667: Random C9 (Game Over!)
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Vi Professor Paragon
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Hello everyone.
*Avinyl - Stuff like Post 81, where he says "hmm maybe not Moospiker" but doesn't say why, and how pretty much all of his posts follow Moospiker around makes me wonder.
*JDodge - Defensive? I think so, but not without justification. What strikes me is that he calls for Moospiker's lynch out of (sort of) nowhere - in fact, almost none of what he has said really had much to do with the game at all, and he has gone so far as to say that basically nothing has happened in this game outside the miscellaneous feuding with the person I replaced.
*Moospiker - Scummy and nearly useless - a stupid noob, to use his term.
*Charter - Aside from calling for Moospiker's lynch so blatantly and the "coming around" bit, seems clean.
*afatchic - Very mildly positive read, but for some reason I feel worried when I look through your posts...
*starrie - This sentence is as informative as the material from which I have to get a read on this player slot.
*KrisReizer - Um, riiiiiiiiiight... No more of that.
'Anyone feel misrepresented so far?-
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Vi Professor Paragon
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@Moospiker: A good part of why you're at L-1 (the "not doing anything productive this whole game" part) persists because you refuse to help yourself. You've stopped defending yourself, the only lynch you seem to advocate is your own... I'm not a fan of jumping into a game and hammering immediately, so I'll give you a single chance to say something meaningful. Use my analysis as a starting point if you have to.
What does my read have to do with it? Should Moospiker have claimed anyway?Charter 139 wrote:Gathering from Vi's read on you, you should claim now.-
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Vi Professor Paragon
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It would appear that my analysis is chopped liver, since the only response I got from it was "Yer gon' get NK'd... *snicker*".
@Moospiker: That's nice. It's also not what I asked for. Even if you don't know who the scum are, take others' ideas (namely mine) and build on them however you can. There's no reason to stay at Square 1 and throw up your hands in confusion.-
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Vi Professor Paragon
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@Moospiker: Why?
@afatchic: It probably has to do with how recently almost everything you've said can be summed up as "I agree with charter". Considering I'm not really thrilled with charter's recent belligerence/refusal to say anything except Don't/Lynch Moospiker, that's not a good path to walk.
@JDodge and charter: Both of youse said you didn't buy Moospiker's breadcrumb, but unvoted anyway. Considering you were both adamant about Moospiker's lynch as recently as Page 6, what swayed you?
@Mod: Should avinyl be prodded?-
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Vi Professor Paragon
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charter 111 wrote:[@afatchic:]Why did you only express your dislike for his asking a claim after I already did?afatchic 123 wrote:[@charter:]QFT.[etc.]afatchic 136 wrote:[@charter:]well that seems like a decent reason right there. haha
but yeah this game has come to a near halt, so im going to spice things up a bit. Vote: Moospiker.[with charter]
---------------------afatchic 141 wrote:[@charter:]QFT.[etc. Repeated in afatchic 150]
This is in a separate category. For claiming to be suspicious of Moospiker after this post, you didn't do a great job of showing it beforehand.JDodge 117 wrote:his buddying up to Moo seems incredibly awkward and off.
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Telling people my suspicions just makes me a target.afatchic 159 wrote:Vi who do you find most suspicious at the moment?
...But I'll take one for the team. Avinyl is my stated top suspect, though I should do a reread to see if this needs changing. Second place is a tie between you and charter.-
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Vi Professor Paragon
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Basically, those are the places where afatchic agrees entirely with you (post numbers provided for reference). I edited out the text for the sake of making it look less like tl;dr filler; apologies.charter wrote:@Vi, I see my name a lot in 161, but I cannot understand anything in the first part of that post.-
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Vi Professor Paragon
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That was blatant mockery of charter and afatchic.Machiavellian-Mafia wrote:
I feel quite uneasy about this statement. Vi why do you seem reluctant to expresses suspicions? You do know that is what the game mainly entails right?Vi wrote:Telling people my suspicions just makes me a target.
Oh, so the people calling you out for parroting people are onto the truth, right?~afatchic 168 wrote:i was answering a question, while giving my own opinions. if everyone seems to think this, maybe its the truth. have you ever thought about that?
Yes, I know that was out of context. With that said, I'm not sure if I can sustain the line I was following about you parroting others, so for now I'm willing to drop it.
I'd like to vote avinyl, but for the sake of safety I'm waiting for one more post from him to answer the accusations against him.-
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Vi Professor Paragon
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I've been meaning to do a reread on it, as I said before, so here's where I'm at:charter wrote:
Reasons for this? (wanting to vote him)Vi wrote:I'd like to vote avinyl, but for the sake of safety I'm waiting for one more post from him to answer the accusations against him.
You haven't mentioned him since your first post despite expressing suspicions of others.
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Against him
Avinyl 60 wrote:c) KrisReizers strange vote of JDodge while being ready to jump off if he would be lynched. I could understand if it was a first vote, but it was already halfways to lynch.Avinyl 65 wrote:Unvote KrisReizer. I didn't notice starrie voted[KR to L-1]after the votecount.
Contradictions much? Even so, it's painfully obvious this guy doesn't vote people to L-1.Avinyl 69 wrote:On another unrelated note, I currently find Moospiker scummy, partly gut, partly because of the unsubstantiated demand for Krisreizer to claim. I think he currently has 2 votes already, so FoS Moospiker.
He posts a short "Moospiker's no longer scummy" message once, and then scoots back to him later - but doesn't vote him, only unvotes starrie. It would have been nice if he had told what exactly made him not/scummy... In addition, half of Avinyl's posts concern Moospiker and Moospiker alone, which is hardly scumhunting.
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For him
The lurker prod on starrie was a bit uncalled for (less so if you buy his philosophy of not putting people at L-1), but at the time Avinyl was posting somewhat frequently (until he flip->flopped on Moospiker).
I only see one question asked to Avinyl - why did you flip on Moospiker? If that question were answered, some of the weight would be taken out of the accusations here.charter 162 wrote:Also ignores some questions directed at him (which I think he definately should have answered).
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So, these are the results of the reread I promised myself (and I should not have said that I would vote Avinyl without doing it). Avinyl basically slipped through the cracks, and what he did not do is more cause for concern than what he did. I do not know if his obvious unwillingness to put people at L-1 is an example of scumplay or bad play. Thus, I don't know what to do with Avinyl - he could show up and explain himself, and that would take care of a lot of the suspicion in my eyes. Because of this, I don't think voting him would be a good idea if he genuinely flaked.-
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Vi Professor Paragon
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Oh wow, backpedaling. It sounds like you really want us to lynch the claimed cop, charter.
Just one more, and I already hit a variant of the question in my list. Avinyl has a bit to answer for, but it's not as much as you're making it out to be.charter 178 wrote:And in post 68 there's more.
And last,
This is interesting in light of the L-1 claim question.charter 139 wrote:Gathering from Vi's read on you, you should claim now.-
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Vi Professor Paragon
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You're right on these counts, but I didn't like how when M-M raised a counterargument you dropped that line of thought immediately, saying you'd come back to it later. It makes sense now, but the way you said it caused me to raise a question.charter 181 wrote:I'm still convinced he's guilty. Where have I backpedaled there? I said I'm not interested lynching him today, I even reaffirmed that in 179, where have I shown otherwise?
I do. Dropping it.charter 181 wrote:But to shoot your point down anyway, do you not see a difference in asking for a claim on page 3, when one of the votes was from page 1, verses asking a claim on page 7 at L-1 and with others saying they are suspicious of the person?
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@Machiavellian-Mafia: Where are those quotes from?
Also,Unvote: JDodge-
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Vi Professor Paragon
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Vi Professor Paragon
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Vi Professor Paragon
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I think it's obvious who your top two suspects are (Avinyl and Moospiker). I was referring to your refusal to answer M-M's question. So, have a direct query - What is your opinion of afatchic, and the general mullings-about that he's parroting people/following you around?charter wrote:@Vi, I don't recall anyone asking for my top two suspects. If someone wants them, ask.-
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Vi Professor Paragon
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charter wrote:
Which question?Vi wrote:I was referring to your refusal to answer M-M's question.
I'm still not liking the idea of playing so guardedly, and not just because it means I have to pry any given bit of info out of you. It's very difficult for me to get a read on you.M-M wrote:What if I asked you "Can you give me your specific thoughts on afatchic, Vi, Avynil, MM, Moospiker, and JDodge?"
(However, I realize that you asked of Moospiker basically the quantity of information you have put out since I replaced in. 'Doesn't make things any easier for me.)
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Also, JDodge appears to be JDodging this game. But looking through afatchic's posts throughout the game, I see little to no scumhunting coming from him, and so I am inclined to agree with JDodge that afatchic needs to die. Time to place a vote.Vote: afatchic-
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Vi Professor Paragon
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Vi Professor Paragon
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One could still say there's a tremendous fluff/stuff imbalance in your posts, but if you want to disregard that, try this.
You'restillnot scumhunting even now, and as you can see there is a larger and different cast of players to look at as of the last few pages. Not only are you not voting for anyone, it doesn't look like you're trying to find anyone to affix that vote to. You defend yourself when necessary, you agree with other people or make small talk about theory otherwise, and that's about it.-
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Vi Professor Paragon
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Your schoolwork hasn't stopped you from posting at all. I'd rather you post less frequently if it means you start investigating people.afatchic wrote:like i already said i haven't been doing much now due to school. if you wanna think thats a lie you are welcome to look in all my other games and see that i am falling behind int hem as well.
Where is everyone else?-
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Vi Professor Paragon
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You're not "everyone else"charter 205 wrote:[Where is everyone else?]Waiting for avinyl to get lynched.
Even so, you have no comment on my line of thought vs. afatchic?
(I know the feeling.)eldarad 207 wrote:Not impressed with KR's early postings. Some comments made me shake my head sadly.
I really, really don't like this. M-M never said that Avinyl's absence was a scumtell.eldarad 207 wrote:How is Avinyl's absence a scumtell now that I have replaced him?
Meanwhile, why not turn the general question around - What is your opinion on me, since I replaced KrisReizer?-
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Vi Professor Paragon
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I did not answer the question. You asked how Avinyl's absence was a scumtell. I noted that M-M never said that in the first place; and if I have to explain technically where the logical flaw is, that means you strawmanned M-M quite blatantly. Way to go!eldarad 217 wrote:How did I misrepresent you? I asked MM a question and you answered it for him. Or do you deny this? And, in addition, you attempted to immediately change the subject before the original question had even been answered by MM.
Can you explain why you did that?
I also don't understand how you dismissed my rather innocuous question - "what do you think of me, since I replaced the person you hated in your read" - as trying to "change the subject" as if it was impossible for M-M to respond to the question you posed to him.
Avinyl's failure to respond to questions was not the ONLY thing making him look scummy. If you think that was the only reason Avinyl is under suspicion, you are mistaken.eldarad 217 wrote:My understanding - and it isn't just MM who articulated this - is that Avinyl's failure to respond to questions (although I don't actually see many questions unanswered - at least partly because he hasn't been posting recently so there is nothing for people to ask about) is making him look scummy.
Perhaps charter or Vi would like to comment more on that point.
I didn't see anything obviously scummy in his posts. When I started seeing afatchic in action, I noticed why - there was nothing to see.eldarad 217 wrote:I'm surprised you had a positive read on afatchic initially. What made you mildly positive about him?
Right now, the point is moot. You're not leaving many positive impressions in my book as his replacement, to be sure.eldarad 217 wrote:Does this still hold true for you now?
I'm leaning this way as well, but--charter 218 wrote:Still think avinyl/eldarad is scum.
--this is a good point when met with--eldarad 217 wrote:I'm not entirely convinced that there is as strong a afatchic-charter link as you suggest, but it is interesting that charter has tried pretty hard to lynch Avynil and has done very little in the way of scrutinising afatchic.charter 218 wrote:Still haven't read it[the talk against afatchic]yet, will shortly though.-
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Vi Professor Paragon
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Your method of dodging my accusation (that is, that you straw manned M-M) is a bit on the tactless side. Do Ieldarad 225 wrote:MM answered the question for himself perfectly well, and along the lines that I expected, as it happens. You're entitled to comment on anything in-thread, but I still find it odd the manner in which you intervened on MM's behalf.reallyhave to be so pedantic about this?
The accusation against you, brought on by the player known in this game as Vi: You misrepresented M-M's position by asking him how he thought Avinyl's action of not answering the accusations against him (due to Avinyl's flaking) was scummy, when M-M never indicated that this was so. Do you believe you are guilty of this misrepresentation, commonly referred to as "strawmanning"? If so, why? If not, why not?
That you answered the question has nothing to do with it. You said that I was trying to change the subject by asking you a question that was somewhat in the same vein as the one you were asking M-M. CrapLogic.eldarad 225 wrote:You mean the question I answered at the first opportunity, once MM had answered my original question?
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I gave terms under which Avinyl could potentially be cleared. His replacement is doing him no favors by attempting to avoid my accusations.
Unvote: afatchic
Vote: eldarad-
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Vi Professor Paragon
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You mean he had not already made that distinction?eldarad 228 wrote:Now, as it turns out, Avinyl's absence isn't a scumtell per se (and I never expected anyone to say it was) but that "his absence does not reduce the suspicion" which is a reasonable distinction for MM to make. But one that I wanted to hear MM say.
Other than that, what you're saying seems feasible... unless I'm not seeing something...Everything you say and do matters. People will respond in ways you may never see. May those responses be what you intend.-
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Vi Professor Paragon
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So afatchic isn't scum because he doesn't fit your current theory...?
That sounds much, much more confident in your theory than someone with limited information should be. And that puts a bad flavor on this wagon...
Unvote: eldaradfor now.Everything you say and do matters. People will respond in ways you may never see. May those responses be what you intend.-
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Vi Professor Paragon
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Did I call you scum? No, no I didn't.
Moreover, the fact that your opinion on afatchic shouldn't have any bearing on eldarad's scumminessis the point- you're not pursuing afatchicbecauseyou believe eldarad and Moospiker are scum, a direct cause-effect relationship. Of course, this suspicion can't be wrong; pressuring or suspecting afatchic would be wasting time at best because he's Town by your current theory.
I'd sooner take a "suspect until proven cleared" approach to Mafia, personally.Everything you say and do matters. People will respond in ways you may never see. May those responses be what you intend.-
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Vi Professor Paragon
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I'm questioning everyone who has given me reason to question them.charter wrote:Why aren't you questioning everyone then? The only possible explaination is that you have more information than everyone else.
I see your point, but you're not even trying to see mine. I don't see the need to question everyone I find even slightly suspicious. I've already said, I think AFC would be a fine lynch regardless of his alignment, but I think an eld lynch would net us scum.
And I do see your point - but I'm dismissing it out of hand as anti-Town. You are basically telling me up front that you have found both scum D1, with so much confidence that no more information is necessary and no information to the contrary (that isn't directly from eldarad or Moospiker) is admissible.
Vote: charter
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I'm also wondering why JDodge is (still) JDodging this game. I wish I could do that with my games. *takes notes*Everything you say and do matters. People will respond in ways you may never see. May those responses be what you intend.-
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Vi Professor Paragon
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eldarad: I do not believe I can go forward with my previous accusations against eldarad. M-M, your perspective on the objections I raised would be nice, since apparently I was defending you. Other than that, I'm hardly singing praises but I'm not tunnel-visioned against him either. He's going to stay under scrutiny.
JDodge: Needs a prod, replacement, or both. I acknowledge that it's very possible that he's basically leaving us to leave him out of our infighting, considering his posts were long on anger and short on (but not devoid of) scumhunting; but is that a better case to pursue than what we have on the remaining players?
@charter:
This is precisely why you're getting voted - your reason for thinking afatchic is notScum is because you say so, basically.charter 253 wrote: I'm fine with afatchic getting lynched, I don't think he's scum,
Moreover, I think you're effectively dodging eldarad's questions right now. I don't see where he has been "caught", although I don't agree with some of what he's trying to argue. Some things I would still like to see answers to--eldarad 247 wrote:What additional information would an afatchic lynch give us over and above knowledge of his alignment?
I don't understand how you can approve - or at least acquiesce to - the lynch of someone you think is a townie - and let's be absolutely clear, you have not said anything to suggest that you think he is scum - on the basis that it will give us "information". Can you explain?eldarad 247 wrote:Do you think that reluctance to name players as prob-town, or as definite-scum as scumtell?
Do you think that a reluctance to scumhunt, preferring instead to talk in abstract terms about game theory, is a scumtell?
Do you think afatchic has done either of those things?-
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Vi Professor Paragon
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charter 259 wrote:I do not think afatchic is scum. I think Moo/eld are scum.
...charter 259 wrote:Really? You catch all the scum day one without knowing anyone's role/alignment? I don't believe it.
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5 players -> 2 scum (LyLo)charter 259 wrote:Let me ask you this, what is better for the town on day one, lynching a townie after 10 pages, or lynching scum in the first five posts?
~versus~
5 players -> 1 scum
This one seems obvious. I think you're giving "information" a little too much credit here.-
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Vi Professor Paragon
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Or do they?charter 264 wrote:Vi, those statements don't contradict.
You taunt whatshisname by appealing to the likelihood of catching all the scum D1 without knowing anyone's role/alignment, but in that same post you declare that Moospiker and eldarad are scum (and previously made it clear that afatchic is NOT scum primarily because Moospiker and eldarad are scum). Amazing how you found both scum D1, without knowing anyone's role/alignment~
Fair. I'll object afterwardcharter 264 wrote:Also, don't answer questions not directed at you, you influence the answer of the person's answer I'm interested in hearing.
If the Townies are intent on lynching each other, being useless is a great scum strategy. I just got out of a game where the two most useless players were scum.charter 264 wrote:Useless is not scum, do people really not realize that?
And an afatchic lynch is not an obvious mislynch to you?charter 264 wrote:I'm fine with any lynch as long as it's not an obvious mislynch.
Mod: Prod status on afatchic and Moospiker?-
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Vi Professor Paragon
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I hope you're not done...afatchic 289 wrote:Looks like i got here just in time... started my catching up tonight. try to finish tomorrow.
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It would be more accurate to say the milder "afatchic is not scum because eldarad and Moospiker are, and I'm not interested in hearing much else"~charter 292 wrote:Eld, stop. I never said the second half of that sentence that you put in quotes. A blatent falsification.
That last part is, after all, the flip side of "consistency" as M-M put it.-
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Vi Professor Paragon
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--Vi 294 wrote:"afatchic is not scum because eldarad and Moospiker are, and I'm not interested in hearing much else"eldarad ### wrote:Do you think afatchic is scum then?charter 239 wrote:No, but what I mean when I say I'm not opposed to an afatchic lynch is that his lynch will give lots of information regardless of his alignment. It isn't an obvious mislynch.Vi 240 wrote:@charter: Why don't you think afatchic is scum?charter 241 wrote:Mostly because I think it's eld and moo, and there isn't room for him.charter 259 wrote:I do not think afatchic is scum. I think Moo/eld are scum. I think afatchic's lynch will give us lots of information to go into day two with and will be a good lynch.
Don't ask me again, I'll ignore everything you write from now on if you do. I'm tired of wasting time not lynching eld and talking about afatchic. If that's who you guys want to lynch, you're going to do it without my vote, get used to the idea.
I suppose you have a point in that not much else has been asked. In which case I'll ask what you think of M-M's suspicion of JDodge, who is neither eldarad nor Moospiker.charter 267 wrote:Vi, I siad I THINK they are scum, not that I've solved the game already.
(...)
No, it's quite possible he's scum. I don't think he is, but he's certainly not what I'd consider an obvious mislynch.
Day 2 is LyLo in this setup if the kill goes through. Is it okay to lynch someone you don't think is scum at this point?-
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Vi Professor Paragon
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Times like these make me wish I had unlimited daykill abilities.
Before I say something I may regret, eldarad. Could you elaborate on--
@M-M: Are you satisfied with JDodge's input?eldarad 305 wrote:My favourites for lynching Today are either charter or afatchic, since they both look scummy and I believe the linkage is so blatant that the possibility of them both being scum is very slim. Hence lynching one would give me a good steer on the alignment of the other.-
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'Waiting on you.afatchic 319 wrote:
quoting to show i read it and im here. if you would like ot look a little closer at all of them you can also see that i fell behind in every one of those games, and that i am just catching up in the one at a time. with all that said, this one is coming tonight.Machiavellian-Mafia wrote:@JDodge: Back to this actual game instead of our debate on meta theory, are you saying that when in a town "mindstate", you have a meta of ignoring a game while being very active in other threads?
I have noticed quite a reliable trend in which afatchic promises to reread to catch up and never delivers the promise. In earlier cases he used real-life constraints as an excuse, but in the most recent case he has posted over 30 tmes in other threads while ignoring this one, so clearly afatchic doesn't consider contributing to this game as a priority, which is very antitown. I wouldn't mind lynching afatchic now.
Big FoS: afatchic-
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Vi Professor Paragon
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So you're interested in clearing afatchic from charter's flip,regardlessof how charter flips...?
Check that logic again. I've not had a blind eye to your near-sensible statements.
And what of a Moospiker lynch or an M-M lynch?eldarad 325 wrote:Hence lynching charter will give us more information than a JD lynch, or an eldarad lynch, or a Vi lynch. (Or an afatchic lynch, actually.)-
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"Cleared" is a big word. The idea nonetheless stands; IYO afatchic would look better no matter how charter flips. Which the way you put it just sounds like an excuse for a charter lynch.eldarad wrote:
Given that I didn't say that I would clear afatchic if charter flipped town, I don't see how you reached that conclusion.Vi wrote:So you're interested in clearing afatchic from charter's flip, regardless of how charter flips...?
Unvote: charter-
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Vi Professor Paragon
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Postingafterprod for a change.
I believe that replacements are the scum's enemy, and thus welcome whoever replaces afatchic.M-M 332 wrote:@charter and elderad and Vi: what do three make of afatchic's continuous trend of delaying his promises and not delivering them?
I'm not sure WHY afatchic is being replaced though; he is posting (somewhat minimally) in other games last time I checked.
@eldarad: Nice technicality. Then let me ask this, more for summary than anything--What do YOU think of afatchic without the charter link?
I'm really starting to agree with charter about this game going nowhere. It's surreal, but thebadkind of surreality.Everything you say and do matters. People will respond in ways you may never see. May those responses be what you intend.-
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Well, replacements one at a time (no comment on Newbie games <_< ).charter wrote:Wait, how are replacements SCUMs enemy? I just replaced into a NG that was plagued by them. I was scum, it was easy as pie to win (two confirmed innocents and no one thought us two were scum, and it was LYLO).
I'll at least let afatchics replacement post before making final decisions. However, if I don't like the post, my vote will come with swift and mighty justice!
But as a replacement, I often feel like my initial opinions are against the status quo, which the scum work to establish in their favor so nobody looks at the Man Behind the Red Curtain.
That could be inexperience talking, but whatever. What isn't theoretical is that Moospiker still needs to be replaced first-
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Well that wasn't the response I was expecting.
So, let me see if I can get the gist of your reasons for hating me.
*KrisReizer's existence. (tbqh, I can't blame you)
*kuribo 352 wrote:Vi says telling people his suspicions makes him a target. (No. Telling people who you think is TOWN makes THEM a target) How the hell do you play mafia without voicing suspicions? Vi claims it wasn't serious.
Notice that IVi 161 wrote:Telling people my suspicions just makes me a target.
...But I'll take one for the team. Avinyl is my stated top suspect, though I should do a reread to see if this needs changing. Second place is a tie between you and charter.actually do itin the next line. OMG nullpoint~Vi 172 wrote:That was blatant mockery of charter and afatchic.charter 139 wrote:I don't really see the need to give my opinions on everyone. It will let scum know whether to keep my alive or not, if anyone wants my specific thoughts or something, I'm more than happy to provide them.
Incidentally, the quoted part of charter 139 still bothers me. Why so interested in staying alive?afatchic 150 wrote:however i don't think it is a good idea for people that have played the whole game and have made there opinions pretty clear to make a detailed list of what they think of everyone at an L-1 position, or close. it just gives the scum way too much info to go on.
*
See above link.kuribo 352 wrote:The band comes out because it's HALFTIME!
*
It would be nice to have your opinion onkuribo 352 wrote:Page 10- Vi finds eld scummy and votes him. (Or bussing?) eld claims vanilla townie. (yeah, okay, and I'm the King of Siam) charter makes a bit of a case on eld. Explains that he thinks eld and Moo are the scum pair. (I say Vi and Eld, but, hey) Vi reinforces that in my diseased mind by taking eld off L-1. (Was it the vanilla claim that did it for you?) eld and charter going back and forth a bit. Vi votes charter. (saw this coming)whyI voted charter, considering this point only makes sense if you start with the assumption that me and eldarad are both scum.
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And that's basically it; the rest of it is a pile of smart remarks as far as I saw. Shortly put, you hate me because of KrisReizer... or am I missing something?
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Three on that page, to be pedantic. But do tell whatkuribo 352 wrote:Page 6 Summary- Vi almost changes my mind about Kris, but two posts won't do it, scum, sorry.wouldchange your mind.
A few things I'd like for you to follow up on.
*Moospiker's claim. True or false?
*Least likely to be scum. Vi, eldarad, or Machiavellian-Mafia?
*JDodge. Safely Town or room for doubt? (Or comical third option?)
*charter. Safely Town or room for doubt? (Or comical third option?)Everything you say and do matters. People will respond in ways you may never see. May those responses be what you intend.-
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Like what.kuribo 355 wrote:It's also blatantly ignoring some of the other criticisms I've had of you.
I asked if I was missing something, and you gave me a vague-as-heck answer like this. Similarly, I asked what I could do to change your opinion, and you ignored that question entirely. If this is how you're going to go about this, I'm going to be as helpful as you are.
It's not irrelevant. Lest you forgot, there are two scum in this game, and you've already named them IYO. If you've found both scum, Moospiker's claim is true.kuribo 355 wrote:1. Irrelevant. There's time to sort things out, and it'd be stupid to lynch him today. Moospiker's behavior is sufficiently disturbing enough to call it into doubt.
You did. You also called M-M for a "thinly veiled lurker lynch", which would seem to me to be a significant scumtell.kuribo 355 wrote:2. MM. I thought I made that clear I thought you and eld were most likely scum partners?
'See, my problem with what you're doing is similar the same problem that caused me to vote charter (oh wait, I only did that as an excuse to pair up with eldarad; logic be darned). You claim to have found both scum, and are thus proceeding to dismiss what other people are doing as Very Scummy but not worthy of your interest.
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Is this stance worth reconsidering in light of Moospiker claiming Cop soon afterward?kuribo 355 wrote:You question charter's interest in staying alive, on the contrary, I read that as charter thinking ahead to the NK and not wanting to tell the scum who they should kill. This would set him up Day 2 as a target for lynching when his "Most Favoritest Townie" turns up dead that night. Regardless of HIS alignment. But, where it ACTUALLY leads from there is circular. (Did he really kill them, or did the scum want us to think that? Or did the scum just think the person was pro-town as well?)Everything you say and do matters. People will respond in ways you may never see. May those responses be what you intend.-
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If ignoring the other person is how you win an argument, I suppose so.JDodge 364 wrote:
Why are you ignoring him? Because you're losing the argument?Vi wrote:All right, time to tune out the new guy.~
easy lynch gogogoJDodge 364 wrote:I'm not liking my vote as much since kuribo replaced in, and eldarad has been piquing my interest for some time, and I think an eldarad lynch is more likely to materialize before deadline, so...
Unvote, vote: eldaradEverything you say and do matters. People will respond in ways you may never see. May those responses be what you intend.-
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Flippant sarcasm.JDodge 366 wrote:
So the answer is "yes", or is this some flippant sarcasm instead of an actual response? Because, y'know, it was aVi wrote:
If ignoring the other person is how you win an argument, I suppose so.JDodge 364 wrote:
Why are you ignoring him? Because you're losing the argument?Vi wrote:All right, time to tune out the new guy.~responseI was looking for.
He quotes my entire post in 360, but ignores IMO the most important part (above). A thorough job if I say so myself.Vi 357 wrote:
Like what.kuribo 355 wrote:It's also blatantly ignoring some of the other criticisms I've had of you.
I asked if I was missing something, and you gave me a vague-as-heck answer like this. Similarly, I asked what I could do to change your opinion, and you ignored that question entirely. If this is how you're going to go about this, I'm going to be as helpful as you are.
There's nothing to be done with someone who's essentially tunneling against me for things I can't answer for.
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I see one mention of eldarad before your vote. You're voting to deadline lynch eldarad six days before the actual deadline, and I'm assuming you're leaving me to fill in the blanks for further motives again beyond that single mention of eldarad. I'd also like to know why you dropped kuribo/afatchic after the replacement.JDodge 366 wrote:
Smart lynch gogogoVi 3:3 wrote:
easy lynch gogogoJDodge 364 wrote:I'm not liking my vote as much since kuribo replaced in, and eldarad has been piquing my interest for some time, and I think an eldarad lynch is more likely to materialize before deadline, so...
Unvote, vote: eldaradEverything you say and do matters. People will respond in ways you may never see. May those responses be what you intend.-
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I'm really not liking how JDodge's suspicions of afatchic, which were stated well in advance and well-outlined in two posts, vanished entirely when kuribo replaced in.
More interestingly, I'm not liking this last assertion that KR was in the least pro-Town, considering basically everything JDodge said until KR had to replace out.
Ergo, something Idolike.Vote: JDodge(L-3)Everything you say and do matters. People will respond in ways you may never see. May those responses be what you intend.-
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Why the surprise? It seems to me based on this--eldarad 393 wrote:I said I was surprised at your reaction - I meant it.
--that the major reason you think I'm scum/scummy is because I disagreed with you and did not push your pet wagon. To which I will say something a couple of people already have in this game, albeit for different reasons--Oh Myeldarad 393 wrote:Vi's charter vote and then his unvote in 328 brought my assumptions about this game crashing to the ground. It just looks...wrong.God, You Suck.
You have no idea how much I'm not buying this. Critical thinking failure is go--eldarad 393 wrote:At this moment in time, I can't really give a standalone meaningful read on afatchic/kuribo because I just can't ignore the consequences of charter's manufactured linkage.
So the lynches you wouldn't be okay with are:eldarad 393 wrote:At deadline, I would prefer to see charter lynched. No-one else even comes close.
If kuribo/afatchic were lynched I wouldn't be distraught, but a charter lynch would be far better from a Day 2 standpoint.
A JD lynch I could live with and would be prepared to contribute to.
*Your own
*Mine (though you explained why)
*Machiavellian-Mafia. And that's who I want you to give an opinion on.
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I realized a day or two ago that Machiavellian-Mafia has been coasting under the radar basically throughout, and all of his votes and significant suspicions have been against people who were unlikely to respond.
*Avinyl (eldarad)
*afatchic (kuribo)
*JDodge
*afatchic again
The abridged version of his commentary toward everyone who has participated is that they have seemed pro-Town to him (except eldarad until he voted to policy lynch JDodge). I don't like it.Everything you say and do matters. People will respond in ways you may never see. May those responses be what you intend.-
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You know, you could just say you think he's Townish without the display of arrogance...eldarad 400 wrote:
Well, I have an opinion on MM, but given that he isVi wrote:Machiavellian-Mafia. And that's who I want you to give an opinion on.at least4th on my list of scumminess I am not going to go any further down that road at the moment.(*ring ring* "Hello?" "Hello kettle?")
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I don't buy this.M-M 395 wrote:*JDodge - My attacks on JDodge actually contributed to his revival in game participation, the exact opposite of "unlikely to respond".
@JDodge:Validate plz
"Questioned" and "a fair bit" are exaggerations.kuribo 396 wrote:If anything, he's questioned me a fair bit, despite the fact that I'm exceedingly likely to respond.
But that's about all I think I can press on in this direction for the moment, and they're not really significant. Carry on, etc.
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@charter: I like the idea and you get two points for deviousness, but I think the chances are pretty much shot if the replacement has any semblance of IQ (which I'd hope for; I've been through too many n00bplacements recently).Everything you say and do matters. People will respond in ways you may never see. May those responses be what you intend.-
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Posting slightly before going away for the day.
Considering Moospiker is/was a claimed power role, I would much prefer he be replaced *before* we get a lynch, and would be suspicious of people who push for a lynch without a replacement.
Invite yourmasochisticfriends! This is, like, one of the few games I'm in that no longer has any utter n00bs in it, so it should be reasonably worthwhile as far as games to replace into go.Everything you say and do matters. People will respond in ways you may never see. May those responses be what you intend.-
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Oh hey, Scheherazade! I thought something was wrong with the forum for a second. (And I wasn't referring to you as one of the utter n00bs in my other games; you actually have a grasp of the English language, ergo you're better off than 20% of the people I've seen.)
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I'm assuming you wouldn't have done so if Scheherazade hadn't replaced in?Machiavellian-Mafia 418 wrote:
Obviously since scheherazade has replaced in, I want to hear what he has to say first.charter wrote:
Any update on this?Machiavellian-Mafia wrote:By the looks of how this game is quickly grinding to a halt, I'm willing to move my vote to elderad fairly soon to put him at L-1.
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Scheherazade's juxtaposition of eldarad's scummy posts makes me see the case about him more clearly. However, the third link is a clear misrepresentation of eldarad's position at the time. Watch--Scheherazade 419 wrote:I think he has a rather cavalier attitude about who gets lynched: I especially don't like the sudden suggestion that he'd agree to a JDodge lyncheldarad 284 wrote:If this is genuinely the only choice, then I would change my vote to JD before deadline. But I don't think JD is the best lynch Today.Moreover, I don't think we are at a point where it is such a simple either/or decision.
Um... what? He claimed, and he's not dead yet for whatever reason. Does this mean he should be lynched for scum?Scheherazade 419 wrote:As he's already claimed vanilla, he's either scum lying, town lying or a vanilla townie who just prioritised survival over protection of potentially concealed power-roles. If he's town and lied earlier about being vanilla, he should probably claim now.
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I'm really starting to hate charter's general lack of scumhunting. He's wanted to lynch Avinyl since before he was replaced, and hasn't really said much otherwise. (Singular exception: 362)
charter, a while ago you said you didn't think afatchic was scum because you thought the scumpair was between eldarad and Moospiker. (Two easy targets IMO, but regardless.) You also said you did not want to provide a list of suspicions because Moospiker was at L-1. Now would be a good time to provide that list, if you want to try to assuage my suspicions.
Incidentally, just looking through your last 40 or so of your posts, the only times you ever said anything about changing your vote from eldarad or advocating anyone's lynch other than eldarad's was in post 342, where you said you were ready to go for afatchic(who you had repeatedly said was not scum IYO and would only lynch for information)and your weak pressure on JDodge. Similarly, after taking on Moospiker you haven't said anything about the scumminess of anyone else (other than "not as scummy as eld").
As an aside, M-M 285 sticks out when following this line of thought.
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Currently re-evaluating where my vote should be, since frankly almost everyone looks suspicious for some reason or another. Your input is welcome.Everything you say and do matters. People will respond in ways you may never see. May those responses be what you intend.-
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Oh, incharter wrote:
Keep on waiting. Go ahead and keep your suspicions of me as well.Vi wrote:Posting before prod. Waiting on charter.thatcase--
Unvote: JDodge(L-2)
Vote: charterEverything you say and do matters. People will respond in ways you may never see. May those responses be what you intend.-
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Fascinating.
Mach-Maf. You said that you consider it a significant and quite reliable scumtell here and here for someone to be posting tons in other places onsite, but not here. With that in mind, has your opinion on charter changed?Everything you say and do matters. People will respond in ways you may never see. May those responses be what you intend.-
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You are correct in the first sentence. I amcharter 447 wrote:He's saying I'm scum cause I post in other games more frequently than this one...
Actually, he's not saying it, he's trying to get you to say/think it. Quite scummy of him in fact.heavilyimplying that I think you're scum (let's see, my vote would indicate this, my suspicions from earlier would indicate this, and now this obviously pointed question would indeed suggest that I think you're scum!) And it's not just that you post in other games more frequently than this one, it's that youdeliberately told meyou would avoid this game when charged with false activity. Atbestthis is the same thing JDodge was doing.
And there's a very good reason that I'm trying to get Ma-Ma to say it. I'm pretty sure that either he or JDodge is your partner.
Calling it scummy is a bluff, but also the best scumhunting you've done forpages. Very satisfied with my vote, and I would encourage others to look into/vote charter as well.Everything you say and do matters. People will respond in ways you may never see. May those responses be what you intend.-
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If you thinkkuribo wrote:I think that if you're basing your opinion of charter on his level of activity in this game, you're either half-crazy or scum trying to go for the kill.
Are you saying that only scum can have less interest in one game than another?I'mbasing my opinion of charter solely on his level of activity in this game, you're either half-crazy or looking for reasons to push a case on me. (But I will separately acknowledge being half-crazy.)
The focus of the argument is that he's not interested in finding scum. Look through his last 40-or-so posts, and you'll see it's mostly shoving words down eld's throat, inhibiting discussion by saying he won't talk about things, calling for lynches because "nothing more is going to get done today", calling for prods, almost jumping on the afatchic wagon, and weakly pressuring JDodge. His activity postwise isn't much of a problem; hisis.refusalto scumhuntEverything you say and do matters. People will respond in ways you may never see. May those responses be what you intend.