Mini 720 - SPQR Mafia {Game Over}

[Pathetric]

Charter is townish. I would be curious to know where Coriolanus learned about Glork and not the rest of us.

Nonetheless, it is now time to place a non-random non-arbitrary

vote: Glork

.

Sincerely,
-Ether

[Pathetric]

It is absolutely beyond me why we are still discussing Corio. This game should not be four pages.

Incognito: Patrick and I spent time on Night 1 discussing Caesar, wikiing him, discovering that he had two older sisters both named Julia, sharing poetry, et cetera. I don't know how many of you did the same, but I kind of suspect scum would be surprised to learn of my own interest. I expect they'd check out the flavor, but stay low-key about it. Incidentally, Patrick doesn't agree with this view, though he hasn't specified whether he thinks it says anything either way.

Glork, you know full well I wasn't referring to OMGUS, but I want to

unvote; vote: dahill1

, so I'll speed this up. I would have expected people to comment on your slip with Erratus and odd non-sequitur defense (the FoSed Yosarian part, not the bear part). I found it uncanny that no one noticed this at all, and instead wagoned Xtoxm to try and kick off the game without it.

Yosarian's a bit off to me, and I find it even odder that Dahill QFT'd him. At least Yosarian admitted that this probably wasn't the most productive subject.

But it was nice voting you for at least a little.

Reminiscently,
-Ether

[Pathetric]

Corio overreacting doesn't do much for me either way: I'd say either he's an alt who's annoyed that everyone's worked it out so easily, or he's frustrated because he's telling the truth and not believed. dahill, can you elaborate on what feels off or alignment-telling to you?

Glork seems ok so far. Not a fan of Xtoxm's responses to being probed, which reminds me a fair bit of the unhelpful Xtoxm-scum I've played with; unfortunately it seems I don't have strong agreement with my other head on that one, again

Patrick, this time.

[Pathetric]

My position which Patrick cited in 104 wasn't strictly at ends with his. It was more about the feel of the Xtoxmwagon. There was never much basis behind it, far as I can tell; it was a "let's kick off the game" wagon when the game had already been kicked off perfectly adequately. Also, I think Xtoxm is the sort of person who's easier to read when left to his own devices.

I'd lean town on him right now solely because of the timing of the vanilla claim, though. (shrug)

for voting assmaster with seemingly no reason,

and i found it strange (scummy strange) that he didn't even really comment on xtoxm.

Terrible.

I understood Tuberk's vote at the time and it was the first thing I liked out of him. But Primate is probably town purely because he has 16 posts. Tuberk should vote Dahill instead.

Patiently,
-Ether

[Pathetric]

I voted Dahill partially for sheeping on Yosarian with that odd pressure on Corio, and liked the vote even more when he sheeped on Glork--his vote for you was terrible. I've already noted his contradiction on his stance toward unexplained votes.

My advertisement wasn't a joke, though I admit skimmed your explanation pretty badly after seeing that it was indeed something about pushing the Xtoxmwagon. I didn't realize your dislike of Primate's remark wasn't based on the context: in general, I think selling wagons is a necessary way to move the game forward.

Apologetically,
-Ether

[Pathetric]

I'd say the risk of a potential quicklynch was minimal, especially with Xtoxm having a vote on himself. I didn't even notice he'd claimed until Ether said so. Xtoxm, why so early? You weren't even at lynch-1 when you yook your own vote off, and like half of the wagon didn't even seem that serious.

Early vibes leaning town on Glork, Tuber and maybe Incognito. I'm a little leery of Yos2 but want to give that some more time, for now I'm surprised dahill didn't get more attention for his Tuber vote. It seems like his first reason was something he knows is pretty much invalid, and his second reason (failure to comment on Xtoxm) seems like it applies to two of three others as well.

Patrick.

[Pathetric]

meh. i was merely citing it as one of the opposing viewpoints to the situation. i wasn't necessarily agreeing with it, and i have questioned when people do this in other games iirc. i dislike using info outside of mafia games in general, so i don't consider this telling of any particular alignment.

The first part I can possibly see, but I'm confused by the last sentence; if you don't consider it telling of any particular alignment, why did you use it as a reason to vote Tuber? Am I missing something?

i don't see how agreeing with others' cases is a bad thing

It's not merely about agreement but more that I don't like your stances in either case. The Tuber vote I don't see either of the reasons as any good and I could see it as a move to follow a little momentum, and the Corio thing seems very meh.

and wait xtoxm, claimed? when/where?

Xtoxm claimed vanilla townie in Post 117. Any thoughts on that?

Patrick.

[Pathetric]

I'm not sold on Xtoxm being town (my other head apparently nearly is), but dislike the last two votes on him. Xtoxm's accusation that Yos2 slipped and revealed knowledge of his alignment seems baseless to me; but Yos2's response and vote is full of hyperbole. I don't see the manipulation in Xtoxm's post that he claims too at all, and dahill's vote just looks like opportunism.

On Patrick - He said he spoke with Ether about finding me scummy for meta reasons, and Ether disagreeing. I have never played Ether, so I see no reason why she would overrule his opinion on my meta, whcih makes me think they are scum and were infact discussing whether to attack me for my play fitting my scum meta.

And btw, I think it's too early to say whether i'm fitting my town or scum meta, given how little has gone on.

So those we be my top 3 atm. Glork today, imo.

You played with Ether in PYP3, and she's well aware of your meta. She "overruled" me for basically the reason given in your second paragraph, I think.

It's a Pot/Kettle thing. FWIW, I had gotten the impression that Yos2 has been involved in the game, so I'm curious to know how you can justify attacking somebody based on "lack of contribution" when you yourself hadn't done anything but a couple of random-votes up until that point.

I don't think this sums it up at all. I got the impression EA voted Yos2 because he didn't see how his contributions were helpful to hunting scum. I don't see why EA's not posting much before then should undermine his point, and I see where he was coming from. Although, I'm a little surprised that EA moved so quickly onto Rally Vincent after that.

Patrick.

[Pathetric]

Um, I just gave 3 reasons why him claiming vanilla for no reason is a good reason to lynch him. Town should never claim vanillia, at all, but scum tend to want to claim vanillia, so it's a scum tell. Plus, he's a safe lynch now that he's a claimed vanillia (he's either a vanillia or a scum), and if he gets lynched no one else has to claim, which protects the power roles.

Scum tend to want to claim vanilla? Your experience must be very different to mine. On the contrary, I see lots of townies carelessly claiming vanilla because they don't think their role is especially important; it's poor play but I don't see how that translates to scummy, and in my experience scum prefer to wait until a claim is explicitly forced out of them. Why would it be beneficial for scum to claim vanilla before they need to? That baffles me. Premature claims are something I've found to be a reliable pro-town sign with newbies, of course Xtoxm isn't a newbie, so I'm less sure what it means for him, but I can't see any reason why Xtoxm-scum would be more likely to do it.

And yet, I cut you slack for this because I know you have a policy of lynching claimed vanillas on day 1, but I think the post where you voted Xtoxm reaches to try and make him look bad. You make an interesting point about dahill. I'll have to take a look, or even better, be lazy and weedle Ether into taking a look.

Patrick.

[Pathetric]

The Corwagon is stupid. Glork bugs me a lot; I'd move my vote to him without batting an eyelash. Actually, there are a few people that's true for.

I don't get Primate's explanation of his FoS. But sure, here's a summary, enjoy and please never ask me to do this again. This is color-coded so that statements that only I believe/believed at the time are in

gold

and Patrick's exclusive beliefs are in

blue

. We mostly agree.

• Dec. 17th
  • that defense was kind of weird from Glork
  • I hate Erratus's joke excuse for a vote
    • no, wait, that vote sort of makes sense considering what he'd already said
  • let's vote Glork
  • How does Incognito find this game confusing?
  • Primate's thing on Corio came off weird but we disagree on why and agree with the sentiment anyway
  December 18th
  • Xtoxm's selfvote is scummy, but Glork's vote is Space Monkeyish
    • Glork's vote is perfectly acceptable but I am ignoring Xtoxm I will read him and Corio later but in any case the Xtoxmwagon pisses me off
  • Dahill and Yosarian are weird
  • Tuberkulos
    • Yeah, he's scummy
    • Eh
    • Wait, no, that Primvote is townish, never mind
  • Dahillvote is good
  December 19th
  • oh wow Dahill was the guy in the Worst 5 thread who sheeped on Glork
  • Rally's Erratus vote
  • Dahill's nonresponse to Glork's unexplained vote is a double standard
    • no, that's null
  December 20th
  • Erratus is townish Yosarian is scummy what is up with Glork's response
  • the acceptability of Dahill's response
  • wait, Erratus isn't voting Yosarian anymore?
  • Glork is too smug about Xtoxmscum
  • not enthusiastic about Glork's Corio FoS
  • If we are counting his railing on Erratus then Yosarian has scumhunted so far this game otherwise he has not
  • the bottom of Ether's list at this point, in order: {Primate, Tuberk, Erratus, Xtoxm}
    • actually, Erratus's quick voteswitch was kinda weird, never mind that bit
  • we are still voting Dahill and not Yosarian
  • silly Xtoxm
    • scary Xtoxmwagon
    • • Corio wins
  • Glork is scummy
  • Yosarian is probably not scum with dahill
  December 21st
  • Incognito's Xtoxmhate is weird
  • Glork's Corvote is stupid
  • Holy shit there are a lot of scummy ICs in this game
    • maybe we're crazy. ._.
    • no Patrick we are messengers of TRUTH.

This doesn't cover everything. There's something in particular we're waiting to spring.

Secretly,
-Ether

[Pathetric]

Nothing is a direct quote; it's a summary based on my AIM logs.

[Pathetric]

(-Ether.)

[Pathetric]

Dear Tuberkulos: Hmm. I could have sworn I'd answered this already, but apparently not. It was an extension of my 124; I thought your Primvote was for advertising a wagon to "kick off" a game that had already been kicked off, denying previous material. (For the record, I was fine with his baiting you response.)

Erratus: Chainsaw defense might hypothetically be useful as an associative tell, I guess...I haven't researched it thoroughly, and I wouldn't expect to use it often outside of certain formats like Vengeful. As an independent one that prompts you to vote the defender over the defendee, it's bullshit. Having said that, I don't really have a problem with the fact that Rally is being voted. (shrug)

To both of you: What are your opinions on Xtoxm, Coriolanus and Dahill?

The next sig-line in the pattern isn't particularly apt this time,
-Ether

[Pathetric]

We're not really split on out opinion of dahill. I'm not wild about his explanation for non-explained votes being scummy, but could just about see it being truthful; Ether thinks he's just flailing. He also didn't attack Glork for doing the same thing (lynch-1 to boot), which Ether is somewhat more willing to put down to some "trusting the ICs" thing, although I could still just see him taking a swing at an easier looking target. His Xtoxm vote is lame, "you are just not being helpful at all and pretty much all your actions so far have been anti-town" is an excuse to place a vote.

Glork is on the list because I don't like his case against Corio at all. He characterises Corio as "Yet he just spent an entire page defending Xtoxm, rathar than hunting scum." which makes no sense, why can't Corio have been doing both those things? He asked Yos2 valid questions there, and he's taking a stand. He's doing plenty, more than a number of others. I'm not agreeing with Glork's assessment of him at all, and combined with his absurd stance on the EA/Yos2 argument, it bothers me quite alot.

Thirdly, I actually thought exactly what dahill thought about the whole "post restriction" comment... I'll just QFT Post 185 here.

I'd also like to know what's scummy about this.

The only thing I can even see as odd about Corio is his comment that Xtoxm can easily be taken care of later if scum. I'm not convinced it's scummy though. *shrug*

@RV, vote could easily be on Glork or Yos2 instead, not really seeing why number of mentions in the summary should equate to how suspicious we are of each of them (which is very close between the 3). What's your opinion of Corio? Are you going to respond to the guy you're voting?

Mod

: Can we get a deadline extension since it's christmas?

Patrick.

[Pathetric]

Ha.

[Pathetric]

That's exactly the point I'm trying to MAKE, Patrick. Corio seems to want to "get more out of the day," butj for the time he's spent in this thread, his actual, real-time scumhunting has been minimal, IMO.

My point there is that I don't see him defending Xtoxm "rather than scumhunting", I see him as doing both. The last two quotes before your smoking gun quote:

The first contains a critisism/question of Yos2's reason for voting Xtoxm. I don't see how that could be seen as unproductive; questioning someone's (shoddy?) vote on a player you read as town seems like a common type of scumhunting.

The quote after that continues that line of questioning. He's even pointed out that Yos2 changed his term from anti-town to scummy, seems like a valid point. You don't see any scumhunting at all in these posts? I have a much better idea of his thoughts on the game than I do from a number of other players. I also don't think his desire to continue the day places any burden on him to suddenly become more active than he already has been; it seems obvious with 2 week deadlines that the mod is unreasonable enough to not even extend for christmas, we should be taking all the time we can get.

Interesting to find out who Corio is. I'll respond to Yos2 in a bit. Patrick.

[Pathetric]

Pathetric: Want to explain why you think I'm scummy? You've said so like 5 times, but the only thing you've actually commented on about my play was my vote for Xtoxm, and even there you all you said was that you thought I was "streaching it" (which I really doubt; Xtoxm really just looks like a scum flailing around here to me) or that you didn't agree with me that scum want to claim vanillia townie (which, again, I don't get; isn't it obvious why scum "should" want to claim vanillia?)

Your early game pressure on Corio looked odd, if not necessarily scummy.

I don't like your response to Erratus Apathos voting you, quoting a few posts made by him in the random stage seems kind of cheap and just designed to make him look bad. I still fail to see why someone who's been pretty inactive apparently isn't allowed to critisise the contributions of an active player, in fact I can't really think how else they'd get into the game. Part of me still thinks there must be some basic misunderstanding on my part of the position you and Glork are putting forward here, because it seems ridiculous to me.

Already commented on your Xtoxm-vote. Not sure what else to say; if Xtoxm is town (which I personally give about an average chance, my other head gives a high chance), he's an easy target for scum, because he's played pretty sloppily, claimed too early, self voted, asked to be lynched, all kind of stuff that often gets you negative attention whether it's scummy or not. You joined the wagon on him for reasons I find unconvincing. For the record: why do you feel it's obvious that scum "should" want to claim vanilla? Plenty of scum claim poweroles.

I'll admit it's possible your thing about vanilla claims is throwing me off despite knowing your thoughts on the general strategy; if you didn't have a history of hating vanilla claimers I'd probably be on you for it, because pushing a lynch for easy and routine reasons like that tends to ping my scumdar (I realise that's not all your reasons, but it seems to be a decent part of it). Dahill, for example, doesn't give me a strong sense that he thinks Xtoxm is scum.

Glork, she hasn't. I scared her off it in that newbie game.

[Pathetric]

Sim and Xtoxm not likely scum together. If Sim is scum I'm guessing he's snuggling up to a townie. I need to think about whether it being revealed as Sim means anything.

[Pathetric]

Are you referring to stuff on you or Xtoxm? I know Xtoxm is a sloppy player if that's what you're getting at. Both of you being confirmed innocents there might throw it off a bit, too.

[Pathetric]

Hmm. Despite what I've been saying, it bothers me how you've made three distinct filler posts whilst all this has been going on tonight. I can't think straight at this hour, will sleep on it and post tomorrow.

Patrick.

[Pathetric]

How am I sloppy Patrick?

This impression comes from the fact that when I played against you and you were scum, you confessed early, and that in games I've read with you as town, you've tended to vote very hastily and make long strings of posts without seemingly putting much thought into them.

What was the point of your last 3 posts in this game? D'you have any thoughts on what's been happening?

Patrick.

[Pathetric]

I'm actually getting a bit wavery on Xtoxm now, too...I'm painfully aware that only a small part of my read on him is based on his own behavior. But his wagon still gives me a bad feeling, and I still definitely dislike Dahill, so, meh. The impending deadline is actually a bit of a relief to me.

A question to Incognito, Glork, Yosarian2, Erratus Apathos, Rally Vincent, probably some other people I'm forgetting:
Are you in fact aware of the full case against Dahill? What do you think of the contrast between this and this?

Coriolanus's reveal as Simenon really bothers me as I know Simenon is an experienced player and therefore I'm really questioning what it was he was trying to get at earlier when he mentioned that the lack of Glork death "really disappointed" him.

This is odd. It ignores the actual likelihood of this playerlist speedlynching Glork--a likelihood Simenon would be perfectly aware of. If anything, this would have been more scummy from a newbie's keyboard.

Incidentally, Primate is still town.

Spartan warrior,
-Ether

[Pathetric]

Could you explain what you mean?

Like I said, based on meta, I don't really think sheeping is inherently a scumtell coming from Dahill, and I don't have a problem with him following me on Xtoxm. I don't really have a read on Dahill yet, I could equally see him doing everything he's done so far as either town or as scum. If there's more to the case then that, I'd be interested to hear it.

What do you think of the contrast between this and this? What do you mean, "what do I mean?"

By the first "this," I meant,

on that note,

unvote vote tuber

for voting assmaster with seemingly no reason,

and i found it strange (scummy strange) that he didn't even really comment on xtoxm..

By the second "this," I meant,

4. stating "X is scum" and giving no real reason why.

take it away, glrok!

Originally I was going to post something along the lines of "because I said so" to draw this out and further illustrate my point, but I don't really feel like doing that, so I'm just going to explain very bluntly.

A few underlying principles:
1) Players -- especially when scum -- like to be comfortable. Bringing pressure that is difficult to respond to pulls them out of their comfort zones, making them react in a way they normally wouldn't react. This makes it significantly more likely that they will say or do something particularly telling of their alignments.
2) In the long-term, players often reveal the most about themselves when acting on limited information. While this maxim generally applies to the notion that D1 and D2 are the most revealing parts of a mafia game, it also applies when dealing with "unexplained votes."
2a) Let's look at the general case of an unexplained vote from a player of unknown alignment. The motivation for a protown player is to discern the intent of the voter, generally in order to obtain their alignment. The motivation of an anti-town player is to discern the intent of the voter (which sometimes involves seeking alignment) and to best utilize the situation to their advantage. There is an important, if subtle, difference. By cultivating our exploration of these differences, we can find new tools to seek and destroy the scumbaggoes amongst us.
2b) Now consider the case where I am a confirmed protown player making an unexplainded vote. In this case, my motivation is very clear. In some way, I am seeking to find scum. Here, I'm actually going to dip into one of my trade secrets and note that protown players tend to have a broader picture of our voter's intent, whereas scums tend to focus more on themselves (or, sometimes, their allies). If the person I'm voting is more concerened with how everyone else reacts than with deflecting my attack, they are usually more likely to be protown. If they immediately seek to bury someone else in accusations, wildly reject my vote/claims outright, or blame-shift, they're more likely to be scum.
3) Taking an alternate approach to scumhunting allows one to take advantage of "weak points" in other players' gameplay. Most mafia is played in the public arena. Players openly debate and discuss who is scum and why. Thus, most people tend to focus most of their attention on growing and evolving as players in this realm of open banter. A couple years ago, I learned that the vast majority of players didn't know how to react to certain circumstances. One such circumtsance was a completely irrational, yet intensely focused onslaught from an established player. This was a very noticeable chink in the mafia community's collective armor, and while you had your Internet Strangers and your Baby Jesuses (the paragons of this style of play), people who effectively played without explanation were very few and far between. Thus, very few players put the necessary time, thought, and effort into ensuring that they new how to interact with these playstyles. Over time, parts of the community evolve, and playing such playstyles shifts and changes just as the overall game meta does. Not only do they not know how to react, and not only do they give more information about themselves, but their weaknesses are actually exploitable, allowing the attacker as an individual to crack other players' shells and expose their soft, fleshy interiors, thus opening the game up for everybody.


And FYI, Xtoxm is a poor benchmark for erratic behavior. It has to be used in moderation, and is really only useful after one has established oneself as being able to consistently find scum using traditional methods. If I had been wild and erratic immediately after joining Scum in 2005, I don't think I'd be anywhere near where I am today. The biggest issue with seemingly :nothelpful: play is that far too many players have no idea when, where or how frequently to utilize it.... so they really do end up just being :nothelpful:. It's awfully hard to explain... something you more have to see and experience over time.

Keep in mind that like these behaviors are also very case-specific. I will not treat Thok the same way I would treat an Oman or a Vollkan or somebody I've never played with.



Now.
Did you know that unexplained votes are the best things ever?

He posted an excuse, but it's pretty obviously bullshit, considering the context of the second quote. I'm taken aback by the number of people who dismiss Dahill's scumminess without acknowledging this contradiction at all...the way that you

quoted me drawing attention to it

and then reiterated how you're okay with his sheeping. I accept that sheeping is in-character for Dahill, but it's not what I'm talking about. I hate his Xtoxmvote and I hate this.

(I'm fuming about this, but looking at it objectively, I don't see a scummy motivation for asking me to elaborate. It'd only serve to make me elaborate.)

If you're asking about the first paragraph, I'm not really sure what else to say on that note. I could be wrong about Xtoxm. Dunno.

Lyrical Rampage, bitches,
-Ether

[Pathetric]

I don't like Xtoxm's recent play and if I was here on my own, I'd possibly be voting him at this point. He's not behaving like someone who actually thinks Yos2 slipped; in which case I'd be expecting him to be trying hard to explain it rather than being so obstinate. I also don't see much scumhunting from his direction. Still don't see much of a case against Corio, even with alt reveal.

I don't feel like the cases against any of them are substantial. Maybe it's just me, but I can't really read xtoxm the way he's been playing, in the same way that I can't really read natirasha ever. I don't think that Coriolanus's "i'm in the business of scumhunting" post implies that he can't talk about anything else. And that idea that dahill is scummy for agreeing with Yos and Glork on Coriolanus's alt defense being strange is just beyond stupid.

Do you typically skim over large parts of the game? Genuine question, because this quote really gives me that impression. Your sum up of the dahill case in particular is clearly wrong.

Patrick.

[Pathetric]

Glork: the tone of "seemingly no reason" makes me think differently. What's more, Dahill's defense (reiterated here) doesn't correspond with yours. It was basically "I quoted Glork for the hell of it but I don't actually agree with him; I do find unexplained votes scummy." (Doublechecking this, he said that this wasn't the first time. I'll want the most recent link to this behavior.) What do you think about this defense?

Incognito: having just skimmed the content of Primate's posts instead of counting them, I'm actually going to eat my words there. He should do stuff.

The quoted post most certainly

does

seem to lean one way or another. Dahill dedicated a full post--no debating with anyone else except Animorpherv--to quoting the counterpoint Glork made, starting off with a "take it away, glrok!". That's pretty strong on its own, and he didn't throw in any disclaimer about him personally disagreeing. Yeah, Incognito. That post had a lean. Regardless of his alignment, it bothers me easily you swallowed that.

Having said that, it occurs to me that Dahill won't be around to claim--that

does

make me somewhat nervous, and I'm surprised no one else has brought this up. (More words to eat: I do not like this deadline after all.) I'm not thrilled, but I'm going to

unvote; vote: Xtoxm

.

Chewing thoughtfully,
-Ether

[Pathetric]

That is a pathetic reason. Was calling me town jsut an attempt to look good?

What would you suggest? I'm uncomfortable to lynch someone who's not around to defend themselves or claim, and I don't see you trying to persuade anyone to lynch Glork or Yos2. We've tried more than once to get the deadline extended, which seems more than reasonable, but mod isn't receptive to it since the contract was written in stone in the sign ups thread and there's literally no way it can possibly be changed.

I'm a little unsettled that like 3 or 4 people have apparently only just fully read up on the case against dahill, despite being happy to stick up for him before. It doesn't particularly strike me as scum defending buddy, but it's weird. I don't really understand Glork's question to Ether; hopefully she will.

Asssmaster urgently needs to contribute some content. No more excuses.

Patrick.

[Pathetric]

Y'know, guys, we could always lynch Glork. That'd be cool.

That said, having known dahill from scumchat and having met him in person, you're saying you still find it unreasonable to believe that he quoted me to debunk the "unexplained votes suck" comment for the lulz?

Oh, I find that extremely easy to believe. It's the Corvote I dislike.

I asked about the contradiction because I do find it scummy and it was the obvious place to start. I felt his flaily defense was just an extension of the original contradiction. (shrug)

You haven't actually answered my question. What do you think about Dahill's defense?

Mentally

fabulous,

-Ether

[Pathetric]

It's the Corvote* I dislike.

*That other guy. Tuberkulos.

-Ether

[Pathetric]

I misread the angle of "for the lulz." I still don't think he'd post that if he completely disagreed with it.

I'm going out in ten minutes and I want a late breakfast first.

Soul sistah,
-Ether

[Pathetric]

Anyway, Xtox is obv the play of the day, Dahill is probably the convenient distraction, which would be serious minus points for both Erratus and Pathetric.

How does Post 351 fit into this theory? You seem to be just slinging mud here. Based on what's just happened I'm thinking Xtoxm might flip town, but if he's scum, this comment is definitely noted.

Why the need to hammer before we heard from Assmaster? You were seriously worried you'd forget to do it later?

If we're killed tonight, Glork seriously needs running up tomorrow, regardless of what Xtoxm is. Don't let him off the hook; he hasn't felt right today at all.