Mini 1511: Insurgency Emergency (Game Over)
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Elyse Jack of All Trades
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Elyse Jack of All Trades
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Oh God. This going to be a wall game. You guys are like those english teachers that read into everything and say that everything has some kind of hidden meaning.
Fusion is town. 48 exemplifies my thought process exactly and I agree with it 100%. implosion's vote on aphix is bad, and the fact that he has yet to respond to Fusion's post despite posting afterwards makes my scumread on implosion even stronger. I don't really have any other additional reasons since Fusion said all I could've said in 48.
I dislike gorckat's vote on aphix as well.
I dislike these sections of Az's post:
The first one eliminates the possibility of aphix-town, which is a very closed-minded approach.In post 53, AzBlueM wrote: Pacman, if you’ve ever heard of a pressure vote…yeah. Don’t appreciate the subtle character attack though (ostensibly, really?). Also, is ABR still scum? Who else is scummy? Why are you defending aphix so hard?
Side note: I was recent scum in a game with a partner that pretended to be n00b levels of newb. They got past and we had a perfect victory because another town member also bought into the idea that they were too noob to be scum as they would have outed themselves already. Aphix is also not n00b-like (Newbie 1376 if anyone is wondering). I’m not sure if you’re that town member or if you’re trying to sell it though.
Fegel, sorry to be a bother but can you either have a “not voting” section or just keep everyone else with 0 votes? Also, are you sure the timer and end date are correct? I’m not complaining, just that’s longer than 2 weeks by my count. Also, please poke fitz (12pm), ants(1pm), elyse(3pm) and skelda(7pm)
The second one seems like a blatant attempt to look town by asking for prods on players not even a day into the game. It's the weekend. I wasn't able to get on yesterday. Relax.
VOTE: implosion-
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Elyse Jack of All Trades
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Why is it scummy for KK to assume he is smarter than you?
Also *ongoing* but Albert takes a while to get into the game. But he does eventually.
I don't like how HP is saying "if you don't know who's scummy, put your vote on Albert for being anti-town". There are lurkers out there doing less than he is. Being open about it is also more of a townie thing to do than trying to hide his inactivity.-
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Elyse Jack of All Trades
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a. Ok?
b. I know. I'm saying that he does eventually get into it and it's better that he's open with it rather than trying to hide it.
c. Skelda, havingfitz - I'm still giving them time to catch up but I think Albert is a silly vote for "anti-townness" when there are people who haven't produced an ounce of content.
d. I wasn't going there at all. Why are you trying to anticipate my actions?
I know that you didn't mention lurking. I never said you did. It was a general statement.
And I'm not fabricating anything, and it's not because you mentioned me. You never even said if that meant anything. Why would I react to that?-
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Elyse Jack of All Trades
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Elyse Jack of All Trades
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Elyse Jack of All Trades
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Elyse Jack of All Trades
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Elyse Jack of All Trades
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Elyse Jack of All Trades
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Your example seemed to rule out the possibility of aphix-town but if you were just using it as a reference, then alright.In post 114, AzBlueM wrote:Elyse, I’m not seeing how I’m eliminating aphix-town in 53. I brought that up as an example because in my previous game iV was absolutely convinced that bae was town because of being too n00b to be scum. I was not saying that aphix was definitely scum but was trying to get pacman to consider his stance that aphix wagon is supposedly on a VI (who doesn’t act like a VI at all). It addresses one possible scenario. We also won because D3 was basically a lurkfest resulting in a no lynch which isn’t a risk today but it doesn’t hurt to call people on it early. Also, I don’t understand c from 99, are you saying that you're giving the lurkers a pass but they are better votes than Albert?
On that note, I’m not sure about pacman’s position (as Ant noted as “trying to ride both wagons” though pacman had no substantial votes on him). On the one hand, he was defending aphix hard, mislabelling him as a VI(scummy) however he doesn’t review his posts before editing (67 being a misread) and is coming on super strong (towny).
And I'm giving the lurkers a chance to post (i.e. not voting them and going POST LURKERS!!!) but I also think that saying Albert is more deserving of votes than them is wrong.
Yeah, I'm an abrasive person. I try to keep it cool but oh well.In post 125, aphix wrote: @elyse do you tend to get good reads from being abrasive? Although I do like more natural responses that tend to come from argumentative behavior your post all seem like your picking a fight.
Yes.In post 126, havingfitz wrote: @Elyse...do you think lack of content is more worthy of a vote/suspicions than anti-towniness?
Az is still on my scumdar. I have KK, Fusion, and Albert as my strongest townreads. EPM is a bit tough to read but overall I'm leaning town on him and same with fitz.
I think HP's style of posting seems more town than his content actually is, so it's a nullread there. I do want his response to mine though.
implosion is still my top scumread. He hasn't improved the slot yet.
I'm not sure where I stand on aphix. I can't quite figure him out.-
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Elyse Jack of All Trades
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Elyse Jack of All Trades
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Well if you were scum and you liked it, then I would think you would remember this game.In post 139, Skelda wrote:
Town. I royally suck as scum. Why does it matter?In post 138, Elyse wrote:Skelda, do you prefer playing town or scum?
I just didn't realize this game existed, it got lost in my threads.
But your answer didn't really prove anything. Meh.-
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Elyse Jack of All Trades
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Elyse Jack of All Trades
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Elyse Jack of All Trades
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Elyse Jack of All Trades
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@Az
You have a grand total of 6 posts, one of which was a confirm. Excuse me for not having a 12-page case on you.
You are pinging my gut hard and your posts seem artificial and constructed. I also find it weird that you mentioned scum have daytalk. I didn't know this until you pointed it out. Your posts almost reflect the coaching of someone, which fits rather nicely.
Also, why is Skelda town because scum have daychat?-
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Elyse Jack of All Trades
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Elyse Jack of All Trades
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Elyse Jack of All Trades
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Elyse Jack of All Trades
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Elyse Jack of All Trades
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Elyse Jack of All Trades
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This is a good post.In post 204, gorckat wrote:Sorry for the weekend absence- wasn't planned, but it did not go as I expected.
I had cribbed this up Friday afternoon and I'll post with some polish now:
Az's obsession with Skelda:
The way deep reading is that Az-scum wanted skel-scum to get in the game and is then covered for by the lame daychat excuse (if he's not reading the thread, why is he reading over on QuickTopic). The wording of 175 seems forced, as well- 'hypothetical' is entirely superfluous there.27- Fegel please change the topic to D1 so people know the game's on
53- Also, please poke fitz (12pm), ants(1pm), elyse(3pm) and skelda(7pm)
113- Poke: Skelda. Also votecount pl0x.
172- After some considering scum have daychat, Skelda is most likely town even if not helpful at all.
175- Hypothetical Skelda-scum would be able to see the daychat and know D1 started.
Also- Az's asking skel about ABR being an easy target in the same post as his own unvote of ABR scans as shady 'lemme be townie and debate with my partner'.
After the weekend, I'll try to read back and decide if I like this over aphix-scum.-
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Elyse Jack of All Trades
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I actually really like this post and agree with it mostly.In post 220, Albert B. Rampage wrote:To everyone else, let me explain to you why Humble Poirot is scum.
Firstly, huge misrep quoted above.Humble Poirot wrote:@ABR: 59: so basically you won't play d1. Nice.
Secondly, Poirot does a whole lot of complaining about other players referencing me as a strong player or defending my play on meta. He goes on at great length throughout the day about this, such as in post 94, post 98.
Thirdly, he uses a cheap trick, quoted above, to add the illusion of credibility to his future vote. Why would a townie try to setup a future vote, on page 7? The norm is starting the day with firing random votes in every direction and using any excuse imaginable to get the game moving. What in the world is up with this guy being on the verge of voting someone...? Let me tell you. He A) feels the need to justify his vote and B) is planning his strategy in advance.In post 159, Humble Poirot wrote:Tl;Dr: On the verge of voting ABR but awaiting some responses.
Of course, it looks bad if I can't answer his questions, because they are too sharp and I have nowhere to turn to, to defend myself.
Unless...
Unless, he doesn't actually have a question, he just wants to provoke me and proceed to push the strategy he pre-planned in his head.
Is that actually a legitimate question he expects me to answer? I disagree that "I made up bs about implosion". I think there was a disconnect in what implosion said. Poirot may think it was a stretch, but the setup of his questioning and the subsequent vote is scummy.Humble Poirot wrote:Do you have no reads? If so, why did you make that bs up about implosion?
He demonstrates a lack of genuine interest in obtaining information; if he did care, he would ask neutral, objective questions that allow the person to present their thoughts in a different way.
Instead, he resorts to asking bait questions, and follows it up with apparent dismay at my uncooperativeness for not responding to him.
Twice, he claims that it's a hard game. It's not a hard game. The reason we haven't been doing anything, and I want to put emphasis on this, is because bandwagons are not being pushed. We can hardly get to half a wagon for a lynch on any one player. Do you think we can scumhunt in these circumstances? Town will not compromise on their reads, scum will not wagon-hop, and we're wasting the day away. Change that with me now. Let Poirot hang.
But HP came up with some good responses and you just ignore him? Wtf is that?
@HP
Fusion is a strong townread for having similar thought processes to my own, gut, being willing to (and changing) reads as new information comes in, and for things mentioned before.
As far as ABR being a strong townread, that's gone. I don't have scum meta from him but yeah I don't like how he's just ignoring you (especially since his case was decent). I feel like he's either lazy, frustrated town or lying scum who can't come up with a good response to you. I can't decide which.-
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Elyse Jack of All Trades
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Elyse Jack of All Trades
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Elyse Jack of All Trades
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Elyse Jack of All Trades
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I definitely want ETL to post her thoughts before she's lynched, but she's still my number one priority for today. I didn't like Az's posts and her's have been awkward and complainy.
@HP
I would compromise onto Albert because I find his ignorance of you and your posts very silly and scummy. I don't understand the town motivation behind ignoring a player you are calling scum, but my gut is telling me you are taking advantage of this situation and trying to squeeze out a mislynch on a competent player's faults. I could be wrong, though.-
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Elyse Jack of All Trades
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Elyse Jack of All Trades
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Elyse Jack of All Trades
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I'm not going to hold you solely responsible for ABR's lynch should he flip town, but you will be the one mostly at fault. You are pushing on him hard.
And by experience/reputation, I'm calling Albert competent. That's part ofwhymy gut is pinging on you. He's having an off game, town or scum. His refusal to interact with you is bad and scummy but he IS a good player. So it does make me wary when people highlight these things and push really hard for a lynch. It's probably paranoia and you SHOULD push these things. However, there's a line between Albert is scummy and Albert is playing poorly. I don't think you've crossed it yet, but it's getting there. And it's not your fault, because he's not interacting with you, but it's just part of my paranoia.
So yes I'm more comfortable with an ETL lynch and I wouldn't care if someone said I tried to squeeze out a mislynch on her faults because I have reasons that go beyond poor play.-
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Elyse Jack of All Trades
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Elyse Jack of All Trades
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Elyse Jack of All Trades
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Elyse Jack of All Trades
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Would you look at thatIn post 297, EspeciallyTheLies wrote:Town reads: epm, elyse, kk (after post 130)
Scum reads: skelda, implosion
There's something weird about how defensive skelda is.
Also fitz is pretty aggressive. I understand there is suspicion on my slot. Thats fine, but you are looking in the wrong place.
I am starting to like abr too. I can understand where he's coming from. It takes me a bit to get into a game myself.
The rest are varying degrees of null, but gor is more nulltown than the rest imo.
Also your major scumreads are the competing wagon and a lurker.
Nothing earth shattering to talk about.-
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Elyse Jack of All Trades
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Really?In post 364, Fusion wrote:A lot of especiallythelies's posts look townish including her questioning of Skelda. I agree with Skelda being scummy as well. ETL is a bad choice of lynch which sucks because she is also the most likely player to get lynched. I am fairly sure there are scum on that wagon.Everyone who disagrees that lies is scum need to start looking at alternative lynches, provide reads and see which ones are possible and which are not I'd go for KK >>> ABR >>> Skelda as possible choices for a lynch.
I think it's great to question players not in the spotlight but ETL seems to be trying to divert attention onto yet another wagon this late into the day, which seems scummy to me.-
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Elyse Jack of All Trades
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Elyse Jack of All Trades
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I only change my reads when there's a reason to do so.
And yes it's scummy to start a fifth wagon 1 day before deadline.
But if I changed my reads too much you'd probably be like "Elyse changes her reads too much."
That post is complete bullshit.
P-edit:
You've played 1 completed game with me. I do get tunnely.-
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Elyse Jack of All Trades
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EVERYONE VOTE FOR DEADLINE EXTENSION IN YOUR NEXT POST
I vote for Deadline Extension
UNVOTE:
Sigh.
ETL's last posts have been town. God damn it. I was confident on that read.
Also, I am ABR's mason partner. Do not lynch him.
Out of (Fusion, HP, KK) I don't really have a preference but my strong townread on Fusion has gone away because I think he's buddying to ETL a lot and I think he thought she would be lynched. If she flipped town, that would make him look really good. He's even aligning his reads to her's.
Actually, screw it
VOTE: Fusion-
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Elyse Jack of All Trades
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Elyse Jack of All Trades
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I'm not going to say "I refuse to vote for ABR" which would draw even more attention and cause more suspicion since there wasn't much to townread him for at that point.In post 455, Fusion wrote:
Makes no sense from a Mason POV. You could have just not said anything at all. Why was the bolded necessary.In post 351, Elyse wrote:I have a townread on KK.
ETL is my preferred wagon butI will switch to ABR if necessary.
I am not sure I want to lynch ABR/Elyse today but I am strongly leaning towards this being a scum gambit considering both of them are scum reads of mine.-
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Elyse Jack of All Trades
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P-edit:
It would be suspicious because ABR was being anti-town so when asked I couldn't really give a reason for why I refused to vote him.
And yes my PM confirms he is town. And I guess he doesn't think it's worth it to come out and reveal his mason partner. Idk. I think it's better to save the both of us and force scum to NK us rather than town lynch us.
P-edit:
Oh my god. This is so dumb.-
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Elyse Jack of All Trades
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Elyse Jack of All Trades
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Elyse Jack of All Trades
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Elyse Jack of All Trades
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I'm not claiming the third person. There's no need to.
The fact that ABR and I didn't mention the third one before is *wait for it* WE WANTED TO KEEP IT A SECRET.
Seriously I think it's dumb you guys want to lynch mason claims on Day 1. Why doesn't EPM check me or ABR? Implosion is being very smart about this and I think there's scum in {HP, ETL, Fusion} for trying to push this when it's not ideal.-
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Elyse Jack of All Trades
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Elyse Jack of All Trades
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Elyse Jack of All Trades
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Elyse Jack of All Trades
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Elyse Jack of All Trades
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Elyse Jack of All Trades
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Damn.
I kinda figured that when all the claims came out but yeah HP is def scum, probably with someone like ant or Skelda or someone. Fusion is prob town cause of his breadcrumb.
Also I went along with it because you obvtowned to me but no one else would understand it sooo yeah I just went with it and hoped you would play along.
I had fun-
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Elyse Jack of All Trades
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Elyse Jack of All Trades
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Sigh.
I knew this would happen. Idk if you are scum or town but PLing me is laaame. We're down another townie if you lynch me.
I'll explain why I went along with it again. ABR obvtowned to me in a way that I couldn't explain (due to site rules) and I knew that I wouldn't be able to turn his lynch around. When he claimed mason, I thought he was telling the truth. Instead of outing ANOTHER mason, I claimed to be his mason, since I was almost 100% sure he was town and it would keep the other mason hidden. When he said we had a third mason, I figured he would get his real buddy to claim and after he was lynched, his buddy would be confirmed and I would tell the truth about me not being a vig.
Everything got out of hand, though. I didn't expect everything to spiral up and have people claiming FOR NO REASON WHATSOEVER. I've learned my lesson. If you want to PL me, fine, but I did it in the best interest of the town.-
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Elyse Jack of All Trades
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Elyse Jack of All Trades
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Elyse Jack of All Trades
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Elyse Jack of All Trades
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Elyse Jack of All Trades
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I'm probably not going to be able to respond to that until like Saturday because tomorrow I'm busy and I'm busy Saturday night but hopefully I get to it during the day Saturday.
And tonight I don't have it in me.
But I will answer the questions you posed.
I thought fitz was the other mason.
I wanted EPM to inspect me because I thought I would get quicklynched today and he would confirm me but people in this game are actually smart and see that I'm town.
I claimed to be ABR's mason even though he said I wasn't because he was obvtown to me.
I'm a girl btw.
And I will post my reasons for you calling me scum eventually.
But I do want to ask you something:
Have you seen masons fake claim often?
It's never happened before to me, and I feel like your doubt about the claims and your continued crusade for ABR's lynch comes from someone who wants to lynch a mason quickly rather than slow the game down, talk about it, and decide the best course of action.
You seem like a methodical person so your "LYNCH ABR WITH FIRE" attitude pinged my gut. That's the basis of my scumread.
But I will go into more detail later.-
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Elyse Jack of All Trades
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People like DGB fakeclaim masons a lot apparently. I've never seen it but I've heard of it. It was a serious question, not a loaded one.
Here, instead of unvoting immediately like any townie would do, you assume he won't tell you who his partner is. Why not unvote and ask? It doesn't make sense. It's like you are holding out for a quicklynch before other people have a chance to comment.In post 415, Humble Poirot wrote:Anyway, I've read your 412. Have your say, do you what you want. Ask me anything, you're not going to self-hammer because you're scum.
oh, btw, I just realized:
hah! you're actually trying to reach a quick wagon on me in the last hours? In the other post you said "if you lynch me, lynch/vig HP tomorrow". That would mean you would be ready to self-hammer in order to get me.Elyse, if you are town in this game, I'm counting on you to lead the charge against HP before deadline, today.
prev-edit: right... Single mason? Or you're going to pull some BS of "I won't tell who my mason partner is"? And your earlier comments about getting lynched don't make sense in light of your claim. You're just trying to pull a lame quickvote on me in the last minute.
Again, instead of unvoting or even slightly believing/listening to him, you bring up scum masons (wtf) and reiterate the idea of a lone mason. I don't see town logically jumping to those conclusions.In post 417, Humble Poirot wrote:furthermore, the first thing that came to mind when I read your claim, was that you might be neighbour with Elyse (due to that last "appeal" to him) but you claimed mason (which I thought was town only). So I read on the mason wiki and there's even, to my surprise, mafia aligned masons.
prev-edit:
ahahah, dude. You're sad.
Answer me.
1) Are you lone mason, yes or no? Who are you mason with, if not?
This is a bad post that looks like you are throwing everything at ABR. Why would he want to lynch ETL, as town, if he thought she was town? It doesn't make sense.In post 423, Humble Poirot wrote:Dude, you're scum. Otherwise, you'd have no problems actually answering me or lynching ETL (even though you don't think she is scum) or actually pushing me before the last minute with a claim that makes no sense considering your comments.
This is what I expect any townie to do.In post 426, implosion wrote:Unvote
I'm inclined to disbelieve the claim given that ABR was acting somewhat defeatist (which is silly if he did, in fact, have a real mason claim to back himself up) but yeah, we aren't lynching a claimed mason if we can avoid it
Also, lone mason isn't a thing, HP.
Because what if he's telling the truth? Then we out two masons for no reason. You are trying to bully and rally support for him to out his partner when it is VERY antitown to do so. Lynching him to see if his claim holds up is better than outing his partner because then we'll have one conftown down the road.In post 435, Humble Poirot wrote:@everyone_else: who's unvoting him or voting other people. Why aren't you forcing ABR to claim his partner? Why are you buying it? Aren't you aware that scum LIES?
As a sidenote, the reason I was townreading him is not immoral. I just can't talk about it until a certain game ends. I will explain it when I can.
This is another bad reason to get him to claim. You're assuming there's a doctor? That's probably wrong and if he outed his partner then we'd be screwed.In post 443, Humble Poirot wrote:hah, no dice. Saying you breadcrumbed him would as town, make him a target for a NK and would be effectively useless.
If you were town. You'd have no problem because doc could protect one of you and mafia would be forced to take a shot at one of you and not other PRs (like EPMI said).
You're scum although I'll give it to you. You have style.
This is only a small thing, but I didn't know there was daychat until you said this.In post 465, Humble Poirot wrote:One thing I've been also thinking is how day talk and availability might affect all this. I guess I prefer classical mafia where scum can't coordinate every step of the way if they're active and organized. Without daychat, it's closer to RL mafia.
Ok.In post 470, havingfitz wrote:VOTE: HP
Still not a fan of ETL. Also not keen on Fusion, EPM or Implosion. Implosion probably weakest suspicion of those listed.
See I thought fitz was the other mason due to this but reading back, it's strange he didn't have any doubt about the claims.
Again, this is what a townie would say. Not "out the third mason".In post 479, EspeciallyTheLies wrote:HP, let's not "out the third" if there is one. We need to lynch ABR to confirm the claim.
What is the point of this post? Posts like these are made by scum trying to drop fake towntells.In post 490, Humble Poirot wrote:Also, guys... Remember what I said about day chat. We might not really process the intrincacies while alive but I'm sure, at the end of the game, it will make for some interesting analysis to see the scum qt and these last pages.
prev-edit: yes, you can. I did it long ago.