Mini 361: Leper Mafia - Game Over!

[ShadowLurker]

Vote: Yos for also breaking that S-name combo

[ShadowLurker]

Numero uno player on list is Sage, so

vote: Sage

Haha, you don't have a post restriction anymore, you can say all English.

Anyway,

Unvote, Vote: Rathyr

because my dice told me to.

[ShadowLurker]

Ok, I will try and clear this up.

-Voting on Rathyr was not an Oh My God You Suck vote at all. If it was, it'd only be a joke random one like all the other votes placed on page one.

-My point to vote on Rathyr was to show that dice rolls are not much different than random votes and to poke fun at him that he thinks dice rolls are forbidden, when a simple Random Vote isn't in the form of a vote.

-I do not see how voting on someone who already has a vote is suspicious. A random vote should be unbiased (especially if it is dice ) but come on now, it's seven to lynch. I'm sure five votes aren't going to randomly pile up out of nowhere. Two votes does not a bandwagon make.

-I note Rathyr called me out on OMGUSing, yet he OMGUSed PJ. It looks to me as he attempted to back that up, but I did not like his reasons.

-However, I also think most of the "crap logic" Rathyr is using is a poor choice of words and failure to read what he wrote. If he clarified the "SL is not scum, SL is not town" quote by saying he meant my behavior he would've saved himself a lot of trouble.

-I, myself don't see how my behavior swings one way or another. Many of you have your own scumtells though and I'm sure you can decide with this post since it does voice some serious thoughts.

-I am happy with my vote on Rathyr. I believe he has been way too defensive and suddenly at a loss for clear thoughts after people have questioned his behavior. Obviously, this can change at anytime.

[ShadowLurker]

After rereading it a couple times with the assumption in mind, Rathyr is scum, Rathyr is not scum, PJ is scum, PJ is not scum, and so on, I would like to say some more things.

-You do not vote just to lynch. You can vote to get a reaction, or just vote so you won't look guilty for not voting. (as I've seen happen many times) Saying PJ wants Rathyr lynched immediately is ridicolous. We aren't even at a half majority on Rathyr.

-Also, the, If <A> is <Alignment>, then lynch <B> is a logicial fallacy. First, it looks like Rathyr is already preparing for the best play for him and the scum when someone is lynched and is trying to form connections. Two, just because someone is defending someone doesn't mean they are scum with them. Obviously, you'd defend someone you think is town and prevent them from getting lynched. Rathyr making arguments like that is false makes me think he is trying to convince me with arguments with holes because I am a "newb."

-Lastly, I would like to know why Rathyr thinks I am townie, not mafia, and not a power role. I would also want to know why sacrificing me is definitely good for town in the long run. With so many variables and factors as well as different scumtells in the game of mafia, that seems like a really stupid quote. Am I confusing everybody? Am I being unsupportive of the town? I do not know why Rathyr wants everybody to finish me off immediately just because he thinks I am probably Townie. If I was Cop or something, then the town would be screwed, no? I am very trusting of the town however, that I wouldn't be lynched.

[ShadowLurker]

So Sage is suspicious for saying PJ or Rathyr is scum, and then backtracking on that after people got suspicious at him for it. I don't think that is deserving enough to take my vote of Rathyr and I don't think that is more suspicious than all the un-explained remaining contradictions Rathyr has to account for. Like the one where he thinks being "sure" of something is scummy as no townie should be that sure which happened right after he acted sure I was pro-town. Also, a vote on Sage would bring him to -1 without letting him explain anything.

Rathyr, I personally don't think acting "sure" on anything is suspicious. People will do it to try and convince other people to see their point, it's a basic point of trying to persuade people.

PJ, I think you should dominate the discussion if you believe you have good points to make as other people can pop in the discussion at any time. Plus, Rathyr seems really jumpy and makes the most contradictions when he's arguing against you and I want to see more of his reactions for me to determine if he's scum or not.

[ShadowLurker]

I also want to know what "slip-ups" I made and what exactly are "slip-ups" in the game of Mafia. I really don't think you can slip up. If you mean I have made some scumtells and if I was mafia, then I slipped up, then just state them so I can explain them and then you can decide whether they were justified or not.

[ShadowLurker]

Woops, I counted the votes by doing a Ctrl + F through the thread so I didn't notice that you voted twice because the first one didn't count or MM unvoted Sage.

And Turbovolver, there was more than that one incident where Rathyr acted like I wasn't scum. He also didn't say I was 100% outright, most people are infering it. Plus, he just posted answering my later post rather than some more points that were brought against him before mine so I'm still keeping my vote on him.

[ShadowLurker]

Umm, how is that a new reason? I said it too in my original posts.

[ShadowLurker]

Rathyr, I mean the new posts made by PJ after yours [65]. Turbo also made some points but not as many were directed toward you.

I don't think that is deserving enough to take my vote of Rathyr and I don't think that is more suspicious than all the un-explained remaining contradictions Rathyr has to account for.

From Post 73, so I didn't come up with a new reason.

[ShadowLurker]

See, PJ, now that you didn't post, the game has had no one post for almost 12 hours.
More than PJ, Turbovolver, Rathyr, and I can contribute to discussion

[ShadowLurker]

I think Sage defended the few accusatiosn against him well.

Did spectrum_void's post confuse anyone else?

Rathyr, you are close to a lynch, but I think most people are going to hold off and wait. If you drop even more scumtells though, I think your only option to defend yourself would be claiming.

[ShadowLurker]

Obligatory slap on the wrists for ShadowLurker for getting a Vote Count wrong twice. It's one of those things that are always a bit suspicious to me, because most people assume an incorrect VC to be an innocent mistake, but it's something the scum can sometimes really get an advantage with.

About SL: I'm less inclined to want to lynch newbie scum on day 1. It might be easier in end game, because newbie scum are more likely to make mistakes.

What?

FOS: spectrumvoid

Anyway, Rathyr is one away from lynch. Do you want to claim Rathyr? I do request that no one hammers him before some people have had a chance to react (StD for example).

Twice? Other than Sage's, I don't see me getting it wrong. Unless you thought I thought Rathyr was -2. I knew he was -1, but I didn't think that most people would want to hammer just yet.

[ShadowLurker]

What about me?

I won't switch my vote off Rathyr just yet, I'm the type of player who isn't really bandwagon-ish and is extreme conservative until votes until he has found someone he would like to lynch, and then very hard to persuade off that vote.

This might sound exactly like what Falcone and Sage have been doing but I believe I am backing it up enough so it makes sense: I do agree Falcone and Sage have been suspicious but your arguments PJ sorta make no sense if Rathyr and Falcone are scum buddies. If Falcone was and Rathyr wasn't then Falcone wouldn't really want to push suspicion on everyone but him would he? I also think Falcone knows better than to "buddy up" with someone.

[ShadowLurker]

PJ, why aren't you voting Rathyr if you are so sure he's scum? The town seems much more willing to support Rathyr here than Falcone, and you're making statements like

because I

honestly, truly

think Rathyr is scum.

Ditto. If you are so sure of his scumminess, you should put him at -1. But I take it you are trying to out scumbuddies and their reactions toward Rathyr before Rathyr is lynched? As we wouldn't be able to see their reactions day 2 or any further day.

Rathyr, that is exactly the kind of behavior that is keeping my vote on you and keeping my thoughts of wanting you lynched. Lurking is a way to attract even more votes, not lose them. If you start posting your opinions and responses and we think they seem a lot more pro town, then maybe we'll unvote for you, but lurking won't help at all.

[ShadowLurker]

More players need to speak up.. especially the ones that haven't posted since page 1.

[ShadowLurker]

I really don't see what's wrong with Yosarin's arguments. His "lack of passion" could be just an analytical mind that's not really too deep into RPing his role.

And I also find all the people that want to vote Rathyr but aren't sorta strange, seems like a way to cover your tracks as scum, doesn't it? Rathyr turns out innocent, you have "I didn't vote him". Rathyr turns out guilty, "Well I said I wanted to vote him." If everybody who wanted to vote him voted him we'd have a huge overkill right now.

[ShadowLurker]

I guess we'll have to wait for now on the people who haven't posted much..

[ShadowLurker]

What do you mean what townie would run out of things to discuss? I have commented on every issue so far. I said I thought Yosarin was innocent before he even made that post defending himself so that issue is clear and I've also said I think Sage's statement was blown out of proportion. And I like how I'm "earning" my name of lurking when I have stated my opinions, received NO response to them so I can't really say anything back. (I've even asked what people's thoughts on me were, see Post 121) I don't control all the votes Turbo, I control 1 and I've decided what I want to do with it. We need OTHER people to get a lynch, I'm waiting for those other people so I have no idea how I can be accused of lurking.

[ShadowLurker]

Oh and Turbo, that's twice in the last 15 posts I've actually posted (now 4) Many people haven't posted in the last 15 posts. Can you please tell me what your defintion of lurking is? Because it's definitely different than mine.

[ShadowLurker]

For a specific list, I'd like to hear from spectrumvoid and M-M and what their opinions on everything. Rathyr, Falcone, Sage, me, who they think is protown, what they think the play is, etc.

I'd like to hear from Smashy and Save The Dragons just slightly more. They've been posting their opinions but I just want to see them more often. Smashy has started posting a lot more recently though.

I'm getting pro-town vibes from Yosarin2, PJ, and from the few points he's made, Save the Dragons.

[ShadowLurker]

I also notice that Turbovolver is changing his vote so often that he can't keep track of it himself.

PS this is kinda scummy. Constant vote switching seems like the kind of thing people would find either immensely scummy and annoying, or not a big deal at all.

I only find constant vote hopping in some cases scummy like always jumping on a bandwagon in such. However, your behavior is starting to concern me for a

FoS: Turbo

[b/]

. After a reread, I see you have done:

Vote: ShadowLurker (mostly random/accused me of bandwagoning)
Vote: Sage (For commenting about skimming and could use it as a potential out in case the bandwagon fails)
FoS: PJ (For FoSing him because he's barking up the wrong tree, also disagrees about how good Rathyr's answers were)
Vote: Falcone (For FoSing PJ, he says PJ has done suspicious things in the same post and then votes on the bases of "trusting him")
IGMEOY: Sage and Falcone (Sage's explanation was a bit weird, Falcone is a bit oppurtunistic)
FoS: PJ (PJ honestly, truly, thought Rathyr was scum)
Vote: Yosarin2 (His arguments are solid, but he's playing without passion)
Vote: ShadowLurker (For lurking)
Vote: Smashy (On M-M's reasons of Smashy being too methodical and might be bussing)

These are the items that bother me, Vote: Sage, FoS: PJ, Vote: Falcone, FoS: PJ, Vote: Yosarin2, Vote: ShadowLurker, and Vote: Smashy.

The Sage vote at the beginning was on a weak reason, but then again it didn't put him anywhere close to a lynch and was probably to get a reaction, not too big of a deal.
The FoS: PJ's reason seemed just like an OMGUS when during when votes had been put on Rathyr for OMGUSing.
The Vote: Falcone concerned me because you wanted us to "trust you." You even said Falcone's actions were legit in the same post and based on good reasoning yet you voted him?
The FoS: PJ because he was sure Rathyr was scum. Again, I think that isn't a reason at all.
The Vote: Yosarin, You say his arguments are solid, but he's playing without passion. That seems like craplogic to try and divert attention off Rathyr.
The Vote: ShadowLurker, I was not lurking but my recent posts hadn't contribute content, I explained it and you dropped it, not that big of a deal but I still don't like it, seemed once again to try and divert attention of Rathyr.
The Vote: Smashy, you didn't add any of your own reasons and once again, it looked like you're trying to divert attention off Rathyr.

What does everybody else think of this?

[ShadowLurker]

Fair enough, I noticed Turbo vote hopped a lot during Too Much Scum! and turned out to be town. That's also why it was a minor FoS.

I was also going to call turbo out on his FoS on Petroleum Jelly in post 70, but then he changed his tune in post 83. So just for the record, turbo...Petroleum Jelly...FoS-worthy or not?

If the FoS stands...I have to agree with PJ that Rathyr's response did not give off a pro-town vibe, and I think your claims that "PJ is striking again" are rather uncalled for. And if Rathyr DOES come up scum, I'll remember that you encouraged us to "shift focus" away from him.

Is Petroleumjelly FOS-worthy? Yes. I didn't really change my tune at all, I just realised some things about Rathyr that were also suspicious. That doesn't change the fact that PJ has been (imo) exaggerating, or that he misrepresented me a few times.

But here's the cool part.

Unvote: Sage
Vote: Falcone

Trust me.

It looks like I misinterpreted this post but after rereading it, I still don't think I did.

I also went through Turbo's posts post by post but I decided not to quote each one of them for sake of brevity

[ShadowLurker]

EBWOP: It looks like I messed up the FoS anyway and it was supposed to be a minor FoS. It looks like I forgot the minor as well as forgetting to put the slash in front of the b. I'll wait for Turbo's PBPA for now.

[ShadowLurker]

No I don't believe that part as the post wasn't referring to Falcone at all but I believe you still voted on a "Trust me" which still strikes me as something that should've been explained.

[ShadowLurker]

No I don't believe that part as the post wasn't referring to Falcone at all but I believe you still voted on a "Trust me" which still strikes me as something that should've been explained.

I'm curious as to why you originally claimed it was referring to Falcone

I looked through and I think it was because Falcone posted about PJ too and I guess I just assumed it was him.

[ShadowLurker]

Does anyone know of a finished game (preferably a mini) that Smashy has played in? I think most of Turbo's comments against Smashy could very well be his playing style just like Turbo likes to vote hop and PJ is very verbose. I want to see how it checks versus his past actions.

[ShadowLurker]

I kept thinking and couldn't place my finger on what was bothering me and I realized it. It is Rathyr now all of a sudden lurking. Also, PJ, can you explain your dislikeness of the votes on Rathyr a bit more? It looks like you dislike everybody's vote but mine. What makes my vote so town but the other 5's scummy?

[ShadowLurker]

It is 7 to lynch, correct? So putting someone at 5 votes would put them at lynch -2.

Also, I think what you mean by a "trigger-happy townie" seems to be someone who wasn't paying attention. I think pretty much everyone playing has shown they are paying attention and most people have been frugal with their voting. (a couple obviously haven't though)

And this is what I mean with my point on Rathyr about lurking. PJ is now less sure about Rathyr being scum. Is it because Rathyr has made a great defense? Is it because he was cleared by another role? Is it because all the points against him were found to be invalid? No. It is because he hasn't made any more slipups because he has been lurking. If he didn't start lurking I'd probably be willing to help pressure some other people for reactions, but at the moment, I prefer a Rathyr lynch and I would like to see what his alignment was and then do a complete reread during the night looking at who seemed like he/she knew Rathyr's alignment and was preparing their response as to distance themselves, but also try and prevent the lynch if possible.

[ShadowLurker]

It is 5AM here and I realize I have just been wrong for about the 6th or 12th time regarding vote counts so I think I'll try and shut my mouth about them for the rest of the game.

Falcone: Way to completely shelve responsibility off you to provide a reason and leave it to everybody else by telling them to completely reread.

A little reasoning or a couple of directions at posts you find particularly scummy or even a PBPA (I read through them, those are where usually the bulk of evidence can be said) would be nice.

[ShadowLurker]

FOS: ShadowLurker

Correct me if I'm wrong, but in post 178, you accuse Turbovolver of jumping around and you explain your suspicion. I was first a little wary of this, because it wasn't mentioned earlier by anyone except for Falcone. I'm thinking, maybe SL's trying to pick up on something one player finds scummy, and is trying to expand. Then, in 188, when it doesn't stick, you downplay your accusation, calling it minor, when if it were minor, I don't understand why that much effort would be put into it. 189: covering your tracks. But this is one scenario, and I like Rathyr more for the lynch, so I'll sit on this for now.

I have posted a little bit on Sage. My biggest beef with Falcone was a post that I misread, and I lost the rest of my train of thought. I could post a lot about Turbovolver, but that would prove is that his statement is true; some find the voting scummy, and some are cool with it. I think it's his playstyle, and I'm not convinced he's scummy for it.

Now for the big picture of your point on me. My vote is still on Rathyr because I am convinced he's a good lynch for today. So far no one's offered any good reason why I should vote for anyone but Rathyr. If I keep finding suspicious things, like the one at the top of the post, I will probably FOS them, unless they are stronger than what we have already. For the most part, I pick targets that I like and vote for them. Sometimes I try to move my vote around, but sometimes I don't.

I'm fine with discussion and talking and all that, but there comes a time when the day's gotta end. We can talk around in circles, but I wouldn't be surprised if we don't find anything and return to Rathyr. Maybe this game has just started for you, but I'm not convinced day 1 has to go on for 20 more pages or anything like that.

I'm not convinced on Smashy, because if you look at the post where he votes, he does explain why he's putting Rathyr close to the edge, so I fail to see the contradiction.

Wow, Falcone, your post was a bombshell. There's plenty of playful banter, but I haven't come to that conclusion. I personally think that a place to look would be helpful, rather than an ambiguous assumption of simmilar thought. Or I could just be lazy...

So I'm suspicious for "downplaying" it after I was told it was his playstyle but you thinking it is his playstyle so not worth mentioning is just fine? May I ask what would be the non suspicious thing to do? Pursue it and say Turbo is scum because of his playing style? That would be a logical fallacy and I wouldn't say it didn't completely stick. Falcone isn't suspicious. Lastly, I'd like to see how "putting effort" into something that you think is a scumtell makes it suspicious if it's minor. The game was slowing down in my opinion and I want to show the town everybody I think who might be dropping scumtells not just Rathyr.
Right now, it seems you're accusing me of not being lazy.

[ShadowLurker]

Post 202

: PJ apparently had a change of mind regarding Rathyr. He now suspects that there's scum voting for Rathyr (for the record, voting for Ratyhr are STD, Sage, spectrum & SL). He seems to be preparing to switch his vote to Smashy, i.e. the person Turbo is voting for. This smells like scum who see the easy lynch (Rathyr) isn't so easy after all, and search for a better candidate.

However, both PJ and Turbo could've hammered when there was overwhelming evidence against Rathyr and he was at -1 repeatedly. Also, PJ expressed intent many times to vote. (Of course, you may find not following through a way to cover his tracks)

Rathyr: Are you even reading what is being wrote? After all those posts, I can't believe you commented on something like that.

spectrum: What post number did you give your reasoning on Rathyr and what post number did that flavor claim come from?

[ShadowLurker]

Currently, I am undecided on the PJ & Turbovolver/Falcone/Smashy issue. I still want a Rathyr lynch however. After spectrumvoid's last post, I thought it was a little suspicious. Spectrumvoid put her vote on Rathyr when everything looked like it was going to be a Rathyr lynch and now when many other people have started acting suspicious, she's backtracking so if Rathyr is lynched and turns out innocent she can say she had double thoughts and if he turns out guilty, she can say she helped lynch him as she didn't move her vote yet.

I am going to wait until Falcone responds to post my thoughts on PJ, Falcone, and Turbovolver because many major points of Falcone's attack were defended well and I would like to see his rebuttal.

[ShadowLurker]

Anyways, I'm still a bit neutral on the Rathyr lynch. While he is beginning to seem a bit more pro-town

Explain.

You know what? We're letting all the lurkers off the hook. They're not even coming up as potential canindates for scum. Suddenly, lurking makes Rathyr seem pro town. How the heck is lurking protown?

TOWN: FOR THE THOUSANDTH TIME, RATHYR HAS BEEN LURKING. HOW IS THIS PRO TOWN?

That being let out as it's been really bothering me, I also would like for M-M to post more.

[ShadowLurker]

His posts however, amount to two sentences at best and are all safe, obvious, statements or answering some non important question directed at him.

[ShadowLurker]

And I just read that game Smashy was town in. Smashy changed votes a lot, even though there probably were better reasons as there were already many pages when he replaced in and didn't act like he did now. However, that was his first ever game, but still his playing style now of slowly building an argument is much different from that game.

That game also had horrible modding.

[ShadowLurker]

Once again I say: "There is no defence against attacks against my contradictive posts except to admit that they contradictive and scummy. (Note: This is not a claim or anything. )"

In light of recent posts, I will

unvote: Sage

Vote: Falcone

I do not want you to defend yourself, I want your comments on the accusations against Smashy, Falcone, Turbo, PJ, etc. Once again, you have decided to answer some little thing about yourself instead of thoughts on other people. You have not even provided justification for changing your vote.

[ShadowLurker]

Or you could state why you think Turbo is protown, if you think PJ is scum like you did before, etc.

[ShadowLurker]

I was

very

excited, because I thought we had caught

two scum on Day One

: Rathyr

And we're letting him slip through our fingers as he lurks in the shadows.

PJ, I would like to know one question, on the 10 players other than you, if you ranked them from most suspicious to least suspicious, which place would Falcone be?

Also, can we get a vote count?

[ShadowLurker]

The amount of votes on Falcone is ridicolous compared to the amount of votes on Rathyr. I'm betting Falcone was just using Rathyr is innocent as an assumption and also, it can be pretty much implied from Turbo/PJ being scum. Just because he said Rathyr is innocent doesn't mean he's sure of it, it just means that's his thoughts. On the other hand, Rathyr has made an uncountable number of slip ups. Falcone, has been actively participating and commenting on everybody as well as Rathyr. Rathyr has been lurking and only commenting on himself.

[ShadowLurker]

Woops

But hey, since I gave the "correct answer" does that mean I'm cleared?

[ShadowLurker]

Argh, didn't even see the one on page 10, kept going to the one on page 8.

Falcone has only 2 votes? I was under the impression more people were suspicious of him.

Oh, StD never unvoted.

[ShadowLurker]

Turbo, if you believe it's worthy of a PBPA response, do it. If you still want Smashy lynched or more pressure on him, it's a good idea to convince other people to vote Smashy. Also, if your reasons are good enough, it may help to make you look pro town. It's your call.

Also, why are you scared?

[ShadowLurker]

I don't really agree with Falcone, but that kind of blunt attack against the two most vocal players in the game simultaniously on day one when neither one had really had much suspicion on them up to that point dosn't seem like an especally likely scum move (at least, it wouldn't seem to be a smart scum move), so I'm not really interested in bandwagoning falcone at this point.

I am actually thinking you are more pro-town than scum (as I believe somebody said elsewhere, attacking two vocal players at such a juncture strikes me as a fairly bad move by scum).

Completely WIFOM, not a defense, not an attack.

[ShadowLurker]

Add this to the wiki.

And I really hope this does not get sidetracked into a discussion when we're going to act like "Either PJ or Turbo is scum" and let Rathyr lurk some more.

[ShadowLurker]

Another wonderful lurking in plain site post by Rathyr.

spectrum: WIFOM basically means the argument leads to circular reasoning.

For example, scum would most likely kill <x> because <x>'s suspicion list has the scum at the top so doctor should protect <x>. This is WIFOM because the scum might think doctor will protect <x> so they would kill someone else. This means doctor shouldn't protect <x>. But mafia might be expecting the doctor to think like that and acutally kill <x> and so on. That's what WIFOM means.

[ShadowLurker]

Here is another good example:

SL, if I were scum, do you really think I would be this blatently inactive?

Sorry to keep barking up the Romany treee, but this post definitely called for it. Your defence doesn't make any sense. I hope you were trying to be funny or sarcastic, because lurkers may equal scum, and being inactive will not help town in any way.

The reason why I may seem to be a commentator could be my emotionless posting? No idea about that, but I tend not to get riled up unless someone really rubs me up the wrong way.

FOS: STD

I don't like his voting patterns. Also because people like Yos have been accusing him, and I don't think he has given a valid defense. All he has done is sound extremely defensive, and still not provided explanations for his voting. However, I need more evidence before voting STD instead, simply because I think there is much more proof against Romanus at the moment.

By the way Yos and STD, lynching practically everybody who has been actively participating in/contributing to this debate will provide us with information tomorrow. That's too many people to go after, so we should concentrate on who exhibits scummy behaviour, rather than how his death will give us info.

Romanus isn't in this game, did you get Seven Samurai and this game mixed up?


Also, my thoughts exactly mirror Sage's. I think Rathyr still should be lynched because his lurking is hoping that we'll lynch StD or Smashy or someone else instead.

[ShadowLurker]

ShadowLurker's first list of suspicion

Rathyr - He started the game off with a bang. He voted on ShadowLurker and then when other people started voting him, he took a stance that SL must be protown because he was a newbie all the while leaving his vote on him. When he was called out for being so convinced that SL was not scum and the fact that newbies have just as much a chance of being scum as experienced places, he started making false dilemnas and saying while SL is probably protown, we should lynch him for the good of the town in the long run. He then made a couple of conditionals depending on his, PJs, and SL's alignment. All of these used extremely bad logic when he himself added a link to logical fallacies which only he was using. Later, he claimed townie and said that his emotions probably made him say what he said earlier and he would lynch himself if he was town. After that, he started lurking and making all lurker posts while completely ignoring anybody other than himself and ignoring repeated requests for content and calling out M-M for lurking. I believe he is the play today by far.
Save The Dragons - At first, I didn't see what the initial case against StD was. I basically thought there was no case at all and I didn't expect much from his reponse to convince me he was scum. However, his defense did the opposite. It moved him from the bottom half of my suspicion list to the top. In his latest post it seemed like he realized the Falcone wagon wasn't turning out and went back to trying to get Rathyr lynched. He still hasn't provided a reason and OMGUS FoSed spectrumvoid. I find him extremely suspicious, but I believe Rathyr is the play for today.
HUGE GAP - It might seem that I would be about as content with a Smashy lynch than with a StD lynch if I don't put this gap here because it isn't true. Anybody below here I don't consider lynch canindates at the moment.
Smashy - I will be honest about Smashy. If it was my opinion's on his actions, he wouldn't be this high up. However, everybody else is suspicious of him including many people I believe to be definitely protown so that is the reason he is this high up. His playing style in another game was different than his playing style now of a methodical build up before voting but he refuted that point well. Right now, I'm just looking for more scum slip ups from Smashy.
Turbovolver - While I relented because PJ said most of my arguments against Turbo were for his playing style, I still got my eye on him for the accusations of Yosarin "not playing with passion" and me for "lurking" even though he has receded the latter. His recent behavior is less vote hopping and while that would usually seem protown, it happened right after he vote hopped a lot. I am just watching him at the moment and believe he is fine.
Falcone - While it is true the attack on PJ and Turbo being protown is WIFOM. I noticed everybody else had a point when it is not seen as a smart thing to do. However, he could've used it as a resort because he was under pressure. He went under fire earlier in the game for a couple of simple comments for which I don't think he should've been under fire for. Leaving him alone for now and listening to his thoughts like we're doing seems like a good play.
Sage - Hasn't posted much recently but the one little post that caused him to get a couple of votes didn't bother me that much in the first place. I want to see him post more so I can get a better read on his thoughts.
Machiavellian-Mafia - He's barely made any contributions so it might seem odd for him to be this low but from the few contributions he's made, I have a protown vibe. I definitely want to see him start posting more however.
This applies to the next three people - I'm a little concerned about putting these people this low because if they're scum, they'll just continue playing the way they are. So all of these people would either be really high on a suspicion list, or really low in my opinion.
petroleumjelly - Makes lots of contributions. He is like that in all his games but he is also mostly town in his games. He's made very good points but if Turbo is indeed scum, I would take a closer look at him for first taking two opposite sides on Rathyr like Falcone pointed out, and then for that scuffle which had more FoSes but still no votes. For now, he's pretty much off my scumdar.
spectrumvoid - Once again, seems very low for a lurker. However, her posts definitely give me a good vibe but she also needs to post more. I don't like lurking in general and as we get more toward the endgame, lurkers will become suspicious just for not posting much.
Yosarian2 - Yosarin has been constantly putting his thoughts in which have solid points. He is the player I consider most protown. However, I'm sort of uneasy about doing this because if he's scum, he pretty much has this thing down. His stances on things mostly mirror mine.
Shadowlurker - So obviously protown I don't even see how he's on here.

[ShadowLurker]

Sorry for lack of bolding and spacing in that post to help divide things up. I hope it's not too painful to read If you guys want though, I'll repost it with things like bold and spaces between each player so it's more easily readable.

[ShadowLurker]

Did you just dice roll to decided whose posts you were going to analyze? As I have no idea what that dice roll could be for.

Anyway, for the sake of people not reading to much after my post and yours, I'm just going to make a short reply to Post 306.
I still don't think StD provided a real reason. He said PJ's rebuttal made him think twice, but I still think it would be good if he provided some specific points like he did when he pointed out #3 on PJs rebuttal. I also don't like quotes like these:

Rathyr still seems like a great choice, but nobody's biting anymore.

I think if you think somebody should be lynched, you should push for it. He seems like to be saying "Well, Rathyr is a great lynch! He's acting suspicious! If you guys don't want to, then I'll have to lynch the second best choice, Falcone." That specific sentence and ones like that are things that moved him up so high on my suspicious list.

[ShadowLurker]

I was just wondering... what happens if we never reach a consensus? Will there ever be a no lynch day?

The mod will implement a deadline after a while and usually the most votes will get lynched. However, it is up to the mod.

Turbo's votehopping is back right after I pointed his behavior change on my suspicion list. Also, two people are waiting on him to make responses to their posts and he decides to comment on other things.. Interesting..

[ShadowLurker]

- Turbo is again defending someone who's near the top of several people's suspicion lists. This is not inherently scummy, I just noticed it.

- Turbo, my vote is still on you for a reason. You have yet to answer my question from 276.

- Also still waiting for Smashy's explanation (see my previous post)

Bolded part mine.

[ShadowLurker]

That much said, I still like my vote on StD, and I becoming more and more wary of the Rathyrwagon. He

might

be the correct lynch for today, but why cut discussion off early?

Well, the discussion is starting to run dry. The back and forths that Smashy, StD, Falcone, are all involved in are running to their ends. Also, Rathyr has not contributed in any of those discussions and his lurkiness is rathyr worrisome compared to his earlier behavior when he wasn't even that close to a lynch.

1.) What is your take on the fact that Rathyr claimed Townie?

BS.

2.) Do you think his flavor is believable?

I think it is unfair to consider flavor because this is supposed to be a Regular Game. People probably sign up so they don't have to deal with flavor. Anyway, I find his flavor believable at least but the flavor he provided (does not know why he got his condition but will deal with it) could be very easily made up or could even be included in almost all the roles as it's very general.

It seems like many people have failed to comment on either of these issues, and I believe both of them are quite important as to the state of the game.

I think you can imply a general response from everybody though in the form of who they're voting for and who they believe is suspicious.

[ShadowLurker]

That much said, I still like my vote on StD, and I becoming more and more wary of the Rathyrwagon. He

might

be the correct lynch for today, but why cut discussion off early?

Well, the discussion is starting to run dry. The back and forths that Smashy, StD, Falcone, are all involved in are running to their ends. Also, Rathyr has not contributed in any of those discussions and his lurkiness is rathyr worrisome compared to his earlier behavior when he wasn't even that close to a lynch.

1.) What is your take on the fact that Rathyr claimed Townie?

BS.

2.) Do you think his flavor is believable?

I think it is unfair to consider flavor because this is supposed to be a Regular Game. People probably sign up so they don't have to deal with flavor. Anyway, I find his flavor believable at least but the flavor he provided (does not know why he got his condition but will deal with it) could be very easily made up or could even be included in almost all the roles as it's very general.

It seems like many people have failed to comment on either of these issues, and I believe both of them are quite important as to the state of the game.

I think you can imply a general response from everybody though in the form of who they're voting for and who they believe is suspicious.

[ShadowLurker]

I think it is unfair to consider flavor because this is supposed to be a Regular Game. People probably sign up so they don't have to deal with flavor.

That dosn't really make any sense; regular mini games often have some kind of flavor, and in any case, if the flavor is there, it'd be silly to ignore it just because it's a regular game. It may or may not be a major factor in your decision making, but "unfair to consider"?

Anyway, I thought his flavor was reasonable, although perhaps a little thin. He said the mod wouldn't let him post more then that, which may or may not be true. Next time someone role claims, check with the mod about how much flavor you're allowed to claim, and we'll see if it it matches up with what Rathyr claimed the mod told him.

Really, that's a dirty tactic and just being unfair IMO

[ShadowLurker]

PJ: Since you have played with Turbo before, does Turbo usually make accusations based on "emotions." That just strikes me as a completely strange thing to do. I'll put it off to the side if it's part of his playing style once again but I don't like it =\

[ShadowLurker]

It also looks like he's trying to get Rathyr lynched so as to avoid getting lynched himself.

I've been trying to get Rathyr lynched since before you were born. Have you seen how he's been playing?

Rathyr still seems like a great choice

, but nobody's biting anymore.

To me, it seems like I am still pushing for it.

Anyways, StD is still up high on my list of suspicion. A lot of his wording just doesn't come off right, and

The rathyrwagon is not of interest to the town at this time.

Could be read as 'Well this wagon attempt failed. Onto the next wagon!'

Look at my post towards ShadowLurker a few lines up. I was very much into the Rathyr wagon when I vote Falcone.

Then why didn't you push for it harder? In the first place, you barely posted against Rathyr, and then, you just unvote, now when you're caught on it, you just claim to be "still pushing the Rathyrwagon." Saying Rathyr seems like a great choice is barely pushing. You could've summarized the list of things scummy behavior he showed or even point out all the lurky posts he's made.

In fact, I'll think I'll do that later tonight.

[ShadowLurker]

Note: This post was made yesterday but I kept getting an error and went to a friend's house to sleepover. I have not read anything past that yet.

I'll wait for StD's response.

Longest time between doubleposts EVAR.

Strange, I didn't see this post when I made 335, 337, or 344. I got the weird error so I decided to wait a bit and when I came back, I tried again and it still gave me the error. I didn't know the posts went through though until later.

For Yosarian, PJ, Turbo, Smashy, M-M
Note: All the quotes below are from Rathyr, I have not edited them at all, and they are self explanatory as to why you should hammer.

I don't think SL is scum, I don't think SL is town. I also don't think we should lynch him for the sort of error almost every noob makes.

I'm actually getting the impression that you are trying to either:

1.) Guide your partner into not making mistakes
2.) Trying to buddy up with ShadowLurker so he will not want to vote for you later.

Either way, I'm not liking your behavior.

Damn quick to attack, you are.

Unvote: Turbovolver, Vote: Rathyr

.

Wow, it's not too often you catch scum this quickly. Guess we got lucky this game.

What the hell?

That last sentence is so scummy I don't know what to think.

It seems that, thanks to a couple of posts just barely getting out of the random stage of the game, you've already decided I am scum and are already ready to lynch me, whether or not I post a defence.

You're not using that vote to create pressure, you're trying to lynch me and end D1 not 24 hours after it has started!

Your only proof is that I didn't want you to lynch a noob on the morning of D1 without giving him a chance to defend himself.

Instead of lynching me, a somewhat experienced player, lynch SL, an obvious beginner. If he turns out to be scum, lynch me, and you will probably win the game. If he turns out to be innocent, lynch PJ, and you will have found a scum. Either way it is a win-win situation.

Ok. You can stop that right now. I'm not getting into the quote-by-quote-page-long posts game. The only good thing about an obscenely long post is that most people just skim over them. (Note: This is only good for scum.)

Falcone: I like essay posts; what I don't like are the "quote by quote" posts that nitpick endlessly. I do read them, but in my experience (Which is small, admittedly) a lot of people just read the first and last sentences or so.

Go ahead and lynch SL now. I dare you. You aren't afraid of what we will find if we lynch him, are you?

It's a foolproof plan. The town can't lose if they follow it. Only the scum will lose.

I already have the first vote on SL, so feel free to finish him off.

I think he is a townie, but I am willing to sacrafice him, as the town will benefit in the long run.




So PJ, accept my terms or claim scum, I don't want to wait any longer!

Fine. Here is a new idea, since you seem to be afraid of lynching SL.

Lynch me.

Then, when I turn out to be a townie, kill PJ.

I will not kill myself, because hopefully someone will see the scummyness in PJ's "arguments", and I will not force this course of action upon the town, but if you feel I am guilty, lynch me.

But then lynch PJ.

This is all I feel I can do for the town at this moment.

Do what you must.

Also the fact that you said "sorry I was up late posting, it was kinda screwed" I don't find scummy, because you've done it as town. But what was that about you reconsidering your position on Shadowlurker after reading some more of his posts? That suggests you really

were

sure of him being town originally, which is troubling. What did you mean here?

OK, I admit it. I was gambling. (This is linked to my misunderstanding of PJ's attack on me.) I was risking my life on whether or not SL is scum.

Also, forgive me if I don't post many suspicions etc. about other players right now, because I consider myself too close to the lynching tree at the moment.

I am beginning to think that perhaps my lynch is best for the town, because if I survived this day and the next, I would always have a black spot, and a special place on the suspicious list of nearly every player.

Oh, damn. I've really screwed up, eh?

On Rathyr's activity..
39 posts in the first 4 days
10 posts in the following 12 days

Lurker much? That's about a 12x drop in activity. Although some drop might be expected as he didn't need to defend himself anymore, a 12x less posting rate is ridicolous.

[ShadowLurker]

Wow.. that was really bad timing on doing a list of Rathyr's post. Oh well, I still stick on my stance on Rathyr especially with his latest post considering most townies who give up hope and ask to be lynched turn out to be scum in past games I've read. (WIFOM I know but even when WIFOM is used in every game, it still happens o_O) However, I did promise it in a post two days ago "later tonight" so I guess I had to have done it anyway.

Posts #233 and #234 are the accusation.
Post #243 you defend Falcone for him.
Post #247 ShadowLurker defends Falcone for him.
Post #249 I get angry when I see ShadowLurker did this.
Post #250 You point out you did it too
Post #264 Falcone answers

Also, I would like to point out that at the time I made that post, I was not convinced Falcone was protown and still aren't. He was #5 in my LoS. (Updated one coming however) However, I believe the gist of what I had done was not "defending Falcone." I believed the point against him was faulty and so I went after that. Attacking someone on faulty points even if it's not completely craplogic = BAD.

I don't like StD's vote, I don't like Sage's vote, I don't like Spectrum's vote, I didn't like Smashy's vote, and I don't even know what to think of Falcone's vote.

Once again, seems like a pretty non committal way to say "SL's vote is the only vote I don't completely dislike." Also, I am a bit confused on what you mean by you don't know what to think of Falcone's vote? Do you believe it strange? If so then you do not find that suspicious?

Also PJ, did you think Turbo was townin the earlier stages of the game? Specifically, probably pages 5-10.

Bah, I didn't mean we should lynch STD tomorrow. Of course, saying that is completely contradictory because I said "we should lynch STD tomorrow." I just meant that STD is high on my list, below Rathyr, and that tomorrow I would press him.

Is anyone else starting to believe this is getting a too common occurence? Sage hasn't posted that much, but in the few posts he's had. The two things he got called out for have both been bad wording/mistakes.

SL's Updated List of Suspicion with reasonings on changes and nicer formatting

1) Rathyr - The recent behavior, even the little there is with all the lurking he's been doing is concerning be a lot. I would be willing to hold off a lynch so we can have discussion especially considering how active this game has been but the thing I'm scared of with that is that he might slip through our fingers.

Small gap

2) StD - Same thoughts as before, everybody keeps saying he explained everything and most of the town likes it but I still do not like it too much. However, it was enough to put him a gap behind Rathyr. I would also like to see more content in his posts like thoughts on others and maybe not just defending.

Small gap

3) Turbovolver - In my original LoS, I stated Smashy was only as high as he was because many of the town were suspicious of him and they couldn't all be scum and I did not think him to be that suspicious. However, that feeling has subsided for most of the town and my original doubts about Turbovolver that were shoved aside have been growing.

4) Smashy - Hasn't posted too much since then but he dropped only because Turbo rose and town feeling against him was subsiding a bit.

As I'm writing this, I realized EVERYBODY has moved up a a notch, so 5-10 are much more suspicious on average in my opinion than the 5-10 in the eariler LoS. Also, any same numbering = tie.

5) Sage - Sage has moved up again with the backpedaling of his thoughts on StD once again, pegged as a mistake after town questioned him about it because they did not like it. I would also like to see Sage posting more now.

6) petroleumjelly - While I do agree Turbo's FoSes are getting worthless, when I actually read his posts. I do see some points. Also, the one thing that's starting to majorly nag at me is the fact that PJ seems to be defending everybody. He has been suspicious of many players, but then after they make a response, he defends them.

6) spectrum_void - While her thoughts are still an echo of mine is a lot of areas. I didn't like the way she defended herself when Turbo attacked her which do seem minor, but enough to move her up considering how close everyone is right now. The specific gist was that she seemed to be slightly backtracking on the Rathyr lynch, and also, using numbers as her defense that sorta made no sense at all. (It was assuming a LOT of things such as some possible setups, if everybody Turbo defended was town, etc.)

7) Yosarian2 - Post more. I also notice that Yosarin likes to sit back and wait for an attack on someone, and then comes in and summarizes that attack as his own attack. I don't believe he's been bold yet and gone after someone that someone else hasn't gone after first. I do not like that which is why Yosarin has moved up. Technically, this should've been in my last LoS but I didn't really notice it.

7) M-M - Post more.

10) SL - Still pinging a 0 on the scumdar for me.

[ShadowLurker]

7) Yosarian2 - Post more. I also notice that Yosarin likes to sit back and wait for an attack on someone, and then comes in and summarizes that attack as his own attack. I don't believe he's been bold yet and gone after someone that someone else hasn't gone after first. I do not like that which is why Yosarin has moved up. Technically, this should've been in my last LoS but I didn't really notice it.

Um, what? Post more? I have made 21 posts so far this game, which is more then once a day, and is more then most people in the game. And I've hardly been "sitting back and waiting" for others to post; I've given my thoughts on every major topic in the game.

Maybe it's just me but I sorta find your posts non-memorable which probably goes hand in hand with my other point. I also think you misinterpreted what I mean. I mean all your thoughts on other players were after someone else has attacked them and you basically summarized them. You haven't really taken a huge stance on any one person yet or brought somebody not in the spotlight into the spotlight. This is also the reason mainly I think you haven't really been gone after yet. =/ Anyway, you're basically last on my suspicion list. I'm not looking for the amount of posts in what I said against you, I'm looking for the boldness/safeness of those posts.

Your attack was along the lines of:

In this snipped line, Falcone says that Rathyr is innocent. It must be a Freudian Slip! Scum!

You would have to think Falcone is in idiot if you actually expected him to respond along the lines of:

Oh, damnit, you're right. I know Rathyr is innocent, and that was a complete Freudian Slip. I guess you may as well lynch me.

This is really misrepresentitive, and I thought you were better than that. I'm pretty sure it's been multiple occaisions where I explained that townies would have an answer, but scum would have to try to explain on the spot. And often, their explanation would not match that correct answer. They don't have to break down and confess for you to catch them out, and I never suggested they did.

I've never really seen you explain that, if you have, can you give us a post number?

Also, I believe your point here doesn't really make sense. Scum have a reason for everything they do as well as townies. They should have an answer on the spot. Also, your use of "correct answer" worries me. There are many many many scumtells and multiple thought processes in thinking of a question and many possible outcomes. A townie with a radically different list of scumtells would probably never have the "correct answer" because he was looking for something completely different and therefore, scum, by your definition. I definitely think this was a bad answer.


Oh and I missed Falcone on my revised LoS. He's probably at 6 or 7 but my thoughts on him haven't changed since the last LoS due to not that much posting.

[ShadowLurker]

SL, if there are any specific points I have not addressed, or anything else you want to know, please alert me, and I'll get back to you.

As for others, I'm not feeling the PJ attack, and I think Turbo is pretty town. Sage is pinging high, but I'd just be repeating what others have been saying, because I got to go right now and can't look for myself.

Didn't see this yet as I was writing my post. Most of my feelings of scum toward you are probably not answerable and just your behavior that's pinging. However, I'll do a lookthrough of all your posts tommorow (I probably don't have enough time today) and see if I can find anything that's answerable and I would like answered.

I do note that you've moved down on my LoS from last time though

[ShadowLurker]

Hey PJ, you called Sage out for his reason for being suspicious of StD being explained now yet he's still suspicious.

I was wondering, if you believe Turbo to be so suspicious, and StD has answered thee reasons for voting, why is your vote still on StD?

[ShadowLurker]

Hey PJ, you called Sage out for his reason for being suspicious of StD being explained now yet he's still suspicious.

I was wondering, if you believe Turbo to be so suspicious, and StD has answered thee reasons for voting, why is your vote still on StD?

Read my Post 349.

I am currently voting for Sage, and have unvoted StD.

Never mind then. But at the moment, in my opinion, that people not on Rathyr would need to band together to get any pressure on anyone but Rathyr as basically the entire town knows that unless they do not seriously screw up, Rathyr is the play today.

I would also like to know what you would like to see so much more discussion on. Is it spectrum_void and Sage? More participation from M-M? Rathyr is a lost cause I'm afraid.

[ShadowLurker]

Ugh I am just not liking Turbo at this moment.

Once again, he has switched his style of voting. First it was hop hop hop, which PJ said was his playing style. Then it turned into staying on one person but when he was called out, he changed votes again. Then he wanted support from other people before changing and now when he's called out again, he votes for that person after (SIX FoSes, mind you) you think if someone had a votehoppy playing style, they wouldn't wait for six FoSes to go by before voting.

If I was PJ though who was the person that said it was Turbo's playing style, I would've been voting Turbo. But I am not PJ and I have never played with Turbo so I am going on what PJ says here. Turbo has not disputed that though.

I would rather have a replacement for M-M than Sage but oh well..
I don't like replacements in the first place, you have to reevaulate the player and take both past and current actions into play and it makes the day guranteed to last a couple more days.

[ShadowLurker]

Once again, he has switched his style of voting. First it was hop hop hop, which PJ said was his playing style. Then it turned into staying on one person but when he was called out, he changed votes again. Then he wanted support from other people before changing and now when he's called out again, he votes for that person after (SIX FoSes, mind you) you think if someone had a votehoppy playing style, they wouldn't wait for six FoSes to go by before voting.

I only voted PJ because he was suggesting all the FOSing and no voting was bad *shrug*

The thing that bothers me about that is how your behavior earlier in the game would just vote, not FoS. Now you're FoSing to no end, like when you did in every other post there.

[ShadowLurker]

The thing that bothers me about that is how your behavior earlier in the game would just vote, not FoS. Now you're FoSing to no end, like when you did in every other post there.

What's so bothersome about that?

You don't see what's bothersome about your vote hopping being pointed out as scummy and it was defended as playing style by someone else and then that playing style suddenly changing?

And Smashy, how about something a bit more constructive, you've read everything today and only had those few words? No one is even deserving of of your vote yet? Right now, to really pressure anybody not on Rathyr, we're going to need some help from everybody not voting Rathyr.

[ShadowLurker]

I've done a thorough read-through. I'll provide some general thoughts and ideas on where I stand for now; if you want something more in-depth, I'll have to do a dedicated re-read. I realize that people were suspicious of my predecessor Sage, so if you have any specific questions, I'll try my best to answer them.

First of all, I will

Unvote

. Unlike Sage, I don't think Rathyr is the correct lynch based on what we've heard so far. There are two reasons for this:
1. We have gathered so much information today that I don't see the point in going for the lynch which "provides the most information" anymore. We have enough leads as it is.
2. I'm not sold on him being scum.

Reading through the game, the one person that stuck out the most to me (apart from Rathyr) was Smashy. More than anyone else, he has been going with the flow. He only really placed one legitimate vote (on Rathyr), and that was at a point where pretty much everyone agreed that he was a good lynch. As soon as someone voiced doubt about his vote, he retracted it. Apart from that, he has been like ebb and flow. People get suspicious of Falcone? So does Smashy. People stop suspecting Falcone? Same for Smashy. Pretty much the same thing happened when STD briefly appeared on everyone's scumdar. Yet he never actually votes, never commits himself to what he says.

I also don't get the impression that he is interested in finding scum. "Waiting for X to respond" seems to be a standard sentence that appears in a lot of his posts. He only ever really gets involved when he is attacked himself, but then again, it's easier for scum to react to direct questions than to act on their own.

To summarize, I believe that Smashy is trying to fly under the radar in order to keep a low profile.

Vote: Smashy

Thoughts on everyone else will have to wait, I need to get some sleep now.

PPE:
Smashy's last two posts were not accounted for in my analysis above, but I'm too tired to put much thought into them right now. My points still stand. Off to bed for me now!

I have one question for you. Let's say you were an additional player with Sage. What would your thoughts be on him? I would be extremely happy to see a PBPA (Sorry to rest of the town) on Sage if you have the chance explaining what your thoughts would be and what do you think he's trying to do. Of course, this is time-intensive so you may be too busy.

[ShadowLurker]

I hope my posts haven't been 70% quotes

But Smashy, if you believe it is too much, then just simply skip the quotes, you should be able to get the gist of the quote looking at who the person is attacking, remembering their past behavior, and looking at the person's response. Also, PBPA's tend to find the most information in my opinion. You can still be concise while doing a PBPA.

CTD: Also, more questions this time about your views, I personally have heard enough from Sage on his defense. Why are you not sold on Rathyr being scum? What do you think of his many contradictions earlier in the game? Also, I believe it was abandoned a lot earlier that Rathyr's lynch would give the town most info. I believe PJ, Turbo, Falcone, etc. were all canindates for that spot.

[ShadowLurker]

Actually, I agree.

Rathyr, if you agree that you should be lynched, then could you please say a little more on your thoughts on other people? That way, when you're role is confirmed, we have something to analyze. You keep agreeing that your lynch is most beneficial to the town but you don't help us in any other way.

[ShadowLurker]

SV: Did Turbo ever post his LoS? If so, can I have the post # ?

Turbo, you're almost tied with STD on my LoS now. However, the part that prevents me from moving him up too far is it seems like it would be too dumb a play for him to be scum. If we're -1 on a Rathyr lynch who's not making his case any better, Turbo could've easily kept his mouth shut. Instead he goes and attacks PJ who he could hopefully kill off in the night. (Turbo: I am ASSUMING you are scum, that wasn't a slip) Then again, it could've been a ditch effort to make a connection by distancing or set up a lynch later in the game.

Also, looking through both M-M's and SV's posts, M-M and SV both are the type of players that don't get on too much and don't post too much in their games. I would still like to see both of them try and post more if they could however.

Lastly, PJ, it seems to me you keep saying all the latest arguments are pretty stupid and shouldn't even been answered. I think this is a pretty much a sign that we've exhausted discussion for today. I'm willing to *hazard* a guess that the general consensus of the town is to end discussion soon as can be said by the 5 on Rathyr and probably some of the people who aren't voting not because they want discussion, because they think Rathyr is innocent. (which is an extremely farfetched idea)

[ShadowLurker]

STD has moved down in my LoS a bit since I think he has defended himself very adequately by being sincere and genuine. I also noticed both Sage and SV possibly setting up STD has an lynch for tomorrow after Rathy today, but Sage was talking about STD as the person he'll most likely go after tomorrow while SV just flat out calls STD "confirm scum" if Rathyr is scum. Plus the fact that I like Sage's replacement CTD thus far, SV is moving up my LoS.

May I ask how he's being sincere and genuine? I personally don't find the whole "I've been wanting to lynch Rathyr before he was born" "My LoS is 1. Rathyr, 2. Everyone else" behavior after he was called out for switching his vote from Rathyr earlier sincere or genuine. That's why he is still #2 on my LoS

[ShadowLurker]

Instead he goes and attacks PJ who he could hopefully kill off in the night. (Turbo: I am ASSUMING you are scum, that wasn't a slip) Then again, it could've been a ditch effort to make a connection by distancing or set up a lynch later in the game.

So you've changed your opinion from "if Turbo is scum, PJ is likely scum too"?

No, I'm just simply pointing out all possible scenarios that aren't completely impossible. Also, I use the "likely scum" term very conservatively. For example, right now, Rathyr is "likely scum" and StD is "possible scum." Everybody else is "undecided" or below.

Explain please. You look rather scummy right now, to me at least.

I just laughed out loud. Literally. This coming from you of all players. I also like the vagueness of it.

[ShadowLurker]

Eeks I didn't realise that there was another page. Turbo: you've been evading the question that Yos keeps asking. How did you know that the 2 of them are town?

I see nothing wrong with Yos being detached. After all, I also don't think your scumtell is logical and well-explained. To everyone else: Turbo is in the habit of posting actively, but his posts usually don't make much sense (to me anyway). Let's look at the latest one: Rathyr asked turbo why T placed R 7th on T's FOS. He explained saying he thought Rathyr was town and commented about his quietness and his wagon. Yes, he did post a response, but his response doesn't make sense, ie it doesn't answer the question. He just THOUGHT Rathyr was town.

Err Turbo just said it's an exaggeration. All players do it, it's his feeling, just like when Falcone did it. I didn't think it was a slip when Falcone did it, I don't think it's a slip now even though Turbo pursued it harder. This point is moot.

Turbo is in the habit of posting actively, but his posts usually don't make much sense (to me anyway). Let's look at the latest one: Rathyr asked turbo why T placed R 7th on T's FOS. He explained saying he thought Rathyr was town and commented about his quietness and his wagon. Yes, he did post a response, but his response doesn't make sense, ie it doesn't answer the question. He just THOUGHT Rathyr was town.

It makes perfect sense. Rathyr gave me a pro-town feel early on in the game, and I stated that then.
After his wagon started to trail off, Rathyr became very quiet. It's very possible he's lurkerscum and was only posting frequently before to defend himself. This moves him up the LoS.
Still, his wagon grew very fast and had several scummy people on it, making him seem more town. Hence he's still pretty low on my LoS.

Is that any clearer?

You're waiting till NOW to realize he's been lurking? He's been lurking for half the game!!

[ShadowLurker]

"I've been wanting to lynch Rathyr before he was born"

I believe your quote is incorrect.

"My LoS is 1. Rathyr, 2. Everyone else"

I'm sorry I've got one vote to give...

It's posts like these that keep you near the top. You go and nitpick irrelevant parts instead of addressing the main issue. However, to be fair, I will say that the main issue has been briefly addressed by you in past posts.

Turbo: Benefit of the doubt = BAD in mafia. They will abuse it

[ShadowLurker]

Plus you've been iggling me for ages.

You float around everywhere

and comment on A LOT of things, but

most of your analysis has been "the bandwagon leader is scummy/lurking, let's get 'im guys".

Sorry if my posting is a bit all over the place:

Bolded parts mine.

So Turbovolver, what the hell? First you say I'm floating around and then you say most of my analysis is the same issue meaning I don't float around. Then you admit to floating around. I don't even understand what you mean by floating around but from my opinion of it, floating around IS GOOD. You NEED to comment on what you think of everybody and every issue. You can't just ignore a person for the moment because another is scummier, else, what are you going to do the next day? If what you mean by floating around is trying to get everybody suspicous, then I'm sure doing a heck of a good job by focussing on Rathyr, eh?

And yes, I do have a point against StD. He still has not answered the questions in fully in my opinion. I've stated this in my past posts and I'll state it again. He's briefly touched on them at best in my opinion and that post by him decided to nitpick on wording rather than actual content.

About me trying to "hound" the wagon. First of all, Rathyr himself, spectrum_void, and Falcone all stated that discussion is starting to slow down. That is exactly my point. Going through my last 25 posts, only 5 of them mentioned Rathyr lurking and 1 of those was a List of Suspicion where I mentioned everything against him. That's hardly "every other post" in my opinion.

Also, Rathyr just accused me of "lurking in plain sight." I have posted 2 full List of Suspicions with actual reasoning on each player over the past couple of posts. I have also just been accused of floating around. I can't be lurking in plain sight if I'm floating around so two players have contradicting opinions on me. I can't answer to contradictions, only questions. The only player to comment on any of my LoSes was Yosarin2 and I answered what I thought of him and he hasn't posted back.

[ShadowLurker]

Also, while I do not presume to call SL scum, I will say that his repeated statement about my lurking and his repeated call to "Lynch Rathyr now!" Is a little odd. It provides a wonderful way to "contribute" to the discussion without really contributing anything. I just want to point that out.

You described Lurking in Plain Sight which is what Turbo accused me of earlier too.

[ShadowLurker]

Turbo: Could you please read Mini 350? While that isn't too large a sample of his posts, from the coorelations between that game and the start of this game and the fact that Rathyr was scum in that game, that just reaffirmed by belief of Rathyr's scumminess.

[ShadowLurker]

Turbo: Could you please read Mini 350? While that isn't too large a sample of his posts, from the coorelations between that game and the start of this game and the fact that Rathyr was scum in that game, that just reaffirmed by belief of Rathyr's scumminess.

I'll get on it.

As for your response to my "floating around" comment, floating around just means being a non-entity. And when you

are

an entity, it's pushing for the lynch of what was at least once the easiest target (Rathyr). That is troubling.

And being a non-entity means not voting on anybody, then I believe that your view is flawed. I do not have to put pressure on everybody. Rathyr I believe is the play today. I am still offering my thoughts on everybody else and that definitely is not lurking in plain site. I have provided two full list of suspicions with full reasoning on each player.

[ShadowLurker]

Well, I think I remember him posting better in the newbie game I referenced right at the start... suffice it to say I'm suddenly thinking a lot worse of him.

Do you have the game number?

[ShadowLurker]

Does anybody else have no idea what that above exchange was about really?

[ShadowLurker]

What the means is that while you have given reasons for things like why you didn't vote on Falcone, I felt that the explanation you gave could've been more expanded on and I don't see why it couldn't have been included with the original post.

Anyway, if you believe you have answered them to the best of your ability, then why not post something like you just did? Why instead did you choose to nitpick stupid things?

Lastly, there is still a nice cushy gap between you and Rathyr and the gap between you and the rest of the town is gone. Turbovolver has nicely bridged that.

[ShadowLurker]

FoS: Shadowlurker

.

How can you even call out StD for "nitpicking" when it was you who was trying to nitpick ("you didn't answer these questions" when they were in fact questions he had already answered, except that the other questions were worded differently)?

Seems more to me like you are more trying to secure lynches (Rathyr today, with a target on StD tomorrow) than you are looking for scum.

First of all "nitpicking" is misrepresentative. The whole accusation was for nitpicking

unimportant

things. Look at this Post 436 and tell me if it seems pro-town or someone being half-assed?

I believe I answered your second point in my latest post.

My last point is about gaming in general, I read this in one of the mafia games I read, forgot which one it was or who said it but kudos to them.
Hypocrisy is not a scumtell. Why? You know you are innocent. This is the example I think that person used "Scum are more LIKELY to place the third vote on a bandwagon." If you place a 3rd vote on a bandwagon, then you can still accuse other people of placing a 3rd vote on a bandwagon becasue you know you, yourself are town, yet you don't know if that other person is.

[ShadowLurker]

Oh and I'm off to bed, it's 2am, addressing any respones will have to wait until tommorow.

[ShadowLurker]

Here is the long post I promised before going to bed

Seems more to me like you are more trying to secure lynches (Rathyr today, with a target on StD tomorrow) than you are looking for scum.

I heavily disagree with this. In fact, this is one of the things I believe StD to be doing.

If I was actually trying to secure lynches, would I have kept on Rathyr this long? Obviously, Rathyr's at -2 so it's not like he really is an easy lynch. If anybody is looking for a good lynch target, it's StD who you defend in that post. StD jumped ship to Falcone when suspicions turned to him even boldly stating "The Rathyrwagon is not of interest to the town at this time"

First he asked PJ and Turbo to explain themselves and then voted Falcone after their rebuttal. When he was questioned about it, this was his response.

At first, I looked into a post presented by Falcone against both Turbo and PJ. But the rebuttal made me change my mind, especially where PJ states he never asked for a claim. So now I can either keep my vote on Rathyr, or I can vote for someone else. What the hell am I going to do? Vote Yosarian? Vote PJ? Keep my vote on Rathyr?

Falcone's death probably has something to say about Rathyr's alignment and vice-versa.

I don't see that as explaining his vote on Falcone at all. He never expalined why he shouldn't keep his vote on Rathyr or vote someone else.

This is the other post that I believe was not fully answered

I've made my choice. Maybe I was too hasty when I voted for Falcone. But I had two pieces of information at that time:

1) The rathyrwagon is not of interest to the town at this time.
2) Falcone's post seemed solid at first, but was torn down.

Falcone's post seemed solid but was torn down. His post was an attack, not a defense. If your attack on somebody doesn't work, why would that make you suspicious? Falcone didn't really have a case against him, as it wasn't like it was a defense or anything.

And this is the point I have brought up many times about STD, STD jumped ship really fast from the Rathyr to the Falcone wagon with no explanation on Falcone. He even said he still had the option of pushing for Rathyr and never explained why he didn't. Yet read this post

Rathyr still seems like a great choice

, but nobody's biting anymore.

To me, it seems like I am still pushing for it.

So STD, why did you not continue pushing for Rathyr when you had that option? Please give me an actual example of where you were still pushing for the Rathyr lynch while voting Falcone before you were questioned. And finally, if Falcone was lynched and came up scum, what do you think that would tell you about Rathyr's alignment.

[ShadowLurker]

*sigh*

Yeah, we

are

at twenty pages of discussion. I guess I wouldn't be opposed to seeing a lynch soon, especially since we have no power roles outed, and at best we hit scum, at worst we hit a townie.

Unvote: Turbovolver

, and my vote will probably move to Rathyr soon unless there are any objections. I already have a good idea of who I will be looking at if Rathyr comes up town, and who I will be looking at if Rathyr comes up scum, so this would also be a fairly informative lynch.

I'll give the vote 48 hours, even though I don't even think this is hammer.

You gotta be kidding me. I spent the many last pages saying we won't really have much more discussion and was pushing for an actual lynch from Rathyr and came under fire from many people. Then when SV says it, you suddenly have a change of heart when you just accused me many posts ago of trying to secure lynches. Plus, I thought you still didn't feel the bandwagon?

Unvote: Save the Dragons, Vote: Sage

, and

FoS: SpectrumVoid

.

Guys, I seriously

do not want a Rathyrlynch right now

. In fact,

FoS: Anybody who lynches Rathyr

until we get more discussion.

That's a SHARP contrast between posts with NOTHING DRASTIC happening at all in between this posts yet a sudden change of heart. Also, your prime suspects are still the ones on the Rathyrwagon yet you're willing to go along with it?

Not liking this at all, if it was where we actually got NO information or got A LOT of information I would've been ok with it. But we still got a reaction out of me and a couple of people and CTD still has many things to comment on it and now you want a Rathyr lynch.

FoS: PJ

[ShadowLurker]

Anyway, if you believe you have answered them to the best of your ability, then why not post something like you just did? Why instead did you choose to nitpick stupid things?

Cuz nitpicking is hella funner.

And you still choose to not address the points I mentioned....

[ShadowLurker]

*sigh*

Yeah, we

are

at twenty pages of discussion. I guess I wouldn't be opposed to seeing a lynch soon, especially since we have no power roles outed, and at best we hit scum, at worst we hit a townie.

Unvote: Turbovolver

, and my vote will probably move to Rathyr soon unless there are any objections. I already have a good idea of who I will be looking at if Rathyr comes up town, and who I will be looking at if Rathyr comes up scum, so this would also be a fairly informative lynch.

I'll give the vote 48 hours, even though I don't even think this is hammer.

You gotta be kidding me. I spent the many last pages saying we won't really have much more discussion and was pushing for an actual lynch from Rathyr and came under fire from many people. Then when SV says it, you suddenly have a change of heart when you just accused me many posts ago of trying to secure lynches. Plus, I thought you still didn't feel the bandwagon?

Unvote: Save the Dragons, Vote: Sage

, and

FoS: SpectrumVoid

.

Guys, I seriously

do not want a Rathyrlynch right now

. In fact,

FoS: Anybody who lynches Rathyr

until we get more discussion.

That's a SHARP contrast between posts with NOTHING DRASTIC happening at all in between this posts yet a sudden change of heart. Also, your prime suspects are still the ones on the Rathyrwagon yet you're willing to go along with it?

Not liking this at all, if it was where we actually got NO information or got A LOT of information I would've been ok with it. But we still got a reaction out of me and a couple of people and CTD still has many things to comment on it and now you want a Rathyr lynch.

FoS: PJ

I'm guessing 20 pages of conversation does begin to wear thin eventually. The question here is are we going to get any new info out of today, or are we just going to sit around and attack each other? If it's the latter, then we should probably move on. We DO get quite a bit of information from Rathyr's lynch, and Rathyr's been condemed for a long time. I do find this post pro-town, though, because you are questioning the motives, although I do feel there was some decent discussion in the last 6 or so pages.

Exactly, there was decent discussion. If there was something extremely important that came up within the past 6 pages that would lead to a sure lynch then it would probably be a good time to lynch. On the other extreme, if we made no progress, then that's also a sign for lynch. But these specific few pages, we've had discussion rather than stalling. My LoS has changed a bit too. Also, we will (or I'll be extremely pissed get ) get the information from Rathyr eventually.

[ShadowLurker]

*sigh*

Yeah, we

are

at twenty pages of discussion. I guess I wouldn't be opposed to seeing a lynch soon, especially since we have no power roles outed, and at best we hit scum, at worst we hit a townie.

Unvote: Turbovolver

, and my vote will probably move to Rathyr soon unless there are any objections. I already have a good idea of who I will be looking at if Rathyr comes up town, and who I will be looking at if Rathyr comes up scum, so this would also be a fairly informative lynch.

I'll give the vote 48 hours, even though I don't even think this is hammer.

You gotta be kidding me. I spent the many last pages saying we won't really have much more discussion and was pushing for an actual lynch from Rathyr and came under fire from many people. Then when SV says it, you suddenly have a change of heart when you just accused me many posts ago of trying to secure lynches. Plus, I thought you still didn't feel the bandwagon?

Unvote: Save the Dragons, Vote: Sage

, and

FoS: SpectrumVoid

.

Guys, I seriously

do not want a Rathyrlynch right now

. In fact,

FoS: Anybody who lynches Rathyr

until we get more discussion.

That's a SHARP contrast between posts with NOTHING DRASTIC happening at all in between this posts yet a sudden change of heart. Also, your prime suspects are still the ones on the Rathyrwagon yet you're willing to go along with it?

Not liking this at all, if it was where we actually got NO information or got A LOT of information I would've been ok with it. But we still got a reaction out of me and a couple of people and CTD still has many things to comment on it and now you want a Rathyr lynch.

FoS: PJ

I'm guessing 20 pages of conversation does begin to wear thin eventually. The question here is are we going to get any new info out of today, or are we just going to sit around and attack each other? If it's the latter, then we should probably move on. We DO get quite a bit of information from Rathyr's lynch, and Rathyr's been condemed for a long time. I do find this post pro-town, though, because you are questioning the motives, although I do feel there was some decent discussion in the last 6 or so pages.

Exactly, there was decent discussion. If there was something extremely important that came up within the past 6 pages that would lead to a sure lynch then it would probably be a good time to lynch. On the other extreme, if we made no progress, then that's also a sign for lynch. But these specific few pages, we've had discussion rather than stalling. My LoS has changed a bit too. Also, we will (or I'll be extremely pissed get ) get the information from Rathyr eventually.

[ShadowLurker]

You are saying that you will be angry if I do not get lynched, regardless of my alignment?

No I'm saying I'll be angry if we don't get that information out of you because of that post I just made and decide to lynch someone else as personally, it's highly doubtful for a cop to come out to confirm your alignment seeing the amount of stuff we have to go on.

[ShadowLurker]

this game

Has he acted differently in a past game as town?

[ShadowLurker]

Hmm, I'll look at that later, Yos2.

In response to ShadowLurker, twenty pages is

a lot

of pages for Day One in a Mini (or any game). My vote will not

lynch

Rathyr, but I am signalling that I, for one, have seen enough of today. If you disagree with me and would rather have the day go longer, you are more than free to

unvote

so a lynch cannot happen in the first place. Don't FoS other people for something

you

can undo.

Can you please respond to my other posts?

And also, if you read my post, the FoS was not directly caused by you about to vote Rathyr. It's your sudden change of behavior and not a lot of explanation for it.

Also, I doubt the first 8 pages or so are useful looking at what they contain with Rathyr and so.

And Rathyr, why have you waited until now to give a defense or say your suspicions of other people? I may have been more swayed if this was given in the middle of the game but you chose to lurk instead. The time for that is pretty much over.


On a different note, #1 is one of my favorite arguments =D

[ShadowLurker]

What exactly is there to address?

On Monday, I still felt like I could get a few more reactions (when I made the post you quoted). Now I have gotten them.

Today is Friday. I have gone through an entire, exhausting week of school, and during that time, given this game a good deal of thought. There isn't much else I expect from today, so I have no objections to seeing this day end. Five days is a long time in real life, so it's not as if my change of opinion was "hasty" or "sudden".

Not that issue, my response to your FoS in post 475.

My responses are in 477 and 488.

[ShadowLurker]

How about I just explain

why

I've gotten these

strange

niggly feelings that have been trying to lynch Rathyr for a very long time and trying to convince others to do so (i.e. hounding his lynch):

You know what? We're letting all the lurkers off the hook. They're not even coming up as potential canindates for scum. Suddenly, lurking makes Rathyr seem pro town. How the heck is lurking protown?

TOWN: FOR THE THOUSANDTH TIME, RATHYR HAS BEEN LURKING. HOW IS THIS PRO TOWN?

I was

very

excited, because I thought we had caught two scum on Day One: Rathyr.

And we're letting him slip through our fingers as he lurks in the shadows.

That much said, I still like my vote on StD, and I becoming more and more wary of the Rathyrwagon. He might be the correct lynch for today, but why cut discussion off early?

Well, the discussion is starting to run dry. The back and forths that Smashy, StD, Falcone, are all involved in are running to their ends. Also, Rathyr has not contributed in any of those discussions and his lurkiness is rathyr worrisome compared to his earlier behavior when he wasn't even that close to a lynch.

BIG BIG BIG:

For Yosarian, PJ, Turbo, Smashy, M-M
Note: All the quotes below are from Rathyr, I have not edited them at all, and

they are self explanatory as to why you should hammer.

"Hounding", there is thy definition.

Lastly, PJ, it seems to me you keep saying all the latest arguments are pretty stupid and shouldn't even been answered. I think this is a pretty much a sign that we've exhausted discussion for today. I'm willing to *hazard* a guess that the general consensus of the town is to end discussion soon as can be said by the 5 on Rathyr and probably some of the people who aren't voting not because they want discussion, because they think Rathyr is innocent. (which is an extremely farfetched idea)

So all this time you've been asking for the town to hammer Rathyr, and now that I'm finally ready, you're trying to stop me. If you don't want discussion to end, then

unvote

and discussion won't end. It's entirely simple.

Once again, like I said in my previous point, I am NOT stopping you. If I did, I would've unvoted. I can want to lynch somoene and still point out other scummy behavior can't I? I'm saying I don't believe your sudden change of heart has good reason behind it.

As for your other point, hypocrisy

is

scummy, but it doesn't automatically make you scum (it simply greatens the likelihood). Of course townspeople are going to be hypocritical sometimes, and that is only natural. But due to the nature of the game (i.e. scum will say whatever they can in order to get somebody besides themselves or their scum partners lynched), they are more likely to practice hypocrisy in order to try to cast suspicion on townspeople. Furthermore, since scum can't really

be

as suspicious as townspeople (since they already know who at least one scum is), they have to fabricate suspicions and try to justify them: this in turn greatens the likelihood that they will be hypocritical in their policies.

That wasn't the specific point I wanted answered, the one I wanted answered the most was on STD and was said in Post 388.

[ShadowLurker]

I'll be making a series of long posts tommorow, I'm pretty busy though atm and school is starting in a couple of days so my activity level might drop a lot in all my games.

I do not want any lynch until I have voiced by thoughts.

[ShadowLurker]

Sheesh, I had tried to post this earlier, but my internet went down, and it's back up now:

In response to ShadowLurker:

1.) Post 388 was written by CrashTextDummie.

2.) Therefore, you must mean Post 488.

My point of lynchmongering was directed at YOU,

not

StD. When I want a response (read this carefully):

Pointing at somebody else and saying "but they're doing it too!" is not a defense.

StD has not been hounding the Rathyrlynch nearly as much as you. Fact is, the person who

sticks out to me

as having hounded the Rathyrlynch the most is

you

. Period.

The

both

of you have been trying to secure lynches somewhat, from my point of view (except I have accpepted StD's explanation for his actions). I have

already

pointed that out about StD, so there is no point in repeating myself (and in fact, I voted for him at one point for that exact reason). Nobody had yet at that time mentioned the fact that you were hounding the Rathyr lynch, while seemingly trying to set up a StD lynch for Day Two. Pointing the finger at somebody else (especially when they have already been pointed at) means nothing to me.

*****

Yeah, we are at twenty pages of discussion. I guess I wouldn't be opposed to seeing a lynch soon, especially since we have no power roles outed, and at best we hit scum, at worst we hit a townie.

I'm just curious, and this is aimed at the whole town. What have we accomplished in 20 pages that we couldn't have in 5-10?

Since pages 10-21, we have put a number of other people under pressure, considered a few new scumpairs, gotten reactions from different people on how/why they jumped on Rathyr/StD/Falcone, we have slowly watch Turbo's style emerge, we have gotten a replacement for Sage, we have forced people to continue making arguments (thereby picking out the bad ones), we have determined which people wanted to end the day quickly as opposed to slowly, we have gotten a more sure grasp on whether people are voting at this point because they truly think Rathyr is scum or because he is a Best Worst Case Scenario lynch, and probably a few other things I'm not thinking of at the moment.

2. Do you really think I am the most scummy of everyone? I think you just want to lynch me to speed the game onto the next step, you are tired of day one. I don't blame you, I just don't like being the sacrificial victim.

Yes Rathyr, you are the scummiest person in the game. Of course, that doesn't make you unequivocally scum. I

am

tired of Day One, and seeing as you are scummy, and you have claimed townie, lynching you (if you are town) really isn't very much of a loss, and lynching you (if you are scum) is a very good thing for the town.

4. What are the chances of having a GF in a mini? (I don't really know, I'm just hoping that the chances are very low.)

If there is a 3-person Mafia group in this game, chances are very high that there is a Mafia Godfather.

No, I did not merely accuse StD of doing the same thing in that post. If you read it, you would've noticed I pointed out that staying on Rathyr was not securing an easy lynch. If it was, Rathyr would've been lynched by now. Then I pointed out what does look like securing a lynch to me which is what StD has been doing. I am going to say though that the length of the two points were disproportionate. But that post was also to respond to StD where he asked about what accusations against him, I was just trying to hit two birds with one stone.

I've made my choice. Maybe I was too hasty when I voted for Falcone. But I had two pieces of information at that time:

1) The rathyrwagon is not of interest to the town at this time.
2) Falcone's post seemed solid at first, but was torn down.

Falcone's post seemed solid but was torn down. His post was an attack, not a defense. If your attack on somebody doesn't work, why would that make you suspicious? Falcone didn't really have a case against him, as it wasn't like it was a defense or anything.

Aren't you accusing me of attacking Falcone? Isn't that why you think I'm scum? How can you say an attack that doesn't work makes you town? If I say, "VOTE SHADOWLURKER CUZ HE HAS AN L IN HIS NAME AND HE TOLD ME HE'S SCUM" are you really going to consider me town? I'm sorry, I'm not sure where you're coming from, because scum are likely to attack people if they think they've got something solid, and if it's torn down, it could be because it wasn't as solid as they thought, which should happen quite a bit, since they are attacking someone they know to be town.

You are comparing apples and oranges. If you voted because of that late in the game, I would prboably assume you had reasons you didn't want to state. But also, you would be considered scum there for using crap logic. On the other hand, you actually thought Falcone's post was good at first meaning that you think Falcone's suspicions were justified. If you're town then, then you should also think Falcone is town as it being torn down should come just as a surprise to you as to him.

Rathyr's play:

He's like a hunting dog, who, instead of attack the deer his master sent him after, attack another dog. The hunter put him in the corner, where he sat with his tail between his legs, close to being put down. The master takes pity on his puppy dog eyes, and leaves him in his cage, where he's resigned to his fate. Yet it doesn't happen. Finally, the hunter opens the cage, and gives Rathyr a second change. He thinks he's found a deer, and he lunges for the weakspot...but it's a painting of a deer on a wall. He's breaking his teeth trying to maim the deer. The master is shaking his head, and he's furiously doing the puppy dog eyes again. Some of the other dogs have been making gestures with thier eyes toward the needle, looking from the master to the needle, to Rathyr.

I didn't see the use to that and the metaphor was unnecessary.

The only other thing I want to add is that I think at least one of ShadowLurker or Petroleumjelly is scum. Something about their interactions I cant explain at the moment. I still think we should be lynching spectrumvoid though. (And still nobody is commenting on her AT ALL )

Oh the irony of you pointing out false dilemnas, putting two people at the top of your suspicion list for them, and then creating one even without a reason, just a gut feeling.

EBWOP: Oh, Rathyr I read your reply to my "talking about the debug mode error" scum tell, and I liked it, seemed genuine. So I'm dropping that issue.

Can you explain how the heck commenting on that is a scum tell at all? Since the scumminess of 0, anything you make out if it is making it infinitely times too big. Plus, compared to the other things he's done, those don't make you suspicious but this does? What the heck?

There are 20 pages worth of reasons to lynch you. I'm sorry if I just wanted to condense that.

This is more smoke.

1. There are not 20 pages worth of reasons to lynch me. If there were, I would be dead right now.

2. You could have condensed it without creating a (Rather confusing) back story.

Ok. I'll conceed. What's your point?

Point? There is no point. I'm just trying to keep you from building a house of (false) cards.

Give me an EXAMPLE!

Ok. Here's one:

Anyway, if you believe you have answered them to the best of your ability, then why not post something like you just did? Why instead did you choose to nitpick stupid things?

Cuz nitpicking is hella funner.

(other than your little "I'm a dumbass and I'm going to ignore the game and then make up a lie about going into town so I that they'll obviously thinkg i'm protown heh I'm evil" thing. Seriously.

Sounds like someone it getting a bit angry. I suggest you leave sentences like this out of your future posts, in order to save room and to be more concise. Drivel doesn't help your argument.

I take a shower every day and I take Multivariable Calculus Monday, Wednesdsay, Friday.

This only convinces me further of your scummyness. This "defence" has absolutely nothing to do with this game.

I would certainly hope I'm neither of those things. Now that I have defended against your point, try bringing it to the game.

Your previous "defence" couldn't defend against a donut. It was a joke. Now it not the time for jokes.

It's not damning. (It could potentially be scummy, but if some one thinks it's damning, I'll eat my firstborn).
Now others are starting to jump in against you.

They are continuing their thoughts from the first pages of day one.

Which thoughts?

At the begining of day one, a lot of people were damn sure I was scum. Duh. Where have you been?

This is all parralelled in the story, and it does not instill confidence in me that you are town.

Your last sentence is is a little weird.

How so? Oh well. I'll just rephrase it.

You know how you kinda lurked for about 10 pages or so? You know those contradictions in the begining? You know all the wierd stuff that didn't add to your arguement?

Yes. I've gone over this before.

You know the way you all of a sudden come after me with a passion based off a crappy piece of evidence (which you have yet to defend against this attack)?

Mm? You mean just now? What attack? And what "crappy piece of evidence" are you talking about?

You know the way you're begging for an extra day? You know the way you're leading the cop investigation? Yeah. That's kinda scummy to me.

1. Wanting to remain alive is not scummy. Duh.

2. I am leading no cop investigation. I don't even know if there is a cop. I would like it if, if I remain alive, a cop would investigate me. That isn't particularly scummy either.

3. Are you done with your baseless accusations yet?

Also, you act as if, 1. PJ is a proven townie, and 2. PJ is running this game. Both are wrong. You are spinning your smoke again, I fear.

Point 1: No. I don't believe this. He's said he was considering hammering, so I was awaiting what he would do (hence the dogs looking towards the master). Although I would personally consider him to be up on my list of town.

So what your saying is that you don't doubt that he is a townie, but you aren't going to openly admit it. Nice.

Also, anyone else could have hammahed me. Why did it have to be PJ? I think you're buddying up to him.

See me LoS if you're confused. (that's a joke)

You know my opinion of jokes, especially at this point in the game.

Point 2: Don't tell me that PJ's not running this game on the twenteth frickin' page. (that's a joke, too...but there's truth to that one).

I don't understand the point of this sentence at all. No one person should be running the game on day one. I think you're buddying up again.

PJ has been an important voice in today's crowd. He's been all over. I would say that he has been doing a lot of leading the town. I don't necessarily have much of a problem with this cuz right now if he's town, then that's not so bad, and if he's scum, sooner or later he's gonna screw up.

Here's a new idea I have: Wouldn't it be interesting if PJ and StD were scum together? I don't think that's the case, but this paragraph makes me wonder if anything more than buddying up is going on.

StD: What if he is scum, and doesn't screw up? What if whoever the scum really are never screw up? Eh?

The town pointedly asked Rathyr who he thought was scum. He gave an answer, and now he his voting based on his answer. He is doing exactly what we asked: playing the game. His "going after you" isn't exactly heinous, because for all we know, you're scum and he's town.

And now I'm second-thinking placing my vote on him again. Ugh. What a Day One.

FUCK ME. Vote Rathyr. I'm not going to be the cause of a 40 page day one.

I apologize. I overlooked a detail. But I am NOT satisfied with what's going down. If Rathyr wants to attack me, bring it. I love defending myself.

Of course you're not satisfied. I'm attacking you.

If you are honestly satisfied (and I mean really, honestly satisfied) with his play of "he's scummy and stupid," then I encourage you to vote me. If you think that's enough information to condemn me, vote me.

Like PJ said, don't polarise this. (Another scum tell, for anyone that's looking.)

----------------------------------------------------------------

I've got to make something clear just to ease my mind, not that I think it's a problem, or that anyone is confused by this, but, I don't consider PJ cleared and I never did. But right now I'm leaning towards town.

Guess I'm just getting to the point where I'm starting to care less.

I was there 5 pages ago.

And I didn't mean to drag you into that, PJ. I'm just a little upset with how Rathyr is going about with his vote.

1.

Buddying instance!!

2. Of course you're upset. Skip the melodrama, will you?

----------------------------------------------------------------

Clarification for Rathyr, spectrum and Yos2:

What is suspicious about Rathyr directing the cop in his direction is that he might be the Godfather.

Note the freudian slip.


Or, I might

be a townie!

I hate it when people act as though townies love to get lynched. "Oh, s/he must be scum, s/he is defending him/herself!"

If we let Godfather-Rathyr live, and tomorrow a cop would come out with an innocent result on him, that could have disastrous consequences for the town. I agree that a townie could also ask for a cop to investigate him, but it's a fact that anybody could say it, and that scum would likely benefit more (if believed) than a townie.

So? Are you saying I should just vote myself?

Big FoS: Falcone

.

At first as I was reading the post was Rathyr's actually doing what we want of him and making very constructive posts and defending himself! Then I got to the part about Falcone. Rathyr, can you say where the hell in that post Falcone even implied you voting for yourself? Also, Falcone didn't say defending yourself is scummy. Asking for a cop investigation is not defending yourself, talking and showing why you did things is defending yourself. Falcone made a good point about the possibility of you being the godfather and how we'd have to out the cop just to say he got an innocent on you, that's not suspicious at all.

Alright...I just looked through the recently completled normal game "The Big Five 0", where STD was a good guy (a vig, to be exact). And while he was agressive in that game as well, it definatly looks to me like he used much more logic, and that his votes made more sense and seemed less like pure bandwagony then they have seemed in this game.

viewtopic.php?t=3294&highlight=

He does seem to be playing differently in this game, as far as I can see.

I'd have to disagree with you there. STD made a total of 41 posts that whole game, he's already made 28 here. Also, all of his posts in that game were pretty short and he did even more vote hopping. I saw lots and lots of times over the few posts he made in that game where he would vote someone, and unvote immediately after after even one person questioned about it. This actually drops him a bit on my suspicion list rather than raise it. His behavior this game is a lot better in terms of activity although maybe less so in relevance.

[ShadowLurker]

Falcone basically said that he thinks that my asking for a cop investigation makes me a GF, and that the possibiity of me being a townie is too small to worry about.

I defended with sarcasm.

I got the impression that he said there is a possiblity of a godfather and asking for a cop investigation is more beneficial to scum than to town. Frankly, I'd have to agree with him.

Update on the top 3 spots of my LoS: Within the last couple of pages, Turbo overtook STD for a couple of posts, but STD overtook him again, they're basically neck and neck on my suspicion list and the gap they had behind Rathyr is now gone.

[ShadowLurker]

To

the town

, or to a townie?

The town. As to confirm that townie, the cop would have to claim and even then, there is still the possibility of you being a Godfather.

Also Rathyr, I'm sorry to say this, but you can't just erase 10 pages of you lurking. If these posts were made earlier, other people would've already been under the same pressure you are right now. But the fact is, those 10 pages of lurkingness don't sit well with me especially because they were ignored even after I resorted to posts in nice big capital letters.

Also, what do you think about StD's recent posts? I really don't like how careless he is with his "logic". He posts are often confusing and filled with drivel.

His confusing and drivel loaded posts don't concern me directly but they indicate a bad attitude toward helping the town. He is #2 on my suspicion list because of the whole jumping off and his attitude is what keeps him there. I also don't like the fact that he seems to be passing off responsibility to PJ on your lynch by saying PJ has led the town. That way, if you turn up town, PJ doesn't look scot free because he "led" the town according to STD.

[ShadowLurker]

I don't think that's the case, but this paragraph makes me wonder if anything more than buddying up is going on.

I haven't had sex with him [PJ] yet, if that's what you mean.

Yet? Well, that problem can always be alleviated. *waggles eyebrows*

>.>

And oh my God. As much as this is going to make put a giant neon sign saying "Look how much I agree with Turbo!", I am now also getting the feeling that StD is town. And, as I have said before, I am thinking that Rathyr is town. Somebody shoot me, please.

That said...

FoS: Shadowlurker

. You know, I wouldn't be surprised at all with a ShadowLurker, Smashy, SpectrumVoid scumgroup here. I'll have to look into it later, though.

I find it strange for you to pick out Smashy and SV. SV and Yosarin2 have both echoed my thoughts this whole game yet you pick one over the other with Smashy.

Also, I'm tired of everybody saying "I have a gut feeling that...X is Y" screw gut feelings. That's what's stalling the game. When evidence all points to something, half the people go and vote it. But then the other half have gut feelings that it's not right and nobody will give anything up getting us to where we are now. I also dislike the attitude most people are having with being tired of this day yet they're unwiling to pursue somebody they find the most suspicious if they do not find Rathyr suspicious. I'm sorry but if you want to end the day, you're going to have to convine the rest of the town why X is suspicious as the day isn't going to magically end itself.

The slip part is where you say the godfather, instead of saying a godfather. I admit this is a piddling little point, but I just thought I'd point it out.

While 1 godfather is a staple, it is virtually impossible to ever have 2 godfathers so I believe that's why Falcone used the.

[ShadowLurker]

*shoots PJ*

I'm tired of reading long posts, posts that do a PBPA with quotes, and tired of today in general. Some people think that Rathyr is scum, and some think he is town. And there is currently 0% possibility of one side convincing the other. (except maybe PJ) So we'll be stuck like this for the next 100 pages or so. My verdict: We've done everything that can be done on day 1, we've investigated the possibilities of other scum pairs/trios and we've gotten a whole chunk of info. Can we please let the day end now? Then the cop can get to work investigate the others tonight.

(shrug) If you want the day to end, then change your vote to STD, or convince me Rathyr is scum. Just saying "can we please just end the day" accomplishes nothing, as I'm never going to vote for someone I think is probably town.

Case in point.

[ShadowLurker]

Rathyr, I'm sorry to say this, but you can't just erase 10 pages of you lurking.

Why not? Because you don't like to see your backup lynch victim slipping away? Since when does lurking make someone scum, anyway? I notice you aren't voting MM.

Because M-M does that in all the games he's in and I've liked the few posts I've seen from him. I don't even understand what you mean by "backup lynch victim." On the other hand, you posted a lot in the beginning and came under extremely heavy fire for it, instead of answering questions or commenting through 10 pages of posts by everybody else, you choose to sit on your hands through it. That seems scummy to me.

Also, what do you think about StD's recent posts? I really don't like how careless he is with his "logic". He posts are often confusing and filled with drivel.

His confusing and drivel loaded posts don't concern me directly but they indicate a bad attitude toward helping the town. He is #2 on my suspicion list because of the whole jumping off and his attitude is what keeps him there. I also don't like the fact that he seems to be passing off responsibility to PJ on your lynch by saying PJ has led the town. That way, if you turn up town, PJ doesn't look scot free because he "led" the town according to STD.

So vote him already.

The first 20 or so posts have enough suspicion together to have more than what STD has accumulated these past couple of pages.

The slip part is where you say the godfather, instead of saying a godfather. I admit this is a piddling little point, but I just thought I'd point it out.

While 1 godfather is a staple, it is virtually impossible to ever have 2 godfathers so I believe that's why Falcone used the.

You misunderstand. When Falcone says "the godfather" it is almost as if 1. there is a godfather in this game. And 2. He knows it.

It's like this: If I said, "I think SL is the arsonist." You would wonder why I presumed that there was an arsonist in the first place.

Once again like we pointed out with Turbo, it is not a slip, it is just an assumption from his post that is easily implied.

I also dislike the attitude most people are having with being tired of this day yet they're unwiling to pursue somebody they find the most suspicious if they do not find Rathyr suspicious. I'm sorry but if you want to end the day, you're going to have to convine the rest of the town why X is suspicious as the day isn't going to magically end itself.

FoS: ShadowLurker

What do you think I'm doing? The reason I'm tired of the day is people like you wearing blinders and caring about nothing else but lynching Rathyr. Also, my job is not to convince you of someone's guilt, our job is to hunt scum together. Unless, of course, you're not part of the team.

Firstly, that post wasn't directed specifically at anyone.

This is irking me so much at the moment I can't even begin to explain it. This is absolute BS. Part of your job of hunting scum is to CONVINCE OTHER PEOPLE of someone's guilt if they do not agree. You seem to be sure that your viewpoint is right and refuse to listen to any other viewpoints at all with this post. I can easily turn this around using your own logic to say "My job isn't to convince you of Rathyr's guilt, you're going to have to find that yourself."

I would also like you to show what kind of my behavior shows I only care about lynching Rathyr. I have offered my thoughts on everybody MULTIPLE times and right now I'm pretty angry with the fact that with all that I have contributed, I'm being accused of wearing a blindfold and only caring about one person.

Lastly, how the hell did that deserve a FoS? If you disagreed with that point of view, fine, your opinion, but that doesn't mean it's scummy.

Sage bothered other people more than he bothered me while he was in the game. But CTD is bothering me tons more than he is bothering other people right now.

Yes I would like to see pressure on Smashy, but that doesn't mean I can't look past that.

[ShadowLurker]

I am going to say though that that last post was had a bit of OMGUS drive behind it. I'm just angry at the fact that two LoSes I made with full reasoning and repeated offerings of my thoughts on everyone have been labelled by PJ as only hounding a Rathyr lynch, by CTD as wearing a blindfold and only caring about Rathyr, etc. Just because I'm pushing for a lynch on someone doesn't mean I'm not offering on thoughts on other people as well and even in the same post. Those two things aren't mutually exclusive.

[ShadowLurker]

Mod:

Vote Count please?

[ShadowLurker]

Woah, that was a

very

quick hop. I do not like how fast this wagon has grown.

[ShadowLurker]

PS Guys I'm really starting to think Shadowlurker is scum.

Thanks for pointing out reasons I can defend against.

[ShadowLurker]

@Turbo + PJ: Point taken. Where is smashy?

Hanging out with you and your other buddy, obv.

I don't know how to interpret this quote. Are you saying that you are not as convinced I am scum as you are Smashy and SV? Or are you just being lazy? I still have not seen the evidence you "Maybe later"-ed away.

I have also started school this week and have been extremely busy.

[ShadowLurker]

Why are you still voting me?

How can you possibly find Smashy less scummy than me?

1. Because all the reasons I pointed out earlier about the advantages of your lynch are still true.

2. Because yes, you have made a good effort to contribute and to defend yourself, and yes, your scumminess has diminished over the past five or so pages, but there are some remarks you're making that don't sit well with me (e.g. the 5-minute-notice vote for Smashy).

3. Because I couldn't be bothered unvoting before I was ready to vote for Smashy.

4. Because I'll decide for myself who I find scummy and when I want to vote, thank you very much.

1. Not really.

2. I explained that.

3. Not a real reason. And not pro-town.

4. This is pointless, not to mention somewhat scummy, IMO.

4. How the heck is this scummy? Personally, goading votes is scummy IMO like when you ask questions like "How come you're still voting me?" after my position on you starts to unfreeze.


Ok, I find Smashy suspicious. But why am I not voting him? Because I find other people MORE suspicious. You don't have to vote for everybody you find suspicious and 99% of the time, you can't. You only have 1 vote, (most of the time) pure and simple. I also DO NOT see what everybody thinks of CTD is so protownish. I've been getting scummy vibes from him since he replaced and he's above Smashy on my suspicion list right now which consists of Rathyr in the front, Turbo/CTD, followed by STD/Smashy.


If anyone has any questions about this post, please post them. I have been pretty unable recently to post much in my games and visit ScumChat at all while I used to be 24/7 in there. I can only post my thoughts periodically and cannot sometimes post all I want to post so you might see some actions that you don't think are explained that well. If you do and want them answered, please directly point them out, I gurantee I will answer all questions that are specifically directed at me.

[ShadowLurker]

SL: You've been getting scummy vibes from him since he replaced... but you haven't said anything until now?

Since when did I wait until now? I have criticized him in many of my past posts.

[ShadowLurker]

All CTD's posts to me have been "Let's throw out ideas and walk a generally middle path and see which one sticks."

I did a complete reread over all his posts. What do I see?

His stance on Rathyr: He says he doesn't want a Rathyr lynch over it "providing the most information," he says we have gathered so much information today that we have enough leads.

What's wrong with this? He is comparing two different things. A Rathyr lynch would give us a CONFIRMED player's alignment and he's been the focus for most of the day, the most would be revealed about player's alignments as most people have posted the most thoughts on him. Our "leads" are grey areas which we have to explore and make judgments on.

"He only ever really gets involved when he is attacked himself, but then again, it's easier for scum to react to direct questions than to act on their own. "

Same can be true for Sage/CTD.

"Concerning Turbovolver: I find it tremendously difficult to read him. A lot of what he says is (deliberately?) confusing and his unreasonably vigorous defense for Rathyr and STD is slightly alarming. Nevertheless, I think that some people might be getting their judgement clouded by being increasingly annoyed by him. It would therefore really help the town if he started doing more scum-hunting and less discussion over petty technicalities. One thing I do want to hear more about is his List of Suspicion, because it seems like he pulled it out of his ass (as evidenced by me appearing twice on it). "

Once again, walks down the middle and throws out a lot to see what sticks. Says that Turbo has confusing posts and seems sure that some people are confirmed innocent. But then he says people could just be annoyed at him. Lastly, he adds that he wants to hear some information. Turbovolver never answered to this and CTD didn't pursue it. If he really had these thoughts, it seemed to me like you would've pursued it instead of just forgetting about it.

"I question your level of participation. Whenever someone is on the spotlight, you pipe in with a small remark of your own."

He finds that about Smashy suspicious, yet he said Rathyr's lurking is understandable. Smashy has shown consistency with hsi amount of posts in my opinion and doesn't only stop in when he's under fire. I will not explain Rathyr again for sake of brevity.


I have rebutted all of CTD's posts after those later in the day but CTD never answered them.

[ShadowLurker]

"I don't agree with <x>" is much more constructive than "I don't agree"

Mod:

Prod on Smashy please?

[ShadowLurker]

I'm not sure what else I'm supposed to say about the entire Rathyr issue, other than he's gone way down on my LoS. I've slowly become disinterested in this game, though, but I'll try to reread later when I have a clearer head.

You still have not explained what people have wanted of you... You said Rathyr was suspicious for not really posting content and then when he does, you still say he's suspicious..

[ShadowLurker]

I really don't see how you can attack me for this. I suggested that we look for scum without the aditional knowledge of the Rathyr lynch, and as far as I'm concerned, that plan has been pretty successful. Of course we're dealing with grey areas and we don't know if Smashy is scum unless he's dead, but that's really the essence of the game that is mafia. What did you expect? We lynch Rathyr and all our problems solve themselves?

I don't think you see what I'm saying. I'm saying that a Rathyr lynch is
1) Beneficial to the town. If Rathyr's in the endgame, what are we going to think? We may have tons and tons of other things to look at, but Rathyr has that black mark against him.

2) I believe Rathyr is scum. The majority of focus has been on Rathyr today and therefore, a Rathyr lynch would help us the most after we see his alignment and look at other people's thoughts on him.

Can be true how? Until just now, I haven't really been attacked at all. Are you saying that I haven't been involved?

I'm talking about your predecessor, Sage. Just because you guys have differing opinions doesn't mean we should completely ignore Sage's actions. (Not saying you suggested it because you didn't, just pointing it out)

1. Turbo's playstyle had been a hot topic at the time, so I commented on it. I said that I had trouble getting a read on him, and this is still true to some extent. I didn't pursue the matter because it wasn't terribly important to me. And, unless my memory fails me, he did adress the faulty LoS.

All he addressed was the two people, not the actual content (which there basically was't) of it. I guess we have different priorities then if you don't think not being able to get any scumtells/towntells from a person isn't important.

2. Where did you get the "seems sure that some people are confirmed innocent" from? That is a gross misinterpretation of what I said.

Umm.. not at all. You said Turbo's defense of STD and Rathyr was strange. Isn't that Turbo being sure people are confirmed innocent?

Well, thank you for adressing the exact reason why I find Smashy's lurking much more scummy than Rathyr's. Smashy's playstyle has been consistent all through the game. In my opinion, he has played the whole thing so far in true scum fashion. Rathyr on the other hand did some lurking during the middle, which he explained quite convincingly.

That's the exact reason I'm NOT suspicious of Smashy. It seems like Smashy just doesn't have a lot of time to get on MS and reply, while Rathyr just chose not to comment in the game for a long part of it because in the beginning, he showed that he could be active.

Did I miss something? Other than your outrage at me accusing you of wearing blinders, I didn't notice anthing that needed to be adressed.

Your later posts don't contain much and I have offered my thoughts on them. If you would like an answer to a point of yours, then point it out and I'll answer again.

[ShadowLurker]

I don't think you see what I'm saying. I'm saying that a Rathyr lynch is
1) Beneficial to the town. If Rathyr's in the endgame, what are we going to think? We may have tons and tons of other things to look at, but Rathyr has that black mark against him.

You might think that. Turbo seems to think that my actions have been those of a townie.

.....Do you have a point? People are going to have differing opinions. Thanks for enlightening me on that fact.

2) I believe Rathyr is scum.

Because I lurked for a bit?

Thanks for misrepresenting what I posted and completely ignoring the OTHER reasons after it.

The majority of focus has been on Rathyr today and therefore, a Rathyr lynch would help us the most after we see his alignment and look at other people's thoughts on him.

I haven't been the entire focus. You seem eager to lynch me even if I am a townie for all the "information" you think you'll get from my lynch. Not good. Not pro-town.

Once again, you aren't even reading what I'm saying. Did I ever say you were the entire focus? No. I said the MAJORITY of the focus. And I don't believe you are a townie so yoru second point doesn't apply.

I'm talking about your predecessor, Sage. Just because you guys have differing opinions doesn't mean we should completely ignore Sage's actions. (Not saying you suggested it because you didn't, just pointing it out)

True. We shouldn't lynch CTD for Sage's actions either.

I have no idea what you mean here.

Umm.. not at all. You said Turbo's defense of STD and Rathyr was strange. Isn't that Turbo being sure people are confirmed innocent?

No. Definately not. It is not scummy in the least to defend those you think are town. If you attacke STD I'd probably defend him.

This is why you don't comment on replies to other people. You missed the point entirely. I have said what you said above multiple times, I am talking about a specific quote CTD said.

Well, thank you for adressing the exact reason why I find Smashy's lurking much more scummy than Rathyr's. Smashy's playstyle has been consistent all through the game. In my opinion, he has played the whole thing so far in true scum fashion. Rathyr on the other hand did some lurking during the middle, which he explained quite convincingly.

That's the exact reason I'm NOT suspicious of Smashy. It seems like Smashy just doesn't have a lot of time to get on MS and reply, while Rathyr just chose not to comment in the game for a long part of it because in the beginning, he showed that he could be active.

Then why aren't you asking for Smashy to be replaced? Do you like lurky players?

Because Smashy is posting, just not what we want.

These questions were directed at CTD, but I feel you answers are too scummy to go unacknowledged.

Until Smashy posts with his LoS/Claim,

Unvote: Smashy, Vote: ShadowLurker.

Wait, so a LoS/Claim from Smashy would make you MORE suspicious of him? Another nice OMGUS there as soon as somebody brings you back into the light.


Very happy with my vote right now.

[ShadowLurker]

Well, would you rather lynch Smashy or her?

I really don't care which one.

Shadowlurker's complete lack of interest in either is very telling.

I'm seriously starting to suspect the scum all suspiciously start with the same letter.

Wow, people just love the misrepresentations today, don't they?

I have a complete lack of interest in SV. I will say that right now. All her actions have seemed in line with mine and I've placed her along with Yosarin2 at the bottom of my LoSes repeated times and I believe she is protown.

I have NEVER said I have a lack of interest in Smashy. I have offered my thoughts on him multiple times, said I found him suspicious, put him in the top 5 of my LoS everytime, but said I find other people MORE suspicious. Have you even been reading my posts?

[ShadowLurker]

I have NEVER said I have a lack of interest in Smashy. I have offered my thoughts on him multiple times, said I found him suspicious, put him in the top 5 of my LoS everytime, but said I find other people MORE suspicious. Have you even been reading my posts?

All I'm saying is, if you were town you'd be voting for him 8)

I think this is a joke so I won't start to list the many things wrong with this.

[ShadowLurker]

Well it does have the 8) face in it

But if you think it's a joke, why aren't you getting up me for not giving you a real answer? You're so fake.

Because the questions weren't even directed at you?

[ShadowLurker]

Smashy, lurking like this is not a viable tactic.

If you continue, we

will

lynch you.

You have 48 hours before my vote falls.

48 hours? What the hell, if you want a claim, put him at -1 now.

[ShadowLurker]

Unvote: Smashy

.

Smashy, claim please.

You unvoted pages ago..

[ShadowLurker]

You know why this game is going slowly?

It's because you guys keep saying Smashy this, Smashy that, yet you aren't applying any real pressure. Put him at lynch -1 if you really want a claim.

[ShadowLurker]

Ok, this stall crap is pissing me off. I guess I have to take things into my own hands.

Vote: Smashy

NOW CLAIM AND POST SOMETHING RELEVANT.

Kthxbai.

[ShadowLurker]

Yeah; I'm rather surprised he dosn't have more votes. I was under the impression that we were very near to lynching him.

Didn't see that post when I made mine but this is your 3000th in game post.

Congrats

[ShadowLurker]

I am pissed off.

I will get flak from scum if I say I think Smashy is suspicious as I wasn't before and he hasn't posted anything to change anyone's opinion.

I will get flak from scum if I try to say who I think is suspicious for trying to derail the Smashy wagon.

This game has frustrated me. The players here have frustrated me. My posts in this game have started to differ from my actual thoughts in these last few pages because this is a busy and stressful time of my life and I feel a bit lazy to explain some things so I just do not post the things that require the most explanation. My posts in all my games have shortened a lot within the past weeks.

NOTE TO EVERYBODY: STOP AND THINK. THERE ARE SCUM PLANTING SEEDS IN THIS GAME. FOLLOW YOUR INSTINCTS THE MOST AND NOT EVERYBODY ELSES.

[ShadowLurker]

Unvote, Vote: Smashy

I am voting for Smashy because I am suspicious of him. He is in the top 4 of my suspicion list but is not the highest. However, I realize in the game of Mafia, you may have to compromise sometimes. Since it seems no one thinks the same of me with my top couple of suspicion picks, I think a #3/#4 suspicious player is a reasonable compromise.

I also find his recent lack of content disturbing much like I did Rathyr's midgame.

[ShadowLurker]

ShadowLurker still looks fake as anything. But assuming Smashy is scum, if ShadowLurker is willing to vote him and SpectrumVoid willing to 'pretend' (she didn't unvote)... if those two are scum why are we having so much trouble lynching this guy?

Hmm...

I have no idea what the hell you are trying to say.

But I find it extremely funny you decide to try and pin the blame on us that he's not getting lynched.

[ShadowLurker]

ShadowLurker still looks fake as anything. But assuming Smashy is scum, if ShadowLurker is willing to vote him and SpectrumVoid willing to 'pretend' (she didn't unvote)... if those two are scum why are we having so much trouble lynching this guy?

Hmm...

I have no idea what the hell you are trying to say.

But I find it extremely funny you decide to try and pin the blame on us that he's not getting lynched.

I'm not pinning the blame on you. I'm saying that if the other people I think are scum are already voting for this guy or willing to, then I'd expect the lynch to go faster.

Because a lot of the time lynches on scum go slow because a subset of the group (the other scums) won't be going down that path.


PS: Nice use of the word 'us'. I love it.



And I'm a little less sure about Smashy being scum now. But even if his 'giving up' does seem genuine, he's done enough scummy things (and unlike Rathyr, his served the motives of the scum e.g. trying to get probable townies lynched). I'm still happy with my vote, though if we all suddenly decide to lynch Spectrumvoid that'd be even cooler.

That is total BS. Scum often often bus.

And why did I use "us"? Your comment was extremely bizarre, after reading it three times, I decided it was to point out something against me and SV.


And I love how everytime we get close to lynching someone, you ALWAYS backpedal. As soon as we suspect someone though, you're like I CALLED IT! I CALLED IT!

[ShadowLurker]

Then you are too sympathetic, plain and simple.

Scum could easily make a sympathetic post, it shows nothing about the person's alignment, people have to remember it is just a game.

I understand frustration, but it isn't a defense, it only explains certain behavior.

[ShadowLurker]

That is total BS. Scum often often bus.

Yes, but:

Let's say I'm scum.

A bandwagon comes along on someone I know to be townie who has done suspicious stuff. I'm quite likely to vote there.

A bandwagon comes along on someone I know to be a scum partner who has done suspicious stuff. I might vote there, but I'm less likely to then in the above, aren't I?


So a lynch on scum will go slower than a lynch on a townie (when both have done the same amount of suspicious things). Scum might bus, but they're even more willing to go after townies who have slipped up and hence those lynches will go faster.

So by your definition, everybody who has been bandwagoned up to thus far are scum, including Rathyr who had the longest wagon ever which is completely disrailed as of now.

[ShadowLurker]

Vote: ShadowLurker

I believe his frustration at the end of the previous day was caused by his scummate Smashy failing to put up a good defence or claim, and his subsequent inevitable lynch.

LOL

The exact same posts where I stated my frustrations had reasoning.

Once again, I do not believe Spectrumvoid is the play. Spectrumvoid has seemed extremely protown for me and is one of the lowest on my scum lists.

I would like to hear comments from Yos though, I think he's agreed on generally by everybody to be protown.

[ShadowLurker]

Speaking of which, since when is Rathyr all of a sudden protown?

Vote Rathyr

[ShadowLurker]

At the beginning of day two, you feel the need to vote me because I am acting like a townie??

I think something is very wrong here.

Find me the post where I said you were acting like a townie.

And now that I recall ShadowLurker saying he's found spectrumvoid very protown, I get the feeling he's hoping I can direct a lynch on spectrumvoid (considering I pwnt Smashy) and come out with me looking bad and him roses.

You just now recalled? I've said it THIS WHOLE TIME. Also, I have no idea what the heck you are saying, how is saying SV is one of the most protown players here helping you direct a lynch on her? That has got to be one of the most ridicolous reasons I have ever heard, defending someone you are innocent makes you look scummy?

Also his vote for Rathyr for dodgy reasons.

Unvote: spectrumvoid
Vote: Shadowlurker

Happy to give you some pressure.

Nice "dodgy reasons" have you been paying attention to.. yesterday? Just because it's day 2 doesn't mean we should completely forget about Day 1, in fact, it's the only thing we have to go on, especially PJ's posts.

[ShadowLurker]

Nice scene. I'll nominate you for scum awards if there's another one.

Sounds very insincere.

How the HELL is that related at all to this game? How the hell did you conclude it's insincere? You're being ridicolous at this point.

[ShadowLurker]

At the beginning of day two, you feel the need to vote me because I am acting like a townie??

I think something is very wrong here.

Find me the post where I said you were acting like a townie.

You said "since when is Rathyr acting protown?". I interpret that as "Rathyr's changed his tune and is acting protown now, that's suspicious".

I interpret that as Rathyr hasn't been acting protown at all, why is everybody scared to vote for him?

And now that I recall ShadowLurker saying he's found spectrumvoid very protown, I get the feeling he's hoping I can direct a lynch on spectrumvoid (considering I pwnt Smashy) and come out with me looking bad and him roses.

You just now recalled? I've said it THIS WHOLE TIME. Also, I have no idea what the heck you are saying, how is saying SV is one of the most protown players here helping you direct a lynch on her? That has got to be one of the most ridicolous reasons I have ever heard, defending someone you are innocent makes you look scummy?

Firstly, it doesn't matter how long you've been saying it. When I recall is irrelevant to the point itself... it's not like I keep all the information in this game in my head all at once.

Secondly, I didn't say it was helping direct a lynch on her. I was saying if I got spectrumvoid lynched and she turned up town, I'd be looking bad and you'd be looking good. Given how sure you claim to be that spectrumvoid is town, and the fact I find you scummy, I started to worry about my thoughts that spectrumvoid is scum.

That's one of the stupidest arguments I've ever heard. I think you are scum. Therefore, Rathyr and STD are immediately cleared by your logic.

Also his vote for Rathyr for dodgy reasons.

Unvote: spectrumvoid
Vote: Shadowlurker

Happy to give you some pressure.

Nice "dodgy reasons" have you been paying attention to.. yesterday? Just because it's day 2 doesn't mean we should completely forget about Day 1, in fact, it's the only thing we have to go on, especially PJ's posts.

It's not like I didn't start leaning towards you as scum yesterday.

Plus PJ isn't one you want to be referencing when voting for Rathyr... remember PJ was agreeing with me that you and spectrumvoid were the suss ones.

Are you suggesting I ignore information from the only confirmed innocent in this game? Are you saying that PJ is always 100% correct? Are you saying I should misrepresent the amount of information we have?

How the HELL is that related at all to this game? How the hell did you conclude it's insincere? You're being ridicolous at this point.

Related at all to the game? Anything insincere is a scum tell.
How is it insincere? The language doesn't sound genuine. That's all I can say, and I don't expect everyone to agree.

Wow, you sure found a lot of language in that one sentence to something completely unrelated to the game.

[ShadowLurker]

Goodposting.

Like I've said, I've been a little suspicious of Yosarian all game long (And Falcone too, actually.) and the quotes you supplied just make him look more scummy.

With the infomation we have ATM, I am happy with a ShadowLurker or Yosarian lynch.

Not sure I want a spectrumvoid, Falcone or MM lynch though.

I'm only checking in briefly while at home going to an ortho appointment in a few minutes so I'll only reply to this one for now.

STOP lying. You have not been suspicious of Yosarin all game long. In fact, we have very little to go on of what the hell you were thinking for about half of the day because you decided to lurk.

[ShadowLurker]

Rathyr: If you really think that one sentence post means you have been suspecting somebody all day long, then I've been suspecting you since time began.

I will NOT claim at this moment, stop fishing.

Longish post coming soon.

[ShadowLurker]

Allow me to do some salvaging, STD.

I would like to hear comments from Yos though, I think he's agreed on generally by everybody to be protown.

What an odd thing to say. For one thing, you were taking great pride in having your own opinion on everything yesterday. Why are you suddenly depending on another players thoughts? The other thing that bugs me is that Yos is certainly NOT agreed by everybody to be protown (more on this later).

You can't have an opinion and want somebody to post at the same time?

And virtually ZERO suspicion has been voiced on Yosarin2. Do you actually remember him being seriously voted or FoSed in this game? A Ctrl+F reveals ZERO votes and ONE FoS. You phrase it as if many people have said they do not think he's protown as evidenced by him only being anywhere near the top of ONE LOS when a couple of people posted them. If people really don't think he's protown, why haven't we seen more heat on him?

This brings me to my next point.

Turbo, while rereading, I found you put Yosarin2 3rd in your LoS. Why the heck didn't you pursue that?

I have more reasons to think you are scum, Shadowlurker:
1. On more than one occasion, you gave "friendly advice" to Smashyscum. Not just by the end of day 1, in the beginning as well. This is curious, as he's the only one you interacted with in that way.

Are you talking about posts like 386? I don't see how I could be giving friendly advice and showing no interest at the same time. While looking through my posts with a Ctrl + F Smashy I see..

My 19th Post: Was addressed at Smashy and STD to post more.
My 25th Post: Asking about Smashy's playing style
My 32nd Post: Asked Smashy to explain a sentence, then I went into a short rant about Rathyr's lurking.
My 34th Post: Said Smashy's playing style was different. (I didn't puruse this because Smashy replaced late into the game and because it was his first game)
My 46th Post (A LoS): My comments about Smashy were that he wouldn't be this high up if it wasn't for everybody else's suspicions.
My 57th Post (A LoS): Said that Smashy has been lurking, but Turbo rose in suspicion to overtake Smashy.
My 64th Post: Addressed below.
My 66th Post: Only thing so far I could see as friendly advice. But this isn't about the game at all, it's about Smashy complaining about too long posts.

In fact, I just went through all of my posts after that instead of commenting on each one and rereading them. There was only those TWO posts that resembled anything of giving advice and one was just about skimming instead of reading and the other was addressed below. I would like to see your "more than one occasion" right now, CTD.

. You are lying about thinking

for the whole time

that spectrumvoid is town. At the very least, it's an exaggeration: You expressed suspicion about SV in posts 227 and 363.

Post 227: Addressed immediately after in 236. Obviously, I didn't even think the point was worth enough for a FoS or vote.

Post 363: I don't consider putting someone in the bottom 4 of my suspicion list being suspicious of them.

3. For the longest time, you showed absolutely NO interest in Smashy. Even when it was reasonably clear that he was scum, you went out of your way to make a case on me, which, the longer I think about it, was utter bogus (I'm willing to elaborate if I need to). You only jumped on his wagon at the very last moment, when there was no doubt left that he would be lynched.

Hm.. Didn't TV make a comment about showing lack of interest fairly recently? I'll make this brief since it has been sort of addressed already.

First of all, he was about #3 or #4 on my LoS, that's not reasonably clear at all. Next, I've expressed suspicion about you since BEFORE the Smashy wagon built up. People asked for some more reasoning, and I gave it. So I would like you to elaborate more. Lastly, I don't see how there was anything close to no doubt. In fact, the whole town kept saying WE WANT PRESSURE ON SMASHY WE WANT PRESSURE ON SMASHY yet no one was doing anything about it. This pissed me off and I decided to put him at Lynch -1. Sorry this wasn't as brief as I was expecting it to be.

4. Your vote was parked on Rathyr for the longest time. Your vote is now again on Rathyr. I find this illogical; unless you believe that Smashy decided to bus his partner in a very odd way, I can't see how you can still not at least consider Rathyr to be pro-town.

I don't see what you mean by a "very odd way." Tons of people have pointed out that Smashy's case against Rathyr was very methodical, slowly building up with a couple FoSes to a vote. That seems easily like waiting to see if he gets even more suspicious with just a couple of FoSes first. Frankly, since I still would've preferred his lynch over anybody at the end of the day, and I still do, I don't see how this is illogical at all.

5. Please explain this post to me (386):

And Smashy, how about something a bit more constructive, you've read everything today and only had those few words? No one is even deserving of of your vote yet? Right now, to really pressure anybody not on Rathyr, we're going to need some help from everybody not voting Rathyr.

To be honest, I don't completely understand what you were suggesting, but it's certainly an odd thing to say to someone we now know to be scum.

I don't see how that comment is any different from me asking Rathyr to post more content in the middle of the day, and then slowly evolving to getting extremely pissed off at him or me getting mad at STD for all his shenanigans earlier. This time, it just evolved into frustration and a vote.

[ShadowLurker]

Also, Rathyr, if you really want a new point. Stop echoing everybody else's thoughts AFTER they post them, you've been doing it with almost everyone of your posts lately, echoing TV the most.

[ShadowLurker]

Turbo, while rereading, I found you put Yosarin2 3rd in your LoS. Why the heck didn't you pursue that?

Oh I'm sorry, I guess I was too busy

lynching a scum for the town

. I wasn't just another straggler on that bandwagon, I was first to call him scum and one of the louder voices in calling for his lynch.

I was quite liking some of your rebuttals against CrashTextDummie, but this was ridiculous.

Your acting like you can only do one thing at one time.

You could've easily nailed Smashy and in the time you were on waiting on defenses, pursued other points. I was on Rathyr for most of the day but I added my thoughts.

I will concede however, I should not be the one saying this considering that I did not vocally attack anybody else other than Rathyr but it could've been done.

[ShadowLurker]

I was re-reading my old posts to see how many times I did in fact attack Yosarian. Anyways, I've convinced myself spectrumvoid is scum again. But ShadowLurker has more votes and I want a claim so I won't move my vote just yet.

Can I please have post numbers? I did not reread your posts, I just briefly skimmed the game and noticed your LoS. If I missed attacks afterwards, I'm sorry.

I will judge myself whether I thuoght you purused it enough though.


Also, I will NOT claim as of this time.

FoS: FISHERS

[ShadowLurker]

Do you want to die?

Or are you scum?

Do you want to contribute something relevant?

[ShadowLurker]

What about you, Mr. no I'd rather die than claim?

How about you stop fishing? I'll claim when I feel the need to and when I believe I have legitimate reason to claim, right now, people like you voting me's reasons are just BS.

- A comment from spectrum I FoS'ed her for and which I consider a real Freudian slip (post number available on request).

Post number please. The number of supposedly "Freudian Slips" in this game is getting ridicolous.

- SL's attitude towards Smashy. He put him on number 3 of his 1st LoS for the sole reason that others thought Smashy was suspicious. I interpret that as "I'm not going to help the case against him, but I need some insurance in case he does get lynched." There were also some other remarks that seemed undeservingly apologetic towards Smashy.

Did you even read the LoS? Why the heck would I be thinking in that mind set at the moment? Smashy had ZERO pressure on him at that second. Also, if I didn't want to help the case against him, I would've said so, why didn't I say so at that time? It was pretty blatantly obvious at that time I wouldn't support a SV lynch or a Yosarin one, why wouldn't I do the same for smashy considering SV had more pressure on her at that time?

I still consider SL's behaviour at the end of Day 1 the typical behaviour of scum that's frustrated with his partner's poor play and that realizes too late he should get on the bandwagon.

Wait wait wait, I'm confused. Being frustrated at the town for whining about Smashy not claiming while putting very little pressure on them, (Which Rathyr helped with relieving pressure, see below) and being frustrated at the town letting Rathyr slipping through our hands is being frustrated at Smashy?

Hmm.. It looks like I'll have to brood over this a while because I'm not seeing it..

- PJ-the-innocent-townie thought he was scum.

Yes, PJ has a 100% accurate scumdar, good point! We should all lynch SL immediately. If the day ended earlier when PJ had a different scum group and couldn't post his most recent thoughts, would you be voting them now?

Therefore, since PJ has suspected different people throughout the day, his scumdar obviously can't be 100%. This is a really stupid argument.

- SL's recent posts don't inspire me with confidence either.

Nicely general with no specifics at all.

I'll say that Rathyr is one of the people I don't want to vote for today. His interaction with Smashy would be too weird for two scums.

Wow, another general point. Except this time, it's easily found to be BS.

Hmm.. interaction being too weird? Such as not being one of the people that lynched him at all? What about unvoting for little reason? What about multiple times trying to deflect the bandwagon. If you noticed, Rathyr voted basically everybody that attacked him that day and then unvoted immediately after he was realized to have no case each time.

Rathyr unvoted Smashy TWICE. When you want a claim like he pretty nonchalantly said in a couple of posts, doesn't that seem a bit ridicolous? Completely unlike Rathyr sticking with me now and saying stupid things about how I want to die since I'm not claiming yet.

Just because people have been on Rathyr the longest dosen't mean he isn't scum.

[ShadowLurker]

Just because you want me to be scum doen't make me scum either.

Get a grip.

When the hell did I ever say anything of the sort?

All your posts today have been for one of the following:
-Echoing someone else's thoughts exactly
-Fishing
-Making stupid comments like the above

How about actually contributing?

[ShadowLurker]

How so? By unvoting you and trying to find and lynch the most pro-town player I can find?

My thoughts are: I thinks you're scum and I want you dead.

Fishing? Why are you so damned reluctant to claim? I claimed.

Stupid comments? I am wondering why you persist in attacking me even though it only makes you look scummy.

By actually providing thoughts with a vote.

For the last time, I am not claiming at this moment.

Wait, so are you saying, that you don't do anything for the town that might make you look scummy? And you do the things that will help you escape under the light?

Confirm Vote: Rathyr

[ShadowLurker]

By actually providing thoughts with a vote.

I have. Do you expect me to make up new ones just because other people in this game agree with me?

For the last time, I am not claiming at this moment.

I did not ask you to claim.

Your reluctance to directly answer my question, why are you so reluctant to claim, is noted.

Wait, so are you saying, that you don't do anything for the town that might make you look scummy? And you do the things that will help you escape under the light?

Please provide the post and specific sentence or sentences in which I said this.

You have not, if you have, provide the post.

You did not ask me to claim? Wow, my reading comprehension sucks then. I thought for sure 774 was asking me to claim, and I guess I was completely off in the point of posts 791 and 793. Seriously, your lies should be less obvious. And if you actually read my post, you should know why I'm not claiming.

How about the last sentence of the post I quoted? You wonder why I'm attacking another player which you say makes me look scummy. This basically implies that you

1) Would rather not help the town (ie. attacking players you think to be scummy) to not look scummy

2) And your prime goal is not looking scummy (ie. escaping under the light)

[ShadowLurker]

You have not, if you have, provide the post.

My statements of agreement with those who pointed out your scummyness are sufficient. See the second part of the sentence that you were replying to.

If you actually read my original post, I told you to say something of your own. "I agree" is just a craplogic way to shove blame on other people and to not provide a reason.

You did not ask me to claim? Wow, my reading comprehension sucks then. I thought for sure 774 was asking me to claim, and I guess I was completely off in the point of posts 791 and 793. Seriously, your lies should be less obvious. And if you actually read my post, you should know why I'm not claiming.

I was specifically refering to the post in which I asked you why you were reluctant to claim. Your eagerness in misenterpreting other's posts only further convinces me of your guilt.

In which post to you give a reason for not claiming other than that you don't feel like it?

If misinterpreting posts is a judgment of scum, then you're basically mod confirmed at the moment.

Once again, it is implied. It should be obvious. Does the word fishing mean nothing to you?

How about the last sentence of the post I quoted? You wonder why I'm attacking another player which you say makes me look scummy. This basically implies that you

1) Would rather not help the town (ie. attacking players you think to be scummy) to not look scummy

No, I wonder why you persist in attacking a player such as myself who is generally taken by the town to be a townie.

You are the only one who "knows" that I am scum.

LOL.

Once again, you are implying I should attack players like SV who the town finds scummy to not look scummy. That is bullshit. I will attack who I think to be scummy.

You claiming to be taken the town as a townie is the funniest thing I have read on MS so far.

2) And your prime goal is not looking scummy (ie. escaping under the light)

No. My prime goal is finding and killing the scum.

Although having people think I am innocent isn't such a bad thing.

Wow, what a good answer.

[ShadowLurker]

Rathyr:Other players will see to the fact you wanted a lynch of me without reason, I want reasons OF YOUR OWN.

Then I guess you won't know if you don't know the definition of fishing. My job is not to explain game terms to you.

That should say "taken by the town"

I was re-reading my old posts to see how many times I did in fact attack Yosarian. Anyways, I've convinced myself spectrumvoid is scum again. But ShadowLurker has more votes and I want a claim so I won't move my vote just yet.

Can I please have post numbers? I did not reread your posts, I just briefly skimmed the game and noticed your LoS. If I missed attacks afterwards, I'm sorry.

#64: I point out a tiny thing I found suspicious about Yosarian2. Nothing much, really.
#124: I debunk Yosarian2's attack on Rathyr.
#145: I

VOTE

Yosarian2. Didn't you claim there had been no votes and only 1 FOS?
#180: OOH, I see a post where you tried to discredit me once I voted Smashy. Cool ^^. Also in this post I justify my Yosarian2 vote a little.
#299: I disagree with Yosarian2 about SavetheDragons. Not really an attack though.
#413: I call one of Yosarian2's posts a scum tell.
#414: Clarification of previous post.
#417: More attacking Yosarian2.
#423: I put Yosarian2 3rd on my suspicion list.
#520: I FOS Yosarian2 for making up crap about StD's behaviour in a previous game.


So you missed all of those occaisions, eh?

I never said I reread, I said I did a Ctrl + F. So no, I didn't miss anything other than a one vote on Yosarin.

#64: You

agreed

with Yosarin here. The only thing that could've been remotely interpreted as suspicious is you saying Yosarin didn't comment on a big fight.
#124: That was more of a defense on Rathyr, not an attack on Yosarin. Your sentence at the end saying that this is generally everybody's points and they don't hold water to me implies that you just picked Yosarin's attack on Rathyr to defend against.
#145: I missed one vote. It was an accusation of "playing without passion" which I think is BS and many other people have said so as well.
#180: See below.
#299: As you said, not really an attack.
#413 & #414: Extremely vague attack that the actual point was never pursued (a "trap" in it was). Seems like it was a trap? Then how is that an attack?
#417: You accuse him of "not being annoyed" that's a lot of more attacking there over something you yourself said had zero reasoning and was only applicable to Yosarin.
#423: Which I pointed out and said you never pursued anything afterwards. This is evidenced by the fact that your next post attacking him is

97 posts later

and we weren't pursuing Smashy immediately after either.
#520: I counted it.

Plus I see you lied about nobody voting Yosarian2.

One vote, huge lie there.

Plus I see where you tried to discredit me when I put my vote on Smashy.

You act like I was the only one that attacked you then randomly as soon as you put your vote on Smashy. That is BS, in that same post, I pointed out other past votes that had bothered me including.. your attacks on Smashy, me, Yosarin, Falcone, and PJ.

Found the important part.

So by your definition, everybody who has been bandwagoned up to thus far are scum, including Rathyr who had the longest wagon ever which is completely disrailed as of now.

Of course, the speed of a bandwagon will be dependent on far more than just the theory I posted about how scum wagons tend to go slower than town wagons.

You seem to misrepresent people in every single post where you quote someone.

Umm.. no, that's not a misrepresentation. I did not ignore that fact at all. What my point was was that EVERY BANDWAGON in Day 1 went slow hence the 30 page Day 1.

[ShadowLurker]

I never said I reread, I said I did a Ctrl + F. So no, I didn't miss anything other than a one vote on Yosarin.

I just briefly skimmed the game and noticed your LoS

You did more than a Ctrl + F. Really I was just trolling, but it seems I caught you in a minor lie anyway.

*Sigh* I'm tired of explaining this.

Could I really get a good review on what went on Day 1 with Ctrl + F?
Could I really remember who voted who by skimming the game?

The answer to both of the above is no. I Ctrl+Fed to find out who voted Yos and I skimmed the game to get a review of what happened.

I also dislike the fact you were trolling on purpose.

*Commens on all the times I attacked Yosarian*

You asked for it, and I gave it. That is my summary of my negative interactions with Yosarian2. If you feel that it's "not enough" for someone I put 3rd on my suspicion list, then come out and say it, vote me or whatever, and I'll defend it. For the moment I think there are enough quotes in this post.

I was asking why you didn't

pursue

it. While that isn't what I want, it bothers me what you said. You're only going to explain something if you're voted?

You act like I was the only one that attacked you then randomly as soon as you put your vote on Smashy.

Who else attacked me?

Players agreed with that post. I'll go back and check for specific names if you really want me to.

That is BS, in that same post, I pointed out other past votes that had bothered me including.. your attacks on Smashy, me, Yosarin, Falcone, and PJ.

I never said anything about what your attack was made up of, so I don't even know

what

you are calling BS, much less

how

. All I said was you 'tried to discredit me'. Which is certainly true - you in fact "pointed out other past votes that had bothered" you, as you say.

Yes but you also said "as soon as I voted Smashy" which is implying to the town that I was defending Smashy there. Rather, I was saying you had been vote hopping too much.

Umm.. no, that's not a misrepresentation. I did not ignore that fact at all. What my point was was that EVERY BANDWAGON in Day 1 went slow hence the 30 page Day 1.

Yeah, I got that. Suggesting I was saying "every slow bandwagon is a scum wagon" is the

very definition of misrepresentation

, because I did not in fact say that! Do you see how that works?

"So a lynch on scum will go slower than a lynch on a townie (when both have done the same amount of suspicious things). Scum might bus, but they're even more willing to go after townies who have slipped up and hence those lynches will go faster."

You said a scum lynch will go slower than a townie lynch. Then by your own logic, you should be voting Rathyr who had the slowest bandwagon. In addition, every bandwagon in this game has been slow once again. Have you see a 30 page day 1 for a mini game, ever?

Rathyr:Other players will see to the fact you wanted a lynch of me without reason, I want reasons OF YOUR OWN.

I have stated my reasons, again and again.

Like the one below?

1. I agree with the reasons outlined by the ther players.

Wow, I had no idea.

2. I don't like the way you defemd against my attacks; you tend to misinterpret what I say and occasionally blow off my questions.

So far, I have answered every point you brought against me which is extremely few other than "I agree" so you saying that is a misrepresentation.

In fact, I have specifically said in this thread if you want me to answer anything, post it and I will.

3. I don't like the way you acted in day one when you saw that I was slipping from your grip, even after many of the players had designated me as the "back up lynchee".

1) Who called you a "back up lynchee"? If it's true, that comes off extremely scummy to me. I would like a post number please.

2) So you wouldn't be pissed if scum was slipping from your grip? That's nice to know.

4. I don't like the fact that you persist in voting me when there are many better and scummier targets that you blatently ignore.

Rathyr, STOP CALLING YOURSELF PROTOWN. It comes off as arrogant and it's fucking annoying. You are the scummiest target. I am not moving my vote until I think otherwise or when you become impossible and someone else I find relatively scummy could be lynched.

Plus, not everyone voting you has to make up individual reasons to vote. That only weakens the argument against you.

More reasons = weaker arguments? What?

Then I guess you won't know if you don't know the definition of fishing. My job is not to explain game terms to you.

If you will not explain your defences to me, I consider those defences invalid and destroyed.

No shit it's not a defense, me saying you are fishing is completely unrelated to any point against me.

That should say "taken by the town"

Why is it funny to you that I seem pro-town to other players in this game?

That is not a real defence.

No shit it's not a defense, calling yourself protown isn't an attack on me so I can't really defend against it, can I?

[ShadowLurker]

If the only thing stopping one of you from hammering is a claim, go ahead. I WILL NOT claim.

[ShadowLurker]

I was asking why you didn't pursue it. While that isn't what I want, it bothers me what you said. You're only going to explain something if you're voted?

I said "come out and say it, vote me or whatever". Not only was the voting bit part of a throwaway line, but I said I'd defend it if you'd come out with it as an accusation anyway, vote or no.

STOP MISREPRESENTING ME.

Asking a question isn't mispresentation, it's to actually clear potential misinterpretations up. You need to learn the definition.

Yes but you also said "as soon as I voted Smashy" which is implying to the town that I was defending Smashy there. Rather, I was saying you had been vote hopping too much.

How are we to know you weren't defending a scum partner? Of course

you're

not going to admit to it.

Why do you even bother bringing up that point up? If you're going to use it like that, it's not an attack. Bussing scum is a possible option, defending scum is a possible option, if you are always going to use the one that's favorable, don't bring it up at all.

You said a scum lynch will go slower than a townie lynch. Then by your own logic, you should be voting Rathyr who had the slowest bandwagon. In addition, every bandwagon in this game has been slow once again. Have you see a 30 page day 1 for a mini game, ever?

AGAIN, you are pretending like the argument I gave is the only factor in a lynch's speed. It's not, I never claimed it to be, so yet again

STOP MISREPRESENTING ME.

I mean, perhaps the statement should be "lynches on scum tend to go slower than lynches on townies", if you want to play semantic games with my quotes. But even if you do want to go down that path, you still have to deal with the fact that I said the two must have done an equal amount of suspicious things. So the text you quoted from me already makes it clear their actions are also important.

You are really terrible at this arguing thing, you know that?

We have one lynch so far, you CANNOT BASE ANYTHING ON ANYTHING YET.

It almost makes me think you're town, given all this crazy fervor you put into all your misrepresentations. It's a shame it appears you haven't finished any games yet, because I want to see if you act this ridiculous as town and/or as scum.

If you look harder, I have one finished one.

OMG YOU WERE MISREPRESENTING ME WTF CAUSE I DO HAVE A FINISHED GAME.

[ShadowLurker]

Rathyr:Other players will see to the fact you wanted a lynch of me without reason, I want reasons OF YOUR OWN.

I have stated my reasons, again and again.

Like the one below?

1. I agree with the reasons outlined by the ther players.

Wow, I had no idea.

2. I don't like the way you defemd against my attacks; you tend to misinterpret what I say and occasionally blow off my questions.

So far, I have answered every point you brought against me which is extremely few other than "I agree" so you saying that is a misrepresentation.

You did not answered as to why you are reluctant to claim, other than saying it is "fishing", a term you refuse to explain.

My job isn't to teach you game terms, kthx.

I

n fact, I have specifically said in this thread if you want me to answer anything, post it and I will.

Congrats on not responding to this.

3. I don't like the way you acted in day one when you saw that I was slipping from your grip, even after many of the players had designated me as the "back up lynchee".

1) Who called you a "back up lynchee"? If it's true, that comes off extremely scummy to me. I would like a post number please.

Post number? How about pages 4-about 25?

Wow, you sure learned a lot in school. I said a post number, in fact, you saying that maybe me think that it was never said, I highly doubt people referred to you as a backup lynchee so until you provide an actual post number, I think you are pulling quotes out of your ass.

I also dislike the fact that you can't even use quote tags properly.

Most players planned to lynch me throughout those pages, however, things changed, and your planned victim was taken from you.

Stop pretending to be stupid.

I'm sorry for pretending to be stupid by asking for a post number.

4. I don't like the fact that you persist in voting me when there are many better and scummier targets that you blatently ignore.

Rathyr, STOP CALLING YOURSELF PROTOWN.

Then stop calling yourself pro-town.

It comes off as arrogant

Every single player in this game is trying to not be taken for scum, so shut up!

Yeah but other players don't do it by calling themselves protown now do they? So before you start throwing around words like "shut up" maybe you need to reread your own gameplay because when you are asking other players for tips for acting protown, you really are one to be talking. And by the way, please learn how to use quote tags, I'm tired of having to fix yours.

and it's fucking annoying. You are the scummiest target. I am not moving my vote until I think otherwise or when you become impossible and someone else I find relatively scummy could be lynched.

Plus, not everyone voting you has to make up individual reasons to vote. That only weakens the argument against you.

More reasons = weaker arguments? What?

No, you MISINTERPRETED ME AGAIN.

Telling everyone who votes you that they must all have separate arguements is bull shit.

I never said they did, I just want them to state which reasons they thought were the most scummiest or whatever and not just "I agree" that's just a fucking lazy way to hop on a bandwagon.

Then I guess you won't know if you don't know the definition of fishing. My job is not to explain game terms to you.

If you will not explain your defences to me, I consider those defences invalid and destroyed.

No shit it's not a defense, me saying you are fishing is completely unrelated to any point against me.

It is related to me wondering why you are reluctant to claim. Stop lying.

That's not a point against me. May I suggest a dictionary?

That should say "taken by the town"

Why is it funny to you that I seem pro-town to other players in this game?

That is not a real defence.

Once again, where the hell did I say it was a defense? I just find it funny you keep calling yourself protown.

No shit it's not a defense, calling yourself protown isn't an attack on me so I can't really defend against it, can I?

My point is, you are seemingly the only player who thinks I am worthy of being voted.

That's nice. NOW LEARN TO FUCKING USE QUOTE TAGS.

[ShadowLurker]

They are.

Shadow Lurker, provide a claim, or I will count that as another thing against you.

Good.

Count it.

[ShadowLurker]

Forgot to address this one:

I also dislike the fact you were trolling on purpose.

Anything to catch scums lying, brother.

Yes but I only Ctrl+Fed to get the votes/FoSes on Yosarin which is what you were referring to.

*Sigh* I'm tired of explaining this.

Could I really get a good review on what went on Day 1 with Ctrl + F?
Could I really remember who voted who by skimming the game?

The answer to both of the above is no. I Ctrl+Fed to find out who voted Yos and I skimmed the game to get a review of what happened.

Exactly, you both skimmed the game and Ctrl+F'd.

So when you say "I didn't reread the game, I just Ctrl+F'd", that is a minor lie.

"Yes but I only Ctrl+Fed to get the votes/FoSes on Yosarin which is what you were referring to."

[ShadowLurker]

Also in case I didn't already mention, if ShadowLurker is town I will be quite suspicious of a Falcone/Spectrumvoid pairing.It was really cute the way he said "if ShadowLurker is scum, I think Spectrumvoid is too"... because that means if ShadowLurker is town his scumpartner looks better.

SETTING UP LYNCH CANINDATES FOR TOMMOROW

[ShadowLurker]

Oh well. If we lynch SL and she's scummy, I bet the whole world will think I'm scummy too because of the way we were on the same wavelength yesterday. So TV thinks I'm scummy regardless of whether SL turns out to be scum or town.

(still rushing out a proj, haven't read through the rest.)

Town tell. Doesn't know whether I'm scum or town.

[ShadowLurker]

Would you please provide some tips for better gameplay then?

Thanks.

LOL.

[ShadowLurker]

I'm back now after finishing my darn project. I went back to do a reread.

I disagree with STD's Rathyr is scum partners with SL theory, because I think SL is in quite a lot of danger now because he's at lynch -2.

Let's look at CTD's reasons for thinking SL is scum.

1) for giving help to smashy. Hm... Well, I know a lot of players who give advice to others, and who were pro-town. But I agree it is suspicious in this case since SL only interacted with smashy.

2) Lying about thinking I'm town. Nothing to add here. But I think this is reaching a little, I read that more as SL being confused, rather than as a scum-tell.

3-4 are related. For not voting smashy, for accusing CTD, and for being the last to jump on the wagon. I kinda sympathise with him here. I also thought that Rathyr was the lynch day 1, and I really didn't concentrate on Smashy yesterday. (I realised that I made a mistake being too focused on Rathyr and STD, so I'm trying to change that.) I think what he said about CTD was valid.

Right now, the most important reason for SL's scumminess for me is he jumping on the Smashy wagon at the last minute. I know he explained himself, but I'd like to hear more about it.

For now,

FOS: SL

I'll decide later after I've reread TV's accusations on SL. Anyone else?

1) Everybody has yet to point out a place where I "helped" Smashy.

2) I wasn't lying, but this post is extremely odd in contrast to what I normally expect out of you.

You were late on the Smashy wagon too. I've explained myself, these points were all here at the beginning of the day, why didn't you FoS me then? You were even later than me on Smashy btw.

[ShadowLurker]

I don't see the point in you not claiming. First if you are a protown role and just get hammered we will not be able to gain any potential info from people's reactions to your claim. Also if you are a protown power role if you claim and get killed tonight you will have prevented other protown players from being killed. Plus there is always the possibility of a backup type role like a backup doc.

However, it would make sense for you to be SK or mafia and just refuse to claim and hope for the town to give up, which is what I'm seeing you to be right now.

Everyone calm down. Breathe in, breathe out. Breathe in, breathe out. Seriously. Do that before you post.

Rathyr, please do not talk to Shadowlurker, and visa versa, for a least a while. Right now you guys are giving out hollow arguements that aren't passing information.

Shadowlurker, I'm not convinced you're pro-town, but I don't think I'm ready to vote you (especially since that's a hammah). If you are pro-town, please stop to think about your decision. If you are not claiming because of game related reasons, then that's understandable. But if you are not claiming because you are pissed off, you're letting your emotions get in the way, and this game is going to suffer.

If you're scum, then die die die.

I will collectively answer these posts.

If you notice, you will see a lack of me over the past few pages. I was debating what to do.

After careful consideration and carefully examining each case against me. I have decided that the outcomes of me claiming and me not claiming are

equivalent

but that I may get more joy out of not claiming so I decided that course of action.

Sorry other town members if this seems selfish to you and that I may change the flow of the game in this decision but I honestly have decided these what will happen will happen regardless of me claiming or not.

[ShadowLurker]

I pretty much claimed if you look in my last post.

Maybe it was death miller?



When (not if) I am lynched, many of you will want to reread the game. I urge and emphasize reading the past occurences over these past few pages.

[ShadowLurker]

Here's why I'm considering placing down the hammer...besides the "sorry, town, but I'm not going to help"

Welcome to STD's world of circumstancial evidence. Not a conviction in a court of law, but when you put them all together, things aren't looking so good...

And Smashy, how about something a bit more constructive, you've read everything today and only had those few words? No one is even deserving of of your vote yet? Right now, to really pressure anybody not on Rathyr, we're going to need some help from everybody not voting Rathyr.

This could be percieved as you telling your scumbuddy to be constructive and to vote Rathyr.

But Smashy, if you believe it is too much, then just simply skip the quotes, you should be able to get the gist of the quote looking at who the person is attacking, remembering their past behavior, and looking at the person's response. Also, PBPA's tend to find the most information in my opinion. You can still be concise while doing a PBPA.

Helping Smashy get through the pages.

Smashy has shown consistency with hsi amount of posts in my opinion and doesn't only stop in when he's under fire.

Defence of Smashy.

Mod: Prod on Smashy please?

Smashy can't survive if he doesn't defend himself.

48 hours? What the hell, if you want a claim, put him at -1 now.

Then you start bussing...

Ok, this stall crap is pissing me off. I guess I have to take things into my own hands.

Vote: Smashy

NOW CLAIM AND POST SOMETHING RELEVANT.

Kthxbai.

And your tone with Smashy changes from, "and Smashy,..." "But Smashy,..." to "CLAIM AND POST DAMNIT."

But this was 2 days after you said, "apply some pressure, town." You were ready to bus, but hesitated until it didn't seem like Smashy could defend himself anymore.

I'm disappointed in you STD. At the beginning of the post, I thought you were going to hammer at the end. So I was reading through your reasons getting all happy and such and then I scroll to the end and see no bold. WHAT THE HELL? I look to the top and see that you were

considering

. Thanks a lot, STD.

[ShadowLurker]

Lots of angry posts by SL.

You know, I could answer all this stuff, but unless you really want me to, I won't bother.

To me you look exactly like a floundering scum, especially with your claim refusal. I mean, even I claimed.

Was this supposed to be directed at somebody?

[ShadowLurker]

Here's why I'm considering placing down the hammer...besides the "sorry, town, but I'm not going to help"

Welcome to STD's world of circumstancial evidence. Not a conviction in a court of law, but when you put them all together, things aren't looking so good...

And Smashy, how about something a bit more constructive, you've read everything today and only had those few words? No one is even deserving of of your vote yet? Right now, to really pressure anybody not on Rathyr, we're going to need some help from everybody not voting Rathyr.

This could be percieved as you telling your scumbuddy to be constructive and to vote Rathyr.

Misinterpretation, read through the post again. It is saying, if you want to see a reaction out of somebody other than Rathyr, you will have to vote them because a lot of players are on Rathyr now. So it's actually telling him the opposite. And I already explained this in a previous reply to CTD.

But Smashy, if you believe it is too much, then just simply skip the quotes, you should be able to get the gist of the quote looking at who the person is attacking, remembering their past behavior, and looking at the person's response. Also, PBPA's tend to find the most information in my opinion. You can still be concise while doing a PBPA.

Helping Smashy get through the pages.

What? This was a general game sorta thing, and it was directed at Smashy not wanting to skim and irrelevant to this game, in fact, I believe I said the same thing to somebody else who was complaining about the long posts earlier in the game.

Smashy has shown consistency with hsi amount of posts in my opinion and doesn't only stop in when he's under fire.

Defence of Smashy.

Attacking the attacks of him "lurking" because he wasn't lurking, he's like that in all his games.

Mod: Prod on Smashy please?

Smashy can't survive if he doesn't defend himself.

NOW this is where you're stretching it. If the game is stalling waiting on somebody to respond, how is a prod helping him. Also, other players wanted Smashy prodded. I've asked to prod other players. Asking for a prod on somebody should not affect your opinion on somebody at all. In fact, in fairytale mafia, a newbie game, day 2 town LYLO. One scum put the 2nd vote on an innocent and asked mod for a prod on somebody. The scum's scumbuddy was inactive, but it wasn't the person he was asking for a prod on.

48 hours? What the hell, if you want a claim, put him at -1 now.

Then you start bussing...

Nope not attacking or defending, questioning why the hell town is unvoting when asking for claims.

Ok, this stall crap is pissing me off. I guess I have to take things into my own hands.

Vote: Smashy

NOW CLAIM AND POST SOMETHING RELEVANT.

Kthxbai.

And your tone with Smashy changes from, "and Smashy,..." "But Smashy,..." to "CLAIM AND POST DAMNIT."

Town forced me to with their whining of Smashy's inactivity and refusal to put pressure on him.

But this was 2 days after you said, "apply some pressure, town." You were ready to bus, but hesitated until it didn't seem like Smashy could defend himself anymore.

You just summarized why I hesitated up. I was waiting for town to put pressure on him for me to judge his response and see if he would move up on my scumdar. When town refused, I got pissed and went to see his reaction myself.

[ShadowLurker]

@STD: Good point.

I agree wholeheartedly, except for the whole not hammering thing.

[ShadowLurker]

Simulpost.

I pretty much claimed if you look in my last post.

Maybe it was death miller?

Vanilla townie? I don't know. This isn't

The Davici Code

.

When (not if) I am lynched, many of you will want to reread the game. I urge and emphasize reading the past occurences over these past few pages.

Oh dear. Resignation.


Actually, vengeful resignation, if I'm not much mistaken.

All those posts is a nice sign of resignation

[ShadowLurker]

Yeah. sually when you quote someone, whatever you have to say is directed at them.

Then you're bad at reading people's intentions when they post something.

Here, lemme clear it up for you, the message was "RATHYRSCUM, I DONT GIVE A DAMN ABOUT WHAT YOU SAY." and it was leaving lots of posts for town to analyze after I'm lynched.

[ShadowLurker]

Here's why I'm considering placing down the hammer...besides the "sorry, town, but I'm not going to help"

Welcome to STD's world of circumstancial evidence. Not a conviction in a court of law, but when you put them all together, things aren't looking so good...

And Smashy, how about something a bit more constructive, you've read everything today and only had those few words? No one is even deserving of of your vote yet? Right now, to really pressure anybody not on Rathyr, we're going to need some help from everybody not voting Rathyr.

This could be percieved as you telling your scumbuddy to be constructive and to vote Rathyr.

Misinterpretation, read through the post again. It is saying, if you want to see a reaction out of somebody other than Rathyr, you will have to vote them because a lot of players are on Rathyr now. So it's actually telling him the opposite. And I already explained this in a previous reply to CTD.

But Smashy, if you believe it is too much, then just simply skip the quotes, you should be able to get the gist of the quote looking at who the person is attacking, remembering their past behavior, and looking at the person's response. Also, PBPA's tend to find the most information in my opinion. You can still be concise while doing a PBPA.

Helping Smashy get through the pages.

What? This was a general game sorta thing, and it was directed at Smashy not wanting to skim and irrelevant to this game, in fact, I believe I said the same thing to somebody else who was complaining about the long posts earlier in the game.

Smashy has shown consistency with hsi amount of posts in my opinion and doesn't only stop in when he's under fire.

Defence of Smashy.

Attacking the attacks of him "lurking" because he wasn't lurking, he's like that in all his games.

Mod: Prod on Smashy please?

Smashy can't survive if he doesn't defend himself.

NOW this is where you're stretching it. If the game is stalling waiting on somebody to respond, how is a prod helping him. Also, other players wanted Smashy prodded. I've asked to prod other players. Asking for a prod on somebody should not affect your opinion on somebody at all. In fact, in fairytale mafia, a newbie game, day 2 town LYLO. One scum put the 2nd vote on an innocent and asked mod for a prod on somebody. The scum's scumbuddy was inactive, but it wasn't the person he was asking for a prod on.

48 hours? What the hell, if you want a claim, put him at -1 now.

Then you start bussing...

Nope not attacking or defending, questioning why the hell town is unvoting when asking for claims.

Ok, this stall crap is pissing me off. I guess I have to take things into my own hands.

Vote: Smashy

NOW CLAIM AND POST SOMETHING RELEVANT.

Kthxbai.

And your tone with Smashy changes from, "and Smashy,..." "But Smashy,..." to "CLAIM AND POST DAMNIT."

Town forced me to with their whining of Smashy's inactivity and refusal to put pressure on him.

But this was 2 days after you said, "apply some pressure, town." You were ready to bus, but hesitated until it didn't seem like Smashy could defend himself anymore.

You just summarized why I hesitated up. I was waiting for town to put pressure on him for me to judge his response and see if he would move up on my scumdar. When town refused, I got pissed and went to see his reaction myself.

@STD: Good point.

I agree wholeheartedly, except for the whole not hammering thing.

SL, what's with you?

Either you want to die or you don't. This is what makes me suspicious of your "Oh I'm ready to die, oh well" schtic.

Yeah. sually when you quote someone, whatever you have to say is directed at them.

Then you're bad at reading people's intentions when they post something.

Here, lemme clear it up for you, the message was "RATHYRSCUM, I DONT GIVE A DAMN ABOUT WHAT YOU SAY." and it was leaving lots of posts for town to analyze after I'm lynched.

Yeah. I was aware of that. Why do you think I didn't reply to your individual points?

Simulpost.

I pretty much claimed if you look in my last post.

Maybe it was death miller?

Vanilla townie? I don't know. This isn't

The Davici Code

.

When (not if) I am lynched, many of you will want to reread the game. I urge and emphasize reading the past occurences over these past few pages.

Oh dear. Resignation.


Actually, vengeful resignation, if I'm not much mistaken.

All those posts is a nice sign of resignation

Is that sarcasm? If you, how do you explain the "Damn, I'm not hamahed yet" additude?

May I direct you to http://en.wikipedia.com/wiki/Joke ? Up to you to figure which one's a joke. Or if I'm schizophranic. Or if I'm just so pissed off that I'm messing with your heads purposefully. Or if I've gone crazy.

Probably the latter. No wait former. Ah screw it.

[ShadowLurker]

If you really want a clarification...

The coherent posts are for the town to analyze once I'm lynched.

The incoherent posts are to screw with you Rathyr and your scumbuddies because you are scum.

[ShadowLurker]

OK. Which one's a joke?

Do your best to answer me without sarcasm this time.


IMO, this is just a scummy way to brush me off.

If you really want a clarification...

The coherent posts are for the town to analyze once I'm lynched.

The incoherent posts are to screw with you Rathyr and your scumbuddies because you are scum.

I don't think I'll post here 'till tomarrow, by whcich time you will hopefully have been lynched. I don't think anyone could deny your scumminess at this time.

I was extremely liking the way you were still trying to coherently answer my obvious points solely for the point of causing annoyance.

That might've made me start answering your posts nicely.

But then I saw that you chose to be ignorant and was like "WTF WAS I THINKING?"

[ShadowLurker]

What, you're annoyed that I'm ignoring you after

this?

RATHYRSCUM, I DONT GIVE A DAMN ABOUT WHAT YOU SAY.

I thought you weren't posting here until tommorow?

[ShadowLurker]

Plus your apparent insanity amuses me.

Too bad you didn't have two votes.

[ShadowLurker]

Unvote

I hope that wasn't foreshadowing anything..


































So then in like 7 hours, Turbovolver will come and be like SL YOU ARE SO FAKE and then confirm vote, and then someone will finally drop the hammer, and it'll be revealed the SL is unlynchable or whatever he is.

[ShadowLurker]

>< I may have to hammer to get you guys to stop posting.

At least someone else understands jokes.

The thing is, SL, if you are telling the truth, then I think I know exactly what your role is, and possibly more.

Oooh speculation! Please write down what you are thinking right now and post it after the game is over. I'm extremely interested now.

But for all I know, you could be doing a last ditch effort to save yourself.

Part of the game of mafia Not going to play the newb card however

To save people's bleeding eyeballs (quoting the whole post and then saying "what's up with that" is not helpful)

I was basically trying to answer your question about the connection between you and smashy.

1. Town didn't force you to do anything.
2. Why were you waiting for town to put pressure on smashy so you could decide? Why couldn't you put pressure on smashy when you said "put him at -1" if that's what you wanted all along? That doesn't make sense to me.

Still, I'll wait to vote.

1. Sorry about trying to help hasten the day up. I've said this probably about 10 times already. I LITERALLY actually saw somebody unvote in the same post and ask for a claim and tons of people were unvoting yet whining about lack of pressure. I was wondering why the hell they were being so contradictory and I knew that all of them couldn't be scum, so I put him at -1 to hopefully force a claim.
2. He wasn't the highest on my scum list. I was waiting for the other people's actions so I could judge on them as well. As I certaintly wasn't the most vocal player in attacking Smashy, I believe that should've fallen on others.


If you guys have notice, the tone of what you ask me usually gets replied to in a similar tone.

[ShadowLurker]

Rathyr, ShadowLurker, your hateful tirades are rapidly sucking all the fun out of this game. I don't know about you two, but two pages full of "You're scum!", "No, YOU'RE scum!" is pretty much the opposite of helpful. Now why don't you do what STD suggested and stop adressing each other? It would be appreciated.

I'll be back in a moment with some real stuff for ShadowLurker to defend against.

Could you address my rebuttals to your original post a lot of pages back in the process?

[ShadowLurker]

Rathyr, ShadowLurker, your hateful tirades are rapidly sucking all the fun out of this game. I don't know about you two, but two pages full of "You're scum!", "No, YOU'RE scum!" is pretty much the opposite of helpful. Now why don't you do what STD suggested and stop adressing each other? It would be appreciated.

I'll be back in a moment with some real stuff for ShadowLurker to defend against.

Hey, I'm not hateful. I'm actually having fun.


Also, I think SL is past defending anything in a logical manner.

And why aren't either of you hammahing??

Because of posts like the two I just quoted.

[ShadowLurker]

I resent that last bit!

Jesus, Ratyhr, do you ever think before you post?

QFT.

[ShadowLurker]

That, my friend, is called spam. Kindly stop. Now.


CTD: I eagerly await you post.

Point?

I should totally steal David Letterman.


Top 10 things Rathyr posts
1) SL is obviously scum!!
2) I AM PROTOWN!!
3) I'm waiting on...
4) I agree
5) STOP MISREPRESENTING ME!!!!
6) Any tips on...?
7) Stop being sarcastic
8) Be serious
9) I'm just going to ignore....
10) " "

[ShadowLurker]

Turbovolver, could you unvote and vote me again when I'm at -1?

[ShadowLurker]

Hey look! It's a post of no relevance!

What are you guys waiting for? SL to say: "I'm scum"?

"I'm scum"

Let's see if they're actually waiting for that.

[ShadowLurker]

Just because certain people in this game are dense.

That last post was a joke.

Turbo hammers.

End of story.

[ShadowLurker]

Turbo can't hammah because he is already voting you.

Wow, how did I not see that huge flaw in my plan?

[ShadowLurker]

So, if this post

Just because certain people in this game are dense.

That last post was a joke.

Turbo hammers.

End of story.

was a joke, does that mean that you were joking when you said

That last post was a joke.

and that this

"I'm scum"

is a real claim?

What are you expecting me to answer?

[ShadowLurker]

"Holy Quote Tags, Batman" Vote Count

ShadowLurker (4): Falcone, Turbovolver, Rathyr, Machiavellian-Mafia

Not Voting: CrashTextDummie, Yosarian2, Save the Dragons, spectrumvoid, ShadowLurker

With 9 alive, it takes 5 to lynch!

QFT

QFT

[ShadowLurker]

Vote STD

[ShadowLurker]

If you guys want to lynch me tommorow, please MAKE SURE Turbovolver hammers.

[ShadowLurker]

WHY???

If you don't answer me satisfactorily, I'll make sure TV

doesn't

hammah.

Unvote: SL

Vote: STD

Yos: I advise you not to tell who you got innocent on. Why? Because whoever it is will then die.


Whoever is the doc, if there is one: Please protect the Yos tonight. It might be prudent of you to claim as well, but not if you don't want to.


Yos: I hope you plan to investigate SL tonight.

Oh, and STD: Thanks for not hammahing. We might not have found you guilty if you had.


Everyone else: If we lynch STD and find him innocent, I assume we will then lynch Yos.

FISHING FOR THE DOC.

DIRECTING THE COP.

SETTING UP LYNCHES FOR TOMMOROW.

[ShadowLurker]

I call BS.

Vote: Yosarian

The thing is, SL, if you are telling the truth, then I think I know exactly what your role is, and possibly more.

SL is either townie or scum. PJ was townie. Rathyr is either townie or scum. Arafax is townie. I am townie (or scum).

This game is mountainous. I'm under the impression that there are only townies and scum. That was my prediction. This cop claim is pure crap.

Where did I claim townie or scum?

You got the impression that the game was mountainous from 3 townies?

Would Yosarin be stupid enough to trade 1:1 with the town?

The only thing I could imagine Yosarin would be doing is getting us to lynch you, then claiming insane, and then lynching his innocent, but we'll cross that bridge when it comes.

[ShadowLurker]

Yosarin, results?

[ShadowLurker]

Hmm does Yos know it's day? I saw him post in all his games earlier.

Maybe a prod just to tell him it's day?

[ShadowLurker]

ShadowLurker, would you explain your repeated statements that Turbo should have been the one to hammer you in case of your eventual lynch?

And now, that he's dead, is there another person who you'd like to appoint for that honorable job?

Yes, you.

[ShadowLurker]

SL and MM: Reasons please?

SL: Explanation please?

Reasons for what?

I'm not going to roleclaim as I said.

[ShadowLurker]

I want Falcone to hammer who the reasons I wanted Turbo to hammer.

There, now you can be done waiting.

[ShadowLurker]

EBWOP: That should say "for" not "who"

[ShadowLurker]

And speaking of hammers, how would you feel about me doing the deed? Because I'm awfully tempted.

No thanks.

[ShadowLurker]

And speaking of hammers, how would you feel about me doing the deed? Because I'm awfully tempted.

No thanks.

OK.

I

vote: SL

for not claiming but seeming to have an odd role, as well as other scummy things he has done, etc. We've gone over this before.

I am happy to lynch SL, unless, Yosarian, you have any objection?

Asking people to claim while having 0 votes on them is retarded.

[ShadowLurker]

Umm Falcone, isn't this plan basically just your way to lynch me while making it look like you followed the majority of the town's wishes? Serously, think.

[ShadowLurker]

Stop trying to rush the day and end discussion.

I also see exactly what's going to happen of CTD's plan.

Day 3 lynch SL
Someone dies in night
Day 4 lynch SV
Someone dies in night
Day 5 Town is at LYLO.

[ShadowLurker]

If we have a doctor, we pretty much have this game won.

The only thing that will be flawed with that is if we force the doctor to claim. Then the plan is ruined.

[ShadowLurker]

Vote Falcone

[ShadowLurker]

SL nice reasoning for your votes.

Thank you.


1. Falcone
1. Rathyr
1. SV
1. CTD
1. MM
7. Yos

[ShadowLurker]

That should be 6. Yos

[ShadowLurker]

I am feeling a strong urge to vote you right now.

Ok.

I don't see why you don't like my LoS.

[ShadowLurker]

SL, does your list mean that you have no preference about which of your five number one's is lynched, or are you just being uncooperative?

I have no preference.

[ShadowLurker]

Liar. I think you just like being a pain in the ass.

That's nice. I don't care what you think.

[ShadowLurker]

Confirm: Thought.

You really expected me to answer that thought seriously?