Open 99: Mayo Clinic (Game Over!) before 703

[TonyMontana]

vote:nameless

For being a muslim angel with 70 heads.

[TonyMontana]

Mod: I'm running through some simulations of night 1 for kicks, and I was hindered by a couple things I'm unsure about:

1. The doc pm specifies they can't self-protect, but the Mob doc pm is more vague. Can the mob doc protect themselves?
2. If two killers target a protected person, will the kill go through? And will it not if there are 2 protections?

Thx in advance. -.-

[TonyMontana]

Did some random night 1 simulations at work during confirmation stage, thought I might as well share...

I'm not gonna bother explaining the scribbling (just wanted to show how incredibly bored i am at work)

The simulations were done under the assumption that a doc was lynched.
Out of 10 simulated night scenarios:
At least one doc was killed

100%

of the time.
At least two docs were killed

60%

of the time.
At least 3 docs were killed

20%

of the time.

A vig was killed

40%

of the time.

Scum was killed

0%

of the time.[/img]

[TonyMontana]

Additional Stats:
5/10 nights with 3 kills
3/10 nights with 2 kills
2/10 nights with 1 kill

Hey, I thought since people was discussing night probabilities, and I already did some simulations, I might as well share. ¬¬ Does every tidbit of info have to be about scumhunting?

[TonyMontana]

In other words, my ethics are completely nonexistent in regards to how I play this game.

So if you want something important, you have to ask for it, and be really clear, so I'm sure to understand you completely.

Otherwise, I'm not going to respond much, mostly because it is hard for me to read some of the posts.

Can I join in on this preemptive get-out-of-jail card notion too? ¬¬

Nameless comes to charter's rescue, a white knight attacking my attack as if charter needed to defend against a nearly baseless vote. "Lol pwnd by the Noob." or something, right? I forget now.

Strange how Nameless felt the need to defend against literally nothing.

All the while, Nameless is also ravenously defending charter, like a lapdog. Perhaps we kill charter, no?

GnKoichi agrees with me on this: Nameless was behaving oddly in favor of charter's goodwill with the town.

We all know the scumbuddy angle is wifom at its best/worst. There's no clearer example of "what would scum do?"
But the thing is, I see this attack every single game I'm in, and it's never on the right side of the wifom. Sometimes one of the accused may be scum, sometimes none are. But in the scenario you're pointing to, on day 1, I think the characterization of how nameless "came to the rescue" is ridiculous.

If you're town, you really shouldn't be lying in the first place. You may have won as town, when lying, but it's still anti-town. Just because you were town in those games doesn't indicate whether or not you're town in this game.

Would you not say there can be situations where lying could be in the towns best interest?

[TonyMontana]

I'm totally calling it now guys! Wall-E is the mafia doc, Tony and Orange are mafia goons, and Charter is the SK.

¬¬

Seems to me the only thing you are contributing is asking other people to contribute...

[TonyMontana]

Sounds like a lame gig to me.

[TonyMontana]

@ Tony: You've really done no scumhunting. Please briefly give your thoughts on each player.

In due time.

I can start off by noting how your arrogance is concerning. Judging by the lack of basis for your audacious scum-team, I'd say you were lucky if a single one of them turned scum.
And I've said it before, 90% of your contributions have been to ask for contributions.

[TonyMontana]

*is at work, and has a busy life that doesn't let me make full-game/user analysis on command*

[TonyMontana]

Unvote

[face_palm]
Sorry, work has been killing me this week, I'll try to make more time this weekend.

[TonyMontana]

Whatever, if you guys actually lynch me you're incredibly dumb. It doesn't benefit me if I'm scum either. I stand by my guesses on who's scum. Don't listen to anything GK says.

First of all, the lashing out at the town when "pressured" is not helping. Secondly, I'm really relieved that you stand by your, seemingly, random guesses.

Dude, I posted last like a day ago, chill out. I have a life. Why compare me only to Tony?

You don't have to sound so insulted. I have a life too.. and feelings... which you hurt.

Pretty sure I've said GK and given reasons. I've said I think you are too, but I don't have time to

make

a giant case against you now.

Arguably semantics, but I think this is your problem in a nutshell.

Vote:Charter

[TonyMontana]

Ugh.. for christs sake, wall-e.

You made a shockmoney move, and you've had 3 people since ask you to explain. Quit being coy, and answer.

[TonyMontana]

After reading Charter's (at the time) possible last few posts I'm ... actually inclined to think he might be town (or at least, not mafia).

If it pleases the court, I'd like to file this as Exhibit A under "duboius distancing"

Sudden mind change by Wall-E? Unexplained? Attempts to distance himself from a dubious and seemingly inevitable bandwagon? Lurkerscum Tony is displeased his scumbuddy is backing down? ALL SYSTEMS CHECK.

Objections, your Honor, the questions assumes facts not in evidence.

Hmm ... I'm going to go with Tony / GK / Wall-E scumteam.

I seem to get thrown into alot of scumteams for being a poor contributor...
I'd say charter/nameless/wall-e, if we were placing bets.

Quite honestly, GK comes off way more a townsperson than charter, who seems like the best lynch for today. And if it's a case of GK vs charter, the choice is even clearer.

[TonyMontana]

@Tony Montana: You like ignoring questions? Why did you fail to answer this? I'd like an answer please.

That's not a question. That's a request to do a full-game analysis. Which I just don't have the capacity to do now, sorry. I stated my top suspicions above.

@ Tony, it's called "giving my opinion". You should try it more often. (See also: dramatised interpretations, and yes, I wonder why that might be? in response to your other quotes.)

It's called "giving my opinion on your opinions".

[TonyMontana]

i am involved in like five scumteam theories

most of the theorists aren't voting for me, though

weird, huh?

I know how you feel. I'd vote you in a heartbeat if you had a better chance of getting lynched than charter, tho.

[TonyMontana]

I decided that the mod mispelled GnKoichi's name as an involuntary reaction to consternation regarding his play style, leading me to believe the town's fighting affected the mod's mindset, thereby influencing his actions while typing GnKoichi's name.

I know, that sounds dumb as all hell.

I believe it enough to ignore how it sounds.

I thought it was a joke the first time you said it.

It's still a joke. ¬¬

[TonyMontana]

It does seem quite unfathomable that OP could believe his vote would be a hammer, when there was a vc on the top of the page, and no additional votes in the few votes in between.

[TonyMontana]

This.

This.

[TonyMontana]

unvote

Ugh, I'm sorry, I meant to post something substantial before I left but,
I'm

V/LA

from wednesday till sunday, due to a trip to NY.
Don't lynch anyone while I'm gone, especially not me.

[TonyMontana]

To the SK:

If we mislynch and you fail to kill mafia tonight you will lose when the two mafia outnumber the two remaining players tomorrow morning (worst case, you and a townie doc). It therefore behooves you to help us find scum.

While the possible outcomes are more numerous than that, I certainly agree that it's in both our and the SK's interest to catch scum today.

I would like to hear from myself too, I'm alittle disgruntled that the day was over before I even got a word in yesterday.
Bedtime now, tho.

[TonyMontana]

Oh and btw, is there any point in massclaiming. I would figure the only person who might not be claiming doc would be the vig, and I dunno if it's benefitial at this point to out the vig.

[TonyMontana]

Tony needs to speak. Now.

Workin on it. I'm at the office, so gotta read/write ninja style. -.- Don't go lynching someone first.

[TonyMontana]

Dunno what you mean, I've used none of the lines before -.-

Review of yesterday coming after lunch, don't go lynching while I'm lunching. (I kill myself)

[TonyMontana]

Day 2 in review

#786 -

Charter

kicks off the day with "kmd, explain"
#787 -

Nameless

elaborates by voting KMD. -

First vote on inevitable lynch. Neither here nor there

#788 -

Plum

elaborates further with a second vote. -

Second vote on inevitable lynch. Neither here nor there

#789 -

KMD

says his hail marys, votes GnK.

---

#790 -

GnKoichi

starts off by defending himself. Goes on to vote kmd, citing faking ignorance as reason.
Says he doesn't wanna push for too short a day, even tho he's putting kmd at L-2. -

The defensiveness right of the bat rubs me the wrong way, and the push of wagon with a wish to hold it back.

---

#790 -

Charter

airs the idea of targetclaim and the vig claiming
#794 -

Kiro

is not impressed by Kmd's efforts, subsequently votes. (Then EBWOPs in #795 that kmd is at L-1, which is good for scum-bait, then unvotes in #796 because kmd can self-hammer) My

scumdar

is already tingeling, but it's the next paragraph that irks me. Kiro argues against the idea of a massclaim, and

states he doesn't recall 2 doctors to block 2 kills.

This during kmd's failure to feign ignorance? On the very first page #8 I asked about this. Not only did stef answer it, but Mirth answered it in her first vote count on the same page.

---

#798 -

Nameless

announces his disapproval of kmd's defense, as well as gives Kiro a skeptical smiley for his 2 doc 2 kill comment. Smiley recanted in next post. -

Fine.

#801 -

Plum

starts off her critique with kmd. Then asks GnK to back up his reasoning with more examples, and gets on his back for supporting the hammer, but not the fakehammer. Gets back on kmd, citing Kiro as well as adding how she's displeased with his assement of having a 50/50 shot at scum claiming vig is good. Advocates a massclaim, but not really. -

Overall, a fine enough post.

---

#802-804 - Alittle back and forth between kmd and

Nameless

. Nameless wants kmd to defend the hammer, kmd is sticking to his fake hammer story. -

Neither here nor there. Feels like an honest quarrel,

but could just be scums "fighting".

---

#805 -

Wall-E

drops in, hands kmd a big shiny hammer.

- Did you bother reading the 20 posts before you?

#806 -

Kmd

ka-dunk. Wants us to know he really did believe he was fake hammering.
#808 -

Wall-E

is really upset that kmd used the big hammer he gave him. Unvotes, and puts town on timeout.

- I guess you didn't bother to read before you voted.

#809 -

kmd

mocks Wall-E, saying it's too late to unvote.
#810 -

Wall-E

still upset, promises to strangle kmd if he's town.

- I see you're sticking to your story of not knowing your vote was L-1. This is on level with kmd not knowing his hammer was real.

---

20 hour day comes to an end.

I'm seeing Kiro and Wall-E as remaining scum, and GnK as SK. Nameless and Plum come off neutral at best, but gets benefit of any doubt when compared to the last three.

So in response to GnK: *raises hand*

Only black visible text is allowed. You obviously have not read the rules. This is an official mod-warning for disobeying the rules. The only thing that saved you from a mod-killing right now is that the color tags said "darkblue" instead of "blue" which is how the text appears on my screen.

[TonyMontana]

@ Tony, you say Plum is "neutral at best", but not once in your review (or indeed, the entire game) have you mentioned a single negative point against her. Why?

Well, the last comment was intended to be somewhat smirky (albeit not warranting a red text).
But that's just how I see everyone. I don't see anyone as particularly town, I just see people in degrees of scumminess. I hate when people label people as town anyway, as it's giving them credibility they might not deserve.

[TonyMontana]

Why do you think I'm voting for you?

The situation is exactly as described by Tony. Thanks for the post.

¬¬

vote:Wall-E

[TonyMontana]

Confident the SK is already on your scumbuddy's wagon?

Something you want to confess?

[TonyMontana]

Tony hasn't bothered to respond to my post about him. I feel he doesn't bring enough to the table still. He did put the 3rd vote on Wall-E which brings up a whole bunch of mind games. But at the very least, that action itself was pretty anti-Town and I don't see why he just HAD to get that vote in. There were no new reasons introduced to make it necessary. You're also being really unhelpful with the guessing games between yourself and Nameless after that vote. Care to comment about that and any other point I'm contending with you from #857?

Well as far as your objections to the issues I posted as reasons for your suspicions, there's not really much for me to contend, as you merely explain why your actions were not intended as i percieve them.

Wall-E is acting more and more anti-town, and seems to try to confuse the town, and derail the discussion. I think it's pretty dubious to say Wall-E hasn't earned my vote today.

What a useless statement. We all know you lurked, why are you trying to prop yourself up like that?

I did not lurk during a day that lasted 20 hours, so I don't know how you can "know" that I did.

If Wall-E was Mafia and intentionally allowed KMD to self hammer himself, an obvious benefit would be to protect a scumbuddy Tony from not having to comment about anything till Day 3. Our expectations of Tony would be so low that when he finally got something out, we're like... "Ooh! Good post."

This is highly questionable material. Setting up a case on me, depending on Wall-E flipping scum. Seems like you're laying down a connection for a flip you know how turns out.

[TonyMontana]

Over 48 hours since my last post and NOTHING from ANYONE! I don't even know what to say about this, but it needs to be pointed out.

Merry Christmas!
Dunno how you celebrate, but my schedule is packed for the rest of december. Just so you know.

Tony, Kiro: If you are town, what would you advise our Vig to do tonight?

His/her best. I don't know what you are fishing for here, do you really expect me to suggest a target?

[TonyMontana]

Good game

most

, not including those players with unacceptable contribution levels (... Tony)

We won didn't we? :p

gg all!

[TonyMontana]

I don't think you actually participated in the game enough to fairly say that you won anything.

Have some respect, if it wasn't for me you'd be dead. -.-