@Seraphim: You don't think the mafia has safeclaims? Or are you just wondering aloud what the official mafia names are? Ignore this if its related to stuff you don't want to reveal.
So Vi we meet again. Wait a second, Vi... vi.. vicious !!!
What I did? Or do you mean Seraphim? You are confusing the heck out of me right now.GreyICE wrote:Nice clear posting:Jahudo wrote:I'm not seeing it. What about your other waffler claims?GreyICE wrote:YouSeraphim wrote:@GreyICE: how the fuck is that post waffling?actuallyfeelsomewhatmore comfortable with your votehowever?
Put an extra qualifier or two in there, I'm not sure it has enough conviction behind it.
I feel comfortable with my vote.
What you did = someone not all that comfortable with what they're saying.
Deciding to take my comment as a serious accusation rather than an offhand comment about the sentence?
Overdefensive.
Jahudo = good wagon.
So is Toasty.
I don't understand his logic, so it peaked my interest.ToastyToast wrote:Today's bounty is likely town, as he is a minor character and a rival bounty hunter.
I still disagree with your claim. The words "actually" and "however" that you originally italicized don't seem to distance from his confidence in any way that I can read. How do you see otherwise? Yes he did say "somewhat" too, but I don't see how that is unusual. It tells me he still isn't too confident in UK being scum, which is expected at this stage in the game. Your original reason for suspecting him still baffles me.GreyICE wrote:He put like 18 qualifiers on it. It's a sign that you're distancing yourself from your own damn position. "Well perhaps he mighta sorta maybe I feel better however kinda."
I can understand why Lady L would vote for this one. I can't remember exactly where I've seen the "But he did it too" tell used before. Its not one that I think about, but it sounds like a tell some believe in. So while I disagree with Lady L, I think her involvement on the wagon is townish. And asking for a claim? I actually don't think scum would be so bold to do that on page 6. So I think she's town.Seraphim wrote:Also, GreyICE, what about Toast, man? I'm sure you had like eighteen scumtells on him maaaaaan.
Does one scummy post count as a serious accusation? Taking just that part of the post I can understand anyone (Sera included) in thinking they are two different levels of seriousness. Offhand comment sounds more like an inquiry where you don't know if there's anything scummy going on yet.GreyICE wrote: I'm backpeddling? It was an offhand comment. Your post was scummy.
One scummy post does not make you scum, as I will happily link you to game after game where townies make perfectly scummy posts.
Well Sera did give the reason of not liking Lady L jumping onto a large wagon without a reason first, and asking a claim in a situation where he thought it should be asked.Lady Luck wrote: As scum, you feel yourself being wagoned, and then switch your vote to the next largest wagon to try and save yourself.
You haven't even given me a reason why you think I am scum.
Because I had already given my reads on them when I talked about the Seraphim wagon earlier. I said I think both Lady and Sera are town. I disagree with Grey's case and Sera's case against Grey but right now the only concern I have about him is this one you just brought up. I do wonder why he faded into the background after being more aggressive before.ToastyToast wrote:@Jahudo: Why did you leave LLD, GreyICE, and Seraphim off your list? Its a very fair post, just curious about that.
The fact remains that you did like a Seraphim lynch in the first post, and not in the second. It wasn't a matter of deciding you'd rather vote Toasty, that would be understandable. But you said Seraphim was "pretty townish". That is a dramatic change in such a short time.Untrod Tripod wrote:Jahudo wrote: Untrod – I don’t understand how he goes from “I can get behind a Seraphim lynch” to “I’m not for a Seraphim wagon at all right now”.By rereading the game more closely. Lrn2readI wrote:I'll reread and figure out whether I like a Seraphim or a TT vote moar.
Because its possible I have inside information too, but I think its much more likely that I have flavor that is not meant to be read into. Maybe he's in a similar situation, I can only guess and feel that he is not scummy for bringing that stuff up.Nachomamma8 wrote:Why would you ever bring up something like the bolded up?Jahudo wrote:And I agree that Sera's speculation looks uncharacteristic, but I don't see how its suspicious.Maybe Sera knows some inside information.I think his talking looks innocent right now, not malicious or opportunistic in any way.
I know, I saw that post. What I'm saying is I think there is reasoning to think it was an honest mistake. There was that one Grey post that was basically a response to one of my posts and he acted like he liked the vote on me. So I thought at least somewhat he was mistaking me and him, but I wasn't sure if it was every part or not.UncertainKitten wrote:Again, there needs to be more game reading here, Jahudo.
You know, like reading this post. I don't feel like digging for the Toasty one at the moment. I'm sure you can find it with a bit of effort.
But what changed between Rhinox saying things that rubs the wrong way, to Rhinox town? And when you call CES terrible town or scum are you trying to say he's good vig fodder?GreyICE wrote:Um, when did I give those reads throughout the game? Did you read my reads list where I said Rhinox was town? And explained why he moved when he started posting more content? You are in there? I mean what?
Ok, is this a new opinion? I didn't see you talk about this before this post.GreyICE wrote:As for Seraphim, if Toasty flips town, I really don't have a desire to lynch him. I tracked down other town games with him in them. He's about this 'levelheaded,' toxic, and abrasive in those. Meta? I don't think so. I can see a town motive, at this point, for what he's doing. I think he really is trying to generate reads. And toasty? He's a scumread that shines like the eastern star.
And this one that comes later on are hard to understand.UK wrote:I'm not convinced of Grey scum yet. I'm merely slightly more suspicious of him. Seraphim is far scummier in my eyes.
UK, how did you go from finding him "slightly more suspicious" (I guess then neutral?) to not knowing where the suspicion is coming from?UK wrote:The first part of Grey's ISO looks solid and I don't get the suspicion. Maybe it's later stuff. I just can't think right now...
You brushed off my case by saying I wasn't reading. I responded with this post: 296 with some questions. I am still investigating you because I still think my case is valid and good, and that you are not taking it seriously. You are the scummiest person in this game IMO.UT wrote:-Why is Jahudo still voting for me? Not real protown to keep your vote parked here.
What do you mean by 455? Are you trying to say its scummy / that I am not active enough / that my post was full of townie truth and awesomeness. (Hint: Its the third one).Nachomamma wrote:The only one I'm truly interested in right now is Jahudo, and he'll be getting lynched today. I'm just waiting for him to make a couple more #455s before the games begin.
You are guessing all of this right? Like there is nothing in your role PM about a reason you don't have a bounty reward.GreyICE wrote:Most likely because I'm not a bounty hunter. Since the Red Dragon clan are not bounty hunters either it seems highly likely that bounties grant powers to town and town alone.
What about the earlier quote. You did say Grey looked suspicious, but not as much as Seraphim. Right? Was that being dumb, mostly? I still don't know if you had been thinking about something in particular there or what.UncertainKitten wrote:@Jahudo: I was dumb, mostly. But at the time, I basically had only read the first part of his ISO and it bled town. Then I actually READ the game today. Yeah.
Okay, I think I know what you mean now when you were talking about the first part of Grey's ISO.UncertainKitten wrote:@Jahudo: It was dumb that I thought GI was town, even with the slight suspiciousness.
No hurry. Basically what I can gather is that its in Rhinox's posts and not so much Seraphim. Its how Rhinox is calling Seraphim town many times, and how you don't think he's adding it naturally. I was wondering if you can pick out each of those times he says it. Because right now I can see where he's said Sera is town as a part of saying something else, typically about the voters or Grey. Like he's adding new opinions instead of repeating the same point in an unnatural way.Lady Lambdadelta wrote:Jahudo, do you mind if I do that when I have a machine that can quote multiple posts and make long walls?
Is clearly talking about Vicious. I wouldn't think it would be that easy to lynch Vicious though.Flavor wrote:The Red Dragon Clan has made a move on the opposing White Fang Gang.
Sorry. I was still thinking it over when I asked him to confirm what results he actually gets. His answer makes me question his claim.Rhinox wrote:jahudo, you still haven't answered my question...
I claim Gren. I am a miller with a bounty reward of not being a miller.Vi wrote:I am Julia, Former Red Dragon Clan.
I do have a bounty reward. Per Bounty, I can Hide.
No mention of Vicious, but there is a mention of Spike (flavor).
As a Former Red Dragon Clan I am assumed to still be part of the RDC and thus investigate as Mafia.
A case I never heard, so even if I was scum how would I know if it was good or not? And remember I kept asking him for a case. I really did want to hear his case because we've played in enough games together that I wanted to know what he was thinking.GreyICE wrote:there's one person in the thread with a solid case on him. He hammered day 1 cutting off the case.
What are you talking about? I claimed after Vi and showed the holes in the miller flavor. You think it was some kind of elaborate plan from the start for two scum to claim the same role and show where each other was not believable?GreyICE wrote:You were counterclaimed by Vi. YOU WERE COUNTERCLAIMED BY SCUM
So day 1 I bussed Vi and day 2 I decided to try and save him? How are you able to stand by both of those empty theories? It is not the most likely scenario and you aren't even trying to prove it.GreyICE wrote:Jahudo's actions in the thread are terrible. His waffling is terrible. It really feels like he didn't want to lynch Vi day 2 and his expressed logic today is bad. He claimed miller after I claimed investigate. His short circuiting discussion on day 2 was bad. His hammer day 1 was bad.
An action I would take as miller, you haven't provided any reason I can't be miller or that I wouldn't act that way as a miller.GreyICE wrote:His short circuiting discussion on day 2 was bad. His hammer day 1 was bad.
That is a very small part of the conversation. What about the when Seraphim claimed lyncher and argued that Vi softclaimed his role? What about when Grey revealed he was a hider? People were calling Vi scum and you said nothing, not town or scum. Did you have a null read on Vi after all that?Cogito Ergo Sum wrote:Vi was a likely enough investigation that not claiming miller would've been a definite misplay for hypothetical Vimillertown. Even disregarding that, miller breadcrumbs wouldn't prevent me from voting a guilty.
You assume I didn't look into your past games? I did and I saw one where you were town and played just like you are playing now, but I haven't looked into all of them so I said its probably something you do enough to become your meta and you could easily be this way as either alignment.Cogito Ergo Sum wrote:This is not pro-town curiosity. It's not a lot of effort to look at another game I played and glance at my ISO.Jahudo wrote:This is probably something he does often enough to become his meta though
There is still a lingering suspicion but I can't question Untrod anymore which I felt I needed because he didn't post much after my first time voting him. When this happens and a player replaces out, I typically unvote and see how the replacement plays on their own, then I reassess my read on the playerslot.ToastyToast wrote:@Jahudo: why the switch from UT/reckoner to CES? Has reckoner said anything to change your mind?
My defense is that an actual miller would counter-claim in that situation. The flavor didn't line up and two millers didn't sound normal so I thought Vi could be scum based on that.GreyICE wrote:Namely, right after I claimed cop. Claiming miller when you're under some level of suspicion is somewhat scummy, and having a SECOND person do it doesn't really make either of them less scummy.
My defense is that Nacho never presented a case on me, why would I feel threatened against someone like that?GreyICE wrote:Nacho shot makes NO BLEEDING SENSE with anything other than Jahudo scum.
I've never heard of this tell so I'm calling BS until you explain it.Cogito Ergo Sum wrote:Entirely serious.
You reinforced me point there. You hadn't given a reason for voting me before that, and you ask someone else to read my ISO and in order to justify a vote on me. Something you haven't done.Jahudo wrote:Nice failure to check context (as if you're more interested in making a point against me than finding out my alignment). I told Reck to iso Jahudo since he didn't want to read the entire game.
Did I use meta to form an alignment read on you? No. I only wanted to check on a little bit of your history in order to see what someone else was saying about your personality. I never tried to use it for or against you personally. So what is scummy about that?Jahudo wrote:I'm not convinced now that you did look up my meta let alone that you did it properly; I've clearly opted for a specific playstyle this game (which you'd know if you had meta'd him semi-decently) and you didn't comment on that at all in your case.
Inflated confidence + no reasoning = scum grasping for straws. My miller claim is starting to look like a scapegoat for you if I do get killed before you. If you focus on that you could go back and say "Well it would have been a good move if he was scum counter-claiming scum". Sure I guess, but what makes it more likely than an actual miller being in this game? You haven't been able to answer that, so I doubt you are thinking it either.Jahudo wrote:Dude, you radiate scumminess. The miller claim was just the icing on the cake.
This again? What reason did I have to be worried about Nacho's case? This isn't my first game, its not like I haven't been put under the spotlight before.Cogito Ergo Sum wrote:You weren't looking forward to Nacho's greatness and you overcompensated. Self-conscious scum are more likely to use a smiley here too since in principle it conveys less information.
You are deflecting. The fact still remains that you had not justified your vote on me even after three re-votes. There was no reasoning to backup and no excuse for your overconfident behavior that suggested anyone not on my wagon was blind. That is exactly the same as leading someone.CES wrote:It's clear I was telling people/someone to read your ISO; what I just pointed out, doesn't reinforce your point at all. It purely weakens it since I only told one person to read your ISO as opposed to everyone; that decreases the postulated scum benefit by a factor of 7 or so. Detracting from the point even more is that it makes perfect sense for me to point to your ISO there for Reck to read.
In hindsight I was being lazy town. If you'd prefer I will agree with you that you are not playing to your town meta. Hmm, who doesn't play to their town meta. (hint: its scum)CES wrote:It's too prominent to ignore in any certain analysis if you're aware of it. I can totally imagine you reading Oldy to quickly confirm your preconception that I'm probably playing the same way and concluding that my play is similar; guess who's more likely to hold that preconception (hint: it's scum.)
If anything I was hoping to have more suspicion on me. I try to catch scum while looking like a bad NK target, which makes me live until endgame where I catch more scum. I play that way every single game. Nacho saying he had a case on me was good in my mind. I felt confident I could answer for myself and avoid getting mislynched, like usual.Cogito Ergo Sum wrote:I doubt you were happy with your play thus far. "I could've ignored him." would be a more plausible excuse if this wasn't one the only comment you made on the matter.
I'm using facts. Here are all the instances where you push for a lynch:Jahudo wrote:No, you're deflecting. We're arguing about a specific thing I said. You can't rhetoric your way out of not conceding this point, kid.
Why isn't GreyICE dead yet?
A vote for GreyICE is a vote for progress!
Can we lynch Jahudoscum now?
Just read Jahudo's iso. That should tell you plenty.
obvscum Jahudo, Reck. Scummy claim, scummy behaviour.
Reck's your partner, aye?
CONFESS!
Last minute Jahudowagon is go!
Not a chance. What has he done that is pro-town? He ignores major wagons like the Toasty wagon, gives no reasoning for his votes, and generally tries to stay under the radar making it hard for people to read him.GreyICE wrote:Fuck CES is so much more town than Jahudo. Read the ISOs people.