Mini 378- R&GAS: GAME OVER

[The Central Scrutinizer]

Random.org sayeth:

Me! No, that can't be right... hmm... am I mafia or not mafia? That is the question. Shall we go with not?

Random.org sayeth:

Me again! Maybe I should try the magic eight ball or something.

Third time's the charm...

Vote:serinah80

[The Central Scrutinizer]

Over defensive not at all.
I'm happy for people to discuss you putting a third vote on me and even if a fourth appears i'm not going to get overly concerned, not this early. Discussion's good gets the juices flowing.

Okie dokie!

unvote, vote:rich_25

for overdefending himself and then changing tacks instantly. A town would have kept being an ass cause he'd have less to lose.

[The Central Scrutinizer]

Well, "being an ass" is too strong. "Defending oneself in a very reactive manner" would be a better way to put it.

[The Central Scrutinizer]

Checking in... who stole my cheese?

Fos:Bogre

You

know

you stole my cheese.

[The Central Scrutinizer]

So, are you for real, or is being as stupidly scummy as possible part of your role or something?

[The Central Scrutinizer]

Checking in.

I figure it's time I lifted my vote from rich.

Unvote

. Now where to put it?

[The Central Scrutinizer]

I don't see any good reason to vote for anyone right now. :\

[The Central Scrutinizer]

Vote: Maz Medias

because I have to vote someone and your name is alliterative. That's it.

[The Central Scrutinizer]

Early bandwagons are far less likely to be indications of mafia than indications of town trying to gauge the reactions of the other players-- in my experience. Mafia generally play it a little safer until they can feel the game out. Unless it's Rosso, who for all I can tell is insane anyway.

[The Central Scrutinizer]

Early bandwagons are far less likely to be indications of mafia than indications of town trying to gauge the reactions of the other players-- in my experience. Mafia generally play it a little safer until they can feel the game out. Unless it's Rosso, who for all I can tell is insane anyway.

Nice WIFOM.

Nice what?

[The Central Scrutinizer]

I voted for him because he dropped a WIFOMbomb, then joked about it, trying to be coy when I pointed it out.

Stop OMGUSing and be serious! This is a game, after all...

[The Central Scrutinizer]

unvote: Maz Medias

[The Central Scrutinizer]

I've been wanting to vote Rosso for some time, but it's terribly difficult for me to tell if a person with a belligerent playstyle is mafia or town while playing online. It was a lot easier to do when I played live games.

I'm perfectly willing to vote Rosso, but I want to hear from someone if his behavior is typical of games he is usually is first.

[The Central Scrutinizer]

Ok, I'm going to give Rosso 24 hours to defend himself before I drop the HAMMAH.

[The Central Scrutinizer]

Scratch that: I'll give him eight hours. I forgot tomorrow is the deadline. That will give enough time for someone to remove a vote if they feel Rosso is not the correct decision, and perhaps for him to defend himself. But at 8:30 CST I'm voting Rosso unless I'm given a good reason not to.

[The Central Scrutinizer]

Scratch that: I'll give him eight hours. I forgot tomorrow is the deadline. That will give enough time for someone to remove a vote if they feel Rosso is not the correct decision, and perhaps for him to defend himself. But at 8:30 CST I'm voting Rosso unless I'm given a good reason not to.

You might as well wait until the deadline. There's no one else with more than one vote, so it would be extremely bizarre for anyone else to be lynched without Rosso posting first.

Honestly? You can say this is scummy if you want, but:

1) I doubt much can change in 4 hours

2) Someone *should* be lynched regardless. No-lynches on Day 1 are stupid IMO

and

3) I just want to "hammah" The Hammah.

vote: Rosso Carne

[The Central Scrutinizer]

Honestly, he was going to get lynched anyway... I'd rather be responsible for it than make it defaulted. More information for the town to argue about, right?

[The Central Scrutinizer]

How about 100% chance of hitting scum?

ThAdmiral is scum.

[The Central Scrutinizer]

By the way, this is not roleclaiming... this is only a suggestion that I'm getting an incredibly strong falsetown vibe from ThAdmiral. Why would anybody want to roleclaim now? Isn't that a stupid idea, unless we are lynch or lose?

If there is a serial killer,

is

this lynch or lose? Or do you think ThAdmiral is just fishing? Thoughts?

HoS:ThAdmiral

[The Central Scrutinizer]

Wow, so this is lame. I suppose everyone's out for the holidays or something. I'm going to go ahead and confirm my previous insinuations by

voting: ThAdmiral

and

FoS: HackerHuck

for obvious role fishing.

[The Central Scrutinizer]

Wow, so this is lame. I suppose everyone's out for the holidays or something. I'm going to go ahead and confirm my previous insinuations by

voting: ThAdmiral

and

FoS: HackerHuck

for obvious role fishing.

If you didn't catch it earlier

WE'RE IN LYLO

!!!

It seems you're afraid of a cop claiming and revealing their investigations.

Vote: the central scrutinizer

.

Blatant badlogic. I'm

afraid

of a cop revealing investigations? How would I know what those investigations are? You're silly, and you're scum. My vote is confirmed.

Now will someone other than these two scum discuss?

[The Central Scrutinizer]

Hmmm...

Scrutinizer. Now that it's lynch or lose, explain to me why it would be beneficial for the cop to stay quiet if he has a read on someone still in the game?

If you can do that, I will accept your rediculous FOS.

Is it LYLO? We don't know if we have a vig or a serial killer on our hands. We don't know if there are two mafia or three. I'm not convinced that it

is

LYLO and I think that you and ThAdmiral's insistence that it is might be a concerted effort by the mafia to reveal pro-town roles and eliminate them.

[The Central Scrutinizer]

The cop should do what the cop thinks it's best to do in this situation. Given that this could be a LYLO situation, we should only vote if we are certain that we have got our man...

So... The Central Scrutinizer and ThAdmiral - do you have any evidence from prior Day 2 you can draw on to justify your votes, or do you feel confident enough that the reason you have got you placed your vote is a good enough one?

I don't know about HackerHuck, he could just be an innocent bystander--but ThAdmiral is not a pro-town player. You can stick that in your pocket and take it to Capital One.

[The Central Scrutinizer]

Alright hands up if you seriously think there are only two mafia in a twelve player game. I certainly don't. I believe

strongly

that we are now in lylo, and I think that we should do everything possible to ensure that we do not hit another town member. So far it doesn't look like we've lost the doc so I don't see how it's scummy of me to suggest that the cop should reveal his investigations. Otherwise we're just shooting in the dark, and that's already failed us twice now.

Unvote: central scrutinizer

Jules, you are right, I didn't really get a scum vibe from him before this day and I think he may just be misunderstanding/misjudging the situation we are in so I will unvote him for now. But his mafia conspiracy theory is ridiculous. As I already said the doc is still around, and every night that goes by just means it gets more and more likely the cop will be killed without revealing anything, since there are two (how shall I put this) killing entities around, neither of which have done anything to help the town as of yet. I think we have a serial killer on our hands, but if it is a vig, can you bloody sharpen up!

Who said there was a doctor? Why do you just keep assuming that certain roles exist?

[The Central Scrutinizer]

Why do you just keep assuming that certain roles exist?

1. Every other game of mafia I have played in/looked at/heard about. Plus this wasn't advertised as a vanilla game.

Just saying. I've seen games with neither or without one or the other. We could have roleblockers, masons, whatever. There may not be a doctor, or even a cop as such, at all.

2. There are two killing roles, neither of which seem pro-town. It would be a

little

unbalanced if there wasn't a cop/doctor.

Two nights in a row we have had a townie die. Correct me if I'm wrong, but the SK/Vig has no idea what anybody's roles are. Since both are acting on incomplete information, as are well all, both are equally likely to nightkill town twice in a row.

So again, you're making an assumption about the alignment of the SK/Vig. How the hell do you get off doing that? Maybe you

know

it's an SK because you

are

the SK? I don't see why else you would continue to make this assertion.

3. The better question is why

don't you

think there's a cop and a doctor?

I try to play every game with the assumption that it's vanilla, regardless of whether or not it is. Assuming that there is a doctor when there's not would be deadly for a cop, and assuming that there is a cop can be a crutch for a townie. The object of the game is to sniff out scum and lynch them no matter what.

[The Central Scrutinizer]

2. There are two killing roles, neither of which seem pro-town. It would be a

little

unbalanced if there wasn't a cop/doctor.

Two nights in a row we have had a townie die. Correct me if I'm wrong, but the SK/Vig has no idea what anybody's roles are. Since both are acting on incomplete information, as are well all, both are equally likely to nightkill town twice in a row.

So again, you're making an assumption about the alignment of the SK/Vig. How the hell do you get off doing that? Maybe you

know

it's an SK because you

are

the SK? I don't see why else you would continue to make this assertion.

If

I

was a vig who was forced to put in a kill each night I would reveal myself and let the town as a whole decide who to kill, rather than just randomly targetting people.

I don't really understand why you're attacking me so singlemindedly so I will restate my main points:
- I believe there is both a cop and doctor around.
- I believe that there are three mafia, as such I think we are in Lylo.
- I know that there are two killing entities, and I believe the non-mafia one to be a serial killer, although I admit it is possible it is a vig.
- I believe the cop should come forward now with any investigations as another day without could very possibly lead to another town lynch, and another night could lead to the cop being killed by one of the two killing entities (as you said: even a vig acting with incomplete information could kill the cop).

Anyway, if there isn't a cop, as you seem to think, then it doesn't matter either way if I'm asking him to claim.

Well, you've just been a little too convincing for your own good. You're right. At this point in the game, since there are two killing entities, I can't risk dying with a scum in my hands. Especially since I've made a nuisance of myself today.

The reason I've been picking on you is this: I got a guilty investigation on you last night.

I am Hamlet, and I AM THE LAW

[The Central Scrutinizer]

If

I

was a vig who was forced to put in a kill each night I would reveal myself and let the town as a whole decide who to kill, rather than just randomly targetting people.

I just happened to catch this part of your quote. Terrible logic here. Why would you want a power role to claim? If you want to direct a lynch (which is also scummy), it can be done without claiming the role. We can reasonably assume there is a Vig/SK, so it wouldn't be hard to select two "lynchees".

Scrutiniser, did you have an investigation during N0?

Yes, on Maz Medias.

[The Central Scrutinizer]

If

I

was a vig who was forced to put in a kill each night I would reveal myself and let the town as a whole decide who to kill, rather than just randomly targetting people.

I just happened to catch this part of your quote. Terrible logic here. Why would you want a power role to claim? If you want to direct a lynch (which is also scummy), it can be done without claiming the role. We can reasonably assume there is a Vig/SK, so it wouldn't be hard to select two "lynchees".

Scrutiniser, did you have an investigation during N0?

Yes, on Maz Medias.

OK, either you can't keep your story straight or something very fishy is going on. I'm thinking you're playing us now.

Unvote: ThAdmiral
Vote: The Central Scrutinizer

Vote: Maz Medias

because I have to vote someone and your name is alliterative. That's it.

I was trying to see if anyone would jump on the bandwagon, and gain information. Notice nothing ever came of it.

Do you honestly think I'm that stupid?

[The Central Scrutinizer]

Furthermore, the safest place for that vote was on Maz. We had to vote at that time, and I decided the best place was on someone that I knew I could vindicate. I'm sorry if that was stupid of me, but that's what I did. I suppose now the lynch will vindicate me, one way or another.

[The Central Scrutinizer]

Guys, due to unforseen events, I am going to be without reliable (if any) access to the internet until January 2nd. I'm truly sorry for this, as it was an unforseen occurence and this game has just got interesting for me. However, this is unavoidable.

My vote remains on ThAdmiral. He is guilty.

If this situation is not acceptable to any of you I have no problem being replaced, even though I would rather not be.

Thanks.

[The Central Scrutinizer]

Uh, wow... well, I'm back a little early. Nice to see everything moving apace.

[The Central Scrutinizer]

Responding to prod.

[The Central Scrutinizer]

So The Central Scrutinizer has claimed cop with an innocent on Maz Medias and a guilty on The Admiral?

vote ThAdmiral

just now as it looks like we have to vote someone. This quote...

How about 100% chance of hitting scum?

ThAdmiral is scum.

... helped me with my decision, coming as it did before The Central Scrutinizer claimed cop, as if he had information. I'm assuming he said this on the basis of his investigation, following the 2nd night. Is that correct?

Yes, I did so on impulse, and then quickly rushed to cover my tracks with some sort of reasoning as I realized he was role fishing.

[The Central Scrutinizer]

ThAdmiral wasn't posting much content. Bogre and ThAdmiral were voting eachother day 1 which could be a distancing tactic. I don't like rogue_two's vote for bogre instead of rosso. I'm surprised Rosso was lynched. ThAdmiral was fifth on the bandwagon. TCS dropped the hammer though. ThAdmiral did seem to be fishing earlier although I do agree the cop should have spoken up. I don't think it's clear that we're in lylo though. I suppose HackerHuck is rolefishing as well but But if they think it's lynch or lose then they wouldn't care about a cop at all, maybe a vig and ThAdmiral did fish for the vig. I do find the way HH and ThAdmiral are sure it's lylo suspicious, the game setup isn't known. Maybe they are scum who know it isn't lynch or lose and are eager to get rid of the cop. TCS really does sound like a cop. Bogre says someone is post rescrictioning him, I'd like him to elaborate, could be a scum tactic. I don't like HH's switch to TCS. Still don't have an opinion on Jules, he seems to have slipped under the radar, he doesn't have an avatar though. He is voting Admiral though.

Sorry for the rambling style, I wrote it while reading.

Pretty good stuff, rambling or no.

Should we decide collectively who to investigate, or should I just use my judgment?

[The Central Scrutinizer]

There is nothing in my investigation that could discern whether he is mafia or SK. I am Hamlet, an insane cop, but I knew that I was insane from the start. On Night 1 I got a guilty on Maz, and on Night 2 I got an innocent on ThAdmiral. Therefore, Maz was innocent and ThAdmiral is... well, you get the picture. All I know is that he's not pro-town.

Therefore, we *have* to lynch him. Assuming that he is mafia claiming SK, he will guide us to a town lynch today, and that's pretty much game over for the town, SK or mafia wins. Assuming that he is an SK, and we are stupid enough to agree to his plan, even if we can lynch mafia today, he can defect and NK town, leaving us at 1 SK, 1 Mafia, and 2 Town--> town loss. Obviously, the ideal scenario is we lynch mafia, he NK's mafia, and we lynch him Day 3 ftw, but I think that we would be naive to count on ThAdmiral to go along with the plan and sacrifice himself when he could as easily screw us over. This completely discounts any scenarios in which we fail to correctly lynch mafia.

I think our best plan is to lynch ThAdmiral, and hope that we can pull a doc protect out of our asses to get a guilty investigation.

[The Central Scrutinizer]

I think the best we can hope for is LYLO. The cost of ThAdmiral defecting is too high. And if he took high school biology, he knows that defecting is always the answer.

[The Central Scrutinizer]

Ok, I'm pretty sure based on how the voting and discussion has gone this game that mikeburnfire is almost certainly mafia, and that Bogre is the next most likely candidate. If we lynch someone today, and it's not ThAdmiral, it should be Mike and ThAdmiral should NK Bogre. I will then investigate one of the other remaining players.

If not, we should lynch ThAdmiral and I will investigate one of those two tonight.

[The Central Scrutinizer]

After rereading a couple times, I think that Jules and Bogre are the most likely scum. They are the ones most likely to play the question game.

I think it may be unwise to lynch HH on the off-chance that he's a Jester.

[The Central Scrutinizer]

By the way, sorry for FOSing you mike... after reading and thinking I believe I was mistaken.

[The Central Scrutinizer]

unvote

[The Central Scrutinizer]

So, what's the consensus? I want to hear from everyone before we pile on.

I'm leaning towards lynching ThAdmiral and taking our chances. The price if he's Mafia falseclaiming SK is too high.

[The Central Scrutinizer]

What makes you say that?

[The Central Scrutinizer]

But what I'm saying is, yes there might be an SK. But it might not be ThAdmiral. If that were the case, not only would he have no reason to counterclaim, but lynching ThAdmiral tonight would completely screw us.

[The Central Scrutinizer]

vote:ThAdmiral

I smell a rat here. I will NOT vote for anyone else.

[The Central Scrutinizer]

I'll have to think about this some more, but I'm not sure about this. If there were a vig or a SK they would likely

not

out themselves to counterclaim ThAdmiral. It would be in their best interests to stay quiet. A vig would be able to NK ThAdmiral for sure and maybe even avoid getting killed himself. A SK would love that a mafia claimed SK because he could stay anonymous and, if he NK'd scum, would still be in the running.

That's why I'm concerned ThAdmiral might be falseclaiming.

On another note, if we ultimately decide to lynch Bogre and he comes up mafia I definitely think the best NK is Jules, not HackerHuck.

What does everyone else think?

[The Central Scrutinizer]

Should we just mass claim then? Names, not roles?

[The Central Scrutinizer]

Has everyone been prodded in addition to the deadline?

Jules, where are you?

Bogre, what do you have to say?

[The Central Scrutinizer]

I didn't realize I put him at -1. I'm going to

unvote

again temporarily, to avoid any unwanted action.

[The Central Scrutinizer]

Hit Jules.

I will place my vote once ThAdmiral has acknowledged this.

Good luck. I still think that he might be falseclaiming, but whatever. It's obvious that the town has spoken, sort of.

[The Central Scrutinizer]

vote: Bogre

I just have a bad feeling about this. Oh well. Maybe I'm just paranoid.

[The Central Scrutinizer]

Ok, so what the hell happened? Did we have a bomber? A vig? I am completely confused.

Also, my investigation has not yet come in. It is on one of the other two remaining people. When I get it, I will cast my vote.

[The Central Scrutinizer]

I did not get the investigation results yet because the player I investigated was replaced.

[The Central Scrutinizer]

I was given the choice of whether or not I still wanted to investigate you with the knowledge that you were replaced at the last minute, and I only recently replied to EmpTyger with my response. Needless to say, I had not read the thread at the time.

[The Central Scrutinizer]

vote:mikeburnfire

Nice evasion on the last day.

I want an explanation of everybody's roles in this game, if possible.

[The Central Scrutinizer]

Wow, so we lucked out. We totally fucked up our guess by going for Jules and Bogre when it was Jack and mike... thanks for bailing us out.

[The Central Scrutinizer]

Yeah, the mafia deserved to win that one. I definitely thought we should have lynched ThAdmiral, but all's well that ends well.

GG all. I am definitely including some of the elements of this game in a game I mod at some point.

[The Central Scrutinizer]

Yeah, even though our stage direction was poorly written, your performance was appreciated.