Open 175 - Picking Simplicity (Game Over)

[Col.Cathart]

/confirm

Note: My computer decided to piss me off, and is crashing down every 5 minutes. Writing any longer post is almost impossible, so

V/LA until it will be repaired

. It'll go to service today, so it shouldn't be longer than

1-2

days.

[Col.Cathart]

Ok, I have my comp back. It's now working smoothly, and I'm much poorer person now -_-

But, to the business...

Vote: Col.Cathart.

I think I've been in the most games with him than anyone else on the playerlist. This is the third in two months or something, isn't it?

True. Too bad, you were replaced in one of them, and killed N1 (by me ) in other. In fact, I was pretty sure, you'll vote me. ;]

vote: Blastinus

. I know this guy from other, non-mafia related board which hosts semi-serious mafia games. Let's see, how he'll do here ;]

[Col.Cathart]

All that baseball stuff

Never really watched any baseball game. I prefer hockey and basketball, Blues in H and Magic in B for that matter ;] (as a guy from Europe I'm not region-biased or region-claimed to any team )

And yeah, there's nothing wrong with RVS IMO. Someone will always say something weird, that will spark future discussion Not voting at all can lead to stalling, when no one will say anything, because there's no topic to discuss.

[Col.Cathart]

I'll agree with Hyl on this one. You should vote someone who you find scummy, not someone who already have some votes to make a bandwagon... Just to make a bandwagon.

[Col.Cathart]

Unless you're in the RVS, where bandwagons are law.

The more I play, the less sense I see in them. For the first, second, even third time - sure. Nice to see people reaction. But now, when I see it, it's like 'ah, random bandwagon. Cool...', and it seems that others are taking similar approach, and so bandwagon gives us... Exactly nothing.

[Col.Cathart]

If you're saying that RVS is a nonsense, than what conclusion you want to draw from it?

[Col.Cathart]

Freudian slip much?

Come again? I didn't understand that one.

[Col.Cathart]

So if someone doesn't join a RVS bandwagon that makes the person who initiated the random vote scummy?

Sigh.
I said 'anti-town'. I did not say 'scummy'.

And being anti-town is scummy. I don't really think those two words can be divided. Gonna argue with that?

[Col.Cathart]

!!! ARE YOU IN THIS GAME OR NOT?

He is.

Care to explain your way of thinking at least once?

[Col.Cathart]

Sorry for my absence. I had a Crazy weekend. I'll do a reread and get back to you.

[Col.Cathart]

Ok, re-read done. First of all,

Unvote

. While Blast is certainly new to mafiascum style of game, hence some weird reactions, he's acting definitely Pro Town IMO. Well maybe except that last post exchange with Nikanor, but it's nothing big, really.

Zwet is acting like a typical Zwet. Read on him is impossible ATM.

So is read on YankCane, Dramonic, Snow_Bunny, and Skitzer, because of lack of posts.

Mod, please replace Vaya

. Nuff said.

WarWound, better start minding, because no one likes to play with troll. You may got a newbie pro-town card from Iguana, but that's not giving you a permission to spam instead of scumhunting.

And finally last, but not least:

vote: Pomegranate

No real game content added, just like Keyblade. Also, she's acting waaaay different than Town-Pomegranate I encountered twice already.

[Col.Cathart]

Col, one of those games was a newbie and the other one only had seven players. I play large games differently; I generally do some lurking D1 to get a feel of the players.

Huh? How does your activity and contribution to the game has anything to do with feeling other players? That's something you're doing by reading and analyzing their posts, not by lurking...

[Col.Cathart]

Huh? How does your activity and contribution to the game has anything to do with feeling other players? That's something you're doing by reading and analyzing their posts, not by lurking...

And posting hurts getting a "feel", how?

Pom, you ignored those questions, and IMO deliberately, as you even answered other FF's question from his post.

So far, happy with my vote.

[Col.Cathart]

I thought it was clear that my answer was to start posting more, which I've been doing.

Posting more doesn't answer the question.

QFT.

In other news: I have a weird feeling, that several people are hopping KB's wagon, because it's an easiest wagon around. Ok, fine, he didn't post anything useful at all, but also he didn't post ANYTHING in like... Week? Meanwhile, when there are other things to discuss, some people, like Blastinus or Foilist are just saying 'Yeah, KB is not saying anything, let's lynch him'. KB doesn't look like a lurker IMO. He looks like a main candidate for a replacement.

Personally, I'm willing to wait for his response when he'll be back, or his replacement, before judging anything in that matter. In the meantime, I advise everyone to observe, who's hopping on the easy wagon, because he have reasons, and who's hopping because it's easy.

[Col.Cathart]

People should not speculate on what I am

I still am interested to hear cases from about half the game.

To be more specific, I would love to hear a case from Scott, HH, Spy, CC, and everyone not voting.

I'm going to a party in a minute, so I don't have a time right now. Expect all my thoughts about this game so far, tomorrow after I'll sober up.

[Col.Cathart]

Sorry guys for absence. Promised post will come after I'll read all the stuff that happened lately.

[Col.Cathart]

Blargh... Since it will help me going from the one point to another, I'll start with answers to Anithero.

And yeah, there's nothing wrong with RVS IMO. Someone will always say something weird, that will spark future discussion Not voting at all can lead to stalling, when no one will say anything, because there's no topic to discuss.

This is obvious. Active lurking.

Nope, not really. I didn't throw it in the air just like that. Someone was questioning the usefulness of RVS, so I decided to state my opinion on this. I don't see how this particular thing is active lurking in any way.

HOWEVER...

Yeah, I admit that I am not writing much useful things, and I don't have that much RL stuff on my head to stop me from doing it, so you can call me an active lurker, if you want. *dramatic music*

I made several attempts to re-read the game, find something new etc. etc. But the only new thing I discovered, is that I suck at games with larger player count than 12. Too many players to observe, makes me forget about something interesting I found in the sea of 18 other people posts.

No, this is not an excuse, as there is no good excuse for it. This is just an explanation (Zaz can kinda confirm it from my similar behavior in Deja Bastard which is another ~20 players game). If you don't like it, go ahead and vote me.

That said, I'm still refusing to give up, and I'll try to play better (should be a bit easier, when the player count will drop a little).

Going back to actual mafia game: Pom's latest behavior seems to look like going back to normal Pom. A bit better, though now it may be an attempt to cover it up. Also still no answer for my and FF's question. Vote stays for now.

Second place on my list (aex aequo) goes to Blastinus and Foilist (now ZazieR). As I stated already, they hop on the K12/AH wagon look more like an opportunistic jump, rather than really following the case.

Blast, as you now know, that K12 didn't said anything because he was inactive, what do you now think about this wagon, and the case?

4th place goes to WarWound. As someone already pointed out, he had some time to read the Wiki and/or other games to see how this game should be played. He still did not, and opts to be useless some more. I think that playing a newb card and moving on is not really a good idea.

Also, can someone highlight me the main points against Iguana? I find the fact, that she's calling town too many people for not really that good reasons, but apart from that I don't really see that case.

AH, is that all you found on everyone, or is that only a highlight of your top suspects? What do you think about Pom? And what about Iguana?

[Col.Cathart]

Pom: Heh, somehow I knew, of all people around you'll be the one to press me the most for it.

"And since I can't get away without some actual scumhunting, I'll copy what the majority of other people had to say. I can't go wrong with that."

Except that two of three points you were referring to, were my own, so this is not true.

Also yet another post, and I'm yet to hear an answer from you. Lets try it one more time:

I play large games differently; I generally do some lurking D1 to get a feel of the players.

In response, I asked this question (later, FF asked a similar one):

Huh? How does your activity and contribution to the game has anything to do with feeling other players? That's something you're doing by reading and analyzing their posts, not by lurking...

The only thing we got from you in this case is:

I thought it was clear that my answer was to start posting more, which I've been doing.

Which in absolutely no way answers, why the heck lurking in the first place? What logic was behind this behavior? You're avoiding this question like fire.

So yeah, thanks for doing a complete breakdown of my active lurkiness and my not willingness to try anything anywhere, but at least I found someone who acted somewhat weird, and still refuses to explain herself, which is quite enough reason for me to think you're scum.

[Col.Cathart]

@people who have been saying pom is scummy - At this point would you support the lynch, yes or no?

Yes, that's why I'm voting her in the first place.

[Col.Cathart]

*Sigh*

Sorry, wrong again.

b) Col has lurked through 19 pages so far. He first voes me because I'm not playing the way I usually do, according to him. After 15 or so pages of content, he says I'm acting the way I usually do, just forgot to answer a question (which I will get to after this post).

Nope, not exactly. You DID behave differently before. You changed your play somewhat, after I pointed it out. It doesn't change the fact that you did behave differently for some purpose (still unknown), and the fact that you're slowly coming back to your old self may be just as well attempt to cover up your slip from early game.

He keeps his vote on me with a weak case. When I make a case against him lurking, he responds with a full case on me, seemingly OMGUS.

Nice attempt to twist all the situation. Strength of a case is a matter of point of view, I'm not going to discuss it. Also, if you have an actual reason to vote someone other than 'he/she voted me as well', then it's not an OMGUS. Let's try not to overuse those acronyms, without actual need, shall we?

It seemed as though he was sitting there with a vote on me, waiting around, not actually going for a lynch on me until after you (Nik) agreed with him. I think some pressure on him to get a good post up is in order.

Again, not really. I placed my vote in the early stage of the game, when every reason is good to place a vote. Coincidentally, no one actually seemed more scummy than you in the meanwhile, so the vote stayed. And that's the whole philosophy.

just forgot to answer a question (which I will get to after this post)

Looking forward to it.

[Col.Cathart]

Flave, mostly I see you looking for an information lynch, not a scumhunting lynch on Pom. I don't think it's a great reason to lynch someone, but your reasoning for what the lynch would provide works for me.

So you don't approve that way of scumhunting, but you're willing to support it?

[Col.Cathart]

Why I often lurk D1 (a response to Col and FF, who both wanted to know):

There are a lot of people in large games, and it's hard to keep track for the first day. After there's a lynch (and a NK) there's more information, and there's more to look back at, and it's easier to make connections between players. D1 is confusion, and I get intimidated, forgetting some people entirely.

Okay... So basically you just told me the same thing I did, using a bit different words. Interesting, that you voted me for that.

I wonder why Col is pushing for me to answer this.

When someone avoids the answer, I think that he/she has something to hide, so I press as hard as I can. And it benefited in the end. I got my answers, which is pretty... Interesting, gotta say.

It's not like he's done much scumhunting himself.

Yeah, that's why I ask you this. I'm trying to scumhunt more.

This isn't his normal meta; he normally acts helpful and pro-town, using good logic.

You mean that game where I was a scum?

[Col.Cathart]

Well the fact that I'm trying to scumhunt (and the only person you're looking at is me) seems to explain it well.

Voting for someone, for doing what you do usually sounds really weird. Even when this time you're trying to do otherwise. ESPECIALLY, when it's possible, you would continue to act like that if not my and FF's reaction.

Also, not the only person. I just asked question to zwet. Additional point from Iguana makes the thing even more interesting, and I await impatiently his answer. Also, I'm closely observing Blastinus, for reasons stated before + he started to lurk heavily. The fact, that you're a bit more active than them, and in my eyes also a bit more scummy, results in most of my attention directed at you. But not all.

[Col.Cathart]

Well, his overall action does not give enough material to say anything more than Iguana just stated. Or ask him for something more for than I just asked, for that matter, unless he'll come here and explain his latest actions. The same thing with Blast. I asked him one question, and he gave me one short answer, and then went to lurk some more. Be sure, I'll be the first one on his back, when he'll show up again. Talking to someone who does not respond is pointless.

And you're yet to tell me, why do you think, I'm scum for doing something you like to do normally (assuming you like to play like that as a townie of course).

[Col.Cathart]

And you're yet to tell me, why do you think, I'm scum for doing something you like to do normally (assuming you like to play like that as a townie of course).

She wasn't comparing your play to her play. She was comparing your play in this game to your play in other games.

a) It doesn't look like that from my point of view. She voted for me, immediately after breaking down my post as a 'I'm a scum lurker, and I'm going to scum lurk some more.' That's a clear signal, she finds this behavior scummy (otherwise, she wouldn't vote for me. She added that metagame argument later). Then, when asked about why she usually lurks on D1 in larger games, she basically said the same thing as me, but in a bit different words. If she's doing it as a townie, then why is she voting someone, who's doing what she's doing normally? I just don't get it.

b) If this is really the case, then...

Pom: Check the latest lynch in the game, where we played together, and you was replaced (Newbie 828). It's still ongoing, so we cannot discuss it, but I'm sure you'll find it interesting in terms of doing my meta (for other interested - Check my wiki for my completed and ongoing games).

Iguana: I think that Pom is more scummy than zwet, and so far her wagon has more gas, so I'm staying here for now. If there'll be bigger wagon against zwet, then sure, suspect #2 works for me as well, and I will join your case.

[Col.Cathart]

If I think that both of them can be scum, then why not? As long, as I'm going to lynch scum, everything is fine. I don't see anything wrong with that.

[Col.Cathart]

Yabba: this is the whole case against zwet:

I don't see a scumtell case on Pom at all.

Flave, mostly I see you looking for an information lynch, not a scumhunting lynch on Pom. I don't think it's a great reason to lynch someone,

but your reasoning for what the lynch would provide works for me

.

pshaw

And while zwet is acting completely the same as in my previous game with him, and he was a Doc in there, I think this actually I nice catch. That's why zwet is my #2 suspect.

Zaz, what's up with your re-read?

Grimmy, and Blastinus are lurking.

[Col.Cathart]

Blast: It's interesting though, how you jumped 12KB wagon when it had already some people on it, for pretty weak reason, and now you jumped on zwet wagon, for reasons, because he plays like typical zwet (Here you have an example. He behaved exactly the same with 'why is xxx still alive' etc. etc. and he was a Doc), and not because of, for example, his slip, which SpyreX already covered with details.

Also, does anyone else looks suspicious to you?

[Col.Cathart]

Re-read in progress.

[Col.Cathart]

Ok, my current thoughts after re-read (sorry it took so long. I just got back from the Soccer tournament on my university, and I had rest for some time ):

12KB/Antihero - Complete null. One was inactive and unhelpful. The second one made a decent start and disappeared as well. Last post by him was made whooping 11 days ago.

Mod, please prod or replace Antihero

Blastinus - Still scummy reading. Going after opportunistic wagons, refusal to give us some more thoughts. I know he's new to mafia scum, and he don't know most of the unwritten rules/tells here, but I'm not going to give him the 'get out of jail for free' card because of this this.

Dramonic - Never played with him, but for some reason I'm assuming, that's his normal playstyle. Anyone who played with him can confirm that? If yes, then I guess he's somewhere on the line between neutral and slightly pro-town.

Flava Flave - Strong town read ATM.

Grimmy - Tough stuff. He is always at the verge of inactivity prod (oh, btw:

Mod, please prod Grimmy

), but I'm getting gut town read from his posts so far.

H_H - Gut + meta town read. I personally believe he has a better chance of being SK rather than Mafia (if any).

Iguana - Still don't see that case on her. Maybe she's pushing that zwet wagon a bit to hard, but I can see reason why she would do that. Town read.

Nikanor - again, can someone tell me if this is his usual behavior, regardless of alignment? Gut town read.

Pomegranate - Still strong scum readings, for reasons mentioned earlier. She did nothing so far to convince me otherwise.

Scott Brosius - One sentence every few pages of discussion is not enough. I think that Iguana called him town waaay too fast. Neutral reading, leaning toward the scum parts of the axis.

Brothetnature/Skitzer - Usually that kind of posts, he's making should make me think he's pro town, but my gut screams something is wrong in here, although for now I cannot localize the problem. I'll certainly watch carefully his posts in later game.

SpyreX - I like his play so far. Town read.

Toro - Strong town read, although he IMO spends too much time on WarWound, especially when he's already sure, WW is scum. If so, you can go look for his partners.

WarWound - Gut scum read, especially after his last posts. Learn to play this game properly, or be lynched. Seriously.

Yabbaguy - Gut town read so far. I like his contribution to the game.

YankCane - Good Lord, he's still in this game? O.o

Hyl/Yankee - Null read. Let's see what Yankee will bring to the table.

Foilist/ZazieR - He promised us the storm, but so far I don't see even a single cloud. He was pretty inactive in my other game with him too, but he lately picked up the activity there, so maybe we'll finally get to hear his revelations.

Zwet - typical zwet + one slip. Leaning scum.

My vote stays on Pom for now, although unfortunately her wagon lost all the steam, so in the face of the deadline I'll probably change the vote for zwet or WW.

[Col.Cathart]

no

Ok...

unvote

vote: zwetschenwasser

[Col.Cathart]

You know, that you are already performing overkill? That's 12th vote already.

[Col.Cathart]

Vote: Pomegranate

. My top scum pick for Day 1. So far nothing happened, to change it in any way...

[Col.Cathart]

Vote: Abandon Game

This game is out of control right now in terms of player inactivity. This isn't even fair to town anymore.

I'm absolutely against it. One of my last games was a win, only because of 3 fresh replacement (all of them entered the game almost at the same point), who brought a lot to the table, and made the pace of the game incredibly fast.

[Col.Cathart]

Blargh, Exams...

I'll try to do re-read later today.

[Col.Cathart]

Ok, I guess nothing really happened since my last post. I still like my vote on Pom, though I'm willing to switch for Zaz as well. He posted regularly in other game, I'm in, so his not posting here, ESPECIALLY after promising us some major revelation is really scummy.

[Col.Cathart]

Stranger: Ok, now I'm curious. You're mentioning Hyl and Flava for following the 12KB wagon. Blastinus also did it, and IMO in much worse manner than others. And yet, you didn't mention it. In fact, you mention him only once during your whole post, but it's enough to place him on 'neutral' list. It looks weird to me. Like you want to have clear path to either oppose ar approve his possible lynch in the future (via stating he's neutral), but not brining any possible arguments against him, even if you can (I assume, you spotted that as well, if you already looked at people on 12KB wagon). Care to expand your point of view on Blast?

[Col.Cathart]

Ok, sorry guys for low post frequency lately. Mid-term finals and Assassin's Creed II ate the whole lot of my time usually available for some scumhunting. Thankfully, tomorrow morning, I'll have the last exam, so I'll probably be able to do some recap.

[Col.Cathart]

Ugh, sorry guys. I just wrote the last Mid-Term final today, and I was busy celebrating it. Too drunk now to post anything of value. I'll be back tomorrow with some actual content, after I'll sober up.

[Col.Cathart]

Finally some free time. I'm doing re-read right now. Post should be done in a while.

[Col.Cathart]

Ok, re-read done.

First of all, may I ask those people who were all for Hyl/Yankee/Saberwolf lynch before Michel's case came in, what's the reasoning behind it? It looks like I missed something, as I don't see anything lynch-worthy in any of their behaviors.

Secondly, what happened to Skitzer case made by Iguana at the beginning of the day? I actually liked that case, as Skitzer was giving me unexplained gut-scum feelings. It died under all those posts lately, and I feel, it should be brought back to attention.

Thirdly, I think that Yabba/Michel/Spyrex discussion reached the point, where everyone has a solid, unchangeable point on any of discussed case. And so, I think, anyone should conclude his standpoint, and quit it, since I don't really see any way to squeeze something more from it.

That said, I don't agree with both cases on Michel and Yabba. I have town reads on both of them so far. This looks like to me like a typical, mildly aggressive discussion between two misguided townies. Usually in that kind of situations, scum just sits back, smiles, and sometimes adds some small question/points to keep the forest burning. Just like Nikanor with his question to Michel in post 799. That kind of questions will only make this (IMO pointless already) discussion even longer. I don't like it.

FoS: Nikanor

In other news: I still have some iffy vibes on StrangerCoug. Mostly because:

a) I still find it unusual, that he isn't mentioning Blast's hop on 12KB wagon, even in his expanded stance, after I pointed it out. If you already call 2 people out for doing the same thing, then I don't see any logical reason, why this argument is not mentioned against someone who is 'neutral' in your books. For the future note, I think if either Blast/his replacement or Stranger (with Serial Clergyman on the board, I cannot use SC anymore ) will flip scum, the other one has a good chance of being one as well

b) You replaced Zazier. I was (and still am) playing with him in another game (and you should know well which one, as you're modding it ). He promised us some major revelations about this game, but then disappeared. He also did it in that other game, so I thought 'he's inactive. Fine.' But then, he started posting back in other game, but not here. I don't like it, and Zaz earned some scummy points with that action, and they came on your account, when you replaced him.

FoS: StrangerCoug

Despite all of this, my vote stays on Pom, unless Hohum will return from his forced V/LA and change my point of view with better play. Her play on D1 is still something, no one else is even close to match in terms of scuminess.

[Col.Cathart]

One, ZazieR is female. Two, don't discuss ongoings.

1)Noted

2)Not ongoing anymore

[Col.Cathart]

Skitzer or Hyl are my prefered lynches, 12kb is an acceptable one (possibly yabba too). Not overly keen on any other at this point though.

I'll repeat my question, since the first one was ignored:

What is the reasoning behind Hyl/Yankee/Saberwolf except from voting outside of the wagon at the end of the day?

[Col.Cathart]

Personally, I would be willing to support a Saberwolf lynch because of post #134 by Hyl. Zwet was lynchbait day 1. It is likely that the mafia decided to push his lynch when they had the chance. Hyl's #134 fits that picture exactly.

Fair enough, though I'm still far from calling him obvscum. On the other hand, Saberwolf so far he's not helping the town, as he's doing completely nothing, so his lynch isn't really that bad at this point...

I'm interested to finally see some insight from Hohum.

Lynches, I'm fine with: Hohum, StrangerCoug, Nikanor, Blastinus.

Lynches I can support if deadline will demand it: lurkers.

[Col.Cathart]

I was waiting for somebody to call me on my lurking

ok then, time to read the remaining 20 pages...

Wait... You're actually saying, you were lurking deliberately?

[Col.Cathart]

yes, I am.

oh, did scum just make the game too easy for you? My bad

Ugh.

Unvote

vote: Saberwolf

[Col.Cathart]

But what if your supposed "idiot-town" is the smart one here?

saberwolf's self-vote has reenergized the game and potentially brought out a lot of bandwagoning scum.

And your point is?

His self-vote did spark discussion, but for Christ sake, this isn't a towntell.

As for my current point of view, I still like that lynch. I wasn't entirely buying MSH's logic against Hyl, but there Saberwolf came with his lurking bullshit. And then it all went even more downhill from there. Actually his self-vote is probably the thing I have the least problems with.

[Col.Cathart]

lynch me?

Oh, how I wish, I would be a double-voter in a situation like that...

[Col.Cathart]

Combined forces of new job and university pretty much drained 99% of my time and strength to write and contribute here. I'll try to actually be useful the first moment I'll have some free time and energy to play this game, which should be tomorrow (hopefully).

[Col.Cathart]

Ok, I still don't have much free time, but I tried to re-read day 2, and make some notes...

And the main observation is: I still cannot understand that SK kill. During D2, Clergyman (at least I think it was him), pointed out, that SK will be more likely to hunt for mafia during the night. This is a good point, so I read the thread to see, if anyone was really against MSH. And... I'm still nowhere. Scoug voted for him, but quickly retracted, as he realized his reasons weren't really good. Spyrex was voting for MSH... Because he thought, Michel was the SK. D'oh. Also MSH had an argument with Yabba, but that was more Michel attacking Yabba, not otherwise.

So yeah, this trail is dead, unfortunately. As soon as I'll catch up with my other games, I'll try to read those walls from Michel to see something more than pointless discussions with Spyrex.

And so, back to the scumhunt we go... I gotta check Flava's reads on people and see if he was suspicious of someone specific. I didn't check his case on Kreriov, who had a vote from FF at the end of the day, so I'm not going to push this topic until I'll actually read the arguments.

Flava was also one of the supporters of Pom/Hohum lynch. Me too, since early D1. I don't really think, hohum's 'forgetting' about the game is such a towntell. I had a game here already, when one of the scum 'forgot' about the game (or did he?) which helped him ride to the coast to LyLo, and eventually hammer, because not much of people even bothered to take a good look on him.

Bottom line: Pom's behavior screams 'scum!' to me. Hohum did nothing to change my opinion. And now Flava, one of the Pom lynch supporters, is dead.

vote: Hohum

I hope this time people will pick this one up. I know it may look like another 'easy lynch' but my gut just cannot let this one be.

Though, I'll check the thread again, when I'll have some time, especially Flava on D2. Maybe this will open my mind for more options.

[Col.Cathart]

Nikanor earns himself a vote, not a cookie.

unvote

vote: Nikanor

His play raised my alarm already during D2, when he was trying to keep alive that pointless discussion between MSH/Yabba/Spyrex.

And about D3, I have a theory:

Someone (Clergyman, I think): Ok that's it. No more lynching VI-like players.

Scum Nikanor: So... If I'll start acting like a VI... They won't lynch me. Awesome!


-------

Clergyman: Although MSH kill doesn't make any sense from SK, I still think it was him, not mafia. Why? I don't have much time to find it unfortunately, but I remember, that during my newbie times, I was checking all the roles posted on the wiki. One of them was a Flavor Cop or something like that, who insted of getting guilty/innocent result, got a gun/no gun, where mafia, cop, vigilante are the roles that can have a gun. Serial Killer was excluded from the 'gun' list, because his weapon of choice is usually knife.

So now, when I see, that one killing source is using a gun, and second is choking it's victims, I'm going to say Mafia shoots, because SK is not using the gun

[Col.Cathart]

Sure it did. You just didn't say anything back then because it was better to keep it a secret, right?

Bad memory?

[Col.Cathart]

Ohhhhhh an FoS and a one-liner. Spooky.

It was enough.

In fact, one liner is enough to sum up your entire performance in this game, so...

Even if this was true, I 'started acting like a VI' before SerialClergyman wrote his spiel on not lynching the easy targets.

Unless that's your plan with Clergyman for D3 (yes, I am suggesting you being buddies).

And by the way: Why are you trying to look like a VI?

[Col.Cathart]

That is not the impression I intend to give, I assure you. If it looks that way to you, it's because I've completely lost track of this game after not keeping up with the game for the week or so before the deadline. I'm just starting to regain my bearings now.

...

Ok, I still don't know, why are you writing 'weeeee' type posts, and follows the random wagon, if you lost the track of the game, instead of saying typical 'sorry for inactivity, re-reading thread right now'.

But fair enough, I'll wait impatiently for you proving me wrong.

Also, the one-liner was enough to place an FoS on me, yet you still kept your weak vote on Pom, despite nothing coming of it. Why?

IMO this vote is far from being weak. Pom played terribly during D1, and jumped on me for doing exactly the same thing she was doing. Then she disappeared, came again, disappeared again, she got replaced by someone who still didn't move his ass up here.

Bottom line: Pom was terribly scummy, and further inactivity of both her, and hohum, is doing nothing to change it. Unfortunately, no one seems to follow this trail (except from Honcho, who now disappeared as well), so I have to go the other way.

Mod: Can you please prod those, who still didn't post anything during D3?

[Col.Cathart]

Why are you voting me now, then, instead of hohum? What changed? Is it really that one 'wheeee' post that makes the difference between myself being scummier than Pom to you?

Uh... I said it already. Vote on Hohum is a dead vote, as long as people will not even acknowledge his existence in this game... You're not scummier than Pom/Hohum, but at this point voting for him makes no sense, so I'm voting you.

[Col.Cathart]

Just like it made no sense to stay on hohum for so long yesterday. I think the only thing that's changed is that now I'm the easy target. Is this a correct assessment of the situation, or am I missing something?

You missed Honcho and Flava supporting my stance, which could eventually lead to Pom/Hohum wagon. Now they are both gone, and no one else even cares about Hohum.

.... I don't like any time this early in a day when someone says "Yea, they are scummier, but..."

If you don't like it, then do me a favor and at least reread Pom, instead of ignoring her existence and bashing me for seeing the futility of being the only one to see her scuminess.

[Col.Cathart]

Just like it made no sense to stay on hohum for so long yesterday. I think the only thing that's changed is that now I'm the easy target. Is this a correct assessment of the situation, or am I missing something?

Oh, almost forgot.

You're not easy target. You're scummy.

[Col.Cathart]

So yeah, what I said. I find it funny that you wouldn't just answer the question directly.

I don't know what do you mean with this line. I said the exact same thing about Flava and Honcho earlier.

[Col.Cathart]

I could get behind the wagon on SCoug, as I suspected him during D2. Also, that flip would help me determine Blastinus's/His replacement's alignment.

That being said, I still would like to see Nikanor lynch more than SCoug. Partially it's a gut thingy, partially the comparison between D2 and D3, but I don't think this time it's typical 'VI VT' behavior.

[Col.Cathart]

@Col.Cathart: At 1104, you claim a Blastinus link could be drawn from Coug's flip. How come?

Damn, I was digging this thread once again to find those specific posts, only to learn that one is the very second of Scoug, and the second one was already linked by me a couple of pages earlier

Here you have Scoug's first analysis of the game.

And here you have my thoughts about his post.

Basically, I think, that if SCoug is scum, then Blastinus/Danakillsu is probably scum as well.

[Col.Cathart]

Hey again, Sotty!

Greetings Amished. I hope you'll be more active than your predecessor.

Not much came up since my last post I see.

Mod: I will be V/LA from Wednesday 23 to Monday 28, due to Christmas.

I don't have much time now, but I'll try to do a recap post before leaving.

[Col.Cathart]

I'm back from my Christmas holiday!

It's awfully late for me now, so give me a few hours to sleep, and I should re-read, post and be open for discussion with still some hours left before the deadline.

[Col.Cathart]

Ok, first some answers to questions pointed at me:

So you are thinking that the SK is looking for the mafia? So why is the trail dead with Spy here? Do you not think he could be the SK that killed MS? I am not 100% on your thought process here unless you are only looking for the mafia.

I don't have a clue right now, tbh (to be honest - that's for Heilograph), but at the time I thought it's very possible, as SK will lose with the town, if Mafia will have majority. The trail was dead with SpyreX, as it made no logical sense to me to kill someone you accuse of being SK, when you are a SK yourself. If SpyreX will turn out to be SK, I will be very surprised.

If I haven't made myself clear this time as well, please tell me.

However you simply say “Bottom line: Pom's behavior screams 'scum!' to me.” What behavior? Why is it scummy? Elaboration please.

I thought, I explained it already:

- She said, she always acts scummy at the beginning of larger games.

- She refused to answer my question about what she is trying to accomplish by that

- She voted me after I said, that I'm sorry for not giving 100% of my abilities, and staying outside of the discussion, as I found 20+ player game very confusing and hard to manage.

- After very long drill from me and Flava, she finally answered the question why she acts scummy a the beginning of every large game, and it's because... She founds 20+ player game very confusing and hard to manage

(!!!)

At this point my scumdar exploded. She voted for me and named me scum for doing EXACTLY THE SAME THING, she's doing at the start of every large game. WTF? If she's acting like that as a pro-town player, then why in the nine hells did she vote for me? It makes no sense from town perspective.

Do you think Hohum and Nik are possible scum buddies? Is Nik your number two target? (Assuming that Hohum is your number one)

Possibly but not necessarily. I wouldn't be surprised if they would both flip scum (Pom's vote against Nik could've been an early try to distance themselves).

That should do for the answers. If someone have something more, and I missed it - please point it out.

Scumhunt post is coming very soon, as I'll be back from basketball practice.

[Col.Cathart]

unvote

vote: Amished

I love you people. This is exactly the lynch I wanted to see. Case on Pom was already presented in my previous post, and add the latest efforts of Amished to derail the wagon nicely sums it all up.

[Col.Cathart]

Good lord, read the discussion from early D3. I'm tired of repeating myself over and over again.

Until Amished came, no one even cared to take a look at Pom/hohum. I tried to convince everyone to look in that direction, but no one listened. I decided to go for other scum suspects, as no one even bothered to help me with that lynch... Until now at least.

[Col.Cathart]

Ok, after checking Iguana in ISO, my wild guess is, she never actually hit any scum with her investigation, or she's hiding that breadcrumb really well.

Gonna do some re-read.

[Col.Cathart]

You're scum, too.

Ok, now that's just funny. Is it still because I voted for you on D3? After you failed to prove me that you are NOT acting like a VI on purpose?

vote: Sotty7

Let's see, where this trail will lead.

[Col.Cathart]

I have a theory about SK.

Dramonic was as good n1 shot as anyone, and Nik knew him before from other games. If I recall correctly, Nik was also questioning MSH, voting for Coug on D3, AND voting for Kreriov on D4. So yeah, I think Nikanor is our Serial Killer. Mafia is still a bigger threat though, so I'll leave him for now, especially, if he'll manage to shoot one more scum along the way.

Grimmy still seems obv town at this point, though I have to admit, I'm actually surprised, he's alive after last night, especially because Skitzer wasn't beyond any suspicion (unless Mafia is doing SK hunt themselves).

I have strong town feelings on Clergyman. He seemed genuinely convinced, mafia was strangling, and SK was shooting (the point, that I think is destroyed completely after last night). I don't think scum members, who exactly knew who killed who, would act like that.

So that leaves Heilograph, KoC, Yabba and SpyreX in my mind.

vote: Yabbaguy

Due to the discussions on late D4.

If I had to choose right now another scum, that would be Heil probably. Honcho wasn't very active during the game, and Heil stuck in my mind after asking pointless trivia questions instead of scumhunting near the deadline on D3.

I haven't re-read Kreriov's or Sotty's game though, so my opinion may change, after I'll re-read them.

[Col.Cathart]

Why did you hammer Sotty so quickly yesterday?

Truth to be told, I didn't look at other people voting, and I didn't check the count, so I was quite surprised to see, that actually I threw a hammer here. I did good though, I think...

He couldn't find a cop breadcrumb?

Ok, I agree, my bad. I have no excuses for myself, except from late hour of reading this thing and I just didn't add 2 with two. But as I said, yes, that's my mistake.

Look at his interactions with Anti-hero/12kb.

I see, where you're coming at with 12KB. All I have to say, is that I really thought that wagon was way too fast at the time, and since some people hoped on it 'just because' (I'm looking at Foilist [later Coug] and Blast [later KoC], I was against it, as I smelled some scum driven wagon.

And AH? I don't see much here, especially with the amount of his contribution. He came, did one recap post, name me, Blast and Nik scum, and gone away. Not really incriminating IMO (though if someone is a fan of Chaos theories, he may suggest he planted here one of his buddies within the rest of [town] suspects, but in this case why me, and not Blast or Nik?), so I don't see your point here.

[Col.Cathart]

I wanted to lynch Sotty for this kind of crap. Why would you make the same mistake your buddy did? Also, this just seems incredibly out of character for you. You see a lynch coming and want to placate your attackers. That's just scummy.

Out of character? Sorry, but that just means, you don't know my character. One of my personal traits is ability to actually admit your own mistake, when you make one (I developed it in myself, mostly because i just HATE people who cannot admit their mistakes, and think they are beyond any critique).

Also, re-read coming soon.

[Col.Cathart]

Just wrote one exam, and I have another 2 during the next three days. Consider this as a

V/LA until Thursday

, because it's unlikely I'll have even a little shred of attention away from studying... ~^

[Col.Cathart]

Back from V/LA

Currently catching up with all of my games. Re-read and post coming up.

unvote

. I want to look at all situations with clear eye.

[Col.Cathart]

*Sigh*

I'm terribly sorry for this, but please, replace me out.

I just got my schedule for upcoming exams from 15th January to 15 February, and looking at amount of them, I know, I won't have time to be as active as I should be in this game. I would rather to opt out rather than to be one of the anchors dragging this game down.

Once again, sorry to you all, especially you, semi...

[Col.Cathart]

I thought it was interesting that on night three Col.Cathart was originally contemplating killing SpyreX, but after the way day three ended he changed his mind and killed StrangerCoug instead. The change would have drastically affected the outcome of the game.

*sigh*

To add insult to the injury, I was planning to gun down Spyrex during the next night, if I would be still playing that game and manage to avoid lynch.

Sorry Nul for leaving you a doomed spot.

Also, thanks a lot town - I was helping you by taking down Kre, and his flip was the main reason you lynched me/Nul. God damn...

[Col.Cathart]

May I ask what your reasoning was for killing me on night 2, Col. Cathart? Spyrex seemed to believe I was SK, and that was the only SK discussion going on. I would have expected that you would keep me alive as a lightning rod.

Dramonic was pretty much random shot, but I smiled when someone started creating link between Dramonic's death and Iguana as an SK by you. So I decided to shoot you as well, and see if we can get somewhere in that direction ;]