Mini 1372 - Over

[Dunhamganger]

I'm a townie, by the way. Just wanted you all to know that.

Don't do that.

Yes, the purpose is to breed discussion as quickly as possible...

And it looks like I achieved that. Go me.

Less talking, more voting.

Vote: Benmage

[Dunhamganger]

Hey guys, heads up, I'm v/la until the 10th.

@ mod - a pm this game was open would have been nice

vote: benmage

After my most recent 9P game, we need to get someone to L-1 ASAP. Trust me.

fos: Dunhamganger

Scum.

vote benmage

for posting and voting when he is in V/LA eventhough he never said he was going away in game.

fos robbnva

for that terrible Reasoning of his FOS and Vote.

Double scum.

Unvote

For the worst wagon ever.

Vote: Fourseen Circumstance

For the worst reasons to vote ever.

Town.

What, exactly, are you trying to say, Benmage? Do you think I'm scum for claiming VT, or don't you?

Noobtown.

You make a good point, Ben. Sadly it's too late for me to do anything about it now.

Where the hell is everybody else?

Oops, back to noobscum.

I think you're incredibly foolish for claiming VT because people will rage later if you claim something else later. Moreover if its true (yeswifom) you've lowered the NK pool for scum to shoot at.

-And the jurys out on your alignment... welcome to the game barely starting.

Unvote

.

See, this is exactly why I didn't want to answer the question in the first place! Benmage took what I said out of context, and now he's using it as pretext to paint me scummy. You can't go around asking loaded questions like that, dude.

Jumpy noobscum.

Happy to see either ProfGuppy or FourseenConsequences hang.

Vote: FourseenConsequences

. I think a wagon on him yields us the most information right now.

[Dunhamganger]

He's appealing to emotion, he's buddying with you, and he's trying to pass the buck by pretending to be really concerned about the lurkers.

Fourseen is still better.

[Dunhamganger]

Lol go learn to play

Aw, poor baby .

I fully expect backlash, bring it on.

Yawn.

I want to vote you but prof. Guppy did sonething much worse.

Scum.

I'm not ready to jump on your wagon yet. I want Fourseen to make another post first.

This kind of elaborate caution gets us nowhere. As a claimed vanilla townie, and a newer player at that, you have precious little going for you. Your vote is the one thing. Use it.

[Dunhamganger]

Attaboy.

[Dunhamganger]

Aw, it's cute, he thinks he's leading the town.

[Dunhamganger]

I've done quite a bit of scumhunting. More, I would wager, than everyone else in this thread combined. Sound + fury =! scumhunting.

Could you even tell me, for instance, what my reason for pushing FourseenConsequences's lynch is? Or are you just determined to make sure everyone sees what a bad guy I am? I think there's a term for that, but I'm about to lose my reception as I go through this tunnel.

[Dunhamganger]

Yeah wow, everything would have been fixed if I knew what p.edit meant instead of you, you know, directing the parts of your post you want directed at certain people AT those people.

Saying I'm scum for suspecting you is just down right scummy. That's why I think you are probably scum.

Sigh. OMGUS is null at worst, and besides which if you had any reading comprehension you'd know that isn't even the reason you're scum. Let's review some recent facts:

Hey guys, heads up, I'm v/la until the 10th.

@ mod - a pm this game was open would have been nice

vote: benmage

After my most recent 9P game, we need to get someone to L-1 ASAP. Trust me.

fos: Dunhamganger

Scum.

Wait, was it you who just told me my posts were crap for not explaining my reasons for things? Delicious.

I want to vote you but prof. Guppy did sonething much worse.

Scum.

Wait, was it also you who told me that voting for a player I hadn't most recently mentioned as scum was somehow scummy? Man, it's a good thing craplogic isn't actually a scumtell, or I'm pretty sure I could get every other player in this game to string you up no questions asked!

Calling Guppy's FoS a "slip" is seriously stretching it, and the fact that you then decided to take him to task for claiming VT is pretty much undone by

Durham is scum, guaranteed. Im not scum, guaranteed.

Since I'm not a child, I'm not going to "guarantee" that you're scum, but it sure does look that way.

[Dunhamganger]

And before you get all randy about the fact that I'm still not voting for you or whatever silly thing you'll come up with, I'm keeping my vote on Fourseen until he or his (ahem) replacement comments on the goings-on. More information = more better.

[Dunhamganger]

I'm not worried if you vote me or not.

I'll flip town and people will see what I've been saying.

Your words + my mouth = ?. Not to mention you're contradicting yourself, but that's just your style.

w/e. Guppy's gone ahead and disappeared whilst we quarrel, which is consistent with a noobscum read, and I didn't even realize we were missing 3 whole players. Sound, meet fury.

[Dunhamganger]

You seem to be under the impression that any scum player, seeing any town player at L-1, will immediately hammer, thus handing himself to the town on a platter at the relatively small benefit of killing 1 townie. You are under a mistaken impression.

Also, I didn't ever say I wanted you to put FC at L-1. People in this game and putting words into peoples' mouths, man. I said I wanted you to use your vote when you had suspicions instead of picking grass in the outfield like you've been doing all game. Even your current buddy-buddy player Robb thinks putting players at L-1 immediately is supposed to be good for the game, so I suggest that if you're going to just sheep random players you at least align your actions better with their beliefs.

[Dunhamganger]

Hm.

Well that's not scumhunting.

[Dunhamganger]

Someone's been reading the Wiki.

[Dunhamganger]

(I like what you did there. Just to be clear.)

[Dunhamganger]

N replaced in with you, Slan, so he's hardly more of a lurker than you are. I agree that his post ain't good, though.

On the other hand, this thread is full of people calling someone scum and then voting for someone else.

[Dunhamganger]

So.

Vote him?

Unvote, Vote: N

[Dunhamganger]

(The system works.)

[Dunhamganger]

Best lynch =! scummiest player.

[Dunhamganger]

Because you're a moron? And probably scum? Seriously, that's the post you come back with? Hang.

Unvote, Vote: FourseenCircumstance

[Dunhamganger]

N hangs tomorrow, please.

[Dunhamganger]

Less pointless bickering, more forcing Fourseen to account for his useless posting and nonsense voting.

[Dunhamganger]

Robb hammering is a protown move. Slan and N's argument smells more and more like townies tunneling each other, at least on this page. Thanks and g'night.

[Dunhamganger]

Hammering a scummy, worthless player is usually protown in my book. Especially when the hammerer in question wasn't doing much in the way of use otherwise.

[Dunhamganger]

You certainly would if you were pretty sure you could avert a lynch today. Which is why we don't play the WIFOM game when we're townies. Because it's needlessly distracting.

Your hammer seemed awfully town-motivated when you did it, but today's post simply oozes fake regret and elaborate fake caution. If Guppy's scum I'm actually willing to wager that you are too. Hint: I think Guppy's probably scum.

No read on Sable Tip. Why is that. Speak.

[Dunhamganger]

lol

[Dunhamganger]

Sable Tip get in here.

robb stop being a dickbag for like two seconds and vote for a scum.

N, you're a

moron

scum.

Vote: N

[Dunhamganger]

(For the record I think there's a dec chance Guppy is scum too I just am also happy to allow that he's clueless.)

(Whereas N, holy moly.)

[Dunhamganger]

Scuuuuuuuuuuuum.

Probably scum pair.

[Dunhamganger]

Sable, this post from day 1 is quite interesting. You said we need to hear from the players barely posting and the replacements. Than you say you especially want to hear from McStab.

1. Why McStab? Why was his opinion the most relevant.

2. That post was I beleive your 3rd post, which makes you one of the people not posting. Why call out others for something you were guilty of (still are)

Not Content.

[Dunhamganger]

Hey Guppy.

Stop being scum please. Kthx.

[Dunhamganger]

The case against N is balderdash. Slaandar just pulled a name out of his ass, and piled made-up evidence on the poor sucker. All N has done is defend himself against baseless accusations. Nothing scummy about that, no matter what Slaandar wants us to believe.

Thanks for repeating exactly what I was saying earlier without any input of your own.
VOTE: Guppy

I'm sorry, how does defending you make me scummy in your eyes?

Could you people be any more useless?

(Not you Sable.)

(Not you either, N. Scum at least have an excuse.)

(So really just Robb.)

[Dunhamganger]

No... clue why I quoted that post. It has no bearing on my overall point.

[Dunhamganger]

lol

[Dunhamganger]

I found the scum. You're just too much of a reactionary (and uselessly noisy) player to pay attention.

Slandaar, you ready to vote for N yet? Your absence in this thread except to mention that this game is "funny" and your vote on Guppy rather than N are starting to grate my "Slandaar is probably town" nerve.

Everybody else, it's N-voting time. (Not you, Robb, I know you're not capable of it.)

[Dunhamganger]

you have yet to provide a reason for why he is scum. just like you failed to provide a reason why FC was scum.

and why are you criticizing Slandaar's "funny" post when you have had your fair share of useless posts. (I could actually quote your entire iso, but here are the highlights)

So.

Here's the thing.

Your reading comprehension isn't very good.

No, you didn't. You just found a convenient target for a mislynch. N is town. Saying he's not is scummy. I never should have taken my vote off of you.

The only people who talk about "Convenient mislynches" or - better - "Saying someone else is town is scummy" - are - you guessed it - scum.

[Dunhamganger]

that's my final vote for the game phase. if I get lynched today, please for the love of god lynch this bastard tomorrow.

Sigh.

[Dunhamganger]

BTW, I'm voting Dunhamganger now because he's a manipulative bastard.

You should probably be voting for the people that you think are scum. Just fyi.

(j/k, I know that you're the scum so it doesn't really matter much who all you vote for.)

[Dunhamganger]

Right back atcha, big guy .

[Dunhamganger]

Define "punked."

(Is it "Wildly accusing most everyone in a game of being scum while remaining stubborn and oblivious to logic and reason?" Because if so definitely.)

(I hear your pointless rejoinder already, so here's some Real Talk:

based on play thus far, I would argue the evidence is there to support a Sable/Mcstab scum team. McStab only mentions sable 1 time all game and he basically says he has no read on him.

Barely mentioning players =! scumbuddies. Especially when both of those players have posted far too infrequently. But by your own Swiss-cheese logic, there's plenty to connect you to N, since you've barely mentioned him all game (and obstinately refuse to vote him despite voting for nearly every other living player at some point today.)

Sable, you're below the mod line. Post.

McStab, Benmage still has more posts than you. Post.

[Dunhamganger]

Ugh god that's a scum post.

[Portion of post for Robb's edification:

1. Thorough list of unsupported scum and town reads.
2. After-the-fact implied back-patting for having a phantom "town read" on Benmage.
3. Offer to chain lynches.
4. Overconfidence in Robb's flip.
5. "Associative links"
6. Listing himself in his town reads. (I know you did that too, but it's not good.)]

[Dunhamganger]

N - can you outline why you are voting for Slandaar?

Can't you?

[Dunhamganger]

Score.

Unvote, Vote: Prof. Guppy

(Still think it's N, too.)

[Dunhamganger]

I could argue the same about everyone but me...

Sigh.

If/when we win I'm nominating you for "Worst Town Performance in a Winning Effort."

(Or maybe you're scum. I don't even know anymore.)

Hopefully sonething stops the kill tonight. That would be awesome.

I don't... what are you even... jesus.

[Dunhamganger]

Was it the entire playerset who hammered a power role without waiting for a prod or claim, or.

Fish.

Boobies.

[Dunhamganger]

It will please me to no possible end if Robb is scum in this game.

[Dunhamganger]

Yeah, you know what? Quickhammer + not being on the scum lynch = Robb is today's lynch.

Obviously I need to re-read but I'll probably be voting for N.

Oh, so you "obviously" need to re-read but you'll "probably" be voting for the other scum choice that most of us townies agreed on yesterday? How quaint!

Your hammer seemed awfully town-motivated when you did it, but today's post simply oozes fake regret and elaborate fake caution. If Guppy's scum I'm actually willing to wager that you are too. Hint: I think Guppy's probably scum.

Oh, it hurts to be this good.

P. edit:

Well I'm sorry to disappoint you but I'm not scum.

It's probably best to lynch me today to eliminate all doubt in lylo tomorrow.

Personally I'm shocked you are alive...

A. Ever the helpful scumbag.
B. You're shocked I'm alive because... you thought the scum would kill me for being so obvtown? After harping on how "scummy" I've looked all game? Or you're shocked that nobody else ever joined your half-hearted lynch attempts? Because that one should not shock you.

Hey Sland, N can't be a better lynch than this guy, right?

[Dunhamganger]

Wait, a second ago it was "probably best to lynch [you] today to eliminate all doubt in lylo tomorrow."

The other scum was on the wagon. I never ever defend my scum buddies when I'm scum.

Is... voting with your scumbuddy tantamount to defending him? Or are you just flailing wildly now? (Those are rhetorical; I'm a good enough player to know the answers.)

[Dunhamganger]

Hahahaha, there it is.

Look at how quickly he backtracks off being today's lynch. Poor cornered scum.

[Dunhamganger]

What are you even babbling about? "Permission from N." Jesus.

[Dunhamganger]

There's this thing I call "discussion." One uses it to double-check one's gut against the reactions of other players. I know from your behavior in this game that, town or scum, you don't understand either of these concepts, so it's no surprise to me that you don't understand why I'm not voting you.

[Dunhamganger]

Ive got nothing else to add.

LAL

[Dunhamganger]

@Robb: Normally when you ask a question, you use this punctuation mark

called

a "question mark." There actually isn't one in the post that you quoted or the text that you bolded. So.

Massclaim is fine, if potentially unexciting. Notice how excited Robb is at the prospect of getting to lynch N instead of following through on his plan to trade his lynch for mine. Curiouser and curiouser.

[Dunhamganger]

Well now that's a wrinkle. I understand what you're getting at with your "for reasons I hope are obvious," but doesn't that pendulum swing the other way, too? (Like, having the rest of us claim gives you more time/full information with which to fake your night actions?). Reading your most recent post especially, I'm tempted to give you the townpoints necessary to trust your reasoning, but it's not that clear-cut.

If Slandaar is scum, he's scum who didn't vote on the only townie wagon and who bussed the shit out of his partner for no particular reason on D2. He's so obvtown it makes my eyeballs hurt, and I have no problem claiming before him.

I'm assuming

Well, you know what they say about doing that.

[Dunhamganger]

Also VT.

It makes some sense that scum wouldn't have Guppy send the kill after his miserable D1, but on the other hand it feels a little unlikely that the scum team is just 2 plain goons with 3(ish) town power roles, and normally a roleblocker can't kill and block (though that isn't a hard and fast rule). On the third hand, ruling out N with the same claim doesn't feel advantageous here as a lie.

Robb is indeed today's lynch. If he's town (giggle), Sable's our lynch tomorrow barring unforeseen shenanigans (and if Slandaar turns out to be scum, then the JK should still give us the win).

[Dunhamganger]

Not sure that was the hammer but

If he flips town jail Sland. That is all.

[Dunhamganger]

(It is I think Sland was doing a thing.)

[Dunhamganger]

(A pro-town thing. But if you're actually a JK, then Sland has to be the final scum barring some kind of strongman kill sent by N last night, and we can sort that mess out tomorrow.)

(What I'm trying to say is that if, by some miracle, Robb is actually town and then Sland dies tonight after you claim to have JKed him, then in all likelihood it is you who are the scum and not N.)

(And if Robb flips town and you or I die while you JK Sland, then N is in fact the scum.)

[Dunhamganger]

Never mind never mind never mind, scum can no-kill.

But these are things to be dealt with if Robb actually flips town.

[Dunhamganger]

I'm kind of suprirsed, Robb. I figured you'd try to wait and hammer the other town power role .

(I just ran a quick scenario in my head wherein there were 3 scum to balance the number of town PRs, but given in that scenario that Robb is still alive the only possibility that Robb is town is that Slandaar is a terrible, terrible player, since both Sable and N are on the Robb wagon and Slandaar could have easily hammered and won.) (Because in that scenario, 2 of Robb, N, and Slandaar have to be scum since Sable is the other claimed PR, so.)

Not gonna third-guess myself here. Not to mention that your complaints about the set-up feel more like the complaints of a lone pissed-off scum player than those that a townie would have in a similar situation.

Can he hammer both scum? I think he can. Dunham, to ganger:

Vote: Robbnva

.

[Dunhamganger]

Sable, pick your poison (but don't tell nobody).

Robb, I gave up on you not being a twat in real life a long time ago, so good to see you keeping up the bluster.

[Dunhamganger]

(Also, Sable you're probably scum now. Sorry bud. But if you aren't though.)

[Dunhamganger]

your attitude today is not how I would expect a townie to act.

p.edit - regardless of what sable is, please lynch dunhamganger tomorrow as a policy lynch. he deserves it

L.

O.

L.

[Dunhamganger]

"UR NOT ACTING LIKE A TOWNIE!!!" *RECOMMENDS LYLO POLICY LYNCH*

[Dunhamganger]

Hey Robb.

How's it feel to get through an entire game of Mafia without making one correct read?

[Dunhamganger]

so ur scum rite?

[Dunhamganger]

Yuuuuuup. Makes sense. But only if Sable is scum.

Should we NL once first?

[Dunhamganger]

V/LA

for the next couple of days. In case we decide to go the obvious route,

Vote: No Lynch

. Make Sable pretend he targeted someone first.

[Dunhamganger]

Okay, well in that case.

It seems disadvantageous to me for Sable to bother making another kill in this game. Especially since whoever he claims to be JKing that night will then be confirmed town.

So. Here are some reasons why Sable is the last scum.

Play-Based

: 1. Bussed Guppy hard at the start of D1.
2. Easily the least active player alive.
3. Posts mainly in walls and makes those nuisance-y lists.
4. Has thusly managed to avoid the attention of the very slapfight-prone townies, alive and dead.

Set-Up-Based

: 1. I cannot think of a scum PR that would single-handedly balance the game against a Tracker, Jailkeeper, and Neighborizer. It simply doesn't exist.

WIFOM Based

: 1. Spent the latter part of yesterday "confirming" N as town and then accusing Slandaar of being the scummiest player to the point of requesting that he claim before me. After learning that I considered Slandaar to be obvtown, decides to JK me instead of Slandaar without giving any justification. Note especially that he selected a formerly scummy player to clear that we weren't likely to lynch on the heels of his (N's) involvement in the Guppy lynch. (Clearing Robb, for instance, doesn't necessarily lead to N's lynch the way that clearing N more or less directly led to Robb's.)

I would still no-lynch for a night to see what kind of staring contest we could get in to. But the chances that N is a permanent strongman/used his 1-shot strongman on N2 for whatever reason or that Slandaar would have no-killed last night seem so infinitesimally small compared to the case against Sable that I can't imagine voting for anybody else.

[Dunhamganger]

See, if you were actually the town JK, I would have expected you to advance that theory much earlier today. This is actually the first time you've even put it so simply. The only motivation not to at least bring up the possibility is to play politics, which is solely a scum motivation in lylo.

(By "hard bussing" I meant that you appear to cut ties with Guppy very early, not that you pushed incredibly hard for his lynch. Your posts at the beginning of D2 advance this theory, a la 166, where you posit three different possible scum groups, take pains to call Guppy "dumb" over and over, and then vote him.)

[Dunhamganger]

Vote: No lynch

. In case I'm not already.

[Dunhamganger]

Okay fine.

Hey Sable, who'd you JK?

[Dunhamganger]

Wait.

At the time, I felt that something was going on with Robb - that there was a good chance that he was scum, but that if he wasn't, he was probably a power role.

You thought that there was a good chance that a 9-player game had

4 town power roles

?

That oughta be the final nail.

Vote: Sable Tip

.

[Dunhamganger]

whenever it was

Night 2. After Guppy flipped plain ol' goon.

[Dunhamganger]

Wait.

At the time, I felt that something was going on with Robb - that there was a good chance that he was scum, but that if he wasn't, he was probably a power role.

You thought that there was a good chance that a 9-player game had

4 town power roles

?

That oughta be the final nail.

Vote: Sable Tip

.

Um,

literally

the sentence after the one you quoted:

At the time, I didn't think about the balance issue; if I had, it would have been obvious that there simply wouldn't be another townie power role in addition to me and the other two.

I understand why you quoted me so selectively there, though; you want to make me look as bad as possible because you think I'm the easiest lynch and you know that I'm not going to give you a chance to get another nightkill in.

Sort of like how if you listen to the prevailing opinion of the town and change your target you lose access to your perceived "easiest lynch?"

There is no town motivation to have targeted me again. There is also no town motivation to ever have paid little enough attention to not immediately dismiss the possibility of Robb being a PR. You are trying, rather badly, to retcon your D2 pressure of Robb and random choice of N to save face on the fact that you then turned around and pressured Robb again D3.

[Dunhamganger]

(In case you were wondering what it was you were doing.)

[Dunhamganger]

Um.

What?

[Dunhamganger]

I made a pretty thorough case on Sable yesterday. I pointed out all of the inconsistencies in his story today. I voted him. I won't be voting for you or for Slandaar.

Is there something else you need from me?

[Dunhamganger]

I decided to go with what felt like the safest jail.

"The safest jail."

Because on Night 2 in a 9-person game with 2 revealed PRs, a town PR would really be worrying about jailing other PRs.

[Dunhamganger]

Ow.

[Dunhamganger]

Yeah that's bad.

[Dunhamganger]

That's all well and good.

But if I am actually scum. And Sable is actually the jailkeeper. Then the set-up was, literally, 3 town PRs against 2 scum in a 9-person game.

Finally, he realises that he can’t actually make good arguments against me anymore, so decides to disappear entirely and let me into the spotlight for a bit while Slandaar and N confirm one another as town.

Did... you, post, while they were doing that?

Oh wait, I have posts on that page! Weird!

(Also: It's hard to make good points when I've made them all already.)

(For the record I think there's a dec chance Guppy is scum too I just am also happy to allow that he's clueless.)

Oh. Weird.

It's like I provided an explanation or something.

And consistently called out Guppy on his shit D2 while calling for pressure on N, my top scum read.

What a scummy thing to do!

[Dunhamganger]

No worries duders I'm town.

[Dunhamganger]

Woo!

(I really wish Robb had been scum.)

How much thinking went into the JK claim, Sable? Was it a ploy you had scoped out from the beginning or were you winging it as you went?

[Dunhamganger]

I think by most metrics, Robb, your play in this game was sub-par, if not downright scummy (though I think it was certainly the latter as well). That said, I'm glad we are able to pull out a win, especially since all Sable really had to do last night was to "JK Slandaar" like we asked him to and then kill N.