Mini 934 - Troubles at Smiths&Catharts (Game Over!)

[RayFrost]

I know everybody but copper, scrambles, and TCC.

Man I'm awesome.

Anyway, no random vote or random accusation from me. [/metabreaker]

[RayFrost]

Oh, copper is a hydra. I hadn't noticed.

Yeah, I may know the heads of copper.

[RayFrost]

I know everybody but copper, scrambles, and TCC.

Man I'm awesome.

Anyway, no random vote or random accusation from me. [/metabreaker]

unvote

Vote: RayFrost

Active nonLurking. And breaking my mind.

Explanation required.

[RayFrost]

I know everybody but copper, scrambles, and TCC.

Man I'm awesome.

Anyway, no random vote or random accusation from me. [/metabreaker]

unvote

Vote: RayFrost

Active nonLurking. And breaking my mind.

Explanation required.

Explanation of how this is active lurking / breaking your mind required as neither make sense.

[RayFrost]

What's the difference?

[RayFrost]

Not sure how much I can explain this, but:

You posted here.

That's non-lurking. I can't get any more basic than that.

Umm... and that's scummy... how?

And what did you mean by breaking your mind?

[RayFrost]

Vote: Col.Cathart

His company makes guns scum kill people with.
And Ray... it's RVS, I don't remember reasons needing to make sence.

FoS Ray

And Scrambles... it was worded like a serious vote, I don't remember serious votes not making sense.

[RayFrost]

Copper, would you be bothered if I tried to figure out who the heads of you are?

[RayFrost]

@Rayfrost - since when does 'active nonlurking' i.e. posting and 'breaking my mind' sound like serious reasons for a vote?

When I'm exhausted, mentally burnt out, and unable to think straight.

I lost three games of go in a row (IIRC) on the same day I posted that, so yeah x.x Bad brain day.

Anyway, thor supporting policy lynches of those below the age of 18 is evil.

Cuz I'm 15. :/

Also, thor, personal attacks as a method of argument is ad hom, not OMGUS.

Anyway, I am not of the mind to believe that scrambles is scum, yet.

His vote was bad, but it doesn't seem all that scummy to me.

[RayFrost]

Cuz I'm 15. :/

This explains

so much.

Such as how I'm

so much

smarter than you, I know. Child geniuses are more common these days than in your time.

[RayFrost]

Mod: Do typos count as mistakes?

[RayFrost]

Then it's him using reasoning that doesn't promote scumhunting or actually find the person scummy but, rather, for non-role/alignment related issues that shouldn't impact scumhunting.

[RayFrost]

More accurate interpretation of what I said...

'Scrambles used reasoning that is unrelated to actual scumhunting and is using it to support a lynch rather than using actual reasoning to show that ythan is scum (note that annoying != scum), which makes his vote piggy backing with popular opinions while not giving any solid support - throwing shit into the fire, so to speak'

but yeah.

[RayFrost]

I always thought ythan was about 24.

[RayFrost]

I turn 16 this year, if it makes you feel any better.

[RayFrost]

He suggested he went to an online (correct?) college, so 20 seems about right.

well, I am going to an online college, sooo... (senior year, too)

[RayFrost]

/ninjaskillz

[RayFrost]

/ninjaskillz

ninja'd by Ythan.

No, I posted that after ythan.

cuz both ythan and myself are ninjas.

hah!

[RayFrost]

I'm a nk immune miller vig.

That makes me auto-town, boo yah.

[RayFrost]

Ray's questioning of NS's vote in iso posts 2, 3, 4, and 5 strike me as out of character. Really all of Ray's posting seems out of character. And I've only played with him as town (as far as I know).

I stated earlier that I was breaking my meta for this game.

I meant it.

[RayFrost]

If I had to vote, it would be on bob the builder.

Seriously, I wouldn't be voting anybody.

If I actually HAD to vote, I'd just vote nobody special for the closest thing to a policy lynch that isn't a policy lynch.

@ copper...

reasoning is tech.

become tech soon for a grand prize!

[RayFrost]

If I had to vote, it would be on bob the builder.

Seriously, I wouldn't be voting anybody.

If I actually HAD to vote, I'd just vote nobody special for the closest thing to a policy lynch that isn't a policy lynch.

@ copper...

reasoning is tech.

become tech soon for a grand prize!

Well isn't this just beautiful.

Starts by saying that he can't even imagine himself hypothethically contributing, and then follows it up with a cryptic little insult.

What reasoning, exactly, am I missing? Is this about you saying you're playing against your meta? Are you saying that you're going against your old meta of contributing and are now trying out a new strategy of not contributing?

I'm very happy with my vote right now.

It wasn't an insult.

I was saying 'STATE YOUR DAMNED REASONING!'

Is that clearer?

Because you didn't talk about me at all in the post where you voted me...

[RayFrost]

I wish I had something to accuse ythan of.

[RayFrost]

I'm doing away with the meta, and I have to say that it is quite freeing, even if it is annoying to go against my usual and comfortable playstyle.

[RayFrost]

Yeah, I haven't been contributing.

I actually contributed about this much when I was a SK.

But I posted a lot less often.

And I have more posts in this game than I did for ~30 of the pages in the game I was SK in.

[RayFrost]

Well, the game's reached pg. 10, you guys will get content from me when I've finished my schoolwork for the day.

[RayFrost]

~responding to a prod~

content later today.

I promise.

If I don't provide it, lynch me.

[RayFrost]

Oh god, I wish I was a Jester this game.

I'd almost certainly win. x.x

Anyway, catching up now, expect content in about 1-2 hours depending on difficulties that crop up.

[RayFrost]

Calling JesteRay.

/win

Now stop interrupting my work!

A cop's gotta investigate, you know!

...

...

did I say that out loud?

[RayFrost]

By the by, I'm tempting to reallign with my most ancient meta of writing walls of text.

But I'm not going to.

Now, I have to ask, do you guys wish to see the RayFrost that makes jokes interwoven with his reads or the RayFrost that makes walls of text or the RayFrost that does neither but rarely posts because the straight-to-the-point posting gives him a headache?

[RayFrost]

This is an important question to answer because it changes how I display my reads.

[RayFrost]

Are you stalling, RayFrost? I don't get what's so hard. You've played games before, many of them.

Why can you not give a substantial post? You don't need to ask your fellow players "how" you should play.

I agree with Zorblag's critical read of CheshireCat. So far as I can tell, Cheshire is completely coasting through the game, and her vote on Zorblag is seemingly trivial.

And, if you bothered to read them, you'd realize I rarely played well in any of them or, if I did, I died

really freaking early

.

If I was truly stalling, I wouldn't be posting.

That's how I avoided content posts so far, right?

[RayFrost]

Dear god, you remind me of plum. Anyway, gimme a few minutes to type up the reads I've got and be astounded... I guess.

[RayFrost]

town reads woohoo, oh yeah, boo yah, they are...

copper, pome, ythan, thor, zorblag, and inquisitor jl.

the scum reads are NS, NS' sister, and NS' pets.

Neutral is scrambles.

Jester is RayFrost

did I miss anybody?

[RayFrost]

Zorby - it's weak meta, gut feelings, and not much of logic. why use logic as anything but a prop, anyway?

I think the thor v ythan thing is more town v town than scum, as I have to agree with ythan's defense.

NS throwing a hissy fit was scummy to me, and the subsequent replacing out made it worse.

[RayFrost]

vote: nobodyspecial

[RayFrost]

Yawn. No disclaimer language, I'm not going to trudge through Ray's meta myself on a minor vote, I didn't distance from the vote, I changed the vote because of the post I replied to, blah blah.

This

[RayFrost]

They were jokes.

Or so I say.

Their real purpose will be revealed when I am feeling like saying.

[RayFrost]

I want to vote ythan, but I need to check the votecount before I do.

unvote

for now.

[RayFrost]

yeah

speak

for

yourself

considering

that

I am

only taking the most recent worthless posts out of your 128 posts

[RayFrost]

Yawn. Reasoning is tech.

Okay, lemme break it down for you.

Your posting consists, for the majority, of worthless fluff post that provide no content and do nothing to contribute to valuable discussion. In posting such high degrees of spam, you are capable of active lurking without seeming like it because you are deluging people with posts to the extent that reading your iso is more of a chore than reading the entire thread - your posts, despite the lack of content.

[RayFrost]

WORTHLESS POSTING THAT DOES NOT REPLY TO THE CASE AND DOES NOT CONTRIBUTE TO ANYTHING WHATSOEVER

[RayFrost]

Pot kettle etc.

Yawn. Reasoning is tech.

Okay, lemme break it down for you.

Your posting consists, for the majority, of worthless fluff post that provide no content and do nothing to contribute to valuable discussion. In posting such high degrees of spam, you are capable of active lurking without seeming like it because you are deluging people with posts to the extent that reading your iso is more of a chore than reading the entire thread - your posts, despite the lack of content.

[RayFrost]

Vote: Ythan

'ey, zorb, what do you think of the assorted ythan cases?

[RayFrost]

I respond to pretty much anything. This habit produces spam when the material to which I'm responding is itself meaningless. You know that, so if you want a policy lynch just call it that and set yourself up for the noose tomorrow.

So, lemme break down your post...

You think that 98% of the posts in this thread are meaningless and crap?

And you aren't doing anything to actually help in scumhunting in order to decrease the quantity of crap posting?

And this seems like a good idea to you... how?

And why are you taking a reactionary rather than actionary stance?

[RayFrost]

I was.

But that still doesn't explain why you refuse to respond to any of the cases against you.

[RayFrost]

But that still doesn't explain why you refuse to respond to almost any of the cases against you.

I thought you agreed with his response to my case on him. Has this changed?

Ah, I had forgotten about that case entirely.

Yeah, lemme fix the quote.

[RayFrost]

I'd say that my top suspect is RayFrost, who wins in a landslide victory. Recently he started harking on Ythan for Fluffy posting. I mean, seriously, him being the one talking? The hypocrisy is killing me. And that's all he doing- like linking to useless posts of Ythan.

Like, the case feels really half-hearted. The type of way ScumRF makes cases.

Confirm Vote: RF

.

WROOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOONG!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

My cases as scum are nonexistent or heavily 'tunnel visioned.'

They aren't half-hearted; none of my cases are half-hearted. As scum, I'll say there is a case I have and then just not provide it, or I will say there is a case and then go BOOM and keep using it as reason to attack one person the entire time they are alive.

Unless, ofc, you are counting my 'person T is scum, that is all' type posts as half-hearted cases, in which case you are looking at my town

and

scum meta on that.

The fact you are misrepresenting my meta so egregiously is scummy, just a fyi.

If you are going to so heavily rely on meta, you should first actually back it up with links and such.

Now, I think it is about time I go on the offensive, so let's rumble.

Your reasoning for finding me scummy is mostly 'omfg, meta, meta, omfg, matching scum meta!' and 'not posting!!! scum!!!' I'm actually posting now, so the second point is null, so let us look at the first point.

It's weak, as your meta on me is like... two games? One of which I was

attempting

to get myself lynched (*ahemflashmafiaahem*)? The other I was intending to lynch you to get into lylo and then get bussed and have my partner win 3p? So you are basing your meta off of the times where

I have deliberately been scummy in order to make it easy for my partner(s) to bus me in order to get town cred

? Really? Not only is your meta

heavily

incomplete (see the lack of town meta and the limited number of scum metas), but the meta you

do

have doesn't even apply to this game.

So your reasoning to find me scummy based off of meta is flimsy and weak, just like the 'omfg, scum for not posting' argument.

So, overall, you are really just trying to match the more outspoken players in that they think I'm scum (copper, scotty, etc) without actually contributing much in the way of substance to the attacks on me.

Stop riding their coattails and provide some substantive attacks already.

[RayFrost]

By the by, post 495 is my version of a half-hearted case.

[RayFrost]

You spent that whole post criticizing Pom for riding the coattails of the players attack you for better reasons.

Yup.

Got a problem with that other than the fact it lacks the defending myself from the reasoning given by the other players?

[RayFrost]

Ray

– Why are you choosing to break meta in this game?

Because I need to. Trust me, I have the town's best interests at heart.

By the by, if you find yourself agreeing with locke on the majority of his points and one of his points is that he thinks I'm town for [insert stuff here], would your vote state that it is one of the (few) points of his that you disagree with?

And I didn't come online at all yesterday, Japan time, which would explain the absence.

[RayFrost]

Unvote, Vote: TCC

my annoyance that D1 has still provided no more information than speculation of posts. I think we need a flip.

Your points are valid, but this is alerting my scumdar.

I feel that having this in your post is pointless and isn't even true.

It's a misrepresentation of the scumhunting that has happened through the game as well as the information that can be gathered.

In addition, if everybody votes TCC because 'we need a flip,' then there will be little information gotten from the flip, which makes getting a flip not very useful. In addition, how would a flip be helpful if there is little information on D1? Why aren't you attempting to spring more information in D1 rather than turning this to night?

This part of your post gives it a more opportunistic and piggy backish feel than I'd get otherwise.

FoS: kthx

[RayFrost]

THE CHESHIRE CAT IS AT L-1

This information brought to you by the committee of 'no excuses for "accidental" hammers.'

<3 thank you for joining the

cult

committee.

[RayFrost]

A 542 post day one is a tad bit ridiculous and isn't helping us. We can go round and round all day long about how this is scummy and that is scummy, but without flips, there are no actual facts so far. Good speculation and scumhunting, absolutely....but zero facts, period.

You are making a clear contradiction with what you have already said!

Unvote, Vote: TCC

my annoyance that D1 has still provided no more information than speculation of posts. I think we need a flip.

This clearly says 'no information other than speculation,' yet you are now saying that there has been good scumhunting!

In addition, your statement clearly posits that

good scumhunting

is not useful, which is an outright lie and shows that you are, in fact, just going with the tide!

Vote: Kthxbye

[RayFrost]

please explain the difference between speculation and good scumhunting. just because its good scumhunting and logical questions and accusations (which is how I define scum hunting) doesn't make them any more factual. Hell, I even put "Good

SPECULATION

and scumhunting, absolutely....but zero facts, period." There is no contradiction.

the only info we are getting till a flip is speculation; whether it come from logical good scumhunting or Ythan posts. There are still no facts in this game.

Issue was the change in wording from this post:

Unvote, Vote: TCC

This is mainly due to p533 and my annoyance that

D1 has still provided no more information than speculation of posts

. I think we need a flip.

This doesn't include scumhunting because

scumhunting is the active searching for scum using evidence

whereas

speculation is searching for scum without the use of evidence

. Also note that

good scumhunting

leads to

scum lynches

, making your 'facts' worth less, as they only

come as a result of the scumhunting and speculation

. Your argument (at least, how I read it) stated that the speculation [and scumhunting] (using brackets to include what you added in your second post) of the entire day was pointless (as in

the stuff that makes us decide on who to lynch

was pointless, as in

the stuff that leads to the gathering of your hallowed 'facts'

was pointless)

Also, what 'facts' will there be in this game after a flip? The alignment of that single player? How is this 'fact' so utterly and overwhelmingly useful that we should just lynch somebody to get a flip?

Why are you focusing so much on

facts

?

You will not get

facts

that

prove

that somebody alive is scum from a flip (barring circumstances such as a watcher / cop result, etc, etc, etc).

[RayFrost]

Insomuch as the case against Kthx has been made by RayFrost, I tend to see more there than not. Still, as much of a broken record as I sound, I can't honestly say I'm ready to abandon RayFrost, or possibly Locke, as our lynch today. I think with Ythan and RayFrost's unfortunate and awkward game discussion outside of the thread, the town owes it to itself to see at least one of these players in the noose.

Wait, what?

How does that make us the lynch choice?

Seriously, a discussion like that isn't exactly lynch-worthy.

The mods have dealt with it.

Why are you trying so hard to get a lynch on me/locke? Why are you using a non-game-related reason?

Also, you see my kthx case, but you still want to lynch me for a non-game-related reason.

How does this make sense?

[RayFrost]

~prod response~

~no content~

~people on my wagon pointing this out as super scummy~

~scum agreeing without really doing anything~

~nobody noticing~

[RayFrost]

Anyway, of the two attacking copper, charter is town, pome is scum, and copper is town.

@ Thunder Man - actually, my case isn't as good as my original idea of 'SLICE OPEN THE POMEGRANATE,' so I'll return to that.

unvote, FoS: Pome

don't want to vote cuz of the whole kthx quickhammer threat thingamajig.

[RayFrost]

Ray if Pom is scum why FOS?

Because I like the idea of doing this weird thing called looking for a partner. I know, I know, it's really strange, but I like doing it.

Scotty, why the lack of proper grammar / sudden cessation of finding me scummy?

[RayFrost]

Scotty, why the lack of proper grammar / sudden cessation of finding me scummy?

You can blame the grammar on my dyslexia, but this is pretty funny seeing as you couldn't even get my SN right.

I never said I didn't find you scummy. Your still on my list, Pom is just doing a great job of overshadowing you.

Also, how exactly are you looking for Pom's supposed partner(s)?

Well then, the joke is even funnier. Besides, you are and always will be known as scotty to me.

Do you have any new evidence against me, or is all of your evidence old news?

I'm reading people's pressure on Pome for whether or not they are doin' it for real or something else.

[RayFrost]

posting to let you guys know that I'm going to post soon, also posting to avoid being prodded in the meantime.

[RayFrost]

Oh, hi guys.

I was on V/LA because I was quite verily sick.

I still am, but I obviously can't deny you all my glowing personality even if I'm prone to coughing fits in the middle of a post.

[RayFrost]

Hmmm... I had never thought of replacing out.

Brilliant idea.

I'm way, way too sick to concentrate hard enough to do well, so I'd only be detrimental.

Mod: replace me