Mini 2079 - Guns & Roses [Game Over]

[Lady Lambdadelta]

Vote: Something_Smart

[Lady Lambdadelta]

[Lady Lambdadelta]

pretty sure 8 roses means the optimal play is for everyone to not say a word about their choice, argue with me in thread if you think different but please no one claim anything until someone gives a good reason.

VOTE: popsofctown

you were the person who taught me how to play league of legends, a clearly immoral thing to do

[Lady Lambdadelta]

oh btw I think LLD randed wolf

Man are you really gonna make me play this game seriously?

I wanted to play the whole game with the Song Name thing.

Take the fun right out of it, eh?

[Lady Lambdadelta]

pretty sure 8 roses means the optimal play is for everyone to not say a word about their choice, argue with me in thread if you think different but please no one claim anything until someone gives a good reason.

VOTE: popsofctown

you were the person who taught me how to play league of legends, a clearly immoral thing to do

Anyway what I meant by this is that we have one gunner and that person is a more or less named townie. Obviously the issue is that if you claim that the other 8 roses become obvious to scum but the question you have to ask is "what are the scenarios where scum can kill all the roses... and NOT the one gunner.... and not win automatically?"

And I can't think of one. I literally can't think of one.

So I think the gun should claim ON THE DAY they shoot to be a named townie that day and shoot that night.

And no rose should ever ever ever claim their night they are safe. Ever.

[Lady Lambdadelta]

By automatically I mean "have already won by the conventional rules of mafia" not "by the rose condition"

[Lady Lambdadelta]

Like simple math from my perspective solves that problem, so I'm uncertain exactly what your fear is Hito.

The only thing we have to protect is "not getting the named townie night vig killed before they can use their shot"

and even then town vigs are negative EV sooooooooooooooooooo

[Lady Lambdadelta]

hitogoroshi is town but his proposed strategy of having the gun claim immediately is garbage. having them claim on whatever day they have a shot is 100% the correct call.

I feel pretty confident calling popsofctown and Alisae town as well.

LLD feels the scummiest so far.

VOTE: Lady Lambdadelta

Remind me who it was that correct Hito and suggested that "100 percent the correct call" again?

And then answer the question: What exactly about my play has been scummy so far in relation to your apparently strong town reads?

And here's the real kicker: If you answer contains anything wishy-washy along the lines of "oh it was gut" or "oh I don't have any strong scum reads" after the way in which you confidently ran down the rest of the list

I'll be on your ass today driving you into the ground.

So let's hear it b'y. Show me exactly how your mental process came around to make this post, because these reads feel fucking fabricated as shit. Let's go, one shot, one opportunity motherfucker.

[Lady Lambdadelta]

Man I should just pay someone to piss me off every mafia game, it invests me instantly.

[Lady Lambdadelta]

(and if anyone wants to know why those reads feel Fabricated, I'm not giving that reasoning until after buddy posts his response, because that'd be too easy for him to find some way to worm post facto logic in there)

I wanna see him justify or die~

[Lady Lambdadelta]

oh btw I think LLD randed wolf

Man are you really gonna make me play this game seriously?

I wanted to play the whole game with the Song Name thing.

Take the fun right out of it, eh?

you know ur scum when you gotta make this post.

Three things:
1) You know personally what my scum game is like
2) You have been fooled by me in every game I've been scum and you've been town
3) you're saying this shit but I don't see a vote, so are you scared or what?

[Lady Lambdadelta]

What I'm basically saying is, money where your mouth is. You seem content to take shots from the sidelines, and I ain't with it.

Like, I feel like there's some part of me that says if you were town you'd not be concerned about poking me, you'd vote me and desperately want me to die if you really felt this way.

You would be really motivated to see me dead.

But you ain't. You're playing sideline gigs so what gives.

[Lady Lambdadelta]

Vote: Something_Smart

Oh and this vote wasn't random, by the by. S_S's entrance was not good. Actively choosing to decline the gambit choice (be the third vote on the Pops wagon v. start your own RVS wagon) and just post an empty phrase as he did feels like he was trying to slip into the thread, look like he's arrived but dodge having to enter crossfires early.

[Lady Lambdadelta]

Why are we talking about CCing a vig claim
First off, anyone who saw that there was 11 players and thought “huh, ig I’ll take a gun anywhere that isn’t night 1” is probably bad or scum.
Second off, just shoot the fucker

Tbh I feel like I figured out a lot of pro strats for this setup but I don’t want to out them because
A. I’m a bitch
B. Its anti-town.

Anyhow ah shit here we go again
VOTE: LLD

When did you go and get bad at this game, by the way?

[Lady Lambdadelta]

Like for real what is that post actually saying

It says nothing. You've said nothing.

You comment on the 1 vig stuff with meaningless drivel about your own preferences for when to choose a Vig, and then advise on nonsense that will never fucking happen. No one is going ot CC the vig claim, it's literal suicide at best and game throwing if they're town at worst.

Then you say you have strats but you won't post them. Ok, that's fine. It's anti-town to post them that's with I get it but then why say it? Why mention it to begin with?

You just wanna increase credibility and pad your posting so you can slip that vote in there? without commenting back to me?

You ARE scared aren't you?

[Lady Lambdadelta]

Man you lucky I wanna see what S_S says about why he didn't vote in his opening post (or comment on anything at all) and that I wanna hear what Xyzzy says about his nonsense.

Cause I'd love to vote your ass right now and watch you squirm tbh. Your posts are nonsense, they contain no relevant content, you show no town motivation in any of you actions.

You're just applying meaningless pressure to a slot that will never fold under pressure, so you're learning literally nothing. This whole fucking interaction will end with a bunch of townies going "it's NAI" and waving their fucking hands.

So what's your motivation then yeah? What you think comes out of this?

[Lady Lambdadelta]

And I honestly can't tell if it's because you've grown jaded with Mafia and just can't seem to remember how to fucking play, or if it's because you're scum and you're shooting an angle at me because this is the best time to do it.

I feel like in either case it feels pre-meditated. You planned to come into this game and push on me no matter what I said, it's just whether you're a townie who doesn't understand how the fuck reaction tests and pushes work (see: your lack of a vote until I called you on it for not voting me after calling me scum.... twice) or if you're scum who just wanted to play this angle, pick a fight with me and watch the thread explode.

[Lady Lambdadelta]

first, being the person to propose the correct strategy in a previously unplayed open setup is not a town tell, and proposing a suboptimal strategy is not necessarily a scum tell.

out of six players who've posted so far besides me, I have one strong town read, two pretty good town reads, and one scum read -- and I explicitly stated that you were the scummiest so far, because that is completely subject to change once all the other players show up. obviously my scum reads on page 2 aren't going to be airtight, but whereas hito's setup analysis came off as pretty genuine, yours felt... not.

also, Alisae saying you seemed scummy so far very early on caught my attention -- it made me reassess your first couple posts, and I felt like they came off as you trying to be present early on without necessarily being

involved

early on.

anyway your weirdly over the top hostile tone to being scumread this early in the game is a really bad look! freaking out and writing 7 posts in like 20 minutes does not help your case

Cool awesome, so here we go.

In order:

He town reads Hito, the person who is sufficiently easy to town read because you can point at Hito's setup spec and go "wrong but town" and literally no one will question you.

He town reads Alisae because it helps him push on his intended target (me) because she's already entered with stated suspicion on me and creating that bond works well for him.

You'll notice here, he's yet to give anything about why I am scum except "Hito felt genuine, you didn't"

Except he

admits that I had the correct speculation and tells me that it's not alignment indicative.

So which way is it, my dude? Did I genuinely provide speculation for the town, and it's Null, or did I attempt to gain credit off it at that time, and it's scum?

You can't have it both ways.

Which is just further evidence that you don't have anything and this was a failed push attempt.

Finally, you come back at the end here saying that my surge of posting "isn't a good look" in an attempt to re-validate your vote because you have nothing else to stand on but the fact is you don't even say WHY that's not a good look. You have no reads, no motivation and no reasoning beyond ones you are LITERALLY FABRICATING FOR A NARRATIVE.

VoteL Xyzzy

[Lady Lambdadelta]

Why are we talking about CCing a vig claim
First off, anyone who saw that there was 11 players and thought “huh, ig I’ll take a gun anywhere that isn’t night 1” is probably bad or scum.
Second off, just shoot the fucker

Tbh I feel like I figured out a lot of pro strats for this setup but I don’t want to out them because
A. I’m a bitch
B. Its anti-town.

Anyhow ah shit here we go again
VOTE: LLD

When did you go and get bad at this game, by the way?

WAIT
I WAS GOOD AT MAFIA?
THIS IS NEWS TO ME.

. Wait why are you calling me bad on page 3 that doesn’t make sense.

You were good at mafia when you actually considered why people did things and then pursued those avenues of thought to see if their mentality and responses were consistent with that world view. I remember playing with you and I remember you doing well by your own style, but you still INVESTIGATED SHIT.

If the best you ahve right now is "she did her Sona schtick" which I did TWICE as scum, by the way, I have a better memory for it than you I'm aware. What do you even have? That I like a schtick and sometimes I did it as scum because in those games I rolled scum and Sona and could fake it thus?

I'm not Sona this game, I have no meta reason to fake it, no flavour role to get town cred for.

I just wanted to do it because it's fun.

So what motivation do I have and what do I have to gain by using something I know I've done as scum before when there's no meta benefit or flavour benefit (the reasons I did it in the past) for doing it this time?

[Lady Lambdadelta]

Ask yourself that question, and come back with an answer. If you still think I'm scum after that and after these posts I can't help you and that's your choice. I'm not gonna bully you out of your vote, but at the end of the day it frustrates me.

Also, I've settled that despite Alisae's gross emotional manipulation potential ont he post about the 451 game above, I think she's almost certainly town and I don't see her doing that anyway but town there.

So I think Xyzzy is probably scum and I still want words with S_S

[Lady Lambdadelta]

Also let's be perfectly honest, I'm really upset you've said that shit to me after.... I'm gonna keep that personal detail out, how about that. This is me posting as Alexis the person not LLD the player?

If you're that scared of me and you've got a problem, not talking to me about it, then approaching me about [Redacted] to vent about and asking for my trust, then coming in here and telling me you have that problem with me completely guts me as a person and it's kind of fucked.

Like, if you're using it as a game thing it's double fucked but just in general it's fucked that you came to me for [Redacted] and you still had this, like...

Especially since you paint me like some kind of villain when the scenario in the 451 game was very very far from the truth

[Lady Lambdadelta]

It's fucked up. I don't wanna talk about it no more. Spent enough of this thread on it. If you wanna talk about it after the game that's chill but I came here to play mafia.

When I asked if you were scared of me I meant scared I'd push back on you and lynch you if you were scum.

[Lady Lambdadelta]

Nah hold on this is actually fucked I feel like I can't do anything but base my read on whether Alisae is like, the kind of person who would say that to angle shoot at my feelings or just said it from the heart as town.

This is fucked.

[Lady Lambdadelta]

Like I have to just assume she's a decent person so she's town but like

that in and of itself is almost a method of confirmation outside of regular mafia

[Lady Lambdadelta]

Oh god it's a literal actual trust tell

"Trust that I'm not a bad person, so I'm town"

[Lady Lambdadelta]

I don't know what to do in this scenario.

[Lady Lambdadelta]

I'm gonna sleep on it. I don't know what to do. Xyzzy is still scum, that's still... its own thing

[Lady Lambdadelta]

I'll talk about the thing more iwth you after the game but I wanna be clear I didn't say I was disgusted and I never would for something like this. The closest thing to it I think you could mistake is when I said it "guts" me, which maybe you didn't get because it's a bit of a british/colonialism thing.

It references the term "Gutted", which just means saddened+disappointed+disheartened basically.

But not disgusted, no that's... that'd be cruel. I'm gutted, I'm heartsick, I'm all the above words.

[Lady Lambdadelta]

Hito talk to me about Implo, I don't really get your reasoning.

[Lady Lambdadelta]

Fakegod: Says a [1] by implosion in the vote count, ought to be [2].

Hito talk to me about Implo, I don't really get your reasoning.

Didn't you just get done saying that there are a bunch of reasons you might use your vote, rather than just wanting to lynch someone?

yeah! and some of those reasons I would expect implo to rally his townreads (maybe he wants a pressure reaction or something), and some others I would expect him to try to sell me why I'm wrong, some others he might say "hito talk to me about this S_S AIGHT read because he seems more of an OH DANG to me". But blank voting on someone with very little pressure feels bad for both pressure AND information, and when implosion has four "solid town" reads to work with, you'd think he would have been able to use them in conjunction with the vote some way or another, right?

LLD gimme your strongest town read plz

Wasn't obvious? Alisae.

Or do you want one that is non-ridiculous interaction based?

Because then it's Cephrir

[Lady Lambdadelta]

hey yeah sorry I meant to post yesterday but then I didn't because I'm a lazy fuck

I feel like a lot of the discussion re:LLD vs me comes down to LLD's meta, but tbh I know exactly nothing about her meta. can someone who knows things about that summarize what about this interaction feels town to them? I'm willing to be convinced, but for now I still feel like my initial reaction of thinking it's just an irrational, over the top response from scum is correct.

162 is very good -- Cephrir is town, I think.

Why is this person still aliiiiiiveeeeeeeeee

[Lady Lambdadelta]

I really wanna hear what Pine says about this. It'll be interesting to see how he reacts.

[Lady Lambdadelta]

Pine didn't respond huh?

Hmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmm

Should we build a wagon on pine he has to respond to then? I still think Xyzzy is way scummier but Pine slipping beneath the waters feels like a Bad End possibilty.

Vote: Pine

[Lady Lambdadelta]

Vote:Xyzzy

[Lady Lambdadelta]

It's more I got demotivated by the Alisae interaction, honestly.

Also, I resent that you think I'm a step above active lurking as either alignment? I always post content based shit, and I always engage with the game

I'm kind of honestly tired too because I just finished winning in the MU championship game I was win as scum so.

I can focus here a bit more now at least? I dunno.

[Lady Lambdadelta]

I feel like Pine is meant to know me better than that, and know I prefer scum over town, and if I do have an engagement preference its usually as scum?

Like I certainly don't get demotivated as scum... I rather enjoy it.

[Lady Lambdadelta]

Okay, it’s pretty clear I’m not going anywhere with my pops vote. You guys are fucking blind.

I’d vote LLD, but I think that’d put her to L-1 and I don’t want to do so without a chance for further discussion.

UNVOTE:

LLD is on notice[/b

Yeah the earlier shade that was mostly discredit and not really much of a read on anything + this cowardice in placing a vote makes me pretty confident in this.

Vote:Pine

My dude can't even fake it right. He doesn't think I'm scum, rather it feels like he knows I'm not and he's

terrified to engage me properly

for fear of me rallying on him. I mean Hito's on the edge with him, he's not exactly in a great position of town cred, he didn't show up yesterday despite my vote which I was willing to write off but with this context feels like it could have been calculated due to the fact his absence makes the Xyzzy lynch inevitable without blood on his hands?

Too much circumstantial and personality based evidence to ignore. Pine feels like he needs to be scum here, trying to organize a lynch of a player who could wake up from her stupor and swing the game at any time.

I believe he genuinely respects me, that's why I think he's scum. Otherwise he wouldn't pussy foot around my wagon twice, yet encourage others to read me as scum. He's trying to be hands off.

[Lady Lambdadelta]

ahhh

Vote: Pine

[Lady Lambdadelta]

Also I found scum Cephrir, if you were waiting for it.

Also like, effort is hard, and I need to use effort to obv-town. I'm trying b'y.

[Lady Lambdadelta]

Holy shit I actually survived

Can you please clarify *precisely* why you thought you were going to die last night?

I kind of want to write off Pine as town completely and ignore paranoia just because of the NK spec. I guess I shouldn't do that with the possibility of a vig shooting alisae and NK spec not being a guaranteed thing but like, if it wasn't a vig shot then I just don't understand why scum-pine *ever* kills Alisae unless his scumbuddy is pops and there's no way it's pops/pine based on the way pine is pushing pops. I feel like NK spec is underutilized these days and scum probably shot alisae partially to make a pine lynch easy today and it's just so... meh. Like, if we lynch pine and he flips town I feel like we go into tomorrow with nothing, and I think he's significantly more likely to flip town. I don't think his LLD pussyfooting is that meaningful because I don't think he's the kind of scum player who would be motivated in that way to specifically play around one town player.

LLD voting Pine is reasonable, but she's not giving any other opinions on anyone else. I understand demotivation (and the MU championship win is cool) but there's nothing really to analyze in what she's doing that she can't fake as scum.

What do you want me to tell you all the people I think are town? That seems a bit counter productive, I'd rather see what other people try to push and cut them at the knees when they try to push my town reads. Generates more interesting interactions that way. I feel like if I say things like "Hito is town!" people will shy away from him and then I don't get to do that.

Let me have my potential come back interaction points to re-engage in this game you goon.

[Lady Lambdadelta]

Also for the record, since Pine decided to bring up my meta here's a literal like, couple days old scum game of mine for you

https://www.mafiauniverse.com/forums/th ... 8RERAND%29

enjoy.

[Lady Lambdadelta]

Alright. Willing to agree w/ ceph and call cyanjet locktown.

What do you want me to tell you all the people I think are town?

If you're town, I'd like you to actively make yourself readable. You giving one scumread and no other opinions is only conducive to that if you happen to be online at the same time as that scumread. Playing slow and reactively is all well and good but you're effectively at L-2 with pine's presumed vote.

You think I care about how many votes I'm on?

I mean honestly, Ceph's vote is a BoP pressure vote that I expect from him as either alignment and says nothing.

Your vote is garbage as you apparently don't even actually have a read on me, and should know better than to think that any amount of pressure is going to get me to do or show anything.

You want to see me towntell or some shit, find another axis to interact with me on, because telling me "you're getting votes time to act how I tell you" ain't it, bruv.

[Lady Lambdadelta]

Your vote is garbage as you apparently don't even actually have a read on me, and should know better than to think that any amount of pressure is going to get me to do or show anything.

and yet here we are having this conversation! isn't it great?

Do you have any take on why Alisae is dead?

You're asking me to do NKA on a kill like that?

In a game where (admittedly low prob) she could have been shot by the one and only town vig and then we're doing confusion to ourselves?

Sure, fine.

Alisae was completely obvious town who never trusts herself to take a gun in any world and probably doesn't value herself to take a rose night 1. Rather, she thinks if she's going to die it'll be later one since she expects to live. Her interaction with me however skyrocketed her to obvious town and made her a very easy kill.

Side effects of the kill include: Reduction of a buffer against LLD lynches, reduced active town presence, reduction of pressure on Pine and S_S.

Likely people to make this kill are you, SS, Pine and Hitogoroshi.

Satisfied?

[Lady Lambdadelta]

You want to see me towntell or some shit, find another axis to interact with me on, because telling me "you're getting votes time to act how I tell you" ain't it, bruv.

What do you want to talk to people about, then?

Why would I feed you that? Isn't it more important you come up with those things? Isn't part of reading you that what things you decide to talk about are important to your motivations?

Sometimes I feel like I'm trapped in a box.

[Lady Lambdadelta]

Basically the kill produces apathy and encourages status quo and protects certain at risk players while making lynches on players who are less gated easier.

Like that kill makes Hito impossible to lynch but me easy to lynch.

Improves Pine and S_S's chances of living today, since she probably enters on one of them today.

And frankly, you asking that makes me feel like it's a motivation you could have easily produced and you should KNOW this, which makes me think you could have easily done and benefited from the kill too, since you saw some pressure yesterday as well.

[Lady Lambdadelta]

Ok I’m comfortable with an LLD vote now.

VOTE: LLD

heehhahHAHAHAHAHAHUEHAHAHEHAUEHEUEEHAHUEHEHE

LET'S GO SCUMFUCK.

ALL THE BENEFIT OF HIDING IN THE SHADOWS FINALLY DISAPPEARED EH?

GOTTA PUT THAT VOTE DOWN NOW HUH?

IMPLO IF YOU CALL THIS VOTE TOWN I'LL SKEWER YOU NEXT WHEN HE FLIPS SCUM BETTER HOP ON THE BUS NOW SO I CAN TOWN READ YOU.

YOU'LL TOTALLY FOOL ME LET'S GO.

CHOO CHOO

[Lady Lambdadelta]

HITO, BLOOD PACT ENGAGED.

IT'S TIME.

[Lady Lambdadelta]

fuck I want to play with Fate again...

now I'm actually depressed ahah...

[Lady Lambdadelta]

Okay, it’s pretty clear I’m not going anywhere with my pops vote. You guys are fucking blind.

seems kinda weird that you're writing off the pops town readers as all town when presumably one could be a nefarious scumbuddy you catch by judging the insincerity of the TR

Too much circumstantial and personality based evidence to ignore. Pine feels like he needs to be scum here, trying to organize a lynch of a player who could wake up from her stupor and swing the game at any time.

But what's your view of implosion here, LLD? Pine's switch to you seems largely to just be him following implosion after pops wagon didn't work out. I don't like how he abandoned pops wagon, but your argument seems contingent on the fact the swap is to you specifically, which seems a lot more rooted in implosion's play than Pine's.

I think in games full of passive players, the nka often doesn't need to get any more complicated than "kill the active players". Alisae was town read by like everybody, posting a lot and voting, I think that is probably the reason e died.

HITO, BLOOD PACT ENGAGED.

IT'S TIME.

Lemme keep a bead on Haschel for a bit and get back to you. I'm actually not that skeeved by Pine's jump on you, although I AM skeeved about the point I made above.

pops, whats up with the no vote chief

MY VIEW OF IMPLO IS HE IS NOT BUSSING THE SCUM AND IS INSTEAD VOTING YOU.

SEEMS BAD.

[Lady Lambdadelta]

CHOO CHOO IMPLO

[Lady Lambdadelta]

I mean yeah technically speaking my vote would be more dynamic voting someone who is here, but sometimes when people lurk for all their fuckin worth it's more important to just discretely document that you're not going to just randomly forget about them. I think Pine has a pretty good shot of flipping scum! But I also think that Haschel's back half of D1 seemed pretty insincere, his first real post of D2/vote will be very instructive, and the fact he's suddenly gone radio silent makes me feel even more uneasy (because trying to fake the "well, I had three scum suspects and the game started with two of them flipping town, so let me try to reset my thought process" dance is an annoying thing for scum to do, so a very plausible reason for lurking is that it's exhausting to run the counterfactual). So I would be pretty unhappy ending day without another post from Haschel, which means I would be silly to put Pine at L-1. But I'm also not going to

diffuse

Pine wagon, because I am pretty fond of it overall. Maybe Haschel does a good post and I feel better about being L-1 on Pine; maybe he does a bad post and I want it more then Pine, which will be the time to try to monger for support.

also like... I almost want S_S to be scum at this point for his own sake?? the dude has made 80 posts and voted a single time, on the Pine lurker wagon because we yelled at him to. If he's town that's like going to Disneyland and spending all week in the bathroom playing with the hand dryer, or something. like dude you have hand dryers in the bathroom at school, why did you want to go to Disneyland. what's this doin for you

YOU DENIED THE BLOOD PACT YOU DON'T DESERVE THE TOWN CRED FOR LYNCHING PINE.

FUCKING HASCHEL VOTE WHO THE FUCK VOTES HASCHEL HERE.

NOT CONTEMPLATING MY NAVEL ABOUT THAT ONE, THERE'S SOME OBVIOUS SUBTEXT MISSING, HMM WHAT COULD IT BEEEEEEEEEEE

YOU SHOULD CONSIDER ANOTHER WAGON IF YOU LIKE PLAYING IN THE DIRT WITH COUNTERWAGONS TO SCUM WAGONS HITO.

YOU SAID IMPLOSION IS TOWN RIGHT, WANNA CHOO CHOO HIM INSTEAD?

[Lady Lambdadelta]

also like... I almost want S_S to be scum at this point for his own sake?? the dude has made 80 posts and voted a single time, on the Pine lurker wagon because we yelled at him to. If he's town that's like going to Disneyland and spending all week in the bathroom playing with the hand dryer, or something. like dude you have hand dryers in the bathroom at school, why did you want to go to Disneyland. what's this doin for you

In addition to being an awful analogy, this is also misleading (it implies that I joined a mafia game only to not play mafia, which isn't at all what I'm doing), it doesn't really seem relevant (it's a very belated playstyle criticism that you've already acknowledged can be misguided town), and it is extremely convenient to a scum agenda (it looks like the perfect excuse to transition me from the town spot where you had me to somewhere low enough to mislynch).

But that aside. For someone who's touted the value of using your vote frequently, you really haven't gained much from it. (Or at least, if you have, you haven't shared it and you should.)

HEY FRIEND.

WANNA JOIN A CULT?

BLOOD FOR THE BLOOD GOD?

SKULLS FOR THE SKULL THRONE?

WE WILL SMITE THEM AS KHORNE DEMANDS!

GET UP ON MY PINE WAGON AND WATCH THE BLOOD OF FILTHY SCUMFUCKS FLOW

[Lady Lambdadelta]

EXTRA BONUS, YOU WON'T BE A PANSY TOWNIE LIKE HITO.

[Lady Lambdadelta]

My school didn't have hand dryers check your privilege

UR PROBABLY TOWN WHAT ARE YOU DOING TODAY

[Lady Lambdadelta]

YOU TWO FUCKS AREN'T ON ANY WAGON.

WAIT S_S ISN'T ON ANY WAGON AND HE'S COMPLAININ

[Lady Lambdadelta]

COOL I DON'T WANT S_S ON MY WAGON ANYMORE ANYWAY.

MY DUDE JUST CALLED HIMSELF A RATIONAL THINKER AND IMPLIED I DON'T THINK RATIONALLY.

I TOLD YOU WHY PINE IS SCUM. HE PUSSYFOOTTED WITH VOTINg ME WHILE I WAS BEING RUN UP BECAUSE HE WAS SCARED TO BE THE ONE WHO POKED THE BEAR AND NOW I'M AWAKE AND ONCE I VOTED HIM AND SHOWED I WASN'T GONNA ROLL OVER AND DIE HE COMMITTED HIS VOTE INSTANTLY.

ASK YOURSELF WHAT CHANGED IN MY PLAY REALLY. HE SAYS "HE WANTED TO GIVE ME A CHANCE OT DO SOMETHING AND HE DIDN'T LIKE IT BUT NEVER DESCRIBES WHAT IT IS HE DOESN'T LIKE OR HOW ANY OF THIS MAKES ME SCUM.

HE USED SHIT META THAT IS FALSE TO INTITIATE VOTES ON ME, THEN USED HIS OWN FAULTY LOGIC TO SUPPORT HIS POSITION WHEN HE WAS CHALLENGED BY ME.

AND NOW HIS WAGON ON ME IS GONE AND HE'S SUDDENLY DISAPPEARED, HOPING HE'LL BE OVERLOOKED LIKE YESTERDAY AND I'LL FIND SOME OTHER FUCK WHO WILL ANNOY ME AND MAKE ME LYNCH THEM.

LIKE YOU S_S.

DOES THAT MAKE YOU TOWN THINKINg EMOJI

BUT YEAH FUCK YOU AND YOUR RATIONAL THINKINg I HAVE PERFECTLY VALID REASONS BASED ON PINES BEHAVIOUR FOR THINKINg HE IS SCUM.

EAT A DONG

[Lady Lambdadelta]

My school didn't have hand dryers check your privilege

UR PROBABLY TOWN WHAT ARE YOU DOING TODAY

I may eventually vote Pine, but I don't want to see the day end soon. Haschel is definitely my runner up.

S_S seems too scummy to be scum in his lack of pushes. Scum often play by " I need to push anything very interesting even when I know everything every 3 pages, everything medium interesting even when I know everything every 5 pages, and even if I don't genuinely find anything interesting I need to come up with something every 7 pages", where town often play by "I'm gonna push everything that looks interesting given I don't know anything whenever it happens". S_S is failing both metrics but I think failing the former even harder. Meta might matter a lot for that it's something I might look into when I'm not v/la

I cant remember anything s_s has done this game either

IF I SAID THERE WERE SECRET REASONS NOT TO DO THE HASCHEL THING WOULD YOU BELIEVE ME?

I DON'T EVEN FULLY BELIEVE ME, BUT I HAVE THIS FEELING IN MY BONESSSSSS

AND ALSO THERE'S SCUM BLOOD TO BE SPILLED. CUT THE TREES.

[Lady Lambdadelta]

I feel like I've lost this round. I don't really see any path to getting my scumreads (Pops + LLD) lynched without first proving my intentions by flipping green. I'm not interested in pushing a save-myself-compromise because I have TRs on everyone else. I'll go back through some ISOs to see if I missed anything (having last minute doubts about Pops) and then take my ML like a man. It's likely necessary, though ofc not ideal.

LOOK AT THIS SCUM FUCK ROLLING OVER AND DOING THAT "FOR THE GOOD OF THE TOWN" APPEAL.

THE RULES ARE SIMPLE FOLKS. IF SOMEONE ASKS FOR DEATH, NEVER DENY THEM.

DON'T PLAY WIFOM GAMES. DON'T OUT GUESS YOURSELF. THEY SAY THEY'RE OK WITH DYING, PROVIDE THEM THE SWEET GLORIOUS DEATH THEY DESIRE.

[Lady Lambdadelta]

I wouldn't exactly call what you've done so far "cases". You've given a couple arguments here and there. And you're using emotion just as much as everyone else, and calling it unproductive while engaging in it is... unproductive.

Idk. If you're town I just want you to not just bite the lynch. But you just biting the lynch seems like a pretty sensible thing to do here as scum so :hitoshrug: (oh my hito is actually in this game uhhhhh)

Alright here.

No he isn’t. Go back to the scumthread.

Why. You've given two lines of justification for this and it was during a catchup post and you haven't mentioned him since then and neither of those lines has any real depth and I've given like 4 paragraphs arguing he's scum and you're complaining that people aren't using logic and argh

IT'S CAUSE HE'S SCUM AND HE AIN'T GOT SHIT MY DUDE

[Lady Lambdadelta]

he knows he's dying and is hoping to draw the counter claim, or live in a world where he appeals to absurdity.

That's all this is, it's not town. It's scum motivated. Pls lynch.

Not enough energy to do fate posting rn

[Lady Lambdadelta]

So since you're here and still voting Pine, ceph, what are the circumstances under which scum-Pine derives any benefit from this?

Hito is wrong that there's some world in which scum-pine lives, he obviously gets deadline lynched in the abscence of a CC.

What are the odds that the town gun is N3+ (which is a very foolish choice)?

It wasn't my choice, fwiw. I replaced one of FakeGod's irl friends.

Shouldn't there be two Town guns? 8 Town roses announced at game start, standard 10:3 distribution, 13 - 3 - 8 = 2.

Please lynch this, there's no way.

Non.

[Lady Lambdadelta]

There's only 11 players people.

Like

[Lady Lambdadelta]

Dude. LLD. Your desperation to get me lynched won't make up for the fact that you've done fucking nothing else all game.

My dude there is 0 percent chance you did not know there were only 11 players in this game after being in the game this long.

None.

You are fake claiming, your actions are scummy across the board. You Are Scum.

[Lady Lambdadelta]

Oh snap, you're right.

Sure, go ahead and CC me, then.

Does anyone actually believe this bit of theatre?

Also Pine is at L-1 from Pops' vote

[Lady Lambdadelta]

Dude. LLD. Your desperation to get me lynched won't make up for the fact that you've done fucking nothing else all game.

My dude there is 0 percent chance you did not know there were only 11 players in this game after being in the game this long.

None.

You are fake claiming, your actions are scummy across the board. You Are Scum.

Actually, there's 100% chance of that...why the FUCK would I make that mistake?

To create credence why you didn't claim having a gun 3 days ago and waited until your scum partner was replaced so you would have support.

[Lady Lambdadelta]

You as a townie never do this, you never miss this you read the game and see the vote counts ansd come the fuck on.

No this is theatre.

[Lady Lambdadelta]

OBVIOUSLY YOU CLAIM TO SAVE YOURSELF YOU FUCKING MORON

[Lady Lambdadelta]

WHAT IN THE UNHOLY FUCK

"OH LLD HAS A CONTRADICTION SHE SAID THE GUN SHOULD ONLY CLAIM ON THEIR DAY OF SHOOT"

GOOD LORD.

THIS IS NOT REAL.

[Lady Lambdadelta]

Aight well you literally claimed to be okay dying which no gun holder should ever do, you lliterally waited until the last minute so there's no time left and let town sink into apathy waiting for your death and now you're here seeking last minute claim value?

That shit aint' fucking real if it was real you'd literally be playing the worst manner you could. It would literally be not just sub optimal but beyond the pale of belief.

[Lady Lambdadelta]

Also, let's be clear - LLD's current furor to get my lynch across the finish line? She knows she's the prime target for my bullet.

This logic makes no sense either.

You don't shoot tonight per your own claim.

If I was scum I could just

FUCKING SHOOT YOU YOU IDIOT

[Lady Lambdadelta]

It turns out that my intentions are perfectly clear and yours are too.

You're trying to pull off a last minute play to either set your partner up for glory or draw out the only town gun (because they didn't claim today, so you could easily think they're not a N2 gun either.) so you don't risk that person being shot.

Like god your logic and posts just keep flailing looking for anything to defend yourself with and you just keep lying and being swatted down.

[Lady Lambdadelta]

THEN DO IT

LET ME EAT THE NIGHT KILL

WHAT DO YOU HAVE TO LOSE

YOU ARE SCUM

AND YOU COULD EASILY LIE.

IF YOU'RE SCUM YUO PROBABLY TOOK A GUN AND I BET IT'S NOT FOR NIGHT 3 MY DUDE.

THERE IS LITERAL BENEFIT TO LYNCHING YOU AS SCUM.

[Lady Lambdadelta]

Also for someone who didn't seem to care about living you sure planned this out with the intent to live my dude.

For 3 days.

This isn't fucking real.

[Lady Lambdadelta]

The hilarious thing is I haven't lied once, and you're going to look absolutely awful on my flip.

??????

OK?

AND YOU THINK I'M SCUM RIGHT?

SO WHY IS THIS PHRASED THIS WAY.

LMFAO

[Lady Lambdadelta]

OR CAN YOU NOT KEEP YOUR OWN READS STRAIGHT IN YOUR HEAD OR SOMETHING.

MAYBE CAUSE THEY DEAD ASS AIN'T REAL EITHER

[Lady Lambdadelta]

My number 1 is Kagami Haschel because the timing of the claim suggests Pine wanted someone to intervene on his behalf and HC had a kid. Can't be helped, but makes sense.

My number 2 is Implosion. He's stayed clear of the wagon all fucking day despite my prodding and it doesn't look good in hindsight. I think he may have been pushing Pine not to throw in the towel, so to speak.

You dig?

Cyan... lemme reread Cyan?

[Lady Lambdadelta]

Holy shit I actually survived

To be honest, I thought at one point that Pops was scum based on how he/she responded to my post, but after finally reading through the old posts and what's happened since the night, I don't feel as strongly about it.

I'm leaning toward Pine based on his scumhunt on Pops and am curious to see how he responds with a little more heat on him.
Herschel's posts rub me the wrong way right now (something about the tone feels off before Night 1), but that might just be because of his interactions with Alisae. I'm holding off judgement until he's a bit more active.

No strong townreads for me yet

VOTE: Pine

Does this vote really come on his partner at that point when it's just Pine and me yelling a bit? Circumstantially I wonder about Cyan's skill level and ability to bus like this.

[Lady Lambdadelta]

Does this vote really come on his partner at that point when it's just Pine and me yelling a bit? Circumstantially I wonder about Cyan's skill level and ability to bus like this.

well, I think it was a pre-coached bus, but it's a good point that it's more likely you'd tell your scumbuddy "bus when it looks like I'm going down" and not "at the start of the day, and then leave forever"

okay, it feels fair to say that our ghosts are with each other on pressuring kagami tomorrow. and now I have heard your concerns about implo and you have heard mine on cyan. you got anything left you want us to know if you die or are we gucci for the hammer

Never lynch Cephrir.

For the love of god no matter what people tell you to do.

Never lynch the party pig.

He's town and I'm 1000 percent on it.

Beyond that, I think Pops is decently town and so are yuo and tha'ts kind of my whole reads, innit?

I'm good to go.

[Lady Lambdadelta]

Oh yeah S_S, missed S_S.

S_S is probably town tbh. Not partners with Pine for certain, and his kind of standoffish attitude is very "I'm town and I don't care".

[Lady Lambdadelta]

I need a night to myself. People voting me in MyLo like this are idiots and the worst part is one of you at minimum is town which is awful because Kagami is absolutely scum.

All I'll say to your statement Implo and Hito is think about it like this.

I have 2 votes on me.

We all think Kagami probably is scum here (Hito is wavering but honestly Hito, what pairings exist if Kagami is town? Do both scum enter on me today like that? Implo+You has already hammered and won if it's the case.... so you're relly looking at Implo+X Kagami+X or LLD+Y teams (Y subset of all, X subset of players on the LLD wagon).

And given Implo scum is lowered by his constant denial of the Pine wagon in my mind, because it'd be easy to climb aboard I'm taking the heat regardless.

That just leaves Kagami.

So my message to the two of you tonight is this. If I'm scum with Kagami, help me bus her. If I'm town, Kagami is always scum here from both of your perspectives.

Find me a reasonable functional world where lynching Kagami isn't the right move today and I'll debate you tomorrow, happily, but Kagami is always scum and it's one of Cyan or S_S who is her partner.

And if you wanna think I'm her partner bussing her, feel free to solve for that tomorrow. Every day I live is a new chance to reevaluate me.

Night folks.

[Lady Lambdadelta]

I guess hito's wallpost two posts up is a sensible thing to do as scum here, particularly if he's scum with LLD, but idk I feel like scum him would probably end with the conclusion that S_S is scum because he's kind of calling everyone town right now? Not really sure what the deal with that is.

less "everyone is town" and more that I think we have decent acid tests for LLD/Cyan and S_S could swing a lot depending on meta. then I did the meta and feel...I guess not *great* on S_S, but better.

not a fan of the LLD post. not for my usual reason that it assumes I'm town - we have entered Real Hito Hours and LLD knows it - but the weird instant PoE based on the assumption that "I don't believe both players who voted me are mafia together, so lets ignore sorting either of them and find the mafia player who isn't voting for me". I've deleted a couple of lines because it's hard to articulate exactly WHY I don't like, but I think it's because here on the home stretch LLD's first post set up a rationale such that you can vote Kagami without ever having a reason to suspect/talk to Kagami?

w/e though let's talk. I think that "implo scum is lowered by his constant denial of the Pine wagon" is a weird credit to give to implo, since he basically reversed it by the end, s_s defended WAY harder, and Kagami denied it in a less scum-indicative way (saying that on reads it looked unlikely, but he wanted to stall to check for cc's - even though we were 1 day out with a v/la player so it was quite likely we would never get town to agree that real gun counterclaims, and then get everyone to post. And if Pine doesn't die there, Kagami is super in danger as an alternative.) I think implo's probably town but I'm not grokking why you clear him from your pov.

Oh, one other thing and this is for everyone: what did you think about pops putting Pine to L-1 without a claim? I have a reason for asking which I will reveal later

I swore I wouldn't do this tonight but here we go.

What do you want me to do, pretend that Kagami isn't scum?

I'm in a unique position where there have been 2 votes on me and most players who are off my wagon have been online in the same time frame that a coordinated hammer would ahve been possible. Which means from my perspective that at most one of you kagami and Implo is scum.

You're not scum. I'm not that wrong. I re-evaluated overnight and I'm convinced you don't fake agreeing with me that way as scum how you handled it.

Implo is town for reasons mentioned. He didn't take the Pine bait he could have easily done, especially when Pine claimed.

So either BOTH S_S and Cyan are scum (but I just can't believe that. Both entering on me like that together is really really risky when I die today a good percent of the time without that move anyway) or One of them is scum WITH Kagami.

So it's Kagami. It always has to be Kagami from my PoV. I'm not trying to set up a simple PoE, I'm forced into it based on what I know and what has been voted. I know it's different for you, which is why I'm inviting you to talk to me, but don't act like it's so strange that I've suddenly come around to a solid opinion and I'm pushing it. You know how I play, once I'm sold it's not about how extra super special right I can be, it's about making sure townies I know are townie get on the fucking boat and ride with me.

[Lady Lambdadelta]

Sorry I've been busy with a new job offer and stuff.

[Lady Lambdadelta]

Also Apathy, Implosion?

It's MyLo. There's no apathy to create if I flip town my dude.

[Lady Lambdadelta]

Are the scum somehow like, slow rolling me because they're afraid they'll shoot a rose or somehting?

[Lady Lambdadelta]

Hito and Implo there are two people voting me right this moment who have said nothing about anything as a result.

What makes you think that behaviour is town? What's the odds BOTH of them are town and then what's the odds they do that to me as scum together?

It doens't exist. I don't have a good scum pairing from either of your perspectives. I'm not scum with Kagami Implo Cyan or S_S, and then you have to wonder if Hito and I do the theatre yesterday instead of Hito just doing the deed and killing Kagami?

Like... This is so clearly the scum win stroke. I don't know what to do because one of S_S and Cyan is town and we need to convince them to flip to fix this.

Cause even if we go to night, I have serious doubts mafia will choose to make a kill if they have only one, and if they somehow picked a night 3 vig, we'd lose on the spot.

So we can't even no-lynch effectively.

So we need to get Cyan and S_S talking. There's no reason not to use the 5 days you have to make them talk, worst case from your perspective is it forces them if I'm scum to interact and show their oclours yeah?

So for now, stop assuming I'm the defacto lynch, I'm not, this is MYLO ffs.

[Lady Lambdadelta]

Like this is a strict loss condition on my death.

You want to know why I didn't take a gun this game? I expected everyone would be trigger happy and I wanted to increase the town win-rate.

Who the fuck shoots a town LLD expecting a rose to be there? No one.

Turned out, didn't matter.

Also I was a night 1 rose, so there's possible outs where I was shot night 1. Or do you really believe that there was only one scum kill night one and scum didn't take any N1 vigs?/

Like what's the odds on that.

This doesn't add up, you know it doesn't add up, and lynching me because Piine played scummy and got lynched for it is just bad play by any townie, and the scum are capitalizing.

[Lady Lambdadelta]

Zero chance implies I'm infallible Hito, and I'm not, but I admit that I don't exactly understand the purpose of your question. You want me to argue for something I don't remotely believe to be true, even though there's possibility? Sure.

S_S and Cyan could in theory be scum together, but that would require that they both opted out on the ability to sway the town in any direction, and this isn't a "they did it because they weren't being suspected" S_S was on my scum list, I voted S_S day 1 and if things had swapped around day 1 or 2 they could have easily died on a dime and not been able to stop it.

It's a risky strategy if true, but certainly one that would have worked given Pine's play and claim and Xyzzy's answers and pushes. The question is if they have enough foresight to know that's gonna happen. I have my doubts. One of them being coached to lurk? Sure. Both of them agreeing there's no need to take hold and guide the town wrongly? Even today they're both lurking which makes them both stand out. If one was active lurking and pushing me and the other wasn't they'd be less obvious. There would be more coordination, I would think.

It's hard to imagine them playing scum together against this town and being this discordant in their play together. It feels.... off. You can argue all you like that I didn't complete your task as requested but I'm not wasting any further energy on this topic. From my view point, looking at votes and methods and interactions it's just not there Hito. Under 5 percent chance, under 1 percent chance? I'm pretty confident.

Of the two, I think Cyan is the one who is paired with someone else. S_S blank voting me today feels like Town committing to an action, he voted first, before Cyan, without a word, and confidently, and has said nothing else all day. That is a terrible look, and one I think a confident townie who just wants to do the job would do (see: CES' playstyle) vs. a concerned scum player with a partner calling their shots.

Which, by the way, is how Cyan's vote reads. Plan is to vote me today, probably told to look natural when doing it, let someone else lead if possible, he sees S_S and votes me and writes what are essentially empty words that feign justification that he didn't need to give to have that justification. It was entirely performative.

I think the team is almost always Cyan/Kagami. You and Implo not hammernig here either means one of you is chicken shit and scared of a night 3 rose which is laughable both of you would happily take your licks in that scenario. Or you're both scum/town together. And if you were both scum together, again, see: Chicken shit.

So you're both town.

And S_S+Cyan doesn't work.

So there's your team.

This is exactly like a game I played like 3-4 years ago against an MoI Sleepykrew ??? team where I was fooled the entire game forever and then I woke up on dya 3 and 180'd on everything, named the whole scumteam and was lynched 4-3 because one townie didn't believe, and we lost. It's a shame, and probably my fault for being so gung ho about the rest but frankly there's not much else to be done.

I need to convince S_S... or Cyan, I guess if I'm somehow wrong about Cyan being scum which I doubt I am, but just speaking to S_S and S_S being scum makes our win chance zero sooooooooooooooooo

Like, at this point I need you two to either get on board or lynch me.

Because if you're on board and you believe I'm town, then sorting my alignment and doing this nonsense is not gonna save the town. So like, take your time and sort me or whatever but make a fucking choice on me while we still have time to try and fix this with our last townie, seeing as we need all the votes today to win.

Or just lynch me if you will never come to see me as town. That's your call. I can't stop it, but please don't make me spend 72 hours begging for you and others to see the light and then just hammer me anyways. That's literal actual soulcrushing levels of agony.

[Lady Lambdadelta]

I need to convince S_S... or Cyan, I guess if I'm somehow wrong about Cyan being scum which I doubt I am, but just speaking to S_S and S_S being scum makes our win chance zero sooooooooooooooooo

Right now you need to convince hito and implosion to wagon cyan or Kagami with you. I'll never be moving my vote if that doesn't happen.

I'm currently wanting to lynch Kagami obviously, I just want to take my time. If you are town we need all the townies on the wagon to succeed ANYWAY so it doesnt matter to me what order things come in.

[Lady Lambdadelta]

However, it does matter to me, because those votes provide useful information, and the game is obviously not nearly as solved from my POV as it is from yours.

Understandable, I suppose.

[Lady Lambdadelta]

Kagami's analysis should frighten anyone who is town and reading it, because it's deliberately misleading and designed to power tunnel on me for one last lynch.

The concept that I would take a N1 gun and shoot is an easy thing to speak to because normally in games I love to take vigs, but the analysis of the game's structure is one that if town gets overly greedy, they can easily lose a very winnable game. I was heading into a game half filled with players I normally expect to take a gun and half a list of players I knew nothing about and were complete unknowns.

What's the more important choice? To take a gun in a game filled with them and potentially lose as town implodes?

or to take a rose and increase the likelyhood of town's victory even if it means I get to have less fun?

The odds of town win increase dramatically in my opinion as the number of town roses increases. There wasn't really a choice in my opinion.

And Kagami's logic here is designed as a trap. It's meant to laser focus on me not taking a gun when other players (Hito, Implo) have similar gun toting streaks. Why she never went in on those two should be obvious. It would be far harder than to push on me, because I'd never break or fall for it and I was the leader yesterday.

S_S, what are your thoughts on that?

[Lady Lambdadelta]

Ank, it's already pretty silly to think that kagami-scum would be antagonizing Hito-town here especially given I could have leveraged the townread in this utterly repulsive post, but to do so as a team with S_S makes absolutely no sense.

That's ridiculous, I think Hito is more likely to scum read you if you call him town entering today instead of scum. You say things like this and phrase them as the truth, but they're completely subjective, and any move you make like this, you could have made to make this exact post.

Like, does anyone think Kagami doesn't have this day already completely planned out?

Further and finally, Hito and Implo.

Kagami blames me and Hito for Pine's lynch, but she was present that day and the amount of resistance she put up was enough to say she resisted but exactly sufficient to ensure no one would actually unvote. She yelled at two players (hito and I) who were mostly committed to voting and never tried to appeal to anyone else on the wagon.

Why would she do that if Pine was town? Why not appeal for an unvote?

Because she wanted that lynch to happen, and she had a plan of attack.

At this point Hito, Implo, if you think I'm scum I can't help it anymore. Kagami is scum, I have a hard time with the other two. I think Cyan/Ank is more likely to be scum but S_S completely blanking my arguments to him, not really listening or considering is worrying because it feels like he just wants the result to occur and wants to keep his vote there.

I wonder if he was instructed to just stonewall me to try and have one of you end up lynching me because there's no other option.

Vote: Kagami

Hito, Implo.... which ever one of S_S/Cyan is actually town: We need all of you to vote correctly today. Town cannot be divided even by one vote. Please, please see the light about Kagami's posts and actions. Kagami's posts keep telling lies, keep pushing agendas in secret ways, and her motivations and actions continue to push scum intent from even YESTERDAY. She is scum. Vote her.

[Lady Lambdadelta]

Why can't it be Kagami S_S Hito?

And why can't Ank enter and go onto Kagami when he sees the game has stalled?

I dunno why you're just discounting these worlds when you pushed hard for me to see S_S+Ank.

It's super frustrating, it's basically means you're gonna compromise lynch me and town will lose and I'm fucking kind of exhausted.

[Lady Lambdadelta]

Oh god that would be a trip.

What if I was shot night 1 and Kagami knows that and that's why she wanted to deflect from the option of a N1 Gun.

YO HITO

WHY IS THIS PERSON TOWN AGAIN

[Lady Lambdadelta]

@Hito

Did you read my "playing scum" article?

Kagami just did "Bullets for Bullets".

[Lady Lambdadelta]

Implo has been scummy all game Hito. If he literally could be scum in this situation I would be lynching him, but he and you both had me at l-1 with the ability to hammer and neither of you did.

So from my perspective you're both either town or completely legitimately insane.

Hito, I want you to read Kagami's response to Ankamius' read and tell me, from your experience if you think that is town posting.

Because the bullets for bullets on ank's case strikes me like the goal wasn't to actually address Ank and read and sort him, her goal was more or less to deflect the case and convince YOU she's town.

They only need one vote right? it's yours they are looking for at this point. I think she lost Implo, no matter how scummy he is, and now she's losing Ank.

So if she can gain your vote, she'll probably gain an apathy vote from one of the tohers, especially if she switches from calling you scum to calling Implo scum.

Did you notice that? She did it to sway you to lynch me, her reasons for the switch are kind of flimsy at best. Basically she's altering her reads to suit her survival and scum game, and not her actual developed reads. She's fabricating Hito.

Please god tell me you can see this

[Lady Lambdadelta]

Hito I promise promise promise you I am town.

Like I get that I am often unreadable, and so you're reading me through implo in a sense but like

in any other world I'd tell you to just lynch Implo cause the dude does look scummy.

But I have more or less mod confirmation he is town because he didn't hammer, just like you, and we're in MyLo.

The town is you me and Implo and one more, Hito.

At this point I have to think it's Ankamius, given how Kagami responded to them. Do you think Kagami responds to a partner that way? I can't see it as theatre, really.

So I don't care which one we lynch first anymore. I was on Kagami because I didn't wanna sort S_S/Cyan and I had my guesses but I wanted it saved for tomorrow, but now it's basically clear to me what the team has to be, and so

Hito
Implo
Ank

let's not throw a fucking easily won game for the love of all that is holy.

S_S was scummy on day 1 then lurked under the radar to my eternal shame, Kagami has been open!wolfing this entire day.

this is the team, please god listen to my words

[Lady Lambdadelta]

What exactly about that is skeevy?

I'm saying I'm town. If I'm scum of course I'm lying if I'm town I'm telling the truth. It's an appeal to his emotions as someone who he knows, but I'm doing it as town beseeching him to consider and view things my way.

I don't understand what you're so cross about, to be honest, and frankly I feel a bit insulted. I've done nothing wrong.

[Lady Lambdadelta]

Like if your issue is Appeal to Emotions, people appeal to emotions in mafia all the time as both alignments. I'm not doing anything abnormal there.

If your issue is me saying I promise him I'm town, and that somehow promises hold some weight in mafia, if you can't break promises in Mafia, the optimal strategy for town would be to force people to swear and promise they're town and if they lie about that promise, they're clearly scumbags who play in a bad way!

So of course people promise and break promises in mafia, it's a game of DECEPTION. And sometimes you keep promises.

I'm actually really really upset about this, because it transposes the game. You're calling me a bad person because I promised someone I was town. As either alignment there's nothing wrong with this and yet you think yourself superior or something?

Fuck this and honestly fuck you that's such horseshit I'm honestly really hurt.

[Lady Lambdadelta]

I've seen things you wouldn't believe. Townies lynching confirmed town players. I watched Hito cruelly betray my heart and lynch me at the last moment~. All these moments will be lost in time, like tears in the rain.

Time to die.

[Lady Lambdadelta]

I'm gonna say nah to this one.