Mini 1040 - Everyone's A Critic! [Game Over]

[Carapuce]

Hi.

I have not read the game yet but wanted to say hi.

Looking at the game I see a hidden mechanic. The kill passing thing acts as a pseudo cop. If a mafia gets the kill, they have to give it to a town, that means that town is cleared as town.

Also I bet that it is two mafia. If it was three mafia the game can end on second night which is something I see smaller games ignore at almost all cost.

I will try and read right now.

How did the first person with a kill get chosen?

[Carapuce]

Yo.

I decided to stop reading at where LMP claimed miller due to also haven read this page and realized things need to be told to people to prevent idiocracy from occuring.

A massclaim sounds like a delightfully horrible idea. A best case scenario stemming from massclaim is that we get all vanilla claims. Even then what happens? We lynch the miller claim because we assume mountainous? What is we get claims? Then what? The merit of a massclaim here rests on the assumption that this is infact a mountainous setup. This means that everyone voting LMP must think this is a mountainous setup. I am not fully acclimated to this game but I would bet my bottom dollar that anyone voting LMP who disagrees with this being mountainous is a mafia.

So open question to anyone who is voting LMP: Do you think this is mountainous? What happens if we massclaim and get a few role claims that are not vanilla?

If I had to make a bet, this is a 10 town 2 mafia setup, but it is not mountainous. If it was 9 town 3 mafia, game can be over very fast with two town lynches and one or two town vig failures. I put money against the mod allowing the game to end this fast, that is an extreme reward for mafia playing well. I personally think that mafia should be able to win on (1/4)(players)=day at the quickest, almost all people I have met agree with me on that.

Basically, massclaim is just a dumb move here. The only reason that someone should support a massclaim is if they think LMP is scum if all vanilla claims occur, but would not want to lynch him if other claims happen. If they would still support the lynch with other claims, asking for a massclaim is a mafia move because you want to out information when it does not change your course of action.

From what I read I think scorpion is the mafia.

If everyone can please say why their top pick for mafia is mafia in their next post in under 100 words but more then 50 I would be happy. It is smart to do this every few days even with new people not playing so lets go ahead and get on that.

[Carapuce]

@ Carapuce I asked you a simple question. To join the danawagon or give your reasons why you think you shouldn't vote dana. I'd like an answer.

Reading comprehension is not one of your strong points is it? Now is the time for you to answer my question about the setup. If it is not blindingly obvious, I do not think that we should massclaim, especially with mafia caught, double especially since I do not think this is mountainous.

If you will notice, I said that I was not done with my read, was only at the point where LMP claimed to be a miller. At that point, I really did not think dana was too likely to be mafia, and later on most of the pushing on him was for things that were not mafia tells while real tells appeared to be ignored.

I still think that scorpion, who apparently also quit playing and now is being played by NAU is mafia. What is very interesting is that if NAU is mafia, I see zero way for the doc to also be mafia. The fact that people are trying to control the vig kill is stupid as well, that means at any point there are at least a few mafia people who get to influence a second kill. There are limitations on who is stupid to be killed, but for the most part you should treat this like a normal vig.

Also I agree now that dana is mafia because of the fakeclaim business, two people are saying he is. This also ties into my NAU is mafia theory as the two work well together. I would reccomend killing him tonight. If people want me outlying the points on dana that I have found I will, but with him already confirmed as mafia I would rather just spend time getting up why NAU should be killed tonight.

VOTE: danakillsu

[Carapuce]

I still think that scorpion, who apparently also quit playing and now is being played by NAU is mafia. What is very interesting is that if NAU is mafia,

1

I see zero way for the doc to also be mafia.

The fact that people are trying to control the vig kill is stupid as well, that means at any point there are at least a few mafia people who get to influence a second kill. There are limitations on who is stupid to be killed, but for the most part you should treat this like a normal vig.

Also I agree now that dana is mafia because of the fakeclaim business, two people are saying he is.

2

This also ties into my NAU is mafia theory as the two work well together.

I would reccomend killing him tonight. If people want me outlying the points on dana that I have found I will, but with him already confirmed as mafia I would rather just spend time getting up why NAU should be killed tonight.

VOTE: danakillsu

1> The doc?
2> Pluh Leez you don't even have a NPAU-mafia theory let alone a joint theory.

1) The guy whos name starts with doctor... im not claiming for him or anything
2) Does anyone in this game have reading comprehension down? I specifically said I had not posted reasoning yet but am pretty sure you are mafia.

You say that I must be wrong because the person I essentially have a guilty on told you something! Are you really that retarded? PM the mod yourself and ask if the passing on of the vig ability is trackable!
Also, do you really think I would go to such lengths to say RC was scum if I was fakeclaiming? Why not just claim cop? Or claim that RC had targetted HC, not Jack?
The fact that none of this has even been considered is making me very angry.

You are missing a very important fact that you must have missed when you decided to fakeclaim. Also I think this means the people who have been voting for RC, and RC himself, are town since they would readily rejoin the wagon and you can sucker a down +- partner into voting him. That aside, the only way that you are telling the truth is if RC is mafia, LMP is mafia AND the kill went to Jack, who died with it. Have you ever heard of the saying "the simplest solution is the most likely answer"? That is what is happening here. You missed the ammount of things that must occur for you to be telling the truth. Even simpler you say? Try this on for size.

You say that RC went to only one player. RC passed on the kill, rules state that he must. So how did he visit only one player? Isn't that a physical impossibility?

You are mafia. NAU is you partner *cue his bitching* and this game should be over soon.

Will start working on why NAU/Scorpion is mafia now.

[Carapuce]

Going to do a psychic move here

danakillsu: Well what if RC gave the gun to and killed the same player! That would make it look like he only target one person!
carapuce: You do realize that this still makes no sense since even if the mafia group has three players they cannot end the game with a mislynch and regular kill. With no extra kill appearing they will be caught tomorrow and two mafia will go down over the next two days.

Now, back to our regular program (tomorrow unfortunately as im going out with friends right now)

[Carapuce]

@ Carapuce
idk, that might be it I suppose. But why would a town player give the vig ability to the person he was killing? No, I'm sure RC is maf.
And no one has addressed my point that the simplest solution is actually that RC is maf. Do you really think I'm maf making up this crazy, complicated story when I could just be saying "I'm cop with guilty on RC" from the start of the day?

You continue to ignore that if he is lying this is a forceable gambit since the game not ending forces RC and LMP to be maifa, which given that this is basically a guarenteed 10 town 2 mafia setup. My theory here is that RC and LMP are town, you did not claim cop because you guessed that there would be a cop due to the miller, but hoped to either get RC lynched or get a read on who the cop is.

The arguement you are presenting here goes something like

1 - RC is scum with LMP
2 - RC passed the gun to who he killed
3 - The gun "disappears" if the holder dies.
4 - Somehow rule Specific-4 is ignored
5 - Mafia have three palyers

I would put massive money against, well, all five of those points. You tried to fakeclaim, you didnt read all of the rules properly and are going down now.

NAU, I will get to that sometime tomorrow. It is late now and I am meeting with a laboratory group tomorrow to finish up some work.

[Carapuce]

Antihero overdid his bussing. If you check his posts, he is

very

perceptive of everything stef did. It's tunneling ++, and with the knowledge of Antihero being scum, you can piece together why he could find all those points on stef. He knew he was right.

So reworded:

"Mafia made a good BS case. Because mafia made a good BS case, it must be on mafia."

Ever heard of mafia trying to get someone mislynched? Apparently MoI thinks that a bit too, thats funny. Not ha ha funny either, the sad type. Lets see if you guys can't dig a hole faster then I can here.

NAU is still mafia. This week is bad for me though getting up a case on him being mafia wise. I will most likely not be free for more then a 30 minute period until friday.

[Carapuce]

The merit of a massclaim here rests on the assumption that this is infact a mountainous setup. This means that everyone voting LMP must think this is a mountainous setup. I am not fully acclimated to this game but I would bet my bottom dollar that anyone voting LMP who disagrees with this being mountainous is a mafia.

The merit of a mass-claim was to minimize the chances of a bad lynch (which happened anyway) and narrowing down the field for the Vig kill – which turned out good since Antihero got nailed.

That is not why people massclaim. People massclaim because they think that the information gained by the town will outwiegh the information gained by the mafia. The other scenario is in a lynch or lose situation. If those are your reasonings for a massclaim in this setup, you should have pushed for one right out of the gate to avoid a night one miss-vig.

I still think that scorpion, who apparently also quit playing and now is being played by NAU is mafia. What is very interesting is that if NAU is mafia, I see zero way for the doc to also be mafia.

The fact that people are trying to control the vig kill is stupid as well, that means at any point there are at least a few mafia people who get to influence a second kill.

There are limitations on who is stupid to be killed, but for the most part you should treat this like a normal vig.

1. Posted close on the heels of RC calling for Antihero to be vigged. The bolded portion reads as a bad attempt to discredit RC’s shot choice. Note that neither of his ‘scum pics’ in dana or NoPoint was making any attempt to influence where LMP shot.
2. Note the inference that Shotty isn’t Mafia based on dana and NoPoint being scum.
3. Lastly, despite his repeated insistence that NoPoint is scum I do not see a single NoPoint vote from Cara. Classic FOS partner, vote Town scenario.

1. Stupid does not equate mafia. Having everyone put discussion in allows mafia to not only manipulate the direction of the kill, but also to setup whatever countermeasures they deem necessary. Also nice that you are ignoring people saying to kill me (myk), doc (myk) and myk (LMP). You are applying the parts that suggest me being mafia, but ignoring identical parts that suggest otherwise (unless you are suggesting a five player mafia group).
2. Ok so now your theory is that im mafia and knew that dana wasnt mafia, so I attempted to clear shotty on something that would be immediately disproven?
3. Timelines are key. I say that Scorpion is mafia while reading. When I get done reading dana claimed and was essentially countered by two people. I state that I still want NAU killed at night, but that the proven mafia should be lynched first. If dana did not claim, I would not have voted him over NAU.

My theory here is that RC and LMP are town, you did not claim cop because you guessed that there would be a cop due to the miller, but hoped to either get RC lynched or get a read on who the cop is.

This is plain stupid. If dana as a theoretical Mafian (which we know is not true) wanted to get a read on who the Cop might be by fake-claiming he would have fake-claimed Cop. Whatever theory you are floating here is full of fail.

Not necessarily. If he did not screw up his claim, he might not have been lynched. At the same time, a cop role would likely react oddly given that it was likely fake, but they would not want to claim in the case that it was real.

Hey myk - You going to give me anything I can respond to?

[Carapuce]

Forgot to mention -

@Carapuce

- Why are you not voting for your Number 1 scum read in NoPoint?

Because I have not made a case yet. I do not like to start voting people without having a case as to why they are mafia out. Had a midterm today, have to run an Atterberg Limit lab for the undergrads tomorrow, after that I should be able to make it.

Also I see I am a vote short of being lynched, although I fear that it will simply make some lynch me due to how bad it looks.

I am a bodyguard which apparently is like a doctor expect if I save someone I die instead of the person that I saved. I did not get told what the person that I replaced did during the first night so I asked the mod what they did and he said that they did nothing. Upon further questioning they did not submit an action, not actually say that they were not going to use their action. On the second night I decided to bodyguard RC who somehow still died. I asked the mod if he actually got my action and he said yes. When I asked why RC died he said he would not tell me. I do not know why RC died at this point unless I was roleblocked, which does not make any sense to me since why would I be the person that gets roleblocked in a situation like this but that is the only way I can think that I should not be dead right now instead of RC.

If you lynch me before I get to make a good case as to why NAU is mafia and not me, I would advise to kill NAU tonight. I think that LMP is town, and that shotty is probably town, MoI might be town too. Myk confuses me since what he is doing seems to be a cop out since he will not say anything that I can actually talk about.

[Carapuce]

You at the start of the Day assert with clear conviction that NoPoint is Mafia. If you haven’t built a case how do you KNOW he is Mafia? If your answer is Gut then don’t bother responding. And you had no qualms about voting Dana with no ‘case’ made on her Day 2.

I have read the game, so I do know why I would be voting him, it is just that I do not have enough time to make a case. I am a full time student, take six hours of laboratory classes a week and am a TA for another three hours. This week has been worse then most for free time so I have not made a case yet. Dana was different as there was role information calling him mafia.

Noted for future potential claims. The only way this makes any sense is if a Town role-blocker targeted you. Especially given your play yesterday. Because LMP would be a more logical choice for a Scum role-blocker. Unless, of course, the Vig ability can’t be blocked. Or the small chance that LMP is indeed scum.

That is what I do not understand either and why I asked the mod why RC died when I should have. A roleblocker is the only thing I know of that can stop an action.

I have about 40 minutes here so will lay out why I wanted scorpion dead during my read.

If you ignore the fact that he never actually makes anything resembling a case on anyone, you end up with things like this

Ignoring me? Fine. Maybe this will encourage you to be less anti-town.

unvote
Vote: Jack

This is actually not scumhunting, this is anti-town hunting. There is a distinct difference between the two things, and if you look at what he continues to say regarding Jack, it is obvious that this is a vote on someone who he thinks is town. When is it right to vote someone you think is town? Basically never. This is not one of the rare exceptions.

I still got my eye on you, Jack. You better spill the beans before the day is over.

He has jumped over to the popular wagon at this point, but is still trying to keep pressure and encourage the claim of someone who is not scummy, simply "anti-town" but deserves to be lynched.

What was the problem with Jack? He read pretty town to me.

I don't see how you can read anything. He's hiding the majority of what he thinks about the game.

More of him stating that Jack, one of his biggest targets, is not scummy.

vote: Shotty

I want everyone to tell me
a) how many games they've played with shotty
b) what roles he was in those games
c) what they think of him so far.

Go.

Obviously an attempt to get a policy lynch going. Policy lynches are bad mmkay?

Anti
Dana
You are dodging my question.
I get really really pissed off when people dodge my questions.
Answer before I start throwing votes at you.

Anti coaching

Shotty continues to cruise through the game on his vote with no real explanation on it. There is 0% chance of him helping town in this game. Why is he still alive?

More fishing for the policy lynch.

Now I have class soon. Was able to get a decent ammount down though

The two biggest points against Scorpion is his lack of making a case, and the fact that he on multiple occasions went for votes of people that he did not think were mafia (Jack early who was just "anti-town" and shotty later who was "useless").

Vote Scorpion

[Carapuce]

That was annoying, myks made it obvious in his first couple posts that he was a cop with a guilty on me. Just tried to stall for a bit and then make something that makes it look like NAU was town by voting for Scorp, fueling the N1 innocent or gut feeling from myk that he was town. Considered claiming that myk was cop before I died incase NAU didnt realize it.

Shocked scum won it. Read the game before my role and had Scorp as top pick and my role as second one. That read was legitimate, just had to tone down the case and make it look ugly.