Mini 727 - Mafia in Standardville - Game Over

[BSG]

Vote alvinz95

Capital letters are much better than numbers

[BSG]

Unvote Vote Artem

From the looks of it, your RVS vote was the only with a serious side attached to it. The only other player who could have a serious reason attached to it, would have been Xdaamno, but I'm not sure about that yet. So I don't see why you would unvote and not vote another player.
You also accused Artifex for going after an easy target as she voted Xdaamno, who had put me at L-4. However, you FoSed the player who put me at L-2. Aren't you doing the same as of which you accused Artifex?
And I don't see the WIFOM. I can see two reasons why Charter put me at L-2. But I'll let Charter respond to this first.
Just like Dfan, I'm wondering why you didn't vote.

[BSG]

Because if I voted, I would be doing exactly what I voted Artifex for, making me a hypocrite.

Am I the only one who doesn't like this? When I read this, it gives me the impression that he wanted to vote Charter, but didn't do so as it would make him a hypocrite. Isn't he admitting here that he finds Charter scummy, while saying that what Charter did isn't scummy just a few posts ago?

[BSG]

Blame the penguin

[BSG]

You're not pouncing an easy target? But you wanted to as post 39 gives that impression. You only FoSed him, because you didn't want to come across as a hypocrite, as said in post 39. If you FoSed Charter for the WIFOM, then why no vote as it wouldn't make you a hypocrite. You're now making up excuses why you aren't voting Charter.

And no, Charter's vote wasn't WIFOM. You made it WIFOM in your own mind. I can see two reasons why Charter would put me at L-2. And none of those reasons includes WIFOM. I'm waiting for him to tell his reason. From that I'll look if it was scummy or not.

Besides, why should I be afraid for the votes made against me? Most of them were random votes. If town lynch a player with many random votes, then there's something strange going on with the wagon. If I'm lynched with most of these votes, it will only give information. So I don't see why I should be bothered.

And it's interesting that you name Charter as my buddy, while all the other players are put into the category of buddy. Are you implying something?

[BSG]

Actually, make it three reasons that I can see why Charter put me at L-2.
I find it also strange that two players call Charter scummy, but don't vote him.

[BSG]

I'm typing my post right now. Just wait patiently. Thanks for the compliment though . I want to thank the penguin for that.

[BSG]

(b) If I voted for my buddy to distance myself from them, why would I unvote them when they were not in any danger, especially since I didn't vote for anybody else?

Don't like this. Isn't this WIFOM?

Mod, if possible, could you tell us why Lunar_Tick requested replacement?

I can understand it if you aren't allowed to answer this question.

Okay, I can see the WIFOM now after reading Lynx's post. It seems we're all waiting for Charter to respond to this. I would like to hear a respond from Xdaamno after Charter's response as well.
I'll post more about post 90, but Charter needs to respond before I go further into post 90.

@Artifex
I'll post my thoughts about the players eventually. I think I can place some players already, but there are many of whom we have almost nothing. And some events need some explanations before I can fully understand everybody's thoughts about them. Eventually, I'll post them here.

Also, Charter gets back the 11th so let the countdown start

[BSG]

Not yet.

[01] VOTING METHOD: Votes must be in bold. example: Vote: LlamaFluff If you do not bold your vote, it will not be counted. You must unvote before casting another vote, if you wish it to count.

Xdaamno hasn't unvoted me.
Xdaamno, did you know that your vote would be the hammer?
Why didn't you wait for a claim, if you knew? Why didn't you check the votes if you didn't know? And why are you voting Artem?
Will react to the other posts soon.

[BSG]

It's good to see Charter back. Then I can respond to some things.
Charter, this is the reason why it's WIFOM what you did:

why would I place the vote if I knew it was scummy? What scum would be so boisterous?

However, like I already told there were three reasons that I saw why you would have put me at L-2:
-To see what my reaction would be, as I'm suddenly at L-2 without any real reason.
-To see what Panzer's reaction would be, as he said that it is a little scummyish to put someone at L-2 with no reason.
-To see what all other players would do, as someone would have been put at L-2 without any reason.
I see that you did it for reasons 1 and 3.

Well, the only thing that bothered me a bit was that you had time to say that you were still here after the Bluehost accident. That's not completely without access. And we were waiting for your explanation. I don't know how many players told that they were waiting for you.

Also, in response to Panzer, I'm not a newbie. I've played some games with a different account, but due to the exams, I had to leave some games. This is a fresh start for me. My previous account was made in August 2008.

Darox' claim.
Null tell to me. It could be the truth to save our powerroles, but it can be scum trying to survive. I'm not going to use this claim to look at you Darox.

Further regarding post 90:
He, again, gives an answer that someone could use for their advantage. He tells what his reason could be for putting at L-2. But that's not what caught my interest. That's the following:
His reason for putting someone at L-2 would be to see how the wagonee would react. If that's the case, then why would he say that I have nothing to worry about? This could have been the reason for Charter as well, so why would he ruin that?

[BSG]

Regarding the claimed PGO, I have only seen that role once:
Mafia 84
This was a large normal. The claim is made at the first page. And if you look at the end of this game, you can see that the claimed player survived till the end, and was eventually a PGO. This is the only example I could find with a PGO.
Charter, you also mentioned a game with a PGO in it. Could you give a link to that game?

@Lynx

The quick hammer by Xdaamno was extremely Scummy. FOS:Xdaamno Definitely want some answers on this vote. However, I am keeping in mind the fact that Xdaamno hasn't really been involved in the game. I think carelessness could be the major cause of his vote. He hasn't seemed to pay much attention to the game. Certainly doesn't excuse a vote of such magnitude though.

Also, Unvote, Vote:Xdaamno
He hastily jumped on the Artem wagon with no analysis or evidence of his own(For the hammer vote nonetheless). He's contributed nothing to the active scumhunting and given no case for any of his votes. Just shown little activity, but is still obviously here.

The first quote can be found in post 126. The second in post 171. Can you explain why the sudden switch?

@post 127
The player has changed, but the allignment hasn't. If the first player was suspicious, then you should use those arguments against the replacement as well. So it's fair.
However, to me it's a null tell. I've seen players who asked for replacement after they got FoSes or votes against them, and some of them turned up town.

@post 140
We asked if Xdaamno knew that he was the hammerer. He's asking if anyone expected him to say yes.

Is it just me, or did nobody respond to post 142 (except Artem with his claim)?
And yeah, I also have some difficulties in believing Xdaamno that he didn't know. Especially as there was a VC count on the page where he voted. And now that he has explained his 'reason' for voting Artem, I really don't like it.

@Artem
As already explained, I voted you as you were doing the same thing you voted Artifex for. If you find that scummy, why do it yourself? And that you didn't vote Charter as it would make you a hypocrite. Those were my reasons for voting you.

I'm not going to debate how likely the mod is to include a PGO because thats just playing with mod WIFOM

This

@post 151
As already mentioned, there was a VC on top of the page where you 'voted' Artem. Strange that you didn't pay much attention towards the VC when you wanted to apply pressure, not?

@post 153
I also got the wrong impression like Charter about your 'saved' comment and I'm also wondering how you could miss the VC. Perhaps it's not that easy to understand, as we're not as great as you ( ), so can you please answer the questions from post 152?

MR, can you next time let Xdaamno respond first?

Posts 166 and 168. You are exactly doing of what you accuse Lynx off. Besides, in post 168, you already give Lynx a way out of your attacks.

I really want an explanation about post 172.

@post 183

I also call bullshit on "contributed nothing" and "given no case".

Where's the evidence for this? Especially, the second part.

Having seen all of this:

FoS Xdaamno

FoS Master Ruck

[BSG]

I assume that you are saying that I have to give evidence that you aren't giving any cases.

Fos Artem. I think you could actually be scum. Bringing a RVS wagon to three votes is scummy? That's some imagination. I'd vote for you but Panzer has already been caught.

Are you actually defeating your own argument with a counterclaim of "but it's under Panzer's name"? Surely one oughtn't use ones fos so lightly, neh?

The only possible way I can conceive of a player not realising that was a joke would be if said player was looking for reasons to attack people.

IGMEOY.

Xdaamo, why did you say Artem would be a good lynch, then you were "saved" when her lynch didn't actually occur? Why the backpedal? And why did you say you reread when you voted, and then in your next post say you need to reread? And how did you miss it being L-1 with a votecount at the top of the page?

That's unusual. Interrogating, when the answers to all of those questions should be obvious to anyone who's done a moment's thought. This is a real, general "trying to look helpful" scum vibe.

Unvote, Vote: charter

Of your now 16 posts, these two were the only one which I could find in which you attack a player. As you didn't continue with the first attack, it means nothing to me. And the second is based upon a vibe. I don't really call those cases.
You're part right about your contribution. Some posts of yours have responded to discussion, but not all of them. This includes some posts after your 'vote'. But as said, I was more interested in the cases.
Can you show your evidence? Because I'm not a fan of reflecting questions before answering.

When I get irritated, I post sometimes sarcastic things. One example is what you just quoted, Xdn. I just got the feeling that you saw as 'weaker' as you said that those answers should be obvious. But I didn't know them, and apparently Charter didn't as well. I hate it when players act like everyone should know.
Also, did the quote went wrong in post 192?

I said I was "saved", because I was saved from having accidentally lynched Artem.

This quote bothers me. It's just strange to say that you were saved before the flip.

I still find it strange that you didn't check it before you voted. And can you also explain post 193. I don't get the 'also' in it.

[BSG]

@MR
Have you read my post totally or not? As you could have seen, I mentioned a few of your posts. Perhaps it has something to do with those posts. And you might look at post 142. I find it strange that you didn't comment on Charter while he called you scum.

[BSG]

@Ruck
What I see is the following in posts 166 and 168:
You first call him scummy as he keep changing his positions. In post 168, you state that he could be confused or easily influenced.
To me that seems as if you also can't make up your mind.
You also give two explanations for Lynx to use in post 168. Now he can come up with a story in which one of these explanations is given as reason if he's scum.
Well, someone called you scum. If you're a townie, I would expect an explanation of your thoughts at that time. I would expect it sooner from scum to ignore such point. That's why I was wondering why you didn't give any comment.

And last for this post:
Those who are voting Xdaamno, why and what do you think of his explanations?