In post 3, mastina wrote:I can see the swing concern in both side's powers being incredibly strong--I'm of the opinion tho that it's definitely not terribly townsided tho. The strongman gives clear counterplay to the doctor AND cop, and technically the town RB, too. The town gets a lot of potential clears (vig, cop, cop inno, doctor, informed townie, as a maximum), but the scum have good counterplay to them in the form of the strongman and the vig being ascetic.
The town roleblocker is a bit of a mixed bag. On the one hand, it fits really well as a scum role and the town doesn't "need" it to still be strong so the town can waste an elimination on it, but on the other hand, if the town is smart enough to deduce that the strongman + rb vs doc makes less sense than strongman vs doc+rb, it could potentially be a potential sixth clear.
I believe the former (town seeing it as a scum role) is more likely than the latter (town seeing it as a town role), but I will say that in the event of the latter, unless scum play perfectly, the town probably crushes the scum tho.
Basically, what I mean here is:
The cop is incredibly unlikely to be eliminated. It's theoretically possible with a town not giving them a chance to claim or disbelieving it as a scumclaim meant to buy time, but in nine games out of ten, the cop probably isn't eliminated. If the cop gets their investigation off (which they will unless scum kill the cop N1 and/or strongman kill the cop), they have a definitive inno/guilty to give the town an edge and are likely to be believed.
The vig, the moment they shoot, becomes conftown due to a second death during the night (barring the town RB/Doctors stopping the scum/vig kill, which they're unlikely to do--most vigs will shoot N1 and quite a lot of strongmen will use their shot N1 so two kills N1 is quite likely and the town stopping town killing is less likely because in this case the only way it happens is if the doctor and vig target the same player which almost never happens).
The doctor, and potentially the roleblocker, become conftown due to the information that the scum have a strongman.
And the informed townie becomes conftown due to outing that there is a scum strongman.
While I feel like the scum can handle these roles pretty well, in the event that they're all seen as town and cannot be eliminated quickly enough, the town will win.
Overall, I'd say as-is it's probably ~58-42 town-scum, higher for the town if they identify the rb as town, lower for the town if they do not. So passable, but presumably townsided if the town plays remotely above average.
Cutting the town roleblocker wouldn't really remove the swing, but it'd help limit the extreme swing in the town's favor; my estimate would be more in the ~50-50 range without the town roleblocker. (All the town PRs when claiming will be seen as town, but they probably would be anyway. All the town's PRs are fairly strong and give an edge, but have notable counterplay from their own modifiers and the scum strongman.)
