Mini #764: Notre Dame Mafia, Game Over

[DrippingGoofball]

Alright, it took a little while, but I get how the game works. *I think*

I agree with this post of ortolan's: http://www.mafiascum.net/forum/viewtopi ... 74#1567874
There are several posts from charter later on that continue within that vein.
2 scumpoints to charter.

I suspect ortolan of early distancing, the way he's so in-tune with charter's feelings.
1 scumpoint to ortolan

Kinetic is doing good work trying to figure out some of the mechanics.
1 townpoint for Kinetic

I VERY MUCH like this Kast post: http://www.mafiascum.net/forum/viewtopi ... 39#1568539 - even though Kinetic thinks Kast is wrong.
1 townpoint for Kast

charter's vote on Kast is a little scummy.
1 scumpoint to charter

This post: http://www.mafiascum.net/forum/viewtopi ... 55#1569755 is uber scummy.
2 scumpoints for Ace

"I agree that defensive drafting of plague cards is not an anti-town move. I could even understand if a townie took a plague card with the intention to use it as a vigilante." I'm not sure what to think here.
1 scumpoint Kast

Budja's response to Kast is pretty pro-town.
1 townpoint Budja

SPECIAL NOTE: http://www.mafiascum.net/forum/viewtopi ... 36#1570236 charter may be scum with ABR. ABR gets a scumpoint if charter flips scum.

Another townpoint to Kinetic for post #84. I'm also seeing Kinetic's point that Kast might have been warning his buddies through daytalk.
1 townpoint Kinetic

This post is scum extreme: http://www.mafiascum.net/forum/viewtopi ... 14#1575414
1 scum point ABR

This other post is scum extreme: http://www.mafiascum.net/forum/viewtopi ... 87#1575787
1 scumpoint Ace

Votes Kinetic? http://www.mafiascum.net/forum/viewtopi ... 02#1576602
1 scumpoint Ace

ortolan's #137 very townie.
1 townpoint

zwet is 100% confirmed town for asking IN-THREAD how to best utilize his cards. No way in heck that scum would do that EVER.
5 townpoints to zwet

And ABR wants to lynch zwet?
1 scumpoint ABR

SPECIAL NOTE: Ace, charter and ABR all vote zwet??? Hahaha, scumbags. They're afraid of zwet.

Posts 154+155 and walls of text by Kast are town.
1 townpoint Kast

For voting Kinetic, Ace gets a scumpoint
1 scumpoint Ace

ABR keeps focusing on zwet. Way not to give out the rest of the buddies!
1 scumpoint ABR

Ace tries to find out what zwet will use hisi cards for. Fish!
1 scumpoint Ace

ABR tries to policy-lynch zwet out of desperation.
1 scumpoint ABR

Ace triest to slow down ABR.
1 townpoint Ace

SPECIAL NOTE: Re post #257 - ABR and ortolan are not scum together.

Budja's #292, very townie!
1 townpoint Budja

charter votes Budja???
1 scumpoint charter

CTD's post is reasonably townie.
1 townpoint CTD

Budja's #343 is SUPER town.
1 townpoint Budja

CTD's 346 is SUPER town as well!
1 townpoint CTD

zwet' 353, town yo!
1 townpoint

Several posts by Ace surprise me, they are more pro-townish than anything he's posted so far.
1 townpoint Ace

ABR has fear, FEAR of zwet.
1 scumpoint ABR

SPECIAL NOTE: http://www.mafiascum.net/forum/viewtopi ... 44#1609444 if Ace flips scum, both zwet and ABR are town.
1 scumpoint Ace

I like this from ortolan: "My candidates are mainly AM, ABR, Budja and zEEnon at present." - that's very well in line with my observations.
1 townpoint ortolan

This from charter is pretty awful: 'ABR has just been useless. Haven't seen anything scummy from him.'
1 scumpoint charter

This from Ace, http://www.mafiascum.net/forum/viewtopi ... 17#1614417, and the post he made before that are townish.
1 townpoint Ace

CTD's vote of BUdja is opportunistic.
1 scumpoint SCTD

charter *****
ABR *****
Ace $$$*******
CTD $$*
Kast $$*
ortolan $**
Kinetic $$
Budja $$$
zwet $$$$$$

[DrippingGoofball]

No scummy reasons for replacing out, I simply don't want to bring outside grudges into friendly games.

I ain't got grudges against anyone.

This being said, this is definitely a scumbag that doesn't want to suffer the humiliation of being caught by me, in addition to his palpable fear of zwet's cards, and his careful avoidance of tying himself to anyone else, I say ABR's recently vacated player slot is scum.

[DrippingGoofball]

To sum it all up, so far, I'd be behind a lynch of either ABR's replacement or charter.

You can check out Medieval Mafia (just finished) where a player rage quit on me, because I was saying he was scum. Well guess what. He was scum. His replacement got a bit of a break, even though his predecessor was scummy beyond belief.

When scumbags feel caught be a player they don't like, they often skedaddle. For instance, ABR may not like zwet, (though he violently feared zwet's cards), but he didn't leave the game, because ABR categorized zwet as an 'easy lynch' while I'm more of an unpredictable player that will pick up his scent if he's scum.

[DrippingGoofball]

No scummy reasons for replacing out, I simply don't want to bring outside grudges into friendly games.

Since you're still here, maybe you can explain how YOU bringing a grudge against zwet in this game, and rendering it decidedly unfriendly, doesn't contradict the statement: "I simply don't want to bring outside grudges into friendly games?"

It's very unfair to PJ, to boot.

I was perfectly willing to find you 'town' in this game if your behavior warranted it. Regrettably, it did not.

[DrippingGoofball]

DGB, how is my vote on Budja opportunistic?

Also, can you provide a reasonably recent game of yours where you replaced in as town, please?

It's the timing of your vote, and the fact that I view Budja as townish, and the people pushing his lynch as scummish.

I haven't replaced in a while, let me see if I can find something for you.

[DrippingGoofball]

When scumbags feel caught be a player they don't like, they often skedaddle.

So you're saying that I predicted that you would go after me as soon as you replaced in, and I preemptively replaced out before you started attacking me? You're making me out to be quite the clever guy here.

He had to know I'd be on to him if he were scum.

[DrippingGoofball]

@ CTD

I did a lot of replacements in New York as "Toaster Strudel"

http://www.mafiascum.net/forum/viewtopic.php?t=9065
http://www.mafiascum.net/forum/viewtopic.php?t=8020
http://www.mafiascum.net/forum/viewtopic.php?t=5779

[DrippingGoofball]

So you don't think I should have moved my vote to someone on my suspicion list that had a reasonable chance of getting lynched as opposed to leaving it on a somewhat stagnant wagon one day before deadline? Or is that what you find opportunistic about it?

I don't recall mentions of looming deadlines in your post, but PJ is going to postpone the deadline on account of replacements, so yeah, I'm not crazy about that vote. You could have fought harder for your favorite lynch candidate. It was worth one scumpoint, which puts you in the middle of the pack until further actions. I'm not sure where the defensiveness comes from.

[DrippingGoofball]

I also replaced in Thespival as "Beep! Beep!" - that was a large theme.

[DrippingGoofball]

One thing I figured is that you couldn't have spent a whole lot of time reading, at least when it comes to my posts. Not only did I make more than one specific mention of the looming deadline in the very post I voted Budja in, you'd also know that I've been suspicious of Budja ever since I've first read the game and that he therefore isn't just an emergency lynch for me. I am perfectly content lynching him, just as I would be perfectly content lynching a bunch of other people.

I wrote "

I don't recall

mentions of looming deadlines in your post," but I didn't check because it was not that important. More crucial is that I believe Budja to be town, and, secondarily, is the timing and the fact that PJ is postponing the deadline.

[DrippingGoofball]

I'm not interacting with DGB. It's a new policy I am enacting across the site. It's regrettable she came into this game, because if her and zwet aren't scum, now it's 5v7, so today would be LYLO.

Another caught scum!

[DrippingGoofball]

It's regrettable she came into this game, because if her and zwet aren't scum, now it's 5v7, so today would be LYLO.

What do you mean, today would be LYLO?

[DrippingGoofball]

Another AtE? Really?

AtE is a Wikitell.

I don't subscribe to AtE as a scumtell. I'd rather examine the reaction and judge whether or not it's genuine.

[DrippingGoofball]

AtE just bugs the hell out of me.

It's often the best way to gauge a player's alignment.

[DrippingGoofball]

Wait, didn't you just say it wasn't a reliable tell?

No, I said it wasn't an automatic SCUMtell. It depends on the contents. Sometimes it's a SCUMtell, sometimes it's a TOWNtell.

[DrippingGoofball]

@DGB-
Interesting assessments. Do you care to elaborate on any of them, or are they each assumed to be obvious? Your system itself seems to give breaks to lurkers/low-content posters.

You're right about the lurker break, but since I was not "in the moment" to question and challenge the players myself, I use the system mostly to find people I trust, and obvscum. Any player that doesn't fall in my trusted/obvscum categories is guaranteed a vigorous grilling by me at some point because every player needs the light shined on him/her.

Also, prior to your announcement as a replacement, I already asked ABR to consider replacing instead of screwing the town by his out-of-game grudge against Zwet. I assumed his comment was directed at that.

No, it seems he recently developed a grudge against me, too! He thinks I "enable" zwet but really, I can read zwet like a book, he's totally transparent. In 5 minutes or less, I know whether he's obvtown or obvscum.

Your assessment of my posts clearly marks a difference in opinion between yourself and KidIcarus. Still, could you clarify whether you feel my posts had any significant effect on the value of a mass card claim for the town.

I don't know if it did, but it doesn't matter either way. The conclusion I've drawn from your exchange with Kinetic is that Kinetic is almost certainly town, and that you're probably town.

BTW I got a strong Budja town feel all around. Did I miss something particularly scummy???

[DrippingGoofball]

charter - What exactly is your problem with DGB?

We had a game where I was scum, and he was town. I wasn't sympathetic to his pleas of being townie, imagine that, and of course he was right when he pegged me as mafia... I may be wrong, but since I've rarely played with charter, I can't imagine what else it could be.

[DrippingGoofball]

because if her and zwet aren't scum, now it's 5v7, so today would be LYLO.

What does THAT mean???

[DrippingGoofball]

11 rubs me wrong. In it, he completely evades the direct, obvious, and contextual meaning of AM's post so that he can question/suspect AM (but then drops this with nary a word). He also clarifies that he did not actually agree with Zwet's comment, but had a completely different reason for calling AM scummy over the "slip". I find this very suspicious and looks like he was just saying he agreed with Zwet without actually meaning it.

12 attempts to evade this discrepancy between his claim to agree with Zwet, and actually giving a completely different reason.

24 uses straw men to argue against my suggestion that Zwet first Double, then Plague. He also chooses to go with an ineffective policy vote right before going V/LA.

I'm really not seeing this as scummy, especially compared to other players that have behaved far scummier, ABR comes to mind.

I think Charter was pretty clearly implying that he thinks Zwet+DGB will vote together with scum and are effectively traitors. 3 mafia+Zwet+DGB = 5 mafia. 5/12 means the town is in LYLO. Charter, feel free to correct me if I misunderstood that. I think it is pretty much craplogic, but then, I think he wasn't intending that to be rational and more an expression of frustration.

I never would have guessed this, but you're probably right. It's not because I find it ridiculously easy to pin down zwet's alignment that I'm going to trust his scumdar and vote with him, nor is he likely to vote with me, either.

Now that you mention this, I think it would annoy charter mostly if charter was scum, and feared that I might tunnel on him, and with zwet in tow, act like a double voter.

Failing an ABR/replacement lynch, I'd lynch charter way ahead of Budja.

[DrippingGoofball]

I might as well vote at this point.

unvote, vote: charter

[DrippingGoofball]

Excellent.

unvote, vote: Ace

[DrippingGoofball]

Gah! charter makes the needle on my scumdar swing to the right, swing to the left, swing to the right... I want to vote him again.

[DrippingGoofball]

Now I think charter is town again.

[DrippingGoofball]

I mean, my top choice really is ABR's vacated player slot...

[DrippingGoofball]

You think charter is town... because he's given up? What? >>;;

It's not the "what" it's the "how."

There's no rush to lynch, since we're awaiting replacements. I hope to see a larger sample of charter to enable me to be more firm/consistent in my read.

unvote

[DrippingGoofball]

- I don't like the way her list is vaguely similar to mine but with some players entirely reversed. I disagree with her top two scum suspects (ABR is neutral, charter is town) and don't possibly see how she could be so sure of Budja being innocent (or zwet for that matter, not that I've seen anything scummy from him).

I absolutely don't see ABR as neutral at all. And again, zwet is so transparent, you know his alignment within the first 5 posts, so roughly 25 words. I'm in a lot of games, which means I'm in a lot of games with zwet.

I don't like her top two suspects being people she has claimed history with (with ABR it's obvious from the fact he replaced out/what I've read and charter's claim in 471 illustrates there's some history there also).

I wished that I could have been able to mend fences with ABR by finding him town, and not bothering him all game. Unfortunately, I believe that hiding behind a policy lynch and not considering any alternative agruments is very scummy.

As for charter... I personally have no history with charter, though clearly he has history with me. But that's complete news to me; and until he made that post, I had no idea that there were any electrons spinning the wrong way between the both of us. I mean, I was scum in the game we played, and he was town. So of course I was obtuse, that's part of fulfilling the wincon. It was absolutely not personal. Go check it for yourself, the game is RagingRabbit's "Really Deep South." There is also another ongoing game, with a similar situation, so that's 2 for 2, me being scum, and charter being town.

- I don't like[blah blah blah]

You may not like it, but that's what I think.

"I agree that defensive drafting of plague cards is not an anti-town move. I could even understand if a townie took a plague card with the intention to use it as a vigilante." I'm not sure what to think here.1 scumpoint Kast

Why?

Something in the wording sounded like it could be manufacturing excuses for scum to take anti-town cards. The point is technically correct. It's a little too strong. But overall I find Kast to be pro-town, so the point is a very small one. When I do these analyses, I don't dismiss a possible scumpoint because I have an earlier town read. After everything is tallied up, then I can look back and say "given everything else, it probably isn't a scumpoint." Don't forget I'm replacing, and analysing old interactions that I wasn't personally involved in.

SPECIAL NOTE: Ace, charter and ABR all vote zwet??? Hahaha, scumbags. They're afraid of zwet.

There's several of these. Very good chance DGB is sucking up to zwet in the knowledge he's town (because she's scum).

Seriously. What's more likely? Ace, charter and ABR being afraid of zwet, or me coming in as replacement, and sucking up to zwet (I mean, really, I don't have to, he can't read me and he's not even trying).

This from charter is pretty awful: 'ABR has just been useless. Haven't seen anything scummy from him.' 1 scumpoint charter

I wonder why this is awful. It does accord entirely with what I think, for example. ABR's given us nothing but null-tells.

The situation reminds me of Medieval Mafia, where TSQ ragequit because I caught him being scum. No one believed me. But TSQ (like ABR) thinks I'm an idiot, and fancy themselves geniuses. They think they're playing a perfect game, fooling me. When TSQ went rabid after zwet, refused to listen to reason, and screamed for a quicklynch, I was pretty sure he was scum. And all the players kept saying, like you do, oh, it's a null-tell, he just doesn't like zwet, blah blah. Although no one supported me, I continued to hound TSQ. And he hated the fact that an idiot like me caught him being scum with retarded scumtells so much, that he quit. And still no one believed me he was scum, because they ascribed his behavior to personal issues. Similarly, I believe that you are all very wrong to ignore strong clues about a player's alignment because these clues are scumtells as spelled out in the wiki.

charter's vote on Kast is a little scummy. 1 scumpoint to charter

is highly scummy when you see what she said later:

Another townpoint to Kinetic for post #84. I'm also seeing Kinetic's point that Kast might have been warning his buddies through daytalk.
1 townpoint Kinetic

She gives charter a scumpoint for voting Kast, but later says she can "see" the reasoning for his actions there being scummy.

I grant you this one, my reading records spontaneous thoughts, and I don't cross check.

It's the timing of your vote, and the fact that I view Budja as townish, and the people pushing his lynch as scummish.

when you look back and read this:

I like this from ortolan: "My candidates are mainly AM, ABR, Budja and zEEnon at present." - that's very well in line with my observations.
1 townpoint ortolan

So you think I'm townie for suspecting Budja amongst others, but the people pushing Budja's lynch are scummy? You also find me townie for suspecting the person you replaced, and ABR (obviously).

Oh nooooooooooo. Wrong. I think you're wrong about Budja. But I thought you were right about Ace and ABR. And I thought you listing ABR was pretty courageous.

[DrippingGoofball]

This one needs its own special post:

Because of DGB's post I really do not want Budja lynched.

Seriously? Because you've been saying he's scum. I've been defending Budja. So if you think Budja will flip scum, you could really shut me up. Then I'd look terrible for defending a scumbag. So why would you not want to lynch Budja, all of a sudden?

It leaves the door open, if he flips town, for DGB to gain townpoints for having defended him.

But again, you think Budja is scum, right? So wouldn't I be more likely, by your calculations, to get scumcred for having defended a scumbag?

It is still quite plausible he is town- his constant "having it both ways" may be consistent with his playstyle.

Aw, now you're backing up.

Ortolan knows Budja will flip town.

The vacated ABR slot won't get any traction. The more direct interactions I have with charter, the more he leans town. Ace is a bit of a toss up.

Now, at last a vote I really, really like.

vote: ortolan

[DrippingGoofball]

Apparently I just jumped over 5 players on your suspicions list.

Yeah, that happens. I trust the reactions I experience

in situ

more than the ones I read about

post hoc

.

[DrippingGoofball]

You should have seen the WIHII postgame discussion. DGB got majorly pissed off at ABR for the reasons she wrote earlier.

You're confusing ABR with TSQ in Medieval. I can't be mad at ABR in WIH, because he played the game until his role was over, like an adult. Also, I was scum, and when I'm scum I tend to pick on poor innocent townies and be unreasonable out of necessity. Sometimes that can be a little bruising for the townie. So I don't begrudge him that.

[DrippingGoofball]

I have some problems with this post.

1) ort was high on your town list, yet you turn around and vote him?

Yes. He

was

. Based on reading interactions that I did not personally participate in.

2)Said vote seems rather OMGUS.

That would be true if my vote was not justified by the arguments that accompanied my vote.

3) "ortolan knows Budja will flip town". a) this is baseless.

No, it's not baseless at all. Have you read the post?

b)you yourself defended budja. Doesn't this mean you think he will flip town?

Indeed I do think he will flip town. But if you look carefully, ortolan was pushing for Budja to DIE, until he took a step back, and decided that Budja flipping town would be too high a price to pay in terms of town cred for me, and scum dirt on him. So he's making all these calculations that depend on Budja flipping scum... then based on these calculations, he wants Budja to LIVE, and LYNCH me instead. Calculations based on Budja being scum. Do you get it now? Then in the same breath, he backtracks and decides Budja isn't scum after all... and still his calcuations hold? Is your thinking cap on?

Stop thinking in terms of wikitells and use your mind. Ortolan's post was the biggest bombshell in the whole game.

BTW, you also switched vote at the drop of a hat, should it bother me?

[DrippingGoofball]

...(and if DGB's read has been adjusted of this playerslot after ABR replaced out).

I can't say that ac1873fan's contribution does far sways me one way or another. Neutral so far. It doesn't take away ABR's behavior, but adds nothing damning.

I do thank him for replacing.

[DrippingGoofball]

I would also like to know if he finds DGB scummy.

Your attempt to manipulate the new kid on the block into focusing on one particular player is noted, scumbag.

[DrippingGoofball]

also that's not manipulative at all, asking one's opinions of another specific player is entirely legitimate.

It is manipulative, when the SINGLE one you're picking is the one you most recently voted for.

[DrippingGoofball]

DGB is very definitely the lynch for today and is now favoured over AM and Budja (and zEEnon, and ac1983fan).

Nice combination of bullying and wishful thinking, Only Ace and yourself are voting for me.

And another thing.

You didn't ask the ac1983fan WHAT he thought of me. You asked him if he thought I was SCUMMY. That's a leading question.

Your statement that I'm 100% scum is interesting. You realize that you will DIE when you turn out to be wrong? You will be vig'd or lynched. You can't make that kind of lying statement without realizing you will pay for it with your life.

Given the cards that I have, the scum will have to work extremely hard to have me lynched during the day.

@ KAST - help!

I don't understand 100% of the card mechanics here, but is there a way the scum would know which cards I hold?

[DrippingGoofball]

Many reasons to lynch DGB:

1) I've played with her before, know she's a good player and don't see her as town plausibly genuinely thinking I am scum in this game. This is a good reason for me to find her scummy, but I can't necessarily prove this to the town.

Is that fancy talk for OMGUS?

[DrippingGoofball]

2)

Apparently I just jumped over 5 players on your suspicions list.

Yeah, that happens. I trust the reactions I experience

in situ

more than the ones I read about

post hoc

.

This contradicts pretty much

EVERY

opinion stated in this thread: http://www.mafiascum.net/forum/viewtopic.php?t=11190.

Let me introduce myself. I'm DrippingGoofball. The most outstanding game hell-raiser that ever lived. Common wisdom doesn't apply to me. Sorry.

[DrippingGoofball]

3) 576 is very scummy

Your statement that I'm 100% scum is interesting. You realize that you will DIE when you turn out to be wrong? You will be vig'd or lynched.

This is exactly why me changing to your wagon makes no sense if I'm scum, and therefore why your vote on me is unconvincing.

And why is that scummy? You only say "I know so-and-so is 100% scum IF you have rolebased info. Clearly you don't have such info, since you didn't say my predecessor was 100% scum, and you're attempting to build a gauche case against me. However, the number "100%" is meant to suggest rolebased info, and therefore you are misleading the town. If you succeed in having me lynched, you WILL be vig'ed or lynched for having faked rolebased information. It will be the correct play.

You can't make that kind of lying statement without realizing you will pay for it with your life.

I think this is just an attempt to scare me but the same point as above applies- if that's true, why would me attacking her make sense if I'm scum and she's town?

Because you might know the cards I hold. That would explain why you need to eliminate me in broad daylight.

@ KAST - help!

This is a "leading" question in the same way my question to ac1983fan apparently was. I think this is an attempt to link yourself to a townie though.

No, I happen to trust Kast, and I bet he'll give me a trustworthy answer. But anyone willing to answer it is welcome, of course. I really need the answer. I want independent confirmation of what I believe I have figured out.

Given the cards that I have, the scum will have to work extremely hard to have me lynched during the day.

This is just like a power-role softclaim - very scummy in this instance and why would you telegraph your cards without even being the leading lynch target? There's only one card which is objectively more useful than the others to a townie anyway, scumbag.

Your softclaim nonsense is a wikitell and therefore worthless. A lot of players have claimed cards already, and there's not even really power-role cards. But I'll say no more about them until I hear from someone else who might know which cards I have. Some of your buddies might be in that lot.

I still prefer a DGB lynch to Budja though.

Er, I don't think you'll get your wish today either way.

[DrippingGoofball]

It's not OMGUS when I suspected you first.

It's also not OMGUS when it's correct (even if only from my perspective).

That's not under the wiki definition of OMGUS. But it is.

"

don't see her as town plausibly genuinely thinking I am scum in this game."

[DrippingGoofball]

Can scum figure out which cards I hold?

[DrippingGoofball]

I have no clue what DGB's might be.

You can read my wiki page for giggles.

[DrippingGoofball]

Can scum figure out which cards I hold?

Please someone answer.

[DrippingGoofball]

Night Zero: Draw 3 cards, then draft cards.

How did the draft work? I wasn't there.

[DrippingGoofball]

Trying to figure out from my PM.

First draft, my predecessor chose from 3 cards
1.) A >>> passed to other player. but which?
2.) B >>> passed to other player. but which?
3.) C

Card C was retained for my own use.

Second draft
1.) >>> which player passed on this card? D
2.) E >>> passed to other player. but which?

Card D was retained for my own use.

Third draft
1.) >>> which player passed on this card? F

========================

If the scum passed me cards (especially card F) they would know that I have it.

If the scum received cards from me, they would know what I declined.

The only card that they cannot figure out is card C, because it wasn't passed to me, and was not passed to anyone else.

[DrippingGoofball]

Ha, so I'm between Kast and Kinetic. OK.

First draft, my predecessor chose from 3 cards
1.) A >>> passed to Kinetic
2.) B >>> passed to Kinetic
3.) C

Card C was retained for my own use.

Second draft
1.) D >>> passed to me by Kast
2.) E >>> passed to Kinetic

Card D was retained for my own use.

Third draft
1.) F >>> passed to me by Kast

I am stuck with card F.

[DrippingGoofball]

So... I'm 100% certain that Kinetic has card E.

And I know that Kinetic has some of A, and B.

I know that Kast wasn't interested in card F.

So scum would know this for ~3 players. They could put something together, no?

[DrippingGoofball]

Is this useful?

I don't know yet. I'm trying to get a grip.

[DrippingGoofball]

looking back, I'm starting to suspect zwet a little because of the cards he passed to me. He passed a sanctuary, an apothicary, and a mimic over a rat, plague, and mimic.

OMG

There can only be one explanation for this.

unvote, vote: zwet

[DrippingGoofball]

Any other players have suspicious draft activity to report? Holy Guacamole!

[DrippingGoofball]

In other news, nothing suspicious to report from Kast. In fact, his choices hint of town.

[DrippingGoofball]

Opportunistic much?

Like your draft choices much?

[DrippingGoofball]

Opportunistic much?

I'm your only vote. Opportunistic?

[DrippingGoofball]

What happened to him being obv-town and the easiest player to read on all of mafiascum?

Only an idiot doesn't change his mind in the face of massively contrary evidence.

@ Kast >>> You recall passing me a doctor card, right?
@ Kinetic >>> I did NOT pass you a doctor card, right?

mod prod: Kinetic & Kast

[DrippingGoofball]

Honestly, I feel like all the DGB attention is an attempt to distract from Budja, and it's extremely likely that DGB is scum with Budja trying to cause havoc before deadline and force a lynch by splitting the votes.

If we're scum together, why aren't I bus'ing Budja at this point, and why am I drawing attention to myself?

[DrippingGoofball]

100%

Well Touché about that, I should listen to myself talk more.

I find it absolutely bizarre that you would make a complete 180 on someone you previously seemed to be absolutely 100% convinced was town.

Duh! He's hogging all the scum cards! I'm supposed to be stubborn and keep saying he's town??? Also, take a close look at his reaction. If that's not reinforcement, I don't know what is.

Thirdly, you claiming to have a doctor card in this situation is not only completely unnecessary, but also not the move of a pro-town player.

I think you better explain that in more detail. I'd like to see you trip on your own shoelaces.

[DrippingGoofball]

If Budja flips scum, I think Ort deserves more scrutiny, as he really seems to be the primary drive in pulling pressure away from Budja while at the same time claiming to suspect Budja.

Very well said.

DGB can verify whether Kinetic was passed NK/Mimic in Pick#2 and Rat in Pick#3

Confirmed.

[DrippingGoofball]

Still, I think DGB is a more likely candidate for being scum than zwet. Zwet still gets a

Huge FoS

from me.

You've got to be kidding me, knowing zwet's cards, and his reaction?

[DrippingGoofball]

unvote, vote charter

.

That's it? A defensive vote without a comment?

[DrippingGoofball]

Sheesh... even I would be willing to vote Budja at this point; for that post alone.

[DrippingGoofball]

claim?

For starters.

"Paraphrasing a role PM takes seconds, fabricating a good fakeclaim can take a lifetime."

[DrippingGoofball]

Hardly a set of cards that scum would bother with.

[DrippingGoofball]

Actually, there's no confirming card (1), right?

[DrippingGoofball]

Also here to publicly state that this game should not be abandoned and that I hope you all PMed PJ to that effect.

Is there a danger? Oh please no!

[DrippingGoofball]

Budja is town.

The rest of you better be ready to face my unending wrath tomorrow for pushing this lynch.

[DrippingGoofball]

I'd like for one of these scumbags to unvote. NAO>

4 Budja (

charter, Kast, CrashTextDummie, ac1983fan

)

And it's not going to be ac1983fan, because he needs replacement now. charter and especially CTD are on a mission to exterminate townies. Kast is sorely mistaken.

unvote, vote: charter

- it's not optimal, but it's better than Budja. I'm much much rather vote zwet.

[DrippingGoofball]

Scum.

Tomorrow I want you dead, ortolan. You and your buddies zwet and ABR/ac1983fan/replacement.

I want you DEAD DEAD DEAD. All three of you.

The cavalier way you ignore Budja's totally townie card choices has just given you away.

[DrippingGoofball]

Mod Prod Kinetic

Come on town wake up - the scum is walking all over you.

[DrippingGoofball]

Both Kast and myself are townies, scum. But that's not news to you.

[DrippingGoofball]

PLAYERS THAT MUST DIE:

ortolan
zwet
ABR/ac1983fan/replacement.

Thank you.

[DrippingGoofball]

@DGB-
CTD is right. Budja is probably lying about his first card. If Budja is scum, we'll never be able to find out (until the game is over). I don't think it is a very pro-town move to pick a mimic over an apothecary.

Is apothecary that much better than doctor? If mimic was kept as the SECOND card, I would understand a slight preference for mimic over apothecary, given a first Doctor card, and a third card than may be more useful. Am I wrong?

[DrippingGoofball]

But apothecary can only protect against plague, not kill?

[DrippingGoofball]

@DGB-
Apothecary makes you permanently immune to plague.

So tonight would be the ideal time to use such a card, should one hold it, right?

[DrippingGoofball]

While it is possible that he could just really trust his ability to guess likely mafia nightkill targets, I find it more plausible that he did not worry about Apothecary because he is scum. That would mean he is lying about his first card and it is probably Plague or Rat.

Hey.

Before or as the cards were being drafted, were the scum talking? Because if they'd agreed to grab all the plague cards, they would nix apothecary cards wholesale.

[DrippingGoofball]

I was spectacularly wrong with Budja. It was humbling.

@ charter

Why do you feel ortolan is scum?

[DrippingGoofball]

What are ortolan's other cards?

[DrippingGoofball]

What are ortolan's other cards?

[DrippingGoofball]

The players between ortolan are

# 6.) Kinetic

# 8.) ortolan

# 10.) Rishi

They should know what they passed/received.

[DrippingGoofball]

Fisher!

Yeah. 'Cuz his night choice is pretty weird.

[DrippingGoofball]

Mod Prod: Kinetic

Hasn't posted content since Apr 9. We neeeeeed him!

[DrippingGoofball]

YAY, Kinetic!

Do you have an opinion on ortolan? Also, on everyone else...

[DrippingGoofball]

ortolan was scum yesterday, and he's scum today, too.

I bet zwet is his buddy.

In other news, charter makes a good point on Kinetic, who is also lurking like mad.

So the third mafiate would be zwet or Kinetic.

vote: ortolan

[DrippingGoofball]

@ charter

I wanted to know charter's cards to understand why he chose doc-protection, of all things, and coincidentally, on the dead guy, which also requires the extraordinary coincidence of scum having used a rat card on him.

[DrippingGoofball]

@ charter

I wanted to know charter's cards to understand why he chose doc-protection, of all things, and coincidentally, on the dead guy, which also requires the extraordinary coincidence of scum having used a rat card on him.

It would be so horribly anti town to say what card I used, I will not do it unless every single player asks which card I used.

SORRY

I meant ORTOLAN'S cards. Not yours.

[DrippingGoofball]

The third mafiate may be Kinetic for his blatent terrible usage of his cards which I bet is a lie for what he really did. Zwet is in no way scum due to there not being five scumbags this game.

Also, add to the fact that both ort and Kinetic used cards on the dead townie, and suspicion soars threw the roof!

zwet might be a fourth... but I rather believe a toss up between Kinetic and zwet.

And as you point out, another player that used his cards on the dead guy stretches credulity.

We still don't know what zwet used. And zwet's hand isn't super protown to say the least.

[DrippingGoofball]

Plus, your reasoning makes no logical sense.

Let's see.

1) If I was scum, why would I ever claim to have targeted CTD?

Because you DID use a card. So you have to claim something. And using your other cards wouldn't make sense (Rat? You wouldn't claim that, right?) (1/4 NK - that's kinda dumb on its own). So who will you claimed to have used your plague card on? THE DEAD GUY. Of course. You won't claim using it on any of the currently living... we might lynch you for it.

There isn't a tracker card, no one would know.

That's true, you can't be tracked. So it's easy to lie.

Not to mention the fact that I do have (and still have) a Rat card. I could easily use my lurking to distance myself from the CTD kill with no one being the wiser.

uh? Who is not making sense, now? Using the rat card on CTD would make no sense at all, and again, too huge a coincidence to be believed.

2) If I was scum why would I waste my plague on CTD and then use the team kill to kill him out right. That makes 0 sense. Why waste a delayed kill by using the real kill on top of it?

Well. We don't know if that's the card you used. That's what you say.

) The only possible explanation for a plague from a mafia on someone they were using their team kill on is if they feared a doc. The fact that we have a doc claim, and the kill went through ANYWAY means that the mafia used a Rat or the Doc is lying. If the Mafia really used a Rat, a Plague AND a team kill on CTD, don't you think that is a TAD overkill?

Again, we don't know whether you used a plague. Maybe you used a rat. That's what ortolan says, haha.

4) I targeted CTD because I didn't have a lot of time and I was looking for he bus. I know someone was bussing Budja in my gut and CTD's vote looked like it was primly placed to be the driver. I don't think both scum are on the BUS, the counter wagon was too close for that, but I'm feeling pretty strong that at least one of the scum was on it.

Where were you to make these feelings known yesterday? As it is, we can't verify whether this is fact or fiction.

5) The only way you can be 100% on someone is if you're scum or have the Cop card and a result on them. Seeing as the latter is impossible until at least night 2 it makes me question exactly how sure you are about this. Are you overstating yourself a little bit?

Here we go with 100% again... but it's hard to cast ortolan as town.

[DrippingGoofball]

The most believable target for the plague would have been me.

CTD is indeed ridiculous a plague target.

I think we can kill ortolan and Kinetic and win.

[DrippingGoofball]

Kinetic.

I don't believe you used the plague on CTD.

So the whole argument falls apart.

[DrippingGoofball]

@ charter

Don't put un-necessary wear and tear on your typewriter arguing with Kinetic.

He's scum. You won't convince him.

More importantly, we need to know if he's willing to help, and bus ortolan.

[DrippingGoofball]

What, pray tell, is he trying to convince me?

That you're scum.

[DrippingGoofball]

In fact, I happen to know for a fact that at least one scum

did

use a rat card on CTD last night, because I used a doctor card on him.

I believe neither.

WHAT ARE YOUR OTHER CARDS, ORTOLAN???? YOU HAVE TO JUSTIFY YOUR USE OF THE DOCTOR CARD.

So tell me why you are so much surer that I am scum[...]

@ charter - don't waste your time. It's obvious to everyone. It's just going to make your blood boil. You can't win an argument with scum - they'll never say "oh yeah, I see your POV, I'm going to self-vote now." And you won't convince his buddy, either. But there are 7 players that are not scum, and the evidence is as plain to see as daylight.

I'm still thinking zwet is scum.

There may still be a SK whose kill was foiled. The only 'evidence' is zwet's cards.

TOWN
1.) AceMarksman
2.) ac1983fan (rep. Albert B. Rampage)
3.) charter
4.) Kast
5.) DrippingGoofball (rep. KidIcarus)
10.) Rishi
11.) ZEEnon (rep. Slicey)

SCUM

6.) Kinetic

8.) ortolan

12.) zwetschenwasser

[DrippingGoofball]

This is an open setup, there's three scum and nine townies.

Ooops.

So I've got ortolan as one scum.

And one of zwet or Kinetic.

So we lynch ortolan today, someone can plague zwet tonight (I can't) and we lynch Kinetic tomorrow.

[DrippingGoofball]

I VEEL EAT YOUR SOUL WITH BREAD AND MAPLE SYRUP

I hope the bread is a baguette, and the syrup from Québec. Bon appétit!

Hey you know what we call that disgusting corn syrupy fake slop Americans call "pancake syrup?"

We call it "telephone pole syrup."

Here, it's maple syrup or nothing.

[DrippingGoofball]

That's got to be the most wishy-washy post I've ever seen.

He just announced he's perfectly willing to lynch one of two players.

[DrippingGoofball]

We need to know all of ortolan's cards...

"Paraphrasing a role PM takes seconds, fabricating a good fakeclaim can take a lifetime."

OR in this game,

"Listing your cards takes seconds, making up fake ones can take a lifetime."

[DrippingGoofball]

ortolan is hoping I'm going to forget that we need to know the rest of his cards in order to decide whether it was believable for him to use a doctor card on the dead guy and claim the dead guy was ratted.

[DrippingGoofball]

Ortolan's silence on the matter of zwet is deafening.

[DrippingGoofball]

Especially given how zwet seemed to be in a rush to get rid of ortolan.

Very, very strange lack of reaction.

[DrippingGoofball]

Ortolan's silence on the matter of zwet is deafening.

ANSWER NOW

[DrippingGoofball]

Yes, we need input from the "silent ones."

[DrippingGoofball]

Good grief. Zwet is soooooooooooooooo scum.

[DrippingGoofball]

There are several people whose thoughts you deprived us of.

You have robbed us of information for this day. And I'm sure some of us have been plagued already and won't be back tomorrow.

[DrippingGoofball]

vote: zwet

[DrippingGoofball]

I will post some other stuff later, but DGB:

on a scale of 1-100%, how sure are you that I am scum? be totally honest. 100% means it is metaphysically impossible for me not to be scum, in your view.

Despite your uber scummy actions, there was something in your tone that sounded town. Though I reckon Budja had me completely fooled, tone-wise. So maybe I should not let players pull at my heartstrings, it's not that trustworthy.

If you now think zwet is more scummy than I (as would be implied by your vote), please also answer this question for zwet.

His cards are scummy. He will plague townies. He is lurking hard by zwet standards.

I don't know.

Now that you ask me the question, I think you're scummier than zwet, still.

And Kinetic doesn't smell right, either.

So sorry, no, I can't put numbers and I could change my mind.

There are 3 players I'd be willing to lynch.

Yeah I might go back to voting you later today. I have to think this through but I'm seeing a RL client most of the day.

[DrippingGoofball]

@DGB-
Please provide more content to your votes than simply the vote itself. As it is, your voting is just as irresponsible and anti-town as Zwet. I am assuming that your vote implies agreement with everything that Rishi posted.

Indeed, there was nothing to add to the case, and I have already expressed concerns yesterday.

Do you think Zwet is likely to kill townies with his plagues regardless of his affiliation?

Absolutely. But his selection of the cards is pretty damning.

He has threatened to plague you. Is this affecting your desire to lynch him?

That's how I know that he is likely to kill townies with his plagues, but mind you, I may or may not have a self-protective card so the matter may or may not be academic.

[DrippingGoofball]

@DGB-
For my edification, please include at least a comment referring to your previous opinion with your future votes.

As much as I'd looove to edify you, I don't understand the question...

[DrippingGoofball]

And if you don't understand what edify means...you are welcome to edify me anytime

I know what edify means!

I didn't post a reason for the zwet vote because I agreed with the post above. But I will in the future.

[DrippingGoofball]

Who was exceptionally allied with budja?

Me. So why are you voting for ortolan?

[DrippingGoofball]

V/LA May 5-13.

[DrippingGoofball]

Looks like someone faked reading the thread.

[DrippingGoofball]

Lynch him?

It is very tempting.

[DrippingGoofball]

I checked out Looker's posts all over the site.

He's a zwet clone. The only difference is that Looker doesn't capitalize 35% of the time when he should, whil zwet is a more reliable "capitalizer."

[DrippingGoofball]

ort is obvscum. I've never seen a self vote from a pro-town player.

I'm a notorious self-voter when exasperated.

[DrippingGoofball]

@ ortolan

Assume for now that I'm town. I am, but you assume.

Who is your top suspect and why?

[DrippingGoofball]

You know, ortolan, I think we should acknowledge that both of us are absolutely abominable readers of the other's alignment.

I think you should fight your urge to tunnel on me, imagine that I'm not in the game, and spend as much energy making a case against another player as you would against me.

[DrippingGoofball]

Another failure. Sorry, try again. Scum don't know my other cards for a start

although DGB did try to get me to announce them in-thread LOL!!!!

You claim to have used a doctor card. That in itself is extremely unusual. But then again, it depends on what your other cards are. Maybe it's not that unusual. I expect that it is, in the absence of information about your other cases.

Furthermore, you have use a doctor card on a player that died.

Kinetic's claim was hardly re-assuring.

If you're resigned to die and self-vote, maybe it is time to annouce your cards to give us actual hard facts to evaluate your alignment.

[DrippingGoofball]

DGB, if you weren't scum I would say Kinetic, Rishi or zEEnon

zEEnon for the whole "my predecessor looked scummy" (I don't remember anything else from him), Rishi for lurking, Kinetic for his card choice.

Those are very skinny 'cases.'

Can you put more meat on them?

[DrippingGoofball]

You claim to have used a doctor card. That in itself is extremely unusual.

....???????????????????????????????????????.

Yes. Normally, you wouldn't protect another player before protecting yourself.

[DrippingGoofball]

How obv-town, was CTD? If you were scum, would

you

use a rat card on him? I'm actually surprised he didn't get more doctor protects, I can't imagine what the other townies were doing last night.

A very good case could be made that Kast is more pro-town than CTD.

My card choices will tell you nothing about my alignment. Remember Budja's.

That's true in a way, but it might justify your priority to protect CTD rather than use some other cards in your hand. In your case, it may be more informative than Budja.

[DrippingGoofball]

Yes, and DGB is consistently anti-busing.

You keep saying that, but I can point you to two games where I lead day 1 buses. Recent ones, too. Check Sushi mafia (no discussion, ongoing) and Really Deep South.

[DrippingGoofball]

Bus isn't the word I'd use for what you did in Really Deep South. More like weakly accused ABR of being scum after he did something stupid. If I remember right, you didn't even vote him.

Then check the other game, if that's not bus'ing enough for you.

Also, I did vote for him indeed: http://mafiascum.net/forum/viewtopic.ph ... 45#1531345

[DrippingGoofball]

charter, ort wants to die. Can we not abide by his wishes?

ortolan is a good player. I'm interested in his opinion if he flips town. There is no deadline and I'm in no rush to see him lynched.

I'm a bit worried by the fact that he refuses to acknowledge that his locking on to me is very much "auto-lock-on-to-DGB-she-is-never-town."

I'm tryin to get some insight into other players from him, but so far he's no cooperating at all, in terms of making actual cases.

I'll be V/LA May 5-13. Within 5 days, if ortolan hasn't provided ortolan-quality cases on at least two of his non-DGB suspects, I'm going to unvote zwet, and switch to ortolan (unless someone 'fesses scum or something). I think 5 days is reasonable to make good cases.

[DrippingGoofball]

I think zwet is scum. He's not his usual cricket-self.

[DrippingGoofball]

I'm seriously wanting to lynch him...

That seems too good...

[DrippingGoofball]

In my experiance, I've only seen scum self-vote, and my philosiphy is this: if you are town, then you are the ONLY confirmed pro-town player that you know of. Considering this, then WHY would you vote the only person that you know is pro-town? Also consider that ort thinks that his lynch will give us information about the alignments of other players.

I've done it many times. AS TOWN. Sometimes no one listens and you become really exasperated.

[DrippingGoofball]

Hm... This is actually quite interesting, DGB is trying to talk me out of an ort lynch. I'm having second thoughts about an ort lynch now. I still feel he is scummy, but the above post is making me consider DGB again...

I'm not trying to talk you out of an ort lynch. He has done much yesterday that is indicative of scum.

There has been trend recently where gaggles of stubborn players start ganging up and tunelling on players and rendering these players totally ineffective at scum hunters. The players that are thus targeted become cornered into defensive positions all game to the detriment of the town.

In order for us to pick the best lynch candidates, we should be open minded and make fair cases. Part of this is pointing out to you that self-voting is not a scumtell. Everything else against ortolan remains one big scumtell. But again, in case I'm wrong, I want to make sure he has enough comfort zone to be effective as a townie between now and the time he dies. I decided to improve my playstyle in this direction a couple of days ago in reaction to what I perceive to be game-impoverishing trends.

[DrippingGoofball]

I also have to acknowledge that some players are perma-scum in my book, like you and SlySly!



And it's not personal reasons, that's just the scumdar calibration. I felt the same way about Yosarian and farside until I learnt to read them.

[DrippingGoofball]

Could ABR have been so mad about this game with zwet because zwet was on his scum team, and that is why he refused to play unless zwet was replaced or lynched?

You know that's the sort of argument that pushes ALL my buttons, don't you?

[DrippingGoofball]

ortolan if he doesn't find anyone scummier than himself.

I'm finishing my current games and I will stop playing. There's too much of this. ^^^^^

[DrippingGoofball]

It is literally inconceivable that DGB is not scum.

As usual, you are completely blind to all the signs that I'm town.

Like, for instance, my not jumping on

you

when I know you tunnel on me in every bloody game.

[DrippingGoofball]

Day Two: Vote Count #5

3 ortolan (AceMarksman, Kast, zwetschenwasser)
3 zwetschenwasser (Kinetic, Rishi, DrippingGoofball)

OFF-WAGON (charter, ac1983fan, Looker, ortolan)

Ortolan and zwet are 3-3.

We have 4 players currently off the wagons. I wonder why none of them is moving their vote. We need 6 to lynch, right?

[DrippingGoofball]

Yea, after this post I really do like my vote on Zwet all the more.

I like my zwet vote as much as the next guy, but why do you say that?

[DrippingGoofball]

I have a queasy feeling that you're trying to manipulate Looker by pulling at simplistic heartstrings. It may work on him.

"@ 1023 your hesitance to lynch DGB even if I flip town is anti-town, because she is scum. I however don't think you are scum at this stage."

WOW

unvote, vote: ortolan

[DrippingGoofball]

Why is zwet scummy DGB?

Vote: ortolan

zwet is not scum. Stop screwing around and lynch DGB after me.

Self-vote again?

[DrippingGoofball]

Why is zwet scummy DGB?

He's lurking hard, and his cards reek.

[DrippingGoofball]

DGB, is zwet committing any of your classic zwet scumtells that I know you have?

Yes. He is now.

Why are your current suspects so amazingly deviant from your original suspicions list, and how do you explain your misreads on CTD and Budja?

Because I don't tunnel and I am able to change my mind as new information arises.

So I misread these two players. Am I supposed to be 100% accurate?

[DrippingGoofball]

I think it's time to hammer ortolan.

[DrippingGoofball]

I was VLA May 5-13. I'm back.

[DrippingGoofball]

Is there a matter that requires my urgent attention? I've been prodded.

[DrippingGoofball]

Hey look! Ace and kinetic are voting the same person!

Fun Fact #37: You're not voting for either one of them. You seem so sure that Ace and Kinetic are scumbuddies - so why aren't you voting?

He's scum.

vote: zwetschenwasser

[DrippingGoofball]

I don't think zwet has been particularly scummy at all this game.

That's why he's scum. He's more careful.

[DrippingGoofball]

-Any thoughts on the Ort lynch?

There's scum on it. He self-voted. Scum loves this. Of AceMarksman, Kast, zwetschenwasser, DrippingGoofball, ortolan, ac1983fan, AceMarksman is the player that most jumped on the self vote to add his own.

-Any thoughts on Charter?

He was going after Rishi. Though Rishi doesn't strike me as particularly scummy, charter didn't strike me as so townie as to draw the kill. Speaking of which, I wonder why you're still alive, Kast. Why hasn't the mafia killed you???

-Any thoughts on ACFan's claim?

I can't seem to find the claim.

-Any thoughts on Looker?

I'll wait for his replacement.

-Would you be opposed if I shared my notes on cards (particularly, do you have objections if I share the cards that I passed to you)?

No, go right ahead.

[DrippingGoofball]

zwet is there any reason why we shouldn't lynch you?

[DrippingGoofball]

zwet is there any reason why we shouldn't lynch you?

While I was all for lynching zwet yesterday, at this point I'd rather see who his plague targets were before we lynch him because they may be very revealing toward alignment. I feel that means waiting until tomorrow at least before moving on zwet, no matter how scummy he looks right now.

The play for today is ac####.

Uh? If that's what you think, I don't understand why you're not asking who his targets are.

[DrippingGoofball]

Uh huh so the scum can speed-apothecary. You wish, fool.

Don't you need to use the Apothecary BEFORE being plagued?

[DrippingGoofball]

While I was all for lynching zwet yesterday, at this point I'd rather see who his plague targets were before we lynch him because they may be very revealing toward alignment. I feel that means waiting until tomorrow at least before moving on zwet, no matter how scummy he looks right now.

I really don't see how this is a reason for us to let him live another day.

[DrippingGoofball]

Because there is another scum buddy out there if he is scum and we can still try to lynch him.

Uh??? You think zwet is scum and you want to let him live because you'd rather lynch zwet's buddy? What????

Because zwet has done his 'damage' and we now can tell a lot more about his alignment depending on who he kills.

No... if he kills two townies, which is likely given his "scumdar" if he's town, and a "given" if he's scum, are you going to know anything about his alignment? No.

Because you are more scummy than he is right now if you don't understand that.

That's debatable.

If zwet somehow plagues a scum, there is little reason to think of him has scum. If we lynch him today and a scum dies from plague tomorrow

Well, that's true. But I'm certain that one of his choices is me. And perhaps his other choice is Kast, which might explain why Kast wasn't nightkilled. However, I'm more confident that zwet is scum than any other player. So I'm torn.

No, patience on a zwet lynch. He is not the right play today for multiple reasons. We can lynch him tomorrow if need be, but he should have been lynched yesterday before he got his plagues off. Now we have to wait to see what comes out of them.

That's what I was trying to say yesterday. How come no one listened?

[DrippingGoofball]

I could go for a Rishi lynch.

[DrippingGoofball]

I don't like how both Kast and DGB both said they were suspicious of me without specific reasons (and DGB is worse - because she didn't say anything until after Kast did), but I'll give them a chance to explain.

You needed a wake up call.

Can we kill zwet now?

[DrippingGoofball]

@Something to discuss-
I think I'm already probably the top NK target tonight (unless perhaps I'm plagued and scum think I'll be dying anyway).

We shall see. Two nights in two, I protected you. I could have used the self-protecting card (I forget the name of it) but I felt I had enough suspicion to be a very unlikely nightkill.

Seems like you weren't targeted. Either you're scum, or you've been plagued. I don't know why zwet is still alive.

[DrippingGoofball]

I'm certain that zwet plagued two townies regardless of his alignment, which is more likely scum than town.

The town has probably already lost.

I'm not hugely motivated. Can we lynch someone?

[DrippingGoofball]

Pooky? We are blessed.

[DrippingGoofball]

That is untrue. AC is at deadline lynch threshold.

Ironically, Zwet was going to be the lynch until Kast unvoted. Makes me wonder why Kast did that for a Looker vote which is, pretty much useless...

THIS is important.

[DrippingGoofball]

@DGB-
Are you saying that I am scumbuddies with Zwet for putting him into lynch threshold then taking him out?

Only that's it's a weird move. Time will tell.

[DrippingGoofball]

kast promised that he would vote for looker when he got replaced a few pages ago or something to that effect.

I guess it's consistent then. I look forward to Pooky's contribution.

[DrippingGoofball]

The longer it takes him to post, the greater the likelihood that he's scum.

[DrippingGoofball]

unvote, vote: Pooky

[DrippingGoofball]

The longer it takes him to post, the greater the likelihood that he's scum.

[DrippingGoofball]

That could be because I adore you and it feels like forever.

[DrippingGoofball]

So... which one lied?

(1) Pooky is scum and actually passed a rat, while zwet is telling the truth. Rat sure is an odd card for scum to pass up.

(2) Pooky is town and passed a sanctuary, and zwet is lying. Sanctuary sure is an odd card for a townie to pass up.

I think I just short-circuited my brain with WIFOM.

[DrippingGoofball]

Whatever, I don't think stating where my vote might go is scummy, but whatever. I don't even care anymore. Obviously there is nothing to say to stop my lynch, I've defended with everything I've got.

Your lynch is inevitable?

[DrippingGoofball]

Whatever, I don't think stating where my vote might go is scummy, but whatever. I don't even care anymore. Obviously there is nothing to say to stop my lynch, I've defended with everything I've got.

Your lynch is inevitable?

I see. Looks like it might be.

Hmmmm. I don't much see the case.

[DrippingGoofball]

ac19583 is almost certainly town.

[DrippingGoofball]

I believe that at least one, if not two of the scum are in the following group:
*AM
*Kinetic
*Pooky
*Rishi

so yeah, either I get hammered now or get deadlined, unless everybody not currently voting me wants to vote one of those four, or one of the people voting me wants to change.

This is a TOWN reaction. ^^^^

[DrippingGoofball]

Why aren't we lynching zwet? He's way scummier than ac1983fan.

[DrippingGoofball]

I hope that was a mistake... you were already voting me.

The exact sort of mistake I'd expect scum to make.

[DrippingGoofball]

didnt finish that thought: quite frankly I think the only way DGB could've read "town reaction" is if she is scum.

I'd love to hear your explanation.

[DrippingGoofball]

The player basically just said nothing of relevance and you immediately came to the conclusion: "yup he's town"

The tone felt right.

[DrippingGoofball]

Can a scumbag unvote ac1983fan? Especially zwet. Thanks.

[DrippingGoofball]

Can a scumbag unvote ac1983fan? Especially zwet. Thanks.

WHY DO YOU TORTURE ME

WIFOM

[DrippingGoofball]

Didn't hit preview. To clarify, I'm willing to switch my vote to avoid a No Lynch. Again, probably goes without saying.

Please don't switch to ac1983fan.

[DrippingGoofball]

Didn't hit preview. To clarify, I'm willing to switch my vote to avoid a No Lynch. Again, probably goes without saying.

Please don't switch to ac1983fan.

Do you think No Lynch is preferable to an acfan lynch? There's no viable counterwagon at this point.

Much as I love Pooky, I believe he IS a viable counterwagon.

[DrippingGoofball]

The only thing I would chance is that if ACFan is scum, I think it is more likely that his partner is trying to start a counter wagon than that his partner is bussing.

The change of a single person away from ACFan would probably be sufficient to secure a lynch on another player.

If ACFan is scum, then I would suspect all players currently on his wagon are town.

That's a mighty convincing argument.

I await Pooky's response, and I may very well switch to acfan.

[DrippingGoofball]

@DGB-
If you decided to hammer ACFan in response to my post, and ACFan flipped scum, I would not think that clears you as a townie.

It sure wouldn't clear me, I'm pretty handicapped with my Budja support.

[DrippingGoofball]

Gawd. Acfan is so town. I can't do it.

[DrippingGoofball]

Good job scum, especially Kast.

No thanks to zwet.

[DrippingGoofball]

At least I would have gotten one of the scum...

Which one?

[DrippingGoofball]

And no one drew an Apoth card?

Nope.