Open 562.1: C9++ endgame

[reinoe]

Confirm.

[reinoe]

Gameplay keep your personal vendetta out of the game.

VOTE: Venrob

For completely duping me last game.

[reinoe]

vote: princess

bad RVS vote, RVS is over.

You rolled scum again?

VOTE: bjc

[reinoe]

I don't like gameplay. First, because he's annoying. Second, because it's too easy for scum to just say "gameplay is annoying" all game and never scum slip. Third, he's acting exactly like he is last game, except now he calls people "biatch" instead of "BITCH."

VOTE: gameplay.

these are terrible reasons and read like policy lynch to me but then again I know nothing of the last game

This is correct.

vote: Beck

Y'know bjc usually I can see where you're coming from, but this game I don't know what the hell you're doing.

[reinoe]

I can see your argument that your play is similar because as SK you try to play as though you are town, but I can also see that you can use that argument no matter what alignment you are. The argument does mean that their argument in itself is not valid, though it does not make you seem any more town. Their calling you scum is invalidated by your argument, but it is more null then town because the argument works regardless of alignment. You are null for me at the moment.

This had townish vibes.

[reinoe]

Bullishe's reasons really were bad. But they give me a feeling that they may be coming from a newbtown compared to scum. Yet there is more to see.
I don't get what's with the push on Beck btw. Imo she was active and tried solving things out.

Don't let that blind you

What: that Bullish' reasons are bad or that Beck might be trying to solve things?

[reinoe]

Actually I will do this. Elk's iso creeps me out.

VOTE: Elk

You do ISO's?

Posts 173, 174, 175 suggests that Gameplay can do more than play up a VI persona.

Gameplay what are your thoughts on Wolfy sheeping your vote?

[reinoe]

Bullish you're pissing and moaning about Gameplay after he's turned his game around.

VOTE: Bullish

[reinoe]

I'm vanilla.

any chance of a reads list before you go? (apart from me being scum of course)
any likely scum on your wagon?

Sorry. No reads whatsoever. That's one of the reasons I'm asking to be replaced.

Are you coming back from some sort of hiatus? Your replace out reeks of scum motivation. The fact that you also have no reads reeks of scum too.

[reinoe]

^This is the type of senseless clusterfckery I was talking about. If this is SOP on this forum, I'm sorry but I don't get it.

but ""WHAT"" is senseless about it? It's remarkable how even during this time you're not contributing. I'm genuinely trying to understand you.

1) If you are coming back from a hiatus then it totally makes sense that you're not up to speed with things or your rusty.

2) I'm explaining exactly what's scummy about your behavior and your counter is that it's "clusterfuckery".

I'm pretty sure my vote is going to be parked. I don't think a replacement can rehab the slot.

[reinoe]

Just from the last few pages...

HavingFitz(by far the one of the best players here imo)

Being good at the game is NOT a town-tell. Try again.

Bullish's replace out was soooo scummy at first, but I'll buy his explanation for now.

gameplay is still impossible to read.

reinoe is way too agressive in some posts and I don't like it.

More to come.

ok, why do you buy his explanation "for now"? It's not like he's going to have a chance to go over it again later. The "for now" is just weird.

Certain people do have playstyles that are hard to read. You were able to get a read on gameplay slight read on gameplay last time. What changed?

Examples of me being "way too aggressive". For added lulz be sure to compare them to other posts made this game from other players when doing so. Your statement looks like soft-pressure in light of wolfy "gut scum" read and bjc's sheeping of the "gut scum read". Like it looks like you're trying to set up a counterwagon.

[reinoe]

Bullish, if you aren't going to give a final list of reads and you are seriously requesting replacement, stop posting.

asking me questions

Questions like "where's your final reads list".

[reinoe]

Squirrel girl replaces Bullish.

Yay! Squirrelgirl likes nuts you guys.

[reinoe]

Waiting for SquirrelGirl's reads list.

Also bjc, are you on V/LA or not?

[reinoe]

Reinoe & fitz - why are you just waiting for stuff to happen ? Why aren't you trying to be proactive?

I'm experimenting with changing my playstyle each game. Taking a reactive approach to the game is part of the experiment for this particular test. If you have further questions feel free to ask.

[reinoe]

Links to games where you have talked about this.


as town unless you aren't very good, there's no reason to change what works.

Talked about it? nope. I'm just doing it. Peruse my wiki and you can see the playstyle changes yourself.

[reinoe]

The main reason I was voting for Bullish pre-replacement was that he appeared to be using excessively forced hostility as an attempt of giving us a "bad reason" to lynch him, so that he could then argue that we weren't lynching him for a good reason. I.e. trying too hard to give himself an out.

I also find it more likely that scum would replace out in such a position than town.

I have never seen scum to be more or less likely to replace out than town - are you actually saying if he ahd been town he would not have replaced out? How do you figure that?

Look forward to your reads SG.

Already offered some reads, looking forward to your feedback on them.

Waiting for SquirrelGirl's reads list.

I didn't promise a reads list - but I've already offered two scum reads and a town read and have now voted, would you like to talk about any of those with me?

Sure...
Would you expand upon your BeastCharizard's scum read? Like just outline your case. What is your opinion of Venrob and bjc?

[reinoe]

Playing D&D. Will catch up this evening.

[reinoe]

Phone posting.

bjc is active in other areas and not here. This is a style of bjc that I've never seen as town or scum.

[reinoe]

Scum aren't the only ones who have fun at night...

Prostitute
I suppose there is another reason for a townie to get excited about the night phase...

[reinoe]

Scum aren't the only ones who have fun at night...

While I sorta agree, I would also like to point out that Squirrelgirl fingered Beast as scum.

[reinoe]

Oh great the day is over by the time i come on here to do something of some meaning. And at that, a bad lynch has happened. Just great.

Hey squirrelgirl, what do you think about this post? Especially in light of the almost non-existent reason for the vote on your slot to begin with.

Yay d1 bandwagons!!

VOTE: bullish

I counted first- that puts him at L-2.

Yes, he unvoted, but to say it's a "bad lynch" is a little over the top here. Bullish really scummed up your slot and you've done some things to rehab it, I wouldn't call it a bad lynch because you could simply be a more skilled/patient player.

There are too many weird reactions going on in light of the "not hammer".

UNVOTE:

[reinoe]

Reinoe could you tell me again why you unvoted?

There are too many weird reactions going on in light of the "not hammer".

UNVOTE:

[reinoe]

New and upgraded Votecount

wolfy(1): beastcharizard
Squirrel Girl(5): Beck, Elmo TeH AzN, gameplay506, theelkspeaks, Wolfy
Beck(2):

Mafia 1-shot Fruit Vendor,

Princess Bubblegum
Venrob(2): havingfitz, The Bulge
beastcharizard(1): Squirrel Girl
Not Voting(2): reinoe, Venrob

With 13 alive it takes 7 to lynch.

Deadline is in (expired on 2014-08-02 22:30:00)

Welcome bjc's replacement! I don't care for apples. I hate having to eat around the core. I want blueberries, some seedless grapes, and bananas.

[reinoe]

Oh wait, that's the real name not a typo?

[reinoe]

Venrob is now a scum read of mine.

Why?

Venrob's ISO is full of time wasting garbage.

[reinoe]

Why are you answering for her?

It feels good to see the same thing someone else sees.

[reinoe]

VOTE: SquirrelGirl

With only an hour left 'till deadline I do not believe SquirrelGirl has done enough to rehab the slot.

[reinoe]

With only an hour left 'till deadline I do not believe SquirrelGirl has done enough to rehab the slot.

What would you have liked to have seen to 'rehab' the slot?

Strong town play to overcome your slot. Your play has had a "null" feel which isn't enough to overcome the "I want Bullish lynched" feel of the previous slot holder.

[reinoe]

I demand a deadline extension until we know where the vote count is. NO vc since thursday and I have no clue who is voting who

This is actually a fair request. I second the motion.

[reinoe]

Beck/Squirrel what are your thoughts on lynching Venrob? He's my other scumread.

[reinoe]

VOTE: Venrob

People keep saying "there's no viable wagon alternative". Maybe there is and people just don't know it.

Sheep this vote if you think Gameplay and/or Squirrelgirl is town.

[reinoe]

Our chat is boring and it isn't contributive. So bye

Place a vote on Venrob on your way out.

[reinoe]

The fact that we've had three wagons stall at L-2, the third being when several players cried and screamed for an alternative to the first two, suggests to me that at least one of the wagons was on scum.

[reinoe]

Not a bad cop-clear choice.

Wolfy and Bulge...

Whom are your scumreads and why?

[reinoe]

Any sort of a case?

I think there was scum voting Venrob. I ruled out a bunch of people - basically everyone is either me or a pretty solid clear besides Reinoe and Beck. i mildly townread Beck - therefore I'm voting Reinoe. Wanna hop on?

Sooooo Squirrel how do you feel now when you know I am clear hah?

That you're not clear-clear but that I'm not going to vote you today.
Wanna vote Reinoe?

Ahh ok. Two things.

• 1) I wanted to see whom would ask for the case.
  
  2) I also wanted to see if anyone would sheep a caseless vote.

So you're using weak POE to say I'm scum? Without mentioning anything I've done scummy except saying "There was scum on the Venrob wagon". This seems oddly prophetic since...squirrelgirl was on the Venrob wagon...

Yeah I know I know OMGUS, but...

VOTE: SquirrelGirl

@TheElkSpeaks
Most of the people who were on the squirrelgirl wagon switched to Venrob but most of the people on the Gameplay wagon stayed on Gameplay. What are your thoughts on that?

@The Bulge
Do you think there's scum in the lurkers too?

[reinoe]

@Reinoe - your case against me seems to be the value of my case on you.The case you are using to justify your vote on me is...the same logic as my case on you. If your case on me is okay - why do you have an issue with my case on you?

Have you forgotten that I was scumreading Bullish and that your play had a "null" feel but not enough to overcome the scumminess of Bullish? Your case on me looks scummy...OMGUS vote.

The fact that we've had three wagons stall at L-2, the third being when several players cried and screamed for an alternative to the first two, suggests to me that at least one of the wagons was on scum.

S.G. your vote is coming out of nowhere with no buildup or trajectory. And you're claiming "POE" when there really isn't any POE to be had. Basically your vote and reason look fake and when you get called on it you're trying to claim that our cases are the same.

[reinoe]

S.G. your vote is coming out of nowhere with no buildup or trajectory. And you're claiming "POE" when there really isn't any POE to be had. Basically your vote and reason look fake and when you get called on it you're trying to claim that our cases are the same.

Are you serious?
Like, look at the names on that wagon - Wolfy, Venrob, Bulge, BC - and tell me again how I shouldn't be able to PoE it.
.

Your "POE" is weak because it could be used in any number of ways...

Take the gameplay wagon for example...

Beast is dead and Venrob is Vig so POE means Elmo is scum...

or

everyone else is voting for someone except gampley plus his unvote contributed to a no-lynch so by POE he's scum...

You "townread" Beck and exclude yourself. Your PoE is weak. Well I'm going to chill on this discussion for a bit and give other players a chance to comment.

Vote count

gameplay506(3): beastcharizard, Elmo TeH AzN, Venrob
Squirrel Girl(1): theelkspeaks

Venrob(6, L-1):

havingfitz, reinoe, Squirrel Girl, The Bulge, Wolfy, Beck
reinoe(1): Mafia 1-shot Fruit Vendor
Beck(1): Princess Bubblegum

Not voting: gameplay506
With 13 alive it takes 7 to lynch.
[/i]

[reinoe]

Honestly, we have so many hard lurkers, why is Fruit Vendor the option of choice?

Fruit vendor is actively posting in other areas.

VOTE: 1-shot fruit vendor

[reinoe]

Thinking about reading this game and joining the wagon for another short day.

Can you clarify what you mean by this?

[reinoe]

Ok here's the plan. Fruit vendor today reinoe tomorrow. The resistance of reinoe's wagon compared to how fast fruit went off is odd. So yeah

The resistance to reinoe's wagon? You mean defending myself from poorly applied PoE???

And the speed of Fruit Vendor's wagon is probably because he's actually doing a scummy thing.

[reinoe]

What is PoE?

Process of Elimination.

[reinoe]

I'm pretty surprised at the number of players who are willing to sheep a scumread squirrelgirl, based on a flawed PoE.

Hey wolfy and Gameplay...what do you think about these...

You're all scum. Like, the entire game.

I'm content with the lynch. My vote stays.

Gameplay remains scummy.

Vote: Wolfy

I am buying what Venrob is selling, regardless of the poor choice.

Do you think it's odd that squirrelgirl conveniently has so few townreads and has been pushing to lynch town players? And while you're at it weren't you both scumreading squirrelgirl?

[reinoe]

Spoiler:

"Being a rowdy rapscallion is all well and good for those rambunctious twins, but it's not proper behavior for a lady!" shouted Mr. Bonk.

"Indeed!" sighed Mrs. Bonk "After associating with those twins now my daughter, Slapper, is full of spunk!"

"There's nothing wrong with a lady full of spunk" growled Mr. Goolies, father of the Todger and Willy. "Slapper should get out more and not be cooped up inside all the time. Let her have some fun."

"Oh I beg to differ" said Mr. Bonk. "Your boys should stay away from our daughter!"

[reinoe]

I'm also seeing Elk as Town.

could lynch...

Squirrelgirl, Venrob

[reinoe]

Even though SG's PoE is ridiculous...

I think Venrob could be the serial killer...

VOTE: Venrob

[reinoe]

Another reason not to lynch Venrob is that there are a lot of lurky/unreadeble players. His shot every night can be extremelyyy helpful in sorting the game out. Like I was scumreading BC and his shot helped me.

Venrob has already shown that he's not going to shoot lurky players. He's going to do whatever the hell he wants. It's nice that shooting a townie helped you out but Beast was not universally scumread.

[reinoe]

I feel like I've walked into some sort of twilight zone.

We have a vig who didn't see fit to shoot either the Princess Bubblegum or 1shot fruit vendor slots last night, two slots that were hardcore lurking yesterday, and instead shot Beastcharizard. No offense to the current occupiers of those slots, but either of those would have been totally acceptable shots last night. Also...

You know whom else can influence this vigilante? The scum team. I wonder if they'll influence this vig to shoot townies.

Like this is ridiculous. Beast has already shown to be negative utility.

[reinoe]

I feel like I've walked into some sort of twilight zone.

We have a vig who didn't see fit to shoot either the Princess Bubblegum or 1shot fruit vendor slots last night, two slots that were hardcore lurking yesterday, and instead shot Beastcharizard. No offense to the current occupiers of those slots, but either of those would have been totally acceptable shots last night. Also...

You know whom else can influence this vigilante? The scum team. I wonder if they'll influence this vig to shoot townies.

Like this is ridiculous.

Beast

Venrob has already shown to be negative utility.

**FIXED** at the end there.

[reinoe]

I would like to point out how amazingly easy it was to get this wagon as opposed to Reinoe.
I'd like to see Reinoe dead.
Just saying.

Because the case on me is a Shitty PoE. And if a Wagon is "easy" it's more likely to be on town because there's scum on it. Thanks for accidentally proving I'm town and that Elk probably is too.

[reinoe]

I would like to point out how amazingly easy it was to get this wagon as opposed to Reinoe.
I'd like to see Reinoe dead.
Just saying.

Because the case on me is a Shitty PoE. And if a Wagon is "easy" it's more likely to be on town because there's scum on it. Thanks for accidentally proving I'm town and that Elk probably is too.

THE IRONY

Explain.

[reinoe]

She said your wagon was difficult. Using your logic, that makes you likely not-town.

Or that the case on me was shit.

It's time to YOLO this shit

UNVOTE: squirrelgirl

VOTE: theelkspeaks

[reinoe]

Bulge, could you hammer theelk so I can get shot tonight. It'll prove squirrelgirl is scum.

[reinoe]

Omg.riddle.you are an idiot.

You know throughout the first half of day one I considered you town, but since then that opinion has been chipping away.

Hopefully a fresh pair of eyes can revitalize the game.

[reinoe]

Phone posting. Content tonight after work.

[reinoe]

Least Scummy
reinoe
Wolfy
Angrypidgeon
TheBulge
MorphTheCat
gameplay
ElmoTehAZN
Riddleton
Most scummy

[reinoe]

Links to games where you have talked about this.


as town unless you aren't very good, there's no reason to change what works.

Talked about it? nope. I'm just doing it. Peruse my wiki and you can see the playstyle changes yourself.

Then why did you mention it this game?

It just felt right. Hard to abandon my "do random things" roots.

[reinoe]

Hmmm. Wolfy is town. I know that might sound redundant but it's worth mentioning again.

[reinoe]

bjc was scummy. 1-Shot fruit vendor was posting in other areas and ignoring this game which is hella scummy.

In post 791 you posted this...

Venrob is my main and only scum read at this point in time.

I have null reads on Reinoe and Gameplay.

Everyone else I can see as town for now.

And in 792 you posted this...

I am interested in lynching either

Venrob, Gameplay or Reinoe

today. In that order, but Venrob takes priority.

Which suggests that you're more interested in lynching people than developing reads. Gameplay hilariously called you out on this in post 793. So that's three different people in the same slot acting scummy. And yes I'm pretty sure you don't like my reads list because it lists you as the most likely scum.

You've done nothing to develop your reads. For example your read on gameplay and I went from null-reads to scum-reads based on what?

You haven't mentioned one thing I've done that's scummy: your just sheeping other player's reads (and they are also not mentioning what I've done that's scummy).

[reinoe]

Let me know if/when the massclaim happens. I'll be online until around 2pm PST. After that not until like 10pm PST.

[reinoe]

That was post #791. I have obviously developed my reads on you and Gameplay since then.

You've done nothing to develop your reads. For example your read on gameplay and I went from null-reads to scum-reads based on what?

Have you not read my posts?

You haven't mentioned one thing I've done that's scummy: your just sheeping other player's reads (and they are also not mentioning what I've done that's scummy).

I apologise; that was more laziness on my part really, but my case on you is no different to other users. I'll post my case on you later, if you wish.

Yes I'd appreciate that.

[reinoe]

Guys massclaim now! It may be LYLO and we need to find this out now!

Did you post a claim order?

TBF, I thought Wolfy was going to post it.

[reinoe]

I've already said I think Riddleton is scum.

[reinoe]

I've already said I think Riddleton is scum.

He still hasn't returned the favor and explained why I'm scum though. It's like he's been calling me scum for no reason...

[reinoe]

still waiting for that Riddleton case...

[reinoe]

still waiting for that Riddleton case...

Please have some patience. I'm writing it up as well as replying to some posts here as well. Would you be OK waiting another hour?

OK. I'm not used to people posting and building a case. <----Not Sarcasm btw.

[reinoe]

I'm really starting to think Gameplay is scum.

[reinoe]

I'm really starting to think Gameplay is scum.

I mean I thought GP was scum before but I think he's cornered scum.

[reinoe]

VOTE: Gameplay

[reinoe]

Well I'm headed to work. I won't be able to add anything until much later tonight.

[reinoe]

Zmuffin/vezok....

Could you delete everything related to my confession in the scum qt?

[reinoe]

Normally I hide my online status but I made it public so my teammates would know I'm online and ready to hammer.

[reinoe]

I still don't understand why I was killed.

You were killed because Venrob should never be given a gun.

[reinoe]

I'll agree that your lynch was bad, but I would also say I thought you shooting BC was an equal level of bad.
I'll agree reinoe should have seemed more obvious as scum. Maybe I just need to work on getting sheep, I dunno

But nobody was able/willing to say why I was scum. That was kinda tripping me out.