Mini 1055 - Return to PEGBAM (Closing Time!)

[JDodge]

bitchin'

i demand ye all start KARENWAGON '10

[JDodge]

Cool. JDodge, is this your role, or is it the work of outside forces?

No no fishy fishy.

JDoge.
I will bet heavy money you'll execute me.

qualify

[JDodge]

I know you're around, Shanba. Why so quiet?

[JDodge]

That's true, Oman. From what I've heard, Vezok isn't a very good player. We should execute him. At worst, we'd be killing scum. At best, we'd be killing useless town.

Sorry Vezok, it's either you or me. Or somebody else.

I like that idea!

Ooops sorry, was testing the "vote" button.
Anyway, Jdodge, are you going to comply with the voice of the people or are you going to be a selfish monarchist?

1. Preview

2. Reasons for your vote; from now on no votes will be going without reasons or you will be on

the bad list

.

3. Why should I comply with the majority? That seems like a really, really poor play.

That's true, Oman. From what I've heard, Vezok isn't a very good player. We should execute him. At worst, we'd be killing scum. At best, we'd be killing useless town.

Sorry Vezok, it's either you or me. Or somebody else.

I hear this so much. It still never makes sense to me.

Look up minmax and see if it makes sense.

ROW ROW ROW, PEOPLE

[JDodge]

3. Poor play, I don't know. I'm not very fond of kingmaker which I think is a near broken setup, its biggest flaw being that it discourage overall interests. What do you suggest we go about this?

I suggest that you guys decide who you want me to execute so that I can determine whom I want to execute. Then I'll flip a coin or something. Seems like the fairest balance between my own interests and your interests.

[JDodge]

Flava Flave and MBR both make good executions I think

See: 2

ye are skirting ye edges of ye

the bad list

[JDodge]

the one I voted you for

WAS HE DOING THINGS WITH THE STUFF?!?!!?!?

[JDodge]

I want to execute Panzer. What do you guys think? I reserve the right to completely 180 on this tomorrow.

You're also being kind of dense. All of you. Except Shanba. So really by "you guys" I mostly mean Shanba.

[JDodge]

You're just mad that a certain game mechanic has left us free to treat the entirety of Day 1 as the Random Vote Day instead of keeping it to an arbitrarily (and often poorly) defined period at the beginning of said day.

So you are committing to being completely useless today?

[JDodge]

You're just mad that a certain game mechanic has left us free to treat the entirety of Day 1 as the Random Vote Day instead of keeping it to an arbitrarily (and often poorly) defined period at the beginning of said day.

So you are committing to being completely useless today?

I don't see how I've been less useful than someone who's only posted once, and that post contained a vote for someone who doesn't exit.

I don't see how that answers my question.

[JDodge]

You're just mad that a certain game mechanic has left us free to treat the entirety of Day 1 as the Random Vote Day instead of keeping it to an arbitrarily (and often poorly) defined period at the beginning of said day.

So you are committing to being completely useless today?

I don't see how I've been less useful than someone who's only posted once, and that post contained a vote for someone who doesn't exit.

I don't see how that answers my question.

Let me rephrase then. I don't see how I'm dense but Shanba isn't

Still haven't answered my question, really.

[JDodge]

I would've given it a straight yes or no if I didn't feel like I was walking into some sort of trap...

ah fuck it

I am not committing to being useless all day, but I do intend to get my jollies while the getting is good.

Now, tit-for-tat. How am I useless whereas Shanba isn't?

Quality over quantity. You're busy screwing around, Shanba's one post seems like he's, y'know,

actually playing the game, if not much

.

[JDodge]

I want to execute Panzer. What do you guys think? I reserve the right to completely 180 on this tomorrow.

Completely 180ing on this now.

Shanba always sounds like that.

Shanba has fairly different feels depending on alignment. I know how his town thought processes work.

[JDodge]

Ghostwriter: Valerie, I like to change VI's names to different names.

I feel I may have had something to do with that... sorry bbm.

In other news, point proven

unvote everyone

what point

[JDodge]

I play mafia by looking for scum intent. I ask a lot of questions D1, rarely commit to anything until around page 15, where hopefully someone has manifested some obvious scum intent. The more talking the better, as I get where people are coming from. I use the word null tell, but I actively avoid trying to use "town tells" or "scum tells". Scumminess isn't a quantity, it's a quality.

We don't have that kind of time, start committing to stuff now.

[JDodge]

Hidden votes?

Which do you think is more likely; hidden votes or mod error?

[JDodge]

Depends. Were those all the people that were being voted in the demonstration? I can't easily look back right now due to being on a phone.

The answer to the question is "yes" or "no" not "depends blah blah blah blah blah". I would appreciate one of the actual ones.

[JDodge]

I personally don't think rolefishing is a joke, and mentioning docs and stuff is really just not good play. That's why I acted in a serious fashion, beside the fact that I'm always serious in the early game.

Anyway, I would vote not to execute Panzer.

What part of "I'm making a complete 180" on this are you not getting? Are you actually reading the game?

[JDodge]

Depends. Were those all the people that were being voted in the demonstration? I can't easily look back right now due to being on a phone.

The answer to the question is "yes" or "no" not "depends blah blah blah blah blah". I would appreciate one of the actual ones.

You asked an "either or" question, which cannot be answered through a "yes or no" means. And I gave you an actual answer.

If the people that were voted with no name voting them had not been the people voted in the demonstration, then I would have thought that the hidden voter was more likely, because the game is admittedly complex, and was admitted as such by the mod himself. Therefore, I have various ideas about what could possibly happen to make it complex, which I will keep to myself, because I'm not doing setup speculation on that level right now. With one of those ideas, hidden votes fit in.

If the people that were voted with no name voting them were the people voted in the demonstration, then I would have known it was just a mod error. However, I couldn't get to the post where the votes happened to check at the time, so I asked.

Don't tell me what I asked, just answer it. It'd be a good idea not to be the first person to piss off the guy who has sole control over who dies today.

[JDodge]

The problem is that I did, indeed, answer it. Is the problem that I didn't answer it with a simple answer? I didn't have a simple answer. I didn't have a simple train of thought on the subject, so it led to a non simple answer.

Your next post had better be a yes or no on my question or my next post will end with something similar to "execute ghostwriter".

Answers.

Now.

It is a fucking simple binary question, something obvious to anyone who read it. I don't give a shit about if scenario b if scenario c if scenario f, I care about

which one you think is more likely, given all scenarios (or one scenario, or six scenarios, I don't give a shit)

.

UK: The large letters will stop or you will also be high on the list for people whose names should follow the word "execute".

[JDodge]

JDodge: Then you'll answer my question, or I'll find a way to get you lynched after this king bullshit is over.

Understood?

You're not very intelligent, are you?

[JDodge]

Actually, dunno why I'm asking, JDodge has made it manifestly obvious he's of some anti town bent.

No, I've made it absurdly obvious that I have no interest whatsoever in answering your question, going so far as to acknowledge it and then proceed to not answer. A smart person would take that to mean "stop asking it every five seconds", but you seem to have failed to get that memo.

[JDodge]

Show me the part in the Townie Win Con that says "You must answer every question asked to you by shrill-voiced, needy players"

Pro-tip: Mine doesn't have this clause

UK, Someone has given JDodge, one of the most stubbornly egotistical bastard players I know, Power Absolute over this day. He's wielding it exactly the way I expect him to wield it, regardless of his alignment. So far, you've shown to be slightly more anti-town than him

Second, your playstyle and mine are going to clash horrifically. Fair warning

Note that I also see my survival as a pro-town player being to the benefit of the town and will have no qualms about taking actions today that protect myself for future days, so you might want to reeeel back the threats just a tiny bit.

[JDodge]

@JDodge: The only word I have that you are pro town is yours, which is garbage.

I don't give a shit what you think.

Now's your time to choose, people. I will be executing from one of the following people:

Oman
UltimaAvalon
UncertainKitten
GhostWriter

Weigh in with your opinions, please

[JDodge]

@JDodge: The only word I have that you are pro town is yours, which is garbage.

I don't give a shit what you think.

Now's your time to choose, people. I will be executing from one of the following people:

Oman
UltimaAvalon
UncertainKitten
GhostWriter

Weigh in with your opinions, please

Feel free to suggest other people, noting that I will not be executing any of the following: Shanba, mikeburnfire, Panzerjager, springlullaby

[JDodge]

Feel free to suggest other people, noting that I will not be executing any of the following: Shanba, mikeburnfire, Panzerjager, springlullaby

I appreciate the chance to continue the game, but... why would you rule me out? Probably not because I seem like the best town player? Is it because we have a history?

Because I don't see any reasons for your actions that make me particularly intent on executing you today.

[JDodge]

Oman
UltimaAvalon
UncertainKitten
GhostWriter

UncertainKitteh, as I have insisted these long, arduous days, is scum. Execution please. I suppose my second would be Oman. He's posted frequently, but his posts have no substance (hypocrisy oh my!)

And you still have not given any reason at all for wanting UncertainKitten lynched.

As for your group of four, JD, ghostwriter is probably the best lynch. He hasn't done anything to help the town, and instead of scumhunting he decides to get unto an argument with you. I think you should also take a look at Flava Flave. Mostly gut, but I don't like how he needs someone to tell him what to discuss.

What do you think about the other three?

Prozac: Why are you depriving the town of your opinion?

[JDodge]

@SL: You clearly haven't been reading my posts. I'm voting who I think is scummy outside the list right now.

JDodge and MBF.

Please pay attention in the future if you want to avoid asking questions already answered.

So basically, you're voting for two people who you know will not be executed today, thus locking yourself in as "completely useless to the town".

Good to know

.

[JDodge]

@JDodge: Actually, it's you who's being "completely useless to the town", because you seem to think that MBF isn't scum. So, nice try, but:

X

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iPnQ77a1UVk

[JDodge]

So why is it, Jdodge, that you chose those people. I'll let you know it my next post who I like less A) on your list and B) overall.

Because these are the four people I feel would make the best executions today.

Shanba: Do you think Oman's actions are more easily explained by him not taking the game seriously? I'm leaning that way right now.

UA is off the list now.

[JDodge]

As soon as Shanba answers my question and I know BBM is online I'm executing.

[JDodge]

Quick question, how common is scum kingmaker? Not the king itself, but the N0 kingmaker?

I dislike this question before your claim because it seems as if you're setting yourself up to look more town.

You still have failed to answer my question, and for that you will be dying as soon as Shanba answers my question. Enjoy your last few hours in this game.

Well, I hesitate to believe a scum kingmaker...it feels wrong to give scum that strong a control over the lynch, even if it's indirect...

That's a bullshit argument

and you know it

.

[JDodge]

I'm well aware proven role does not equal proven alignment. But I'm speaking with my mod instincts. I don't like it.

Feel free to execute me if GW flips scum. Well, or lynch me. Whatever happens.

No, I'm not certain you're scum the more I think on it. I remember you from that hydra game Adel ran, and I remember the only hydra more brain-meltingly stupid than yours being the one with WaltWishbone.

[JDodge]

I answered your question. If you didn't like the answer, that's on you. That's the last time I pick king at random.

I asked you plenty of times to give me a yes or no answer, even explained that i don't care how many fucking scenarios your yes or no answer takes into account. Your failure to listen proves that you are unwilling to listen to me when I ask something of you, which makes you either scum or completely useless to me.

[JDodge]

@JDodge: That's nice. I think you're stupid too ^-^.

considering me + shanba were the ones who caught yosariwen scum when no one else was really willing to push on them on D1, naaaaaaah

[JDodge]

And I've told you your question cannot be answered as such, and even if the phrasing of it had been different, it still couldn't be answered that way, because when I made my original statement inquiring about hidden roles, I hadn't taken into account a mod mistake. And having taken into account the possibility, I'd have needed to know whether or not the votes were from the demonstration of multiple votes. Your unwillingness to listen to anyone you either scum or completely useless to the town.

Luckily, outside of the one-shot kingmaker thing I have no abilities, so at least no one with a decent ability dies.

So the answer is "no, you did not think a mod mistake was likely". Glad that only took a

week we do not have to waste

.

So far I have proven unwilling to listen to you and UK, both of whom were primary suspects. Not listening to people who are likely scum does not make me "useless", it makes me "intelligent". I am more open to UK's opinions, although since now they are completely conflicting with mine I am still not going to take them into account. Furthermore, I am waiting for Shanba's input on my question before I execute - that is not "unwillingness to listen", that is "willingness to listen to someone who likely knows what they're talking about", which is a +++++ thing to do.

You guys have some really weird definitions of "useful to the town". Contradicting me when I have sole control over the lynch and suggesting that I execute people I have already said I am not going to be executing is pretty much a great definition of "useless".

[JDodge]

Your power doesn't make you automatically the only thing that matters. I know that better than anyone else, because I know it only lasts one day. After that, you lose it. Probably explains why you didn't want to talk about it earlier in the game; you wanted people thinking it possibly lasted longer.

No, I thought it was

skullfuckingly obvious

that it only lasted one day. Anyone with any level of common knowledge would know that. Why exactly is it odd that I refused to answer questions about my role?

Not listening to people that are likely scum? Based on what read? Pure stubbornness and a dislike of people who have a backbone? How odd we both ended up being primary suspects. That's totally not related to the fact that we don't bow to you. You can put whoever you want on your non-execution list, doesn't make them town. Suggesting scum is suggesting scum, regardless of your inability to listen. Seems to me like tunnel-vision on the wrong person is useless.

Based on my read. Which is the read that matters today. You do bow to me today, that seems pretty damn obvious too.

Regardless of what you think of my opinions, it's pretty damn obvious that those people are still off-limits for today. If you can't see that, all the more reason to execute you because you clearly aren't paying attention to the game.

[JDodge]

Never said answering questions about your role was odd. However, that isn't your role. You have another role altogether outside of today's king role. That one, fine, I can understand not talking about. However, the king role information could have been told at no expense to you. But you didn't.

The question posed was "is this something permanent for you or something temporary", which says "role". Pay attention.

I do not give a damn about stroking your ego. I'm not going to sacrifice my play for you. Play I haven't even been able to make. I can't count insta-agreeing with you as scummy, because it could be out of fear and self-preservation as a townie or it could be out of willingness to go along for the ride as scum. I can't get reads on people because half the players are sitting back and letting today just go by either because they feel they have no control or because they are scum and don't feel the need to do anything when you can just do it for them. It's not a game of scumhunting right now. The chances of us hitting scum were obliterated the moment you went on your personal feelings and disregarded things people said if they went against what you wanted. It's simply a game of "hide by kissing ass". No wonder I can't see you as anything but scum when you've effectively blocked any other possibilities from my sight.

How is self-preservation town?

[JDodge]

Based on the information that has come today, I would like to come to the following conclusions:

UK is likely town because she was completely unafraid of pressing on things that I had declared off-limits.

The majority of you are really, really playing well for the most part and I am very pleased with how things are going.

Scot needs to start posting or he needs to die tomorrow. Same for Prozac.

Panzer needs to post more.

Come on.

So my execution here comes on the idea that getting solid information from this person is like pulling teeth. He refuses to do anything useful for the town, instead stubbornly insisting on his own innocence instead of scumhunting. And so with that,

Execute: Oman

.

[JDodge]

GhostWriter may be town. Reserve the right to change my mind in my next post, possibly coming in a couple of minutes!

[JDodge]

Yes. Almost certainly I would think.

Vote: scot

rowrowrow

[JDodge]

Not sure where to start hunting. JDodge, why do you think scot is scum? A quick ISO of his posts shows that he reading the game and keeping up with the events, but only seemed to post when I was incorrect about something. This shows active lurking to me.

I don't think he's even reading tbh. He's scum

or

useless.

[JDodge]

Why have neither of you commented on UA's self vote?

Do you think it's worth commenting on?

[JDodge]

JDodge, GW said that you could pass your kinship on, why didn't you?

He must have been wrong

When Oman flipped I thought about the guy he must have culted since it's day cult, I'm thinking Shanba. Would explain why he was not participative yesterday, he is my default lynch.

Face Day cult, not Face day cult.

[JDodge]

I want an awful lot more from panzer today.

Fail. Panzer is not here.

Oh, right.

Wait, what were the results of thingy's vote on him? If it's counted, he's most likely not dead yet and will be returning. In that case I guess defer my comment to whenever he gets back. If he's dead, then it's not a big loss.

Start paying attention, Shanba.

[JDodge]

GW, did your role state that JD could pass on his kingship after his day of reign?

To be fair, I was dateraped.

[JDodge]

Unvote, vote: UltimaAvalon

[JDodge]

Can I vote for both scot and UA?

[JDodge]

Question to all - who supports any of the following wagons:

- scotmany12
- UltimaAvalon
- Porochaz
- mikeburnfire

And what have they done to deserve that? I am going to dodge the second half of the question while indicating my hefty, hefty preference towards scot and UA.

[JDodge]

UA, I'm going to give you 48 to do something else than self-voting

I can't

JDodge I want you to answer your own question before you expect me to answer it

Nah. I want you to answer my question first. There's a good reason for it, I swear! Unless, of course, you don't actually have the reasoning to back up your suspicions. Then I can see where my question would be

troublesome

.

[JDodge]

UK: didn't like his move to MBF. He didn't mention (or barely mentioned him) at all yesterday. It looks like he knows that and that's why he's suddenly switched from one liners to walls of text - attempt to cover his arse for the odd switch. I wouldn't normally care, but the case on mbf is no great shakes, and it's stuff he could have noticed yesterday.. He accused thingy of buddying, then went all RAAAAAH I FOLLOW KING POST WALL OF TEXT ABOUT HIS LIST, and then accuses mbf of going to the king for reads - (note I believe hypocrisy is a scumtell because scum model theoretical scum against what they would do as scum, given the opportunity. So say x thinks lurking is scummy, that's generally because they've seen a lot of lurker scum. The scum you get to observe most often is yourself, so you know the scumtells that work on you and tend to apply them as town.) Them's the bare bones.

Shanba: What about my list? I think Flava's a better tomorrow play, personally. I have a rather large idiot read on him right now and would like to see another night cycle pass before we dump him off.

[JDodge]

Question to all - who supports any of the following wagons:

- scotmany12
- UltimaAvalon
- Porochaz
- mikeburnfire

And what have they done to deserve that? I am going to dodge the second half of the question while indicating my hefty, hefty preference towards scot and UA.

I obviously don't support a wagon on myself and don't support one on Chaz either. I prefered UA over MBF, and believe I made it clear why I suspect both of them. MBF's claim, however, kinda rattled things, and would like him to claim his target before going into this more. Assuming he is serious about that claim.

Your "assuming he is serious" thing suggests you believe you made a massive mistake taking a joke to be true, and are now backpedaling so that you don't look like a complete idiot. Am I right?

[JDodge]

Nope. I don't think it is a joke at all.

Then why include the last bit?

[JDodge]

THREE FOR THREE BITCHEZZZ

[JDodge]

Unvote, vote: scotmany12

Let's make it four!

[JDodge]

Oh, what happened by the way Panzer? You get dateraped too?

[JDodge]

THREE FOR THREE BITCHEZZZ

What?

You need to start explaining your votes JD.

Executed Ouman (DING!)
Called UK town (DING!)
Called MBF town (DING!)

Nah no thanks

scot is an appealing vote but not yet.

How about 9:45 tomorrow night? Will that fit into your dicking around schedule a bit better?

[JDodge]

My lynch list: Scot for being mild.

What does this even mean?

JD, it didn't dawn on me until now, but I was the reason you were dateraped. I was allowed to jailkeep someone last night and I chose you.

I have two votes on me chaz, as MBF is no longer alive.

is this an every-night thing or a HEY I HAVE DATERAPE DRUGS thing

also whyyyyyy

[JDodge]

It's a HEY I HAVE DATERAPE DRUGS thing. Someone gave me a package. I chose you because I thought you would be the one to most likely be targeted by scum if you were town.

It's pretty damn stupid to use a jailkeep as a doc protect. It's definitely more of a roleblock.

[JDodge]

I wasn't certain you were town. It served both purposes.

So why say it was to "protect me" in the first place? Why am I having to drag this information out of you, one tidbit at a time when it's all stuff that could be easily stated to begin with?

[JDodge]

Dont know. It was mainly to protect you, but yeah, I should have stated that I wasn't sure you were town and it served its roleblocker purpose too. I'm not trying to keep information from you.

I don't believe you.

Anyone willing to commit to the scotwagon should do so now so we can push this forward with plenty of room before deadline.

[JDodge]

vis last post: when I tried to address SL's question to me, I ended up calling her UK. My bad.

I have no idea why we're wagonning scot. If it's a question of passivity, there's no shortage of that in this game. MBF town isn't too shocking, as teh case against him was overblown.

I think we need to lynch Flava flave or panzer today, but I would settle for one of the passive crowd. I wouldn't be overly happy, but eh.

We're not lynching Panzer, he's most certainly town and the fact that you cannot see that is shocking. He is literally as town as GhostWriter.

Eh, listening to you worked the last time.

Unvote, vote: Flava Flave

[JDodge]

It wasn't an obvious joke. He posted it in a way that he could have gone back and said it was either serious or a joke. And really, I'm surprised you can't figure out why I was concerned with that post.

It was the most obvious joke so far in the game, and that is why I want to see you at the business end of ye ol' lynchin rope.

[JDodge]

why so quiet when the pressure's off, mr. avalon

why so quiet overall, ms. lullaby

[JDodge]

Come on people, Flava is the play right now. Scot, you vig UA because I'd like to see him dead too.

I really don't like the consequences of NK Immune Miller Vig not being a role. It would mean We are leaving an SK alive.

I would certainly like to see a scot lynch.

I don't see the issue now that we can put him under the town's command and make him disposable at our whim.

[JDodge]

Actually, I want to know what Shanba thinks too. Shanba?

[JDodge]

also: scot, flavor

[JDodge]

I thought you were a regular vig, not a dayvig...

I never said anything about a dayvig. I said my kill on mbf might have been delayed, which is why he died in the middle of the day.

Do you have any flavor to assume your kill would be delayed?

[JDodge]

GW, more than just throwaway comments please

[JDodge]

Also Scot, name your scumlist.

Scumlists are generally bad for the town, as it is not beneficial for scum to know everyone's reads. I'm still suspicious of UA, and I'm suspicious of you spring. You have yet to explain why you think I'm scum until your previous post, points 1 and 3 are just wrong, as I was suspicious of MBF, and MBF was a useless player. And point 2 has nothing at all to do with my alignment.. And your original vote on me was horrible, only stating that I was being "mild"

So it's bad for the town because it's not beneficial to scum?

dur de hur de hur de hur

[JDodge]

Typo. It's beneficial for the scum to know everyone's reads. I'm against scumlists.

And it's harmful to the town to withhold information unnecessarily, so cough up your suspicions before we have to beat them out of you.

[JDodge]

just so you know spring

Also Scot, name your scumlist.

is MASSIVELY inconsistent with

Last post was adressed at Scot. Re:scumlist; lol Scot, you say that you are against scumlist, yet you state yours (UA and I apparently) in the very same post? Yeah, scum.

[JDodge]

I said why I found you scummy on day 1 already. Go verify. As to you finding MBF scummy I remember you favoring a GW lynch. And out of all the useless player MBF was not the worse, and I just don't see a town aligned vig targetting a soft claim day 1. Beside that what do you find scummy about me?

I wasn't going to ask jd to kill mbf when he specifically said he would not be killing him, along with panzer, you, and shanba.

UA would have been a good night kill, but I chose MBF, who I found even worse. Him saying his flavor doesn't fit his role isn't going to stop me from killing him. And I wasn't going to kill chaz, as he is a better player and could be more helpful to the town than mbf.

Yes. Prozac, who barely plays, has a spotty record at best and hasn't even been able to be bothered to post would be infinitely more helpful than mbf, one of the best players of his time.

Idiot.

Typo. It's beneficial for the scum to know everyone's reads. I'm against scumlists.

And it's harmful to the town to withhold information unnecessarily, so cough up your suspicions before we have to beat them out of you.

I just said I found UA and Spring to be suspicious. Literally one post before you pointed out my typo. You even quoted it. Though I enjoy the fact that you say this, despite you never explaining any of your votes.

Yes, but that's out of necessity.

[JDodge]

unvote, vote: scot

[JDodge]

It appears the events of PEGBAM we're just too much for little Justin Bieber to handle. He's always thought of himself as a mature, strong individual, but when it came time for him to put up or shut up,

he only delayed the "shut up"

. He thought he was a tough girl- I mean...guy, now he's just a dead guy. And I was looking forward to laughing at his career through puberty too...Sad day.

Looking back, this can be taken as confirmation that the delay was from mbf's role ability and not from anyone else's - it also makes sense that he might have known hence the marked change in his play from yesterday to the start of today.

[JDodge]

JD: I got a free day tomorrow. I'll look over the scot case then. If it's just that he killed mbf then I'm not really convinced; mbf was all else aside being pretty useless. If he was scum looking for a kill, why not go after you, or maybe ghostwriter (who I have as 80% confirmed in my mind)?

It's not that he killed mbf; it's his responses in this line of questioning that scare the everloving shit out of me.

I have GhostWriter and Panzer as 90% confirmed; what do you think on the latter?

[JDodge]

I like the irony from the person who gets overly aggressive or flakes out a large majority of his games.

oh

snap

[JDodge]

I agree that Flava Flave needs to be put on the grill. Flava, again, why did unvote MBF, while still pushing his case?

VOTE: Flava Flave

JDodge gave us a list to choose from. He also said he wouldn't execute MBF.

you got replaced, stop posting

Shanba: Who do you think is a better alternative to scot? I'm thinking Prozac (because I want to see some contribution from myk before we go any further on that, and I believe we have enough time).

[JDodge]

Flameaxe/mykonian, is there a chance I could have the spot back?

i say no because this will further disrupt the flow of the game as well as bringing back in someone who has proven to flake, thus causing unnecessary harm to whatever side it may be

[JDodge]

Your recently revised reading on me is something Im going to have to change back. As for JDodge, Im just going to let him do his thing until someone else comes along and pisses him off. I would be very iffy to disbelieve Scots claim in a BBM/Oman game. I fully expect there to be a NK immune Millar Vig. I feel Panzer made his want to lynch scot too strongly for my tastes, along with what I feel is a very "coasting" attitude and 5 posts.

vote Panzer

I also want to look through JDodge when I can build my enthusiasm up enough and when I dont feel pissed off at him.

So your point is completely (and this is the first point you've made all game aside from pointless snipes and useless fluff) that "I think that there would be an NK Immune "Millar" Vig in a BBM/Oman game. This also proves that you are not reading the thread whatsoever, because

Oman was the person I executed yesterday

. To summarize, your

only

reason for saying anything is that "I think there is an NK Immune 'Millar' Vig! Panzer is coasting and pushing scot!", which shows that all you're doing is skimming through, coasting, and in general being a complete waste of space.

Shanba, Prozac as a middle ground for a lynch wagon? We're running out of time to decide.

[JDodge]

Do you want to iso me again, hmm? Cause you forget my post on mbf.

My point was, I think a NKIMV is likely in a BBM or a Oman game. Your also misrepping what I said. I dont care if someone is pushing scot (in wagon form). Which is essentially not a hugely great reason.

No, I got your point pretty much entirely right. You have no reason for not seeing scot lynched aside from his claim, and as friendly neighborhood muppet, he's not going to be a useful vig anyways.

I would certainly like to see a scot lynch.

Is pushing for a lynch, now come off it, we are seriously considering lynching someone over what is a joke or not.

It has nothing to do with him not realizing it's a joke. It has to do with the following:

A) He saw MBF claim his role,

B) He did not counter-claim, which does not fit with him thinking it was "completely serious", which means his claim has little-to-no-meaning,

C) His responses are shit,

D) He hasn't done anything.

You haven't even made a case for me beyond lurking and a point that I clarified above. I feel I have posted enough in a game where in the first day it was less about actually playing mafia and more about pandering to you before you shoot someone at random (or from a shortlist of random)

No, it's pretty simple why everyone who was on that shortlist was on it. Ouman was on it because I felt his reactions to my over-the-top attitude to be off. Ouman on a normal day would call me out on being a self-important tosser.

UA was on it because he was (and is continuing to be) a waste of space, but he's a readable waste of space which is why we're not lynching him today.

UK was on it because I thought the way she was acting was dense and it was more of a wake-up call.

GW for the whole mess he made yesterday.

As for my no list:

Panzer is town. No, seriously.

Shanba is so win. No, seriously.

Spring's contributions have been consistently town. No, seriously.

MBF's few contributions that weren't obvious jokes had great pro-town vibes. No, seriously.

, now you feel like lording it over us all still, I made a case about mbf a few days ago

And you were wrong.

, Im now voting panzer, your so big on people not pulling their weight, why not him.

Because he's so completely and obviously town. I cannot stress this enough.

You take pot shots at me when I have nothing to do with your conversation, your opinions are ludacris

^ My opinions ^

90% sure on panzer, in 5 posts?(and not particularly sure about GW either)

Yep! I assure you there's a perfectly reasonable example for all of them.

Im glad we have the mafia god in our midst. Oh wait, we don't. Cause it seems like you need Shanba's opinions pretty much all the time. Why is that? Why not sl or ua, he's not posting much, or me?

Good point. Spring, from now on you can answer all the questions I pose to Shanba too.

I don't involve you and UA because you're both spunk-flavored lollipops of uselessness.

Now what next,

witty

retort back, hmmm?

I assure you, I have no such things

ever

.

[JDodge]

It has nothing to do with him not realizing it's a joke. It has to do with the following:

A) He saw MBF claim his role,

B) He did not counter-claim, which does not fit with him thinking it was "completely serious", which means his claim has little-to-no-meaning,

At the time, I wasn't going to claim right away. I didn't rule it out that there could be to NK-immune vigs. In any other game I would laugh at that suggestion, but when bbm said it might be a complex setup in the queue, I wasn't going to rule anything out. Which is why I wanted to know who he killed, cause him targeting either me or jd would explain the lack of kills from either of us. So, go on and call me an idiot for this explanation, cause that accomplishes stuff.

So you thought the more likely explanation wasn't "he was lying", but there are

two roles that can't be killed at night, both town, that have a kill, despite there likely being a scumgroup and there only being two kills last night

. Can I borrow your rocketcycle and ramp? I wanna make leaps of logic like that.

Of course it's going to be a complex setup, we'd already proven that with the fact that you exist and that there was a cult and a king and you got date-rape drugs. Your explanation is extraordinarily convoluted and it's easier to say that you felt threatened by the possible existence of a night-kill immune pro-town killing role than it is to say you escaped from the obvious conclusion in a way that made Houdini have an orgasm in his grave.

C) His responses are shit,

D) He hasn't done anything.

How are my responses shit? And I have been far more active then I was during day one, and don't think its fair to say I haven't done anything.

See above, see above, you haven't done anything except defend yourself and speak when spoken to.

I don't know why people are letting UA survive. I don't believe that he can only vote himself due to his role, and even if its true, it doesn't make him town. He is coasting right now, and isn't actively scumhunting.

Right. Two night-kill immune pro-town killing roles make absolute sense. A compulsive self-voter

certainly doesn't

.

At least panzer is voting for someone who he thinks is scum. Myk is in the same boat as UA right now, and if he doesn't start posting soon he should die too.

myk is a great tomorrow lynch.

So... Does Flava's replacement feel like posting yet? Don't care, do it anyway. We're on a tight schedule, you see, and if you attempt to sail your way past the deadline without saying anything, I will push for your lynch before the day is over with.

Don't start with the empty threat bullshit. Put your balls where your mouth is, although that might be a bit

scotesque

.

[JDodge]

Valid point from Scot's previous post: UA, regardless of only being able to self-vote, you're going to need to do a little scumhunting. Especially after something like this like this:

The irony of the whole thing is YOU'RE NOT SCUMHUNTING.

Also, the following creates a problem for me:

The events of Day 1, As they pertain to UA:
Found FF scummy. Pursued. King Dodge didn't care. Backed off
Got into a minor argument with UK. (Turned out to be more worthless that FF's, but whatever floats your boat Scot.)Felt she was wrong but Town. She wouldn't back down.

Self-voted to end argument

Analysis: Subject began day with minor leads, but quickly gave up when he realized he'd be unable to convince the one person who mattered. Cruised for the rest of the day.

The bolded is the problem. It conflicts with this:

UA, I'm going to give you 48 to do something else than self-voting

I can't

I say it conflicts due to the fact that the way you describe the self-voting the first time doesn't make it feel like something you did because it's the only kind of voting you can do. It felt like more of a "did it for the shock value" type of thing. That's just my take on it.

It is something he does. There's a reason why his title is vote: UltimaAvalon; the game-start UA wagon is tradition. Hell, one time we were playing AiTP in scumchat and I was the assassin and UA was the king; we quicklynched him at the start of D1 and I won. It was grand.

It's not something he keeps up. It's almost certainly a role. In fact, the fact that the UA wagon is traditional means it's likely a role.

[JDodge]

JD: Stop putting words in my mouth. Me saying I didn't rule something out doesn't mean it is the most likely solution. I simply wasn't going to jump to conclusions and counterclaim him right away. Did I overanalyze the shit out of the entire situation? Of course. Believe it or not, people do that sometimes. Not everyone is perfect like you.

It's not just that you're jumping to conclusions, it's that you decided not to on the basis of

the single most asinine, twisted conclusion you could possibly come to, one that makes no sense in anything other than a setup assembled by a bunch of braindead monkeys on a bad acid trip with a typewriter with a broken "n" key

.

Its looking more like I will be lynched. If that happens, I want everyone to look at spring. I think she is the most likely to be scum out of those who have pushed for my lynched. She seems like the one looking for an opportunistic lynch on me. I'm very surprised JD is voting for me, as he can usually read me very well, but he is a blur right now. I don't really know how he plays as scum, and I can never read him. I think panzer is sincere in thinking that I'm an sk.

I don't think that you know what you're talking about, honestly.

But even if he can only vote himself, it doesn't make him town. UA isn't even making an effort to find scum. He's sitting back, playing minecraft and coasting through the entire game. He's not helping the town; he doesn't want to help the town.

If you couldn't vote for anyone but yourself, thus making you useless as anything other than a brain, wouldn't you rather play minecraft than take a front seat?

[JDodge]

I believe the claim. Kinda hilarious that he got himself as his role, but it makes sense. Plus, UAscum was under no pressure to claim there, and survivor is always an icky claim to make as scum. So yeah.

Given that, and given deadomancult, I think it's unlikely there's an sk as well - that would be three non-town roles already, and then we'd have to add in UK's killer (who I reckon is most likely scum, since uk was pretty townish). If scot is scum, I think we don't have a proper mafia group - and on that note, I also think it's unlikely scot is mafia fakeclaiming vig.

JD: I can compromise on przac if necessary.

Don't you find it odd that scot didn't counter-claim MBF if he thought that MBF was telling the truth, given that being un-NKable there is no risk to himself unless people don't believe him over MBF (unlikely)? I can't think of a legit train of thought aside from aforementioned canyon-via-rocketcycle leap of logic why scot wouldn't counter-claim but would call him out there.

[JDodge]

It's not just that you're jumping to conclusions, it's that you decided not to on the basis of

the single most asinine, twisted conclusion you could possibly come to, one that makes no sense in anything other than a setup assembled by a bunch of braindead monkeys on a bad acid trip with a typewriter with a broken "n" key

.

As I said, sometimes people make mistakes. I find it odd that you think I would counterclaim right away rather than have all the information.

What information could you possibly need other than someone else claiming your role?

If you found it so odd, why did you unvote me at first?

Sorry, I'm mildly schizophrenic on Sundays. You'll have to ask my laundry basket.

If you couldn't vote for anyone but yourself, thus making you useless as anything other than a brain, wouldn't you rather play minecraft than take a front seat?

If I was town with that role, I would claim with my first post, and attempt to find scum, and use my one vote to the best of my ability to beat scum. If I was a survivor, I would still claim, though UA's current play makes sense as a survivor.

Because scum have no reason whatsoever to keep a survivor alive when the survivor gets to choose which side he wants to be on. Nor does any possible, for example,

NK immune miller vig

.

Don't care if this is going to look like omgus.

YOU GO GIRL

I already explained that my low activity during day one was due to my personal situation,

doesn't really jive all that well with

Myk is in the same boat as UA right now, and if he doesn't start posting soon he should die too.

when you consider

yeah, hi. I don't feel like posting, but if there are things you need to know from me, ask it now. I might answer you tomorrow.

which is pretty damn obviously "personal situation"

[JDodge]

Honestly, I'm not going to move my vote off of scot today. I'm convinced that if he's not scum he's town that is functionally retarded; this is not someone I want to keep alive when they have a NK.

[JDodge]

SL: I'm wavering in my conviction. I want to believe him but it's all so icky.

Would you agree that the general ickiness makes him a threat to the town irregardless?

[JDodge]

SL: I'm wavering in my conviction. I want to believe him but it's all so icky.

Would you agree that the general ickiness makes him a threat to the town irregardless?

I don't like that mindset. If we spend our efforts killing "threats to the town" we'll suddenly end up in lylo with a bunch of dead dumbtown. Although, I guess as a vig/sk he's more dangerous than normal. I remember a game as scum where I won in part thanks to the vig offing the (fairly obvtown) cop and doc.

Eh.

Exactly. I'd rather not end up in lylo with a bunch of dead dumbtown prs because of alive dumbtown.

[JDodge]

Although I must say, the prospect of having him vig UA and then lynching Prozac is exciting.

Prozac, GW: You guys are the lone holdouts on the scot and myk wagons. Start figuring out where your votes are going.

[JDodge]

I say Myk dies and that we hereby force Scot to kill who we want and no one else. If, later on, we feel there are no more mafia, we lynch him on suspicion of being an SK.

So you want to leave someone you think is an SK until the last possible minute.

That sounds kinda goofy.

Im still failing to see the big case on scot beyond the joke incident.

It's not about him not noticing it was a joke, it's that his actions following make no sense whatsoever if he didn't.

[JDodge]

Question to everyone: would you say JD is trying to get shanba and others to now policy lynch me for being "functionally retarded?"

No, I'm trying to get you lynched because you're either scum or so exceptionally thick that you, as a vig, are more harmful to the town than helpful,

especially

because this is the only way we can get rid of you.

[JDodge]

I heavily believe in the first. Let's make me four times right!

[JDodge]

Also, if I'm not lynched, I'm not going to have you guys direct my nightkills. First, we don't know if the scum have the ability to protect or roleblock, and if they do, then it would open up a lot of wifom if my nightkill was blocked. And second, if I were to disagree with your choices, I wouldn't listen to them.

Perfect! Then it's settled then. All aboooooard!

We as a town have no reason to keep you if we can't trust you, yet you expect us to trust you to kill people for us. Not happening. You're also not in a position to bargain here - you do as the town says or the town lynches you. If you survive today, you

will

vig UA tonight, or you

will

be our target for tomorrow. Got it?

Well, barring further changes I'll move to scot pre-deadline.

Scot: It actually reminds me more of the sort of thing people used to say when someone was making some funky plays: "you're either dumb or you're scum and either way town's better off with you dead." It's policy lynchish, but it has more than a small seasoning of "what you're doing is scummy, and the only way you could think that way as town is that you're stupid."

In other words, there's an element of policy lynch but a large component of scumminess mixed in.

I asked because JD wrote an entire essay in MD on why policy lynching is bad. Yes, he thinks I'm scummy, but he reverted to policy reasons in trying to convince you to lynch me. It's at least something to think about after you lynch me.

It's not policy reasons; it's just good business.

Shanba, your time is up. It's pre-deadline now, we either lynch or we don't.

[JDodge]

ALRIGHT BITCHES

TIME FOR ME TO BREAK THIS GAME OVER YO DIRTY HEADS, BITCHES. I'M A DAYCOP, BITCHES. I'VE BEEN SHOUTING MY INVESTIGATION RESULTS IN PLAIN SIGHT THIS ENTIRE TIME AND NONE OF YOU BITCHES NOTICED, BITCHES.

WHICH MEANS PANZER DAY ONE, BITCHES
GHOSTWRITER DAY TWO, BITCHES
BOTH INNOCENT BITCHES, BITCHES

WHOMEVER KIDNAPPED ME BLOCKED ME FOR TODAY, BITCHES. I COULD BE SOME SORT OF CULT-DETECTING COP, BITCHES.
IT WOULD MAKE SENSE, BITCHES. MY FLAVOR IS JACK MCCOY, BITCHES.

UA COULDN'T SIDE WITH SCUM BECAUSE HE'S VOTE-RESTRICTED, BITCHES. WHY DIDN'T ANY OF YOU BITCHES NOTICE THAT, BITCHES. OH NO WAIT HE CAN MOVE HIS VOTE ONCE, BITCHES. THE QUICKLYNCH WOULD HAVE HAPPENED BY NOW THEN, BITCHES.

SHANBA: WONDERING WHY YOU'RE VOTING MYK (WHO'S MAKING AN EFFORT TO PLAY) OVER PROZAC (NOT), UA (NOT, PLUS YOU'RE WARY OF HIS SURVIVORDOM), PANZER (SIX POSTS ALL GAME), OR GHOSTWRITER (LURKLURKLURK). YOUR PLAY IS WEIRDING ME OUT, CONSIDERING HOW READILY YOU WENT FROM I BELIEVE SCOT TO I DON'T BELIEVE SCOT, EVEN WHEN YOUR LINE OF REASONING DICTATED THAT

THERE IS NO WAY THERE SHOULD HAVE BEEN TWO KILLS IF SCOT WAS LYING

. HALF OF THAT WAGON WAS A TRAP TO SEE WHO WOULD GO ALONG WITH IT, AND I'M GLAD YOU GUYS DID. I WOULD LIKE TO LYNCH SHANBA TODAY. PANZER, GW, TOWN ALLIANCE, BITCHES?

VOTE: SHANBA

UA SHOULD VOTE NOW AND WIN THE GAME IF SHANBA IS TOWN

[JDodge]

um....

if

Shanba is town? If you're a Daycop with two innocent results, and you investigated Shanba, why is there an if?

DAMN, I WAS HOPING THAT WOULD WORK

SEE I WAS TRYING TO TRICK YOU INTO QUICK-LOOKING AND CHANGING YOUR VOTE ONTO SOMEONE I DIDN'T WANT TO LYNCH TODAY, THUS COMPLETELY NEUTRALIZING YOU AS A THREAT OR FORCING YOU TO REVEAL YOURSELF AS A FRAUD

UNVOTE

GLAD TO SEE YOU'RE STILL NOT READING, THOUGH

[JDodge]

SHANBA: WONDERING WHY YOU'RE VOTING MYK (WHO'S MAKING AN EFFORT TO PLAY) OVER PROZAC (NOT), UA (NOT, PLUS YOU'RE WARY OF HIS SURVIVORDOM), PANZER (SIX POSTS ALL GAME), OR GHOSTWRITER (LURKLURKLURK)

GW is dead and was pretty obvtown anyway - PAY ATTENTION DUMBASS. Panzer is scummy but myko is scummier. UA I'm pondering - if he's a survivor and we have 2 scum, we have to lynch him or a scumbag today. If he's lying scum, lynching him is a good thing. I think lynching him is the safe play, but I'm not sold that lynching him is the

correct

play yet. Prozac is always frigging lurky.

LYNCHING HIM IS THE WRONG PLAY IF WE HAVE 3 SCUM - WE NEED TO TRY AND HIT SCUM IRREGARDLESS, BECAUSE FROM WHAT I CAN TELL TOWN IS HELLA OVERPOWERED AND 3 SCUM MIGHT ACTUALLY BE BALANCED.

Scot was partially a deadline lynch. I wasn't sold on him, but what legit alternatives were left when I voted him? Yeah I'm not sad he was dead - some of the shit he said

was

scummy. But that wasn't the key reason for lynching him, I'd have been much happier with a myko lynch.

WHY MYK? YOUR ONLY REASON SEEMS TO BE BASED ON FLAVA FLAVE'S PLAY, AND I'M MORE WILLING TO CHALK THAT UP TO HIM BEING AN UTTER PILLOCK ANYWAYS

[JDodge]

BY THE WAY, SINCE MY DAYCOP WAS BLOCKED BY BEING KIDNAPPED, I THINK IT'S P SAFE TO SAY THAT THE KIDNAPPER IS LIKELY SCUM AND PANZER IS THUS CLEAR, WHICH FLUSHES OUT NICELY WITH MY INNOCENT

I LIKE HOW I MANAGED TO TELEGRAPH MY RESULTS FOR TWO STRAIGHT DAYS WITHOUT ANYONE FIGURING ME OUT. THAT'S FUCKING TALENT RIGHT THERE IF I DO BOOST MY OWN EGO

[JDodge]

SEE IT'S FUN BECAUSE MY VOTE COUNTS DOUBLE TODAY, SO YOU GUYS ARE BEHOLDEN TO ME YET AGAIN

HA HA HA HA HA HA HA HA HA

HA HA HA HA HA HA HA HA HA

HA HA HA HA HA HA HA HA HA

HA HA HA HA HA HA HA HA HA

QUESTIONING WHY MYK FOSES AND VOTES SHANBA IN SAME POST - UNSURE IF GOOD MOVE?

[JDodge]

ACTUALLY MYK'S VOTE WORKS WELL IN A SELF-PRESERVATORY CONTEXT, WHERE HE WAS RATHER QUICKLY AND ABRUPTLY TRYING TO ESTABLISH SOME LEVEL OF SUSPICION IN REACTION TO SHANBA'S PRESSURING

[JDodge]

SHANBA IS CORRECT

VOTE: ULTIMAAVALON

[JDodge]

THAT WAS THE HAMMER BTW

[JDodge]

So let's see.

1. I caught two scum D1 go me

2. I lead the town and more importantly kept reigning in Shanba so he couldn't control our lynches as effectively

3. I stupidly forgot to outright tell you guys to lynch Shanba tomorrow on my death, my bad, thought that was pretty obvious by the fact that I told you guys I'd investigated him - wait shit forgot that too

4. Cay refusing to read is one of the things that cost the town the game

5. The kidnapper was the single most imbalanced role in the game

6. damnit UA

7. we could have done better if Prozac hadn't just spent his time contradicting me with no real reasoning other than "he's scum" and "i don't see your case"

[JDodge]

5. The kidnapper was the single most imbalanced role in the game

*cough* nk immune vig

scot pretty much ruined the chance of that being unbalanced