Mini 1482: Castle - A Mafia Murder So Vile (GAME OVER)
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Because the exchange a) wasn't interesting and b) didn't appear to be serious either. If I thought it was noteworthy I would have commented on it.In post 47, penguin_alien wrote:Desperado, why come in and vote someone who hasn't posted when there's a whole exchange going on right above your post? Mantisdreamz, why ask if pirate mollie's in the macmollie hydra when that info is in the OP?-
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So the reason you don't like mine is because you aren't suspicious of thenewearth?In post 50, penguin_alien wrote:I don't mind macmollie's for the same reason I'm asking Mantis that question.-
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Oh you're actually town this game. Good to know.In post 60, thenewearth wrote:
1) Which exchange, Mantis - Potato or Bert - Potato?In post 47, penguin_alien wrote:Desperado, why come in and vote someone who hasn't posted when there's a whole exchange going on right above your post? Mantisdreamz, why ask if pirate mollie's in the macmollie hydra when that info is in the OP?
2) What about those exchanges seem interesting?
3.1) Mantis - Potato exchange was pretty much "Hi this guy scum --> No he's not --> Oh OK" So I don't really understand what's supposed to "ping" me, as well
3.2) Bert - Potato exchange was pretty much "Oh hi town --> DON'T U SAY I'M TOWN --> Why not? --> BECAUSE I VOTE YOU"
MUST... NOT... OMGUS...
Unvote
Vote: Bert-
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I've rolled scum with Newearth before in Micro 150 and wanted to judge his reaction to an early wagon because he got wagoned early D1 in then. Didn't get a wagon but his response was genuine and that one post had more pro-town motivation than his entire ISO in the Micro.In post 69, penguin_alien wrote:
Yeah, not my shining moment in reading comprehension. To elaborate, my line of thought was that a bare vote wasn't much in the way of pressuring someone to participate if that was his goal. And I thought we were starting to move past RVS, so it being totally random didn't feel right.In post 62, havingfitz wrote:
So are you saying you didn't care for Desperado's vote on thenewearth because you didn't think TNE had posted yet? Because you got their name wrong when looking for posts in the Activity Overview area?In post 53, penguin_alien wrote:...I didn't think he'd posted because when I looked for his name in the ISO menu I was thinking 'newearth' instead of 'thenewearth' and stopped scrolling.-
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Nothing really. She's null for me.In post 71, Bert wrote:
Desperado: What about Natirasha has been town so far?In post 33, Natirasha wrote:Considering that AA's posted more in this single game than in all my other experiences with her combined, I'm tempted to say she's scum.
Do you dispute that it is she rolls?She has:
1) Self-voted, rather than voting anyone else - because that's "how she rolls"
Her last post was null. All of her posts have been null. You appear to be content to ascribe malicious intent where it might not apply and its scummy.2) She comes in and makes two comments, 1 saying "I hate hydras, I'm bored" and the other saying "Arc is probably scum because she just posted more than I've seen her post in my other games." None of those posts appear to be with the intent of advancing the game along. And on top of that, to complain about the speed of the game when the game just started. Her/his last post is more of a lurker prod dodge than anything IMO.
Is Bert always this lazy as scum?-
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Hey look it's scum slinging mud. How is this relevant and how does me not knowing their gender make me lazy?In post 76, Bert wrote:You didn't even look at HIS gender yet, and you call me lazy. *shrug*
The proper town response to someone claiming to be bored is to ask them why, not vote them and paint them as scum giving an excuse to lurk. If she was scum and wanted to lurk she would just...do it, like 75% of the rest of the game. You took something that was null ("I am bored.") and made it scummy ("I am giving an excuse to lurk.")
That's not building a case, it's scum painting a canvas, and it's lazy scum painting at that.-
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Arc - #18
Newearth - #60
Fitz - #62
Lynx - #64
And you would ask her why she's bored because if you make an effort to engage with her, she might not be bored anymore! Which means she'll be providing more content, which means we'll be able to read her better.
Assume she's town and telling the truth about being bored. Which approach do you think is more likely to produce a positive reaction, mine or yours?-
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As opposed to what, being locked into page four reads?In post 81, Bert wrote:I love how you say "town until further notice."You can just backstab them later.Lol!
Do you always tunnel like this
I don't know, I don't keep a self-meta log. But I was scum in Micros 150 and 168 and Mini 1426, and I was town in Calvin and Hobbes and WWE Believe in the Shield.-
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As opposed to what, being locked into page four reads?In post 81, Bert wrote:I love how you say "town until further notice."You can just backstab them later.Lol!
Do you always tunnel like this
I don't know, I don't keep a self-meta log. But I was scum in Micros 150 and 168 and Mini 1426, and I was town in Calvin and Hobbes and WWE Believe in the Shield.-
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But the only reason you chose to finger point in Nats' direction is because she declared her boredom. Don't you think that fact by itself makes her less likely to be lurking scum than the other 6 players who haven't posted since last night? I'll ask again--if her intent was to lurk it out, as you accused her of, why didn't she just do it? Why did she unnecessarily open herself up to criticism?In post 87, Bert wrote:How is finger-pointing empty? I made a fair accusation saying that she/he should be more serious about the game and not just say "this game isn't catching my interest." I've heard scum (Majiffy in Micro 189) just come in and say "this game hasn't caught our interest yet. I'll be back later"....and then come back days later when a huge portion of the day is already in the books. I have a low tolerance for that.-
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You presented three pieces of evidence for your vote.
1) She self-voted.
2) She said she hates hydras.
3) She said Arc might be scum because she's posted more in this game than Nat normally sees.
You contended that none of these moved the game forward.
In order:
1) Yes she did. Nats' meta will show you that she always self-votes. That means it's null. I pointed this out when you said it originally and you ignored it. I wonder why...
2) A lot of people hate hydras. Do you really think someone's opinion of hydras is alignment indicative?
3) You said this didn't move the game along, but for that to be true you'd have to assume Nat wasn't being serious about the read. Why would you assume that? I considered it scumhunting. Why do you think scumhunting is scummy?-
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Nope. What games should I be looking at? And fitzscum?In post 133, macmollie wrote:
cos I wanted to get inside his head and exploreIn post 119, Wisdom wrote:Why are you voting Desp, mollie?
cos I am coming from a perspective in that I am town reading bert. have you ever played with him before?In post 121, Desperado wrote:Mollie, explain fitzscum to me.
Of your nulls, lynx and arc are both town.
Can you explain why you interpreted my push on Bert as whiteknighting Nat?
@ Arc: My read on Newearth would seem inconsistent if you skipped over the posts that explained why I was voting him.
In post 70, Desperado wrote:
Oh you're actually town this game. Good to know.In post 60, thenewearth wrote:
1) Which exchange, Mantis - Potato or Bert - Potato?In post 47, penguin_alien wrote:Desperado, why come in and vote someone who hasn't posted when there's a whole exchange going on right above your post? Mantisdreamz, why ask if pirate mollie's in the macmollie hydra when that info is in the OP?
2) What about those exchanges seem interesting?
3.1) Mantis - Potato exchange was pretty much "Hi this guy scum --> No he's not --> Oh OK" So I don't really understand what's supposed to "ping" me, as well
3.2) Bert - Potato exchange was pretty much "Oh hi town --> DON'T U SAY I'M TOWN --> Why not? --> BECAUSE I VOTE YOU"
MUST... NOT... OMGUS...
Unvote
Vote: Bert
Does that make more sense?In post 72, Desperado wrote:
I've rolled scum with Newearth before in Micro 150 and wanted to judge his reaction to an early wagon because he got wagoned early D1 in then. Didn't get a wagon but his response was genuine and that one post had more pro-town motivation than his entire ISO in the Micro.In post 69, penguin_alien wrote:
Yeah, not my shining moment in reading comprehension. To elaborate, my line of thought was that a bare vote wasn't much in the way of pressuring someone to participate if that was his goal. And I thought we were starting to move past RVS, so it being totally random didn't feel right.In post 62, havingfitz wrote:
So are you saying you didn't care for Desperado's vote on thenewearth because you didn't think TNE had posted yet? Because you got their name wrong when looking for posts in the Activity Overview area?In post 53, penguin_alien wrote:...I didn't think he'd posted because when I looked for his name in the ISO menu I was thinking 'newearth' instead of 'thenewearth' and stopped scrolling.
And I gave reasons for why all four of you were town. You skipped that post too.
In post 82, Desperado wrote:Arc - #18
Newearth - #60
Fitz - #62
Lynx - #64
And you would ask her why she's bored because if you make an effort to engage with her, she might not be bored anymore! Which means she'll be providing more content, which means we'll be able to read her better.
Assume she's town and telling the truth about being bored. Which approach do you think is more likely to produce a positive reaction, mine or yours?-
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He's wrong about Fitz and I'd be interested in his take on #128. Not sure why he ignored it.
I also don't understand his Mantis read. He says they just lean town and needs to post more, but two of his scum reads are directly related to votes on Mantis. I don't really understand the thought process there.
I will read those games and let you know how I feel about Bert-
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That quote from 503's post game seems pretty apt.In post 1242, Nachopappa wrote:I felt the same way about my predecessor. This was my first time to be scum as well. I felt like if I gave my "reads," Nacho would know that it would be BS. I was hiding/lurking like a coward. Hahaha. Being town is so much more fun for me!
Unvote: Bert
Talk to me about Wisdom. Is the endless one line post ISO their playstyle or is it a relative scumtell? Because so far this game looks an awful lot like Wisdomscum from 503.-
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whatIn post 159, macmollie wrote:
about as much as I think of tator forgetting they fosed me and bert sheeping our vote, sheeping our read on you but has us as nullIn post 158, Desperado wrote:mollie what do you think about Wisdom lying about why his townread on me got weaker?
I want to lynch them all
at the same time
I don't think he was lying (cos lying is intentional)as much as he can't keep up with the very fast pace of the thread
like srsly can we lynch them all
good grief slimer looks better than they do and he has only said 1 word
He said I'm sheeping people to easily when I've objectively not sheeped anyone all game. Semantics aside, it's scummy.
Double post deleted. ~MalaLast edited by Malakittens on Wed Aug 07, 2013 11:52 am, edited 1 time in total.-
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That's the way I see it.In post 163, macmollie wrote:
desp the bold was sarcasmIn post 160, Desperado wrote:
whatIn post 159, macmollie wrote:
about as much as I think of tator forgetting they fosed me and bert sheeping our vote, sheeping our read on you but has us as nullIn post 158, Desperado wrote:mollie what do you think about Wisdom lying about why his townread on me got weaker?
I want to lynch them all
at the same time
I don't think he was lying (cos lying is intentional)as much as he can't keep up with the very fast pace of the thread
like srsly can we lynch them all
good grief slimer looks better than they do and he has only said 1 word
He said I'm sheeping people to easily when I've objectively not sheeped anyone all game. Semantics aside, it's scummy.
Double post deleted. ~Mala
I think he thinks you sheeped my vote. which you did in a way but I took it that you were already feeling sus of him and so I do not see it as you sheeping. is that true?
Wisdom, Mollie said she read Bert as town and provided meta that supported the read. Do you disagree with her assessment?-
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In post 138, Desperado wrote:He's wrong about Fitz and I'd be interested in his take on #128. Not sure why he ignored it.
I also don't understand his Mantis read. He says they just lean town and needs to post more, but two of his scum reads are directly related to votes on Mantis. I don't really understand the thought process there.
I will read those games and let you know how I feel about Bert-
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Bert do you really think mollie wasn't being genuine when she said she voted me to stir things up and sort me out? Do you think the hydra dissonance is fake?
Can you go into more detail about why you think they aren't advancing the game and can you link some specific posts that you thinkhaveadvanced the game?-
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Lynx, I wanted you reasons for molliescum because you three were my townreads on the wagon. What you provided was pretty lame.
You're going to have to be more specific. Which ones are distancing and which ones are stringing him along? Why is scummollie distancing from town Bert?In post 309, Lynx_Shine wrote:Not sure why you want the reasons before debunking but short version
118
147
157
192
212
For the most part is stringing Bert along, distances, strings Bert along, and he's just going with it. I'm getting (right now) Town Bert Scum macmollie off this. 212 I originally leaned Town at this point, but then accuses me of the same thing but voting me for it in 225.
Mollie's 212 and 225 are both extremely town. You can argue how close mollie was to actually getting lynched all you want, Om, her disposition in 225 is clearly town accepting death and leaving a trail.
^Cut that shit out. I'm still very much wondering why you think mollie is scum but I can't afford to get my eyes checked. How about you spell it out so I don't have to squint so hard?In post 302, Sweet Pertayter wrote:VOTE: mollieVOTE: mollieVOTE: mollieVOTE: mollieVOTE: mollieVOTE: mollieVOTE: mollieVOTE: mollieVOTE: mollieVOTE: mollieVOTE: mollieVOTE: mollieVOTE: mollieVOTE: mollieVOTE: mollieVOTE: mollie
If people still are wondering why I think mollie's scum then they should probably consult an optometrist.
I look forward to an in depth analysis of town mollie and why this isn't it.In post 308, ArcAngel9 wrote:wisdom, why are you defending mollie, this is not town mollie in anyway-
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#338 and to a lesser extent #224.In post 365, theslimer3 wrote:I'm not sure what you've seen from there till now. Care to elaborate?
Bert's taken care of 338 but Nat unvotes in 224 because "RVS is over" when it had ended 10 pages earlier, and she still hasn't voted anyone. So not only is her turn on mollie awkward and supported, but she's cheerleading a wagon she isn't even on.
Nat: if you're "getting a clearer picture" why haven't you placed a legitimate vote all game?-
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I had her as null because the things she had done up to that point (self-voting, being bored) were null.
I don't agree that she's engaged and isn't sitting back at all. She hasn't put her vote where her mouth is and the progression of her reads don't reflect the game state in a meaningful way. In particular, seeing nothing but town mollie in 325 but no longer town reading her after a full reread doesn't make any sense and is opportunistic (especially without a vote attached), and the main reason she gave ("I believe Om said it best, 'coasting on town reads'") is pretty rich coming from someone who a) hasn't voted and b) doesn't have a single scum read.
Double posted deleted ~Mala-
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What was the purpose of this post? Because it certainly wasn't to hunt scum.In post 392, Natirasha wrote:What a surprise, ArcAngel being prodded.
Nat I thought you had some things you needed to say? Or was #370 it? I don't like how you started to get a clearer picture, and clearly put some thought into the "alignment table" of three players (that's engagement in the game) but now you're saying it's still having trouble holding your interest.-
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I think it was weak, not bad. And even that push was head and shoulders above the scumplay I'm familiar with from him.In post 408, macmollie wrote:desp I don't think tne is town. his push on us is really really bad.
I don't like nat either but you are going to have to really push it and sell in order to get it to go through so close to deadline.
My read from early in the game is still valid. I saw scum-TNE up close and personal in Micro 150 and this just isn't it.In post 414, Mantisdreamz wrote:
what makes you say she is town?In post 407, Desperado wrote:Newearth is still town guys. If you don't think Nat is town, she is a much better lynch today
Seriously, just read this game, it's 13 pages:
http://forum.mafiascum.net/viewtopic.php?f=84&t=26781
If you still think TNE is scum after reading the link above then we will just have to agree to disagree.-
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Do you have contradictory meta or something? His disposition is completely different this game.In post 420, Wisdom wrote:@Desp
If you think you can read someone just by reading one (1) scumgame of theirs, we will definitely agree to disagree.-
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Do you have contradictory meta or something? His disposition is completely different this game.In post 420, Wisdom wrote:@Desp
If you think you can read someone just by reading one (1) scumgame of theirs, we will definitely agree to disagree.-
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Alright, forget the meta. What's the TNE case again?
Because your vote is weak.In post 402, Wisdom wrote:Shit, just noticed the deadline. We have 1 day and some hours left.
VOTE: thenewearth
His last post gave me bad feelings, and I don't really feel especially good about any lynch, so this is my pick for a deadline lynch.-
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What doesn't look right about it?In post 458, serrapaladin wrote:
Except I have...awkward :/In post 455, Sweet Pertayter wrote:Serra
You've never seen Scum-mara, so what are how are you deciding how I sound like as town without that?
BUT HAI, LONG TIME NO SEE
Can you explain your desp read?
Desp's Bert vote was awful. His lack of push-back after some people scumread him is nothing like the Nuzlocke, and the Nati push while wking tne doesn't look right (e.g. 407)
I really think slimer should go today, though, what do you think about him?
And why does me being town make TNE more likely to be scum?-
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Spoiler: My full Nat push
I suppose those two posts could appear awkward in isolation but it's not like they are representative of my case. Why aren't you including my 367/369 in your analysis of how I take stances and develop reads?
Double post deleted! ~MalaLast edited by Malakittens on Thu Aug 15, 2013 9:22 am, edited 1 time in total.-
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Why? I'd rather NL than lynch a townread. It's pretty simple, and it's not a death sentence or something. We NLed D1 in WWE (multiball large theme) and steamrolled the scum because of it.In post 531, Natirasha wrote:
I mean, I'm sorry serra, but Slimer has done anything but lurk since his V/LA ended. While his contributions have been hit and miss since, to accuse him of lurking is patently wrong.In post 529, serrapaladin wrote:So we have 36 hours left and the deadline is somewhere in the middle of Sunday night, so we really need to get something done.
You guys are obviously intent on letting slimer play this sort of game, so I can only hope he'll replace out or something. I really don't have the tenacity to see this through. If he is scum and wins this, or if he's town and ends up getting mislynched in LyLo, I'll just need to avoid games with him, or better play with people I know don't fuck around with lynching lurkers and other anti-town play.
@DESP: Now, THAT is retarded.
Unvote
Vote: Serrapaladin
Bert, we aren't doing Mantis today.-
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Um...it isn't? I was just saying that a D1 NL isn't an apocalypse scenario, and if anything would be more damaging in a large where there are multiple scum kills.In post 559, Bert wrote:How is a MULTIBALL LARGE theme game applicable here? That you're using a game that is totally not the same as a mid-sized mini blows my mind.
Why are you ignoring my questions
let me ask you another question then. do you think YOU can push a Serra lynch through?
The more you ignore my questions, the more questions you're getting
and if you go "SORRY I DONT ANSWER STUPID QUESTIONS"
then my vote's going back to you
Yes, I'm pretty confident I could get serra lynched.
What question did I ignore?-
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In TNE's case, yeah. The other two are just town. You disagree?In post 563, Bert wrote:Are you THAT sure of all three of those townreads you mentioned that you would opt for a NL over them? Because of meta?
We're 15 hours to the deadline. What other reason do I need? I don't think you have the support for a mantis lynch ready to go and you don't have enough time to make a case, so how is your vote doing anything other than help facilitate a NL?In post 564, Bert wrote:EBWOP: So far, your only reason for "Mantis is not worth a lynch" seems to be "Bert, you know you can't push a lynch on him/her through just because."-
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I don't feel bad and don't give a fuck how it makes me look. What are you even getting at here? It basically sounds like you're saying I shouldn't have any confidence in my reads and should have let TNE get lynched. Do I have that right?In post 566, Bert wrote:Meh, I like mollie - she's being so paranoid as heck, and we are clashing like we normally do when she is town (in my experience).
Wisdom, not too sure. I've dayvigged him and been wrong. I don't disagree, but I wouldn't go "IM NOT GONNA LYNCH HIM, ID RATHER NL"
TNE is derp central like me. I mean, heck he/she was calling me scum with Mollie on page freakin 5. So I wouldn't be sad to see him/her go, it's hard to get a read on people like him/her without past experience.
How you're SO sure on Day 1 without flips that you're willing to NL in order to protect your town reads is what gets me. Do you not see how terrible that makes you look
You should feel bad-
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Your vote counts both ways though. So you can either put Serra to 5 or hope Nat gets here before deadline and puts your Mantis wagon to 3. And then who?In post 567, Bert wrote:EBWOP: No, 4 is not much better than my 3.
If Nat votes for Mantis, that'll be 3.
I'm not at a disadvantage here. So hell no.-
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Desperado Survivor
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Do you have a case that I missed?In post 571, Bert wrote:But no, you're twisting my words. I stand by my comment that your "I'd rather NL than lynch X Y and Z" is bad and you should feel bad. And you're implying no confidence in my ability to garner the support needed for a mantis lynch. am I not convincing enough?-
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Desperado Survivor
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Desperado Survivor
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Desperado Survivor
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- Location: Raleigh, NC
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Desperado Survivor
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- Posts: 12582
- Joined: February 18, 2013
- Location: Raleigh, NC
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Desperado Survivor
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Desperado Survivor
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I completely follow Wisdom's thought process as laid out 1017 and 1042, and they match his behavior at the end of the day.In post 1052, macmollie wrote:
how doesIn post 1047, Desperado wrote:It's the biggest piece of evidence for townWis.thatwork
What was scumWis hoping to gain from doing what he did?-
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Desperado Survivor
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What?In post 1058, macmollie wrote:
by gaining cred on not lynching scum?In post 1055, Desperado wrote:
I completely follow Wisdom's thought process as laid out 1017 and 1042, and they match his behavior at the end of the day.In post 1052, macmollie wrote:
how doesIn post 1047, Desperado wrote:It's the biggest piece of evidence for townWis.thatwork
What was scumWis hoping to gain from doing what he did?-
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Desperado Survivor
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I don't think I can shed any light on that, but I already explained why I RVSed him here.In post 1104, macmollie wrote:
to expand I had them as siblings or masons because of the way TNE rolled into the game which I urge you all to take a look at. i didn't mention it because i thought it was too damn blatant to be scum and I had pinned them to the castle's (knowing nothing about the series) flavourwise but yes it appears to not be like so.In post 1059, macmollie wrote:also I want to say here that mac and on our spreadsheet both noticed a direct tie between desp and tne. I thought they were masons which is why I left tne alone when he did not even remotely make sense with his case against us.
I am guessing that is not the case so I removing the both of them from the untouchables pile.
desp or tne can you explain what happened there then?-
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Desperado Survivor
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Desperado Survivor
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I think it's more likely that there's just 1 scum in Wisdom's web, and it's Nat, but I also understand how he came to his conclusion and it makes sense. I'm not sure why you're being so dismissive about it.In post 1136, macmollie wrote:I believe I already made myself clear on mantis.
what do you think of wis's conspiracy theory on nats and sera?-
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Desperado Survivor
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I think it's more likely that there's just 1 scum in Wisdom's web, and it's Nat, but I also understand how he came to his conclusion and it makes sense. I'm not sure why you're being so dismissive about it.In post 1136, macmollie wrote:I believe I already made myself clear on mantis.
what do you think of wis's conspiracy theory on nats and sera?