Open 262-Hard Boiled!

[saporovirus]

vote: confid

for not having a basic understanding of hip hop lingo.

[saporovirus]

Not following your shadow argument at all hop. Think it's best to let it go though.

This game does seem pretty heavily town weighted though. Interesting.

unvote vote Shattered_Viewpoint

. Misanthropy is scummy.

[saporovirus]

Hey implosion: I don't think the hider will get killed if she hides with a vig, but lets ask. I voted SV to be silly, because thus far I think this HOMJ wagon is kind of annoying and distracting, and someone who hates everyone might well be given to organized crime.

Mod: will the hider be killed if she hides with a vig?

[saporovirus]

Issue of my vote: I made that vote yesterday, when many of these posts WERE NOT EVEN UP. Also, as far as I'm concerned, nothing of note has been learned thus far. Hop's a VI. Do we kill him for that? ...Maybe.

unvote; vote Hop

[saporovirus]

Lol, if what is my reaction?

[saporovirus]

unvote vote sapo

If that is your reaction to simple questions you deserve to have some more serious pressure being tested on you...

I asked what you meant by this. I'd like an answer.

[saporovirus]

Instead of just answering it you show a massive reaction of avoidance - going as far as placing a vote on a wagon that you seemed rather opposed to before. That makes me believe you feel caught in something.

Ok, what? I basically said "The board wasn't showing a lot of posts, and I didn't/don't think anything of note has actually happened in the game." Explain how that is a "massive reaction of avoidance." And I would also like you to quote where I said I was opposed to a hop wagon.

I voted SV to be silly, because thus far I think this HOMJ wagon is kind of annoying and distracting.

=/= "I WOULD HATE TO LYNCH HOP." I think his playstyle's anti-town because he casts out accusations that are extremely ridiculous. What I am opposed to is pages and pages of clutter that keep us from focusing on any other players. He could very well be vitown, but if voting for Hop helps us move on with things better, I'm all for it. And honestly, I haven't seen enough from anyone else to have a feeling one way or another.

If you have any other concrete reasons to suspect me, I'm all ears.

[saporovirus]

Now we are talking.
Now answer me these two questions:
- Why did you not give me this answer when I asked the first time?
- Why did you consider it the right time to jump on the hop waggon?

-Cuz I'm busy and cranky and I'm having female troubles? Mainly because I didn't think my vote for SV warranted much of a discussion.

-Because, as I said, I've been busy, and I'm not exactly IN LOVE with lynching hop today. Also, looking back at the way the first wagon formed, he seems like a very convenient lynchpin that perhaps some opportunistic scum jumped upon. In light of this,

UNVOTE: Hop

Question 4 you!

-Why is hops no longer scummy to you? Or, to ask another way, why do you think it would be a better idea to put pressure on others when you've seen that hops basically doesn't react in any way that's useful?

[saporovirus]

Implosion: My vote on shattered viewpoint is a joke. I offer no other explanation. If you aren't willing to let it go, how about you explain the rest of your case on me?

[saporovirus]

Not following your shadow argument at all hop. Think it's best to let it go though.

This game does seem pretty heavily town weighted though. Interesting.

unvote vote Shattered_Viewpoint

. Misanthropy is scummy.

Saying "Misanthropy is scummy" and later saying that you voted him because you didn't like the Hop wagon implies that it was not a "joke" vote. If you're going to say that misanthropy is scummy, and use that as a reason for voting, you need to back that statement up and not just say that you were voting as a joke.

Shattered Viewpoint is an easy vote to make as scum in that situation, because:
1) it disavows you of ties to the Hop wagon if he flips town;
2) it makes you seem active by placing a vote;
3) he said something very strange in his first post, which is easy to interpret as scummy even though it really isn't.

I don't understand any town motivation for this vote, and saying it was just a joke seems to be contradicted by other things that you've been saying.

OK, let me tell you when I ACTUALLY posted my SV vote: sometime after hop started attacking shadow for trying to win town points. It showed up somewhere on page three. I was basically still in RVS.

I didn't CHANGE my SV vote because I saw no reason to, yet.

Anything else?

[saporovirus]

Because it was. That's what RVS means, to me at least.

[saporovirus]

Hi again guys! Studying looks like it's just not going to happen.

Shadow: lynchpin means

potential

mislynch in saporo's special vocabulary. Lynchpin

actually

means "a center of support/ a backbone." VOCABFAIL.
If I were to explain my vote for hop: I wasn't paying as much attention to the game as I should have, and I decided Hop's problematic personality/ tendency to be paranoid was scummy, so I threw my vote in without thinking about it much. I now doubt this because I have noted objections from other players as to the quickness of Hop's wagon/ how he typically acts in other games. If I were to explain why I

didn't

explain my vote for hop too well: laziness.

Now I will tell you all what I think of you!

Shadow: pretty sure you're town. I'm somewhat troubled by your vote for hop soon after he voted for you, but other than that you're doing well at puzzling out mechanics, trying to puzzle out people's motivations, etc.

Confid: pretty much all you've done so far is address Shadow's vig/tracker question and post your read on hop, but I like your read on hop, so I'm giving you townpoints as well.

donjohnson: neutral. Haven't been around much.

shotty: neutral. You like to be...you.

empking: you get a bit monolithic on hops towards the beginning and your vote/ wagoning could be seen as opportunistic, but you have some valid points to make about mechanics and all your votes seem to have a valid reason. Leaning townish.

HOMJ: urgh

implosion: aside from tiresome harping on my SV vote I'm thinking town. Mechanistic discussions, active participation, active scumhunting are all good in my book.

Jesse: neutral. I think you just like to active lurk.

schrauben: neutral.

scott: neutral-ish-with-slight-streaks-of-town. Your few posts are pretty reasonable.

snake: " "

And now you can see why there aren't any good candidates for scum yet. Lurky lurkers.

[saporovirus]

@ SD and Scott Brosius: TBQH, when I say some of my reads are "neutral," it's because I don't have enough information. I have a scum feeling about Jesse because of another game (where my suspicions haven't even been confirmed). I will have to watch him some more to see how things turn out; if I'm not mistaken, he's going to active lurk for a while then tunnel the hell out of whoever he thinks it is most convenient to pick on. That's probs just his playstyle though. Other than that, I don't really like how Schrauben's been contributing to the conversation, mainly because he just answered an accusation from AGES ago, and then picked on an argument about L1 claims that isn't exactly relevant now. My other neutrals are mostly just based upon inactivity.

Apparently HOMJ loves to find scum based upon 1) their love of discussing strategy and 2) their tendency to replace out of the game when "pressure builds on them" (cuz pressure was REALLY piling up on SV). My URGH is an URGH of frustration.

[saporovirus]

@Confid: isn't the good doctor's contribution usually little more than joining wagons? I feel like that's pretty much a null tell.

drmyshottyizsik[1]ConfidAnon
Scott Brosius[0]
don_johnson[0]
JesseSheffield[2]don_johnson,Empking
Shadow Dancer[0]

saporovirus[3]Shadow Dancer,drmyshottyizsik,implosion,

HopOnMyJoystick[1]Scott Brosius
schrauben8542[0]
SnakePlissken[1]HopOnMyJoystick
Empking[0]
ConfidAnon[0]
implosion[0]
No Lynch[0]
Not Voting:JesseSheffield,SnakePlissken,schrauben8542,saporovirus,
With 12 alive, it takes 7 to lynch.

[saporovirus]

I'm trying to answer questions as I catch up reading the thread, I don't live on this site I try to check everyday, but that doesn't always happen. Anyways, if you just want me to ignore things and move on just say so. I hate reading threads backwards cause you miss the flow of the discussion or arguments. But not many people like the way I post so that doesn't bother me much. And by ages ago you do realize that it is the same day thread wise and it was only 48 hours ago, so while if you live on this site it seems like ages ago, if you are only checking and keeping up with an hour or 2 from day to day, it really isn't "AGES ago", imo.

Ok.

Like your sig, btw.

[saporovirus]

Lol.

[saporovirus]

Apparently HOMJ loves to find scum based upon 1) their love of discussing strategy and 2) their tendency to replace out of the game when "pressure builds on them" (cuz pressure was REALLY piling up on SV). My URGH is an URGH of frustration.

http://www.geardiary.com/wp-content/upl ... l-orly.jpg

1. I had issue with page 1 skipping rvs theory discussion
2. I said it happened to me once when my scum partner replaced out, didn't say everyone who replaces is scum cause u have replaced in as town so I know that isn't true

stop trying to twist things into lies

Yah, sorry, reread that and realized I misrepped it. Still pretty frustrated with your tactics though.

[saporovirus]

LOL @ Biblical quotes

[saporovirus]

This game makes me want to crack my skull open and birth a goddess of wisdom from it.

[saporovirus]

vote: Hop

Maybe now things will be at least a bit less annoying.

[saporovirus]

^ But it's really annoying.

[saporovirus]

Jesse's Hop hammer isn't scummy. We were getting literally nowhere with hop in the game; he was befuddling everyone's reads.

I sense opportunism in Emp's championing in the Hop wagon and in his brief vote for me. I feel like he's been trying to avoid scumhunting and he's been active lurking quite a bit, whilst criticizing others for those same things.

vote: emp

[saporovirus]

Snake: Until Hop exploded recently I wasn't focused on lynching Hop. I was trying to get people to give opinions.

Sapro: Give an example of where I active lurked?

Vote:Sapro

- Same reason as the wagon beforehand.

Your contributions to date: Hop is scummy. Hop is scummy. Let's discuss theory: do you think we should direct our vig if we get a vig? Hop is scummy. Hop is scummy. Jesse is active lurking. I'm on a Saprowagon. Jesse is active lurking so he is scummy. I want Hop and DJ to post their reads of every player because I am super great number one A+ scumhunter. No I'm not tunneling Hop. Vote: Hop

d2) I'm a necrophiliac! saprowagon. I don't care to provide any explanation.

[saporovirus]

Active lurking = posting regularly without saying much. You can't quote a SINGLE post that demonstrates that. This is a ridiculous request, but since you are asking for it, here is an example of a content-less post:

I'm telling other players how to scum hunt.

I'm

scumhunting.

But fine. Hop post a three sentance summary on everybody in this game.

This is in response to Hop complaining about you tunneling him. It doesn't really make sense as an answer, because rather than actually addressing why everyone should vote hop or what other players we should consider, you tell

hop

to come up with a summary of everyone. This is also where I get the "A+ NUMBER ONE SCUMHUNTER" thing from: pretending you're actually doing shit in this game when really you've been going after the easiest target consistently. You haven't explained why you joined my wagon only to abandon it quickly, and why you're trying to wagon me now. How about you do that? The only other player you've even considered is Jesse, and you gave up pretty quick after you realized you couldn't get a wagon started on him simply on the basis of active lurking.

So I'm more than happy where

my

vote is now.

[saporovirus]

You were going for Hop yesterday. Easiest lynch in the world to sell. And Jesse is far from the easiest target today.

Your response to that question was in-fucking-adequate.

drmyshottyizsik[0]
Scott Brosius[0]
don_johnson[0]
JesseSheffield[2]don_johnson,drmyshottyizsik,
Shadow Dancer[1]ScottBrosius,
saporovirus[1]Empking,
schrauben8542[0]
SnakePlissken[0]
Empking[1]saporovirus,
ConfidAnon[1]JesseSheffield,
No Lynch[0]
NotVoting:SnakePlissken,schrauben8542,ConfidAnon,Shadow Dancer,
With 10 alive, it takes 6 to lynch.
Deadline

[saporovirus]

Also, you, now, explain why you are voting for me.

[saporovirus]

You're going to have to do better than that . You haven't pointed out how my problems with you are "rhetoric" and "lies." I'm not being hypocritical: I voted for Hop because he was doing a great job at distracting the shit out of town and he needed to get out of the game. You poked and prodded at Hop and engaged him in discussion, thus helping to distract town. Your contributions have been mostly about hop, explaining why you voted for hop, ASKING HOP FOR HIS OPINIONS. While you weren't constantly like LETS GET HOPSCUM (I'd really think you were more towny if you did), your sum contribution to this game has been very limited. And unless you mean something else by "hypocritcism," you're basically just throwing that word out there.

If you voted for me earlier because I placed a vote on hop, why didn't you say so THEN? Are you just making up a reason now? And you wanted people to vote for Hop throughout. If I'm a hypocrite for pointing that out as scummy, how are you not a hypocrite for thinking my support of a hoplynch is scummy? Though I've already pointed out the flaw in the hypocrite argument, so there.

[saporovirus]

unvote

Emp- I didn't disagree with you AFTER you "listed" me as a suspect (I'm also not getting the idea that you genuinely suspect me). I voted for you BEFORE.

[saporovirus]

Yah, you did. I'm not convinced it was genuine tho.

Mod: I am no longer voting for emp

drmyshottyizsik[0]
Scott Brosius[0]
don_johnson[0]
JesseSheffield[1]don_johnson,
Shadow Dancer[1]ScottBrosius,
saporovirus[2]Empking,drmyshottyizsik,
schrauben8542[0]
SnakePlissken[0]
Empking[1]SnakePlissken,
ConfidAnon[1]JesseSheffield,
No Lynch[0]
NotVoting:schrauben8542,ConfidAnon,Shadow Dancer,saporovirus,
With 10 alive, it takes 6 to lynch.
Deadline

[saporovirus]

I'm not liking shadow's shotty wagon either. In separate posts, he's said Shotty wagon-hops more as scum, he has "deliberately" built a VI meta for himself (which suggests that shotty's meta read now would be null, contradicting his earlier post). I also thought his reason for wagoning me earlier was pretty weak.

vote: shadow

[saporovirus]

Mod: I'm voting for Shadow Dancer

[saporovirus]

Alright, WTF is going on with this CA-wagon? SERIOUSLY. Did everyone leave the stove on?

And what the hell is the case on snake either?

God. I'm happy with my SD vote, but I'm totally eyeing scott and DJ with suspicion now.

[saporovirus]

OK... actually...

UNVOTE: Shadow VOTE: ConfidAnon

[saporovirus]

This whole game is starting to piss me off.

[saporovirus]

*Facepalm*

[saporovirus]

Claimtime.

[saporovirus]

ATTENTION
VOTE: don_johnson

OMG D1 he was either lurktown or all over Hop. D2 he voted for Jesse (FOR LYNCHING THE VI), tried to push a policy lynch of drmyshotty (FOR BEING A VI), voted for snake (JUST FOR THE LOLS), voted for CA (OBVS QUICKLYNCH CANDIDATE), unvoted and derailed with blah blah talk about the SD wagon, tried to push a policy lynch of DrMyShotty (COMPLETELY INAPPROPRIATE GIVEN HOW OBVS CA WAS), then finally bussed the fuck out of him! Yah.

[saporovirus]

I am totes not scum, guys. Last one is Snake, I think, but let me read again.

[saporovirus]

Shotty's probtown because DJ pushed for a policy lynch of him more than once yesterday to distract us from the CA/Coug issue. Thad's confirmed. On a second read-through, I could see SD being scum as well. Here's what I see as the issue w/ snake:

d1: snake seemed to have a rather wishy-washy standoffish attitude towards scumhunting. His main suspicion was empking, but he was sort of like "idk man that's what we've gotta figure out," so he wasn't even definitive about that.

d2: snake votes for emp for tunneling on hop. He then unvotes because he "can't remember" why he voted for emp. He quotes ScottBro's argument against SD calling emp "confirmed town" as his reason for voting for SD- pretty feeble. Finally he jumps on the CA/coug wagon saying he'd rather go for SD, but what can you do man, this is the way the spice must flow.

d3: He's like "Sapo did a good job of talking about how DJ is scum. Thad I'm going to question your claim by asking which of the NKs DJ made even though that info is outside the scope of your claimed PR." CONSPICUOUSLY ABSENT: vote for DJ.

Furthermore, DJ seemed to have a strange attitude towards Snake. d1 he's tolerantly sardonic towards him, d2 he votes for him just for the lolz (or "conflicting wagons") but quickly changes his vote to confid.

[saporovirus]

V/LA thru Sat Night- might be in and out tho (that's what he said )

[saporovirus]

Given the rather town-aligned dynamics of this game, a scum vote for CA might make sense because of the reasons the wagon formed (Jesse's softclaim- not "pulled out of my hat," btw, snake), but a d3 bus of DJ would make it really hard for the last scum to win. Why's SD a better lynch than snake, ThAd?

[saporovirus]

IDK where this "sapo's too sure" bs is coming from. Day 1 I was like WTF IS GOING ON, day 2 I was like MAN THESE PEOPLE ARE SCUMMY OBLIVIOUS TO SOFTCLAIM O NVM NOW I SEE SOFTCLAIM. Day 3 is the only day I expressed certainty that DJ was scum and that was because I was excited to have discovered his scummy behaviors. Kind of interesting that I have quickly turned from town in SD's eyes to his 2nd scum pick. TAIM TO READ MOAR.

[saporovirus]

There's really just one thing that's kind of bothering me about Shadow right now, and that is that scott bro accused him of rolefishing on day 2, because he seemed very focused on the fact that there was a vig, not a tracker. It's not the fact that Scott Bro accused him as such, because in context that seems a bit of a stretch, but it was the way Shadow reacted, accusing scott of tunneling him when really all he had to do was say "Nah, I just thought I'd point that out." Now I'm wondering if scott knew more than he was telling.

Hmmm.

[saporovirus]

Day 1: Shadow Dancer kind of seemed to want a vig instead of a tracker.
#305 SD's first post: we've got a tracker
#314 SB wonders why SD is so interested in the role because he wanted to discuss it a lot yesterday and now he wants to lampshade that someone chose vig instead of tracker.
#315 SD says naw, vig would definitely shoot someone on d1 because if they weren't risk-taker's they'd choose tracker. Doesn't address why he's so curious about that role.
#317 Scott Bro is like "MAN YOU DIDN'T ANSWER THE Q I THINK YOU ARE SCUMZ."
#340 SD: Hark, a claim when the sun has scarce arisen o'er the horizon! Alas, why didst thou choose to hide with this mere twit of a JesseSheffield, young Empking?
#345 Scott Bro explodes rage at SD's "fishing" for info and wants to kill him.
#352 SD points out that Scott Bro's reactions are kind of silly (Ah, thou'st but a convulsively tunneling knave) and votes him.
#354 Scott Bro: idk man, trying to figure out the setup and asking ppl why they do stuff seems kinda scummy to me man. THESE ARE MY TELLS. I AM A FREE SPIRIT ON THE WIND.
#361 Shadow: OK whatevs I'm a talka bout shotty now

So the weird thing in this is-

I would peg scott bro as the scummier one in this exchange, because he appears to be labelling things as "rolefishing" that aren't. However we later discover that he is a power role, and other than this one exchange, he's been lying low and more or less reasonable. So...idk.

[saporovirus]

I really have no clue why he wouldn't have claimed, except perhaps to reveal all at a later date. But I'm also curious as to how scum guessed that Scott had a PR. This could be the key.

[saporovirus]

Very simple explanation: When Scott overreacted on my harmless opening remark on D2 was the point in time when I figured out that Scott was likely tracker himself.
Of course I could not claim that openly, resulting in my first throwing some dirt his way and then backing off his waggon, my exact words were "he's not the lynch of the day", which pretty much would have meant "I won't lynch Scott today under any circumstances" if any one had insisted on it.

And my theory that Sapo might be scum is partly based on these circumstances - if I could figure out SB was the hider, any one else with open eyes could, too - which pretty much even favours Sapo scum over Snake scum in this regard.

OK, so you thought Scott was the tracker based upon how he was like SHUT UP ABOUT TRACKERS ALREADY. But if that was the case, why would you try to "shovel dirt" on him? If anything that would draw even more attention to the fact that he was upset at your tracker talk, and scum would be more likely to notice because of your actions. It really makes no sense that you would vote for your suspected town tracker at all.

I also don't get Scott's death indicates that I am scum any more than anyone else. It's kinda weird that you'd make that case given that I didn't even comment on it d2, unless I'm missing something.

IDK, man, you're giving off scummier and scummier vibes.

[saporovirus]

OH ALSO I don't want to make a big deal of this but there's totally still one town PR.

[saporovirus]

ARGH nvm- there isn't aside from the one we know.

[saporovirus]

Gosh Thad, what should we do?

[saporovirus]

GOSH I NEED INSIGHT GUYS. I AM TORN BETWEEN TWO LOVERS.

[saporovirus]

Shadow: Assume I am very very stupid. Please explain how keeping the tracker from claiming d3 and keeping the day short would help them out aside from giving them townpoints.

Everyone else please tell me your thoughts or unvote. I do not want to lead us into lylo if I can help it.

[saporovirus]

DR SHOTTY PLZ TELL ME WHY

I MEAN I THINK SNAKE'S LAST POST WAS PRETTY SCUMMY THO SO

[saporovirus]

What about how shadow responded to thinking he was hammered? Did he genuinely think he was done?

[saporovirus]

Don't do that, man. THAD: WHO IS THE LAST SCUMZ.

[saporovirus]

vote: Shadow

gooosh I hope I'm right

[saporovirus]

Um yeah.

vote: snake

If he's not the one I'll eat my hat.

[saporovirus]

Have you been to the doctor?

[saporovirus]

Shotty is town because of the attitude DJ had towards him. You are scum through the process of elimination, and also because you've not been too great throughout the game.

[saporovirus]

I go away for one weekend and you act all mischievous, shotty! Young man blah blah blah

I am glad of the outcome.

[saporovirus]

OH WAIT WTF.

I am actually not glad of the outcome. For some reason I didn't read the last flavor scene correctly.
I have not yet decided which of my hats is most delicious.