Mini 644 - Meerkat Manor Mafia (Game Over!)

[curiouskarmadog]

wow, I know absolutely no one from this game...(unless some of you crazy kids are alts)....

vote mafiamann

name says it all.

[curiouskarmadog]

Hello everyone, it seems like im the most experienced player here.

guess again Captian Wisdom.

---
also, I have seen people self vote many times. I have seen experience players, newbies, scum, town, lurkers, and flakers all self vote. Now it is pointless, but really just a null tell, unless they leave their self vote on for a long period of time. No one here will be lynched on a self vote alone, so relax..that being said, self voting is not helpful..and if you are really willing to scum hunt, I suggest you actually start, and remove all self votes

[curiouskarmadog]

unvote

, game has moved on...

[curiouskarmadog]

What made you feel that it was acceptable to put Coug at L-4 on page two?

And this is enough to put Mafiamann at L-3 on the second page?

FoS for you

these are ridiculous questions, that are designed to make you look more townie. Actually what does it matter if someone is at -3 or -4 on page two? Information is being gathered..pressure is being put forth...how else do you find out information?...

vote clock...

[curiouskarmadog]

L-5 would have been adaqute pressure on page two and sudden wagons building for very little reasoning is strange to me. That is what I'm worried about. I didn't want a quicklynch to build up on day one.

-4 is hardly close to quick lynch potential...if I meta you, will I find you jumping on a wagon on page 2 or 3?

[curiouskarmadog]

Unvote
Vote: Bogre

for standing by quietly and throwing suspicion on a bunch of players, so he can vote them when the opportunity presents itself. Defend yourself, Bogre.

QFT

[curiouskarmadog]

I'm going to go ahead and

Vote: MafiaMann

. If we assume that the random voting stage stopped with my self-vote, which most of us seem to, then his voting me out of appeasement and for his inability to spell ClockworkRuse's name, which happened after said self-vote, makes no sense. When he finally did vote ClockworkRuse at post #145, he failed to give a reason. I'm sorry, but lame excuses, a lack of reasoning, and popping your head in and out of the game is scummy.

I find ClockworkRuse somewhat believable, especially later on, but

IGMEOY: ClockworkRuse

anyway for his earlier, somewhat panicky actions.

if/when clock flips scum, I know exactly where my vote is going next.

[curiouskarmadog]

So, the lurker decides to speak? And exactly what is your reasoning for suspecting me? Because a possible scum is keeping his eye on me?

well this is a OMGUS statement if I have ever seen one..I am hardly a lurker...it is how he made the statement and his actions toward you that has him and you on my radar(noting yet another FOS). Also I dont like your continued probing of the claim.

I've finally had time to look over this.

vote:MafiaMann

[/b]

wtf? then why vote? why note wait till you have had time to read?

[curiouskarmadog]

no no, you did state and I even quoted "Ive finally had time"..for some reason I read that as, "I havent had time"...

disregard my last post to you...sorry

[curiouskarmadog]

woah so what just happened?...so was Clock part of the mafia or something else? (confused)..like a SK maybe?

[curiouskarmadog]

well now that my number suspect has been killed, I am at a little loss...I saw a connection between SC and Clock, but I thinking after reading the title page that a predator is probably something like a SK, so a connection is meaningless...going to reread.

[curiouskarmadog]

@Jonathan: with MM's meta, I mean that I've seen him play

extremely

scummy in another game. This by no means convinces me of his innocence, nor should it. But it does make me want to avoid a quick lynch on him and a short day. There's no need to hurry.

Cass is this other game completed?..if so can I have the reference?

[curiouskarmadog]

rereading..busy at the moment though..might not be able to post until this weekend.

[curiouskarmadog]

May I chime in and say that MafiaMann seems more like a VI, come to think of his death?

what was the point of this post at the beginning of Day 2....this almost has the feel of someone trying to defend their participation of a townie lynch..

or am I just reading into it?.

[curiouskarmadog]

you sees self hammers all the time...I have done it for some REALLY stupid reason....mostly because I was new and I flaked or wanted to prove a point. But really why are we talking about the hammer? What is done is done..what needs to be focused on at this point, is the wagon. Who was on it, when, and why?..Who didnt join it and why?

will look into that when I have time. Also making a note of stanger's comment today..that didnt set well with me AT ALL.

[curiouskarmadog]

sees=see

[curiouskarmadog]

Before I say anything else, is failure to pay attention necessarily scummy?

yes

not liking his recent votes, not liking his explanation for no reason at the beginning of the day...not liking yesterday's play.

vote coug

also, i dont think I am understanding the case against Bog...some please explain

[curiouskarmadog]

To be all honest

I find that people who tend to use this phrase are scum.

unvote, vote Muffin.

have you not been honest about other things?

[curiouskarmadog]

unvote: strangercoug

because although he was possibly unfairly targetting Cass, for now I can accept that it was an honest mistake because I think both Bogre and Muffin are good potential scum targets. Bogre especially isn't looking very good at the moment, and if at some point we find out bogre is scum, it might be good to strongly consider muffin as a scum partner.

However, CKD, I'm not sure I like this post of yours...

To be all honest

I find that people who tend to use this phrase are scum.

unvote, vote Muffin.

have you not been honest about other things?

Unless you are not fluent in the english language, you would know "To be honest" is a common figure of speech that maybe shouldn't be used as much as it is because the literal implication is that you have not been honest. Its like if someone asks you "Do you like football?" and you answer "Honestly, I'm more of a hockey fan." That example wouldn't make me wonder what you were lying about, and just the same, I don't think that particular phrase makes muffin a liar either.

Actually, I think that was a very weak and opportunistic reason for voting muffin... After muffin was taking heat, but early enough to vote without being accused of just jumping on a wagon.

Vote: CKD

because we're not only hunting scum... there are potentially more predator roles out there, and if Bogre and Muffin do happen to be scum together, I could see CKD filling in as a predator role quite nicely. And I'm actually more worried about predators than I am the commandoes. Daykills are scary and unpredictable.

this is not the first time I have caught scum using this subconcious slip AND it is not the first time I have commented on this particular phrase or phrases of the like..."to be honest", "in all honesty", "Honestly I have never...", or my favorite "to tell the truth".

But dont take my word for it I can supply you with 2-3 games (they should be completed) that scum have used those terms..

it is a slip...keep in mind I also caught Clock on a scum slip too...

I am noting this attack or defense....there is no bandwagon on Muffin..just FoSes..the current vote leaders are coug and Bogre...so I am being oppertunistic by jumping off the leading bandwagon?

Also you think my vote was just solely on that?...funny you didnt ask before you attacked/defended Muffin.

[curiouskarmadog]

muffin, are you trying to say I am not being honest about something?

what?

[curiouskarmadog]

Rhinox, I remember early in my mafia “career” someone attacked someone for using the “to be honest” phrase. I thought much like you did, and attacked that person (so I guess, I understand where you are coming from.) The person in question came up scum, so I made mental notes to see if scum typically use that phrase. Out of the 5 times I have seen it, 4 of the times they were scum…the 1 time, it was a townie that had faked claim (don’t even get me fucking started on that game)…so from my point of view, it is a tell.

Post 65 (in reference to clock)…he was asking questions that were utterly ridiculous, in an attempt to look more townie…not sure how you missed that when you pulled my other quotes.

In reference to Muffin..I didn’t like his early attempt to dominant this game with his “experience”, I don’t like his light participation on yesterday’s lynch, I didn’t like his vote of coug, and now his “honesty” comment. Now these things individually may not mean much (except the “honesty” comment)..but together are setting off alarms.

also, all this being said, I still dont like Coug's comment at the beginning of the day as well...it felt too defensive...now I dont think that being defensive is that big of a deal (I actually find that scum tend to push that as a "tell"), but the fact that he wasnt being attacked at the time, speaks volumes...

[curiouskarmadog]

About ckd: In the beginning he said that he would vote SC if clock "flips scum", but changed his mind after clock died. (If he and SC form a scum-pair, he might have confidently said that because he "knew" that clock would turn out innocent.) Then he voted SC again, but changed his mind again because of muffinhead's "to be all honest". This might be just to distract his shift of vote.

Clock didnt flip mafia which is what I meant and was obvious. I didnt vote him again, because I didnt see a connection. I have stated twice that I feel that Coug is scummy today for his comments today. What I find interesting is that you are commenting on possible links but not really commenting on any of the cases or scummy actions in the present. Your thoughts on Bog, Muffin, or Coug?

why are you not voting for anyone? If you think that Coug and I might be a scum pair, why are you not voting for us?....I also note that you didnt vote anyone yesterday..please explain


@muffin, I have no clue what the hell you are talking about...I am not telling the truth because of what? Nice silly comeback.

[curiouskarmadog]

jon, I thought you were pushing that Coug and I were a scum pair, why the Bog vote?

[curiouskarmadog]

and my case on muffin?..I know you stated you have addressed muffin before..but I would like to hear it again.

[curiouskarmadog]

325 is good posting....

happy with my vote on Muffin at the moment, but would like to see Jon answer my questions and Ecto's

[curiouskarmadog]

EBWOP Friggen dumb me cant even post quotes right....

Make a choice. Who do you think is most worthy of a lynch right now? Vote them. If you decide someone else is more worthy of a lynch, tell why.

Quick thing though, you wrote this part to Jon, but I also have to ask you this question because you say you are good with a muffin lynch, but havent voted him, you also find a few others scummy, but haven't FoSed or voted them. I'm not in a hurry to end this day by any means, but it seemed a lil contradictory to me.

this post seems like a goad to me. he has thrown plenty of suspicion out there and I dont think that a FoS is needed. he has posed some questions and thoughts and probably wants people to respond. i am noting this post for later.

I like Vi's entrance into the game. tons of content, but mostly opinion(at the end). I wish more people took stances like Vi.

I am interested in hearing jon's comment to Vi's post.

[curiouskarmadog]

muffin's lack of anything is telling.

[curiouskarmadog]

muffin's lack of anything is telling.

Not really.

I find it interesting that Muffin's case seems to be somewhat intertwined with that of Bogre, one theory being one of bussing Bogre. Yet, now that Bogre has been replaced and VI made a good entry, the focus is on Muffin and a claim?
While I cant discount the pressure for him to claim, I find this latest development to be an odd one. If Bogre is considered to be 'ok' for now, how are we still going after Muffin for bussing Bogrescum? I know there is more, but it seems like one leg was just kicked out.

it is telling, muffin came into the game spouting how he was the expert..now that he is getting heat nothing. Also, there was pressure for him to claim before VI joined the game.

My case against Muffin has nothing (if little) to do with Bogre.

[curiouskarmadog]

However, I would also expect a scum or SK to be hammering muffin if muffin were townie,

something about this statement doesnt sit right with me. if muffin is a townie, how do you know that the SK (if we have another) or scum are not already on the wagon?

[curiouskarmadog]

Mod: status on the muffin prod?

[curiouskarmadog]

Gone between 08/29 until 08/31, Bachelor Party..

[curiouskarmadog]

ok back with brusises.

I have never seen the show, so I dont know if the claim makes sense...

now, I am not sure what to do. we have a cop claim, I dont really believe the claim, but if he really is a cop there is no way mafia will let him live tonight. it really is all WIFOM conversation anyway..my gut says he is scum...

I am going to reread the passed couple pages a little more thoroughly. also, would like to review his play from yesterday...I know that cops tend to play a little more scummy so the mafia dont pop them off, but I didnt get an intial cop feel off Muffin...will post my thoughts in 1-2 days.

[curiouskarmadog]

I am going to go ahead and

unvote

(for now)...

Vi, I am not sure why you are asking "is it worth keeping a non-helpful townie around"...a townie is a townie, I am not about to lynch someone because I think they are just unhelpful..I will lynch someone who i think is scummy...AND if he is telling the truth he might be a "non-helpful" townie that has a cop role.

Muffin, at this point, i want a PbP breakdown...a sentence or two will do..but I want your opinion on everyone...quit lurking, or I will return my vote.

[curiouskarmadog]

I would like to hear his thoughts on everyone before he goes..either way this will provide a ton of information. I think his claim is bullshit....what I find strange is that Vi voted AFTER my unvote and request for information from muffin, is there some reason you didnt want to hammer Vi, but wanted to be part of the lynch?

at any rate, I will return my vote and hammer unless, muffin provides something soon!

[curiouskarmadog]

muffin you did not do what I asked....you comment on some of the people, not all.

all we really get is a dedication post...your next post better be a PbP of what you think of EVERYONE...or to ask for a replacement, if not I will hammer....I dont buy the pity party your painting at the moment.

[curiouskarmadog]

the more I reread muffin, the more I dont believe his bullshit...I dont think he is going to post. I gave him a chance to actually try to help us if he is the cop. I have stated my case for several pages now, and I think i have found scum...so I will return my vote and hammer.

at this point, either way, much information can be obtained.

vote (hammer) muffin

[curiouskarmadog]

Nice 2 for 2 for this game.

ok, going to post when I have a moment...getting close to the "big date" for me....and my future mother-in-law is coming in today..will try to post a response to the events of yesterday and today (thus far)....

it is hard for me to swallow that ecto was so blatantly defending muffin if they were partners...I need to see the timing of when the "defense" began...I think Ecto would say that it wasnt a defense as it was an attacking on the "weak" case against muffin...but I for one, dont think the case was weak...anyway, I need to review the timing of it all.

I have not liked Coug for some time. Also need to see when he jumped on and off things yesterday..his vote today, seems hasty especailly given that Ecto has not posted yet today and Coug states that he hasnt given this game a "good reread".

also jon has not really committed to anything....this is sending off huge alarms.

[curiouskarmadog]

I dont believe as some of you do that scum should be lynched as soon as you find them. More can be gained by keeping them talking than by lynching them, if that is, you already know they are scum, and some of you were too damn certain, werent you? Best thing for a scum that has been found out is to shut up and not say a thing.

interesting statement...are you saying you thought muffin was scum and you were trying to get more information?..or am I reading this incorrectly?

[curiouskarmadog]

did you answer my question?

[curiouskarmadog]

did you answer my question?

I did answer your question. Muffin might have been scum, or he might not have been, that point is irrelevant. What is relevant is that there is a situation whereby you can get a good result from a claimed cop, regardless of their alignment. After I thought about it, I realized that we couldn't in this case because you have to know that there is only one scum.
We never quite got that far in the discussion though did we? Someone HAD to hammer. (Oh wow, it was you CKD)
I think it was clear that I was busy pursuing avenues of information. I think it equally clear that my line of investigation (though incorrect upon further thought) was cut short. At the time, you had no idea whether my line of investigation would yield results or not, and so you offed your scum mate before anything could possible be revealed. (Ironically enough, there was nothing, but you had to act anyhow)

vote CKD

so i ask you a question and you OMGUS vote me? At first I was having trouble swallowing that you were scum because of your blatant defense of muffin...but then you came back with, "I thought he was scum, but wanted to get more information"..I wanted to make sure that was what you were saying so I asked you to clarify and then you attack me...that is indeed NOT what you were doing yesterday...

Im a sucker for flavor. Yosarian has

strong

ties to the whiskers. he could be a cop. leave him be.

Hmm, what has been termed a terrible defense on my part is in actuality my display of the weakness of the case. Do not attack others for your failures, rather modify them, or own up to them.

You were defending muffin WELL before he claimed cop.

Well, you do try Vi, I'll give you that. But listen, in my estimation, much of what you said could be explained by Muffin simply being lazy. I think this is why people are pushing the 'utility lynch' angle. (An angle I do not agree with without a deadline hanging over our heads) In my experience though, lazy is not equal to scum.
I do agree with you that at this point a replacement can be hoped for, but I would be content to see Muffin come back and apply himself.

There are several other quotes(this was just an example), people should go back and read for themselves. You not only defended muffin and (tried to coach him) but you tried to discredit those who were attacking him. And today, you are completely back tracking and changing your story.

Vote ecto…

nice try.

[curiouskarmadog]

ECTO you seem to completely be overlooking this post...is that on purpose or did you just over look it.

I am going to go ahead and

unvote

(for now)...

Vi, I am not sure why you are asking "is it worth keeping a non-helpful townie around"...a townie is a townie, I am not about to lynch someone because I think they are just unhelpful..I will lynch someone who i think is scummy...AND if he is telling the truth he might be a "non-helpful" townie that has a cop role.

Muffin, at this point, i want a PbP breakdown...a sentence or two will do..but I want your opinion on everyone...quit lurking, or I will return my vote.

I unvoted when he was at -1....I gave him time to provide insight...when he DIRECTLY avoided this question (his next post avoided it) and continued lurking I thought it was quite scummy...he obviously wasnt going to provide any additional information....and if I remember right..all the time you were defending him...

now you are trying to spin it like you were scum hunting when what you were really doing was trying to get muffin off the hook...nice.

you are scum.

[curiouskarmadog]

you are scum.

A bold and risky statement, and one I'm getting closer to believing. But I'm not ready to vote just yet. Other players still need to weigh in with opinions on the subject.

I agree, but I currently have no good reason to doubt this statement. It is something risky to say, but the fact that he backs this up is making me debate whether it's even FoS-worthy, even if Ectomancer flips town. I do want to look at this later, though.

whoa what?....jesus, both Ecto and Coug make my alarms go off..

you think me calling Ecto scum could be FoS worthy? Why is that?

Vote: Ectomancer

for defending muffinhead solely on flavor.

Please explain how me calling Ecto scum and your above post are any different? jesus, this feels like someone setting up for a lynch tomorrow..."you want to look at this later"..when? later today? Tomorrow?

Christ...

unvote

for now...

if it is not obvious.

FoS both Coug and Ecto

waiting for posts from both.

[curiouskarmadog]

When anyone places a vote on someone..it is essentially saying "I think you are scum"....when I state "you are scum"..it is obviously my opinion, given the rest of the post before it. I did have "qualifers" (see the entire day). It wasnt like I came out of nowhere and said "you are scum" like you are implying...

my problem with your statement implies that you want us to think that you are contemplating FoSing my statement a.) without taking any of my other posts (to include the rest of the post that "you are scum" was in) into consideration and b.) implying that you are doing anything differently.

How is my "you are scum" statement combined with my last 3-5 posts worse (and more FoS worthy) than you hasty vote with a one line case at the beginning of the day? I find double standards scummy.

Then to say you will review it later, makes me wonder about Ecto's alignment...or at least your knowledge of his alignment (meaning, it almost appears you know he will flip town).

[curiouskarmadog]

this is why I am not as certian...posts like this.

curiouskarmadog does come off as panicky to me despite my current belief that he is town. I do not think he and Ectomancer are scumbuddies.

why didnt you make comments like this BEFORE Rhino said it? So explain to me, WHY I am coming off panicky?....because I unvoted ecto? What was panicky about that? One minute you are role fishing ("CKD could be a cop"), next you are warping your motivations around others ("yeah, CKD is coming off panicky").

I am not liking your play today...I didnt like your play yesterday....I was pretty sure Ecto was scum, until you came out with that "I will have to review this comment later" post....Classic example of laying down the ground work for a set up tomorrow if Ecto flips town....what I am think now though, is that if we DO have another SK floating about...Coug is it. Post that leaves himself open to manuver tomorrow. Oppurtunistic voting. Following other's leads on motivation...classic...I have seen it many times. Of course, people busted my balls about the "to be honest" bit too.

Let it be known, that I still hold Ecto high on my scum list, but Coug's play today has put him well over that suspicion...

vote Coug

[curiouskarmadog]

P.S. - Posting walls of text, then later going back and saying "Look, you didnt respond to something", is really beneath response. If something wasn't answered, ask again without the scummy drama.

so did you not read Rhino's "wall of text"? If you did, why did you not answer the questions in it?

[curiouskarmadog]

Jesus christ...I think both of them are scum

You cut off a line of questioning I was pursuing, deal with the fact that I dont like you having done it.

what line of questioning did I cut off? (please provide the post number)

Did you or did you not defend muffin yesterday for MOST of the day?

Did you ever say you didnt believe the cop claim (please provide the post number)

[curiouskarmadog]

wow, this wasnt even in a wall of text, but you ignored it anyway.

P.S. - Posting walls of text, then later going back and saying "Look, you didnt respond to something", is really beneath response. If something wasn't answered, ask again without the scummy drama.

so did you not read Rhino's "wall of text"? If you did, why did you not answer the questions in it?

you DID defend him yesterday...you DID NOT ask him questions and you WERE NOT waiting for answers. IT does matter if you stated you believed him or not yesterday...it gives your back track today some weight...

you had already implied in a least 2 posts that you were leaning to believing him.

I am tired of your lies.

At this point, i think Coug is an SK and Ecto is mafia.

unvote, vote Ecto.

this puts him at -1

I think it is time for you to claim.

[curiouskarmadog]

Give me three examples from completed games of saying "I don't know how to go about such and such a comment, but it is noted" being an attempt at lining up lynches later and I'll believe your argument.

I seriously thought you were town, CKD. Now I'm having serious doubts.

FoS: curiouskarmadog

if I go and pull 3 games...and you believe my arguement..what will happen then, you will vote yourself? You will unFoS?....I will do it, if you promise to read the games and the outcomes...for it will take some time to pull them.

also, i find it interesting that you "have doubts" but still continue to vote with me.

jesus, I am so torn at this point.

[curiouskarmadog]

ECTO QUIT AVOIDING QUESTIONS

you STILL didnt answer the question ecto (this is the 3rd time I am asking it)..

did you READ the wall of texts or not...please quit avoiding the question...if you did, why did you not respond as you read?..that is typically how it is done here on mafia, you have been around for awhile so you should know that.

Also, do you think walls of text are scummy?...and before you answer, know that I am king of meta.

also, claim.

[curiouskarmadog]

if you think walls of text are scummy...explain this post?

Alright, let's do some loose theorizing here.

I dont think it is a far stretch to assume that Clock was working alone. (though I still say the possibility, however small, exists for 2 scum groups of 2) Regardless, another scum faction exists in the game and had no idea of Clock's alignment.

What would they do? I may be circling the WIFOM maelstrom and just may possibly fall in, but here goes:

They could assume Clock was town.
They might have gotten lucky and guessed him as a Predator.

I think the greater likelyhood is they would have thought him town. (as I did at one time)

So I think there are a couple of positions scum would try to occupy, depending upon whether MM is scum himself or not.

Let's say MM is town.

Early on in the wagon, scum might see a townie (Clock) attacking another townie (MM). At that time, one of the scum would be tempted to lend some early support to the wagon make sure it takes off. A researcher would comb this time frame for interactions.
Later in the wagon, if it looked like MM was going to be lynched for sure, if they had jumped on early, they would certainly be sitting securely there, and maybe even a little quiet about the whole thing now. If they had not voted against MM, in order to be active, they would probably be looking to toss in a few lines for the next day lynch by gently forwarding a case against someone else, or prepping for the Clock lynch if MM turned up town. (but not enough to derail the MM wagon)

Now, if we assume MM scum:

Early on, who knows what his partners would be doing.
Middle round, as the wagon builds, they might start getting nervous and feel obliged to defend MM, maybe subtly if they are feeling momentum going the wrong way. I believe this is also a good place to bus a partner if you can feel that the case is going to go through.
Late rounds, it is almost too late to bus, but scum might still do it, usually without advancing the case, just rehashing or rephrasing old arguments.

Now all of this seems to point to me wanting to lynch MM, because I think we could get some decent information if we knew his alignment. I hesitated to put forth that idea originally because, as you can see, the information would be dubious, unless he turns up scum. But there actually is a good and valid reason to lynch MM today, and that has to do with Clock turning up Predator.

If we assume Clock was a day SK, he had no idea of MM's alignment. You see, I was going to go back to my case against SC, because I moved off of it due to Clock's case against MM being a better one (IMO). SC's case is still pretty good.

However.

If I'm an SK, I scum hunt. I need them dead, the sooner, the better.

To me, that means that Clock's case isn't trash to be tossed aside. I think it was an honest one.

With that assessment:

vote MafiaMann

I think the case was a good one, and though the information gained may be too WIFOMish to use, I would still like to know whether Clock was right.

interesting you are taking credit for Clock...Maybe you need to reread again...and see exactly who nabbed Clock on a scum tell first....you are using that as your defense, yet your vote is on me when I was actually the first one to attack clock..scummy and ironic

but for the sake of the arguement..lets say that you were on to clock first and his death was solely because of you..

soo?

I dont think you are a SK I think you are mafia...the mafia probably wants the SK(s) dead as much as we do...so what?

so no claim huh?..cant think of another good lie?

reconfirm vote on Ecto

or "you are scum"

[curiouskarmadog]

so when Rhino posts it is "wall of text" when you post it is a "large post"..one thing is scummy, but when you do it, it is meaningless.

Funny you didnt speak up when muffin was asked to claim...

here is a question that doesnt need a defense..so it should be easy to answer.

who are your top two scum suspects right now and why.

[curiouskarmadog]

Jon, I would also like to hear your top two scum suspects.

[curiouskarmadog]

post number?

[curiouskarmadog]

unvote,

well at this point either Jon and Ecto are in it together (which would be a horrid scum play) or Jon is telling the truth.

I have no reason to doubt this claim. I dont need an explanation for I understand each. Espeically Cass night 2.

So Ecto and Cass are not mafia, but they can still be SKs (99% sure Cass is not an SK)....even though I have a huge scum vibe off Ecto, I am not seeing him as a SK. I can not see Ecto(SK) defending someone (muffin) without knowing his alignment...seems way too risky for an SK.

thats leaves the obvious for me.

vote Coug.

[curiouskarmadog]

Rhino, I think that Coug is a SK (pred) maybe even mafia (but doubtful). If you take jon's claim at face value...then either you or wolf are mafia....if you are mafia, you are playing a good game, so I am leaning wolf. However, I am not 100% confident of jon's claim, but I have no reason to question it at the moment. Coug and Ecto were at the top of my scum list today...if jon is vouching for Ecto, then my vote returns to Coug, unless anything else happens.

also, getting close to the big date (see sig)...might be a very light poster till Tuesday.

[curiouskarmadog]

also, left breadcrumbs for my role, but dont want to reveal just yet (once you find out you will understand). I dont know if I agree with there being just one scum yet....I have a feeling there might be another SK...I also think that the SKs just have a one shot day kill thing.

happy with my vote, not surprised the coug fos Jon...

last post for a bit me thinks.

[curiouskarmadog]

married...now cleaning up...will post in the next couple of days

[curiouskarmadog]

(posting in all my games)....hoping to update this by thursday, house is in disorder, catching up on work, etc etc.

this game is second in line to update..

[curiouskarmadog]

other game went to night before I could update...so this is on top of the heap...hitting it tomorrow.

[curiouskarmadog]

going back to page 22 to get caught back up

[curiouskarmadog]

Ok I believe jon’s claim (for now)…If we have a cop (that is not jon) they would have counter claimed by now and it is a huge gambit for mafia or even an SK to pull. I have reason to believe that jon can only find commandos and not predators, so in my view that still leaves Ecto and Cass open to be an SK. HOWEVER, I am 99% sure that Cass is not an SK and I don’t believe that Ecto’s play looks SKish. I thought he was scummy, but only if he was mafia..not seeing an SK from him.

Now there is the GF possibility, so that could leave both Cass and Ecto in the running for mafia, but I don’t think that should be considered today. Jon was there anything in your claim suggesting that there could be a GF?

Due to claims and soft claims, I think at this point, we have one mafia and one SK left. For mafia (today) that leaves Coug, Rhino, and wolf. For SK that leaves Coug, Rhino, wolf, and Ecto…I am taking Ecto out of that pool because of previous stated beliefs. Rhino has a pretty convincing claim and I think he has breadcrumbed it early on..so he is out (today anyway)…that leaves wolf and Coug.

Wolf, pegged me scummy on day one, but the way jumped on the muffin wagon doesn’t seem like bussing. Coug just looks pragmatic through and through. I think his play could be mafia or SK. Though I am/was leaning SK, I have stated this several times. He jumps on the hot wagon of the hour and when jons throws some heat his way, he tries to discredit the claim cop. Only mafia would do that today When I call him on it, he votes me.

I'm still pretty certain curiouskarmadog is scum (and

vote: curiouskarmadog

, by the way—still don't like your overreaction today), but if curiouskarmadog is not scum and jonathan83 is telling the truth, then by process of elimination at least one of wolframnhart and I scum.

This is just a strange phrasing…why by process of elimination would you be scum?...dont you know that you are not? This also seems like he is setting something up for tomorrow with inside knowledge no matter the result today. Why are you not hypothesizing outcomes tomorrow if I am scum? You seem like you already know I will flip town if hung today.

I will be utterly shocked if Coug is not hung today.

Couple question though.

Rhino, why did you claim? You weren’t under any pressure (as far as I could see) after Jon’s claim. Why didn’t you wait? Wouldn’t it have been better to claim only if you had gotten some pressure..there might be a chance that you could have foiled a NK if you remained silent.

Wolf, now that jon has claimed, what are your thoughts about him? About Coug..do you think he is mafia, SK, or town? Why or why not?

Ecto, I don’t think I understand your SK theory (have to help kill a town first)…wasn’t someone killed Day 1 by a SK?

I also would like everyone’s thoughts about the a GF…if you believe everyone’s claim seems like the town is favored in the set up. I doubt the mod set it up that way.

[curiouskarmadog]

also, if for some reason I am offed today (SK) or tomorrow...my crumbs make sense with my role.

[curiouskarmadog]

Ecto, but didnt a SK make a kill before anyone died(Day 1)?...still confused.

Coug, I note your attempts to try to paint for us a smaller possible scum group ....Coug, with all of the claims and soft claims..you think there is just one scum left?...isnt that a little lopsided for town?

[curiouskarmadog]

I will be utterly shocked if Coug is not hung today.

[curiouskarmadog]

CKD, would you be willing to outline the points against coug that point to him being commando?

will address this, this weekend.

[curiouskarmadog]

forgot about this game...ok checking in...post coming tomorrow.

[curiouskarmadog]

Vote Coug,

he IS the SK, you should have killed me yesterday, man.

I am Tosca the Seeker, not to quote my PM, I am essentially a Pred cop. This is why I had a hard time with jon role claim yesterday…and this is why I stated:

Ok I believe jon’s claim (for now)…If we have a cop (that is not jon) they would have counter claimed by now and it is a huge gambit for mafia or even an SK to pull. I have reason to believe that jon can only find commandos and not predators,

My role description specifically says I can only “see” the predators around us.

Night 1 Investigate wolf, not a SK
Night 2 Cass, not a SK
Night 3 Coug, SK “circling” the “family”

I left some blatant clues and some less than obvious clues (actions) about these investigations.

also, if for some reason I am offed today (SK) or tomorrow...my crumbs make sense with my role.

When asked what I thought about wolf, I mentioned that:

Due to claims and soft claims, I think at this point, we have one mafia and one SK left. For mafia (today) that leaves Coug, Rhino, and wolf. For SK that leaves Coug, Rhino, wolf, and Ecto

I mentioned why I thought Ecto and Rhino were not the SK, but did not address wolf (in reference to the SK), I only addressed him in reference to mafia. I was hoping that this would portray a known fact. I mention yesterday that if I should die, some of my statements would make since.

Wolf, pegged me scummy on day one

, but the way jumped on the muffin wagon doesn’t seem like bussing.

I threw both Ecto and wolf out of contention of a lynch yesterday based on partial investigation results (mine and jon).

For Cass, the obvious.

I have no reason to doubt this claim. I dont need an explanation for I understand each. Espeically Cass night 2.

So Ecto and Cass are not mafia, but they can still be SKs (99% sure Cass is not an SK)....

so in my view that still leaves Ecto and Cass open to be an SK. HOWEVER, I am 99% sure that Cass is not an SK

I investigated wolf Night 1 because I got newbie scum vibes off of him, and cass because I thought he was blatantly lurking.

Last night it just have been obvious who I was going to investigate…

He is a SK.

Now I don’t know if we have a mafia left or not. A day killing SK, a night killing SK, and a 3 man mafia team seems too much…but given the amount of claims maybe not. Especially if SKs are only a one shot deal, which I think they are. If we do have a mafia, what happened to their kill last night? If both Coug and the mafia killed jon, that indicates to me that the mafia doesn’t have a GF (why kill the cop?), thus confirming Ecto and Cass. At any rate, I don’t think we have a mafia left.

I think this game is wrapped up.

[curiouskarmadog]

LOL, you "call bullshit"?....as in you dont believe it and I didnt say enough to make you change your mind?

I just got an investigation result stating you were a SK and you come back with that?

LOL, you should have killed me yesterday, bud.

[curiouskarmadog]

again, you say the claim doesnt make any sense. You have yet to deny being a SK in the past two posts.

got you

[curiouskarmadog]

I am not currently in any game that is waiting for a death scene...also, you keep referencing an ongoing game(s) (mine or yours I am not sure, and I think that is just poor play and against the rules)...feel free to meta my current games if you wish, I am not in that many at the moment.

I have no reason to lie...if I am lying, I will be killed tomorrow..quit trying to delay the game and squirming out of your lynching. I have caught you.

[curiouskarmadog]

it doesnt matter to me either way...I feel like we got this game in the bag...Ecto is not going to say anything that is going to change my vote.

[curiouskarmadog]

Cass, I dont think I udnerstand your reasoning. Either I am lying or I am not. I think there is just one more scum...if you are hesitant..lynch me today then Coug tomorrow or lynch Coug today still equals one a win for us.

Cass, did you read Coug's reaction to my result?

Coug, why are you still trying to soft claim? If I am hung today, your weasling ass WILL not be able to get out of it tomorrow, so just stop and except it. If it is today or tomorrow, we have won this game.

[curiouskarmadog]

To tell the truth, I don't have any evidence to say that curiouskarmadog is definitely Commando or definitely a predator, but with the role I have he has to be one of those two things, and I believe the consensus is that curiouskarmadog is probably not Commando given the flavor.

this role seemed like you were trying to back track and false claim.

[curiouskarmadog]

"to tell the truth"..jesus christ I missed that.

[curiouskarmadog]

eh, I thought Coug might have been a Sk which would have bought me some town cred....As I dont see a way to argue out of this I am mafia and I will vote myself, and maybe earn some brownie points from the Mod.

Vote CKD

yeah I was setting up for a fake claim when wolf was a round that would have won us the game, but he town tide turned out of no where to hang wolf over Coug, which left me with a bunch of breadcrumbs that a.) didnt make any sense and b.) were now holding me down.

We should have killed Jon the night before he claimed...if Rishi posts the mafia chat you can read all about it. good game town.

I think Cass (or Rhino) hit it on the head yesterday with this comment.

"maybe CKD is the last remaining commando and doesn't know if coug really is an sk or if 1 even exists"

[curiouskarmadog]

I havent lost a game as scum in awhile..good show.

my ground work for my fake claim screwed me.

again good show town, unless Rhino IS the SK...then very good job Rhino

[curiouskarmadog]

Well, I thought we had that won until the wolf lynch. it was quick and unpredicted. I didnt know what to do going into the night....I spent most of the night trying to figure out my claim. I orginally was going to claim SK cop, then I thought Shrink. Then I thought about a watcher/tracker role...but none of the claims made sense with the crumbs I left. If wolf had lived and Coug would have been hung instead, I was going to turn around next day and claim that Rhino was the SK. I thought about not killing jon but Cass. I figured Jon would investigate me that night (because I wasnt on the wolf lynch)...I could have argued a jon/ecto connection, but once one flipped town..that would have been bad.

Pretty much all game, Coug hit my radar as scum (SK). I thought I might have a chance because I thought Coug was a SK, but then conversation changed that even if Coug did flip SK I was still scum Mafia SK cop. I hadnt even thought of that possibility (from the town perspective) while putting together a claim. I thought about saying I falsed claim to draw a kill, but I dont think anyone would have bought that.

for the record...overreaction = scummy, is bullshit. I have been hung (or vig killed) so many times as town because people peddling that crap. I always play hot and angry, any meta of me would show you that...and as town (and I guess scum too)..I always attack anyone who pushed that as a case.

Next time, I will definately go with my gut about who to kill. I would have killed jon, but was talked out of it. The town was saved because of that claim. I almost had Ecto hung.

We did try to kill Rhino one night..

I think Rhino played a great game, even though you were wrong about me. Cass I think had good instinct...

Muffin pissed me off, first with his "I have the most experience here" comment, then his scummy playing, his claim was poor (though I guess mine wasnt much better), and then his lurking....if that is what experience teaches you, I dont want any of it.

Wolf's play Day 1 was super scummy, but he corrected his play and I felt he ended up doing a fair job.

Myself, learned to not fake crumb so heavily, for nothing is certian.

I will comment on the set up once a list of roles and NIght actions are posted.

[curiouskarmadog]

for the record...overreaction = scummy, is bullshit. I have been hung (or vig killed) so many times as town because people peddling that crap. I always play hot and angry, any meta of me would show you that...and as town (and I guess scum too)..I always attack anyone who pushed that as a case.

[curiouskarmadog]

lol, that is true..I wasnt lying. I almost didnt bring it up here because I didnt want that kind of attention at that time...but then I realized there was a couple other games I was having the same arguement in..if anyone would have meta-ed me in this game and saw that I wasnt following up here too...it could have hurt me in other games.

I have been proven wrong in another game....I brought up the arguement, and someone meta-ed a couple random games....apparently townies say it as often as scum...though, I was right in this game was I not?

[curiouskarmadog]

you played fine dont beat yourself up about it. You had a good point about jon and if I REALLY wanted to kill him it would have been done..I tend to be very aggressive...so dont sweat that. after your Jon case feel through, you should have made a case against Coug or myself....