Mini 527 - Doom in Valencia - Game Over!

[Gorgon]

Greetings. Reading now. Will post soon enough.

[Gorgon]

Okay, I probably need to read all this again, but here are a few thoughts after the first read.

I feel that the wagon on neko is quite justified ... I understand why it built up, but I'm not sure he's the best lynch. A few things do worry me about him, such as his accommodating, nonaggressive stance - his post 16 where he votes Sikario8 and says he'd be hesitant to vote him if he had some votes on him already ... what's up with that? But overall ... nah, he's not uberscummy. He's about 50/50 on my scumdar.

Sikario8 ... voting neko when he was already voting him, then backing down quickly ... sucking up to gorckat ... overall his behaviour worries me.

I don't really understand why Guardian is so sure SirWario is scum. I feel that SW has indeed come up with a few helpful tidbits, and has been quite aggressive at times. Also, I was in a game with SirWario recently where I felt he was terse, and was somewhat suspicious of him because of that, but he turned out to be town. I think he's acting pretty much the same way here. It doesn't prove anything of course, but at least it's a hint.

This is all I have for now. More later, when I have the time.

[Gorgon]

I don't really understand why Guardian is so sure SirWario is scum.

Hmm?
best I can tell =/= sure.

Bah, semantics. What I meant is that you're pretty focused on SW and seem pretty confident in his scumminess. Some thoughts on other players would be mucho appreciated, btw.

I love how people think I'm scummy because I'm being too nice. "Be careful of that one, he's trying to be rational and not emotional! What a scumtell!" My bad I guess... maybe I should be a jackass and vote recklessly. Would that be better? I'd like to see anyone make an argument for this.

It's a little more complicated than that. There's nothing wrong with being nice and not a jackass, but town on the whole tend to be more forceful and a little less concerned with looking 'proper' than scum, in my experience. As with anything else, it's no solid proof, which is why I personally put you down as 50/50.

[Gorgon]

If sikario worries you, why didn't you vote him?

Because I wasn't thinking about who to vote when I made that post. It was just a quick list of my thoughts at that point, after a first skim of the thread.

And please direct me to those helpful SirWario posts.

Well ... In his post 17 he comes up with meta on neko, defending him from the 'too nice' accusations. I don't have any other specific examples, though.

Btw, a deadline extension would be most welcome.

[Gorgon]

Because I wasn't thinking about who to vote when I made that post. It was just a quick list of my thoughts at that point, after a first skim of the thread.

Have you gathered up any further suspicion or worry in the two weeks since then?

Not really. Although I must say that upon rereading, I'm not convinced Sikario8 is scum.

Regarding SW, I'm by no means convinced he's town, but again ... not convinced he's scum either, based on my already stated previous experience.

This game is still slow and still in need of replacements. I would prefer more active discussion instead of poring over old stuff.

[Gorgon]

Crap - Guardian gone. This is one mish-mashed game.

I'm cool with the 'top 3 idea', except I'm hard pressed to name even three suspects. I could probably dredge something up if this idea goes through though.

General thoughts ...

Sammich/Pra is not the lynch today, IMO. Sammich posted some good analysis and looks more protown than not to me.

I'm not seeing the case against gorckat. Even though I appear to be at the top of his list, I think he's somewhat justified. Overall his motivations seem protown to me. However, if I'm to defend myself, I feel the case is thin, and hinges mostly on the fact that cast suspicion on Sikario8 without voting for him ... and yeah, probably the fact that I haven't been that helpful in this game, at least not so far. To this I can only say that there isn't an awful lot to go on, and the replacements and inactivity only add to the confusion and frustration. Right now there's a whole bunch of people that need prodding/replacing.

[Gorgon]

Vote: Arakorn

Reasoning ...

- Contributes nothing. I can understand that he's busy, but he's posted enough posts, short as they are. I'd except them to contain

some

comments on what he thinks of the other players
- OMGUS vote on gorckat
- Erroneous "So the only reason you voted for me" argument ... a scumtell in my book

I'm also concerned about gorckat's mindless wagoning, but at this stage in the game, it's merely something to note for later.

[Gorgon]

Sorry, I've been very busy lately, as can be seen in that I haven't posted anywhere. I'll try and make up for it over the weekend.

[Gorgon]

Bah, lynch already. Self-vote at that. That makes me inclined to believe that MeMe is actually scum, but it is interesting to note that Tarhalindur has claimed mason-cop in another game that I'm with him in. I therefore don't buy his claim 100%.

[Gorgon]

Well, soupfly's claim seems solid enough, PM posting aside.

I must note, though, that there's still the slight possibility that Tar is mafia. If he is, he's most likely the sole remaining member, and thus would have been forced to carry out the nightkill. In this scenario, the lack of an NK is explained by the fact that Tar was blocked, rather than him having been protected. However, I find this unlikely, especially since this means that Tar essentially sacrificed MeMe yesterday.

Arakorn remains a suspect in my book, although mike is there as well. His 'nice' comment at the beginning of today is classic 'scum trying to look town', although it must be noted that I've seen town do something like this as well (and done so myself as town).

Others are possibilies as well. The only people I see as very probably town right now are Tar, soupfly, and neko. Thankfully we have lots of leeway in our lynches - especially since there doesn't seem to be an SK in this game.

[Gorgon]

Well, I admit that I forgot that of course Tar's partner can back him up whenever he feels like it, and in a regular mini, it's unlikely that masons aren't confirmed townies.

Also, there's most likely only one scum left. If that's Tar, falsely claiming mason with no backup would be very stupid.

So, Tar's not the remaining scum. There's almost no way that's possible. I admit that.

However, the mason-cop thing still bothers me. It sounds extremely powerful. We have this, an inventor ... while the mafia have a goon, a godfather, and probably one more member with unkown powers. It all sounds pretty unbalanced.

Anyway, I agree with soupfly that we're better of with letting Tar decide today's lynch. Also, I have some reservations about a mike lynch, but I can't say I'm dead set against it.

[Gorgon]

I agree with Javert here. MeMe's interactions are not 100% reliable, especially since she's an experienced player. I can easily see her varying her interactions with her scumpartners.

Anyway, the Arakorn vote wasn't even that dangerous, IMO. She was the first person to vote for him, and I was the only one who ever followed that vote. She also stated explicitly that she would be willing to switch her vote at the deadline in order to ensure a lynch. It was certainly more dangerous than the Pra vote, but I can easily see it as a scum distancing vote, especially as MeMe left it on at the deadline.

I don't think neko is solidly confirmed by the money press, but I feel that his play has been very townish. He's certainly not a top priority for lynch in my book.

I don't think soupfly should use his rocket tonight. He could easily do so tomorrow night, if the remaining scum is still alive by then.

[Gorgon]

I don't think soupfly should use his rocket tonight. He could easily do so tomorrow night, if the remaining scum is still alive by then.

And if he's dead by then...?

Then we'll have two live mason-cops, which is A Good Thing.

[Gorgon]

Well, I'm not happy with this development, but I am a vanilla townie, so I'm expendable. Good luck.

[Gorgon]

Since I'm still alive, I might as well offer my opinion as to my suspicions. I don't have that much to back it up though. This is just my general feeling at the moment.

From most suspect to least suspect:

mike - Arakorn - Pra - gorckat - Javert - neko - soupfly - Tar

[Gorgon]

Appeal to emotion?

vote: Gorgon

That's a very simplistic interpretation of what I said. You just went up my suspicion list.

The entire context of my post was that I had accepted my fate. I wasn't asking anyone to reconsider based on emotional appeals - just stated that I was unhappy that I was to be lynched, since I know I'm innocent.

I'm at what, four votes now? One more will probably do it, but since Tar has decided, I think I'm going down no matter what. Also, I've claimed vanilla, so there's no real reason for you not to lynch me, per se.

[Gorgon]

... although I must say that neko didn't climb that high up. His play, apart from that last vote, has been good so far.

[Gorgon]

Oh well, looks like I'm lynched. Good game.

I think the town will be hard pressed to lose this one, but if you do, I shall be quite annoyed.