Mini 1041: Wheel of Fortune Mafia (Game over!)

[brianj]

@ yabbaguy, I choose not to random vote, because I know it goes against the mafiascum grain. People usually jump on me about that. They think this minor bucking of tradition is a scumtell.

These people are either inexperienced, or scum themselves.

If your tendency not to RVS is to, as you put it, draw out scum attacks, why tell us about it immediately? Yabbaguy did ask but there was absolutely no need for you to add that last sentence in my opinion.

Don't know what to think of Charlie's post at the moment.

[brianj]

No, what you are making is assumption out of nowhere. I understand this is beginning of the day and there is not much to go upon but simply asking someone to reveal some of their role just because you have understanding of the flavour is just to much. Unless specifically stated so I am sticking with the opinion that one's alignment is arbitrary.

Moreover, I think Charlie explicitedly stated that his role was "useless". What you are describing is POSITIVE "fabulous prize"/ NEGATIVE "bankrupt" sticks. Useless =/= fabulous prize emo.

[brianj]

I am sorry, but I am not particularly sure whether FakeGod is his partner, or at least there wasn't any clear confirmation about it at all besides his random ambiguous post. So I don't know why Reckamonic and Prof. Guppy is suddenly coming down with the idea of "one of Charlie and FG is scum".

we totally tore down your strategy.
wait, how?

Either way, it's not efficient. So we know that one of Charlie and FG is scum.
We also know the odds of there being a strong PR between those two is huge. If the scum has any form or redirection or blocking, you've FUCKED OVER a town PR.

on that lovely note,

Unvote

Both players claimed themselves to be useless, though. Moreover if Charlie and FG is indeed mystery wedge and knows each other, and had the same idea yabbaguy had, mafia already knew who is the other PR anyway. yabbaguy's action can only constitute as rolefishing only if mystery wedges do not know each other.

Actually, it may be interesting to keep in mind if two mystery wedges actually did not know each other Charlie's soft roleclaim might be attempt to draw out response from another one should Town/Scum theory turn out correct. But for moment this is all WIFOM at best, methinks.

[brianj]

brianj's #27 doesn't sit well with me, specifically because he just shows up seemingly to say that he doesn't know what to think of Charlie's post.

brian, what do you think of Charlie's post now?

Obviously main point of my post was my question against Prof. Guppy, not just to say I don't know what to think of the softclaim (you haven't replied yet btw, Guppy). By "Don't know what to think of Charlie's post at the moment" I was saying I thought Charlie's post was essentially null-read. Although seemingly anti-town move, we don't know enough about his role or setting to sufficiently attack the decision. Of course when Charlie posts more or when the full roleclaim comes, I would be more certain about the motivation behind his post.

I think I have rough idea about what their role is about now but I'll wait and see. Kind of surprised about how Charlie and FakeGod seem to be certain of each others alignment though.

Charlie, FakeGod why does either of you think it was a good idea, to out that if you are town, you are essentially the worse role, minus VT

Yabba, why push it further and try to discern anymore of their roles, when more info about everyone's roles, at this point is detrimental.

Is it me or does the content of the post contradict each other.

[brianj]

PieMan #57
Since his softclaim was specifically aimed at finding the other Mystery Wedge, asking for Charlie to reveal his intention behind his action would likely lead to some more information about role of him/FakeGod, which is exactly the thing you are questioning yabbaguy for speculating.

Oman #61

Unless specifically stated so I am sticking with the opinion that one's alignment is arbitrary.

I argued that the cost of revealing the role of one (potentially two) individuals was not an acceptable trade-off for finding

'Bankrupt' mystery wedge which may or may not turn out to be scum

(I am guessing underlined part is WIFOM aspect). Also, I am curious where you got the impression that I was reacting emotionally.

FakeGod #68
Okay, that information was what I needed. It mean that you and Charlie must share same alignment, it be truly town partners, third-party partners, or mafia gambiting. For the moment I am willing to lay off, though I am quite surpised at that confession; like what karma said, I expected them to be more of neighbours rather than mod-confirmed.

[brianj]

Seems like the role of you guys wasn't completely useless after all, contrarily to behaviour of you two at the beginning.

[brianj]

Let's just say there is a good reasoning behind the way I worded the post you feel apprehensive about. Also there seem to be some ambiguity about my position that few people have pointed out, so clarifying my position now: Prior to the mod-confirmed town claim I was against delving further into their role since I was still not sure alignment of 'Bankrupt' is confirmed to be scum (I posted #35 before yabbaguy's position was further supported with yabbaguy's mod meta and your confirmation, if you remember). However with information in #68 I am definitely more concerned about validity of their claims since their claims of being mod-confirmed definitely does not match their initial behaviour. I do not see why he couldn't have come out clear saying he had mod-confirmed partner and instead try to meet up in secret. I would definitely appreciate if you could clarify what you meant by "calculated risk", should it not involve yourself giving out some critical information.

[brianj]

All right, the problem CKD had with the claim seem to be resolved for moment, so it's time to give a general overlook:

yabbaguy

He was the one who picked up on the mystery wedge softclaim and made scum/town partner suggestion, which I am going to lay off for now since most of his focus was questioning whether Charlie's partner was likely town or not- I think scum would try to focus more on the specific role details. Only iffy part I have about him now is this post about SC mod meta which is kind of strange followup to Charlie's post that there are unknown aspects about their role that makes his theory likely false.

Null read, reading about his opinions on other players would definitely help.

Prof. Guppy

One of those unremarkable players whose major focus was on Charlie/FakeGod claim debacle, but answer this -_-

@ yabbaguy, I choose not to random vote, because I know it goes against the mafiascum grain. People usually jump on me about that. They think this minor bucking of tradition is a scumtell.

These people are either inexperienced, or scum themselves.

If your tendency not to RVS is to, as you put it, draw out scum attacks, why tell us about it immediately? Yabbaguy did ask but there was absolutely no need for you to add that last sentence in my opinion.

Don't know what to think of Charlie's post at the moment.

PieMan

Current impression is scum trying hard to look like VI, mostly due to the fact that too many of his posts are blatantly terrible. I'll probably meta him later to see if this behaviour is normal though.

curiouskarmadog

His insistence on the PM wording was kind of sudden, but I don't really see it being scum-motivated unlike some people pointed out. His posts did prolong the debate about Charlie's claim, but most of the discussion would have been avoided so long time ago if Charlie/FakeGod replied to it. I don't see what scum would gain by learning what CKD asked anyway.

[brianj]

I'm not sure where this Pieman wagon is coming from, but I haven't had a chance to go back and review him or the cases on him.

VOTE: brianj Nothing you have done is interesting me to the point that it takes away that early suspicion. I took the vote off due to the focus being elsewhere, but your analysis is poor, and undisciplined. It feels like you're trying to throw smoke out to cover something.

It's better than nothing, though I would appreciate it if you specifically explained to me which part of my analysis is particularly lacking.

@brianj what do you mean by terrible? If its that I write terrible, I have been slowly trying to make more sense to the community, though im not so sure I have done a great job at it.

Just particular group of posts that I found strange. There's here where you tries to ask motivation behind Charlie/FakeGod softclaim, which is normal reaction I'd expect from some people, but you immediately backs off when FakeGod says "trust me, I had my reasons" which is essentially the same thing FakeGod was saying before.

Lot of people pointed out #64 due to it's ambiguity, "they could either both be scum, both be town, or scum/town", which isn't really saying much.

The reasoning you have for voting me is missing two things, that my change of attitude was due to FakeGod mod-confirmed town partner claim which I had lot of trouble believing, and I think I focused solely on trying to understand their behaviour rather than prodding the specific details of their role themselves.

I thought #136 was unconvincing and came out of nowhere, but now I think about it since you don't seem to be good at english perhaps it has more to do with reading comprehension so withdrawing this point.

[brianj]

Dropping in here to say I'll be too busy to pay attention to this site for one or two days because of lab work.

VOTE: PieMan
Don't know why all the pressure seem to be shifting to others all the sudden.

[brianj]

My mistake on that last post, I should have declared proper v/la. Either way I'll read through the thread now.

Okay, I really do not get Xite91's motivation behind CKD vote. To my understanding he voted for CKD because of he asked Charlie/FakeGod a simple question that could easily have been answered, and voted for PieMan twisting his words. I do see he brings up more points in his iso, but since he stated that he only iso player he are fully convinced of scumminess, I'll treat those two as his major arguments for the moment.

First, why the hell are you persisting on the opinion that CKD question was distraction attempt? He made valid reply when he stated the question wouldn't have been prolonged at all if the response was not delayed by those two. Moreover, the line of inquiry did not prevent people that had other things to say from saying their things anyway. I also fail to see how CKD's vote was different from the votes made by rest of the players.

Though I am still skeptical of PieMan some of his arguments might be attributed to poor literacy, and Xite91 is really raising my suspicion level so I am willing to put him on L-2.

UNVOTE

VOTE: Xite91

@Oman
If your opinion on me is based on little but gut feeling, I want to know what you specifically meant by "It feels like you're trying to throw smoke out to cover something" on the post you voted for me. Reading through the thread I can't really see anything that justifies this statement at all, especially after hearing your reasoning. It just looks like filler statement thrown to make your vote look better.

[brianj]

@Oman
If your opinion on me is based on little but gut feeling, I want to know what you specifically meant by "It feels like you're trying to throw smoke out to cover something" on the post you voted for me. Reading through the thread I can't really see anything that justifies this statement at all, especially after hearing your reasoning. It just looks like filler statement thrown to make your vote look better.

I do not remember and cannot find this post where i voted you. Can you point it out for me?

Clearly you wrote the quoted person wrong, the comment was from me not CKD which I suspect is source of your problem. Just in case:

I'm not sure where this Pieman wagon is coming from, but I haven't had a chance to go back and review him or the cases on him.

VOTE: brianj Nothing you have done is interesting me to the point that it takes away that early suspicion. I took the vote off due to the focus being elsewhere, but

your analysis is poor, and undisciplined. It feels like you're trying to throw smoke out to cover something.

Post #160.

[brianj]

Okay, I shall claim also. I am

Pat Sajak

(mason) and CKD was my mason partner. We know each other to be innocent. My breadcrumb can be read by checking first letter of my odd number posts backwards, except the very last one but I immediately posted right after that I "made a mistake" on the last post anyway.

Urgh, first time being a mason so the fact I had quicktopic slipped from my mind. Apologies to CKD for that, and I'll check the thread for reads. Somewhat busy with my university studies.

[brianj]

@Tasky
Easy- since we are mason, it would be crazy for there to be another town pair that is confirms each other. In my PM it states that "you know each other to be innocent". Thus if there was another role that knew each other, it would have been likelier for the mod to use same choice of wording such as "your partner is innocent" instead of "your partner is also confirmed town/townie etc.". CKD was checking whether FakeGod/Charlie was fakeclaiming or not by addressing this point; if they replied yeah my PM said my partner was "town" then the chance of them fakeclaiming would increase dramastically.

I buy FakeGod's claim. Charlie saying "brianj will be my target if I had vig powers" (or something like that) in previous posts actually make sense considering this information, and looking at his role and what Charlie said day one FakeGod explanation fits otherwise I don't see why Charlie would firmly believe his partner was town.

VOTE: Prof. Guppy
Also didn't say much anything notable, his stance toward Xite91 on post #11 feels off to me. Do you happen to have any other suspects besides PieMan?

[brianj]

Mod:

I also voted for Prof. Guppy which means he is in fact in L-1.
Wouldn't want someone to hammer him accidentally -_-

[brianj]

1. Yes, I am un-counterclaimed mason, and I took care to associate myself slightly with CKD last day too.

Rather pointless question to ask me in my opinion, if it were me questioning the player likely to be town I'll be asking for his reads or opinion on certain situations.

also declaring I'll probably be absent until Thursday since I have lab reports to prepare and hand in next few days. On that note

Unvote

for now since I don't want the day to end while I'm gone either.

[brianj]

Still null-read on PieMan, I have to agree with Tazaro's point and believe his vote juggling was really weird, besides the fact he had not been producing any notable posts (in my brief skim) at all. Overall I expect to find one scum out of PieMan/Tazaro, but if push comes to shove I'm going to lynch Tazaro over PieMan unless I find something new. Also is suspicious of Oman. I'll read them over when I have time and decide on my vote then; honestly I expected to be NK'd last night so hadn't been checking the thread much at all.

Also FakeGod is obvious town.

[brianj]

Hahahaha, I really shouldn't have been conservative with my gut votes if what you are saying is true (there's still that 0.01% possibility it is epic falsehood). Good game, though I definitely could have played it a lot better.

[brianj]

I truly apologize,

please replace me

. I had underestimated my study demands. Fortunately since I am confirmed town and day had just started, cost of my replacement won't hurt that much