Cowboy Bebop Remix [Endgame]

[UncertainKitten]

Vote Fate

Hey, guys, I think I'm onto something here. Fate's the mod, right? And he knows who all the scum are, right? And if he were a townie, he'd TELL us who the scum were, right? SO THEREFORE, SINCE HE'S NOT TELLING US WHO THE SCUM ARE, FATE MUST BE SCUM :O!

Also, I SHALL UNVEIL MY NEW TECHNIQUE NOW!

So, as you all know, I fly off the handle at things I perceive as stupid. Instead of that, I am quite simply going to ignore whatever absolutely DICKTARDED thing is said that would normally set me off. So remember kids, if I'm not responding to your points, that probably means you're a fucking idiot and should reconsider how you use your brain cells. Or consider using them in the first place, really.

But I'm sure we won't have that problem with THIS playerlist, right~?

[UncertainKitten]

Heh, thought you were waiting til next game for that, LLD.

And I suppose you aren't going to elaborate, are you Seraphim? I have an idea but I'd rather hear it from your mouth. Who knows, it might be the first thing I get to ignore~

[UncertainKitten]

@Seraphim: ...I should be ignoring you, but this is too perfect.



I sincerely hope that was a joke. But if not, c'est la vie I guess.

@Vi: Never said I'd lurk, merely that I wouldn't answer batshit insane points. It seems to be the only way I'll avoid getting really irritated at people.

[UncertainKitten]

Ah, right, missed Vi's bounty question. Far as I'm concerned, they don't exist. They're a neat idea but power roles really shouldn't take the place of good old fashioned scumhunting. It's a nice bonus if we happen to lynch bountied scum, but I'd rather just keep things real, you know?

[UncertainKitten]

Well, to be fair, Seraphim, I haven't RAGED at you over it, so it's half a win right there ^-^.

...are you seriously flavor speculating, Seraphim? Why would you ever do that?

@LLD: And you're ENCOURAGING this why?

OK, let's get it out here right now. What POSSIBLE advantage does town get from nameclaiming? Wait, didn't we have this talk in Higu mafia, LLD? Same question to NachoMamma. Rereading LLD's post, it's unclear what she means. Can you elucidate?

@Vi: No, that was a fairly understandable misunderstanding. At least I thought it was.

@Seraphim: You know what I think? I think Fate is a competent mod and is going to do interesting stuff to prevent the flavor games you are proposing, and quite honestly will set flavor up in such a way as to penalize us. I'm really unsure why you're pushing this.

@Vi: What makes Anti town's first post weaker than anyone else's? Particularly UT's?

@LLD: Hmmmmm...

[UncertainKitten]

@Seraphim: That's more understandable. I won't press the point, though for the time being I'm still against nameclaiming.

My apologies for forcing that much out.

@LLD: Yeah, I got that feeling after rereading your post.

So, yeah, my questions stand against Nacho.

[UncertainKitten]

@Kdub: So, um...we agree that Seraphim isn't silly enough to flavor spec without reason. And...when he provides an acceptable one I can't back off?

Just wanna make sure we're on the same page here~.

@Jahudo: A townie for mafia trade would still be far more worth than the information that can be gained for scum by a name claim at this juncture, I think. I don't think scum would be silly enough to counterclaim character names since the cost is too high.

[UncertainKitten]

Ah, ok. That's more understandable. Though why bother going for bounties in lylo anyway? At that point is it pretty much VITAL we lynch scum, so...

[UncertainKitten]

Fair point. And they'd know said role name was in the game. I follow you now.

[UncertainKitten]

@Toasty: Elaborate the scum intent behind Seraphim's soft claim

@Nacho: I hope you plan to be more helpful when the game gets serious.

[UncertainKitten]

All right. Basically the expanded logic we've seen so far.

As I said, I am sort've following it, but still am kinda feeling like something is being glossed over here. Not sure what it is, and it's possibly just a natural knee jerk reaction to playing the flavor/claims so early.

As for the ignoring clause, I wasn't all RAAAAAAAGEEEEE. Basically, if I'm getting angry at something stupid is when I need to step away and ignore it, if that makes sense?

[UncertainKitten]

Mm...can I request a halt to this line of logic? I feel it's dancing around softclaims which we kinda have too many of for three pages. It can, and probably should be revisited later. But for now I think we're not at a good point for it.

[UncertainKitten]

@Kdub: I'd know it when I see it. The apology was a sort of redirection of my irritation at *that* being the response to my line of questioning as opposed to something lamer that would be more pursueable.

@Toasty: You do realize that the information is pretty unhelpful given what he's implying, right? Or rather, if he told us now it'd be fairly unhelpful. That's pretty obvious. You're not thinking your vote through.

And B, as fun as it is to jump on you for your terrible "scum slip" like LLD and Kdub have, I'm going to have to say while I appreciate the prodding you're being given over it, I'm pretty sure it won't lead anywhere. Regardless, you might as well answer.

Cut by Toasty: Well, a better answer than I was expecting, actually.

[UncertainKitten]

@Nacho: Quote the second piece of that. The way I read Vi's call to delay discussion was not to stifle it so much as damage control the softclaims that stemmed from it, which I feel was more protown. I'm going off memory though, so I want to see if your point has salience.

[UncertainKitten]

I'm interpreting that differently.

@Vi: Clarify what you meant. I'm not going to feed you the answer.

[UncertainKitten]

@Kdub: Best you're getting. I don't make tables and graphs of what responses are most likely and what responses make someone scum. I read the game questioning odd things until I get an intent read. That softclaim covered the intent I was looking for. It wasn't an answer I LIKED occurring, but it still would answer the matter of intent nicely.

@Vi: Clarify please. Was the statement Nacho quoted intended to shut down DISCUSSION of the bounties?

Hmm...so, last night I was thinking this but was too tired to really pursue it because I'd also wanna check against her ISO and such...
After sleeping on it, I feel a bit more resolved.

Unvote, Vote LadyLambdadelta

That cute little jump on Toast REEKS of opportunism. Further, there's a disproportionate effort spent defending the colored text. Not sure what to make of the bounty stuff but combined with everything else, I feel there's a chance it's a bit of IIoA to try to look pro town going with the mechanics talk. That would be my weakest thing on her.

Basically, I guess the intent read I'm getting is "I'm a good townie! Really, I am! You don't need to look over here and check, nosiree!"

I'm seeing Vi's Jahudo twitch in ISO.

The Seraphim wagon isn't BAD, but I feel like we're missing something with it. Some key questions should be asked at this point.

Seraphim, why do you feel comfortable about your vote? You haven't actually explained it thus far, and the rest of your contribution has been flavor spec. You're better than this, so what's holding you back?

[UncertainKitten]

@LLD: It was something that you could easily seize upon that looked right on the surface, but with a little more examination CLEARLY wasn't that out of place.

Perhaps we have different frameworks of opportunist, but that read as opportunist to me. You were taking the opportunity to use something that *could* be misinterpreted, without further research or thinking, and pushed it on reasonably flimsy logic.

@Rhinox: Go through Jahudo's ISO. I see where Vi is getting her twitch from 51, because she actually voted someone else for the same reason. That said, I feel the twitch is somewhat supported by Jahudo's further posting which hasn't been amazingly great. There's significant IIoA when most of us have gotten past that point. His latest posts are pushing Gray on the waffling issue but still haven't given any thought to most of the issues that have come up.

[UncertainKitten]

@LLD: Well, starting the wagon for flimsy reasons that look good on the surface, but have no actual standing, is what bugs me. So how about we call it that, and drop the terminology confusion?

@Vi: The vote on CES made me frown as well since I vaguely remember him being one of *those* players. Fortunately, he's the only one, and it's generally good to have one around. I would guess he's a Jack type? That said, LLD might not KNOW that, and it'll be interesting to see how CES confirms. It's a better vote than the toasty one, I think.

To be honest, I see 39 as a bit of a null tell, but I can see where you'd extract town intent from it. For now we'll have to agree to disagree.

I'll be watching raocow, responding one last time to this thread, and then working for the next 4 or 5 hours. Try not to post TOO much while I'm gone.

@LLD: There are players that start off the game like that and then bring in the big guns as things progress. I think this is perfectly valid and quite honestly pretty good in small doses since it's an unusual attack for the scum to fend off. Combine that with some classical scumhunting, intent based scumhunting, etc., you'll find the scum can't hide from everything, and it wears on them.

[UncertainKitten]

@Rhinox: I've seen most players producing some fairly solid reasoning and suspecting. Most of us are into the game.

@LLD: At least I THINK he's like Jack.

Not a whole lot else to say. See you all in 5 hours. Try not to produce 42 pages within this time~.

[UncertainKitten]

@Kdub: That's your choice. Not much I can do to convince you otherwise.

@CES: Do you consider this a good or bad thing?

@Jahudo: Wait, what? Where does Toasty townpoints Andy? I must have missed it.

@Seraphim: To be fair, you already affirmed the seriousness of the vote. I've already provided my defense on the apology thing, though I'm sure you're aware.

Not seeing the backing off of you by voting Toasty, on GI's part.

@GI: Hold it. Where does Seraphim's comment on logic belie scum intent? It reads as silly, but not scummy.

@GI: OK, at this point could you summarize the case on Seraphim? I'm...not really following it?

@TT: Then why aren't you voting GI? You unvoted Seraphim and think GI is scum, right?

@LLD: Do you actually have the second biggest wagon right now?

@Nacho: Reasoning?

Oh God what the hell happened in the past four hours? Suddenly the LLD wagon is big? I wanna see her case, but I'm not feeling that one as much. There's a lot of trying there, which is generally more town.

Seraphim isn't showing the trying as much...

@Vi: Yeaaaaaaaaaaah

[UncertainKitten]

@LLD: I posted a case on you. So please don't try the "I don't see a case" thing. There are some people you don't see a case from, but I'm not one of them. Please proceed with posting your case on Seraphim.

@Seraphim: I really don't see it that way. Can you and GI and everyone voting in this mess consisely explain their vote?

...

Unvote

Want a vote count before I vote Seraphim, because what he's trying now is completely terrible.

[UncertainKitten]

EBWOP: To elaborate, what he's trying is to argue accepted claim practice is SOMEHOW rolefishing. Yeah. No.

[UncertainKitten]

You explained, but I didn't find your explanation satisfactory. That said, your follow ups have had a townish aggression I don't usually see from scum, so I'm willing to drop it.

@Vi: This might be true. But does it make LLD scum? No. And THAT'S the crux of why Seraphim is at the least full of it, and lashing out at whoever he thinks he MIGHT be able to take down. That's not townie.

[UncertainKitten]

I still want to find his reasoning on voting you, LLD.

Also, cute new avi, LLD.

All right, so Seraph is at L-3. I'll make that L-2

Vote Seraphim

[UncertainKitten]

@Jahudo: Yeah, that was kinda silly of him. I'm with you. Not sure it was scummy, per se. But I can see where you'd pursue it.

[UncertainKitten]

@Toasty: Let me put it this way. What good does it do town for your vote to be nowhere, at the moment? It's not like GI is at L-2 or something.

Why aren't you backing up your suspicions?

[UncertainKitten]

I was voting LLD before. When I unvoted, I indicated intent to vote Seraphim as soon as I knew what he was at to avoid accidental hammers. Further, voting cements your view for later VCA. This can be an important tool for town. NOT voting obfuscates things.

THAT'S why I like having something in bold saying "I SUSPECT X" from everyone.

[UncertainKitten]

EBWOP: Re: UT not voting

@UT: Yeah, what's up with that?

[UncertainKitten]

That's twice I've stolen the top post from you, isn't it Fate

[UncertainKitten]

@UT: what about Seraphim's stunning concept that LLD was scummily rolefishing by putting him at L-1 and asking for a claim?

[UncertainKitten]

Hmm.

[UncertainKitten]

Who knows.

I'm keeping my Hmm in the box for now. Remind me later if it becomes relevant.

[UncertainKitten]

@UT: Uh, you quoted an Unvote in that list. So it's three votes. Just sayan.

[UncertainKitten]

@Rhinox: Why is the LLD wagon good? Did you ever explain this?

[UncertainKitten]

@Nacho: HEY YOU'RE ALIVE! Plannan on answering my question?

@Fate: IT ALMOST HAPPENED! I WAS ABOUT TO POST A THING, BUT CHOSE NOT TO!

@Seraphim: I really don't see any lack of coherency.

[UncertainKitten]

Haha, sorry Nacho. Incidentally, I'm having more fun than I've had for a long time in a mafia game by staying cool and collected~

[UncertainKitten]

@Vi: I'll admit the latest barrage of questions felt careless. As in "attempting to look proactively pro town real quick here", but kinda missing the fact things had been answered. Sorta like he was trying to pump up his vitals with the serum stuff in Trauma center, but somehow missed. Except in this case his vitals were his townness. I still like Sera scum better, but GI is not outside the realm of possibility.

@Rhinox: You have a couple good points, but I have to disagree with the claim point, because that seemed fairly routine. The AtE accusation was bad, as was OMGUS, but, to be honest, Seraphim wasn't that great so I'm willing to overlook those. Finally, as for case after vote, I've done that pretty often regardless of alignment. Sometimes you want reactions. Sometimes you think it is so bleeding obvious someone is scum, that you feel no need to spell it out. Sometimes you just plain forget to tell people what you're thinking.

@LLD: Have you posted a concise collection of your points on Seraphim? IIRC I asked for one of those from both of you, and I haven't noticed either really delivering.

[UncertainKitten]

I don't need a wall. I need five sentences or less detailing your strongest points against Seraphim. You needn't include everything unless I ask for it.

[UncertainKitten]

That's significantly more than 5 sentences LLD. Whatever, it'll suffice. I see most of these things anyway.

@Rhinox: To me, I figured that was implied. She wasn't JUST pushing for a claim, she was voting him because he was scummy and reminding him he should claim.

[UncertainKitten]

It'd be a good practice to learn. Concision tears through the obfuscation of :words words words:, giving way to the searing light of the sun of scumhunting, allowing everyone to quickly examine and decide who is the scum. We are scumhunters, not politicians!

[UncertainKitten]

All right, I get you now.

[UncertainKitten]

@GI: Vi's alignment can't be determined yet. Don't tell me you've gotten lazy and not done your research.

Sorry I didn't tell you sooner, but it was amusing to watch.

You should EASILY be able to figure out why I'm saying this.

[UncertainKitten]

EBWOP: Anyway, be back in three or four hours. I have to get all RESPONSIBILITY CHAMPION on shit >=[!

[UncertainKitten]

@GI: I don't care for meta myself. But in this case it kinda applies. Save your case for D2. I sympathize with Vi on this issue. I was basically in your shoes last game I played with her, so.

[UncertainKitten]

I think that was intentional, LLD.

[UncertainKitten]

@Vi: I'm not convinced of Grey scum yet. I'm merely slightly more suspicious of him. Seraphim is far scummier in my eyes.

[UncertainKitten]

@Vi: Generally it was the lack of valid defense, the bogus attacks on GI (at that point), and the whole "rolefishing" comment being the straw that broke the camel's back.

I'm getting kinda lost here. I did find half of Rhinox's post to be invalid. The one on Gray, I mean.

@Seraphim: Well, I like the use of motive. I think I need to take a closer look at Gray. As I said earlier, Jahudo was underwhelming me. I still have a Hmm out on Toasty I may or may not cash later.

@GI: Why didn't you call me out for kind of poking Jahudo earlier? Why aren't you calling Vi out for staring at him?

@LLD: What shit? What is bad about his current accusations?

I mean, it seemed like a logical switch, if not one that changed my opinion a whole lot without further data. But the reactions to it? They read Hook
Line
Sinker.

@GI: Ah, THERE'S the extra attack on Vi. Cool. So now where's mine for Jahudo suspicion?

Am I solid town now that I'm planning to question you after an ISO?

@LLD: Still waiting for forthcoming shit on Seraph's new reads. That said, the why not me thing is bugging me.

Anyway, need to poke around a bit before I decide how to proceed.

[UncertainKitten]

Bah, my brain is fried. I can't do a strong analysis. The first part of Grey's ISO looks solid and I don't get the suspicion. Maybe it's later stuff. I just can't think right now...

@GI: Bah, I've had games where I've rounded the scum up D1 and no one believed me. Granted, my persuasiveness sucked and I wasn't really *certain* about them. BUT STILL!

[UncertainKitten]

@Vi: GI explained. Rhinox was making a big thing of something OBVIOUSLY sarcastic. And spent half his post doing so.

And is it waffling if I quit halfway through because I can't think straight? I think I'm really tired...HOPEFULLY I can get it done this weekend.

[UncertainKitten]

Oh, I saw the invite. The fact that Grey and LLD took it without even trying to elaborate that much (particularly LLD) made me frown.

[UncertainKitten]

@Rhinox: Please read the entire game before asking questions that have already been answered. Thank you ^-^.

[UncertainKitten]

Yes, but I also didn't comment on it and ask questions that had already been answered.

Anyway, the whole big thing you made about GI's "gut read" that was CLEARLY not meant as a literal gut read.

You spent about half your post expounding that one.

[UncertainKitten]

@Toasty: I'm aware you aren't attacking his mockery of your gut read. That was at Rhinox.

@Rhinox:

Then the godawful scum/town list. After looking at greyICE iso, I think ICE/toasty scum is looking pretty good right now:

"Toasty: I have a gut read of my own. You're scum. It's a good gut read. Flavor mechanics, IoA, setup speculation, and more waffles than Jahudo."
vs.
"Toasty - I really need to relook at some of these posts, I may be reading the situation wrong."

What changed?

So we're ignoring this now?

Right now I have no strong opinion on Gray because I'm going to look for myself when I get a chance. Secondly, to strawman you I'd have to actively be trying to attack your points, as opposed to mentioning I didn't like half your post. I see no post of mine accusing you of being scum. Further, I see no misrepresentation on my part. You, quite frankly, just aren't a clear poster. You've elucidated a little now.

That said, why are you getting so defensive?

As for the rest of your points, I think you have fair reasoning in the second half of your post about answering questions before they're asked. Not certain if it's scummy, per se, but I can see where you'd think so.

The waffling thing prefacing the bolded isn't really amazingly useful for alignment detection.

The point about Logic vs. Nacho town also appears to be a non sequiter, and I think I was rolling it in with the sarcastic thing. My bad.

Anything else, Rhinox?

@Toasty: Context. It's your friend.

[UncertainKitten]

That's nice Rhinox. We can further discuss this when you've returned to the real world.

Ooh, you have a concise point by point. This shall be much easier to read!

1: Hasn't GreyICE answered this? Granted, at the time it still applied.
2: Mm, fine, fair point.
3: Damn straight it is >=[!
4: Not sure I agree. There is theory bandied about about L-1 claiming that could make GI's position a townier one.
5: Disagree. There are logical reasons to conclude someone is town from a bad vote, though usually they involve support reasoning as well.
6: Fairish, though I'd argue he'd only use his null list to accuse in the future, cutting his lynch pool down. His town list being so large actually contradicts your point fairly badly.
7: I HOPE you mean "after ICE flips scum" (Insert lol scumslip here against you :V). That said, ICE ALSO explained that one after your post, I think.
8: Potentially. Could also be someone weary with being asked stupid questions. But that's just me being devil's advocate. This point is decent.
9: The only fault I find here is that he felt the need to point OUT that he's "not married to his list". And again, that could be covering for idiots who think ANY contradiction is scummy. There are a lot of those.

So, that's what I think of your opinions. You have a few striking points, but not as many as you think you do.

[UncertainKitten]

Again, there needs to be more game reading here, Jahudo.

You know, like reading this post. I don't feel like digging for the Toasty one at the moment. I'm sure you can find it with a bit of effort.

[UncertainKitten]

@Vi: The we're ignoring this now? was because I thought that was part of the sarcasm thing, and also contributed to my opinion that half of Rhinox's post was about that.

Fuck you and your quote stripes, Vi, because they make shit hard to read, and whether you want it or not, I'm not going to inflict it on people.

Finally, it IS still open for me to consider. I just haven't gotten to getting a good clearheaded read of GI. So, I'd appreciate not assigning me opinions I haven't expressed, thank you very much ^-^.

[UncertainKitten]

@AT: That's really cool and I appreciate the format, but I'm kind of guilty of some of those things listed. Why aren't you pinging me at all?

[UncertainKitten]

-"inexplicable thing in Jahudo's ISO is making you "twitch". Yeah, OK.

I saw that and agreed with Vi.

- "The "why me" scumtell might be the crappiest scumtell ever."

I'm pretty sure I said it bugged me. The why meness.


So, yeah, actually, not as bad as I thought. Just I've supported some of the "scummy" things you've pinged and yet and absent from your list.

It just felt weird.

[UncertainKitten]

@Vi: Been really, really busy. As in my bosses deemed it awesome to crush me in 200 audio minutes of work busy. After reading a bunch of fucknuts who can't comprehend the english language, do you REALLY think I feel like reading 50 posts or so trying to figure out why I should or should not be voting GreyICE?

So you know what?



til I get unbusy. HOPEFULLY that will happen this week.

Or would you like me to just make something up? I can easily bullshit you if you want, Vi.

[UncertainKitten]

Well, I'm fine with *that* level of snark. It's not being personally insulting to Vi, nor is it incredibly ragey. I just want to avoid the all caps lock wall of cursing some people can evoke in me.

[UncertainKitten]

I'm purposefully NOT placing CES and Vi on my list until I see they're D2 actions. I have reason to believe that trying to read them from D1, at least at this juncture, would be less than pointless.

[UncertainKitten]

EBWOP: I mean ANY sort of reads list, so to speak.

[UncertainKitten]

@LLD: Because I just wanted to keep you interested, of course. We all know what happens when witches get bored.

Wait, what?

That's kinda a big thing. Town usually has far less reasons to avoid an undesirable thread than scum.

Should get to the GI issue today or tomorrow. I know a couple of his later posts have NOT been filling me with glee.

[UncertainKitten]

I haven't come to any conclusion yet. I think think the way he is going after Toasty is dumb at best and possibly scummy. I'd need more data.

[UncertainKitten]

So GUESS WHAT FUN I HAVE HAD INFLICTED ON ME!

That's RIGHT KIDS! I have 288 Audio Minutes to do within the next two days! Among OTHER THINGS. While it's not IMPOSSIBLE I'll get that GI read done in the meantime, it just became a fuckton less likely to happen before, like, Thursday.

To put this into perspective, I usually have about 80 Audio Minutes every day. As in 160 over two days, and pretty easily spaced out.

So, YEAH!

[UncertainKitten]

EBWOP: In the meantime I guess you all could ask me questions I can answer really quickly if you want. Or just pile them up for when I have a chance to reply more in full. Or something. I'll probably also comment on anything I feel like commenting on.

[UncertainKitten]

@Kdub: I told you already. That whole "lining up lynches" "tell" is silly.

@Vi: Correction, I've chosen to have no read on you and CES until D2. You should know damn well why. As for GI, I haven't had a chance to give him a serious read in isolation, and I was leaning town on him. But apparently everyone thinks he's scum so I *must* be missing something here.

Secondly, reviewing transcriptions is what I do for ~*~money~*~, and Audio Minutes are naturally how many minutes of audio that have been transcribed for me to review. So, at the very least, you know that if I were reviewing on a one for one basis, it'd take me 288 minutes. I'm a bit slower than that, as it takes me about 5 minutes for every 3 and a half audio minutes.

Naturally, this includes a lot of reading, and a lot of the reading is of fuckwits that can't spell, can't read, or can't hear. Or some combination of the three! So going from that...to analyzing a bunch of text walls is NOT exactly something *EASY* for me. I can do it on lighter days with more time, but there's no way in hell it's happening today, and it's highly unlikely to happen tomorrow.

HOPEFULLY you should understand NOW why I've dropped off a bit. I've been just wee bit busy, just MAYBE.

So, yeah:



The best part is, this isn't exactly uncommon knowledge. I find some of your tactics...interesting, to say the least, Vi ^-^.

[UncertainKitten]

Certainly, I'll give you that. And no, not suggesting you're scum, per se. Just suggesting that you MIGHT be going after lower hanging fruit for some reason. And I'm not sure why.

So it's just been filed away for now.

And no, I haven't done much since Thursday except defending myself and making a few off hand comments. If you'd like, let me detail my schedule since Thursday:

Thursday: Do 80 Audio Minutes, get assigned around 100

Friday: Run DnD, hang out with a friend, get assigned 88 Audio Minutes

Saturday: Fully intend to get work done. Don't because of shopping, loud ass father, and general difficulty. Also was *supposed* to have DnD that evening but that didn't happen. Rhythm is completely fucked up that day.

Sunday: Work on Thursday's work. DnD is cancelled today as well (different campaign). Then I have to cook dinner, spend some time in KoL, etc. It's busy.

Monday: DnD in the morning (the session that didn't happen Saturday). This happens til around 2. I'm tired, so two and a half hour nap. Then I have to upload the work I did Sunday, which is about an hour. Then I have to cook dinner. Then I find out I have 190 Audio Minutes due by Thursday. Note I still haven't finished the 88 from Friday. I'll be doing those today. Monday, I probably SHOULD have taken the opportunity to read. I didn't really feel like it.

Tuesday: Argue with you, detailing my schedule, and start work on the bullshit I have to do today. Then I have to head down to Richmond tonight. Probably not going to get reading.

So, yeah, happy?

[UncertainKitten]

@Kdub: I answered that too. At best it's stupid. At worst it's scummy. I don't have enough information to determine which yet. Well, let me rephrase that. I haven't analyzed the information enough to determine which yet.

[UncertainKitten]

@Vi: It's pretty obvious what I mean by that, and you should also know better.

Rhinox 472 is utterly stupid and I ignored it. Since you've chosen to bring it up, guess what? It WAS relevant to the game. Not to mention the fact that "reading a half dozen GI posts" may have been possible, but it would have been JUST reading. There wouldn't have been time for full analysis. ADD to that the fact that a half dozen posts doesn't do a whole lot to get a read when you're trying to re evaluate someone. So, sure, I could have read a half dozen GI posts.

It wouldn't have done a damn thing to advance my read of him

Also, in the time it took Rhinox to post that, he could have rubbed two brain cells together and realized the above.

@Vi: You've cited the wrong game. Completely forgot about Objection. I was referring to Encore. Hope that clarifies?

[UncertainKitten]

EBWOP: Rather, the part of Rhinox 472 concerning me.

[UncertainKitten]

@Vi: And you completely ignored the other thing. Time isn't enough, particularly after a bad transcription day. I can respond to current things, but I'm not in any damn shape to do a full analysis of a player. Thursday should be fairly decent for this. Oh, and the fact I was playing KoL between post A and post B. That probably has a little to do with it.

Secondly, I'm not entirely convinced you were unaware of the schedule issues I've had as of late, as a general trend in games. But whatever, I'm not pushing it today.

Thirdly, your D1 in Encore mafia was lackluster. You told me why when I recruited you. I feel you at least opened this game in the same manner. I'm not entirely sure you're applying much of your ability yet even now.

[UncertainKitten]

@Vi: Taking a short break, not long enough to do the analysis which I'm sure everyone is going to yell at me to do.

I'm aware you're working on a thesis. The reason I'm posting when I can is so I can keep up with what's happening *now* rather than increase my backlog. Granted, most of that has been defense at this juncture. Good news though, I may feel up to it later tonight. I'll be able to confirm later. My 190 audio minutes weren't NEARLY as bad as anticipated, and pacing myself is doing wonders. Hopefully I haven't jinxed myself to having hell reviews on these last 17 pieces :V.

I think I may just do a reread in full at this point. There's a lot more flying around than the GI thing and it should help re engage me.

[UncertainKitten]

This job has taught me some amount of self control, since it's basically working from home, over the internets. Meaning I have to resist the urge to open bookmarks and get a bunch of forum tabs open, because I know I'd never get anything done. In about 3 minutes I'm going to close this tab and clean up the work I'm supposed to do. I may or may not be back at around 4:30 or 5:00, depending on if I have to cook dinner tonight. I'll probably still not reread the game at that point, because I have KoL adventures to do. That'll take a couple hours, and then around 7 I'll probably be considering getting this game into SRS'D MODE >B[

[UncertainKitten]

Argh! I was this close to ascending tonight.

Ah well, guess I better get started on rereading the game. Bosses have deemed that I should still do a fuckton of work

[UncertainKitten]

Post 0 is terrible and Fate should be lynched for it.

Post 8: Seraphim is being ridiculously silly here. Particularly if he meant "serious vote"

Post 19: OK. No, seriously, Seraphim is being really silly. This is dumb.

I'll note page 1 has four Nacho posts. Three guesses as to how many have content. The first two zeroes don't count.

The flow on the LLD issue makes a bit more sense in context.

Post 48: So this is A) I'm going to ignore points I can't answer (because KDub had a point), and B) I'm not going to provide any reasoning for my "serious" vote ever. How win/win for you.

OK. I'm going to start a Useless Post count for Nacho.

Useless Nacho Posts: 6/6

HOLY GOD NACHO MADE A HALFWAY DECENT POST WE'RE ALL GOING TO DIE. It's still mostly IIoA though.

Post 67: LLD, this is still a terrible vote.

!!USELESS NACHO POST!!: 7/8

Nacho's next post is...decent, I guess.

As I said, I'm not judging CES today. But I see why people hate on him :V
...holy shit I get it. I understand what CES is doing now.

Post 83: This bugs me. It looks like a good post on the surface but it's not a lot of original thought, particularly from a player who hasn't provided much original thought so far. Further, a fair amount of the post isn't exactly necessary because it's kinda explaining joke votes and such.

GI's waffling thing is actually not that great in retrospect. To be honest, his 77 isn't NEARLY as good as I initially thought it was.

/me pets Past Kitty for observing the Seraphim thing.

Post 105: GI continues the "waffle" thing. And doesn't react to *ANYTHING ELSE*

Post 116: Seraphim being terrible again. Yay, you finally explained the reinforcement of your vote. TOO BAD YOU STILL HAVEN'T EXPLAINED WHY YOU MADE IT IN THE FIRST PLACE! And STILL haven't. Slippery bastard. Oh, and the misrepresentation of GI is pretty impressive too.

GI comes out looking better than Seraphim in the initial skirmish. This is unsurprising.

Post 123: Why did you post this, GI? It contributed nothing.

GI continues to beat the bloodily murdered horse on waffling. I know Jahudo asked but the point's been reiterated a bajillion times at this point.

Seraphim doesn't make himself look better with his next two posts. They focus on GI's weakest point ignoring the rest. Classic case breaking technique.

Post 130: Toasty, what the hell are you on about? Are you allergic to explaining your suspicion?

Post 135: Yes, really. Hell, she telegraphed that damn vote. What's your issue?

Post 140: Yes, everything that makes you look bad is a joke. Bravo. :clap clap:

Seraphim continues to dig his pit. He's done nothing to counter LLD's points

Post 153: This post is fucking terrible, Nacho. I know why you did it, but THE SITUATIONS WERE DIFFERENT. LLD actually TELEGRAPHED her damn vote. You just did that for the lulz. This goes in your useless post count.

!!USELESS NACHO POST!!: 8/9

GI 154 makes more sense if you figured out what Nacho was doing. With the Nacho town read from that post. Though I am beginning to disagree.

Post 167: Oh look another terrible Seraphim post. Yawn. The misrep is obvious, and was explained to you no less than twice.

Seraphim 184: "IT WAS A JOKE! ALSO, GAIZ, I'LL GET SERIOUS NOW BY STILL POSTING TERRIBLY!"

Post 188: Jahudo, why the fuck are you still encouraging the waffle thing? It's DEAD at this point. Latter half of your post is OK, I guess.

Post 196: This post is a useless distraction. It's very HEY GAIZ I'M TOWN, SO LET'S LYNCH SOMEONE WHO'S NOT ME!

Post 203: What in the nine hells is THIS, UT? Explain yourself! And do you have any OTHER reasons for voting Toasty?

Post 205: "HOLY SHIT LOOK AT THAT I'M TOWN TECH, LEMME GET IN ON THAT SHIT GREYICE!" Also bussing doesn't exist!

You know what? Vi, remember Bamboo Forest Mafia? With me and Kilga? Apply that to Seraphim and GI. They both need rope. BADLY

I'm redoubling my Hmm on Toasty for 105.

Post 214: This is not a good post. Granted, the Jahudo thing needed to be explained. The vote on you going to a town read basically means GI can A) Never random vote or B) Never change his mind. And you made posts between GI's vote and list. Same on UT.

Post 220: Ad hom and failure to advance anything new. This post is useless.

Post 224: You must have rolled below a 20, cause this is hypo-critical out teh ASS

!!USELESS NACHO POST!!: 9/10

Post 232:
Paragraph one: "Oh shit, Vi's on to me. Hey buddy, you aren't as bad as I thought, thanks for the contributions, we should have tea sometime, see ya!"
Paragraph two: OK, this one is all right.
Paragraph three: "Oh, hey LLD, you're town so I want you in my pocket too. Also I'm going to ignore the people that HAVE commented on the LLD wagon and pretend I'm being original"
Rest of it is fine, though feeds my Bamboo Forest theory.

Post 234: Yeah, it'd be a shame to push your buddy's wagon too far.

Post 240: SHIT BOSS GOTTA LOOK BUSY!

!!USELESS NACHO POST!!: 10/11
!!USELESS NACHO POST!!: 11/12

Now, I'm sure people are wondering why I don't have a useless post count on CES. As I said, I see what he's doing now. I think.

Post 269: >Completely not explaining the Rhinox change.

>Implying Vi isn't actually doing a pretty good job with a lot of content.

Well given you're focusing about TEN TIMES the attention on LLD as you are on Seraphim, I'd have said you gave fucking good indication you did.

[[Citation Needed]]

Post 272: This is hilarious in retrospect

Vi 283: SHIT, I'M SORRY! I WAS BLIND! I SEE THE LIGHT NOW!

Post 285: THIS is how you do a fucking town scum list, assholders. LEARN.

Post 288: Uh, what?

Post 303: Why the living FUCK was Nacho EVER GOD DAMN TOWN to you?

What POSSIBLY inspired that?

HOLY SHIT NACHO IS POSTING CONTENT FOR ONCE. Fair posts, really. Though they ignore a ton of OTHER issues. Some very important ones.

Post 313: I can just IMAGINE you typing "designated mislynch CES" in the scum QT right now. Why is Nacho town? WHY?

Post 326: "MotherFUCK, scumbuddy is being seriously pushed. Better get on here if I want the Bamboo Forest gambit to be realistic."

Post 333: Uh huh. I LOVE your blurb on Nacho there.

LLD: I think we might be on the same wavelength here. And I can understand why you wouldn't want to push it yet if I'm right.

Post 355: Nevermind, guess you aren't thinking what I'm thinking. How is GI town again?

Toasty 367: Problem with Jahudo is that that was a mistake. Rest is fine.

Post 374: HEY LOOK ANOTHER TERRIBLE GI POST. WHO HERE IS SURPRISED!?

Post 375: Way to gloat Seraph.

!!USELESS NACHO POST!!: 12/15?

Seraphim is amazingly disingenous on this page. Particularly the pressing LLD for her scumbuddy reads while saying you can't actually do that.

!!USELESS NACHO POST!!: 13/16?

Vi 399: So I'm not allowed to call out bad logic when I see it? There are lots of good reasons to vote GI. The ones provided by most people weren't.

Another rare useful Nacho post. And holy shit he's following my logic. Mayhap I underestimated him :O!

LLD 409: Again, done it before as scum offsite. Vi can tell you. It was ludicrous. I went on to win the game, by the way.

Post 411: Um, you DID call CES scum. When questioning why everyone thought him town. Thanks for playing though. Antitown I'll cede. Already said why your "setting up lynches" point is shit.

Bah, I'm on page 18 and honestly don't see my scum team changing.
tl;dr post forthcoming.

[UncertainKitten]

I have two out of three, and am not sure on the third.

Seraphim and GreyICE need to hang!

Nacho needs to be shot because he's spent the majority of the game being useless.
Toasty is difficult to read.
Most everyone else is strongly town in this game, with the possible exception of UT. He needs to post more and better.

I apologize for the wall but it's stream of consciousness.

[UncertainKitten]

Unvote, Vote GreyICE

L-Motherfucking 1, Motherfucker

CLAIM!

[UncertainKitten]

@Jahudo: I was dumb, mostly. But at the time, I basically had only read the first part of his ISO and it bled town. Then I actually READ the game today. Yeah.

[UncertainKitten]

/me facepalms

Unvote, Vote Seraphim

GI is town, much as I hate to admit it. I can say this with certainty. GI, why don't you try hard? Your entire game has been lackluster.

If it's not clear,

I am 100% sure GI is town, from his claim

[UncertainKitten]

And another useless post from Nacho. Either way, I guess it's not a bamboo forest situation after all. Seraphim still stands pretty scummily on his own.

[UncertainKitten]

I meant your first post. The next two are fine.

[UncertainKitten]

Bah. GI was pretty terrible looking. His posts suck. How you deduced his townness in that mess is beyond me. Fine with Sera lynch, VERY interested in the GI wagon.

[UncertainKitten]

Again, it was entirely possible they were, since it reminded me STRONGLY of my performance as scum in an offsite claim.

But, I suppose I thought wrong. At least GI won't be getting lynched.

[UncertainKitten]

Actually, it was my scumbuddy that pulled it off. He was manipulating me as much as the town. It was a pretty impressive piece of work. I was kinda really bad at mafia back then.

[UncertainKitten]

@GI: No, Nacho has been useless and has over 75% noise. It can't even be twisted to cryptic mystical bullshit. It's literally noise.

I DO have a hmm out on Toasty but it's less strong now that I know your alignment.

@Nacho: As for my "useless post", sure, it was. But at least MY noise ratio isn't above 75%. I have some leeway.

Yeah, no, we're lynching Seraphim regardless of whatever mystic bullshit tells your using. The scum FAR outweighs the town, and this is blatantly obvious.

And if those two are town, then who IS scum, Nacho?

[UncertainKitten]

Good luck with that. The amazing part is how you outline specific ways Seraphim is terrible and somehow get a town read from it. It's ridiculous.

[UncertainKitten]

Hmm. OK. Maybe, Nacho. Maybe. Seraphim is still worse though.

[UncertainKitten]

I disagree. While we've both been there, I don't think it's a universal thing.

Secondly, it is pretty much absolutely nothing GI

did

that makes him town. It's something I have, obviously.

Thirdly, scumtells are dumb, scum intent is better, and Seraph and GI were leaking it. Clearly I was wrong on GI. I refuse to believe I'm wrong on Seraph.

Fourthly, Vi's done a good job of finding all the scummy things about me.

No. Seraphim
Is
HANGING!

[UncertainKitten]

As an aside, thank you for playing the game now, Nacho.

[UncertainKitten]

That's nice Vi. Amazing how confirmation bias works, isn't it?

[UncertainKitten]

Oh, I'll also note that things that confirm someone as town aren't necessarily masonries.

[UncertainKitten]

LLD: I'm beginning to be inclined to agree with you. It is manifestly obvious that I'm either scum or I have specific information confirming GI. This means that Vi should be voting ME, not GI.

The persistence on GI implies she wants that mislynch badly.

Nacho: No, I know exactly what you mean. It's hard to be motivated to do a full read and you tend to lurk leading up to it. It's just...I feel Seraph has shown a lot of scum intent. Carelessness in who he wants dead, generally bad cases that look decent on the surface and out of context, snark because ~*~obviously~*~ scum don't react anything less than seriously, that sort of thing.

@GI: I actually had a strong feeling Kats was town. HF is a fair point. I was probably more frustrated with CD than necessarily suspecting him.

And you know what's interesting about Seraphim's wagon that none of those names you mentioned have? Seraphim's wagon had a counter wagon. Yours. Further, the wagon was allowed to stagnate. That implies scum were AVOIDING pushing it. I see the signs, and they don't say Sera town.

[UncertainKitten]

Well, for me, Vi town only made sense with GI scum. That condition no longer exists. I can accept Vi scum, though a case detailing specifically why is not unwelcome.

[UncertainKitten]

Wait. Weren't you saying Vi scum DIDN'T make sense with Seraphim scum!?

[UncertainKitten]

RIGHT ZOGGIN' HERE!

[UncertainKitten]

Ah, I understand now. Not sure I like it.

[UncertainKitten]

Oh, I'm just not sure it's only one of them being scum.

[UncertainKitten]

OK. That's more acceptable.

@CES: It's not a scum tell, it's the intent behind it. There's town snark and scum snark. Seraph's was scummy.

[UncertainKitten]

Can't be that easy, LLD. That would be WAY too easy. Vi and CES should BOTH be better than that.

[UncertainKitten]

@Jahudo: It was dumb that I thought GI was town, even with the slight suspiciousness.

@Vi: You're ignoring motherfucking role information to vote GI. That's dumb or scum right there.

And it's stronger than Nacho's spec. That wouldn't be 100%.

[UncertainKitten]

Sudden L-1 Vote? Look, I know it's annoying to read walls of text, but my logic does more or less flow from that. Perhaps you should read that before you call an L-1 vote "sudden"?

Maybe you should just reread the game in general? Or maybe just stop being scum?

[UncertainKitten]

@Toasty: Reaction to my claim. Now.

[UncertainKitten]

@Rhinox: I have role information, if that wasn't manifestly obvious. It's kind of irritating, really.

[UncertainKitten]

@KDub: You mean his lack of reaction? And completely ignoring the factors that make GI not scum? Cause I'm with you there.

[UncertainKitten]

Toasty. Vi's reaction is just bad.

[UncertainKitten]

Your objections AREN'T reasonable though. Even with your theory, you should be voting me. My death would confirm GI, if you really wanted to push it. Instead...you...want to lynch the confirmed (to me) innocent. I don't care about eating a lynch, really, though you'll have to convince the rest of the town of my scumminess.

THIS IS NOT TOWN BEHAVIOR.

[UncertainKitten]

Again, role information. If it's dubious, lovely. You're still not lynching GI today. It's me or scum. I wonder which one you plan to lynch. The big problem I have is you want to lynch an innocent with less than stellar evidence. As more information comes to light, your objections MIGHT have more merit.

Also, which game was that?

@GI: Meaning?

[UncertainKitten]

Ah, right, that game. I replaced in and didn't read it, IIRC.

@Rhinox: Character name.

[UncertainKitten]

@Vi: I thought that was obvious too...hence why your reaction seemed so ridiculous.

[UncertainKitten]

@Toasty: No, my claim. The one that cleared GI in the first place.

@Seraphim: Well, you could reassess other players since GI being town changes the game a little.

[UncertainKitten]

Well then, your flip is all the more important now, Seraphim. It could actually change some things.

[UncertainKitten]

Well, I'll admit your claim has me thinking, but to be honest, I can't really base any conjecture off of it without it being mod confirmed. The fact you are really rather scummy makes me comfortable with this.

And yes, I sort've am. But I'm also placing a wager you'll flip scum. Because I'm pretty sure you will. But if you DON'T, then things could very well change. It's like, if I thought you were town, I wouldn't suggest this. But I think you're scum, so I'm comfortable lynching you regardless of what you flip for information purposes. If that makes sense?

[UncertainKitten]

Oh, it gets worse GI. If Seraph flips town, I will full claim to explain.

I just doubt I'll have to do that.

@GI: Why do you not suspect Seraphim.

@Jahudo: Actually, doesn't the first post flavor heavily imply the Red Dragon Clan is our scum? Not that it's necessarily CONFIRMED, just...yeah.

[UncertainKitten]

Hmm? That's odd to say, Jahudo. Why should it be difficult to lynch Vicious?

[UncertainKitten]

@GI: Well, again, I need SOMETHING Red Dragon related to figure out where I stand on things.

@Jahudo: Oh, understood. That's not why I want to lynch him, that's just something useful I'll get out of it on the off chance he flips town.

[UncertainKitten]

Not the slightest, GI. CES changed patterns.

[UncertainKitten]

@Toasty:
Step 1: Scroll ALLL the way down
Step 2: Look at that cute little thing that says "Display posts by user:" with an ADORABLE drop down box saying "All users" in it.
Step 3: Click the nice little arrow on the drop down box. Now, this is the hard part but bear with me. Select UncertainKitten
Step 4: We're getting into advanced stuff now. You see that little button that says "Go"? You can CLICK THAT :O
Step 5: Go through the last couple pages of my posts. It should be a couple posts after the REALLY LONG one where I vote GreyICE.
Step 6: Read said post
Step 7: ???
Step 8: Profit!!!

[UncertainKitten]

Hmm.

Dammit Jahudo, you cut me ruining the effect. My Hmm is directed at GI.

Also, Jahudo, flavor is more important than it looks like.

[UncertainKitten]

Uh...what?

OK. You have a one shot investigate. I am considering some possibilities but they don't matter yet. Seraphim has claimed RDC. You've stated you are an RDC cop.

Why would you investigate Seraphim? Am I missing something here?

[UncertainKitten]

Now I get it.

Thing is, Seraphim lynch will ALSO lead to scum, I'm pretty sure. And if it doesn't we'll have informations to play with. I don't really see Toasty flailing so much as persisting in his uselessness.

[UncertainKitten]

Leading to scum meant in this case it'd be a scum lynch. I'm not as convinced on the toasty thing.

[UncertainKitten]

Well, convince me then, GI:

A) How is Toasty flailing anymore than his relative uselessness before this?
B) What makes Toasty scummy rather than just bad?
C) What makes Toasty a better candidate than Seraphim?

Answering these questions will greatly elucidate things, and POSSIBLY compel me to listen to you.

[UncertainKitten]

@Vi: Oh U

Anyway, my questions were for GI, NOT you.

[UncertainKitten]

You're being vague. Link or quote, please.

I am in favor of a Seraph full claim

[UncertainKitten]

It was at you. You just say "this happened" and don't support it. Please do so.

[UncertainKitten]

Well, yes, in general when you accuse someone of being scum, you should provide a case. So, handing me one shouldn't be unexpected. I'll look at it in a couple hours.

[UncertainKitten]

Proof...against him...what?

What are you even talking about, Toasty?

[UncertainKitten]

Toasty, you...you completely missed my fucking point. COMPLETELY! I did NOT mean that post. I said the one a couple BELOW THAT!!!! THE ONE WHERE I CLAIM I FUCKING KNOW THAT GI IS TOWN! Are you *seriously* that dense?

Please. LEARN TO READ!

[UncertainKitten]

@GI: The first part was quoting Jahudo.

The response is pretty obviously the rest.

[UncertainKitten]

So this is yet another reason Seraph needs to hang. Paafekuto~

[UncertainKitten]

Uh huh.

[UncertainKitten]

Jesus christ people. Not only do we have someone who has been practically the scummiest scum to ever scum, this game, but he's now admitted he lied to us? At a timing that makes pretty much no logical sense?

Yeah, no. Seraphim.
Hangs.

[UncertainKitten]

Fine. My gut says your lying too. So does my spleen. And my big toe. And my left ear.

[UncertainKitten]

EBWOP: You're

[UncertainKitten]

Nah, I didn't wager em. Just sayan that if logic has no place, my feeling is you're still scum.

[UncertainKitten]

@Toasty: The thing is, you never reacted to it, and it's quite interesting you've spent all this time ignoring it.

[UncertainKitten]

EBWOP: Also, Toasty's use of LAL rhetoric is making me uncomfortable about Seraph.

[UncertainKitten]

Hell, I'm half a mind to go with you at this point, GI.

[UncertainKitten]

@Toasty: Maybe it's because it appears to be the only reason you want Seraphim dead. I said it

in conjuction

with the rest of the reasons Seraphim needs to die. You're just "herp derp HE LIED LET'S LYNCH ALL LIARS BECAUSE GAMBITS NEVER HAPPEN"

One of these is scummy! Which one is an exercise I'll leave to the reader.

And no, it's pretty unreasonable that you missed something in bleeding red fucking text. Red text isn't exactly common in this game. It should have caught your eye. I honestly don't buy it.

[UncertainKitten]

LLD, reactions to Seraph's claim?

[UncertainKitten]

Quit being on the same page as me >=[!

[UncertainKitten]

Hmm...interesting thought. You haven't said, like, anything about me CES. At all. What gives? You haven't snarked me at all ...I feel left out.

[UncertainKitten]

My life is fulfilled now! CES called me out ^-^.

[UncertainKitten]

N, too WIFOMy to consider it anything but a null tell. You know that I've played the "Fine, lynch or vig me" card as scum before.

[UncertainKitten]

Still WIFOMtastic. It gives him an excuse to keep a terrible vote at...what cost to him again? Anyone who'd lynch/vig over it probably has OTHER issues with Toasty, given our target rich environment.

Cut: What do you mean by that? What were you misreading?

[UncertainKitten]

Ah, ok. It still didn't impress me either way.

[UncertainKitten]

Jahudo: Insane Asylum and Insane Asylum II. Granted, the general idea behind those was ~*~playing with millers~*~

That said, god dammit we have too many claims. I'm really at the point where I want to disregard most of the claims and just plain scumhunt irrespective of role information. Well, except for my own. I would assume Fate wouldn't outright lie to me in a PM.

[UncertainKitten]

Uh...what, GI? How would Vi and Jahudo be scum together? You're proposing that Jahudo scum would come out of the wood work...and derail a Seraphim lynch, who you are calling not mafia...and...huh? How does this follow at...what?

[UncertainKitten]

But...

Ugh, you're not making sense.

All right, here's what I see your logic as:
1) Vi is fakeclaiming scum
2) Jahudo could fakeclaiming scum
3) Seraphim is a third party lyncher

Facts:
1) Seraphim is the largest wagon and stands a high chance of being lynched
2) Vi's claim helped push Seraphim to this status
3) Jahudo's claim naturally implicates Vi barring miller madness

Holes in your logic:
1) If Seraphim is not mafia, and was about to be lynched, why would scum Jahudo counterclaim scum Vi?
2) If Vi is mafia, pushing the lynch on a more or less innocent Seraphim, why would Jahudo redirect the wagon to someone who is scum?

Tell me where I'm misinterpreting?

[UncertainKitten]

@GI: You have completely failed to answer my question. Why?

[UncertainKitten]

Well, I'll be honestly surprised if there IS a vengeful kill, so whatev.

And again, I'm not sure I understand the logic between Jahudo and Vi having some AMAZING SUPER SECRET TECH PLAN TO GET...UH...ONE OF THEIR OWN SCUMBUDDIES LYNCHED INSTEAD OF THE CLAIMED THIRD PARTY! TOTES!

And yeah, Seraphim's claim is ludicrous.

@GI: No, actually, you haven't answered my question. I have, point by point, shown why your logic is bad. You have provided no answer OR no clarification on this. Why
Are
You
Dodging
The
Issue!?


Also, when did RDC become confirmed scum? Granted, it was my expectation but I didn't see a clarification.

[UncertainKitten]

@Seraphim: But RDC investigation != RDC scum. It's just highly probably. That does not 100% confirm the RDC as scum. I'm mostly splitting hairs here. I believe they are likely our scum group, I just don't see it as "100% confirmed"

@LLD: My role implies it as well. But I don't see that as ~*~fully confirmed~*~ publically, if that makes sense?

@Nacho: At this point? Scum. And if he flips scum, I expect Jahudo would flip scum. The only wall I run into here is that if we lynch Vi in response to Jahudo's claim, and Vi flips miller, than that sacrifices Jahudo to keep Seraphim alive...why?

His role makes absolutely no sense.

@Seraph: Keep thinking it's tunnel vision and you've done absolutely nothing scummy, made no ridiculous claims, or just overall not played awfully.

[UncertainKitten]

@GI: Are you claiming that you specifically get alignment through RDC flavor, as in it specifically says such? Or are you conjecturing because "Fate wouldn't put in a useless one shot cop"?

@Seraph: I don't think both Vi and Jahudo are town. I do think your flip will solve this. One of them pretty much has to be scum with you. If you flip scum, one of them was trying to divert the lynch to the other miller. If you are third party as you claim, or not mafia, then the counterclaim is true, though REALLY late in coming for some odd reason.

Lynching one of the millers directly at this point is a suboptimal strategy since you're pretty much proven not town. We win regardless of your flip given our parameters. Further, your flip provides ~*~informations~*~ that lead to scum, whether it's your buddy or unrelated to you.

[UncertainKitten]

Yeah, that's the essentia of it KDub. I'll be interesting to see how you support Seraph-Vi scum in the future.

But, if he REALLY didn't get removed from the game, why should he care? Vicious dies, he gets lynched, ~*~he still wins!~*~

[UncertainKitten]

@Rhinox: My role information confirms GI as town, so you know.

@LLD: Is it an Incu-bus!?

[UncertainKitten]

Just wanted to be clear. Because essentially if GI is scum, I'd pretty much have to be scum with him.

[UncertainKitten]

Thank you for your stunning contribution, CES.

[UncertainKitten]

@GI: You've basically gone off the deep end of tunnel vision and into suboptimal VI zone. You'll excuse me if I proceed to ignore your posts until you start being sane again. Sorry~

[UncertainKitten]

@NM: I had a scumread on the Seraphim wagon?

[UncertainKitten]

Having fun GreyICE?

[UncertainKitten]

It'd be nice if you presented things in far more reasonable and...ah...what was the word...AH RIGHT! Logical manner.

Right now you come off as a raving lunatic with tunnel vision. And you know, I've been there before. Had all three scum in a row, named, kept on them all game, but my presentation was so terrible that they basically never got lynched.

I'd like to think that's the case with you at the moment, but that seems to be a rarity. Usually when someone is acting like a raving lunatic, their theories are just as insane.

[UncertainKitten]

DIDN'T SEE THAT COMING!

[UncertainKitten]

Mostly Oh U at the dead QT. Once I questioned LLD being scum, things started falling into place. Though I still was wrong on GI by the end.

@GI: Wasn't really trying that hard in the dead topic, honestly. Bear in mind I was basing my reads off LLD scum. So, before you criticize, I suggest you get a read for the situation, Mr. Pope that was completely wrong about everything.

@GI: No, CES was a terrible lynch. I could tell he was town from the start and nothing I saw changed that. Jahudo was a terrible lynch for reasons I outlined D1. I forget what it was but he had a swing vote or swing claim that more or less CONFIRMED him as town. You all were just dumbasses about it.

@Rhinox: Anyway, I know you don't talk about me, but I want to reassure you that you aren't policy lynch material in my eyes. No, you aren't the greatest, but you're no vezok .

@GI: To be honest, I thought you were milking the fuck out of me "confirming" you and it felt scummy. I probably should have known better.

@CES/GI: I also read CES pretty well, I think. I don't think I ever actually thought he was scum (though correct me if I'm wrong)

So, yeah, what irritates me most is dying N1. I WASN'T PLAYING GOOD ENOUGH FOR THAT "HONOR"!

[UncertainKitten]

Witches did it, LLD .

[UncertainKitten]

town-scum in Objection, Rhinox. H-how did you forgeeeeeeeettttttt !!

[UncertainKitten]

@Rhinox: Eh, I wasn't doing great in O:R either. I'm amazed GammaGooey brought it to a win.

@Toasty: Oh God, I was so WHAT THE HELL when people lynched Jahudo. That was not a thing that should have happened. I even DETAILED who should be lynched after Seraphim because one of Vi/Seraph/Jahudo was scum.

[UncertainKitten]

Incidentally, the reason I didn't just full confirm GI was because I reread my role PM and realized it said GI was NOT IN THE RED DRAGON CLAN,

NOT

that he was town. Whoops!