mini #585 - A Tempest Has Formed (Over), Thanks Patrick!!

[Elias_the_thief]

Hey guys, terribly sorry about the late arrival, I'll get right to reading and posting by tomorrow afternoon. Lulz at tajos first vote.

[Elias_the_thief]

Ok, I'm basically caught up to some extent. Just some things I noted...

General Note: Bandwagoning early on is NOT scummy. Bandwagons are the only way to get a game going and are an amzing tool for gathering info. Its when someone carries the wagon too far and lynches prematurely that you get problems. If town is smart, they should be able to control the bandwagon and use it to their benefit.

Tajo: more agressive than I saw in my last game with him

CohhedCambria: Great band. Um, seems to be exhibiting some noob behavior, but went a little out of his way to make people realize it was his first game.

Alvinz: Retarded logic when placing me the most likely scum among the lurkers. Yes, I'm experienced so therefore I obviously have nothing to do in RL, and I'm just lurking as an excuse . As to his most recent post, backtrack imo.

Gaspode: content filled and well reasoned posts. leaning town for now.

Evil Gorillaz: lulz, doesnt understand pretentious.

Everyone else: not a good enough read or nothing that stood out to me really.

Sorry to say I've got no concrete idea about whos scum yet. Still formulating opinions.

[Elias_the_thief]

defensiveness =/= a scumtell.

[Elias_the_thief]

correct, upon correction. Defensiveness is a major strong point of my town play, and I really hate to see people attacked because theyre being defensive, as it inherently necesitates further defense in which case its an infinite cycle likely to lead to a lynch.

The point he makes about him always agreeing could be valid, but then again, hes a fairly new player and "going with the flow" isnt particularly out of the ordinary for new players regardless of alignment.

So yeah, I'm still totally undecided, as I like to wait until I've examined tells from every angle before jumping into a decision.

[Elias_the_thief]

Tajo: yeah, its part of my scum play too, but my point stands. The antidefensiveness meta is ridonkulous. As for the bandwagoning, I already touched on why I dont find early game wagoning scummy. Therefore theres nothing of note about evilgorrilaz except that pretentious is not in his vocabulary.

[Elias_the_thief]

Dont try to tell me anger is a scumtell. I'll hunt you down and kill you. Also, I like Alvinz response.

[Elias_the_thief]

Thought 1: tajos thought would have been better left unsaid until a later stage of the game so that were it correct, more evidence could have been compiled to support the theory up until a point when it was actually useful

The second thought is meh. Not in actuality that scummy, but worth noting.

[Elias_the_thief]

so...activity much?

[Elias_the_thief]

youll probably be waiting some time, seems like he'll be replaced

[Elias_the_thief]

ah, good.

[Elias_the_thief]

ah, good.

Come on, play some.

Come on, you know me. I dont

really

play D1, unless theres crazy pressure on me, in which case I have to pull a miraculous turnaround out of my ass

But yeah, I'll try to have some more detailed PBP's later this week. Or at least an outline of my suspicions. Trust me, I'll get into it.

[Elias_the_thief]

I am against abandonment...I hope that Laptop will understand so this game doesnt have to die...

[Elias_the_thief]

Sup Skruffs. Long time no play-in-a-game-with-you.

[Elias_the_thief]

I reckon, given that its page 10 and all, that I should probably reread and post some thoughts soon. I dont want to get outshone by skruffs >.<

[Elias_the_thief]

Jeep's Tells = outdated; meta changes too much every year for these to apply

LAL = retarded

---

Longer post in like a half hour, just wanted to point that out.

[Elias_the_thief]

damn, got distracted. Make that tomorrow.

(/has been outshined)

[Elias_the_thief]

Skruffs, please get a new avatar...i keep getting you and patrick confused.

[Elias_the_thief]

Thoughts: A mini essay on the current state of players in relation to scumminess.

Gaspode

: Something has been bothering me about his posts, but I cant exactly put my finger on it. I guess he's been kind of reminding me of my own scum play, but given meta differences, i cant really say that means anything. I guess another thing thats bothering me about him in the first vote he places, on Alvin. That post seems to take some things I consider null tells, or perhaps noob tells, and try to make a case. The thing that bothers me is not the vote, but that there were better things to attack at the time than that. I also dislike the long resistence to voting even when he posted several strong opinions. Meh. Until I can express in words what exactly is bothering me about him, I have a

town to neutral

read on him.

Iamausername

: Seems solidly town so far. My only problem with him is lack of any real suspicions laid out, besides Mellowed Man of course. I'll see whether I agree with you when I get down to him. But yeah, I'd like some thoughts on more than just him, and (if possible) more than just gut reasoning. For now, I have a

town

read on him.

EvilGorilaz

: Likes bandwagons, so cool. Doesnt like metas, so lame. Meh, not too much of note. Makes some decent posts with attacks and questions. So far, I have a

town

read on him.

MellowedMan

: Nothing too scummy in my opinion. Not sure why hes getting so much heat, though I'll admit the part where he forgets what his reasoning was is sketchy, but not necessarily scummy. It does seem that scum would have a weaker idea of why they attack things as they are not sincere in the attacks, but not too strong a tell. I have a

neutral

read on him.

Populartajo

: Again, more aggressive then ive seen in the past, and unsure of how to interpret that. He was town there, but meh, I cant really decide what it means. I plan to reread that game. Um, like his posts for the most part, of the prodding and questioning style that is good for garnering info, but his reasons for suspecting people seem weak to me. His addition of Matt S to his scum list in particular was silly. Meh, so far a

town to neutral

read on him.

CoheedCambria

: Very much classic noob behavior, will improve with experience methinks. Um, seems to be very cautious, and very adamant at pointing out how new he is, which seems to me like it would be more advantageous to scum than to town, but meh. Also, he contradicts himself a couple times, such as having his arguments against evilgorrilaz defeated, then saying hes voting on gut, and at one point saying evil is the best lynch, and later saying that he wasnt pushing the gorrilaz lynch. Also, doesnt want to get bandwagoned? That makes him the perfect candidate for bandwagoning imo. I have a

neutral to scum

read on him.

Cream

: Unvote into fos? Seems kind of weird, maybe a bit noncommittal, not certain though. Exaggerates a little in his post 4 (by sort by post on his name), but this seems to me like more of a noob tell then anything else, though hes not THAT new. Argument with alvinz = waste of space, no real info garnered. At least he backed out of it when he realized it. Hope that he gets back into the game soon, because I could use some better info on him. I have a

neutral

read on him.

Alvinz

: Says he doesnt mind bandwagoning, next post fos's evil for bandwagoning. Contradict yourself much? Moves on to make some reaching attacks, specifically, about the Tajo-Marmalade connection, and his attacks on me for being a lurking IC. Backs off from initial attacks on me, defends himself *decently*, goes into useless squabble with Cream. I have a

neutral to scum

read on him.

Marmalade

: More of the prodding and questioning style of play, which definately has its uses. I like his analysis, and he came to a lot of conclusions similar to my own, especially about CoheedCambria. Could use moar postzorz. So far, I have a

town

read on him.

Hypatia/Matt S

: Was liking the posts until the request for replacement . Not sure what people dont like about her posts really. Then Matt steps in and posts major analysis, which is always good. Not a fan of his policy of ignoring coheed. Overall nothing too impressive from him. I have a

neutral

read on him.

Ashmite/Skruffs

: Makes small attacks, and asks for prods without doing too much himself, which I find annoying, if not overtly scummy. Not too much content, requests replacement. In comes Skruffs. Makes some basic analysis, reminds me of what he was like in a past game with him (nightless perhaps?) I'm making a note to go back and see what he was in that game, though im not planning on basing my entire read on such a small meta at this point. Due to ashmites play, I have a

neutral to scum

read on him.

I believe thats everyone. Given what I've said,

vote: coheedcambria

. Now who's outshining who?!?

[Elias_the_thief]

I may have called everyone retarded, but I said nothing about them all being scum. I said that selective ones were. Also, I was scum there, so its not something to compare you play with under the presumption that you are town.

Not understanding the base of his suspicions does not make HIM scum. He may be going after you because he would like to pressure you to get more info, or something of that nature. Your suspicion of him basically boils down to OMGUS imo, and the fact that he doesnt value the same tells that you do. Thats silly.

[Elias_the_thief]

Well, I may be impartial due to the fact that I thought his arguments made sense, while your attacks on him were basically like, "youre attacking me and I dont understand why". It just seemed more natural that someone with actual justification would want to put pressure rather than the person whos arguments were extensions of OMGUS. Also, I'm fairly sure that he didnt vote you, and simply put you in with his analysis of everyone, so your claims of him voting you and ignoring scummier things is false, making your attacks even sillier.

[Elias_the_thief]

If you think the vote for Matt_s was an OMGUS one or even an extension of this, then the silly are you. Really.

No, I am not saying it was OMGUS, just that it had an OMGUS element to it. More along the lines of "how can you not see this?" kind of reasoning.

This basically sums it up...perhaps it is not OMGUS per se, but it seems to be along the lines of "how can you find X not scummy, and find me scummy instead?", which I would say is related to the same underlying logic that supports OMGUS. Either way, I still find the addition of him to your list silly, as no ones alignment is known at this point. Having differing suspicions means nothing solid until the alignments are known.

[Elias_the_thief]

I thought I explained it pretty well when I analized every player...

[Elias_the_thief]

Limited activity until Friday, will be studying for the AP Euro History exam.

[Elias_the_thief]

checking in. CC is still scum, though I have yet to reread what has happened since I've been out. I hope to post extensively tomorrow as i'll be home all day for studying purposes (and thus i can spare some time for posting)

[Elias_the_thief]

So after the last few pages, Cream has climbed a few spots on my scumdar. The choice of attacking alvinz isnt all that wierd, but the point about noticing Matt S' "buddying" is pretty ot there. I'm not completely certain I few it as a scumtell yet, but the odd play has made me slightly more suspicious of him. The read is no longer neutral.

Now, to finish this post with an unexplained but in my opinion warranted

unvote, vote: MM

. That should shake things up a bit.

(i'll have personalized reasons later, but if you are really just hankerin' for some reasonin', see the last paragraph and specifically the last sentence sentence of post 272)

[Elias_the_thief]

Hmm. I should get caught up in this game.

[Elias_the_thief]

He doesnt need a prod, hes prob watching right now.

Seriously though, working on a detailed post. Chill.

[Elias_the_thief]

I'm gonna be gone until Monday.

[Elias_the_thief]

I posted in this forum earlier in order to avoid replacement. I have not been having a good time of it in RL. If you care, see that I've only been posting in response to prods for a while and the game I'm modding is briefly stalled. You can wagon me if you want but I should be back into it sometime over the weekend.

[Elias_the_thief]

unvote, vote Elias

uh...good posting? working on the reread right now guys.

[Elias_the_thief]

Thoughts II: A Continuation

Gaspode

: Hasn't posted much to change my opinion since last time I analyzed. I have a

town to neutral

read on him.

Iamausername

: Nothing he has done has made me think twice about my townish read yet. But he doesnt post that often. Meh, yay for hypocrisy. I have a

town

read on him.

EvilGorilaz

: Has had one or two really good posts over the last like ten pages. Needs to post more, but liking the stuff hes putting out there. So far, I have a

town

read on him.

MellowedMan

: Forgetting reasons = scummy. Every post being a vote or a push for a lynch or a request for reasons without ever providing his own = scummy. I thinkin

scum

(previously thought neutral).

Populartajo

: Not much of note since last major post. Seemed to be fishing for popular target in 407. Defense that nothing has changed is weak. Meh, so far a

neutral

read on him (was town to neutral).

CoheedCambria

: Still find him scummy, hasnt done much in the last like 10 pages. Then a Cop claim, whoa. Didnt see that one coming. I have a

scum

read on him (think it was neutral-scum before), but not going to lynch a claimed cop.

Cream

: Very odd comment as far as the buddying thing. Posts some useless noise and generally doesnt help with scumhunting. Attempting to fly under the radar. I have a

neutral to scum

read on him currently (was neutral previously).

Alvinz

: Who? Basically nothing up until page 16 so hard to read. Then a lot of wierd small posts. I have a

neutral to scum

read on him still.

Marmalade

: Not much in terms of posts. I have a

town to neutral

read on him (previously town).

Hypatia/Matt S

: Rolefished some (note: i was talking about question about evidence to skruffs, but the mason stuff is valid too). Conversation with Skruffs around 15 is dumb, and scummy. Waste of space and a distraction. Later discussion is better, the evidence point against him isnt that strong, rolefishing point makes me suspect him more though. I has

neutral to scum

read (previously neutral).

Ashmite/Skruffs

: Ok. Obviously I still find the play from Ashmite pretty scummy, but now I've got some more fodder for suspecting Skruffs as well. I really thought that his attack in 315 was a distraction more than anything. Especially after I read 338 from EG, which is a great post as it points out Skruffs inconsistency. The defense from it is pretty weak in my opinion. It doesnt explain why you completely changed your mind on the topic, depending on who's being pressured. Preferential treatment of scumtells in relation to players is always scummy in my book, unless you have a strong meta on the player. Also dont like the defense of MM. Skruffs, you know that wagons are good for discussion and helps to improve reads for all. What is the rationale for not jumping on one with a pretty scummy target? 363 is good posting though, for the first and second points. The third not so much. One, thats not exactly what matt was saying, and two, even it was those attacks wouldnt be necessarily strong, but by no means would they be invalid, and its just as likely to come from scum as town. Also, the demand for evidence is really less scummy then Skruffs makes it out to be.

neutral to scum

read on him.



Now guys...seriously we need to end this day really bad. 24 pages that no one wants to read, anything further without cold hard evidence is useless. My vote? I will keep it on MM. Not only is he extremely scummy, but his posts are COMPLETELY useless. Even if he is town, theres absolutely NO reason that we should be unhappy with his lynch. So let's just lynch MM and get it over with, k? k.

[Elias_the_thief]

Actually I meant to put a comment in there like that. Something like "trying to fly under the radar and failing". Good catch.

[Elias_the_thief]

So...MM claim?

[Elias_the_thief]

Can we try not derailing a good wagon because of a petty squabble? Obv distraction, kthxbai.

[Elias_the_thief]

One that I like. This one has a combination of good reasoning and good potential for info gathering if MM is forced to respond and claim. This squabbling is detracting from the fact that MM has done some scummy stuff and needs to be held accountable.

[Elias_the_thief]

One that I like. This one has a combination of good reasoning and good potential for info gathering if MM is forced to respond and claim. This squabbling is detracting from the fact that MM has done some scummy stuff and needs to be held accountable.

The impetus of both you and evilgorillaz seems to be to get MM to claim, and that's about all. Why?

It is more efficient to focus on one major suspicion at a time, in my experience, and MM is my current top suspect. I'm not COMPLETELY focused on the claim though. I've also mentioned how I would like a response in general. I can't really speak for EG, or why you're making such a big deal of my attack, I feel its pretty well reasoned. Why have you been trying to detract from the wagon over the last couple pages, and why are you unhappy that people want a claim?

[Elias_the_thief]

I'm neutral about people wanting a claim.

I'm more interested in why getting a claim (and not, say,s cum hunting) is your prime objective at this time.

How is interest in getting a claim from someone you suspect not part of scum hunting exactly?

[Elias_the_thief]

Skruffs once again stops the progress and detracts from MM wagon. Noted. Also, this is by no means a quicklynch. Unless you consider two months quick.

MM, if you think theres no case on you go read my posts.

[Elias_the_thief]

Eh, the wagon hasnt been going on that long obviously, but its still certainly not a quicklynch. But the point is mute, you meant quickhammer, and yes tajo is suspicious for pressing the hammer. But I would still like that claim from MM, and I would like to finish with this before moving on.

MM: this is not a quicklynch. Notice how you have yet to be hammered? Notice how several players have posted since the -1? Yeah. Thought so. Also, these are the tells I've laid against you, written in nice fancy terms so you have something solid to attack:

1.

Lurking in plain sight, ie posting a lot and contributing nothing useful or readable, an excellent strategy for a mafioso, if no one notices

2.

Inconsistency. Forgetting your reasons indicates to me those reasons were nonexistent, or made up originally (characteristic of scum play, obviously)

3.

Votehopping/lynch-hungriness. You show clear intent on following and lynching the towns latest target several times. Not only does this help you as scum by supporting bad lynches, it can be used to distract from other, smaller issues surrounding buddies and generally to steer lynches without much effort.

4.

Hypocrisy. Demanding reasons while not providing your own is a no-no. This ties in to inconsistency.

[Elias_the_thief]

1) If it's so noticable, how is it excellent strategy? Oh wait, I'm a horrible player? OK, I agree in that aspect, knowing I've been lynched in 5+ games already as town.
2) That only occurred once, and it was probably a stretch anyway. I had a gut feeling Iamusername was scum for a little word, probably, and then after being away forgot what I was trying to say earlier.
3) I like to votehop in general. That doesn't really concur with scumminess. What if I just played the game, just voting people whenever I wanted, and sporadically? Would you lynch me then?
4) I've been called a hypocrite in games before. Ask Korts, and StrangerCoug. I can still demand reasons, as I like to read people's reasons too.

I am inconsistent, but the ways in which you envision them (these methods) need to be impregnated.

1) It's an excellent strategy either way really, even if youre noticed you can usually escape being lynched because no one has a read on you. But its obviously better if no one notices.
2) Once is enough for me. You didnt even say before it was gut, you said you forgot your reasons. Gut needs to stop existing as an excuse as its completely unverifiable and annoys the hell out of me.
3) Yes, I would lynch you then, as a policy lynch. If a player is lynched everytime they exhibit behavior that the community wishes to dsicourage, they are lynched on policy so they stop it. If you were known as a playstyle that only votehopped I'd support policy lynches against you. And I still find you scummy for this, but provide links to other games where you vote hop a lot.
4) Being a hypocrit before has nothing to do with now. Youre a hypocrit for different reasons, and its scummy independant of times youve been called it before.

[Elias_the_thief]

I didnt find that post from Gaspode that scummy.

[Elias_the_thief]

me neither, but i do appreciate how alabaska tries to set up a link before leading the wagon, I'll note that in the case that alvinz is lynched and scum.

[Elias_the_thief]

Well...claiming doctor was a gambit that CERTAINLY paid off there Mellowed. Well done!

Um...it actually did. Pulling the mafias kill away from real doc by claiming it yourself may cause your death but it seriously helps the town out.

[Elias_the_thief]

I will have a detailed post later today explaining exactly why this connection case is retarded and probably lead by scum tajo. tata for now.

[Elias_the_thief]

I will have a detailed post later today explaining exactly why this connection case is retarded and probably lead by scum tajo. tata for now.

Lulz. Retarded FTW again? This should be fun. I want my revenge.

At the expense of the town?

[Elias_the_thief]

thanks for speculation on the doc, that certainly helps town out a lot.

[Elias_the_thief]

I will have a detailed post later today explaining exactly why this connection case is retarded and probably lead by scum tajo. tata for now.

Lulz. Retarded FTW again? This should be fun. I want my revenge.

At the expense of the town?

You know Im not scum Elias.
If you were town you wouldnt suspect me. And you dont need a detailed post to say why that connection is retarded and why I am scum, unless you exactly dont know what to say.

by detailed i mean more than two sentences and I'm too busy to write it now i have a chem final tomorrow and studying takes precendence, ive just been on the site once in a while to check on things. Thinking youre scum makes me scum? How does that one work?

[Elias_the_thief]

I dont have time for the extensive post I wanted. However, the initial attack is easily explained as a newbie mistake, the times when he goes back and exaggerates are clearly caused by the fact that hes taking heat for calling me suspicious, the obvious response is to take it all back, which is what he did. Those posts are a result of backpedaling scum, and have nothing to do with a supposed relationship. This is almost insanely obvious if you read back, which is why its scummy of you to push this as a case. It is also scummy of you to push this because a connection case without any evidence of the supposed partner whos alive being scum is unreliable, the evidence is completely unreadable as it could be buddying up or actually showing a relationship. Present a decent case independant of connections and then you might have an inkling of a case. As it stands pushing this as lynchworthy is ridiculous, and for a player of your caliber, scummy. The fact that you thought Alvin was town yesterday is just about as reliable as the case youre pushing on me.

[Elias_the_thief]

Wow, did anyone read what I posted about this case? About how his weird behavior is completely explainable by scum backpedaling from the pressure caused by the original action? Or the part where I talk about how its retarded to push a connection case with no reason to suspect me independantly, as it could very well have been buddying up to a town player? (as far as I'm concerned it was entirely backpedaling).

[Elias_the_thief]

Tell me one thing Matt. Can you have a read of a player that almost didnt play D1?
Ill post what Elias had to say about Alvinz.

Dont try to tell me anger is a scumtell. I'll hunt you down and kill you.

Also, I like Alvinz response.

This was probably a subtle way to support Alvinz and to give the impression that Cream was a possible good lynch.

Or, it was a genuine praise of a decent response. Are you telling me that you didnt think that was a good response? If I recall, there was at least one other person who said the same thing, possibly two. This is completely inconsequential.

Alvinz: Says he doesnt mind bandwagoning, next post fos's evil for bandwagoning. Contradict yourself much? Moves on to make some reaching attacks, specifically, about the Tajo-Marmalade connection, and his attacks on me for being a lurking IC. Backs off from initial attacks on me, defends himself *decently*, goes into useless squabble with Cream. I have a neutral to scum read on him.

Why the change of thought, Elias? Why is Alvinz now defenfing himself *decently*?

Because he made additional posts after the original response that were not as good? Again, completely inconsequential.

Alvinz: Who? Basically nothing up until page 16 so hard to read. Then a lot of wierd small posts. I have a neutral to scum read on him still.

Great. Nothing up until page 16 so hard to read.
Additonal fact. He never pushed Alvinz lynch although he was neutral.scum to him, instead he almost went full against Mellowed. I dont blame him for that but I feel he could have pushed Alvinz case better.
Add this to what Alvinz thougt about him and voila, what do you get?
Elias is a decent case. Period.

Um...I didn't push him because there were several players that I thought were scummier. This is your most retarded point yet.
"ZOMG WHY DIDNT YOU PUSH YOUR LIKE 4TH SUBJECT IS YOU SCUMBUDDIES?!"

Summary: genuine praise of a good response, followed by a genuine change of opinion after subsequent posts, followed by a failure to attack a suspect low on my list while attacking higher suspects. Is this honestly the best you can do? And listen: YOU CANT MAKE A LYNCH OFF OF A CONNECTION CASE ALONE, UNLESS YOURE A RETARDED TOWN OR SCUM. FIND SOMETHING SCUMMY ABOUT ME INDEPENDANT OF CONNECTION AND THEN I MIGHT SAY YOU HAVE A CASE.

[Elias_the_thief]

Elias you know this isnt going to work twice.

Just noting how retarded you'll look if I'm lynched.

1. Do you sincerely think that even if Alvinz had said "Elias is my 90% possible scumpartner" we should ignore him? Come on, read his posts and how they involve you. Its a DECENT connection.

Try to pay attention. I never said anything about ignoring the connection you are attempting to construct. His posts are almost indisputably the result of backpedaling independant of me. Even if they werent, you havent shown any strong argument as to how I connected myself to him. As I said before, lynching on connection cases alone is retarded. Its called buddying up, and retarded townies such as yourself are why it works.

2. Its hard to make a case against you when all D1 you have a)lurked to boredom b)write general comments about everyone and c)only push one case, conveniently.

You admit its hard to make a case against me. If this doesnt seal how contrived this attack is I dont know what will. My "general comments" were in depth analysis of every player in the game. If you can't make a case from that, maybe it shoult tell you I'm town. As for my lurking, I'd like to point out that I was doing so as a result of a combo of finals and RL issues, and while I'm not going into details, I'd like to point out that youre a complete douchebag for suggesting otherwise.

My point is that Alvinz was a heavy suspected player. WHy not going after him if you thought he was a decent lynch? In fact, why not commenting anything about him in the last stage of the game? How convenient, lurking again.

I dont recall calling him a decent lynch, firstly. Secondly, I HAD HIGHER SUSPECTS. Youre basically suspecting me for NOT following the crowd? You are a complete idiot. Again. RL issues, you asshole.

3. Why so overdefensive, huh? Disliking my logic much?

Yeah, go suck a dick. My defense has been perfectly in proportion to your attack, this is my standard playstyle, and overdefensiveness isnt a scumtell. Your logic is terrible though. You're basically suggesting the same points over and over again and hoping that no one notices thats I've defeated them.

4. What do you think of Skruffs?

I think I need to reread.

[Elias_the_thief]

I will have a detailed post later today explaining exactly why this connection case is retarded and

probably lead by scum tajo.

Its called buddying up, and

retarded townies such as yourself

are why it works.

Which is it, Elias?

Undecided. Though leaning towards the latter, as the first post was before I'd read the case, and the latter is afterwards. And his attacks remind me of his attacks on me in the game he was talking about when he said "this isnt going to work twice".

username makes a good case on skruffs, but I still dont believe that a connection case is enough for a lynch. A connection of the unknown to the scum is much more damning than the other way around however, as it cant be just buddying up

[Elias_the_thief]

Why do you want to know what lynch everyone else is into? Trying to figure out which way to push? I seem to recall you jumping on my wagon pretty strongly earlier, why back off now?

[Elias_the_thief]

Then why so interested in what others think, why not continue to search for evidence or try to defend the case I've destroyed?

[Elias_the_thief]

I sincerely dont see Cream-Alvinz.
I still think Elias is scum.

good for you tajo. good for you. But next time, try supporting it.

[Elias_the_thief]

I sincerely dont see Cream-Alvinz.
I still think Elias is scum.

good for you tajo. good for you. But next time, try supporting it.

LOL, I already did.
And you havent destroyed them for me. The Alvinz-Elias connection is IMO very powerful.

This explains why you stopped responding to the points I was making against it.

The only problem is that you're good at scum and that you'll always have an excuse but meh, time will tell.

I'm good at defense. I reduce things to nulltells. I do this as town and scum. I'll always have an excuse because no case is ever truly that strong in the game of mafia if you know how to manipulate perception. Thats just how I play, get used to it.

One question, when did Alvinz stop being town for you?
Just curious, am I still scum?

I'd have to go reread to pinpoint a certain time or post number. I was out of the game for long periods of time so its not like I saw all of his posts as they happened, but all of them at once as I read through, so no in depth analysis of posts as they came. I'll get to rereading eventually.

[Elias_the_thief]

Already sent to the mod, but figured I'd post here too.

Starting monday, I'll be working at an overnight summer camp, and I'll probably only be able to post on weekends. If this is a problem, I can understand and will accept replacement, though I'd like to stay in the game. Sorry for the inconvenience.

I'm home now until sunday because of unforeseen medical problems, but due to the circumstances I won't be able to post exactly (I'll be heavily sedated most of the next couple days). So yeah. Just thought everyone should know I'll be inactive.

[Elias_the_thief]

wow i actually had a post ready to go from rereading and was ready to post it when I realized I was dead. Im a tad pissed off that I never recieved a prod last weekend when I was home and had completely forgotten about this game, and Im even more pissed off that I wasnt informed when I died so now I went and wrote up this post for no reason. Needless to say I will be saving my post for after the game in notes and posting it then.

Also, go town. You'll clearly need it, the way you're going.

[Elias_the_thief]

Im a tad pissed off that I never recieved a prod last weekend when I was home and had completely forgotten about this game, and Im even more pissed off that I wasnt informed when I died so now I went and wrote up this post for no reason.

Neither of those things are a mod's responsibility. It's your responsibility to remember what games you're playing in, and to know whether you're alive or not.

A prod was requested on me and you never gave it. This implies to town that I'm ignoring the prod. If a prod is requested (which it was) it is indeed your duty to provide one.