Large Normal 212: Korts' Geriatrics - Game Over @1831

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confirm.

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Vote:Old Man

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claim: town pgo

Forgot to ask this ...

You are ok with being lynched the day before expected LYLO and thus will be busting tail to lynch scum right Cool? I can’t see you not being with this claim but want crystal clarity from you.

Why did/do you assume he was being serious?

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I'm actually quite annoyed at the private alts. Most of us have extensive histories. Why do they deserve privacy?

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If anything you're the one that initiated it as a serious point. I read MoI as half joking. I'm just using it as an opportunity to communicate my frustration with their existence to Old Man. I nearly replaced out when I saw they had joined. I'm frankly still somewhat on the fence over it.

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I didn't ask you.

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I find your reaction to your wagon to be a little off.

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I don't think I've pushed anyone yet? If you mean Old Man, my vote on him is entirely RVS. If you mean Magna, I still find it off that he immediately took CoolDog at face value. I still don't believe CoolDog. But I wouldn't call that a push. Asking probing questions is just my way of engaging with the game. I don't expect you to find value in every question I ask. I'm not asking them for your sake. I'm asking them for mine.

With that said, joking in response to his wagon, and then stating it was a joke is exactly what I thought was off? I don't understand how your post meaningfully engages with mine.

Perhaps more importantly though, this is the 2nd time someone has engaged with something I've directed at someone else. Please stop doing that.

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That's not how Mafia works.

Your behavior is on trial too.

Of course it is. Assuming this is in response to my last line, let me clarify: Let them engage with it first. Then say whatever you want.

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But also, you did just not respond to the majority of my post. What push were you talking about from the previous page? How is your point about his thing only being a joke a meaningful response?

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Something can be directed towards someone without it being a question.

Vote: Eddie Cane

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Axelrod's post is pretty bad for reason's already stated. But, more so in my opinion, because he took it as an opportunity to vote for pine rather than the more obvious choice (even if only in some form of pseudo pressure).

Firebringer, I hope you're joking. Joining a game with the intent of making it a nightmare should be bannable.

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eddie axel insanity? Feels a bit too easy.

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You being scum is entirely dependent on Eddie being scum. I just don't like post 55 into 65 from insanity. 55 feels like she was just asking an easy question in light of the fact that she mostly has the answer for herself by 65. I Don't really buy that his one post triggered her figuring it out for herself. I don't see this as being inconsistent with her busing, but it doesn't need to be either.

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2011 isn't nearly old enough to be considered an Oldie. Not a newbie at best.

@MoI do you think Pine makes those kinds of statements as scum without believing them as town? Personally I agree with you, if anything talking theory like that (best way to claim pgo) is a scum tell, you can talk about it truthfully independent of your alignment and telling the truth is great as scum. But, I don't see why scum Pine says that if Town pine doesn't believe it. Perhaps the degree of certainty is overblown (but until is follow up here and even after it I'm not actually sure how certain he is being). Is that your main issue?

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Ah shoot I got his date wrong. That's embarrassing. I must have been looking at pine. Statement stands.

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I'd be pretty surprised if that was anything other than a bias built from the fact that the base rate of finding town is ~75% compared to ~25% for scum. Of course you'll be right more often when declaring town.

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I don't like the fact that chamber retroactively justifies his vote on me, which, should technically be an extension of RVS, as having serious substantiation, as well as the red flags that 1. He is hopping onto a bandwagon made by Kison, and 2. His reasoning was lifted off MoI's which came earlier and I had noted and discussed above. I dislike the fact that chamber failed to justify or communicate the above in the same post as his initial vote, and instead had to be prompted by Pine and his communication with MoI instead of coming up with the reasoning or original basis for the read himself. If he was so annoyed over the fact that I am playing the game as a hidden alt, I would have expected, or perhaps, preferred it if he had communicated it directly or earlier, instead of taking a passive stance and raising the issue only after it has been discussed, almost as if it is something thought out after the fact.

It was never meant as a retroactive justification for my vote. My frustration with you was completely distinct from the vote. My vote for you was entirely RVS. I've already said as much.

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I don't like the fact that chamber retroactively justifies his vote on me, which, should technically be an extension of RVS, as having serious substantiation, as well as the red flags that 1. He is hopping onto a bandwagon made by Kison, and 2. His reasoning was lifted off MoI's which came earlier and I had noted and discussed above. I dislike the fact that chamber failed to justify or communicate the above in the same post as his initial vote, and instead had to be prompted by Pine and his communication with MoI instead of coming up with the reasoning or original basis for the read himself. If he was so annoyed over the fact that I am playing the game as a hidden alt, I would have expected, or perhaps, preferred it if he had communicated it directly or earlier, instead of taking a passive stance and raising the issue only after it has been discussed, almost as if it is something thought out after the fact.

It was never meant as a retroactive justification for my vote. My frustration with you was completely distinct from the vote. My vote for you was entirely RVS. I've already said as much.

Votes in RVS are never really random. They are influenced by some form of bias one way or another.

Admitting your vote is entirely RVS makes it even worse, pointing to the fact your vote was entirely blindly bandwagon-driven, and especially given the fact that Kison at least justified his very own RVS vote earlier.

I mean, I didn't say it was without any reason. It's just not a reason related to you. I fully admit it was a blind bandwagon vote. I think when all else is equal having competing bandwagons is more interesting than having one, and eddie was already a huge wagon, I thought I'd see what would develop with another option. Did some bias determine me voting for you rather than kmd or hito? Sure. But it was probably my friendship with kison.

I don't know metas, but chamber going so hard off of it and claiming to have solved the game on page 4 pings me. He's accused multiple people so far though, which I don't think scum would be doing on D1. Thing is, those accusations seem to be based 100% on either Eddie or Pine (both?) being scum. I haven't seen any posted content that screams scum to me from either one, and hardpushing with little to no second-guessing pings me. He's not a hard SR mostly due to his playstyle. I don't really see scum pushing that hard on D1, but it does happen with a few players. Titus comes to mind.

I wasn't really claiming to have solved the game. What I claimed did reflect my thoughts at the time, but I was using hyperbole to generate more reactions. Pine might have an issue with me but I don't have one with him. I think hes my strongest town read atm (but I don't put much credence in town reads)? The insanity thing is only indirectly based on Eddie? Which is to say, its based on interactions she had with Eddie, but I don't think it requires Eddie to be scum, I'm not even sure if it looks better or worse if Eddie is scum? My read on Eddie is almost entirely meta based, but I hadn't said that yet, so it's curious to me that you read into that somehow?

Chamber: Do you SR anyone not based entirely around Pine/Eddie? Why or why not? What makes you so sure not confirming in-thread is a scum tell, and what do you dislike about Pine/Eddie's actual content? What do you see in what they've actually posted that pings you?

I don't actually think the confirming thing is a scumtell? Even if I did I'd try not to use it. If I was going to read into things that happened in the pregame it would be something else, but I'm actively avoiding doing so. I'd prefer to actually play the game. And again, I've never actually said Pine is scummy, he's the one attacking me.

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My question to you was basically - why is the fact that Eddie confirmed his initial posts were a joke more 'off' than his jokes in the first place?

Whats interesting about this question?

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I asked him why he had Insanity listed in his "top-3 scum list" and his response started with: "You being scum is entirely dependent on Eddie being scum" which was a non-sequitur.

It wasn't a non-sequitur. I was making it clear that although my suspicion of you was linked to eddie, my suspicion of insanity was not. This is directly relevant to your point about the busing.

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I don't like the fencesitting read on chamber.

This stands out to me. How many players do you have developed thoughts on atm? I certainly don't have them on everyone. I've been vocal, and some players have attacked me, I think it makes sense for people to be talking about me. I wouldn't expect all of those players to have hard scum or town reads. Why do you expect otherwise?

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Can you provide an example of where you've played like you have this game, but were town?

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I despise demands like that. The burden of proof for meta demands is on the accuser.

1: this post is awful. You are no longer top town read (see, no credence).

2: You assume this is some backhanded attack against him. He has a better knowledge of his history than I do, if he can provide the counter example why wouldn't I want to see it?

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He did have an opinion. It was just a nuanced one that didn't end with much net positive evaluation of my alignment.

As for eddie, this burden of proof stuff works if you assume I'm trying to convince everyone else to vote for him. I'm not(yet). I'm still trying to evaluate him for myself. In that context my question is fair.

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Chamber shouldn't you be shooting stuff like this down since you metadived me apparently?

I haven't properly metadived you. If I had I wouldn't have asked for an example game. I did read through your isos in the last maybe 5?(also possible I didn't strictly read your last 5, I just skimmed your posted threads for game topics) games you've been in. I saw a pretty stark difference between scum you and town you. Mainly it seems like you don't actually enjoy being scum, and I don't think you are enjoying this game.

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Could you show me the games you looked at?

I'd rather see your example first.

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Replace me please.

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Mod:

Replace me.