Mini 1080 -- txtMafia -- Game OVER

[Vi]

Hi everyone!

I'm going to read through the game and etc.

[Vi]

Cay-try a little, replace out
Korts-Be funny, replace out
Hero-Be logical but come under fire
moth-come under fire
Eq-come under fire and then be logical

[Vi]

That previous post sounds silly, but I've never played more than one game with any of them and never more than two game days. colonslash emote

[Vi]

Forgot earlier that I played with RayFrost & FtF a long time ago. Don't remember Fish; Frost buddied me heavily as scum.

Still reading.

[Vi]

Am still here. Top suspects are not being wagoned right now, but deadline :colonslash: Why no extension talk?

Rereading for Tasky vs. kunkstar. :sad:

[Vi]

Top suspect is RayFrost, full stop.

A-Vox was briefly on the radar before I got lost in links and one-liners.

Tasky feels like n00bTown. tbc might hit charlim

Truncated. ~~NS

[Vi]

Rereading did zero to give me a read on k-star.

Eq isn't getting lynched Today & I wouldn't care about her cept for "Pretty sure I won't die overnight" (752).

[Vi]

So I don't like either wagon and would rather have an extension.

Also lol Paragon; nobody's re-nominated me and prob for good reason tongue.gif

[Vi]

UnHero: Isoreading is even worse than reading normally; what am I missing?

I didn't get anything particularly bad from H. Also, Page 1 Qs = less likely scum.

[Vi]

H: What about RayFrost?

[Vi]

Buddying argument seems weak.

K: Is Tasky still scum?

H on RF: I was asking YOU a question.

AH: Tasky's play isn't

good

...

[Vi]

@H: Don't think defense is sufficient.

Not up to lynching kunkstar tbh.

Kast's links go to wrong places?

[Vi]

ALL OF THE LINKS ARE CONFUSING
IF THERE'S ANY WAY TO AVOID MAKING ME OPEN ANOTHER WINDOW, DO SO

plz&ty

[Vi]

Also: Tasky vs. Fonz = OMGUS? colonquestionmark

Tasky's case vs. Fonzarelli isn't all that good, but OMGUS?

[Vi]

Also

Unvote: Fishythefish
Vote: RayFrost

(L-6)

[Vi]

Kast - Already have 10 tabs open at once at any given time.

Fonz has thoroughly beaten into ground that Tasky's case isn't substantiated, more

[Vi]

but T still seems like an easy D1 lynch.

H: "Defense" is not intended as a charged word.

AH: I obv. don't agree but tell me why.

[Vi]

I really want to have more to say but incoherent game + 10 posts/hour = v(dot)v

[Vi]

Fonz 889 - Tactlessly so, but given two ongoing game references, not inclined to think Maf101 argument counts.

Kast 918 - AV is on reread list. (more)

[Vi]

AH 925 fails at context; RayFrost meta was before reading; never made case on RF, though H got gist of it.

Saying "content" ITT inspires flaming. (more)

[Vi]

H 951 is correct. Don't get H 972 though.

AH is lurking?

chamber 811 accusing Fonz seems strange esp. after today.

Kast: AV = Scum; Y/N

[Vi]

AH: I did (1008 and now 1027).

chamber: How did that go?~

[Vi]

@Vi: Rayfrost keeps slipping toward scummy, then recovering. Bad vibes, parked votes, etc...

coasting also

also get over yourself, lurker

[Vi]

chamber: Bluntly, I can't get a sense for scum between one-liners and post sprees.
At this point it's probably better to just play from when I replaced in.

[Vi]

Not particularly typical for me to vote without saying why, but it's also not typical for me to be playing a game with this godawful charlimit.

Fonz post-VC ge

Truncated. ~~NS

[Vi]

Still don't understand kunkstar hate beyond what Eq said.

AV reread coming tonight hopefully. Any other requests should be made now.

[Vi]

Because Herodotus asked me to, I had been looking to replace into a game, and I support NS-as-mod.

Also didn't expect it to be this difficult. colonslash

[Vi]

AV: Sympathize w/ a/lurking accusations in beginning, carrying on about Equinox is beyond terrible, wagon votes seem conveniently placed.

also WTH is AV 623

[Vi]

Although speaking of H.
735 "It's my opinion that one of Tasky/kunk is scum"
justification plz because existence late on both wagons is shaky

[Vi]

H 1056
"tasky wagon analysis" has star :curiosity:

also telling kunk to save himself seems off even with PoE reasoning, esp. after "one or other is scum"

[Vi]

Disappointed in lack of RayFrost following - perhaps own fault but w/ever - but vote is presently wasted.

Unvote: RayFrost
Vote: AurorusVox

(L-3)

[Vi]

Fonz post-VC "gets it" (re: Tasky).

[Vi]

Lynching (soft)claimed power roles D1, Y/N

[Vi]

"I don't want to out Eq's role; I just want to lynch her" colonquestionmark

[Vi]

@A-Vox: so

assuming we all got some epiphany and started agreeing with you

what do you foresee happening

[Vi]

H:
After the vote count

also, kunkstar reasoning seems like false dilemma

[Vi]

AV - Twas thinking more about how you would FORCE A CLAIM FROM EQUINOX IN THE PROCESS

[Vi]

@H1111: :scowl:

[Vi]

colonquestionmark

[Vi]

That's not a question; that's a smirk. And it's based on everything I've said in the last two pages vs. your 1115.

[Vi]

There is no reason to lynch a softclaimed power role D1, at least not in this case. AV's justifications don't make coherent sense anyway.

[Vi]

And aside from that, I've already looked at kunk*'s ISO and don't see whatever is so incredibly incriminating.

[Vi]

Not sure what "decent scumhunting" is being referred to in your post.

[Vi]

H1134 - Can't tell; AV locked himself into that train of thought quite a ways before
Re:k* - ...actually, not really. colonslash

[Vi]

Did anything actually result from H vs. RF?

[Vi]

I'm assuming that will come with "cases soon", obv.

chamber: Comic relief doesn't work well with 160 chars/post & no emotes.

[Vi]

Fonz 1175 has point.

AV Vote was because of deadline & better vote than k* more than anything; 1196 is correct.

623 = bizarre logic trying to implicate H.

[Vi]

Don't think I was even around for Equigate tyvm

Antihero seems basically to like discrediting me when I've pushed more than the status quo

[Vi]

although Q: What were you trying to get out of that fakehammer?

Recent post by RayFrost REALLY makes me want to lynch him. :glare:

[Vi]

Aaaaaand

Unvote: AurorusVox

Intent for k*.

also in future don't try to argue with chamber, it just doesn't work *shrug*

[Vi]

It wasn't ANTI-Town; why frame it like it is? Second two sentences are fluff

[Vi]

Why no sense? The notion that people have abs. knowledge of the vote count was pretty obv. shown to be false; that's the whole point behind fakehammering

[Vi]

Why a reaction from k* instead of anyone else?

[Vi]

RF 1251 - ...oh, okay then.

Right now your vote is on Tasqui. Why not say anything that would engage you or your vote?

[Vi]

RF case pretty clearly stated by H - particularly a-lurking
would love 2 know basis behind RF Town read

Keeping vote on RF w/ chance of D1 NL is a "bad thing"

[Vi]

I stand by decision to unvote AV. Also points against k* have been raised in response to my lack of understanding and they're not bad

[Vi]

k* case largely comes down to inconspicuous scumhunting and general low activity, esp. under pressure. Not amazing, but it's who has votes.

[Vi]

"shaky" refers to H's alibi considering he was late on BOTH of the wagons on people he claims scum on

[Vi]

chamber: Referring to previous experience in M.Dodgeball (the other MD) colon P

[Vi]

It's in the past anyway.

k*'s grief is acknowledged.

[Vi]

Not really.

Vote: kunkstar7

(L-1)

23.5 hours to deadline.

[Vi]

You've no idea how pathetic this convo sounds from my POV.

AV: Refer here plz

[Vi]

There's no time for alternatives, and at this point discussion is probably counterproductive.

[Vi]

Vote: RayFrost

(L-5) as before.

V/LA through Sunday; sig.

[Vi]

Kast's reason for me-scum is terrible on a couple of levels.

I don't disagree with chamber here.

[Vi]

Level 1 - Your previous post is incorrect on its face
Level 2 - "overdefense" when questioned about it D1?
I still stand by prev. post.

[Vi]

Kast - TF = scum, Y/N

[Vi]

Kast - Why do you think you know my motives better than I do?

[Vi]

If TF is probTown, why the accusatory tone? i.e. 1328

[Vi]

chamber: Why do you think AV-hypoCop has a inv on you? Specifically, a scum inv?

Vee'elay for four days.

[Vi]

chamber's Guilty-self/Inno-someone-else still has me a little on edge but I think I understand what he's saying.

[Vi]

RF's passivity is frustrating because he's going under so many radars.

AH's attempt at connections/keeping options open is lol.

[Vi]

Judgment reserved on AV wagon analysis until AV and Kast return.

[Vi]

AH1398 - Not vague. No matter who you vote, I'm your second pick - in fact, this time

I'm Kast's partner

for undefined reasons. Really?

[Vi]

RF - I know how hard it is to work with this format. Yet look at others who are being aggressive within limits. No deal.

[Vi]

I had no intention of "explaining away" my vote for k*, as should be obvious by (among other things) my repeated "I STAND BY MY ____".

[Vi]

"Letting people go under your radar" is normally reserved for people who actually do blatantly Townish things. "No less than anyone else"? l'ol

[Vi]

I got it, I got it.

[Vi]

chamber 1418 - It looked like a slip. It evidently wasn't.

[Vi]

@Antihero: How about "rofl"? In which case "rofl 1363".

[Vi]

Re: RF-Everything said Today has been made of air. During #70-#74, he made it clear that no alignment interest in you was at stake.

[Vi]

#68&#69 feels like a Love Tap of Suspicion; RF hasn't mentioned Tasky since he was declared obvTown in spite of him being PE#1 Yesterday.

[Vi]

And that was just a quick look back. Need more?

[Vi]

Ah yes, I forgot about this.
Why not take this to RF: Where did Tasky go?

[Vi]

@1429 - Switching to k* was a pro-Town move, though -risk- didn't cross my mind.

What's your stake in the discussion?

[Vi]

1434:
-Me: <examples>
-You: blanket NUH-UH
So why should I post more examples? No sense in wrestling with a WOMBAT.

[Vi]

1436 - Full-blown cases are meh to me and hard to make ITT. As long as there's some obvmotive behind a vote I'm not upset. (ctd)

[Vi]

(ctd) A better question is whether chamber would up-front try to get you to claim as scum. (leaning no, but no precedent)

[Vi]

RF 1432 - Open up. Who DO you suspect? Why focus on H when he was Town Yesterday?

[Vi]

Kast is a ? for me until he returns.

@H: RF Defense isn't sole reason I'm vs. Antihero.

[Vi]

Let's try this.

"Overjustification

[of k* vote]

" - Outline this. Nao.

[Vi]

1462-what in that suggests I thought k* = innocent?

1463-what in that suggests I had no read on AV considering I was voting him over k*? grey vs. greyer

[Vi]

Aside from being kind of obviously wrong there, you continue to say that my unvote AV was there because of Equinox when I've hinted otherwise p.much ALL OF D2.

[Vi]

Claiming that I said I never suspected AV is, again, retarded and at odds with the truth.

[Vi]

"Response to args vs. k*" is a reference to Herodotus pointing out why k* was getting votes; my response was shown in your first link.

[Vi]

And let's go ahead and drive this home.

THIS IS A DRUNKEN SOFTCLAIM

[Vi]

THAT IS WHY I UNVOTED AV
IT WOULD HAVE BEEN UNTOWN TO SAY SO AT THE TIME
THIS IS WHY I HAVEN'T OPPOSED CHAMBER TODAY
I HAVE ACTUALLY BEEN REALLY OBVIOUS RE: THIS

[Vi]

And now you're leaving me to decide whether you deluded yourself into that interpretation or intentionally framed it that way...

[Vi]

...considering you literally FORCED your incorrect interpretation on me without regard for my insistence that you were wrong.

[Vi]

Catching up...

Kast 1455/6 doesn't seem to mesh. Why accuse someone you think is Town of being not-genuine? (1328)

[Vi]

AH 1474/6 beating the anti-Kast drum immediately after Vi vs. Kast without mentioning the prev. flareup doesn't seem genuine either.

[Vi]

Kast 1487 still isn't quite correct but not worth arguing. Don't think subseq. argument will help anyone.

Tasqui: Does AV-potential PR change your read on him?

[Vi]

Kast 1520 is actually a good point. Also, 1532 is second time H says he was really thinking what became common knowledge all along.

[Vi]

H1563 - chamber is scummy?

[Vi]

Improper use of 'lulz' aside, there's an obvious difference between being emotionally compromised and not being genuine.

[Vi]

If you think someone is Town but not thinking straight, you don't word things toward them like an accusation unless you plan to use it as a weapon later.

[Vi]

You keep using that word. I do not think it means what you think it means.

[Vi]

Also, do you think I'm scum, or are you just an asshat in general?

[Vi]

At risk of shouting into the wind, there's quite a difference between "inauthentic" i.e. not fabricated and "emotionally compromised".

[Vi]

Why is AV at the top of your scumlist?

[Vi]

"initial vote"?
Fishing is blatant but see two posts down.
Attacking defenders is great way to fabricate mass suspicion.

[Vi]

Big question: If AV softclaims and you think AV is scum, why not push for fullclaim? You did exact opposite (1522)

[Vi]

Fullclaim makes AV heavily accountable.

Particular role may also justify fishing (prob why chamber thought AV=Cop).

[Vi]

chamber: Why is AV still worth wagoning?
Kast's insistence that AV never s/cd is ludicrous and avoids issue (1600/1) altogether

[Vi]

1630 - Would you like to clarify what the linked post WAS if not an S/C?

[Vi]

"Buying time" via... what means if not a softclaim?
Also 1633 - if someone you think is scum S/Cs, you

call them on it

(ctd)

[Vi]

or they stay at power role status (rel. unsuspected) with no accountability and the pressure goes away.

[Vi]

Touche, actually. I dropped AV because no lynching claimed power role D1 and never did come back. I agree that as scum he would claim Cop tho.

[Vi]

1641 - "later" as in "at L-1" - really what explanation would be best served at L-1

[Vi]

1646 - Actually, not really. I saw the softclaim and didn't think further about what it could be, though chamber saying Cop made sense.

[Vi]

1652 - Rest assured I feel similarly about you, example: "Vi later

claimed

it was" (1651).

Do you endorse the RayFrost wagon?

[Vi]

H: Fair. If nothing else the argument won't continue over the weekend.

[Vi]

1665 - Passivity and not saying anything solid or controversial, ever. coast coast coast

How 'bout using that vote?

[Vi]

Hafta agree about why you'd have to check your Role PM.

However, AV's LaVT policy is flawed.

[Vi]

VT is least risky but is only good if claimant can sway people off wagon anyway (though this happens).

The notion of RF getting NKd is a bit unlikely.

[Vi]

1686 -

Vote: Rayfrost

DIE DIE DIE DIE DIE DIE DIE etc. j/k

S/what ambiv. about RF due to composure, but that's how RF got to L-1 in the first place.

[Vi]

Still catching up (five pages :emote: ) but 1817 - Did it turn out to be a good move?

[Vi]

Greeted by five pages. :emote:

Theory stuff has already been addressed; won't go over it again...

[Vi]

1707 - lrn2hyperbole
1708 - Very calm collected approach is not the first thing people think of when they think "scum"...

[Vi]

...though I've seen them win games w/out much hassle.

To that end I agree with 1722 reg. of your alignment.

[Vi]

1718 is not a scumslip. After reading these 5 pages, I don't see AV as much other than transparent Town.

[Vi]

1725 - Saying there's nothing to go on in a game with the longest Day 1 in site history (look it up) is a cop-out.

Lack of irony in 1743/4 is noted. :emote:

[Vi]

@H

- In light of 1749, I'm assuming you think AH is scum?

Don't understand point of chamber's questions.

Fonz's recent posts add nothing.

[Vi]

Also, this game is ~*~awesome~*~ for my Posts Per Day. :emote:

[Vi]

Tasky, just checking, but do you even know what it takes to get modkilled on this site?

[Vi]

Oh.
The fact that AV is dead & Tasky isn't in that game makes it a little better but still.

[Vi]

We'll discuss the rules later. For now I'd really rather you NOT get modsmacked, so etc.

[Vi]

1842-Hyperbole was involved. H/ever, most of your useful activity up to this point involved making lists and analyzing wagons when possible.

[Vi]

Most times you make an accusation you follow by denying the pressure. Ditto with votes D1.

Irony responses seem flawed but arguing will get nowhere.

[Vi]

1851-Who are these "people I want to"?

[Vi]

1857 - Why?

[Vi]

1861-
"I'm starting to REALLY dislike this pattern." (#24)
"Whether I think you're scum is irrelevant" (#14)
etc.

[Vi]

1870 - I'm assuming I'm in connection with AV?
1871 - My guess is the AH wagon jump given 1869.

[Vi]

Worth stating at this time: Scum 3 as of beg. of D2 were RF/AH/K.
While K is still a prick, don't think his intentions were bad.

[Vi]

RFposting seemed decent in re: to pressing.
Would vote AH but would be hammer, plus replacement, etc.

[Vi]

Thus, want to reread and regroup if D2 extended, and should have time to do it tomorrow. Questions or suggestions welcome.

[Vi]

Oh hey post 2000 steal.~

[Vi]

Fonz 2030 - Please elaborate on the difference between you and me in this regard, since that's what's at the heart of the issue.

[Vi]

I'm what you could call "very interested" in what werewolf has to say. I know it's exam time, but don't wait up.

[Vi]

I'm done rereading and results will come when I have time to post them (later tonight).

[Vi]

chamber 2050 - Clarify.

[Vi]

So, I have a problem.
The whole summary is 29 tabs long, before checking for exact lengths. :emote:

However, conclusion looks something like this...

[Vi]

AH > Kast = chamber > FtF = Fonz > RF > AV > T > H

[Vi]

Clarification can be provided upon request :emote:

AH on top is actually questionable due to him just not being here much... (ctd)

[Vi]

...and the way he replaced out fits not having time to catch up and makes fluffposts somewhat more forgivable (not other points though).

[Vi]

I have a little more to say but I'll sit on it right now.

[Vi]

You look better IMO, but it's more appropriate to say I like the people ahead of you LESS.

[Vi]

Would you rather I just post the whole thing? :emote:

[Vi]

The conclusion IS the shorthand... :emote:

[Vi]

AH

-Calls Vi+Kast scumteam. (1363) The "Vi AND someone" bit will show up a lot. Reason for Kast suspicion is never given aside from sheeping Fonzie's logic.

[Vi]

-Shows up to call Kast scum again after me+Kast flareup but noticeably avoids mentioning that issue directly above his post (1474)

[Vi]

-Attack on me is made of theatrics and lol.
+This is p.much all of AH's posts D2, but see previous caveat about lack of redeeming value, though.

[Vi]

Kast

-I'm scum with someone again; this time AV. (1307)
This wouldn't be so bad if he recanted it after his premise was blown to pieces but no such luck. (1651)

[Vi]

Meanwhile insistence that there could only have been ONE explanation for my AV unvote suggests a strategic position.
-"AV defense feels 'off'" (1603) (ctd)

[Vi]

is wonderfully vague, and yet is one of the key arguments for me being connected with AV (and/or AV's scumpartner).

[Vi]

-Explanation/insistence of AV NOT S/Cing (1636) makes no feasible sense.
-1919 re:RF is p.much not true.
-1985 defending RF conveniently misses pre-wagon D2.

[Vi]

-~80% of what Kast says is an attack, even on people who from his PoV shouldn't need to be attacked. (ctd)

[Vi]

Aside from sowing discord, discouraging Town synergy, and maximizing # of targets, no reason to do so.

[Vi]

chamber

-Sketchy way of avoiding Kast in favor of RF. (1617) (ctd)

[Vi]

"Laying groundwork" claim is dubious from my PoV because chamber is one of THREE people who have called me scum with someone else (1933). (ctd)

[Vi]

If that's not laying groundwork, tell me what is. Further justification of nonvote in 1763 falls flat.
-Numbers game ~1799 seems completely irrelevant (ctd)

[Vi]

esp. when paired with seemingly unfitting reasoning in 1827.
-First vote on Antihero was an obvious shill (1851); (ctd)

[Vi]

claims reason for that exists in 1869 and I'd love to know what it is.

[Vi]

FtF

-Votes RayFrost w/o explanation (1581) and removes it for info reasons later (1695), thus causing me to question how legit the vote was in the first place.

[Vi]

-Esp. since he did similar to Antihero (1857, 1975).
Granted AH was FtF's original vote for the Day, (ctd)

[Vi]

but timing looks hideous and joining in claim chorus seems at odds with wanting someone lynched.
-Repeated stalling, etc. This is most of FtF's contribution D2.

[Vi]

Fonz

-Default wagon tell is a first for me, and will be first for next time because Fonz never acted on it. (1309)

[Vi]

-Is coasting on imaginary Town cred. Samples:
1528 - pops in like he had been there the whole time!
1950 - Town

leader

,

really?

[Vi]

-RayFrost vote is "locked on" for policy reasons - 1867, 1902 - reminds me of AV's attempt at policy, except more obv. suboptimal.

[Vi]

-Attempt to call H on trying to avoid a Town lynch in 1956 is naff and a half.

[Vi]

RF

-Expresses desire to join Kast wagon, but it's never brought up again. Why? (1369)
-Stanceless as heck at 1432.

[Vi]

-I still have a hard time buying RF's excuses at 1843.
-I like Fonz's case circa 1959 but also dislike Fonz. :emote:

[Vi]

-Doesn't want a premature hammer ess. at deadline (2004) but insists AH is scum in 2011. Mixed signals.

[Vi]

AV

-Given that AV is all-but-claimed PR, suggesting that scum would target RF over him (ever) is laughable (1675).
-Textwall at 1772 doesn't quite ring genuine.

[Vi]

Tasky

Dislike actions in general (esp. tunneling on AV) but not going to dispute what was said and done in MD.

[Vi]

Herodotus

The game's primary mover/shaker IMO. Beat me to Fonz points in 1881.

[Vi]

Also I'm seriously impressed that I was able to go a whole page without getting cut. :emote:

[Vi]

2103 - Logic of "by telling people to get off RayFrost I'm getting RayFrost lynched" is strange but w/ever.
Although is there someone you'd rather see lynched?

[Vi]

I remember looking for why chamber thinks I'm second-string scum and not seeing it at all.
Go ahead and elaborate on 2110.

[Vi]

Your "paper trail" on AH is nonexistent.
Why pressure AH at that time?
2113 is lol; I've changed my mind more than both you & Kast put together.

[Vi]

2115 - Clearly not! :emote:
Your description of H is p.much what I would apply to you at this point.

[Vi]

2122 - I'm clearly scum with ~*~connections~*~ except for AV, and FtF, and whoever else you care to vote. BUT YEP STILL THERE

[Vi]

You said AH was Town in your first or second post, but nothing has been said since.

[Vi]

Fonz - I must ask which bozos you've played with who thought leading the Town was inherently scummy. :emote:

[Vi]

TBQH I see you lingering on outs of the group making ess. no pos. difference.
While I do see what you're saying with H unvoting RF to give him

a lead

in votes

[Vi]

I seriously question if that was intentional.

T&C: I also seriously question if these numbers actually mean anything in practice.

[Vi]

2148 - Vote on RF hasn't moved because I haven't put it someplace better.

The lynch I REALLY want r.now is Kast.

[Vi]

His attempt at a defense/counter is self-evident BS and anyone who wants to scrutinize/ask about it is welcome. Please do this.
However,

[Vi]

Kast wagon does not exist or have support to exist. Which leads to AH. As mentioned prev. AH was top scumread during reread, BUT flake reframes things slightly.

[Vi]

In addition - what I said I was sitting on in 2065 - I've played with WW before. TBQH I expect him to look scummy regardless of alignment.