Mini 869 - Frat Party Mafia (GAME OVER!)

[DeathRowKitty]

/confirm

BTW, CB is scum.

[DeathRowKitty]

^ See, that was definitely a scum response.

Vote: CB

.

@Town
Anyone who doesn't vote CB before the game starts is obviously his scumbuddy.

[DeathRowKitty]

^ Scumbuddy #1

[DeathRowKitty]

We can lynch Biden after we lynch CB, which should be happening

before

the game starts.

[DeathRowKitty]

BC sure thinks so.

[DeathRowKitty]

No; I just figured it would be harder to get a bandwagon on CB for no reason whatsoever once the game actualy starts. Besides, I wouldn't actually tell you if that was my win condition..

[DeathRowKitty]

Nope. Unfinished business from Mini 807. I don't drink (well I drink non-alcohoolic things, but...you know what I mean).

[DeathRowKitty]

Actually I didn't try to quicklynch you that game. I pushed for a normal speed lynch 3 times. Big difference there. Also, if you think I'm going to put a knife in someone's head, why would you only give me an FoS?

[DeathRowKitty]

Okay, fine, new plan. Lynch Reckoner for being SK.

Unvote, vote: Reckoner

.

[DeathRowKitty]

Vote: canadianbovine

Why not start with him!

Trying to appear as though he's not CB's scumbuddy after not voting him in the pre-gae. Do we need any more proof? Then again, who am I to argue with a CB vote?

Vote: canadianbovine

.

[DeathRowKitty]

CB is scum too and it's much more fun to vote him.

[DeathRowKitty]

Mod, Taranski is voting BC, not CB

[DeathRowKitty]

First thing's first: Good job by Seraphim of finding the third member of the scum team. I'm not sure I would've caught the bussing.

you [NH] are the third vote on me, i believe.

NH, did you know you were the third vote on BC and if not, would you still have voted him if you knew you were?

[DeathRowKitty]

I HAS META ON YOU.

What (if any) is your meta read on me so far? (besides my incessant pushing for the lynch on you for being obvscum)

[DeathRowKitty]

Vote: nhammen

I don't know why, but I just got a private message from the mod telling me nhammen is scum.

[DeathRowKitty]

[sarcasm]Yea, you're right, I must be lying to try to get votes off of CB.[/sarcasm]

[DeathRowKitty]

Obviously, the mod is wrong. We have tagged the scum.

Actually, now that I look back at it, it said "not town", not "scum". Perhaps SK?

[DeathRowKitty]

sarcasm tags just make me appreciate the sarcasm less

Well if not there's always someone who misses the sarcasm. Why aren't you voting nham?

[DeathRowKitty]

Unvote

I've been refreshing my watched topics list fairly obsessively since I posted my guilty result on nham. I was hoping to draw this out until more people had a chance to post, but seeing as I'm out of time for now and don't want to leave the thread unattended a minimum of 6.5 hours, I may as well explain myself.

I did not receive a PM telling me nham wasn't town. The RVS was just completely unproductive (and largely due to my pre-game nonsense) and this was my way to try to get us out. I think it's done that quite nicely.

I'll be back tomorrow (well today, technically) with my thoughts on what transpired. For now, I'll just note that, in addition to what we saw in thread, I noticed CB on the online players list in two seperate instances, but he didn't post (and this is the only game he's in).

[DeathRowKitty]

why are you stalking me.

votes staying on you for that comment.

I'm stalking you because I'm a creep, but this wasn't stalking. While I was watching for posts, I was also refreshing the home page specifically to look for someone who was on but not posting. That person was you.

FoS CB

Why would you want to wait for more people to post if you think the RVS has obviously ended? Why wouldn't you post as soon as your original intent was accomplished?

I figured I'd draw it out as far as possible to try to gauge reactions. Speaking of which...

BloodCovenent

IMO, BC had the scummiest reaction to my saying nham was scum. His first post following the mysterious PM was the following:

Unvote:
Vote: nhammen

Very simple solution here. We lynch Nham, and if he flips town, then DRK dies. If he flips scum, then DRK is either town, or scum that is willing to lose his partner in a gambit.

We need more votes on Nham. Anyone that does not vote him will be labeled his scumbuddy.

I see a few things wrong with this.

1. He immediately assumes I did actually receive said PM, despite the fact that we were still in the RVS and I'd done quite a bit of messing around. By assuming this, he gets to lynch nham and me afterwards for causing the mislynch if he's town. This hinges largely on nham's alignment.
2. The way he calls for the lynch smells of quicklynch, as if he wants to make sure nham is killed before I come in and say I was joking or someone comes in with some sense and says not to lynch nham.
3. He suggests I could be scum gambiting if nham flips scum in a way that makes it sound equally plausible. Of course, that would look bad for scum, unless nham is scum too. It's bad, or at least questionable, coming from either side, but I personally think that over-eager scum would be more likely to say it, possibly to cover all angles.

Then we get this:

I didn't think whoever said that was serious.

even if he is, not gonna quicklynch someone for such a reason.

Scum partner number 1.

Again, ignoring the possibility I was faking and looking for a quicklynch.

This next one really raises some alarms for me:

hmmm, drk, can you confirm that you are being legit and not fuckin around cuz of RVS

dude, quit role fishing.

This post should not be answered, and it is scummy as hell.

I see two HUGE problems with this one:

1. Why shouldn't I answer? Considering I'd already claimed a guilty, if nham flipped scum, then it would be obvious I wasn't faking. If he flipped town and I wasn't serious, then not asking me gives scum an excuse to lynch me Day 2.
2. He tells Taranski not to rolefish. Yes, the person who not-so-subtly implied I was day cop accuses someone of rolefishing.

Not long later, we get this:

even if he is, not gonna

quicklynch

someone for such a reason.

So your saying that you're not willing to lynch Nham at all? Gut activated.

(bolding added)Again, pushing for a quicklynch, this time mistconstruing Tar's post in the process.

Finally, I reveal that I'm faking and BC posts:

I find that anti-town in the sense that it's like giving the implication of a jester. If DRK had truly had a guilty, then Taranski implies that DRK could be a lyncher, or something else, then that attracts the town from the original guilty result, and leads the town to possibly lynch DRK. And it is bad, and very anti-town.


Unvote:
Vote: Taranski

Given that I revealed I didn't have a guilty on nham, this is a really bad post. What BC described is only scummy if nham is scum, and even then, it would be pretty hit or miss. With no longer any reason to believe nhm to be scum, why would BC be voting tar?

Conclusion:

Unvote, vote BloodCovenent

[DeathRowKitty]

I don't, but read his posts and try to argue they look like he's joking. Also, I'd prefer if you didn't give BC a defense...

[DeathRowKitty]

I assume "is" was supposed to be "his."

[DeathRowKitty]

its a compulsive tactic. Honestly things like how I was online twice [DRK has me added on facebook, he could be getting my two logins from there] and didnt make a post in that time. What are you trying to show with that?

I'm stalking you because I'm a creep, but this wasn't stalking. While I was watching for posts, I was also refreshing the home page specifically to look for someone who was on but not posting. That person was you. FoS CB

I saw your name on the online players list twice during that time. It has nothing to do with whether or not you were on facebook.

also why did you lie to exit the RVS?

As much as I enjoy randomly starting bandwagons on you for no reason, the wagons on you and BC weren't getting us anywhere. My "lie" has gotten us somewhere. Are you looking for a LAL policy lynch on me?

[DeathRowKitty]

DRK, if you were being serious about something that you now say didn't happen, to help the game move out of the RVS, why did you let the situation snowball for so long?

The quicker I revealed it was a fake, the fewer reactions we'd get to see.

I find it odd that DRK came back to shift suspicion from nham to CB simply because he was online and didn't post. It doesn't seem very productive and the FoS he gives in 131 just looks like OMGUS. The points he made on BC feel right, though.

I'm not sure how exactly I was shifting suspicion off nham, when the only suspicion on him was from the supposed guilty. Also notice I only devoted a couple of sentences to CB and the rest of my post to BC. The CB thing isn't a big deal as compared with BC, but I also don't think it should be ignored.

This is the only game CB is currently involved in, so if he was online, it's reasonable to assume it was to check this game. I think the fact that he didn't see anything fit to comment on is pretty telling. Let's say for sake of argument BC is scum. I can see three valid reasons CB-scum would see this game and yet not comment (and two if BC isn't scum).

• Not knowing whether or not I was serious, he wouldn't want to commit to either serious or not serious. At the same time, asking if I was serious could get him accused of rolefishing (I do agree though that asking if I was serious isn't actually rolefishing).
• Scum are allowed to daytalk. He might have seen the game and immediately gone to the daytalk to plan out what to do with the situation.
• If BC is scum, CB-scum would be in a difficult position if he decided to post. Either he'd have to ignore BC's blatantly scummy actions or draw unnecessary attention to BC before he was sure we wouldn't be lynching nham.

I also find it interesting how CB responded to my accusation. His response was first that I'm stalking him (which I ttly am) and that he was keeping his vote on me for that and second that I must have seen him on facebook. Basically, he ignored what I said.

Obviously, it's not as strong as the case against BC, but I think it's definitely something to look into.

[DeathRowKitty]

@NM
What do you think of BC?

[DeathRowKitty]

[kitty was on facebook 3 times today.]

[This also means CB was on facebook 3 times before posting in this game.] I had nothing to say in this game. I'm waiting for either BC or NM to show up.

Buuuuuut...if you really want to play the facebook game (oh, did you lose the game?), CB was also on facebook fairly often during the whole BC incident (switched between online and idle a few times). I wasn't going to point that out, but since you feel facebook is relevant, why not

[DeathRowKitty]

DRK, why the FB FOS on CB

I didn't FoS CB for FB activity. That was what he said I FoSed him for.

However, this was not the right play in this situation which is why I think BC is most likely town.

Probably not, but it's debatable. If he'd gotten a quicklynch as scum, I'd probably look bad for not stopping the lynch, moreso than him for starting it.

DRK is a neutral read for me but I would really love to hear what he thinks of the other players on their reactions.

I was going to post them when I posted my BC read, but the post turned out longer than I expected and I forgot to come back to it. I don't have as much time as I should like (early action college application deadline is approaching faster than I expected, but I should be able to get around to a decent length post on that by tomorrow night.

[DeathRowKitty]

I don't have much time to post, so I'll just respond to Seraph's post.

I'm not discounting that CB might be scum but merely discounting any cases based on this ridiculous "Facebook stalking".

FoS: DeathRowKitty for even discussing it as a scumtell.

Okay, you're the second person to bring this up, so I'll assume I didn't post this clearly enough:

I HAVE NOT USED FACEBOOK AT ALL AGAINST CB.

Did you hear me that time? Good. CB brought facebook up as where I probably saw him log in. That had nothing to do with it.

Also, why is it not worth bringing up that he logged in twice and didn't post?

Just like DRK's gambit...hunting for reactions is pro-town only if you look at those reactions.

Not getting around to that today. I've barely been home since this morning and I have more important things to do.

I will have a better case soon.

Looking forward to it. Your last post was barely worth my time.

[DeathRowKitty]

- So you think that i'm over eager scum now? To come up with an idea to out two scum players? The way that your wording it, would only make sense if the three of us were scum together. I know I'm not scum, but you sir, I believe could be.

I never said or implied that.

Again, ignoring the possibility

I was faking and looking for a quicklynch.

Possible scum slip?

I didn't word that particularly well, but it's not hard to figure out what I meant. How about responding to what I said instead of writing it off as a scum slip.

- (1) because he was role fishing, and if you were a power role, unless you wanted to get lynched tonight, you would not have answered.
- (2) you implied it when you said you received a "guilty" result on nham, if you were truly a day cop, i didn't want details divulged.

(1) So you're saying we should have just lynched nham without question based on my claiming a guilty and that if nham had flipped scum, his buddies wouldn't have realized I was a cop? Also, considering you implied I was a daycop, it should have been fairly obvious to anyone who hadn't already figured it out.
(2) Answering if I was serious would have given away details? Considering you seem to think it's so obvious I was implying I was a daycop, what exactly did you think scum wouldn't have figured out?

-Tar said he wasn't going to quick lynch him yes, that's why I asked if he was willing to lynch him at all. It really didn't look like he was going to at all.

Can you explain what gave you that feeling? That's not the feeling I got at all.

Your FOS was for seeing him logged into mafiascum, which is something I hate.

Yea...not the first time I've seen someone say that. What's wrong with bringing something like that up?

[DeathRowKitty]

The only thing I find scummy about BC is his readiness to believe DRK's claim.

Why do you think that's scummier than BC's rolefishing and his push for a quicklynch?

[DeathRowKitty]

You can find the answers to both of your questions in the thread and I don't feel like looking back for specific quotes when you could do so just as easily. If you have specific questions about quotes, ask me that instead. I've made my position clear enough that general questions like the ones you asked are just redundant.

[DeathRowKitty]

@NM
Try reading this.

[DeathRowKitty]

Alright, let's get this ball moving. The first part of the DRK case is his biggest play, his fake guilty result on nhammen. I was thinking hard about it and I have to wonder if DRK's play was actually a joke to begin with. Does anyone else see a possible situation where he made a joke as as scum but then saw that BC had thought it was serious and jumped all over that to frame BC as scum. Or maybe it was an intentional trap? Well, obviously it was a trap but was it a trap set for scum...or for town? Therefore, I'm marking it as a nulltell.

You went through a lot of WIFOM to try to make me look like scum to arrive at the conclusion that it's a null tell (especially since just the fact that either alignment could do that makes it more or less a null tell).

I'm ignoring all of the RVS posts right now up until his claim. Between his claim and his reveal of the truth, it's quite odd. DRK seems to be treating it like an RVS joke which I don't think I noticed before.

How would you have gone about it? That was the best I could come up with on short notice (I planned the trap out less than a minute before I executed it).

This is terrible. I think it's perfectly reasonable for someone to be on the site and not post. Not everyone is as inspired as you who can come up with something to say every time you log on. It's not a scumtell, I don't think it's even worth noting.

No need to resort to sarcastic ad hominem here...I hardly think one would need to be [rainbows and leprechauns and fairies and sunshine]inspired[/inspiration] to make a post about something as crazy as what was going on. I outlined reasons scum might not post and I think it's enough to make CB's actions more likely to come from scum than town. If you don't believe it, then don't find CB suspicious for it. I don't see why people on this site are so against using this as a tell, but whatever. Null tell unless you think I'm making up the fact that I believe in using this as a tell.

IT'S A TRAP! Gagh, this post is terrible too. You have no proof of this at all. The bolded could be translated as "I'm going to look for someone who hasn't posted much and attack while I attack BC." or something similar. Basically, the fact that you FoSed him rather than vote him seems to say to me that you don't take your own "scumtell" too seriously...and that you'll probably end up pushing his wagon tomorrow along with your scumfriends after you get BC mislynched!

I have no proof of what? The fact that CB was online? I'm pretty sure he admitted to it (or addressed the question without answering it in a way that implied he was on the site). Should I post a screenshot for you next time? I must have forgotten to take one this time around. I agree it isn't a particularly strong scumtell and I wouldn't have given even an FoS for it. What made me give the FoS was that in combination with CB's previous post. Also, why would I vote CB when I find BC scummier? You're really trying to stretch nothing here to make it seem like you have a case.

Not to mention he still hasn't posted other reactions which makes me even more sure that IT'S A TRAP set for town players or a cover-up for an RVS action taken too far.

Apparently from the time you made started writing that post to the time you finished, the trap changed from being a null tell (you said it was a null tell at the beginning of your post) to being a scum tell. Interesting. Very interesting. I'm not sacrificing the quality of my college applications to analyze reactions and make you happy. I'll get around to it eventually, but BC was by far that most useful person to analyze.

So, basically, I think that DRK has a high likelyhood of being scum for the above reasons. Basically, he makes his guilty result claim and then proceeds to attack the only town player who bites and tunnels excessively on him while using the amount of times CB has logged onto the site to prepare for his lynch the next day.

So, basically, I think that Seraphim's argument is completely crap for the above reasons. Basically, he speculates about why I made my guilty result claim and then proceeds to assume I made it to catch townies

who genuinely act scummy

who bite and overdramatizes it excessively while using my FoS on CB to say I'm looking for a mislynch to prepare for my lynch the next day.

[DeathRowKitty]

Just wondering, do all 4 of you guys on BC still think he is scum?

I still think so.

oops, sorry tar, i meant DRK instead of you, my bad.

So you think that me and BC are both scum?

I like to call This post, Baiting, by DRK.
-Before this post, I would have considered your actions as a pro-town gambit. No longer do I.
-You expected me to believe that you were faking?

-In this post DRK, why didn't you list the two theories if BC was town? I think that warrants an FoS

These still need looked at/answered.

I thought I did answer, but I'm too lazy to look back through my posts, so I'll answer it now.

1) I expected a bit more hesitation before following me, but what I'm more concerned about is that you

never

considered the possibility I was joking and gave Tar an FoS for questioning whether or not I was serious.
2) My first two reasons still apply if you're town. That's what I was referring to.

Mostly because I felt that he was trying to derail the wagon that wasn't happening. It would have been one thing if the wagon had developed very fast, but I was the only one that jumped on. Isn't it suspicious that after one player gets on a wagon, Tar gets remotely defensive, and won't vote for suggested player? So, what do you think about the matter? Did you really think that Tar would have voted for Nham?

I don't recall him trying to derail the wagon. He had doubts I was serious and asked me about it. I can't speak for Tar, but I assume he didn't want to jump on a wagon he didn't think was serious and was wanted verification first. I don't see how that's an unreasonable stance.

Yea, so when is DRK going to analyze those reactions?

College applications are out of the way for now, so tomorrow or Monday (depends on how much time I have tomorrow).

[quot"BC"]when did you determine that I was role fishing?[/quote]Okay, that's probably not the right word. You strongly hinted I was a daycop and then got on Tar's case for asking if I was serious.

[DeathRowKitty]

Reaction analyzationing time! Thank you for being patient (except those of you that weren't).

Dragonfly13

His first reaction is that I'm "obviously lying" and his only other post says that he's never heard of a mod sending a PM revealing a player's alignment. I find it weird that he seems almost angry about my vote in his first post, but it looks to me like he wasn't serious.

Verdict

- Very, very, very slightly scummy based on reaction to my claim. Essentially no read.

Nachomamma8

It seems he never quite took the situation too seriously. He made a couple of joking comments (The mod is wrong! We already caught the scum!). What I find most odd is that even after BC went all serious, NM was talking to BC as if it were a joke (which I believe he later accredited to believing BC was joking).

He says in this post that "lyncher/traitor" isn't too farfetched," which seems odd when combined with the fact that he seemed to be taking the whole situation as a joke. If he assumed my claim was a joke, then why would he have any reason to believe lyncher/traitor was plausible? He then accepted BC's explanation of why Tar was scummy for bringing up lyncher/traitor (the reasoning was that if I had been serious about my guilty, bringing up lyncher/traitor could get my lynched instead), which is based entirely on the fact that nham is scum. I find it odd that neither of them realized they were assuming nham was scum. Perhaps nham is scum along with one or both of them and they didn't realize there assumptions? Perhaps they're both scum who didn't have to stop and consider who could be scum and didn't realize they were making an assumption? Both or at least one town, both of whom just didn't realize it? Only time will tell.

Verdict

- Scummy response (second scummiest for response IMO (BC being first)

Taranski

Personally, I think he had the most level-headed response to the whole situation. He at first assumed I was joking, without making a big deal out of it or going out of his way to show he thought it was some crazy joke. I don't see anything wrong with his asking if I was serious and it seems like a very natural reaction. If he really didn't believe I was serious but saw BC getting all worked up about it, it would make sense to ask me if I was serious and I would hardly call it rolefishing.

His comment about lynchers/traitors is interesting. It can definitely be viewed as anti-town, but I don't think it is unless nham flips scum.

I never got that idea BC was talking about that Tar wouldn't have voted for nham under any circumstances. He did say that regardless of whether or not I was serious, he wouldn't quicklynch and given that he didn't think I was serious, it would make no sense to vote nham.

Result

- Towniest response of anyone who commented

[DeathRowKitty]

Seraphim, I expect either an unvote or a strong response from you SOON. You made a crappy case on me, I shot it down, and then you disappeared...from this game, not from the site.

---

Also, I have meta-based reasons to believe CB/whoever's replacing him is scum. This probably sounds like a cheap shot now that he's repalced out, but I initially planned on waiting until we were a significant portion of Day 1 to iso-read CB to avoid confirmation bias from early posts (RVS posts aren't necessarily very reliable), but since he's replaced out and I won't get any more posts to analyze, I did that now.

@Whoever's replacing CB
What do you think of your replacee's posts?

[DeathRowKitty]

Mod, has Seraphim been prodded and if so, has he picked up the prod?

[DeathRowKitty]

The game seems to have stalled. More BC lynching is what this game needs.

[DeathRowKitty]

We should...but quicklynches are so much more fun!

The call for a quicklynch wasn't actually serious, although a lynch at some point in the next four days would be nice.

Besides, hohum's play inspired me. Now, I just need to create an alt to replace into the game with.

[DeathRowKitty]

I'm not a town power role, but I thinking lynching me is dumb. Thinking that I am scummy because of how i reacted is dumb. Granted, lynching me will yield the most information, but I'd rather not die, since I think I can still help the town.

Plain and simple, I'm vanilla town. Unfortunately, my tools have been ineffective.

Hmm...AtE. Textbook scum tell. But for some odd reason, I've seen townies use it more often than scum. Meh, I'd have trouble using it as anything but a null tell.

@BC
Who are your top three or four suspects.

[DeathRowKitty]

AtE is not a valid scum-tell. Get your head out of wiki.

I think it can be given the right circumstances. I agree it isn't in this case (which is why I called it a null tell).

[DeathRowKitty]

What makes DRK so obv town to you?

Yes, I'm answering for Kise, but that's not what he said. My voters can all look bad for their reasoning without me being obvtown.

[DeathRowKitty]

I'd prefer there be as little (defending of / answering for) other players as possible. More information can be gained when players defend themselves. Also, isn't the point of asking someone a question in this game usually to get a read on their behavior? That can't really happen when people start doing the work for other players.

That's true (I generally try not to answer for other players), but I find it hard to avoid when I see misrepresentations that I think were clear and especially when it involves me.

[DeathRowKitty]

Kise, do you consider DRK's "cop" investigation thing pro-town, or anti-town. Why or why not?

You seem to have forgotten to include "it's a null tell" as an option...almost as if you're trying to get him to pick a "wrong" answer.

[DeathRowKitty]

My point isn't what you considered it to be. My point is that you gave him no middle ground (false dichotomy). Regardless of what he picks you can make it look bad (or at least try to). If he says it's anti-town, then you ask why he thinks my voters are suspicious. If he says it's pro-town, you bring up your arguments for why you say it's anti-town. Also, you didn't actually ask about my reaction to your reaction. You asked about my "investigation thing."

[DeathRowKitty]

Deadline's tomorrow 5PM and no one can be lynched without someone hammering. Basically, anyone not voting BC, vote him ASAP before we lose a lynch.

[DeathRowKitty]

I'm not defending him, nor did I answer the question for him. The question is still open...except now it's not subject to a false dichotomy. I notice you didn't comment on whether or not I was right about it being a false dichotomy and istead decided to accuse me of answering for him, when I never gave you his opinion.

No, your question wasn't about "baiting" and I don't know what you want me to respond to. Regardless of my alignment, my answer is no, I wasn't trying to bait townies. Satisfied?

[DeathRowKitty]

[icebreaker]Okay, that didn't work out so well (yes, I just stated the obvious). I also have to wonder why fjlkwefiasecjklasdfjowierncaewsf was killed, but I've been told in more than one game not to speculate about that in game (which is too bad because I enjoy speculation), so I'll resist the temptation to go through rampant speculation.[/icebreaker]

I'm interested in hearing from our replacements right now.

@Replacements
What did your read tell you and did the two flips change your opinions on anything in particular?

[DeathRowKitty]

DRK, BC WAS CONVINCED THAT YOU WERE SCUM! WHAT DO YOU HAVE TO SAY TO THAT.

Given that he ended up flipping town, I guess I can see why he would have a biased read on me. Other than that, all I can really say about it is that I'm not scum.

[DeathRowKitty]

@NM
I mean that since he's town, he probably felt his play was completely optimal and that I was scum trying to attack a perfectly rational response.

---

Where is everyone?

[DeathRowKitty]

Vote: OGML

[DeathRowKitty]

He hasn't been posting. He could use a few votes. Besides, nothing like a healthy bandwagon to get things going.

[DeathRowKitty]

I was in Mini 807 with the rest of everyone else and CB's actions aren't a surprise.

I disagree. In that game, he made a few stupid mistakes (thinking someone was at L-2 when he actually wasn't, revoting after his unvote, misquoting himself, etc.). In this game, he didn't make any stupid mistakes. He just made questionable posts.

Also, does "the rest of everyone else" refer to me and the

SK

vig?


Reactions to anything else coming later. No time now.

[DeathRowKitty]

A lot of posts suddenly. I'll try to catch up on this thread from school, but no guarantees.

[DeathRowKitty]

It's the kind of response that feels very forced, and is the 'appropriate' way for scum disbelieving the claim, but mildly anxious nonetheless to deal with it. Play it off as a joke, and wedge it between a lot of other information in a post, to downplay it's importance.

I didn't notice this at all the first time around (partly because I was too focused on BC's reaction), but I can see some sense in this. Then again, I do think that there wasn't necessarily a good response for nham to what I did, but I also think there were plenty of "less bad" responses he could have made.

On DeathRowKitty

I do like his case on BC in Post 131.

I'm a bit confused about this. At other points in your post, you disagreed with major points from my case when others brought them up.

I also thought SB was stretching quite a bit with her case on Tar and I really didn't like her buddying up to the dead townie.

Vote: Starbuck

.

DRK:

Obviously, you missed my point completely. I wanted to point out to BC that if he took your first post seriously and actually show that he did, he might want to avoid using the same reasoning as someone before him who was joking. Do you understand that much?

Wait, who used different reasoning on the BC case? One person, maybe two? If you're going to call agreeing with Taran buddying, then you have a few more people on that same wagon to look at.

Was this supposed to be directed at SB?

As for Starbuck, I have my reasons.

Only in a game modded by Reckoner

Update to this, my Great Grandmother passed last night and I got the call a bit after I posted this.

Sorry to hear that

[DeathRowKitty]

OK, I've been using some information without revealing all of it. Every scum I have caught is only 3. So when I say "every scum I've caught" I am over-exaggerating. And two of them gave off practically every tell there is (and half the town still disagreed with me). Now that I think of it, I'm not sure if EtR voted without reasons in Stars Aligned. I would have to look back.

What good did your "over-exaggerating" do you and why did you bother exaggerating in the first place?

Dragonfly -- 3 votes in 17 posts, or 1 in every 6.33 posts

The number of votes isn't that many, but the frequency of vote change is high enough to be suspicious IMO.

Reduces the FoS by 3/8s

Hoopla's analysis of this leads me to the opposite conclusion. You're really stretching things with this one.

@SW
What do you think of Starbuck?

[DeathRowKitty]

o_o

I typed up a post yesterday that apparently I never submitted. Sorry about my recent inactivity (second wave of college apps). I'll have a decent post up in a couple of hours (I'm not sure I have enough time right now).

[DeathRowKitty]

I hate reconstructing posts, so this will probably be rather brief.

@ DRK: I like SB, seems pro-town enough for me. SB and Hoopla are my two pro-towns.

I asked this because I saw a possible connection between SW and SB (and I was already suspicious of SB). I'll probably dig it up tomorrow.

If he reveals the reasons later

And if he doesn't?

We wagon him, duh

I don't have a problem with the reasons given this for the vote, but I'm not so sure the conclusion is solid. If SW is suspicious of Kise, it's a bit odd for him to be suspicious of nham for being suspicious of Kise.

Out of time for now. Will finish tomorrow.

[DeathRowKitty]

I have no scum meta...

What do you mean by "no scum meta?" I know you've played as scum before.

Um...

Unvote; Vote: No Lynch

A lot of us seem to have gone. We can quicklynch someone when we're all together -- even if it's me. Just let me have some time to make posts.

Speaking of your scum meta...where have I seen this before? (Hint: it was in the game I played with you in which you were scum). Why would you vote no lynch? If you don't want us to lynch yet, you could have just unvoted. Why would you vote for a no lynch?

if you give me a good reason why i should do so, I will. Gladly.

Good case = saberwolf lynch

need any more motivation?

This.

- I like DeathRowKitty's early play, but he is also experienced enough to employ this as a scum tactic to hide behind. After he stopped coming under suspicion he has done very little.

College apps + poor time management. Sorry.

---

Right now, I'd be okay with lynches of the following people (in some order):

Starbuck
saberwolf
Kise
Nachomamma
Seraphim

[DeathRowKitty]

Apparently, I never read groinhammer's posts closely enough. Let's look back at GH's posts for a minute.

Post 0 - Confirmation Post
Post 1 - Random Vote on BC
Post 2 -

wow -only been away a day & look what happens!

I see an certain amount of scumminess coming from a few people, but it's still too confusing so say so for sure. I am however, quite happy with my vote sticking on BloodCovenent - even ignoring pre gamestart strangeness: vote-hopping, self voting = not very pro-town.

(btw I love the fact that he got so annoyed that he had to post a picture saying so=)

This came after the whole nham incident, but instead of commenting on any of that, he mentions BC's early game vote hopping (not AT ALL a scumtell in RVS (arguably it isn't one later on, but that's another story)) and his self-voting (also not a scum tell but this one is arguable). The big thing that stuck out for him in that whole incident is the cat picture. Also notice the whole "Lots of people are scummy, but I'm not sure if they're scum!" thing.

Post 3 - I'm going to paste most of his post in pieces for this one:

As I said before, taking pre-game voting as RVS, BC (not CB) starts by voting BC, then quickly switches to DRK as an OMGUS. Then we have what I can only assume is a joke post

CB. Claim or die.

I'm guessing it was made just to confuse things.

We then have the truely weird self vote which is a 101 scumtell! Even if he is town, then by doing this means we have to lynch just b/c he's going to be deliberately confusing.

So, let's see if I have this straight. Let's assume that pre-game voting was random voting. BC OMGUS'ed during random voting, which of course is scummy. He then makes a RVS joke, which by its nature confuses us, and is therefore scummy. He then votes himself, an offense so heinous we should lynch him regardless of his alignment!

The last thing that I'm having problems with isn't the challenge:

show me the confirmation. If you were a day cop, and truly investigated me, then you would not be calling me confirmed scum.

but the cat picture response of 'BACDAFUKUP' {lolz}.

Don't think I actually need to say anything about this one.

It looks very much like he's just happy to have his vote on BC, whether or not there's a reason for it and possibly because it was the biggest wagon at the time. If GH is scum, it could also implicate Taranski-scum, but that connection really isn't clear-cut.

Doesn't make SW look very good. Considering moving my vote, but I'd like to analyze SW's posts a little first. Out most of the day (Happy Thanksgiving everyone!), but should be back by tonight.

[DeathRowKitty]

After reading certain things, I've come to the obvious conclusion of a saberwolf, Starbuck, nhammen scum team. Discuss.

[DeathRowKitty]

Vote: Kise

No time for a decent post, sorry.

[DeathRowKitty]

DRK and saberwolf both picked up their prods, so I don't know what their deal is.

RL is forcing me to be inactive until Friday. Sorry.

Time to point out the obvious: there were two kills last night. If a vig was responsible, he/she shouldn't have killed last night because it put us at an even number. Considering that if somoene is a town-aligned killing role, THAT SOMEONE SHOULDNT' KILL UNLESS ABSOLUTELY CERTAIN (which probably shouldn't happen with our cop dead), I'm in favor of a vig claim if there's a vig in this game.

What's everyone else's top suspects?

Well, with SB flipping town, my biggest scum read is out of the game. Currently, my top pick for scum is Seraphim. I agree with Tar though about posting top suspects. With only 6 players left and assuming 3 mafia at the start, giving a top 3 makes things too easy for scum.

[DeathRowKitty]

Wow, really Tar? Here are your posts so far today:

1. You say it's either lylo or mylo and now you actually have to scumhunt. Makes me wonder what you've been doing the rest of the game.
2. "also, ideas on whether we should mass claim?"
3. "i think imma still follow hoopla"
4. You quoted a few of Hoopla's posts.
5. You say we shouldn't "prematurely vote" in case scum pile on for the quicklynch. First of all, I highly doubt there are enough scum for that. Second of all, you voted saber for making an unhelpful post thinking it was possible scum could quicklynch?!
6. You say you won't post your top 3 suspects and tell everyone to check in.
7. "more posts please"
8. You vote saber for making an "unhelpful post."

FoS Tar

That whole thing about using HL's posts for scumhunting makes it sound like you want to hide behind HL's analysis and your saber vote is horribly weak.

[DeathRowKitty]

Okay, there's too much setup speculation going on and it looks like it's starting to distract us too much. I'm

One-Shot Vigilante

and for some reason, I decided it would be a good idea to kill last night (I somehow miscounted players ). I killed SB, in case it wasn't obvious from my suspicions of her Day 2.

@NM
Any particular reason you say SW is scum?

@SW
What do you think of Seraphim?

[DeathRowKitty]

Of course we all know what a horrible liar DRK has been in the past

Are you referring to the whole cop incident? If so, I would like to point out that that has absolutely no bearing here. Unless you're suggesting that I'm a townie lying about being a vig, the fact that I pulled that Day 1 should make no difference now. If you don't trust me, that's fine; that's just not a good reason not to trust me.

I agree with a no lynch, but I was hoping we'd wait to do anything about it. Even the suggestion tends to bring things to a grinding halt. No one should hammer the no lynch until dramonic has read the thread and given opinions on everyone. If he's scum (which I wouldn't doubt), no lynching now gives him an easy out on giving an opinion on whoever dies N3.

[DeathRowKitty]

Hmm...intersting...

I iso'd Kise and DF11 to look at their interactions. You (yes, you!) should try it too. What you see may shock you.

[DeathRowKitty]

Did no one actually check the iso's??? How hard is it to iso DF and search for "kise" and then search Kise's iso for "dragon" or "DF"???

(Note: If my calling Dragonfly13 "DF11" confused anyone, please note I use base 12 whenever possible.)

DRK, explain your case.

Not a case. Something a bit odd going on between you and Kise. It would be nice if anyone would actually look for it...it loses some of its excitement if I give away the surprise.

[DeathRowKitty]

Guess I'll ruin the surprise then:

THEY ALMOST COMPLETELY IGNORED EACH OTHER

.

Kise mentioned DF by name (I searched "DF" and "dragon") a grand total of 6 times this game, two of which were part of a response to someone directly asking him what he thought of DF. In terms of DF mentioning Kise, just about the same exact thing.

[DeathRowKitty]

I consider this to be a pretty decent scumtell. I used the same thing here Day 1 to successfully call 2/3 scum (although admittedly it's not as drastic in this case). Unfortunately, one of them was never lynched...

Also, I would like to direct your attention to this post.

[DeathRowKitty]

Whoa, whoa, easy on the misrep. You're not just suspicious because Kise igored you. You're suspicious because you and Kise ignored each other. Is there anyone else you ignored to that extent? Also, Kise wasn't a huge lurker and was the focus of a lot of discussion Day 2, yet you still didn't mention him.

[DeathRowKitty]

I already found one person. Your turn.

[DeathRowKitty]

@DF
Where is this going??? Are you accidentally being anti-town and uncooperative or does that go along with being scum?

I found someone you had minimal interaction with. The interactions you did have can easily be seen as bussing. I'm saying it's scummy. You said you ignore people who don't contribute and I asked you for an example, which you've failed to deliver. I'm not making your defense for you and I don't know why you want me to.

So where's this going? Assuming people are still reading this thread (cough cough), hopefully this will actually be addressed.

I also find it interesting that dramonic seems to be defending you, especially considering that Seraphim was scummy before he replaced out.

@dramonic
Any reason you feel the need to defend DF? Do you find it scummy that Kise and DF ALMOST COMPLETELY ignored each other?

@Everyone else
Opinions, please.

[DeathRowKitty]

First of all, I never said I was making a case. Second of all, I told everyone to look for it themselves. That's not "blatantly waiting 24 hours." That's assuming that people are still willing to attempt to scumhunt and I'll be very sad if we've given up on that.

That said, I'll admit I blew this out of proportion (and intentionally). Basically, I was hoping to gauge reactions before we threw the day away to a no lynch. Your reaction was ridiculously anti-town. Scummy? Meh, that's debatable, but you definitely jumped up a notch or two in scumminess IMO. As for wanting you to pick out someone else you've ignored, I figure it gives us A LOT of information if you're scum. If you gave one name, I would have assumed that if you were scum, that one person wasn't your buddy (I already knew there were multiple others you could mention). The fact that you mentioned three tells me that if you're scum, your buddy is probably in that list.

Basically, we'll see.

(Note: I assumed there are scum left for balance purposes because I know I'm not SK.)

[DeathRowKitty]

EBWOP: I assumed there are

two

scum left

[DeathRowKitty]

So, DRK. Since you seem a big fan of reaction hunting, what did you gather on everyone ese's reactions?

Not much. It made DF a bit scummier in my mind with dramonic his most likely partner if he's scum. Your reaction didn't tell me much of anything and everyone else ignored it the situation completely.

[DeathRowKitty]

Bah! I'm dead! Go town!

[DeathRowKitty]

Meh, town lost. I probably should have waited to claim vig, but nothing I can do about that now.

and it didn't help that the people that reacted the WORST to DRK's retarded gambit, were town.

You mean yourself? No hard feelings about day 1, BC?

This is the second game I've been in where the whole ignoring each other tell could have caught 2 scum. Between the two games, one of those 4 scum has been lynched.

Oh, and sorry about vigging you Starbuck. I thought you were scummy and I figured I wouldn't be able to convince the town to lynch you.

Anyways, thanks for your great modding Reckoner...except the part where people thought I was SK. That was just too much irony for me.

[DeathRowKitty]

Meh, town lost. I probably should have waited to claim vig, but nothing I can do about that now.

and it didn't help that the people that reacted the WORST to DRK's retarded gambit, were town.

You mean yourself? No hard feelings about day 1, BC?

This is the second game I've been in where the whole ignoring each other tell could have caught 2 scum. Between the two games, one of those 4 scum has been lynched.

Oh, and sorry about vigging you Starbuck. I thought you were scummy and I figured I wouldn't be able to convince the town to lynch you.

Anyways, thanks for your great modding Reckoner...except the part where people thought I was SK. That was just too much irony for me.