (unless you have RL conflict in which case later is fine)

Yea I am way too busy for that shit.

you're half way to doubling as is

I do not know what this means

your previous slot had 3 posts, you have 4. 2 more and you doubled.

[Flavor Leaf]

Thank, Alianna!

slight town leans on flavor leaf and ccs, i see where fl is coming from on ccs but i also think snivy's posting feels forced because he's the first slot to try to bring the game out of RVS?

i don't particularly like 68, it feels a little scared to put down a vote

"slight" pings of "potential" pocketing

and then the assurance that you're only voting there for the time being

I use that language cause I'm feeling somewhat conflicted on that slot right now. I'm a bit dissatisfied of 33 as an answer to 32 as it feels like a pocket-y answer to me, though it's also weirdly stubborn in a way that feels + town. I'm hoping that by placing some pressure on CCS I can get a better read of their intentions.

Agree with this post here, I'm also getting conflicted read on CCS as well. The early posts he made pings me as a town moving the game out of rvs (like what I was doing in Normal Idea Mafia), but his later posts feel like, idk, posting as often as he could do to farm post counts?
Gonna park the vote on him until some more quality posts are made though.
VOTE: ccs
@ccs What's your read on smilely, FL and Dannflor?

This makes me feel Heinz is scum with someone in the neighborhood, and they naturally grouped us together because they knew who was in it.

How many scum games does Heipz have on site?

Great catch. Heipz is the vote today for sure

Wait, why exactly?

As I currently read it Heip is just pressing cCS for better posts?

the one post RN made looks alright for the slot in hindsight too.

[Flavor Leaf]

Does not look good.

UNVOTE: Heipz

Consider me still on them, but not ready for day end.

No need to drag on the day. All it does it gives scum more reads. Re vote please

I scumread smiley yesterday so I'm fine going there. Think everyone should check in first

VOTE: SmileyDude1

I've played with Smiley as town and scum already. SmileyDude1 he tends to play very analytically and cautious as town. The more aggressive, pushy, tunnely, reactionary Smiley is scum Smiley.

Smiley is likely the scum in the hood, but that relies on heipz being scum. So I think we go there first.

I should have went with his plan first. sorry steady

[Flavor Leaf]

alright, imma step away for a bit if i can.

i need to get off hu tao for a moment.

[Flavor Leaf]

I think Flavor is lying here, straight up.

if you read the game, youd know i shot at Hu tao, not you.

i also think you just need to read up a little bit on the game, or else ill take you down like i took down your buddy Smiley.

[Flavor Leaf]

To what end?

the fool believed you.

also, who claimed Novice?

[Flavor Leaf]

1 or 2 scum on the Not Voting, more likely 2 on 2 off.

Celebloki, Naerys, Hu Tao is a possible solve.

atleast 33% incorrect

i aim for 33% correct, so that's alright with me.

[Flavor Leaf]

I just don't like reading games I only like talking and reading my own posts.

and i dont like jigglypuff, i think you should trade her for a wigglytuff.

[Flavor Leaf]

That's funny

i dont hate Gob's entrance.

I like the Naerys vs CCS stuff. down for more of that.

[Flavor Leaf]

i legitimately have no idea what youre on about anymore

hope fl joins me at least

you joined me

[Flavor Leaf]

i legitimately have no idea what youre on about anymore

hope fl joins me at least

you joined me

unless they flip town, then i joined you.

naerys feels like theyre always the fade today. just feels like where the day's going.

[Flavor Leaf]

to be fair, i spent a lot of time making sure people knew Hu tao has a good chance of being scum this game, but people shut the Hu tao convo out.

[Flavor Leaf]

i dont recall what Gamma's referring to either

[Flavor Leaf]

I don’t really love Gamma’s reasoning about those being town, but the way they want us to see it doesn’t feel like scum.

Like yeah, scum would want to make sure that we see it, but they’re just going ahead assuming that everyone should town read them for it when that, as scum, is super fakeable.

[Flavor Leaf]

I think they’d do it more non chalantly if scum.

[Flavor Leaf]

VOTE: Hu Tao

[Flavor Leaf]

Stop voting Hu Tao.

why

[Flavor Leaf]

I’m confused why Dann died over CCS, unless the hood tells a different story than the main thread

Dann had a claimed guilty on Smiley. Dann didn’t claim role until after Night fell, so Scum didn’t know Dann’s role, but they knew they had a guilty.

We double guiltied, that’s why we were like super positive that it was scum.

And I’m sure it came out to the scum team, but Snivy claimed BP in Neighborhood after I claimed Loyal Vig.

I would have thought that was suspicious if we didn’t have like for sure scum on Smiley.

So you're claiming loyal vig which means I'm confirmed scum to you unless you were blocked right? I don't believe this claim for a second, I know you usually do silly gambit claims so is this real?

I already dunked a scum, Hu Tao

[Flavor Leaf]

I just don’t see how we not eventually run through Hu Tao slot anyways down the line.

[Flavor Leaf]

I just don’t see how we not eventually run through Hu Tao slot anyways down the line.

What makes you more trustworthy than dave?

No clue, not really for me to decide. I imagine dunking a scum, though

[Flavor Leaf]

I don’t believe the worry and energy coming from Hu Tao early in their catchup if they were a Mason.

[Flavor Leaf]

I don’t believe the worry and energy coming from Hu Tao early in their catchup if they were a Mason.

Scratch this, I posted in a wrong game mixing up.

[Flavor Leaf]

I don’t believe the worry and energy coming from Hu Tao early in their catchup if they were a Mason.

read the game please

I believe that was the issue that i have read the game

[Flavor Leaf]

How are you innocent?

[Flavor Leaf]

Oh, I get it.

Good enough for me for now.

VOTE: Naerys

[Flavor Leaf]

Dave is outed essentially, so might as well full claim in case you die, Dave.

[Flavor Leaf]

Now that I'm innocent, I think this also locks FL into his claim. I think he's town for now though

My claim was locked when i guiltied scum

[Flavor Leaf]

I claimed first post of Day 2 in neighborhood

[Flavor Leaf]

I’ve had Dave as a potential suspect here and there, but play wise I haven’t really thought this was Dave scum.

They need to full claim here, though, i don’t want any like Jailkeeper claims coming in later and we find out Hu Tao was incorrectly set free. A doc on Hu Tao isn’t a full clear by any means. A town doc on Hu Tao Town has the same result as a town doc on Hu Tao scum in our situation

[Flavor Leaf]

I also don’t think Dave gambits to save a potential partner.

Dave and Hu Tao were scum last game I had with them together, and Dave won as last scum alive.

3rd couldn’t believe it wasn’t me all game, and that tunnel wrecked us in elo

[Flavor Leaf]

Eh, it was a major event, i don’t think you win that argument.

You just looking like sour grapes

[Flavor Leaf]

Implying I'll probably be an automatic NK is a pretty strong soft. I have been hedging the off chance that scum are also blind. If you

really

can't see the crumb and

really

want me to point it out, it's gonna be pretty freakin obvious.

Bruh, if it’s that obvious, scum already know.

They also know Hu Tao’s alignment anyways,

Most of us aren’t looking for crumbs like that

[Flavor Leaf]

Right now I think it's davesaz Nayers and Hu Tao.

At least 33% correct

[Flavor Leaf]

I would say 4 is pretty likely, it’s a 15p

[Flavor Leaf]

Dave (formerly known as x checking) in.
I'd like a little discussion before yeeting the apparent guilty, just to get fully settled in. I like roles that function like a

cop

, if nothing has happened to mess them up. They're easy to figure out when they're true.
I may

even

have time to read the the game before

night

, if it goes slowly enough.

Any suggestions on who to check out first?

Smiley of course, to see if Flavor's result lines up. Who else is in this hood I see mention of, just in case I don't find it easily.

This was D2, in my first post.

Yo, that is not obvious except to maybe scum teams.

[Flavor Leaf]

Dave isn’t a cop they’re a role that functions like a cop, so I’m most curious about what the actual role is. We’ve had 2 nights to use something.

Then go like Celebloki and Pisskop claims.


PEdit: scratch that, the worst and celebloki

[Flavor Leaf]

I think it’s fine to mass claim earlier.

Imo, scum are typically more ready for it as the game goes on. There are some cool holding PR claim sometimes that can pay off big late game, but it’s not always the case, and i think trapping scum in claims can catch them out and lead us to preventing unnecessary misfades

[Flavor Leaf]

Snivy claimed BP, so could test that to see if they said that just to try and defend against a possible guilty.

[Flavor Leaf]

just gonna put this one out here because y'all are gonna love it: i'm a complex vig!

@flav what are your results?

Targeted Smiley night 1 Hu Tao night 2.

[Flavor Leaf]

Celebloki looks informed of multiple vig’s in the game.

BP, 2 vig, an investigative, and a protective

Inno on Hu Tao claim means i got blocked.

[Flavor Leaf]

Celebloki has scum Doc energy imo.

[Flavor Leaf]

I guess let’s go Hu

VOTE: Hu Tao

[Flavor Leaf]

VOTE: Naerys

[Flavor Leaf]

I’m good with moving forward to the next day.

[Flavor Leaf]

until i see a full claim of what the inno on Hu Tao is, im not considering it confirmed.