Mini Normal 2200 | Game Over

[Day]

I think massclaim is tomorrow but I'm not using my abacus

Use your chiffonier

[Day]

Oh I'm not disagreeing, Chara is def in the PoE and overnight I was thinking Chara could be scum.
Chara's posts on me are fucking yikes

There are people who get angry when I remove their agency in the game.
Chara's frustration with my hammer feels a lot weaker than those people and more agenda/scummy than anything.

Oh yeah, the getting pissed off post made me raise my eyebrow (I only have one)

[Day]

Always rated Norwee as a serial killer

[Day]

Norwee wasn't that hard of a TR here tbh

Norwee was still no.2 town for me, no joke

[Day]

Who is number one town

So I can cry a little when you don't say wyldstyle

Alisae

wyldstyle closely follows at no.6 town

[Day]

I have no understanding why ss isn't scum

If it's not you I do just think it's S_S (with Chara)

[Day]

Norwee
Alisae
Luca
Menalque
Something_Smart
wyldstyle22
Chara

[Day]

Do you think I should be able to?

I already want to townread you after hearing that...

You were top town for me when you were solely gimmick posting, your assessment of my "soulread" based on the fun you were having was accurate

[Day]

Who the fuck is wldystyle22

Lucy

[Day]

I never answered about my day 2 wim drop

Idk whether it had to do with needing to adopt a follower approach I don't prefer that day or some medical stuff

I think the medical stuff is gonna get better do I might be a lil brighter this phase

Alright, sending you many Lulu heals <3

[Day]

Also i had this paranoia that roleblocker ensbler is for a mafia roleblocker. So it’s like negative utility for scum. But Day feels town.

There could be a mafia roleblocker on top of me being a roleblocker

[Day]

Farkran followed me on Ali after I explicitly asked but never pushed them himself iirc

However, Ali's posting before and after the hammer just felt really genuine. I think an emmy or a couple of grammies would be in order if that wasn't a town uninformed Ali

[Day]

I suppose the Ali counterwagon wasn't scum's doing though, considering Norwee and I were the main people pushing Ali, and Farkran was less vocal on it although 'll have to check that. And that probably is the best play scum!Ali could've made in those circumstances

But is it the likely play? E pulled it off really well and my soul cadence (I don't know what this means but wanted to try it) was resonating

[Day]

Always rated you as a mafia goon, Chara :>

[Day]

Doesn't that make you a VT/goon?

[Day]

Who'd you think my main was?

[Day]

I thought you were a Not Chara alt in all honesty but was too embarrassed to say

[Day]

is this partner-talk? i'm asking because i don't know and would like Day to play the game for me thanks.

Doesn't particularly read as partnery to me

[Day]

It makes me a weird sad that you are misreading me here. I don't think it will cost us the game but for some reason I want to be read correctly by you in particular

This makes me want to townread you, Lucy, but I gotta ask:

Would you say something like this to AtE-pocket as scum? I think you said something similar to both skitter and Chara earlier.

[Day]

'm not sure if I should treat you like I treat Pooky but 'd townread him for that post

[Day]

The question of whether it's fair to town read it is mostly like, would it occur to me as scum.

I wouldn't feel to guilty to post it as scum if I thought of it

I see I see

But the SOUL CADENCE

Maybe I should sheep Ali in thinking you'd make a bus look better

[Day]

now that i think of that, i am thinking it's possible he and Ali constructed a bus, but it's also just as possible that Fark tried to go for a different angle to set up his partners.

The Ali bus theory has been posited quite a few times before you, yet you still have the least fleshed out take on it

Luca, the warming up to an Ali vote thing is another big part of why I think it's Chara

[Day]

The more tinfoil crazy theories Luca outs, the warier I become, but I still townread him for them because it seems exhausting to fake one contrarian theory after another, and he still feels genuine while doing so ('m talking about the Ali/Day S/S theory now)

[Day]

Pretty sure Ali got to E-1 at the peak but it was between votecounts

[Day]

How often do you see a play like that happen in a game of mafia, Luca? I don't see what's dirty/fake about it btw, I think you're just inclined to read my tone as fake for whatever reason. Is it the "Huh" that feels off?

[Day]

Imagine for a second that you were scum with Ali and Farkran in that situation, is it impossible you might do something like that to throw off the scent? I could certainly see it.

Sure, it's possible, but you have to believe that we came up with it in the first place and executed it pretty much perfectly. Also, you have to believe that I decided to push Ali in the first place to counterwagon my scum buddy Farkran

[Day]

Tbh, i think both you. Luca/Day have equal chance of being a deepwolf. But i’m not putting that much stock into it yet.

Short those stocks before it's too late, Norwee

[Day]

I've seen it a few times.

Norwegian was scum in a game where a player replaced out D1 and his partner put him that player to E-1 and Norwegian quick hammered (I was correct in calling that one s/s)

I've seen tons of shit like that. I could go into more detail on why it seems fake but I don't see the use right now as I *think*you're probably town regardless

Oh, really, and that was involving 3 scum?

Wish scum pulled more gambits like that in my games, they're fun

[Day]

Damn, nomination mafia? That sounds like a fun read, might invest into later

[Day]

No spoilers

[Day]

Nomination mafia was a... rollercoaster

I feel like I need to read Baton Pass now to see what made RC so paranoid of AtE

[Day]

Why Chara and not S_S?

There's reasons to think Chara is scum, while for S_S, it's more just less reasons to think he's town

[Day]

Shame Sujimichi couldn't play for this one

[Day]

VOTE: No incineration

[Day]

If your read is PoE, I don't have anything to say except that your reasoning for townreading people is almost surely not as solid as you think it is. (This is true even in the case of reads that turn out to be right.)

If it's an actual read, then you should defer to the people who've played more with me recently, because my scumgame as of late basically hasn't bussed ever, even when my partner is under heavy pressure (which Farkran wasn't). Because of the way I play it's very easy to just act hesitant and wait for other people to run the wagon up or forget about it. And I never get towncred for bussing anyway.

How recently is "recently"? How many games back are we talking?

[Day]

Lucy probably busses Chara, right?!??!

[Day]

5099 - This felt weird because Alisae was saying it to a conftown Norwee who should almost always be dying before em.

5229 - This dichotomy feels strange to me. Why were these the pairings for you, Alisae? It must be based on associatives between them, right?

[Day]

Lucy probably busses Chara, right?!??!

How so?

Because Chara was clearly the death ray for the day and you'd think scum!Lucy would care about appearances. I dunno, I have a weird soulread on Lucy being town now ever since that one post she made yesterday.

S_S's reasoning to vote Fark was actually good, and this self-meta does mean something. I don't see anything to suggest he's scum, just it's hard to be very confident he's town.

Alisae has still had weird play this game other than that Farkran hammer and posting around it which I thought was very genuine

This is a difficultly

[Day]

That Ali's play this phase is slightly skeevy and eir preference between Chara vs. S_S is awkwardly articulated?

Yeah....

Surprisingly, Alisae's my pick for last scum right now

[Day]

VOTE: ali

Who is town

Me
Isis
Day
Norwee, regrettably

How many left

S_S
Chara
Luca
Ali

Hmm

Maybe not luca

Chara + (ali/S_S) i guess

Like assuming that I’m right on my day and norwee reads

That’s me, Lucy, day, norwee all town

I *think* I believe Luca is still town. I was thinking at night that it was weird for him to like... mishandle his buddy being wagoned that strongly

So that’s literally.. chara, you, ali

[Day]

Lucy is town

I feel strongly about this

Because Lucy is just a villager

Oh, scum might've thought these were softs and that Mene had an inno of some kind on Lucy

Pretty sure this makes Lucy town

[Day]

correct

[Day]

Oops. This one:

It makes me a weird sad that you are misreading me here. I don't think it will cost us the game but for some reason I want to be read correctly by you in particular

[Day]

lol but do you think he did it genuinely? His reasoning and pushes still feel natural and in good faith to me, even if they were wrong.

[Day]

I don't know that I've seen Isis's scumgame before, but this doesn't seem like a feeling that she'd be unable to replicate? Like it kinda has to do with out-of-game feelings.

It's an out-of-game feeling that'd have to be faked though, because it's dependent on her alignment

Maybe though

[Day]

Oh, scum might've thought these were softs and that Mene had an inno of some kind on Lucy

Perhaps. But there are any number of reasons why he could be killed.

I actually think it's pretty plausible that scum-Lucy kills Menalque before he can change his mind on her.

I mean, that's a possibility, but killing your one defender while everyone else has you in the PoE so early still seems a little dangerous. I think it's more likely someone read Mene as a PR or someone else killed him for his reads.

[Day]

When I think of what I've used to read her in the past it's usually when she has a flurry of thoughts that come stream-of-consciousness and seem to accurately reflect how a townie would be evaluating and changing their mind real-time. I believe she's done this as town in every recent game I've played with her? But I don't think she's done it here.

This is a good point though

[Day]

I don't think Lucy is that outrageous as scum. Firebringer's sig gives me the feeling she's against that kind of thing, like a joke isn't worth outting the scumteam or TMIing down the line.

[Day]

Lucy, have you deep pocketed me again

[Day]

I actually found his reasoning convincing and it was part of the reason I grew more unsure on Fark

[Day]

'm really dumb because I took his word for it and didn't even bother to do the research myself. Speaking of, S_S, mind linking us to the town!Fark ISO which gave you that impression?

[Day]

I actually found his reasoning convincing and it was part of the reason I grew more unsure on Fark

What was convincing about it?

I dunno, I think it's because S_S hadn't voted all game and typically only votes when he really scumreads someone, so it gives the impression that his vote really means something, and that helped change my mind as dumb as that sounds.

[Day]

Scum!SS probably wouldn't anticipate that though, so it's not relevant to the point you were making about the reasoning itself

[Day]

Hmm...

[Day]

Lucy, have you deep pocketed me again

I'm a little too paranoid of you to be pocketing you.

You know how claims work and won 999 games last year and everyone but S_S seems like town

apparently S_S is supposed to also seem like town

Game is hard.

Most of what I remember townreading of you is resonance stuffs

I guess I kind of seem like a free cliffpush where I'm townreading you for not taking it there's that.

It's not that hard to say "skitr smrt" and vote me

Really? You didn't seem to have any paranoia here:

Day is town. I'm very confident. There's a large amount of meta to the read. They're a player that's very good at scum so I can't promise I will be bragging in postgame but she's pushed too many buttons about how she approaches towngames for her to be likely scum.

What changed since this?

[Day]

I skimmed through that game, S_S, and... my God, that was unexpected but also pretty funny.

[Day]

Norwee, you probably want to kill someone today because you likely die in the night, but we really should no incinerate to get the extra night while everyone is unclaimed. Could be an investigative or information gathering role out there in the PoE that could utilise another night.

And don't worry, I have a spare prison cell lying around so 'll jailkeep you tonight to keep you safe.

[Day]

Oh wait, I just realised something.

Most problematic if it's the case... hm

[Day]

I think 'll speak about it; if we have a protective amongst us, they could put us back on odds with a successful protect tonight, which gives us an extra elimination.

I think based on that possibility, we actually might be better off killing someone today, and then taking the no steamroll option in final 4 if we still need to

UNVOTE:

[Day]

Alisae's posting today's made me back to leaning towards Someone_Smort being the final one again, but I don't believe in it at all. I hope this whole PoE process isn't just a scam.

[Day]

I didn't want to claim it this early, but fine:

'm a Fruit Craving Home Invader

I look for a place to stay each night, and if the person I target has fruit, I kill them to steal them of all their fruit. Additionally, the visit acts the same way a hider would.

[Day]

I think Lucy's plan is okay. 'd like S_S to claim whether or not they're capable of blocking a kill next, and then Alisae.

[Day]

Isis just said we should no lim and then claim on the last day to make the optimal choice, but now they want us to mass claim for no reason??

The only reason to not no incinerate is if anyone is capable of blocking a kill. This gets around that issue without revealing what type of role each person has.

[Day]

[Day]

We need Lucy alive, someone has to take care of these flowers with us.

[Day]

[Day]

Despite everything, it's still you.

[Day]

'm happy to revote it after we hear the protective/no protective claims from S_S and Alisae

[Day]

You're a genius, wyldstyle

[Day]

give me an example of how it can justify

Well, the main proper application of that

r

ead in my mind is if

e

veryone

e

lse has done towny/productive things, so that rather than the read actually decaying, it's just the average shifting upward.

S_S on the ropes

[Day]

Something_Clever is taking his sweet time to claim protective/non-protective

[Day]

Aww what, why would we go through with the massclaim when you could've had another night to check someone, Lucy?

[Day]

Lucy doesn't hard push her soft guilties. She once tracked me to the kill and didn't claim it for several day phases.

[Day]

Oh, right, last scum no longer has any friends :[

[Day]

Yeah, I suspected there must be another town investigative or protective which would level the town's power out. I think Lucy's just town from a balance perspective.

2 shots to hit scum in [S_S, Alisae]. Seems pretty easy to me.

[Day]

Oh, I thought you might've been that protective with how badly you wanted to flip someone today btw, Alisae.

[Day]

VOTE: Somebody_Sharp

[Day]

(1 vote from holiday)

[Day]

Non-consecutive Disloyal Roleblocker
Traffic Analyst
Novice Vig
Universal Backup
VT
VT
VT
VT
VT
VT
Mafia Roleblocker Enabler
Mafia Goon
Mafia ??? (probably rolecop or roleblocker)

I'd ber very surprised if the traffic analyst was a fakeclaim. I don't remember the last time I saw a normal game here with just 3 town PRs, especially with none of them being proper investigatives.

[Day]

Non-consecutive Disloyal Roleblocker
Traffic Analyst
Novice Vig
Universal Backup
Even-Night Simple Neighbouriser
VT
VT
VT
VT
VT
Mafia Roleblocker Enabler
Mafia Goon
Mafia ??? (probably rolecop or roleblocker)

Wait, I forgot about Ydrasse's role. I still don't think that's a good amount of power though. My and her role are both circumstantially useful and gated in terms of investigative power.

[Day]

Last two mastina-reviewed setups:

town alien
town friendly neighbor neighbor
town pt cop
town friendly neighbor neighbor
VT
VT
VT
VT
VT
VT
mafia tracker
mafia watcher
mafia goon

Town 1-shot Vigilante
Town 2-shot Watcher
Town Friendly Neighbour
Town Neighbouriser
Vanilla Townie
Vanilla Townie
Vanilla Townie
Vanilla Townie
Vanilla Townie
Informed Mafioso
Mafia Goon
Mafia Tracker

[Day]

If the last mafia is a goon, or lightly informed, then I can actually see this being balanced maybe?

Non-consecutive Disloyal Roleblocker
Novice 1-Shot Vig
Universal Backup
Even-Night Simple Neighbouriser
VT
VT
VT
VT
VT
VT
Mafia Roleblocker Enabler
Mafia Goon
Mafia Goon

(I still think Lucy's town for other reasons though)

[Day]

But would the sick huehueing innocentvillager would opt for that, don't first time designers love to cram stuff in? Last mafioso is probably stacked with some kind of role.

[Day]

don't first time designers love to cram stuff in? Last mafioso is probably stacked with some kind of role.

Depends on the person. And it would have to be a pretty strong role to balance the power if Lucy is town.

You should see innocentvillager though, the guy is actually properly unhinged.

'll go case him now.

[Day]

Absolutely mad:

Town: Hiraki

I will get on MY KNEES for and UNQUESTIONABLY SHEEP this slot. I pledge my loyalty to you, master

huehuehuehuehuehue

This isn't worth doing an argument here about it but I agree with IV. NAI.

RESSSSSSSSSSSSSSSPPPPPPPPPPPPPECT!!!!!!!!

Need I say more?

[Day]

So who wants to chat while we wait for Norwee to put SS out of his misery.
I've started watching re:zero season 2.

Is it any good? Season 1 was alright, but I found some parts of it cringy.

[Day]

'm sold

[Day]

You're excused.

[Day]

so i don't know how the role works and it is just lucy after all

Why does Traffic Analyst not working how you thought make Lucy scum?

[Day]

I'm just gonna sheep day and then like probably lose to a loyal mafia roleblocker

Not if I sheep you first

[Day]

If Lucy's scum, the entire scumteam was built to specifically pocket Day this game, it's cruel.

S_S, how confident are you on your setup spec and Lucy being scum? Give me a percentage.

[Day]

I would scumread my current posting
Ali actin kinda sus

Unironically yes.

How does misinterpreting Lucy's role to be stronger than it actually is make you think it's not her:

If it's not SS it's Luca

?

[Day]

If it's not SS it's Luca

now that you know I'm flipping green you still don't trust my opinion on balance?

The actions are bad but if you're fakeclaiming you're trying to look good.
Targetting Norwee N3 makes no sense when they claimed to be a UB that shot Ydra. Why is this player being targetted, why would you fakeclaim a result targetting this player? that doesn't make sense to me.

Oh, this fakeclaiming logic I suppose. Hmm, is that enough to completely 180 your opinion on her?

[Day]

If it's not SS it's Luca

now that you know I'm flipping green you still don't trust my opinion on balance?

The actions are bad but if you're fakeclaiming you're trying to look good.
Targetting Norwee N3 makes no sense when they claimed to be a UB that shot Ydra. Why is this player being targetted, why would you fakeclaim a result targetting this player? that doesn't make sense to me.

Oh, this fakeclaiming logic I suppose. Hmm, is that enough to completely 180 your opinion on her?

'll fast night if you answer this.

[Day]

Well that was rude.

I know. I did it on the off chance that iv wasn't gonna count Day's vote. Sorry :/

Wow, I had some slight paranoia that was the case but didn't say anything.

Good game, everyone!

[Day]

Day townreading me because of my little emotive moment about getting misread was...mood >_<

The SOUL CADENCE

[Day]

Also, I should clarify that 'm not Heaven even though I tried to impersonate him for parts.

[Day]

It's your old poet in crime.

[Day]

Lucy forced me to lie.

[Day]

Obviously, 've got a few around from 2019 in stores.

[Day]

Lucy was hopkirk

Can you not troll now that it's post-game, Flopz.