Mini Normal 2242 | Opossum Mafia | Game Over!

[Dwlee99]

Hello friends and new ones

[Dwlee99]

House why am I voting you?

[Dwlee99]

My slot was a real piece of work holy crap

[Dwlee99]

GeorgeBailey

Okay I'm gonna try to not spam the thread cause it looks like that already sort of happened and I'm normally spammy but something something game state here

[Dwlee99]

VOTE: Three

[Dwlee99]

House they aren't here anymore. I'm here and will not be cringe I promise

[Dwlee99]

House why am I voting you?

We're distancing, remember?

Right, I should have read our mason chat before asking oops

[Dwlee99]

Homie (heh) you don't have a wagon

[Dwlee99]

Do I do it

[Dwlee99]

See if this flips red I'll look so cool hammering here

Replace in, hammer scum, get night killed, the replace in dream

[Dwlee99]

If t3 tells me to I will

[Dwlee99]

Or GeorgeBailey

Or STD

[Dwlee99]

See if this flips red I'll look so cool hammering here

Replace in, hammer scum, get night killed, the replace in dream

why would you be night killed?

Hammering the baddie. You'd be the obvious doc target so safer to kill me.

[Dwlee99]

I didn't check if all of them were

I know t3 is

GeorgeBailey townie

STD good reads normally

[Dwlee99]

See if this flips red I'll look so cool hammering here

Replace in, hammer scum, get night killed, the replace in dream

why would you be night killed?

Hammering the baddie. You'd be the obvious doc target so safer to kill me.

mafia has no good reason to be off wagon here.

They will know a traitor exists, but not know who it is. So either:

A. I'm right, it's redtea, and it's a done deal so they may as well bus.
B. I'm wrong, it's not redtea, and they can whip through a quick mis-elim with clean hands.

If I was scum I'd at least want my traitor to fake claim or attempt to go one for one

[Dwlee99]

Eh I buy your case though

[Dwlee99]

T3 do you still think I should hammer this? Does not sound smart

[Dwlee99]

If this is a fake claim it'd be super easy to just say that they must have shot a VT. Especially if scum have a role cop or something like that. Or just guess that someone is a VT and then a PR has to be outed for us to lim redtea. We can give it a night but I don't wholesale believe it

Cya tomorrow

[Dwlee99]

If this is a fake claim it'd be super easy to just say that they must have shot a VT. Especially if scum have a role cop or something like that. Or just guess that someone is a VT and then a PR has to be outed for us to lim redtea. We can give it a night but I don't wholesale believe it

Cya tomorrow

Interesting that this shade from Dwlee didn't ping Fua.

Keep my name out of u r mouth

[Dwlee99]

Nooooo

[Dwlee99]

I can't remember if I read all ten pages from before my replace-in but if I did I have zero thoughts cause it was so garbage

[Dwlee99]

t3 I will policy you wtf

[Dwlee99]

You always hate my posts?

[Dwlee99]

That's weird cause I put basically no thought into the things I say

[Dwlee99]

Well anyway why is fua a better vote than three here?

[Dwlee99]

Well anyway why is fua a better vote than three here?

Because fua is literally arguing that one-liners are scummy and fua is misrepping the Three/House interaction.

I didn't find the first thing to be what he was saying and what was the misrep?

[Dwlee99]

they* sorry

[Dwlee99]

Isn't three trying to get redtea killed or no?

[Dwlee99]

I hate dwlee's posts but I also always hate his posts

t3 I will policy you wtf

This reads as kinda partnery. dwlee is shading T3, but simultaneously discrediting the shade by calling it policy.

If one flips red, I'm going to want the other one dead.

This is shallow as fuck

T3 is in like 80% of my games, of course I'm going to be friendly with him

[Dwlee99]

I hate dwlee's posts but I also always hate his posts

t3 I will policy you wtf

This reads as kinda partnery. dwlee is shading T3, but simultaneously discrediting the shade by calling it policy.

If one flips red, I'm going to want the other one dead.

This is shallow as fuck

T3 is in like 80% of my games, of course I'm going to be friendly with him

I said nothing about your friendliness with him. I wonder why you ignored the context of my post and created your own?

The context behind what I said is that I'm friends with him, your framing of it is just wrong

[Dwlee99]

do the people that found oster scummy have opinions about dwlee

dwlee has decent tone, and 485 is slightly town.

I'd think scum would be more aware of wagon makeup for self-preservation.

So am I town or scum?

[Dwlee99]

Well what's your opinion, because you said I was scummy for x and then said I was townie for y

[Dwlee99]

STD why did you get off Three?

[Dwlee99]

Well what's your opinion, because you said I was scummy for x and then said I was townie for y

I said partnery, but fair.

I didn't know that was an exchange between outside of the game friends.

I have a townlean on you.

nice

[Dwlee99]

because it was a random vote

Oh, I thought it was serious. I think three has been scummy

[Dwlee99]

T3 your one attempt at meta on me was doing this same exact wishy washy thing where you shade me and then do a ~idk~ at the end and you were scum

Good thing I don't believe in meta

[Dwlee99]

Also I looked at Dwlee's ISO and saw he was playing exactly to his scum meta and got really hyped up but then I remembered that when Dwlee replaces in his meta will usually give a false negative so now I have a to read him by traditional means
which is blegh

tbh i was feeling a teeny tiny bit guilty for recognizing the scum meta and not acting on it bc 1) i wanted to play with them longer and 2) i thought i would try giving people a chance first and 3) mostly 1).

good to know i dont have to anymore tho if thats the case
/inb4 this gets me scumread

I don't think we have ever played together where I'm scum?

T3 your one attempt at meta on me was doing this same exact wishy washy thing where you shade me and then do a ~idk~ at the end and you were scum

Good thing I don't believe in meta

This is a legit mta tell.

Doubt

[Dwlee99]

But when I replace in I'm scummy? lmao

I hate this so much cause I'm gonna have to try to figure out what it is so I don't end up accidentally trust telling against you

[Dwlee99]

STD I want you to convince me you're town so I can sheep you

[Dwlee99]

Almost50 replaces Wake88

[/b]

Where he at though

[Dwlee99]

Wait I'm getting there

[Dwlee99]

I don't really buy it. The mention of bulletproof would only be a signal if scum knew that the traitor was bulletproof, and normally traitor roles aren't known unless the scum team was informed of something like that. In FIA WRC the scum killed their traitor (t3 lol) because they didn't know what he had there, and I think it's safe to assume that they wouldn't know that information here either

[Dwlee99]

I don't really buy it. The mention of bulletproof would only be a signal if scum knew that the traitor was bulletproof, and normally traitor roles aren't known unless the scum team was informed of something like that. In FIA WRC the scum killed their traitor (t3 lol) because they didn't know what he had there, and I think it's safe to assume that they wouldn't know that information here either

No, I don’t think the first part is necessary for scum to find their traitor? House is right that the reveal that there’s a bulletproof traitor doesn’t have that much town utility to begin with, since it means that mafia hitting their traitor allows them to figure out that the traitor is in their party in the first place, and lets them know not to push them as opposed to not knowing how their target survived giving way to uncertainty.

I thought House was saying that bulletproof was a nod to scum which I don't understand how

[Dwlee99]

It's possible, as Mafia typically don't know who the traitor is and vice versa, but I'm not as sold on red tea being scum anymore.

Just realized this might be a town slip. Or at least a not traitor slip because traitor does know who mafia in normals

[Dwlee99]

My thought is that making the information that the traitor is bulletproof public helps mafia more than it helps town.

Not if we might be able to predict who scum killed and therefore the traitor

I don't really buy it. The mention of bulletproof would only be a signal if scum knew that the traitor was bulletproof, and normally traitor roles aren't known unless the scum team was informed of something like that. In FIA WRC the scum killed their traitor (t3 lol) because they didn't know what he had there, and I think it's safe to assume that they wouldn't know that information here either

No it wouldn't. All scum would have to know when reading cookie's post is that a traitor is in the game.

Cookie's "informed townie" claim was more helpful to scum than town if they DID NOT already know the traitor was bulletproof.

By offering up a miselim, cookie has a ready-made explanation for why he's not nk bait.

I think cookie could get night killed regardless of Redtea's flip because it was pretty consensus that cookie was just town for that

See above for why I think it'd be best to out the bulletproof part

[Dwlee99]

Predicting the scum kill is a lot easier said than done.

If this conversation didn't get brought up and there was no NK I'd guess cookie got shot

[Dwlee99]

I've ruled out that Fua is a koba alt cause koba would have locktowned me already

[Dwlee99]

Ban t3 for spamming

[Dwlee99]

TheZenMan
Almost50
Three
GeorgeBailey
fua
Jacket

@fua

Bonus points if you guess the two people I crossed off only cause it felt right

[Dwlee99]

NVM cookie didn't I misremembered

What did cookie do that you thought was similar?

[Dwlee99]

VOTE: Almost50
A50 no post = ???

[Dwlee99]

okay so after some proper reading, I understood wtf house and fua were going on about

Dwlee #615
I mean the "there is a mafia traitor" IS the signal to scum, and revealing the bulletproof part could be beneficial to reveal. It's like saying "hey, I'm here, don't worry about nk'ing me I'll be safe." Which I think is what fua is hinting at here: #623

also

ah yeah, that reminds me, the traitor is NK immune + gated (no specifics given beyond that). forgot to say that as i didn't really think it mattered, but perhaps it would be helpful when the traitor was trying to fashion a fakeclaim to also gate themselves.

It's just so strange to me that the mod would say that there is a restriction to the bulletproof ability, but not say what that restriction is. Why the alignment and role but not the modifier- though that a modifier exists is mentioned. Is that common?

Scum would already know there was a traitor anyway

All of this feels like moonlogic when I think cookie's play has just been townie

[Dwlee99]

Skip the first 10 or so pages

[Dwlee99]

If t3 tells me to I will

Or GeorgeBailey

Or STD

are they all even voting redtea themselves?

If your claim is true, this is probably Dwlee signaling his team he is the real Traitor.

The dwlee/STD/GeorgeBailey/t3 dream team

[Dwlee99]

I'm a town complex vigilante.

This is probably going to piss "someone" off, but..

I have reason to believe this is a true claim

You're right

[Dwlee99]

In fact, why not NOW:

I am a Town BP Neighbour. At first, I though being a Neighbour was to make me a Miller to a TA/PT Cop (as is the fad), but with that claim it makes more sense for me to be the Miller for the Complex Vig. I mean, without the Neighborhood I could just claim VT if redtea claims to have shot me. However, if I do get shot in this case; my Neighbour will out me as their Neighbour and thus a PR who should have been dead.

@Dwlee: happy now?? Now Scum won't try to shoot me on N1 (or any other night). THAT IS WHY I don't feel the need to out everything I know upon "someone's request".

Who are you neighbors with?

[Dwlee99]

VOTE: Almost50
A50 no post = ???

Lol, at this point you should have voted me since I had said nothing for days. A50 just got subbed in basically.

Idk who you are

[Dwlee99]

VOTE: Three
I think Jacket's opinions seem unsafe if he is scum

[Dwlee99]

Beginning of ISO: doesn't say much. Doesn't interact much. First time involved in actual conversation happens to be when the mech convo with the traitor stuff comes up. Since then, not much to impress me except maybe the truce thing from y'all but I feel like I shouldn't put a ton of stock into it. The townread on me kinda feels like he knows it's true which is why he believes it cause Occam's is just scummy -> scum and I don't think he has played with me to know my playstyle just kinda is this. I think people new to my playstyle tend to scumread me naturally so it's kind of weird for him to actually townread me for thinking I look scummy

[Dwlee99]

Add three to the Scum bin for his posts on page 16

P-edit: D.. did.. you just agree on a read with me??? And without communication or discussion??? I am shocked to the core.

Miracles happen

[Dwlee99]

Fua any thoughts on 807?

[Dwlee99]

Reading through your post it feels like the main reason you’re scumreading him is because he’s townreading you despite your meta? I don’t know your meta, so I’m not really able to see things the same way you are.

No, the main thing is the beginning of his ISO. I don't do meta, my point is that the townread on me for thinking I look scummy doesn't make much sense unless he is familiar with my playstyle

[Dwlee99]

Reading through your post it feels like the main reason you’re scumreading him is because he’s townreading you despite your meta? I don’t know your meta, so I’m not really able to see things the same way you are.

No, the main thing is the beginning of his ISO. I don't do meta, my point is that the townread on me for thinking I look scummy doesn't make much sense unless he is familiar with my playstyle

Is he familiar with your playstyle though?

I have never heard of three so... no

[Dwlee99]

VOTE: Almost50
A50 no post = ???

VOTE: Dwlee
dude

Hello?

[Dwlee99]

How is he associated with Jacket, by the way? I must have missed that.

Is this to me?

[Dwlee99]

People we're voting jacket so I was responding to that and going to a different wagon

[Dwlee99]

Were*

[Dwlee99]

Oh, so I just misunderstood, then. I thought you were referring to Three when you said ‘if he is scum’.

Oh he was jacket

VOTE: Almost50
A50 no post = ???

VOTE: Dwlee
dude

Hello?

UNVOTE: dwlee
hi
I voted you because bad reasons
I unvoted you because you voted someone else

It wasn't an awful reason. A50 must have confirmed to be announced which I thought meant he should be around.

[Dwlee99]

Do you think my vote on a50 there could have led even close to an elimination unless he lurked out for the next 3 days?

[Dwlee99]

I'm familiar with a50. I know he typically comes in posting a bunch. I gave him a kick and he delivered

[Dwlee99]

Everytime someone says meta take a shot

[Dwlee99]

Do you think my vote on a50 there could have led even close to an elimination unless he lurked out for the next 3 days?

Not saying it could have led to an elim, I'm saying it's a very easy push to give yourself some towncred. And imo it was also the wrong push, since I was a better target for it.

I don't see how voting a lurker gives me town cred in any world. I'm pretty sure everytime I do it someone complains

[Dwlee99]

Who are you neighbors with?

Why do you want to know?

Neighbors are supposed to be random alignments but in practice there are ways to get in a mod's head and figure out what they are thinking wrt to balance. I normally think it's best to out hoods early

I'm familiar with a50. I know he typically comes in posting a bunch. I gave him a kick and he delivered

I didn't even see your vote before I posted. I applied to replace in last night just before I went to sleep. I cam in today and found my Role PM along with access to hood added. I posted once in the hood and then came in here to catch up. I didn't need to confirm (I dunno about your modding style, but usually when someone applies to replace into a game I'm modding I just send them the Role PM and announce them at once)

You might be right. I think in my experience sending the pm and then confirming happen fast but I'd typically ask not to post until confirming

[Dwlee99]

@Dwlee was it really necessary to ask who his partner was as far as setup speculation goes?

Yea

[Dwlee99]

Dwlee - [Them] trying to figure out who A50's partner is by asking directly who it is kind of sounds like rolefishing, especially since A50 claimed bulletproof? [Their] 'kick' to A50 sounds kind of flimsy based on what A50 said as well (and how he just replaced in), but it's not enough for me to really fully scumread [them]. I don't think [they] should be limmed today unless we can't compromise, but still.

Asking about neighbors isn't role fishing...

But yea I like to give inactive slots a kick by voting them, a50 started thread spewing and even if it wasn't directly in reaction to my vote sometimes getting votes does get people to start giving out content

[Dwlee99]

Neighbors are supposed to be random alignments but in practice there are ways to get in a mod's head and figure out what they are thinking wrt to balance. I normally think it's best to out hoods early

I prefer to let my Neighbour decide for themselves. This one is very likely Town though, because they said [redacted] in the hood.

If you have good reason to think it's an all town hood fair enough but I also am not sure if I should trust what you think is a good reason

[Dwlee99]

Because if he replaced in you'd think he would be around

[Dwlee99]

Time zones and what not but it was 5pm my time when he replaced in so

[Dwlee99]

Searching for a replacement for Wake88

Almost50 replaces Wake88

Vote Count 1.05

TheZenMan (0):

Wake88 (0):

House (0):

Save The Dragons (0):

Three (4):

GeorgeBailey, Dwlee99, fua, House

T3 (0):

GeorgeBailey (0):

fua (4):

Jacket, Three, T3, Save The Dragons

Jacket (0):

Dwlee99 (2):

redtea, HawaiianPizza

cool cookie (0):

redtea (1):

cool cookie

HawaiianPizza (0):

Not Voting (2):

TheZenMan, Wake88

With 13 alive, it takes 7 to eliminate. Day 1 ends when an elimination is decided or in (expired on 2021-10-08 09:00:00).

Announcements

Almost50 replaces Wake88!
TheZenMan has been prodded.
GeorgeBailey has been prodded.
fua will be prodded if they have not posted by (expired on 2021-10-03 22:44:00).

Possums

Between these two posts a50 confirmed with the mod they were replacing in

It's a reasonable assumption to think they'd be around

[Dwlee99]

Why do I get in this argument so frequently

[Dwlee99]

I wasn't elitelling you, I never checked if you were posting elsewhere because that wasn't relevant. I thought that you had requested to replace in, mod announced it shortly after (cause there was about a 45 minute interval), and I figured you would be around but weren't. I'm not stalking you to know when I think you should post or even thinking about it beyond expecting that when someone replaces in they'd be around. You're telling me I'm missing the obvious when I feel like you're not reading what I'm writing here. I'm pretty sure you've seen this exact same conversation play out with me and every time it's pointless. I voted you cause I wanted you to post. You posted and I liked what you did, so now I'm not. It's that simple. I don't play super subtle most of the time. You can pretty much just take me to mean what I mean unless there is some special circumstance, and voting someone to get them to post is not one of those circumstances.

[Dwlee99]

I'm struggling to believe Dwlee's scum read on me is real at this point. They think it's scummy that I town read them despite getting scum read by them, but if OMGUS scum read them back I'm certain that I wouldn't get town read for that. I don't get why you're so set on miseliminating me since it seems like you are going to scum read me no matter what I say or do.

This is not an accurate portrayal of why I'm scumreading you at all

[Dwlee99]

Beginning of ISO: doesn't say much. Doesn't interact much. First time involved in actual conversation happens to be when the mech convo with the traitor stuff comes up. Since then, not much to impress me except maybe the truce thing from y'all but I feel like I shouldn't put a ton of stock into it. The townread on me kinda feels like he knows it's true which is why he believes it cause Occam's is just scummy -> scum and I don't think he has played with me to know my playstyle just kinda is this. I think people new to my playstyle tend to scumread me naturally so it's kind of weird for him to actually townread me for thinking I look scummy

Pretty sure this is Dwlee99 who posted this.

Read what I wrote and read what you wrote again?

[Dwlee99]

I'd prefer if you just admitted you're death tunneling me,

because despite every single one of your concerns being addressed

, you still scum read me.

See, Dwlee, I read what you wrote. Your other concerns already got talked about and dealt with, which I mention here. So what problem do you have exactly, that hasn't already been refuted?

How was my point about your entrance being empty until mech discussion "refuted?" You townreading me despite thinking I'm scummy has been given an explanation (but not really from you) but not debunked, and now you're angling to flip your read on me by framing me as unreasonable for scumreading you here. What should I be townreading from you?

[Dwlee99]

@Fua

The townread on me kinda feels like he knows it's true which is why he believes it cause Occam's is just scummy -> scum and I don't think he has played with me to know my playstyle just kinda is this. I think people new to my playstyle tend to scumread me naturally so it's kind of weird for him to actually townread me for thinking I look scummy

They think it's scummy that I town read them despite getting scum read by them

My argument: thinking that someone being scummy is town-indicative is weird unless you know someone's playstyle, he frames it as me scumreading him for him not OMGUSing me.

And then this:

Beginning of ISO: doesn't say much. Doesn't interact much. First time involved in actual conversation happens to be when the mech convo with the traitor stuff comes up. [...] Since then, not much to impress me except maybe the truce thing from y'all but I feel like I shouldn't put a ton of stock into it.

Is just ignored. Again, what should I be townreading other than the truce? Is that supposed to be clearing? Cause I know a lot of people would take the truce as scum there

[Dwlee99]

also there's daytalk

What's that got to do with anything??

good question

Also this is tinfoil but I actually hate this post upon seeing it again cause I feel like it's parroting a post George made after seeing someone townread George for it.

[Dwlee99]

Dwele, feels like most of your argument of Three being scum is that he townread you? Assuming that new people scumread you naturally is a bad take and way to general to apply to everyone. Some people can think that playstyle is town indicative. Feels at this point you are just tunneling three because you are afraid to move off him or for the sake of having someone to push.

His entrance is terrible and I don't think anything has redeemed that

[Dwlee99]

Hi

[Dwlee99]

I wish Koba was here cause they could tell me if I should step back from this push

[Dwlee99]

I wish Koba was here cause they could tell me if I should step back from this push

I think you should look at the bigger picture here.

Who do you think Three is scum with?

I haven't seen anything that strikes me as partnery so I'm not sure right now. I could do an ISO later and see if anything strikes me as SvS though

[Dwlee99]

Almost50
TheZenMan
Three
GeorgeBailey
fua
Jacket

@fua

Bonus points if you guess the two people I crossed off only cause it felt right

Updated:
TheZenMan
Three
GeorgeBailey
fua?
Jacket
redtea? (potentially self-resolving so not a D1 lim but back in the Poe)

I feel good with this list. I don't feel strongly on scum vibes from any of these but just think the people outside this list are town

Pedit: I got town pings but don't remember why

[Dwlee99]

I think redtea/George aren't partnered btw

[Dwlee99]

That list isn't ordered, it's a poe

[Dwlee99]

If that was ordered I'd be voting zenman rn

[Dwlee99]

What is scum hunting except poking and prodding?

[Dwlee99]

This is how I play the game

[Dwlee99]

Well you're watching me lol

I am taking a step back from the thread cause I'm like half the posts recently and none of them are helping me figure this out because it's just going around in circles. If you want more talk to me about my Poe or make a Poe yourself

[Dwlee99]

That is everyone

[Dwlee99]

Do you mean redtea is locktown for today or just in general? What did you think of my point that it looked like redtea could have been parroting George?

[Dwlee99]

also there's daytalk

What's that got to do with anything??

good question

Also this is tinfoil but I actually hate this post upon seeing it again cause I feel like it's parroting a post George made after seeing someone townread George for it.

god fucking dammit i knew this was gonna come up when i got to that part of the thread
i was hoping it would come off like a bit
was a dumb tr anyway tho

Did you not see George's post before making that one?

[Dwlee99]

I could go zenman maybe

[Dwlee99]

I could go zenman maybe

Okay, because?

You're in my poe and George said a lot of words

[Dwlee99]

wait i don't think i tr Almost50

VOTE: almost50

Why?

STD I've felt like I'm supposed to trust your reads since LN 233 but this makes no sense

[Dwlee99]

If you tr everyone else you should reeval cause there's more than one scum

[Dwlee99]

Okay then sheep me on a50 and assume he is town here, what does that leave you with?

[Dwlee99]

Three rn but I'm supposed to "stop tunneling" and "do something else" smh

[Dwlee99]

Do you townread him?

[Dwlee99]

I mean, you'd have to be extremely confident that I'm scum for this to be a viable line of thought. I'm just not sure what you plan to do when I flip green since you haven't done anything else all game except tunnel me. Point being that you'll look awful Day 2 with my green flip, and seeing as I'm one of the few people actively defending and town reading you, you're going to be an easy target going forward.

This is another reason I town read you too, you're being way too short-sighted to be scum. Like there's really no reason not to vote you Day 2 once I flip green so I have no idea why you would play like this as scum. But if I'm wrong about my read on you I guess this works out.

What exactly do you plan to do tomorrow when I flip green?

If you flipped town I'd either keep going through my poe or reeval depending on NK. I don't like that you say I haven't done anything other than tunnel you because I've been narrowing down my poe and I feel like that's more important than catching scum immediately

[Dwlee99]

Do you have a name? You've PoE'd around six people but you haven't really interacted with any of them.

Assuming redtea resolves, either zenman or george?

[Dwlee99]

UNVOTE:
My heart isn't in anything I'm gonna check how much time to deadline we have

[Dwlee99]

Okay I have a busy day today (last day of classes until fall break + I have an exam this morning) so unlikely I get a ton done before then. I don't think t3 is going to flip scum here and I don't think killing him even gets me closer to flipping scum so I don't like that wagon

[Dwlee99]

Okay maybe t3 can move back into poe? How confident are you on zen!town a50?

[Dwlee99]

VOTE: Beorge Gailey
I voted.
VOTE: Osetr
I also voted you.

Looking at this looks like a traitor crumb until I remember Osetr is me

[Dwlee99]

I was getting food sorry. I can take a looksies

[Dwlee99]

T3 your one attempt at meta on me was doing this same exact wishy washy thing where you shade me and then do a ~idk~ at the end and you were scum

Good thing I don't believe in meta

Would scum!t3 do the same exact thing to me twice in a row cause this is sort of meta but imo it's actually mostly a scum tell in and of itself. Being wishy washy and also it's easy to make up reasons to scumread someone or townread someone by just saying "blabla" meta.

[Dwlee99]

Based on my skim yea I'd be fine hopping on here? Will consider more after classes

[Dwlee99]

VOTE: T3
Sure

[Dwlee99]

The doing meta on me thing where he just ends up with no conclusion

[Dwlee99]

I wasn’t saying you’re town or not town that was just an observation

That's exactly what you did in MBOS

[Dwlee99]

I wasn’t saying you’re town or not town that was just an observation

That's exactly what you did in MBOS

I thought I walked back on the meta in a later post, no?

From what I remember, you said a bunch of stuff about how I have meta but not or whatever and then you ended with a not sure. And here you said some meta but then said it doesn't actually work cause I replaced in now and I don't know how you've tried to read me so far

[Dwlee99]

House did you decide who you'd want to vote here? We have very little time left atp

[Dwlee99]

We really gonna end up in a mass claim at this point

[Dwlee99]

VOTE: George
Choo choo I guess

We might be making a mistake prioritizing the mech over just reads here by not limming t3 but I don't see a reason George and t3 can't both be scum

[Dwlee99]

Why is fua a better vote than George rn?

[Dwlee99]

5 hours left. Idk what VC is at just make sure we don't no lim

[Dwlee99]

VOTE: GeorgeBailey

I wanna be added to the vc too

This doesn't inspire confidence

[Dwlee99]

George this really did happen to you twice in a row

[Dwlee99]

Okay who would have fallen for that

[Dwlee99]

I don't think a50 falls for that night kill bait given he is often the one doing the night kill baiting in my experience

[Dwlee99]

The only reason I can see to kill fua is it scum was afraid of their reads.

This ignores the NK bait they did

[Dwlee99]

The only reason I can see to kill fua is it scum was afraid of their reads.

This ignores the NK bait they did

That's because this isn't the newbie queue.

Okay, but there are people in the normal queue who would fall for it. Do you think none of them are playing right now?

[Dwlee99]

Incorrect

[Dwlee99]

I think you should give me a chance to prove myself by flipping someone else. I don't want to claim unless I absolutely have to.

Did you miss this post?

[Dwlee99]

VOTE: T3
Weird

[Dwlee99]

cookie knows I'm town and knows my result.
I won't elaborate further.

I don't think there's a normal role that can do this

[Dwlee99]

I don't believe this but I haven't put a ton of thought into it

[Dwlee99]

I do not understand t3 rn

[Dwlee99]

I townread cookie but not t3 and I feel like the way cookie is reacting here means they actually don't have the info t3 is saying they do

[Dwlee99]

town

mailman

This feels like it could be TMI

[Dwlee99]

I've seen neighbors with the same exact role as town before but that was a very long time ago

[Dwlee99]

Did anyone think anything of the game I mentioned where there were two neighbors with the same roles and town (both ungated role cops in fact)

[Dwlee99]

It's relevant cause aren't we suspecting there's scum in the hood because they both said they're 1-shot bp?

[Dwlee99]

T3 why would you not claim no result I don't get it

Like couldn't Jacket be ascetic or something if you're town?

[Dwlee99]

Sooo mass claim?

[Dwlee99]

VOTE: no elimination

We're on evens. Let scum kill and mass claim tomorrow.


Be incredibly skeptical of any investigation claims, especially guilty ones.

Because we don't have all the claims it's possible there could be a doctor or a clear that would make no limming bad here I think

[Dwlee99]

Dwlee is not a neighbor so that check is useless.

I could have told you that

[Dwlee99]

If we were gonna no lim we've talked too much to do it now. We should mass claim, I'm going to come up with an order

[Dwlee99]

Jacket
HawaiianPizza
House
Save The Dragons

I can claim somewhere in here but preferably after jacket/Hawaiian. Others have claimed I think

[Dwlee99]

Why do you think I'm scum

[Dwlee99]

bad shade yesterday

On who. You? Your claim was extremely suspicious and I don't feel like it fits into the game. I don't think I've seen roleblockers in minis so why should I think there is one here?

[Dwlee99]

Why would a Mafia TA need a false positive (cool cookie)?

I mean I agree, but I'm not sure why you would assume that it's a real claim instead of made up.

[Dwlee99]

Neighbor finder sounds useless as either alignment to me. People claim that anyway

[Dwlee99]

How is it a PT cop? That checks if you're in a PT at all and no combination of ta and neighbor can do that

[Dwlee99]

Neighbor Finder*

[Dwlee99]

Also why wasn't T3 blocked? We already think he's fake claiming, but if he's town why would scum risk not blocking him in case he is actually fake claiming and has a more substantial PR?

To put it another way, if I was scum and T3 was town, I don't start randomly blocking other people. It's just such an unnecessary risk.

I recommend everyone else think through that hypothetical situation themselves. If you're scum and T3 is town, do you really risk not blocking him Night 2?

Roleblockers are rare and very strong so if there is one it might be gated

[Dwlee99]

STD or House pick a person to start the popcorn

[Dwlee99]

I've seen odd-night strongman and a traffic analyst with a traitor which is weaker to me than anything with a roleblocker

[Dwlee99]

VT

[Dwlee99]

Is that everyone?

[Dwlee99]

jacket is like 90% scum

Why

[Dwlee99]

t3/dwlee is such a good pair and dwlee's votes on t3 feel like busses omfg im either extremely smart or super dumb

let's go

Pretty sure it's the latter

[Dwlee99]

Vote Count 2.03 (FINAL)

TheZenMan (1):

HawaiianPizza

Almost50 (6):

House, T3, TheZenMan, cool cookie, Save The Dragons, redtea

(Elimination)

House (0):

Save The Dragons (0):

Three (0):

T3 (3):

Dwlee99, Almost50, Jacket

Jacket (0):

Dwlee99 (0):

cool cookie (0):

redtea (0):

HawaiianPizza (0):

Not Voting (1):

Three

With 11 alive, it takes 6 to eliminate. Day 2 ends when an elimination is decided or in (expired on 2021-10-17 09:00:00).

Announcements

-

Possums

Just to remind you where I was yesterday

[Dwlee99]

VOTE: T3
Weird

cookie knows I'm town and knows my result.
I won't elaborate further.

I don't think there's a normal role that can do this

I townread cookie but not t3 and I feel like the way cookie is reacting here means they actually don't have the info t3 is saying they do

town

mailman

This feels like it could be TMI

T3 why would you not claim no result I don't get it

Like couldn't Jacket be ascetic or something if you're town?

Unless you think I make these posts about my scum buddy who was extremely close to being eliminated

[Dwlee99]

t3/dwlee is such a good pair and dwlee's votes on t3 feel like busses omfg im either extremely smart or super dumb

let's go

T3 is a possibility. Claiming investigative as scum weirds me out, though. If he's scum, he's not playing the long game.

dwlee, I'm not seeing. Lend me your eyeballs and show me what you see.

I don't think t3 as scum would be playing to endgame here, but there aren't any other investigatives so I actually think he might be town now after the mass claim. If someone isn't claiming something please do

[Dwlee99]

Let's say every PR claim is legit except for t3. That would give us 1-shot BP neighbors, a mailman who knows there is a bulletproof traitor, a complex vigilante, and am I missing anything? No investigative power at all?

[Dwlee99]

The setup as claimed if t3 is scum might as well be one with one conftown (complex vigilante) and nothing else because neighbors don't give any alignment info, neither does the mailman. I don't get why in this setup where town power seems so low there would also be a roleblocker though. The ascetic idea is possible instead and would make more sense I think, and could explain town!t3 not getting shot because scum might not be worried about getting guiltied?

[Dwlee99]

Complete tinfoil is Jacket (ascetic) + Zen (neighbor), both of which weren't worried that they could get guiltied so they left t3 alive

[Dwlee99]

There's an indirect risk if a person in the poe gets cleared, so it wouldn't be without risk to scum.

But I could see both itching to lim him just for the free mislim even if they're immune. T3 gets eliminated a lot (no offense)

[Dwlee99]

I'm definitely not sold on the theory but I think it makes a lot of sense if t3 is town here

[Dwlee99]

Okay so using precedent that most of the time when I tunnel in a silly way D1 it's on town, let's say I assume three is town here (which I think also has ended up being consensusy)

Then we have
TheZenMan
House
Save The Dragons
T3
Jacket
HawaiianPizza

I think we need an investigative role which gives us

TheZenMan
House
Save The Dragons
Jacket
HawaiianPizza

Sheeping t3 on STD no matter how bad meta is would give us

TheZenMan
House
Jacket
HawaiianPizza

House has been townie and his interactions with Jacket look really good

TheZenMan
Jacket
HawaiianPizza

As the solve. HP being the traitor would make sense cause he could be signalling by angling towards voting me or t3 that he is the traitor

[Dwlee99]

im gay

There was this which could be a traitor crumb after redtea said gay = mafia

[Dwlee99]

lol osetr getting people to dislike him, classic

gtg

remember: hawaiian pizza, a cool cookie, and red tea.
one of us do not quite fit and it's obviously the red tea

This might also be a crumb cause it's saying one of cookie/redtea/HP is different for some reason

[Dwlee99]

im gay

There was this which could be a traitor crumb after redtea said gay = mafia

d1 shitposting being used like this is reachy, lol.

I really don't agree. I think the traitor is very likely to be trying to crumb /somehow/ so scum don't waste a night shooting them or pushing them

[Dwlee99]

Reviewing the joint ISO I feel even better about this solve. They lightly push or shade each other but never go beyond that. They also don't directly interact much at all and seem to be playing with the entire game except for each other (HP being the obvious exception here and has some interactions with both of them but they don't with each other)

[Dwlee99]

HP's interactions are also light towards them as well ftr

[Dwlee99]

Who is it if not you

[Dwlee99]

Crumbs typically are reaching a little bit

But the point is who is saying one is different + saying "I'm gay (mafia)" in addition to it. I don't think I can convince you to vote yourself or your buddy though

[Dwlee99]

T3 either gets a result, ends up blocked, or is dead so we should probably no lim here yea. It will give my theory a night to test it

[Dwlee99]

Crumbs typically are reaching a little bit

But the point is who is saying one is different + saying "I'm gay (mafia)" in addition to it. I don't think I can convince you to vote yourself or your buddy though

Yeah but if anything people would think that Redtea is scum here. I was actually thinking of him as prime elim for D3 before he got killed.

Also, why exactly do you think I'm scum? It seems it's basically just by trying to shoehorn me in along with Jacket and HP. And how do you explain me knowing A50 modifier and having the same modifier as him without knowing it?

But scum would know that HP couldn't know if someone else was scum so they could see the subtext. I've seen worse crumbs than this

You're scum cause PoE and the solve makes too much sense

I think t3 should check Jacket because either scum will be forced to kill him or t3 gets a result/no result

[Dwlee99]

Spoiler: vcs and counts

Vote Count 2.02

TheZenMan (0):

Almost50 (2):

HawaiianPizza, T3

House (0):

Save The Dragons (0):

Three (0):

T3 (5):

Dwlee99, Almost50, House, TheZenMan, Jacket

(E-1)

Jacket (0):

Dwlee99 (0):

cool cookie (0):

redtea (0):

HawaiianPizza (0):

Not Voting (4):

Save The Dragons, Three, cool cookie, redtea

With 11 alive, it takes 6 to eliminate. Day 2 ends when an elimination is decided or in (expired on 2021-10-17 09:00:00).

Announcements

-

Possums

I've seen neighbors with the same exact role as town before but that was a very long time ago

Did anyone think anything of the game I mentioned where there were two neighbors with the same roles and town (both ungated role cops in fact)

It's relevant cause aren't we suspecting there's scum in the hood because they both said they're 1-shot bp?

T3 why would you not claim no result I don't get it

Like couldn't Jacket be ascetic or something if you're town?

Vote Count 2.03 (FINAL)

TheZenMan (1):

HawaiianPizza

Almost50 (6):

House, T3, TheZenMan, cool cookie, Save The Dragons, redtea

(Elimination)

House (0):

Save The Dragons (0):

Three (0):

T3 (3):

Dwlee99, Almost50, Jacket

Jacket (0):

Dwlee99 (0):

cool cookie (0):

redtea (0):

HawaiianPizza (0):

Not Voting (1):

Three

With 11 alive, it takes 6 to eliminate. Day 2 ends when an elimination is decided or in (expired on 2021-10-17 09:00:00).

Announcements

-

Possums

You're arguing that with my partner extremely close to being eliminated I argue against the flash a50 wagon and that t3 wasn't acting like he had a certain result

[Dwlee99]

1-shot BP could be scum for countering the vigilante

[Dwlee99]

Town is weak on power with only redtea as an information gathering role. If that's true, it would suggest scum has very little power, but a roleblocker is contrary to that take.

Which is why the ascetic makes so much more sense

[Dwlee99]

I think if t3 is my partner I would not let him claim like that. I'm not mech challenged

[Dwlee99]

Town is weak on power with only redtea as an information gathering role. If that's true, it would suggest scum has very little power, but a roleblocker is contrary to that take.

Which is why the ascetic makes so much more sense

So, with a bp traitor and an ascetic, who would be the 3rd scum in your theory? I refuse to believe 0 scum would be vulnerable to redtea.

That's just... no.

Ascetic can get shot my guy

[Dwlee99]

I think if t3 is my partner I would not let him claim like that. I'm not mech challenged

Considering you're pushing a world where scum has no fear of a vig OR traffic analyst, I'm inclined to disagree.

Have you never seen a role that gets clears instead of guilties? This would be a way to design a setup like that. And zen could get checked for a PT now that a50 is dead which could be a guilty

[Dwlee99]

well, i assume T3 hasnt claimed being roleblocked.

No result means either roleblock or *side eyes dwlee* ascetic.

[Dwlee99]

i haven't read D2 in detail yet, but it seemed like a lot of people turned against A50 and it can be a case where you wouldn't have to support that miselim? and it still feels like you weren't pushing T3 that strongly other than keeping the vote there?
shrugge

I was on vacation so idk what kind of pushing you're expecting from me then

[Dwlee99]

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This one?

[Dwlee99]

I hadn't considered Ascetic Jacket. However, he claimed he got a message from cookie. What was the message, Jacket?

Hmm I didn't think of that

[Dwlee99]

I'd like to add that Pizza has also been off wagon for both town lims. They were the lone vanity vote on me Day 1, and the lone vanity vote on Zen Day 2.

What do you think that means?

[Dwlee99]

what does me being a vanity vote every day mean to you?

also @dwlee, why sheep t3 on std (some meta read they refuse to explain)? do you have a read on std otherwise?

T3 is typically right when he locktowns people like that. I had STD as town early as well and I don't feel like I have a reason to reevaluate that right now

[Dwlee99]

Okay ascetic doesn't make sense then I guess. T3!town implies roleblocker I think

[Dwlee99]

whether t3/dwlee is a possibility or not

No

[Dwlee99]

Was there a reason you checked me btw?

[Dwlee99]

After you answer that I'm gonna vote no lim and not discuss further. Have to rethink my tinfoil with jacket getting cookie's mail.

[Dwlee99]

VOTE: No Lim

[Dwlee99]

I think three is just off-site not an alt

[Dwlee99]

This day is like a tree trunk.

Limless.

*Ba dum tss*

bruh

[Dwlee99]

So, here's where I am...

Town
T3 - I believe the claim, absent a cc. A bulletproof neighbor, informed mailman, & gated vig that gives imperfect information does not seem to be enough power against a scum roleblocker, bulletproof traitor, and Anubis only knows what else.
Dwlee99 - I can't go into details on this read, but I have experience with both town & scum dwlee and this is looking like town dwlee.
Jacket - dude just oozes town. He's actively solving, and his reads organically evolve.

Scum
Save The Dragons
HawaiianPizza
TheZenMan - Probably traitor? But honestly my preferred lim because this is the strongest red read I have. The others are PoE. I just can't accept 2 town having identical roles. Years of playing Mafia across multiple sites & f2f, this has never happened. Fucking shenanigans.

Do you think t3 and I are just super wrong then?

[Dwlee99]

But like why

I have a good ELO accuracy historically

Although I'm gonna do a reeval so we should see but