We are not color claiming. I actually dont even think a claim near lynch should include color.
Mini 949 - Rainbow Robot Unicorn Attack! - Over
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LlamaFluff Jack of All Trades
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Vote Animorpherv1
We are not color claiming. I actually dont even think a claim near lynch should include color.-
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This game is going to make me need to put my glasses on eventually I think.-
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We need to make some ground rules here for what colors people can post in. Ones that are unreadable should be discouraged as they are somewhat detremental. I for one move to have yellow banned-
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Orange should go too. Good color but not good for reading.farside22 wrote:Personally the orange is killing me more.But I will stop the yellow if mr.happy orange stops too.
Im sticking to black, its technically all colors so therefore the most tricksy to master.-
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If you start posting in white I will be trying to policy lynchanimorpherv1 wrote:If you make me stop posting in Ornage and cyan, I will POST IN WHITE.-
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This is not an answer to the question in my last postVasudeVa wrote:L-2 at page 2? Woah. Are we going for a quicklynch record or something? We can afford some discussion.
@ani - Vi is right. What's up with that? Is this part of the usual brand of carelessness you seem to display?-
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Thats what Vi thinks, not what you think. What do you think? Is ani scum for it? Is it even a tell?VasudeVa wrote:
That's because you ninja posted me. Sorry brah.LlamaFluff wrote:
This is not an answer to the question in my last postVasudeVa wrote:L-2 at page 2? Woah. Are we going for a quicklynch record or something? We can afford some discussion.
@ani - Vi is right. What's up with that? Is this part of the usual brand of carelessness you seem to display?
To answer your question: It really didn't get my attention before Vi pointed it out. Now that he did, there you go.-
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Nah, its more that just almost this entire player list has at least a years experience. I havent even played with half of it.VasudeVa wrote:You guys know each other far too well. I feel out of place >.>.
Cool. So which one is scum and why then?Tony's vote seems out of place. Join date makes me think he's too experienced for OMGUS. Can you clarify please?
Farside's vote could be opportunistic, or could be an aggressive town vote. Gut says opportunistic.
Vi is applying pressure on the tiniest of details. I'm rather uncomfortable with it. But this is my first game with him/her.
unvote
vote ominio
Now that we have your playing history down, how about playing present. Who is scum?-
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unvote
FoS ominio
Ive been doing some thinking and we might want to be conservative with our votes given that stuff is showing up in color on the VCs. Given that the whole "alt win condition" thing relates to 3x colors and there are less players/cycles in the game then are going to be necessary to achieve that if its one per... it has to be related to a continual ability (Use X, if A occurs use X again, if B stop) or votes.
Take it easy is my basic point, I think being reckless in anything with a WC that I dont understand how its obtainable is going to be dangerous.-
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Please be useful, who is scum and why?animorpherv1 wrote:unsee: Vi
see:Percy-
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Are you serious about this?animorpherv1 wrote:At this point, Vas for using the obvious "I can't respond to this, English isn't my native language' to get away with not answer it. Nothing aginst him because he doens't speak English.
First, random wagons are good. Secon which one is more scummy?Also, one of dramonic/Elli for wagoning on me and providing little/no reasoning.-
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So is that a yes? A no? Beating around the bush?animorpherv1 wrote:
IMO, it seems like a cop out, more on the way he phrased it.LlamaFluff wrote:
Are you serious about this?animorpherv1 wrote:At this point, Vas for using the obvious "I can't respond to this, English isn't my native language' to get away with not answer it. Nothing aginst him because he doens't speak English.
Yes. I do expect you to be able to distinguish between two players. Which one?
dramonic posted a total of 2 times, and Elli 11, with several fulff posts, so about 8. You expect me to know this?
First, random wagons are good. Secon which one is more scummy?Also, one of dramonic/Elli for wagoning on me and providing little/no reasoning.-
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You missed this question ani. Answer it now.LlamaFluff wrote:
So is that a yes? A no? Beating around the bush?animorpherv1 wrote:
IMO, it seems like a cop out, more on the way he phrased it.LlamaFluff wrote:
Are you serious about this?animorpherv1 wrote:At this point, Vas for using the obvious "I can't respond to this, English isn't my native language' to get away with not answer it. Nothing aginst him because he doens't speak English.-
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So then its a null tell?-
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We dont have to avoid it anymore since colors that dont match alt-WC are showing up. Just got paranoid that voting recklessly was going to play into someones handsVi wrote:I'm a little upset at how what I/we had going earlier seems to have come to a standstill, and if we have to avoid voting due to mod shenanigans there will be.RAGE
Yep that color is making me think its a signification of wagon strength (red most, etc). Also if you have ever seen me go off on someone who doesnt like to vote you would know how counter intuitive that isElectricBadger wrote:
The funky win condition specifies 6 colors - what do you think Dramonic's name in dark red means? I can't imagine finding the black pylon-bad guy is that easy, but it seems to imply it's not a color reveal. Though maybe we should play it safe, at least until after the first lynch. The thought of re-reads on a game with no voting makes me cry inside, btw.LlamaFluff wrote:Ive been doing some thinking and we might want to be conservative with our votes given that stuff is showing up in color on the VCs.
Will try...
This may be the vicadin speaking, but I have no idea what you just said there. Could you simplify?LlamaFluff wrote:Given that the whole "alt win condition" thing relates to 3x colors and there are less players/cycles in the game then are going to be necessary to achieve that if its one per... it has to be related to a continual ability (Use X, if A occurs use X again, if B stop) or votes.
there needs to be 18 total colors acheived for the WC. There are less then 18 players, days, night actions for a 3 player team, etc. When names started showing up like this, it looked like it might be a way to hit that number.
Why do you need more time for this? Why cant you at least try and draw a conclusion?animorpherv1 wrote:
I'm waiting to see which one I think is scumEllibereth wrote:What difference does that make for my vote on you? I voted you for the wagon.more
Also trying to use any language barrier as a scumtell, even a "very slight one" is not only scummy, but pretty assholeish too.
vote Ani
Now, who is scum. Not who is scum when everyone has posted more, but who is scum now.-
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Cool.animorpherv1 wrote:Most likley is dramonic.see: dramonic.
Why?-
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Policy or on something?dramonic wrote:
absolutely.LlamaFluff wrote:@dram - Would you be ok with an ani lynch?
Also ive been doing some thinking, ominio doesnt have the alt-win condition-
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I tend to be pretty good at picking the "what the hell?" meta type people out as town. In this game though I am not getting that read off ani right now, so that is just setting off a lot of passive bells in my head. It may also be for the whole language barrier thing too though which I am just floored he is making into any type of a tell.Vi wrote:I freely confess I don't feel confident with reading aniskywalkerv1 and trust in Ellibereth's judgment there.-
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Side note but...
100K!!
Should of been 110k at least but something I was downloading popped up on me during second run
Who knew all I needed to break the 100k mark was some jello shots-
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Colors showed up and something that must occur 18 times for a WC to be obtained looked like it could easily be related to votes. Its been proven far more unlikely since then, so ive dropped it.farside22 wrote:Llama: Why did you think the vote count had a reference to who was what color?-
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@RC - What is wrong with lots of voting? You seem to allude to it somehow being a scumtell. Also you are apparently willing to lynch dram for being willing to lynch ani?
It was for almost a year, then it changed. I like this character so dont see it changing in the future. Even the alt I use at times always gets called female... guess I have a feminine posting style or something.Ellibereth wrote:I just realized I've been looking at a picture of lion and thinking in my head that it was a llama this whole time.-
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Are you really saying that because dram was willing to lynch ani on page three, you became willing to lynch dram at the same time.Robocopter87 wrote:He jumped on a popular wagon without adding anything to the discussion and then decided that he was perfectly comfortable with lynching Ani.
Fair enough, who is a better lynch though?ElectricBadger wrote:
He doesn't seem to need a wagon to keep talking; dramonic does.Vi wrote:Why not vote Robocopter?-
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Why are you voting dram over RC who you apparently think is more likely scum?VasudeVa wrote:All in all, I'm fine with his lynch. To me, this is a semi-policy, semi-scum lynch. Probable scum, also probable liability at LyLo. Although, I'd like to hear a bit from dram, so be keeping my vote here until it's lynching time.
unvote
vote robocopter-
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Also this still hasnt been answered
Ignoring me isnt an optionLlamaFluff wrote:
Are you really saying that because dram was willing to lynch ani on page three, you became willing to lynch dram at the same time.Robocopter87 wrote:He jumped on a popular wagon without adding anything to the discussion and then decided that he was perfectly comfortable with lynching Ani.-
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Probably yes. Its because I have reads that I can articulate on them. I have some gut scummy reads on others, but its hard for me to really explain them at this point, so im sticking to pushing what I can explain, and am working from there.farside22 wrote:Llama: Would I be accurate to say you have been attacking/question more of the lets say less then stellar players in the game?
Is there any reason why?
That said the last post from RC is making me second guess myself quite a bit. Something about it just strikes me as resigned, still working on resigned what though.-
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yeah we do not color claim unless it has something to do with what your role/abilities are-
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farside is really setting off bells, I think it stems from her intro to the game (and that farside is always scum) but something is just bugging me there.Vi wrote:
Or you could give me some peace of mind and go ahead and lay them out. They can't criticize you worse than they are me right now :roll:LlamaFluff 226 wrote:I have some gut scummy reads on others, but its hard for me to really explain them at this point, so im sticking to pushing what I can explain, and am working from there.
Also you to a much less extent, although it doesnt really transcend lack of seeing expected town tells.-
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A developed read ten pages into the game from an active person. Not having one is just making me uncomfortable. Just about everyone else I have a read going on.Vi wrote:
What were you expecting? (not a vanity question, honest)LlamaFluff 242 wrote:
Also you to a much less extent, although it doesnt really transcend lack of seeing expected town tells.Vi wrote:
Or you could give me some peace of mind and go ahead and lay them out. They can't criticize you worse than they are me right now :roll:LlamaFluff 226 wrote:I have some gut scummy reads on others, but its hard for me to really explain them at this point, so im sticking to pushing what I can explain, and am working from there.-
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Mafia 86? Im not sure there have been any other games we have played together.farside22 wrote:
I'm always scum? When was the last game we were in together?LlamaFluff wrote:farside is really setting off bells, I think it stems from her intro to the game (and that farside is always scum) but something is just bugging me there.
Its nothing I can explain well so nothing worth pushing. If it was something I intended to push to a lynch people would know.As for my entry it's pretty typical post I have been making lately. Somewhat policy comment and reactionary at the same time. Interesting to see you don't say anything till now. Why did you wait?-
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Joke on what Fonz always says. I dont use smilies or anything like that so sometimes jokes are hard to conveyfarside22 wrote:1 game together makes me always scum? That's pretty odd statement coming from you.
Im pretty sure my "gut slightly scummy but thats it" has held constant. Where am I backing up?seeing you back up when prodded adds points against you in my book-
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Ah ok. I consider "I think its from the intro" as "cant explain well". I think explain well constitutes being able to make a case on it, which I cant with what I have.
Its just a gut thing, the kind of read that you have to check with a role or expand off other alignments.-
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I have Elli as town, then Mae and VV as lesser town. Have RC as scum with a few gut reads, and a few more modifyable after a flip.Vi wrote:I don't really see anything particularly damning in farside 250. L-Fluff already cleared up what I was going to say about 251.
So what ARE your reads, anyway?-
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Just played a game with Mae where she was scum, this feels different.farside22 wrote:@Llama: How do you have a town read on Mae who has said very little?
unvote
for now, need to do thinking about the VT claim.
Also ive never seen dram act this intentionally useless in a game before, he needs to stop that.-
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Yeah, she was. It also was a kinda broken endgame.Ellibereth wrote:
Wasn't she in some foreign language mode though?LlamaFluff wrote:
Just played a game with Mae where she was scum, this feels different.farside22 wrote:@Llama: How do you have a town read on Mae who has said very little?
unvote
for now, need to do thinking about the VT claim.
Also ive never seen dram act this intentionally useless in a game before, he needs to stop that.
I won't get to the isos i mentioned earlier until tomorrow or so.
I just am having lots of second guesses after 277. It just hits quite a few of my towntells of a player near lynch-
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@robo - What are your views on lynching VT claims?
@farside - Do you think robo is town or just less scum?
@dram - What are your opinions on robo?
@TM - What are your current reads? And what happened to that iso?
Im just about ready to put my vote back down at this point pending a few answers to above questions. This game is proving a hassle to get a good handle on, almost seems all the pairings I see are acting like they dont know that are really scum together.-
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You forgot about TM Elli-
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Dash: TM
Stupid page 15... we are going to need to pick up the pace or im going to have to hardcore lurk at certain times.-
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You guys know we can (and probably should) talk untill scene. Would love to hear a few opinions on TM before then.-
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Stuff like this mostly.TonyMontana wrote:Announcing wearyness of a quick-hammer at L-1 on day 1 is not pro-town. It's trying to look pro-town, which is scummy in itself.
The wagon sure broke down quickly after the VT claim. I think I'll keep seeing robo for now, as I don't have a better vote ATM.
I'll check out seacore later, tho, so far he hasn't really redeemed his predecessor in my eyes.
Justifies voting dram for his wanting to hammer robo, who he still wants lynched but is giving himself a way to get off the wagon. All while showing the want for a third wagon on seacore.
Just looks like trying to keep every possible option for a wagon open for himself here.-
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I never payed close attention to TM untill after the wagon fell off of RC. At that point I went back and did some reading and he went up my list pretty fast. I take it you disagree with my suspicion?farside22 wrote:Why did it take you this long to mention anything about TM?
Who else are you suspicious of?
Apart from that.. RC is town, Eli is town, VV is town. Mae, ani and sea are probably town.
Im thinking a combination of you/EB/Vi for last two. Im also thinking this is a very non-standard setup game.-
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Im going to be around for up to another hour, after that probably not but there is a chance.Vi wrote:LlamaFluff (ever-popular!), are you going to be around to post tonight?
Will try to respond to farside in that time-
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hehfarside22 wrote:
And stillLlamaFluff wrote: Im thinking a combination of you/EB/Vi for last two. Im also thinking this is a very non-standard setup game.no reasoningfound here to his scum reads. Cool story bro.
10 to 1 llama is some anti-town role. Thisis all gut.
Lets try this even though its quite a bit of small/gut tells
One of the biggest things on you is that you are overly into just looking for lurkers. Dram is popular with you, mainly for lurking. Mae again you think is scummy, given that she is lurking. The only real case you have persued is RC, which you dropped due to a sudden VI read, which I dont know where it came from.
The whole thing between EB/Vi is that I actually do not see a game with both of you being the same alignment. There has been quite a bit of conflict between the two that was initiated by the other, not picked up on or mentioned in passing. Given the volitary nature of wagons (like RC rise and fall), I dont see this being done between partners that know it.
Moving on to other reads asked of me...
Dram I just dont see being this anti-town as scum since it almost IS intentional its so bad. Yes I realize its WIFOM, but I do not remember ever seeing him be this useless, and given what im assuming, it makes even less sense then normal for scum to be doing this outside of a gambit.
Going to be heading out very soon now, but I should be able to make one line responses for the next 15 minutes or so.-
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No, RC is town because of his VT claim and subsequent actions. Im semi-known for pulling wagons off VT claims when it becomes obvious they are truthful. This is one of those situations.Vi wrote:
So basically, you're affording him the same pass as Robocopter, correct?LlamaFluff 373 wrote:Dram I just dont see being this anti-town as scum since it almost IS intentional its so bad. Yes I realize its WIFOM, but I do not remember ever seeing him be this useless, and given what im assuming, it makes even less sense then normal for scum to be doing this outside of a gambit.
Dram is prob-town for a completely different reason.
I can follow his logic on the push for robo lynch, even though I no longer agree with it. The "Ive never been scum" also kind of makes me believe it, I know that I bring up the "ive been scum once of over 20 games when I joined in queue" thing at times. If this is true for him, it would be fairly easy to meta him.Also you never mentioned anything about your probTown read on Seacore. That's the one I'm most interested in.
Its hard to explain this one, but something about his play says town to me, moreso then my other slight town reads.
NOW im probably going to be late, and gone for good tonight-
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No... thats you saying im going for weak players. Im saying you are going after lurkers over scummy.farside22 wrote:
This sounds familiar about exactly what I said to you.llama wrote:One of the biggest things on you is that you are overly into just looking for lurkers. Dram is popular with you, mainly for lurking. Mae again you think is scummy, given that she is lurking. The only real case you have persued is RC, which you dropped due to a sudden VI read, which I dont know where it came from.
here
I was hoping to get a response from TM before mod came in, or at least some big swings in what people think about him to work with. Tricksy can backfire at times though.Vi wrote:
:?Percy 377 wrote:[no scene]
Vote TM-
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No, No again, Yes and Hell NoSeacore wrote:I don't think there's enough on TM besides his absence.
I'm still pro a Robo lynch, nothing he's done has persuaded me that he's not a newb scum.
I'm very anti a dram lynch, I think he's just unhelpful town
I guess, when it comes down to the deadline, I'll support whatever lynch, at least a dram lynch gets rid of an unhelpful player, but in my opinion, it will be a town flip.
We arent going to lynch RC today, once he got ran up he displayed quite a few strong town tells. If you think dram is town, you should never be voting him.
Am I right in saying you are in disagreement with my TM vote? Is he town or neutral?-
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Stuff needs to happen now though.... which means
TM, Seacore, Dram and Eli definantly need to move their votes. Those wagons are dead in the water, especially the VV wagon.-
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Yeah that claim was almost for sure true. Thats why we are moving the wagon, I would lynch scum then VT. I know some people in this game have seen me do it before (IIRC ive actually pulled one off TM), the claim, the fact that he tried to push a new case after, and a few other tells just make me realize I was wrong to start and we need a new lynch.Seacore wrote:I feel that too many people have just abandoned the Robo wagon, he was guilty enough to get to L-1, he's got only a VT claim, his play since then has not be redeeming.
Who is your second suspect? You are pretty clear on town reads, but I have no clue who your second choice is, I know you will comprimise on dram (which you shouldnt be saying) but who is your ideal backup lynch-
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LlamaFluff Jack of All Trades
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50-50, he seems to post around two times and it was right before one of those windows.Ellibereth wrote:Unvote, Vote Badger
Llama, how likely did you think it was for Tony to show before Percy after the FAKEDASH move.-
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LlamaFluff Jack of All Trades
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Im just going to snip this from a past gamedramonic wrote:Why is Robo's VT claim more credible than any other exactly?
I have pulled this same thing off in a few other games as well. This one fits all necessary keys of my theory, coupled with the other tells he showed around the same time, he is town.Me from Family Guy Large wrote:Well my theory on claims is "The closer it is to deadline, the higher the chance that a vanilla town claim is a true claim"
This is true given that
- Town is assured to not hit power
- There is no way a vanilla claim will derail a wagon
- Scum knows a vanilla has a lower chance of saving them so wont claim it
- Town wont fakeclaim
- Vanilla claims get lynched
Now you did not need to claim when you did, a week from deadline we dont need a claim from you when you are at L-3. If you had a PR, then maybe its an acceptable time to claim, however this is already proven false. You had to know that the claim would not save you, so I dont get why you would of outed yourself with a vanilla claim when you did.
Given the odd setup of this game that I have been alluding to, I think this holds doubly true, especially if a few of my setup guesses are correct.
For the change in heart over the ani read. I lost interest in the case, and after dropping the RC wagon went back to see if it was a good spot to pick back up, and realized that there really was nothing there. From a lynch bait spot, im considering lack of any tell to be a slight town tell. He by no means is a player I would like to find myself in lylo with, but im not down for a lynch of him.-
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LlamaFluff Jack of All Trades
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I would much rather lynch TM at this point and want to see if I can gather support for that one first, but I would be ok with that lynch.Vi wrote:@FluffoftheLlama: Would you like to vote ElectricBadger?-
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LlamaFluff Jack of All Trades
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Dram saying "I want to hammer" was a big reasonfor that thought. I guess my original point applies but this time its just about a different person. Also bringing up seacore later.TonyMontana wrote:Where did you read dram in that?
My first line was aimed at seacore.
Well you should have a reason if you are getting off it. I already laid out why im confident that he is town, do you disagree with my reasoning there or do you just think it would never work? Also he really is town, the VT claim, no shameless wagoning, the change in style. All super strong town tells that close to a lynch.And why would I need a way off a wagon that everyone basically jumped out of . No, sir, I'm still sticking to robo for the time being. Mostly cause I've seen nothing to convince me he's not still a good lynch.
Get you lynched mainly. That post of yours gave me no idea about what is going on with you. You criticize the falling apart of the RC wagon, but at the same time allude to moving your vote, to people who were trying to get RC lynched.Don't see what you try to accomplish by this weak sauce character assassination attempt, really
I dont understand how you can justify the fact that RC is still scum, but at the same time say sea who was trying to get him lynched after the VT claim is scum unless you for whatever reason think it was hardcore bussing.-
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LlamaFluff Jack of All Trades
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@farside - Your interest in mae has been almost primarily activity concerned
Mae = lurking, not offering anything sadly is normal but I have to think if it's just one game I was in with her or more. (will get back to this tomorrow)@Llama: How do you have a town read on Mae who has said very little?
Every time you have been bringing her up, you say she is lurking, and you continutally are challenging town reads on her. I find that when people try and push against town reads it normally is due to a scum read.Mae hasn't said anything that I find helpful or informative so I have no town or scum read. Your assumption that I find her scum without me saying I find her scum is noted.
For the dram thing, you are right. I saw you as one of the bigger voices in the V/LA thing so thought your initial suspicion of his stemmed more from that then what you were voting for. Doesnt change the fact that I dont think dram is a good lynch though.-
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LlamaFluff Jack of All Trades
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this game had her as scum in it. Most of her early game play reads a whole lot different then this one, as there appears to be more of just about everything. While im not saying she is really helpful here, this doesnt match a very recent scum meta of hers. The only concievable difference is it being duel scum in the other game, where some people do play differently.farside22 wrote:First of all you said I called her scummy. Where the quote you show there clearly saying null. I don't see how anyone gets a town read off of someone who voted for omni for weak reason talks about RC and is currently not voting anyone. You stated you saw her in another game (no link to that game) and read her the same there. How so? In what way?
I also disagree that the vote you pointed out is weak. I commented on pretty much the exact same thing in an attempt to force him into contributing to the game as opposed to simply speculating.
Im not saying my meta is rock solid, but this feels really different.As far as I see there isn't much scum hunting, posting, participation or anything that others haven't said. There is one game I can think of that I was in a game with Mae and she was scum who made one post and needed to be replaced so my meta on her is shaky to say the least.-
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LlamaFluff Jack of All Trades
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Yeah I went back and translated some of the bigger ones somewhat recently if for nothing else but to see if gut matched up, which it does. In a 100+ page game I considered page 36 early though, especially given that her first few posts there were catchup ones, and that day one was 49 pages.Ellibereth wrote:
http://www.mafiascum.net/forum/viewtopi ... 83#2188083LlamaFluff wrote:Secret - After about page 10 I never translated anything said in French or Portugeese
MAE replaced in page 36, no?
Also I would hardly consider that early anymore...-
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LlamaFluff Jack of All Trades
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I have seen it work, just doesnt usually.ElectricBadger wrote:
Meh...does this ever actually work? The attempt to get TM to post more was good, at least.LlamaFluff wrote:Dash: TM
Stupid page 15... we are going to need to pick up the pace or im going to have to hardcore lurk at certain times.-
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Vote him with me then, he has a much better chance of being lynched then ani does.VasudeVa wrote:I hate lurkers and lynch them as both policy lynches and scum. TM is next, btw, moving up in scumminess with every "I'm still here" post.-
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The Rules wrote:2b. Each Day will have two-week Deadlines. The Moderator may extend the Deadline by up to a week at the player's request or to accomodate replacements, providing activity has been good.@mod- Request replacement-
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@mod- That should be extension due to replacement, not a replacement for me.-
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tricky trickyEllibereth wrote:LLAMA YOU SCARED ME FOR A SECOND.-
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