Open 395: Carbon-14 (Game Over-Scum Victory)

[Lastsurvivor]

VOTE: Chrimi

Because I'm butthurt about our last game together and he reminds me of that.

Oh hey, both Chrimi and Elmo are here. This is almost like a newbie 1206 reunion!

[Lastsurvivor]

...

Why vote me over him? D:

VOTE: Lastsurvivor
For being butthurt.

Elmo never voted for me IIRC (I'd have to look through the caches to find out). :3

Why the switch to Chimera? A vote on me not good enough for ya?

[Lastsurvivor]

You too good to answer my question, Chrimi?

[Lastsurvivor]

Lol.

I switched because you already had a vote on you, and because Chimera sounds cooler than my name and I want it D:

...What

You were the first person to vote me.

Yup I like my vote where it is.

[Lastsurvivor]

Sorry for the double post. <_<

Emp do you think he's doing the same thing I did last time we played this?

Elaborate for those of us who weren't in the game?

[Lastsurvivor]

Because I pay so much attention to RVS...

So you just weren't paying attention and thought that someone voted me, is what you are trying to say? Yeah, sorry, I'm calling BS.

You voted me in the fourth post of the game. The previous three posts were all short posts. Somehow, I'm seriously doubting that you weren't paying attention up until that point. I think you just made up that reason on a whim and unfortunately were caught in a lie. Come up with a logical excuse please, Chrimi.

[Lastsurvivor]

I don't make excuses.

*yawn*

VOTE: LastSurvivor
For being even more butthurt than originally anticipated.

You don't make excuses? Then what do you call your explanation for why you switched?

I switched because you already had a vote on you, and because Chimera sounds cooler than my name and I want it D:

Certainly looks like an excuse to me. ^.~

Oh, and this has nothing to do with newbie 1206. If I were really butthurt about it, I'd be holding a grudge against Uber, not you. I just find it awful that you lied and instead of doing any actual explaining, you just shrug it off with "Lol I don't pay attention in RVS!!" when RVS had barely begun.

And now you're...voting me? Why? Hoping that I'll go away? Because I won't.

---

Just so everyone's clear why I'm voting Chrimi.

a) He lied about why he unvoted me (see post 21).
b) He defended himself by saying he wasn't paying attention (see post 33). That's hard to believe because he voted me in the fourth post of the game (see post 8). I doubt that all the words in those three posts strained his attention span so much that he thought someone voted for me.
c) Chrimi is now voting me, for no given reason other than the fact that I'm "butthurt." Even if I was butthurt, that's not really indicative of alignment.

The first two points I've already brought up and, IMO, Chrimi could refute them easily if he were town. He hasn't though. :/

[Lastsurvivor]

Those who have not spoken about Chrimi should do so ASAP. :-)

[Lastsurvivor]

Lastsurvivor, getting a quick mislynch already this far into the game huh?

I didn't see a lynch happen. Strange. I'm not intending on quicklynching you either.

And that vote above was

still

RVS.

Your vote for me was a random vote? Somehow I doubt that as well, mainly because...I was attacking you. So there must have been

some

motivation for the vote, no? I seriously doubt it was 100% random.

I haven't said anything seriously since this game started.

Yes, I've noticed that. I'm not sure how that makes you a townie though.

Although, taking action on the first opening you see and attacking it and somehow getting somebody to L-2 at page 2, not giving everybody to do any notes or anything.

Hmm, I'm not seeing how this is scummy. You're not making sense. If no one took any action on the first opening they saw, we'd be in RVS for another two pages and a few days. I'm not sure how that's scummy; is it only because you're the target? Also, the other person voting for you (Empking) voted without my prodding. So I'm not sure how you could say that I got you to L-2.

And what does "not giving everybody to do any notes or anything" mean? I'm assuming you mean "not giving everybody [the opportunity]"? If so, I still don't see the point. People can still take notes out of the interactions going on. You haven't been lynched yet.

[Lastsurvivor]

That's why you voted and got me up to L-1 before page 1 was done. Sounds like pushing for a mislynch asap to me.

I voted you, yup. Please prove how I was personally responsible for you getting to L-1.

You did by making these points early in the game, and letting the scum jump on to the bandwagon. Being closed minded, you didn't even notice them and continue to tunnel me.

Wait, am I scum or am I not scum? You're voting me for allegedly trying to ML you, but here you're saying that I made the early points and "let scum jump on the bandwagon." From your "townie" perspective, shouldn't I be the scum on the bandwagon? Also, how is making points early on in the game scummy? Should we all just twiddle our thumbs and RVS vote each other for 100 posts before we start making points? You really need to explain this one to me.

*le sigh*
I'm meaning that you pulled us out of RVS to be tunneling me instead, and not even worrying about the fact that I was at L-1 for a bit. Just keep on tunneling.

Why should I be worried? Clearly others see what I see.

But in all seriousness, dull skepticism is noted towards the rise to L-1. But when it only takes four to lynch, it's not really that surprising that someone got to L-1 in RVS. But feel free to keep on using dat rhetoric/buzzwords!

So anyways, really, as in, for real, what's your reason for voting me?

Because I can't see it yet. I can't see a very serious reason for you to be voting me. As in, I don't see how your tunneling is helping town.

You lied about why you switched your votes and instead of explaining why you've been skirting around the issue. Your case on me is lame; anyone can tell from a mile away that you don't believe it. You can't decide if I'm scum or town. ETC.

[Lastsurvivor]

I don't have a case on you to be lame, though.

You don't?

Although, taking action on the first opening you see and attacking it and somehow getting somebody to L-2 at page 2, not giving everybody to do any notes or anything.

So, looks like my vote is staying.

Yeah, you were pulling for a mislynch very early into the game.

How about you stop crying that you're being mislynched and do something about it. Start actually defending yourself, scumhunting etc. If you're actually town, you're just wasting valuable time by screwing around. But since you keep on contradicting yourself (LS is scum, LS is helping scum BW me, LS is scum for reasons X, Y, I don't have a case on LS, etc) I somehow doubt it.

[Lastsurvivor]

OMG THE WIFOM!

Is that at me? If it is I don't know where I WIFOM'd but it wasn't intentional and I'm sorry. :[

This makes me happy.

Those who haven't taken a firm stance on Chrimi should do so ASAP!

[Lastsurvivor]

LV, I don't think Chrimi has done a whole lot to be called scummy yet. RVS can be used to find scum, but I don't think him saying you already had a vote on you when you didn't is what should make him scum.

It's his behavior afterwards that's bothering me. I've already explained what he's done, but in general he just keeps on contradicting himself. He's not taking my case seriously, nor his own against me really.

Emp's vote is objectively bad, but since he did it on my top scumspect I have a hard time finding it scummy.

[Lastsurvivor]

Chrimi's the scummiest player so far. But obvs I don't want him quicklynched. When Chrimi flips scum we'd still be screwed because we'd have no associative tells to go off of, so...yeah.

No a Chrimi/Emp team is not likely. Quite frankly I want everyone to actually start participating in the thread before we start thinking about teams, but Chimera's on V/LA.

A Chrimi/Chimera team would be hilarious.

[Lastsurvivor]

Chrimi, you're not making sense again....

No one is seeing what you see because you can't decide if I'm scum or not and you keep on flip flopping.

Why exactly do those two posts justify you not taking my case seriously?

You still haven't addressed any of the points I've brought against you. It's not that hard.

You still haven't done anything to convince me to move my vote. Again, it's not that hard.

To quote something a great man once said:

How about you stop crying that you're being mislynched and do something about it. Start actually defending yourself, scumhunting etc. If you're actually town, you're just wasting valuable time by screwing around. But since you keep on contradicting yourself (LS is scum, LS is helping scum BW me, LS is scum for reasons X, Y, I don't have a case on LS, etc) I somehow doubt it.

[Lastsurvivor]

Chrimi, this is your call to stop screwing around and take this game seriously.

@Everyone else: No hammers please. Chimera needs to come back from V/LA before we do anything in terms of ending D1.

[Lastsurvivor]

When did I ever say I thought you were scum?

You're voting for me. o.O

So you're voting for someone you don't think is scum, then?

I don't take it seriously because I really don't see how you think I'm that scummy.

Alright. I'm gonna break this down into simple questions. Please answer them and don't blow them off.

a) You claimed that you "weren't paying attention" during RVS. What caused you to misinterpret the posts before my vote into thinking there was a vote on me?
b)

WHY

are you voting me? You've gone from saying that your vote on me was RVS but is now justified (which I take as meaning that you think I'm scum) to asking when you said you thought I was scum (which I take as meaning you never said I was scum). So, yeah. That's why I think you're "flip flopping." You can address why you flip flopped too, if you want, for bonus town points.

If you can answer these, I might unvote you. But you keep on screwing around and avoiding the question.

And I'll say this again.

NO ONE HAMMER UNTIL CHRIMI ANSWERS THESE QUESTIONS AND CHIMERA GETS BACK.

If anyone even implies intent to hammer I'll unvote to prevent it. Otherwise, I'm keeping my vote on.

[Lastsurvivor]

Hmm, why the unvote?

I'm not exactly displeased since now no one can quickhammer, but I expected it to come from Emp since you're the one that put him at L-1.

[Lastsurvivor]

b. My vote is on you because you're tunneling me and I really don't see anybody that sticks out in any scummy way. You don't seem like scum, but you're like 20% scummy vibes while nobody else has anywhere close, so *shrug*

You do realize you're tunneling me as well, right? :/

Anyway, this just sounds like you have OMGUS goggles on. You see me attacking you and you're just reacting by attacking.

Alright, so your mass of games confused you into thinking that I had a vote on me. Got it.
We've resolved that you think I'm scummy but only kinda. Got it.

New questions (please answer them and don't blow them off etc etc):

a) Why did you say you didn't have a case on me when you did?
b)

+points to Elmo for jumping off of a wagon instead of going for the easiest lynch.

From your perspective, who is the easiest lynch ATM?

[Lastsurvivor]

Oh sorry, by "from your perspective," I meant "excluding yourself."

So, excluding yourself, who's the easiest lynch ATM?

And I'm not sure what you mean by "otherwise it just fits into the kind of scummy stuff."

[Lastsurvivor]

Oh, that would be you, because if I felt you were scummy I could make a case based off of what I've seen, and nobody else has really posted enough or seems vulnerable at all.

That's what I thought you'd say.

So you've given Elmo town points for hopping off your wagon twice because it's the "easiest." Yet you're still on my wagon.

I find that hypocritical, don't you?

And the other kind of scummy stuff... If I mention it before I make a case out of it, then it's just gut feeling- not really anything I deem scummy enough to take note of.

I think we just have different definitions of the word case so meh.

[Lastsurvivor]

By "on my wagon" I meant "voting me." AKA, you're giving people town points for not taking the easy lynch. But you're more than willing to vote the person who's the easiest lynch to you.

I understand that you won't vote yourself, but that doesn't really change the fact that I'm still the easiest lynch to you (in fact, it's the only reason why I'm the easiest lynch to you). So now that we have a semantics issue out of the way, you must see it's hypocritical? Or at least explain why it isn't.

[Lastsurvivor]

Alright I want Chrimi to answer before I unvote, but I'm gonna look at the other players...

Also this might appear to be IIoA, but I'm too tired to do in depth analysis.

Chimera - V/LA, nothing useful in what he has posted.

Moneybags - Vehemently against the Chrimi lynch. And by that I mean like VEHEMENTLY. I don't think he's scum setting up for the "I told you so" though because of his post #74. I don't think even white knighting scum would go to that length to defer a lynch.
(Of course, there's always the possibility that Chrimi and Moneybags are on a team, but if Chrimi proves himself to be town that isn't possible)

Chrimi: Now that he's answering my questions, Chrimi's not too bad. But the hypocrisy issue still needs to be answered.

TvK: He's basically been parroting things others have said about Chrimi. I don't like it one bit, no, no, no. Scummy, scummy, scummy.

Empking: He thinks Chrimi is scum but doesn't really pressure Chrimi at all. I think he could be scum, assuming Chrimi's town.

Elmo: I dislike how Elmo put Chrimi to L-1 and then unvoted him because Moneybags asked. Also, post 81. Elmo finds it odd that Chrimi was put to L-1 twice. He was on the wagon that put Chrimi to L-1 the first time, and he actually put Chrimi to L-1 the second time. No, something is not right there indeed. But I would think Elmo would know what, if anything. Weak scum read compared to Emp/TvK, but one nonetheless.

[Lastsurvivor]

Ha its funny you think Im scum. Have you not learned anything from me before?

Unfortunately I've never seen your scum play, so I can't tell if you do stupid things as scum and town. :3

But srsly you're only a distant third read. No need to get your panties in a bunch.

UNVOTE:

TvK, who do you think is scum?

[Lastsurvivor]

Same question to Emp, although I'm thinking I know the answer based on his latest post.

[Lastsurvivor]

TvK did the parroting and such, and Emp just seems to have followed the wagon.

<.<

Don't make me vote you again.

------

Money, do you really think we were in danger of a quicklynch? I was doing all I could to make sure it didn't happen before I wanted it to. :/

TvK has been the most scummy, but he hasn't posted a lot. His most recent post (which I kinda glossed over) concerns me though.

His defense against me doesn't really address the point I was making. Also, he said that he didn't vote Chrimi because he would have received the reactions Elmo got. That just strikes me as overly cautious. Then he says that Elmo putting Chrimi at L-1 wasn't bad, and that he was considering it because no one would have hammered him. That, on the other hand, doesn't strike me as cautious. If TvK thought no one would hammer, then why not just put the vote down himself? Are the reactions of others really that debilitating?

Then there's the reads list. It contains one town read, one null read, and one "this doesn't say anything" read. Note the lack of scum reads.

I want Chimera to come back before I vote for TvK, though. I don't feel confident doing anything without Chimera.

[Lastsurvivor]

You don't have enough info to call someone scum? There are 113 posts of information here! I called Chrimi scum when there were fewer posts than that, and you seemed ok with it then.

Anyway, I guess you glossed over part of my last post. Can you explain your rationale for not voting Chrimi again?

[Lastsurvivor]

I'm shamefully not voting. :/

Has Elmo done anything else to make you think he's scum Emp?

[Lastsurvivor]

Both Emp and Elmo aren't making a lot of sense TBH. I don't see how you can use distancing to prove that someone's scum.

[Lastsurvivor]

Mm, I guess I see. I don't like how he framed the argument though. You putting Chrimi to L-1 then unvoting was scummy. But I don't think that Emp should call that "distancing" and use that as his major point against you. Just looks like a way to shoehorn a buzzword in.

[Lastsurvivor]

Mm, I guess I see. I don't like how he framed the argument though. You putting Chrimi to L-1 then unvoting was scummy. But I don't think that Emp should call that "distancing" and use that as his major point against you. Just looks like a way to shoehorn a buzzword in.

How would you put it?

Chrmi's last post is seriously bad though. Not sure if actually scummy though since neither should admit to not scumhunting and merely adding "some pressure".

I would have just said it like it is: Elmo putting Chrimi to L-1 and then taking him off was scummy. A distancing argument is an ineffective one to make because the people you're trying to convince have to accept that both Elmo and Chrimi are scum. And saying Elmo's distancing is a nice buzzword to use against him to make your argument look nice.

Chrimi's explanations for his actions convinced me that he's town for now at least. Should I not have been convinced, Emp?

TvK,

Anyway, I guess you glossed over part of my last post. Can you explain your rationale for not voting Chrimi again?

You missed this post. Also, what has Moneybags done to make you think he's not protown?

VOTE: TvK

Despite the...super duper buddying, Om is ok. TvK is a good vote. Transparency would help you a lot right now, TvK.

[Lastsurvivor]

Not feelin good about TvK's latest post..

1) Would Chrimi finally start answering questions if I put him on L-1?

What was your answer to this question, and how sure were you?

2) Was the case against him serious enough to risk an L-1 vote?

What risks are you associating with placing the L-1 vote?

And eventually my choice wasn't too bad as Elmo put in the L-1 vote and the only reactions he got didn't come from Chrimi, but from you and MoneyBags telling to not hammer and unvoting. And Chrimi still didn't take anything serious. It was only after some more of your questions that he finally started answering.

Ehh, gonna have to disagree. I think Chrimi took the votes against him seriously, but wasn't sure what to respond to. I never made that really clear to him (on purpose ofc) which points I wanted addressed and which ones I didn't.

What has he done to make me think he is pro-town? You tell me I'm parroting, but he hasn't said anything useful yet. He apparently was against the case against Chrimi, but never explained why. Now he is fine with the case against me, but hasn't yet explained why.

Do you think scum would make this post?


@Emp:

It's scummy because of how quickly he jumped off. It seems like me placed a L-1 vote but wasn't serious about it. He could have unvoted for many reasons (town cred, didn't want to be on the wagon in case someone hammered, etc), but distancing is not one that comes to mind. Here's the post where I mentioned Elmo as a scum read. My argument, I guess. No mention of distancing at all.

No its an argument for Elmo being scum, with your logic anything could require people to accept the accused to be scum.

It is an argument for Elmo being scum, but it's useless unless someone believes that both Elmo and Chrimi are scum. Elmo can't distance from a town Chrimi.

Anyway, since you ignored the question I asked you earlier, I'll ask again. Has Elmo done anything else that's scummy, Emp?

[Lastsurvivor]

Elmo's not really making a lot of sense in the Elmo/Om conflict. I doubt Om thought the wagon would escalate that quickly (3 people with an intent to hammer), and he even left a FoS on TvK before he did his reread. I believe that his read actually changed. Elmo's being quite opportunistic.

I'm not done with TvK yet though.

TvK,

I could also have placed a vote on him, but I know I would get the same reactions as Elmo got when he put him on L-1.

You never mentioned this part in your reexplanation of your vote. Was it not important?

Also, are your thoughts on everyone still the same that they were when you last mentioned it?

[Lastsurvivor]

At least Im generation discussion and putting people in awkward positions.

Ah, the good ol' "I'm generating discussion" rationale.

Anyway, while I agree with you that Om should have expected a wagon to form, I don't think it's reasonable for anyone to expect that someone would have already declared intent to hammer this quickly.

Chrimi declaring intent to hammer without a claim is quite bad too, now that I think about it. He's falling out of my good graces.

[Lastsurvivor]

Chrimi declaring intent to hammer without a claim is quite bad too, now that I think about it. He's falling out of my good graces.

Made me laugh.

I would only claim once somebody declares a hammer. That's why I declared, so we could get a claim out of him.

Since when did people claim when they were at L-1 but nobody had declared an intent?

You didn't ask him to claim though. You just declared intent. Also, why'd you declare intent two minutes after saying you weren't going to declare intent?

TvK, I've been attacking you for awhile now. Have you not been suspicious of me at all? I find it odd that I've been a town read of yours this entire time. :/

[Lastsurvivor]

I don't see why you'd be suspicious to him for attacking him.

Eh. In a mini normal (lost to the crash) I was in, I was attacking scum and while I was doing so he constantly mentioned I was a town read to him. Kind of like what TvK is doing.

[Lastsurvivor]

You didn't ask him to claim though. You just declared intent. Also, why'd you declare intent two minutes after saying you weren't going to declare intent?

I always thought that when somebody declares it's kind of a -duh- to claim.

The way I've always seen it is the person who declares intent to hammer either says nothing or asks the person to claim. But the way you said "Anyone have anything to add?" (paraphrasing) made it seem like your hammer was imminent.

And, if you go back and read the posts, I said I wouldn't declare "Just yet" because I hadn't read the recent things and the such.

Once I did, I saw the points still stood so then I declared.

You must not have read a lot then if you read it all and posted in two minutes...

Even if you read everything that happened since you last posted, two minutes is still awfully quick. Plus you had to think about whether or not you wanted to declare intent to hammer. And then you had to write the post...etc

Are you just a very fast reader?

---

Om's elmo case: I don't like the first post; it's a stretch. I like the second post and Elmo should reply to it (because I'll actually read it).

[Lastsurvivor]

I haven't read very carefully. I'm very overworked atm and probably will be for awhile, but I'll read better later on tonight. Just going to pick out some things.

@MB: There's a gajillion reasons for Elmo to unvote after you posted that. Town cred being the most obvious one. I guess you just fell for it?
@Chrimi: FTR my question to you in my last post wasn't rhetorical.
@TvK: Do you find Om's confusing play scummy?

I'll try to have something more substantial later but I can't make guarantees.

[Lastsurvivor]

I'll buy it for now.

Alright, looking over MB, he has been kind of iffy. I'm still not willing to vote him though because of this post.

Those who are voting MB or think he's scummy: Tell me why this post isn't townish. Personally, I think that MBscum would not go to this lengths for town cred. With a post that fierce, it would definitely jeopardize the lynch.

So tell me why I'm wrong and you might have my vote.

[Lastsurvivor]

Yeah, you personally think. Scum can do anything to get town cred. Even if it means not lynching a potential mislynch candidate.

I mean I guess. But is the reward (town cred) really worth derailing a ML for? And it's not like he was subtle about it and setting up for the "I told you so," when Chrimi got lynched. He guaranteed that there would be no Chrimi lynch.

I dunno it doesn't seem smart to me. Do you think that it was smart scum play for MB to make that post?

And @ your meta thing: Nope, not convinced. We don't have a scum game to compare it to. You're really stretching this.

[Lastsurvivor]

Heh, for some reason I saw the me being lynched talk and thought I was already dead.

Maybe that's just what I subconsciously want. :<

The only thing I dislike about Om is that his cases are shit. But, tbh, my cases are shit too sometimes so it's not necessarily a scumtell.

I considered the whole derailing the wagon on his scumbuddy thing but, tbh, I can't see a MB/Chrimi team.

TBH, I don't even think that highly of the MB Chrimi wagon derail post. I just wanted Om to take a stand. It wasn't that impressive.

[Lastsurvivor]

Was going to say something, but I'll wait for Om/TvK's responses before I do.

Just know that I'm looking forward to it you two.

[Lastsurvivor]

And I hate it when someone can just go "WELP, OMGUS!" and completely render a case useless. It shows there's no retort.
If I was OMGUS don't you think I would of been doing this a lot sooner? You've been voting me a couple days now.

+1

Anyway, I was going to say that Om's BW hopping isn't necessarily scummy since he was going within his suspect list, but Om's reaction is not good. Not good at all..

[Lastsurvivor]

Holy shit Om. If you're town, then you need to relax. Take a break for a little bit, alright? It's pretty obvious that you're not thinking clearly.

[Lastsurvivor]

@LS: Take another look at my attacks on Moneybags, and his attacks on me. Who do you think has put more effort into their attacks and is trying to discern the other person's alignment from it? Now tell me who do you think is the scum in the argument.

Honestly I'm trying to figure out if this is even a town/scum argument.

You've both put in effort, and alignment discernment is hard to tell since MB just made the case. You have though, I guess.

But your definitely flailing and if you're town it's not helping you out right now. You're not helping yourself by shouting out jibberjabber and contradicting yourself.

[Lastsurvivor]

PEDIT: Yes it clearly is helping, it stopped you from mindlessly jumping on my wagon and mislynching me, and now you're actually paying attention to what I'm trying to say.

A calm, collected reaction would have helped more... :/

Considering that I found MB's case lackluster, I would not have mindlessly mislynched you. Your reaction is what's killing you. I just don't understand why you're doing it. This isn't scumhunting overdrive mode or whatever you're calling it. It's just flailing.

It's not like anyone declared intent to hammer (nor have they). "Scumhunting overdrive" wasn't required. The noose wasn't close to your neck.

A good break would help you collect your thoughts and relax, but you're not taking my advice so meh.

[Lastsurvivor]

Om, how does one drop a scum read...?

[Lastsurvivor]

I dislike the misrepping, Chrimi. :S

[Lastsurvivor]

Om, how does one drop a scum read...?

[Lastsurvivor]

I'm kinda stuck on what to do in this game :/

Om's defense isn't that good but I'm not sure he's scum :S

[Lastsurvivor]

I'm torn. Om's reaction hasn't been that great, but MB's case is fairly lacking. Personally, I feel like Om should be able to blow that case out of the water. The fact that he restored to saying that he wouldn't be afraid to bus his buddies is worrying.

Sure intent to hammer. Claim etc.

And I'm not gonna hammer today probably so just stay relaxed Om while you're claiming.

[Lastsurvivor]

Well that was an interesting turn of events..

It'll help. I want to see if I'm right.

Chrimi what did you want to see you were right about

[Lastsurvivor]

Guys, new theory:
Moneybags and Chrimi are scum, and Chrimi agreed with Moneyscum's case to try and get everyone to think it's a good case and lynch me for it.

It makes perfect sense.

This.

P-edit: My apologies, I was referring to Om, thought he was the one asking for some reason.

Was this supposed to be a reply to me?

[Lastsurvivor]

I will not be hammering Chirmi. I think a NL would be better than a misslynch.

That's not true, but this is not the time to talk theory.

And Chrimi what does that quote prove exactly? ._.

[Lastsurvivor]

You mean Om? D:

[Lastsurvivor]

Chrimi, claim. Intent to hammer. I'm not gonna hammer tonight since I'm leaving soon...

[Lastsurvivor]

Oh wait you're not even at L-1.

Ignore that then.

It was basically compromise etc. But I'll see where to place my vote now

[Lastsurvivor]

I'm here. Deciding what to do.

I will not be quickhammering whoever I decide. Unfortunately I think both of you could be scum for different reasons which just makes this all the harder.

[Lastsurvivor]

IDK. What I meant was I'm gonna allow whoever I choose to say whatever (or claim if I choose Chrimi) and not just hammer unannounced. If I don't have time then I'll hammer, but I'm willing to go to the wire.

[Lastsurvivor]

I thought Om was town before he started flailing. But flailing isn't really a scumtell. He should have been able to blow MB's case out of the water, but if he was really panicking then I dunno if he'd be able to.

I feel like Chrimi was trying to incite Om though. Posts like this or this are just trolly or snarky respectively. There's a definite cocky overtone that's different than his usual posting.

This misrep is bad :/. Chrimi tried to justify it by saying he was V/LA which isn't a good excuse.

Oh and his behavior now has just been erratic. After I conveniently got Om to claim, he voted TvK, then "accidentally" voted Elmo then went back to Om. He said Om's reaction to his impending lynch was very townlike as well, so I'm wondering if Chrimi was being genuine when he thought that.

I have a sneaking suspicion that the Elmo vote was intentional. But I can't really prove that well.

So...I guess my mind's made up. Chrimi, claim etc.

[Lastsurvivor]

CCs?

[Lastsurvivor]

Chrimi have you soft claimed cop anywhere?

[Lastsurvivor]

By soft claim I mean breadcrumbed etc

[Lastsurvivor]

I'll hammer Om if Chrimi goes Un CCd.

I saw TvK in the who is online thing so I'm assuming he's not CCing. Same with Elmo...

[Lastsurvivor]

Everyone except Emp and Elmo is accounted for...

I don't think Emp's gonna post, but Elmo should just for confirmation.

[Lastsurvivor]

Aight. That's everyone save Emp. So if he's the cop then that's a whoops...but I'm not hammering an Un CCd cop with good conscience.

Om anything else you wanna say? I'm gonna go but I'll be back in a little bit.

[Lastsurvivor]

Chrimi

...No one has said anything about lynching you.

[Lastsurvivor]

Well, to be fair...

Your behavior during the Om wagon was pretty bad.

How long should I wait to see if Om wants to say something..

[Lastsurvivor]

DUN DUN DUNNNN

Why?

[Lastsurvivor]

Is your problem that I was asking you to claim when you weren't at L-1? Or that I had a crap reason for voting you?

Tbh I didn't really realize that Elmo unvoted because...he had no real reason to. I'm not sure you realized either, since you didn't shout out "DUDE YOU CAN'T EVEN HAMMER ME" until the VC came out.

And I was writing a reasons post similar to the post I posted when I asked you to claim this time (with less stuff). But since I wasn't going to vote you I just wrote down a more basic reason (Compromise).

Problems?

[Lastsurvivor]

Imma vote in 10 unless anyone objects.

[Lastsurvivor]

O_o

You've gotta be kidding me.

Elmo why are you not voting Om.

[Lastsurvivor]

@MHORK

Elmo voted Om here: http://forum.mafiascum.net/viewtopic.ph ... 6#p4029546

Yes he did.

[Lastsurvivor]

Because it was between you and Om and you were scummier than Om. See here for why.

I'm not sure what you're asking really. :/

[Lastsurvivor]

Why are you even defending yourself? You're the un CC'd cop. I already know I was wrong about the case.

[Lastsurvivor]

Anyvay I'm gonna hammer in 10 (again).

[Lastsurvivor]

VOTE: Om

Aaaannddd that's D1.

[Lastsurvivor]

It's obvious we have mafia and not wolves imo.

...Possibly. Of course, WIFOM.

Is this usually when we mass claim or something? [/has never made it to LYLO before]

[Lastsurvivor]

Did either of you two breadcrumb?

[Lastsurvivor]

MB, why did you inspect Elmo? You constantly said he was townie throughout the day, the most recent time being here:

And + towncred to Elmo. If he was scum why change wagons when you can keep on the one about to happen.

Looking at this post...

Not quite sure who I suspect right now. LS and Elmo seem town. Tvk seems town but not too helpful.
This leaves

Chirmi,

Emp, and

Om.

I think I'll look into things a little more later.

(Color added by me)

I would think the most logical investigation for you would have been Emp, ya?

[Lastsurvivor]

@My fellow VTs: Who do you think is the true seer?

[Lastsurvivor]

Do you think TvK's scum, Elmo?

[Lastsurvivor]

I think it's possible he's bussing currently to get a free ride into lylo.

You think TvK and MB are scum?

@MB: You investigated Elmo because you wanted to clear him?

[Lastsurvivor]

Yeah what MB said.

[Lastsurvivor]

Also,

Anyways I like how TvK's selection was me. That's cool.

Why is this necessarily a bad thing, MB?

[Lastsurvivor]

True. I would expect TownTvKSeer to inspect you though since you're probably the person he suspected most next to Chrimi and Om.

[Lastsurvivor]

Well of course it would to you.

[Lastsurvivor]

There's nothing particularly wrong with walling us to death. I like that he's trying, even if I don't have the time to actually go through it and see if it's valid.

Elmo, do you still think TvK and MB are bussing?

[Lastsurvivor]

You do realize that if they were bussing each other then we'd have no seer right...?

[Lastsurvivor]

Well MB did ask you who the Seer would be if he was bussing iirc.

[Lastsurvivor]

Eh. I think I see what you're saying. Like, why does he need to give an MB case since we all know that, from his perspective, he thinks MB's scum? I looked at it more from he's trying to save the game (since we are in LYLO), but meh.

[Lastsurvivor]

MB what do you think about the case against you

[Lastsurvivor]

Have you expressed this odd feeling about TvK?

[Lastsurvivor]

Yeah, I suppose.

So who do you think the other scum is then?

[Lastsurvivor]

Hm.

The team is either TvK/Emp, or MB's scum. If MB's scum then his partner is whoever.

I'm assuming this since Elmo has posted in other areas on the site and hasn't jumped on a hammer.

[Lastsurvivor]

For those that have played in LYLO before (this is my first time...): would ScumEmp have jumped on a SeerMB wagon? Or would he have waited for someone else to vote for SeerMB and then quickhammer?

[Lastsurvivor]

I don't think they would either...but I dunno :/

Elmo who do you think is fake Seer?

[Lastsurvivor]

Why wouldn't I behave like him if I were in his position?

[Lastsurvivor]

Why not? We're lynching between the seers today..

[Lastsurvivor]

From my perspective no one is more confirmed than anyone.

But I don't know why Elmo wants to lynch Emp when it's quite clear who the lynch options are for today.

Because he's doing nothing. And why no vote then?

I'm not voting because I don't know who the fake seer is.

[Lastsurvivor]

FTR though I'm fairly positive that Elmo's the scum in the VT group. He's been waffling on the which seer is scum claim since they claimed and hasn't been trying to figure out who's the real one. First he said they were bussing each other (which makes no sense), and now he refuses to take a stance.

MB being his partner makes a lot of sense. And the fact that no one has hammered him should make it clear unless we have a strange scum team. Both TvK and Emp would have to be the scum and why would they both already be on the wagon?

MB what about TvK did you find scummy yesterday?

[Lastsurvivor]

Yes, I haven't been actively questioning both MB and TvK in order to figure out which one of them is the real Seer

...Oh.

[Lastsurvivor]

I mostly meant would scum hop on a town wagon in general instead of waiting to drop the hammer. But what's it like?

[Lastsurvivor]

I meant what were you like in Chuck Mafia as scum. I can't really look since it was lost in the crash.

[Lastsurvivor]

Oh I thought you meant it was lost in the crash

I shall look at that later then

[Lastsurvivor]

Meh...we have time. :/

[Lastsurvivor]

MB I believe is town.

???????????????????????

[Lastsurvivor]

Yeah...I think it has to be MB.

I want an answer to the question I just asked Elmo though.

[Lastsurvivor]

Well you said you were going to hammer and then said he was town.

So I said "???????????????????????????"

So the reason was that you were tired?

[Lastsurvivor]

Oh well idm that you're holding off the hammer. I'm just concerned that you were gonna hammer someone that you thought was town...

[Lastsurvivor]

Alright. Hammer.

[Lastsurvivor]

Were you the seer?

If so fuck...

[Lastsurvivor]

...

So...you're scum?

[Lastsurvivor]

This game. WHY COULDNT I DIE?!?!??

Emp - really now? THE MAN WHO SAYS ALMOST NOTHIN THINKS IT'S ME DJEGJFEUHEV

:/ You obviously wouldn't die because TvK was the cleared Town Seer.

And why are you getting so mad at Emp?

[Lastsurvivor]

Possibly.

Elmo has slipped at least once, but I haven't been able to read you all game.

I'm stuck between a rock and a hard place here.

[Lastsurvivor]

Emp - Ive never been able to read you EVER once

Oh gee it's convenient that you made that observation right after I made it

Elmo, why are you so panicky? I dunno about Emp, but I'm definitely not putting my vote down on anyone yet.

[Lastsurvivor]

Such as?

[Lastsurvivor]

:/ I really do feel stuck. Elmo, are you unwilling to play then...?

Also, you never really did address something yesterday, at least not evasively. Why did you say MB was town while you said you were willing to hammer him?

[Lastsurvivor]

It was a mistype. I thought we already discussed this. Yeah Ill finish this out. This is lylo after all just my activitys been slowly declining in games a bit.

You answered the question but it was all jumbled up and I just decided to just assume it was a mistype until now.

Anyway, I understand you have a hard time reading Emp, but why do you think he's scum?

[Lastsurvivor]

He was town when you played together in whatever the second This setup was right (I'm assuming Carbon-14)?

So AKA as scum he plays like he is here but as town he's very proactive and attacked you a lot? Why'd you lynch him?..

[Lastsurvivor]

Also, how long ago did these games take place?

[Lastsurvivor]

Emp what do you think of Elmo's reason for voting you?

[Lastsurvivor]

Emp what do you think of Elmo's reason for voting you?

Hadn't noticed he had.

My bad, thinking you're scum.

Emp what do you think of Elmo's reason for voting you?

Hadn't noticed he had.

I haven't. >_> how did we determine LS is town though?

Do you think #616 is a scumslip of sorts?

[Lastsurvivor]

The difference in action? I can't say I've seen any. I would argue strenuously that I was one of the aggressive players in this game.

You think so?

I mean, you were kind of aggressive, but compared to everyone else I'd say you were the least aggressive player here..

Really I think Elmo's point is moot because you seem to post like this in all of your games looking through your posting history.

[Lastsurvivor]

Anyway, I'm still not really sure. I'm leaning towards Elmo, so I think that's where I'm gonna put my vote.

Elmo, you wanna say anything? I'm willing to keep going since I'm sure we have time.

[Lastsurvivor]

I played this setup horribly 2 for 2 now. >_>

This statement can be taken in two ways. :/

VOTE: Elmo

Emp feel free to hammer unless you have something to say.

[Lastsurvivor]

Meh...maybe. But you're not really convincing me to move my vote. :/

[Lastsurvivor]

The other thing that bothered me was when you said the seers were bussing each other, which would then leave no seers. You said that you thought I claimed seer, but I just find that hard to believe since that would mean we would have three seer claimants and you (along with everyone else) would probably have made a big deal of that.

And you just seemed very opportunistic bouncing between Chrimi and Om during the D1 lynch too.

It's not a whole lot, but Emp hasn't really done anything scummy IMO. I'm not buying the meta analysis.

[Lastsurvivor]

He was, yeah. But you still readily agreed with his "MB and Chrimi are the scumteam" theory afterwards (and voted Chrimi, along with Emp).

And it has been...mediocre.

[Lastsurvivor]

Vote: Elmo

Moment of truth?

Alright well I'm town.

Are you?

[Lastsurvivor]

And if you're scum, that's just a cruel scumhammer Emp...

[Lastsurvivor]

......HI CHRIMI

I guess we lost. Gratz scum.

[Lastsurvivor]

That's two games I've flubbed up. Oh well.

[Lastsurvivor]

Enjoying your editing powers, Chrimi?

[Lastsurvivor]

According to the main post four of us are still alive



Even TvK is still alive!

I'd like to think that with this great news from Lord Mhork's spirit, we overpowered Emp and freed ourselves.

In another life...

[Lastsurvivor]

But srsly gratz scum! Def Emp, you're impossible to read.

This player list is kinda unlucky because I can only properly read like two players on it. And obviously neither of them were with me in LYLO.

MB CCing the seer worked out quite well for him despite his death. If TvK wasn't the seer and made it into that last day, I think the choice would have been a lot easier. But then we might have chosen wrong on D2 so eh...

@Om: If you hadn't flipped out, things might have gone better for you. And for the rest of us, really. You might have gotten Elmo MLd D1 (which would have been a whole lot better than revealing Chrimi to the scum), or even gotten MB lynched. I'm not saying the town loss is your fault, since you were lynched D1 so you had no effect on anything afterwards, but in future games try to stay calm in the face of a lynch.

[Lastsurvivor]

I'm also kind of sad that I didn't notice Emp's scummy until now...

Best Mafia Performance

Derp.

Really my gut was saying Emp but my brain was saying Elmo. I need to stop listening to my brain.

Also was there a dead QT? And can we see the scum QT? : D