Open 869 | Fight for the Winter Court [Game Over!]

[Isis]

VOTE: Prism I can't resist kawaii wave I love it every time
Pedit: well now the fun is sullied

[Isis]

I think chemistry between people will matter more for games than like "put a consensus townread in game x" because townreads can be wrong if you get them all right you win anyway. Maybe picking scummy players for certain games kind of like gerrymanders your EV though? Maybe that's more impactful.

It seems like a nontrivial setup, brainwrinkler. Which can make me worried about dayplay health.

Coral should just solve the strat and then we should play mafia

[Isis]

I think chemistry between people will matter more for games than like "put a consensus townread in game x" because townreads can be wrong if you get them all right you win anyway. Maybe picking scummy players for certain games kind of like gerrymanders your EV though? Maybe that's more impactful.

It seems like a nontrivial setup, brainwrinkler. Which can make me worried about dayplay health.

Coral should just solve the strat and then we should play mafia

the second sentence here makes no sense to me but it does sound very intelligent.

but i think i agree on the point that the important thing is finding scum and finding town and the rest will fall where it falls.

It's not a fully fleshed out idea but my brain was saying like, if you make all 3 games barely successfully sortable then your EV is high, if you pick that out by hedging the difficult players with easy games and easy players with hard games

[Isis]

As I say that it sounds like one of the nine zillion things that is actually+EV but consistently damages town dayplay then winrate more than it helps if it goes into everyone's headspace

[Isis]

I'm pretty indifferent at the end of the day. I think Gate would be pretty fun to run-back, and puts scum in between a rock and a hard place. I think Wall would be a bad fit but I'd get to play longer. I think Keep is really suited to my playstyle, but I want to hang around and enjoy the game for awhile and that tends to resolve early. It's a good place to quarantine me, but I'm also hoping that enough people have strong scumgames here that I get to go elsewhere.

I generally oppose Coral's suggestion and am curious to hear more of the reasoning behind it.

I had the same thought pregame that probably quarantining you to the one you are likely enjoy least is not as necessary in this run as the previous one.

Which suggestion do you disagree with? The flexible solve order, or the closely examining early decisioners?

I think chemistry between people will matter more for games than like "put a consensus townread in game x" because townreads can be wrong if you get them all right you win anyway. Maybe picking scummy players for certain games kind of like gerrymanders your EV though? Maybe that's more impactful.

It seems like a nontrivial setup, brainwrinkler. Which can make me worried about dayplay health.

Coral should just solve the strat and then we should play mafia

the second sentence here makes no sense to me but it does sound very intelligent.

but i think i agree on the point that the important thing is finding scum and finding town and the rest will fall where it falls.

It's not a fully fleshed out idea but my brain was saying like, if you make all 3 games barely successfully sortable then your EV is high, if you pick that out by hedging the difficult players with easy games and easy players with hard games

Who's difficult and who's easy to you?

It could include the game state in addition to general strengths and weaknesses. Coral is broken and needs to be nerfed though.
Skitter and I probably shouldn't be in the same game t_t

[Isis]

I quoted 33 because I wanted to ask about quarantining faker in the first game but then I decided to not flood a game that's already 90 mph but I guess I'm asking now. Isn't making a slot miserable -EV?

[Isis]

someone came out of retirement only to roll scum in this game, what a hilariously cruel fate

Are you calling Faker scum or saying this whole playerlist is retirementers

[Isis]

P much everyone in this list is an awesome player that I want to be unable to retire.

While I am permitted to retire whenever I want.

[Isis]

VLA Saturday

[Isis]

Chara's new avi is too good

[Isis]

I think the optimal approach here is to find all the scum day 1, then hard townread all of them, lock into the gate, and hope they make me IC for my wrong reads and then boom I turn on them

This made me laugh. Any one who makes me laugh at my screen is town right?

Last time it was Meuh right?

I'm a scientist

[Isis]

I keep reading Chara's signature and thinking "god that is metal af who wrote that"

[Isis]

I think I'd prefer if catboi's promise to play in some kind of vibes instead of reads was more [[show don't tell]]

[Isis]

I have this odd feeling that skitter's *here*.

Demona seems sincere about being easily found as town, Do people who've played with them before agree?

Coral feels pretty town.

I tried to check whether Demona had been eliminated in a game where I remembered town!Demona being unduly suspected, but it turned out Demona was NKed even in that one. I think Demona's playstyle isn't enough of a transparently cased Game Boy for Demona to like eat Inventor shots night 1 (which I kind of seem to be in a handful of my games historically) but I think the proposed strategy is pretty databacked.

Demona is asking for the minigame where you vote for a townie and win, right, not the one where you 1v1?

I wish there were flavor driven names S_S you made Undertale and then you strayed so far from god

pedit: if Chara didn't know me from Adam i would dysphoria cry until April but then I would also townread it so far

skitter actually participates in her own real life to the exclusion of mafia and I don't think her activity can be anything indicative. Like she actually unplugs.

[Isis]

wait i actually thought S_S was in this lobby I wouldn't tease him if he wasn't here

[Isis]

My pronoun is she I know you're not trying to maliciously misgender me but they is a synonym for "I clocked you and want to finish this convo quickly without figuring you which kind of thing you are" in my day to day life so I don't love it ok

[Isis]

I think Coral knows to post her mech talk because it's town stuff it's town and knows to post it if she's scum because it's CoNtEnT. cOnTeNt does win games. I think it's strategically inaccurate, same as Faker, I don't draw much alignment from sharing it though

[Isis]

*it's town stuff if town

[Isis]

viewtopic.php?p=13224635&f=7#p13224635
Staff couldn't figure out how to handle the transition any better than that. It's not associated with 3.3 which is unreleased

[Isis]

tempted to sheep skitter on Coral read.

except it isn't a sheep, it's a goat. baaaaa.

hello again Isis, i missed you. what do you think about all these townreads you got?

I think if skitter wanted to pocket me she wouldn't pick 36 37.
I think Coral posting that her townreads are light and then randomly posting two hard townreads is eyebrows.
That's all I remember. Do you townread me?

[Isis]

have I done enough to unlock the full new york times article yet coral

[Isis]

I think it's strategically inaccurate, same as Faker

I'm curious about your strategic disagreements here

A telegraphed and calcified gamestate actually creates a divergence between what scum and town are doing and benefits town. If scum are owning the game, they will line everything up and blow it up yes but it's not actually spotlighting something that's a difference between won and lost games.

Image of game where town telegraphed their reads too much:

Spoiler:

(not using a meme because I think your stance is meme level bad, just because it's a nice ref to get to make)

[Isis]

tempted to sheep skitter on Coral read.

except it isn't a sheep, it's a goat. baaaaa.

hello again Isis, i missed you. what do you think about all these townreads you got?

I think if skitter wanted to pocket me she wouldn't pick 36 37.
I think Coral posting that her townreads are light and then randomly posting two hard townreads is eyebrows.
That's all I remember. Do you townread me?

Coral, are you ready to talk about Isis townread? :>

to answer you Isis, i have no read on you yet.

whoa we simulposted!

[Isis]

Oh, was my joke really that bad? Perhaps my humour is too subtle and advanced

what was the bad joke

[Isis]

I think the optimal approach here is to find all the scum day 1, then hard townread all of them, lock into the gate, and hope they make me IC for my wrong reads and then boom I turn on them

completely unrelated to my previous post, I hard townread Isis and Faker

I thought I laid it on pretty thick but maybe not

Oh I think the mistaken scumcount made the joke hard to follow, since you'd want to name a full set of fail in the basic version of that joke.

[Isis]

What does that even mean in this context

I think it feels to me like if you had thought about it on a deeper level then you wouldn't have found it to be a significant point. That may be my own bias in the situation, but still, it feels like when I attempt to guide you towards why I believe that to be the case, you are uninterested in trying.

It doesn't feel like an engagement meant to sort me, it feels like you've decided your point and don't want to look into it any further. Which, realistically, is your right! It still feels a bit wrong to me, though.

mmm, 'guiding her' is an interesting choice of words. aren't you trying to read skitter here, not guide her? is her read on you scummy to you?

Yes, guiding her towards the deeper meaning behind her point. I think I was clearly asking leading questions of her. She doesn't have to follow them if she doesn't want to, obviously.

Both for the goal of seeing if she did have a deeper meaning/analysis behind her point (and I didn't much like the fact that she didn't seem to), and for the goal of hopefully bringing us closer to finding each other as town if she is.

i think you have an interesting playstyle and an odd way of speaking that's easy to scumread offhand.

how can I gain this power

[Isis]

I wanna play whatever minigame has Chara in it and I will figure out how that is me playing to wincon later

[Isis]

what power!

i don't want to play the minigame with Isis because i want Isis to be town so i don't need to read her.

Actually when you put it that way you are arguably the best player in lobby at reading me. Have we found another state where there is a +EV +MV minigame arrangement?

[Isis]

I think 266 is funnee and therefore it's +EV

[Isis]

what power!

i don't want to play the minigame with Isis because i want Isis to be town so i don't need to read her.

Actually when you put it that way you are arguably the best player in lobby at reading me. Have we found another state where there is a +EV +MV minigame arrangement?

am i really? i don't remember how to read you! don't make me meta myself Isis, i don't want tooooo.

I snowed every other townie in Nightmare while you scumread me, then I NKed you and won the game

[Isis]

I really need to pack

[Isis]

Gate
catboi
skitter30
Isis

This is, uh, interesting

And g'nite to all

since it's gate it'd be impossible for us to be unconfirmed town v unconfirmed town and explosions

I'm guessing the post is not about catboi but it'd apply to him too

[Isis]

I still need to pack but pandora is on my lap and it'd disturb her

[Isis]

Is the point of 280 to paradoxically make Tammy play worse or actually give good advice my brain is getting wineswapped

ok pandora got up if i post in this thread yell at me that i'm looking at 6 hours of sleep or less

[Isis]

my gf said Pandora should be able to sit on the table during my regionals matches and I agree that absolutely should be allowed

T_T

Good night Chara!

[Isis]

I think I’m on page three and I have no real thoughts other than liking demona’s early game and belief she’ll be easily found. But that’s because it feels a bit like me and that’s dangerous, so we’ll see.

why dangerous?

like do you think

the other players are potentially just going to ignore me and assume i am town?

or

do you think

that i have a mental database of all the things i am commonly townread for to draw upon to be townread here

which i mean, i would assumedly also dip into this as town as well

or

are you saying it would be dangerous to trust you in a vacuum

and you see similarities between us

or

?

I read this post and a fire alarm went off in my ears.



Everyone walked out of the building to the south parking lot as the standard evacuation procedure. It's very cold today so I stood in the parking lot with my head down and my hands in my armpits while everyone else seems fine happy chatting. Then this man who works in my building said I looked really cold and convinced me to go stand in one of the buildings that is not on fire even though policywise I should be in the designated area for headcounts. He said he would tell people where I was if my name started getting asked.
Idk if this is benevolent sexism but the feeling in my toes is coming back so

[Isis]

It’s that it’s dangerous for me to go oh demona feels like town to me because the way she’s asserting her ability to be read as town feels very similar to how I feel about my own play and confidence that when I’m town it’s obvious and most people will find that. It’s dangerous because it’s kinda projecting and I don’t know your capabilities as scum.

It’s just the same type of dangerous when someone goes, “this person is town because they’re making the same comments I was thinking when I read the game. They’re seeing the game the same as me so they’re town.” While sometimes true it’s just an egotistical read that can throw off all your reads.

So I like your posts surrounding that because I identify with it, but that’s a dangerous slope for me to fall into so I try to hold myself in check. I’m not sure if any of that makes sense.

I think I rolled scum with demona once and demona wasn't very confident so it might not be very dangerous anyway. Not as bad as your confidence level in scumsman maybe but less pumped than demona's towngames

[Isis]

Coral and demona are my favorite picks for town atp.

[Isis]

wouldn’t that also tie up one of their night movements making shenanigans less likely?

bucket

Posting psycho pass spoilers is +EV +MV

[Isis]

Oh that was in my quote queue to ask what that post means

[Isis]

Coral made me laugh, at paramount.

The retrospective of her early reads as corrected is a lot better than her misunderstood one. I haven't been chipper enough to radiate light this game and wait-and-see is actually an optimized way to fish for the Isis-hates-being-scum-tell, aggressive page 5s on me tend to false positive or fix the energy problem for scumisis.
I guess I have a more vivid picture of how she's trying to push the game into an unfogged state than like catboi as an outlier or everybody else generally (including demona fwiw, different reasoning there)

[Isis]

Oh that was in my quote queue to ask what that post means

It's a bookmark. I want to revisit something in Tammy's post later.

Why later

There's players where delayed reveal investigations are all kinds of spicy to me and none of them rhyme with Cammy

[Isis]

Coral made me laugh, at paramount.

The retrospective of her early reads as corrected is a lot better than her misunderstood one. I haven't been chipper enough to radiate light this game and wait-and-see is actually an optimized way to fish for the Isis-hates-being-scum-tell, aggressive page 5s on me tend to false positive or fix the energy problem for scumisis.
I guess I have a more vivid picture of how she's trying to push the game into an unfogged state than like catboi as an outlier or everybody else generally (including demona fwiw, different reasoning there)

you always radiate light!

and i feel the same about Coral, though it was more the delay in realizing that she conducts herself in A Way and that focusing on that feels like the wrong way to read her, putting that aside her play does ring townish.

but also, i've been trying so hard, you don't see how i'm trying to move the game forward myself?

Not to the same degree. I like that your comfort level seems high but like I believe you would post funnee minigame assignments as both alignments. If there's other vapor trails I'm missing them

[Isis]

Coral and demona are my favorite picks for town atp.

feel like you are usually more wary of me especially given we had like a two day lead time and you know my feelings on having a set gamestart time

kinda wonder how you are differentiating coral’s like ‘pushing the game’ from a mafia with like, a prepared approach

I was really impressed with gacha mafia and really unimpressed with our rand together. Your approach to this game seems really different from that one, especially because if you're scum here you're doing some kind of carrying play and you were collaborative in our game together (which I can't find, I have so many vibes from it but so little in the way of physical notes >_< ).
I definitely was way more wary of you between gacha and that last game

[Isis]

As for the latter part idk vibes? I don't really like "what's the scheme" paradigms in general and have already rejected them once this game.

[Isis]

Coral made me laugh, at paramount.

The retrospective of her early reads as corrected is a lot better than her misunderstood one. I haven't been chipper enough to radiate light this game and wait-and-see is actually an optimized way to fish for the Isis-hates-being-scum-tell, aggressive page 5s on me tend to false positive or fix the energy problem for scumisis.
I guess I have a more vivid picture of how she's trying to push the game into an unfogged state than like catboi as an outlier or everybody else generally (including demona fwiw, different reasoning there)

Hmm not sure I follow that completely, but I’ll revisit it if I have questions.

I originally asked because at the time you posted it, my opinion was that I liked her posts generally but the majority of it was setup discussion which shouldn’t really be ai, but since then I’ve gotten to the interaction with skitter and chara, and I liked her posts there and came out of it a little suspicious of chara.

Setup discussion can be a little AI. Setup discussion can be a Wall-E or an Eve.

[Isis]

Also no clue where the Isis thing comes from. Her experience with you is more limited IIRC and she's more likely to just townread you for NAI reasons as a result.

From catboi's pov it's not relevant whether I'd townread his scumgames right?
I can play with catboi because catboi is not two people and that leaves room for Chara

Pedit: well see isn't faker x catboi more beautiful

[Isis]

I guess it's kinda natural to want to be townread on merit as town, I do too, but if you think about it there's no bonus win% over charismaballing people with STAB 24/7

[Isis]

Also no clue where the Isis thing comes from. Her experience with you is more limited IIRC and she's more likely to just townread you for NAI reasons as a result.

From catboi's pov it's not relevant whether I'd townread his scumgames right?

Yes, but see 382. We want to put people in that are likely to get an accurate read regardless of the person's alignment, not "Don't worry this strategy works BECAUSE I'm town"

Idgi unless you mean third parties prefer that strategy, then of course. From town!cat's pov it makes sense doesnt it?

[Isis]

No I think you'd still hate it it's just about moral ambiguity. If you don't like that part it's not like a good action anime.

Actually I almost universally dislike action anime maybe I shouldn't opinion

[Isis]

You can win this whole setup if you just bet your whole wallet one person is scum and bet your whole wallet one person is town right(?)

[Isis]

i've decided my group is Isis/Chara and whoever else wants to be there. not Keep because Chara doesn't want Keep. this is my only stipulation and it is serious

[Isis]

I'm boarding my flight. Don't go to wall without me Charaa

I don't think I can draw alignment from demona's lolvote. It didn't fit the game as a while fmpov but it would make sense to demona.

[Isis]

I don't care which game I play

[Isis]

They're calling my boardnunber

[Isis]

So are you saying you've been saying "I want to hug you instead of beat you at mafia" to 8 slots all game because you rolled town and lost wim?

[Isis]

Idr the self stuff helps reading you I remember it feeling obstructive in tiaragame

[Isis]

i'm going to wait for Isis to return and then join the Wall with her unless someone stops me. :>

I'm reading up, were there stops?

[Isis]

I will go anywhere!

[Isis]

The lyft is so warm

[Isis]

what if you just pick the location with the cutest name

Keep is probably plus EV but it's less fun because if I find Chara is town i want that to be not-extraneous

[Isis]

I love Isis but the thought of her as the clear does scare me maybe we do throw her in the Wall after all

I'm not good at reads at least nowadays, but I won the last time I was IC in a dance game!

[Isis]

I feel like I've fluffposted and voted scum enough times to not be mechanically treated differently over style

[Isis]

Vla tomorrow

[Isis]

I'm exhausted I can't believe I voluntarily subjected myself to like 23 games of Pokemon

[Isis]

I was for a long time X-1 until I needed to lose 2/2 remaining matches to not make day 2 so that's what I did of course

[Isis]

Everyone believes in my ability to win at pokemon more than me except like a large number of people at my locals I kinda sense it

[Isis]

I read some between rounds so maybe I can catch up while I drink at this bar.
I'm very dehydrated but I'll drink enough water (I won't)

[Isis]

A lot of the posts I was trying to read were a bit too hard to follow like if the a goes to b goes to c but b is c and b should go wall etc
We need more mafia gaemplay

[Isis]

Possibly it's like not possible to unless you blow up this phase like catboi said

[Isis]

I'm actually not sure catboi's hypothesis that mechanical hell can't damage dayplay in a short deadline game is true. I think mechanically degraded dayplay doesn't actually have to do with phase length and had to do with how much people have to spend time in headspace doing math assuming people are town or like just how much they can't think about scumhunting until later even if they have a green rolecard and then they are harder to distinguish from a red rolecard

[Isis]

It's like when I can't actually think about which card I want to put on top until I go get the Oranguru and bench it and then look at what my had looks likwm. And then at that point I realize oh I can put this on top. Which means as it turns out I discarded the wrong card because I could have put Aurora on top and also played capture enemy but instead I went into the next turn with less basics dlskdkfoskskddk

[Isis]

Coral is saying what I'm saying except coral is a gentlewoman

[Isis]

I'm on page 28 my hotel room is too cold

[Isis]

I have a few thoughts that I think would be better shared once we're on day 2. I am somewhat itching to share them but I think it would be harmful to do so now.

That alone is making me want to get to day 2, but I'll try not to be too impatient

I think besides that aspect, taking our time here isn't a bad thing.

See look at this shit

[Isis]

There's not much I want to say right now that wouldn't be better to hold off until day 2.

I'll entertain questions, though.

LOOK AT THIS SHIT

[Isis]

I realize that you might not have known demona went to the wall, but I’m curious about your thoughts there. I’m on record as having a town read on demona. It’s the only read I’ve unequivocally stated. I’ve mentioned a suspicion of you. Now I know my reads can change quite a lot, especially overnight, but your thought there that you’d be the decider doesn’t line up with the thoughts I’ve given.

I'm not sure exactly why absinthe didn't clarify this, and focused more on the reads portion, but the way I interpreted the original post was that she was saying that she would be the decider due to being the consensus scumread among the Keep players (scummiest person decides is the standard Keep play). Which I think does line up with what you're saying here.

It feels meaningful, somehow, that absinthe focused on analyzing your reads portion of this rather than clearing up what looks to me like a misunderstanding. But maybe I'm the one misunderstanding something here?

I'm pretty sure I already expressed this thought well before Tempest's post, so that doesn't appear to be what needs clarification.

How do you interpret her saying:

1) she townreads demona
2) she mentioned a suspicion of you
2) therefore, you being the decider doesn't line up with the thoughts she's given

That seems to directly imply that, regardless of her reads and whether she stated them earlier or not, she thinks that her suspicion of you is incompatible with you being the decider, no?

I'm so lost, aren't suspicious people compatible with being deciders

[Isis]

I realize that you might not have known demona went to the wall, but I’m curious about your thoughts there. I’m on record as having a town read on demona. It’s the only read I’ve unequivocally stated. I’ve mentioned a suspicion of you. Now I know my reads can change quite a lot, especially overnight, but your thought there that you’d be the decider doesn’t line up with the thoughts I’ve given.

I'm not sure exactly why absinthe didn't clarify this, and focused more on the reads portion, but the way I interpreted the original post was that she was saying that she would be the decider due to being the consensus scumread among the Keep players (scummiest person decides is the standard Keep play). Which I think does line up with what you're saying here.

It feels meaningful, somehow, that absinthe focused on analyzing your reads portion of this rather than clearing up what looks to me like a misunderstanding. But maybe I'm the one misunderstanding something here?

I'm pretty sure I already expressed this thought well before Tempest's post, so that doesn't appear to be what needs clarification.

How do you interpret her saying:

1) she townreads demona
2) she mentioned a suspicion of you
2) therefore, you being the decider doesn't line up with the thoughts she's given

That seems to directly imply that, regardless of her reads and whether she stated them earlier or not, she thinks that her suspicion of you is incompatible with you being the decider, no?

It's the nature of the Keep to me. Just like any other group of three, if Demona, Tammy and I had gone to the keep, then two of us know that we are individually town regardless of which of the other two are scum. And I feel like it comes down to me in that instance because I either am townreading Tammy into the stratosphere or I'm having a nervous breakdown over which of them is town. And if Tammy is town, then given her reads right now, she'd make the wrong choice in that threesome. I feel like it would fall on me one way or another. Tammy and I both waffle a LOT. But I'm pretty sure I'm more decisive than she is in the early game. In fortress, it's ALL early game from my perspective. But maybe I'm totally wrong about how it would play out. And when I was thinking that a Demona/Tammy/me Keep it looked to me like it would be easier than it does now. I really didn't expect her to straight up scumread me at this point. I'm not blaming her for the read. I'm fighting off some major tilt and I'm well aware it's bleeding into my play, but I'm still going to keep it light in this game.

That's was convoluted to write because of the layers of hypotheticals and my own re-thoughts based on Tammy's posts today.

At the moment I can't imagine being the player who is voted in the Keep. So my agency comes down to getting my reads right. Otherwise I'm putting the weight of the minigame on the other town player.

When town, Tammy really shines out as town IMO. We usually have a few bobbles and misinterpretations, but those bobbles almost always have resolved, usually the next time we interact.

I expected (and kinda still expect) us to eventually connect pretty well in this game if she's town. Despite Tammy's assertion that she's never in my top town reads, that's hasn't really been the case in our last few games. WH13, Diffusion, Tenet, all three of those games my read of her settled well before hers did of me (and in Diffusion she never expressed a townread of my hydra. Her hydra partner did). In all three of those games she was high tier town to me (in Tenet even before her hydra were mod confirmed town I was townreading them). We meet as hydras a lot and my partners' thoughts play into my reads of her, but often I'm the first to get there. The Smokefilled game probably deserves mention too, but the dethy had a huge impact on my reads. She was my second-highest townread in the dethy, starting very early on.

I'm so confused, if you are really good at getting correct townreads on Tammy don't you want to go to keep and vote for her? But you don't want to go to keep? Or was that gate?

[Isis]

68 is irrelevant because it's about meta, 171 is my impression from demona of "this looks pretty town" rather than "i think i can read demona".

and 410 is my chara's folly trauma.

Demona does look pretty town it's also the townread in the game I feel I can pull out of the 1000 jigsaw and put down as a corner piece.

I feel waffly about others.

With coral I just wanna eat the waffle anyway since it's just track record doubt

Oh this morning I tried to use the waffle iron but I misread the markings about how much batter to and overflowed it and I didn't know how to fix it so I just left without eating anything

[Isis]

the folly was mine. do you get it.

I GET IT

<3

[Isis]

What are my strengths here, exactly? You sure you're not just taking my word for it?

to my mind anyway you'd rather hardpush someone over trying to make yourself look like the towniest town because there's the possibility people get paranoid and don't trust you and then you're hosed

I don't think this is true. I don't really excel at forcing through specific votes, especially lategame: Town players as individuals are too random. There's a reason I forced through Todoroki quickly in D&C. I'm much better at steering a collective, and I'm very good at becoming a universal townread. In that respect, Keep is very well-suited for my scumplay.

The drawbacks of Keep are twofold: 1) Players who know me, like those in this table, can simply make me the voter, and

then

I'm hosed and 2) I flip first most of the time, when I'm better utilized as an excellent clean up hitter with the potential to solo carry the longer the game goes and the more comfortable I get.

I used to prefer flipping first back in my EM days, and haven't gotten a chance to really show off some of that style on MS, but this has been a stylistic adaptation. I didn't have to put a lot of faith in my partners for them to be able to survive 5 minutes if I handed them the game on a silver platter, but that's not true on MS. Almost all of my games are me ultra-town solocarrying.

This raises the same question I asked absinthe about why people are having simultaneous paranoia about being townread and having to vote in keep?
I think you should go to keep and within your own selfmeta if you're town you win there and if you're scum you win there.

[Isis]

does anyone...

want

to go to Gate?

I do now that it sounds very available since 99.9 repeating percent of my interest is with who I go with

[Isis]

Bring back old Prism I miss her

[Isis]

Define old Prism, you want me to play more Replica-esque?

I want you to come with Chara and I to the gate

[Isis]

It is hard to catch all the way up when my girlfriend keeps texting me and she is more important srynotsry I will keep trudging

[Isis]

let's take a break and have a friendship party in the Gate and eat gumdrops and dance with sugarplum fairies.

I'm a fairy who is the other fairy

[Isis]

^_^

[Isis]

does anyone...

want

to go to Gate?

I do now that it sounds very available since 99.9 repeating percent of my interest is with who I go with

i guess i don’t really understand why you wouldn’t want to come to wall with me if you’re the most sure that i am town and the wall would therefore be more or less solved from your perspective without one of us being switched

but also as i said to catboi earlier i get that i am not always easy to play with and such and if your interest is solely who you go with yeah i get it

i dunno how, like, qualified i would be to sort you/chara but i feel like it would make sense to come to wall from your perspective outside of the people aspect yeah

I mean you're probably town and if I go with you and Chara to wall and scum don't have to add scum to the wall Chara is probably scum. But I think the game's EV as a whole is higher if I get to read Chara, in or out of a context of reevaluating your slot although the benefit is probably greater out?

The problem with math based on reads so far is that it's all double downs. If consensus reads are good right now those aren't needed. Chemistry is always good, even if consensus reads are warped

[Isis]

Did I just write one of the posts I've been having trouble reading

[Isis]

Demona already locked in wafer wall though?

[Isis]

i've been trying to learn trivia so i know something about the world. i've reached pre-Socratic philosophy and internalized almost none of it, but i know who [redacted] and [redacted] are now.

_{edited - ydra}

Why was this moderated?

Pedit:. I'm good to go wall

[Isis]

don't worry about it, Isis.

If it was your fanfic then I will stick up for its broadest distribution if it was something else I will relax

[Isis]

Temptation averted, good night Chara!

[Isis]

I'd certainly prefer Carol of the Bells!

Isnt that the spooky Christmas song I like that one

[Isis]

People call me Mary it sux

[Isis]

Coral Chara and me at one place us my dream fantasy cause that's like just the two people I wanted to play with pregame eeeeeeee ok I can't pretend that's tryhard though

[Isis]

Keep in mind also that only one grouping remains intact. 2 are guaranteed to be altered.

I realize that you might not have known demona went to the wall, but I’m curious about your thoughts there. I’m on record as having a town read on demona. It’s the only read I’ve unequivocally stated. I’ve mentioned a suspicion of you. Now I know my reads can change quite a lot, especially overnight, but your thought there that you’d be the decider doesn’t line up with the thoughts I’ve given.

I'm not sure exactly why absinthe didn't clarify this, and focused more on the reads portion, but the way I interpreted the original post was that she was saying that she would be the decider due to being the consensus scumread among the Keep players (scummiest person decides is the standard Keep play). Which I think does line up with what you're saying here.

It feels meaningful, somehow, that absinthe focused on analyzing your reads portion of this rather than clearing up what looks to me like a misunderstanding. But maybe I'm the one misunderstanding something here?

I'm pretty sure I already expressed this thought well before Tempest's post, so that doesn't appear to be what needs clarification.

How do you interpret her saying:

1) she townreads demona
2) she mentioned a suspicion of you
2) therefore, you being the decider doesn't line up with the thoughts she's given

That seems to directly imply that, regardless of her reads and whether she stated them earlier or not, she thinks that her suspicion of you is incompatible with you being the decider, no?

I'm so lost, aren't suspicious people compatible with being deciders

i think coral/tempest were saying

‘why wouldn’t tempest simply be the decider by voting tempest’s townread, demona’

and the answer to that from a town!absinthe perspective would simply be that tempest was not town and therefore would not actually decide that, at which point i would think absinthe would realize tempest was not town and tada!

but from a town!tempest perspective it makes sense for tempest to simply vote for me and win the keep

Im still lost :/

[Isis]

Ah yes, the game we all threw in the towel on the NRG

Was I a reviewer

[Isis]

I'm finally fully caught up.

I kinda don't like skitter at wall because I dont understand or buy her demona-kinship preference at all. I understand game pref though

I'm falling aslepo

[Isis]

Isis where do u think i should go?

Also ffery

Go fight Faker in Keep y'all both have big personalities.

I don't remember what the keep does

Also I read a couple posts ahead of this on catch-up but not more

[Isis]

My phone's autosuggestion to hyphenated catchup is bullshit ugh

[Isis]

(And am finding it really interesting that i'm getting vague nondescript opposition to that)

i am not opposed in case you thought my recent posts were voicing opposition to you joining the wall

like in theory i could maybe understand absinthe’s position that she was worried about scum!you potentially wanting to fool me but it seemed like she was saying that scum!absinthe would want to fool me because i am unfamiliar with absinthe but! i am not unfamiliar with you

but also like, if absinthe is worried about my ability to find the scums due to unfamiliarity with me, who would be the potential scums in this game that she wouldn’t be worried about coming to wall?

and i don’t fully understand isis’s objection you have correctly read me as town pretty consistently and i am town here and isis believes i am town so it’d just be one way threat

but also maybe i am not understanding

and like i said to faker we offer nice benefit of informed solving here at the wall

It's just a waste, anyone can find you town, dont use master ball on a pidgey

As much as I dont have great games with skitter i believe in the conventional stance about her general proficiency. And probably wall is mostly solved this game.
It may be a thought where if I zoomed out there's not actually room to include such a preference alongside my other preferences let alone other people having preferences

[Isis]

Am I not as cool as Replica?

Replica was so cool

[Isis]

Demona does look pretty town it's also the townread in the game I feel I can pull out of the 1000 jigsaw and put down as a corner piece.

I'm finally fully caught up.

I kinda don't like skitter at wall because I dont understand or buy her demona-kinship preference at all. I understand game pref though

I'm falling aslepo

I feel very similar here. I have somewhat been using demona town as a corner piece to worldbuild off of. I haven't delved super deep on it and probably will do so day 2 if needed, but demona does seem quite town to me, and does seem like the slot or one of the slots here where I can feel the most comfortable about a townread.

With that in mind, I think skitter's stated ability to read demona seems like it doesn't exactly live up to the value that she is placing on it. I don't really mind her going with demona, but I don't think it's that significant in terms of EV.

I suppose the possible alternative I'm missing is that skitter thinks she can find scum!demona when the rest of us won't, but that isn't really the impression I was getting.

You're making my posts before I post them aaaaa

[Isis]

If we're putting me at gate can it at least not be with 2 scumreads of mine? I think i get ic'd there and that won't be a fun time for me
I'm at a thing, will respond to the above later

If you scumread two people couldnt you do pretty well filtering between which one is better foundations? I'd think two townreads would be worse. Maybe I have it backwards though

[Isis]

I'd think defusing assembled indictment theories of what has happened is easier than developing them from scratch

Could it be that one is just more unpalatable than the other rather than harder to play than the other

[Isis]

Could it be the legendary +MV +EV?!?!?

[Isis]

(And am finding it really interesting that i'm getting vague nondescript opposition to that)

i am not opposed in case you thought my recent posts were voicing opposition to you joining the wall

like in theory i could maybe understand absinthe’s position that she was worried about scum!you potentially wanting to fool me but it seemed like she was saying that scum!absinthe would want to fool me because i am unfamiliar with absinthe but! i am not unfamiliar with you

but also like, if absinthe is worried about my ability to find the scums due to unfamiliarity with me, who would be the potential scums in this game that she wouldn’t be worried about coming to wall?

and i don’t fully understand isis’s objection you have correctly read me as town pretty consistently and i am town here and isis believes i am town so it’d just be one way threat

but also maybe i am not understanding

and like i said to faker we offer nice benefit of informed solving here at the wall

It's just a waste, anyone can find you town, dont use master ball on a pidgey

As much as I dont have great games with skitter i believe in the conventional stance about her general proficiency. And probably wall is mostly solved this game.
It may be a thought where if I zoomed out there's not actually room to include such a preference alongside my other preferences let alone other people having preferences

if i were swapped to keep who would you want to be the three players left at the wall? in terms of likelihood for town to win the wall

(also in the case of town!skitter, skitter’s proficiency would be a plus if noone was swapped because she would be able to solve the other two games knowing i was town and the third person at wall was therefore mafia)

I don't think playing around swap hypotheticals is ideal. There's a 22% chance you get swapped out of keep.
Also we need to win all 3 games. (As the general sentiment it's 2/3)
I just want to make all 3 games good games. At least one will be left untouched and maybe a second will have the swap not feel super material.

[Isis]

The main reason to care that people's townreads of you are well reasoned is a reduced chance to move off it. If you ask a townie "why do you townread angela" and the townie gives an answer but realizes their own answer was brief and uninspiring they are more likely to drop the read.

I picked Angela because I tried to make up a fake name that is not you but comparable to you and accidentally figured out how you constructed your account name, sorry demona x.x

[Isis]

Is it coinkydink

[Isis]

For the first part of the video I also contemplated just posting that I'm uncultured swine and won't appreciate the style enough but then by the last two thirds of the video I really enjoyed it.

The lyrics are very simple and seem to be about a relationship ship where someone is convinced they need to change for it to be a happy relationship. There's like this sense of surprise at the amount a person will compliantly change in response to that and then like the notes are engineered to be all mournful about that whole process and how tragic it is. The whole song is one set of lyrics repeated like 3, 4, 5 times? But it seems really appropriate.

[Isis]

Lol I used the word engineered I'm STEM swine

[Isis]

My favorite genre is touhou

[Isis]

Skitter keep looks like it would be good like fox falco marth

I still wanna play with Chara and there is currently space in gate or wall

[Isis]

981 seems very inrange for anyone because it's meta pattern recognition. The others are +town content I think.

I really townread demona the most because demona's early play advances a town!demona wincon and only works in a soloQ way for scum!demona and I don't think that's how demona plays scum (and it doesn't work as well that way as it does for just town)
Which is kind of like an expansion of the "demona is centering a town!demona perspective thing" but I there's easier less abrasive things demona could have emulated if scum

[Isis]

I thouht the point of keep is catboi/faker

Isis do you townread coral?

She is a lambb

I continue to townread the way she's approaching this game

[Isis]

Usually tone, often mindset

I got a four Loko just to find out what ppl are talking about and it's very mid

[Isis]

I have no idea how that quote got into my post

It's really hard to play mafia mobile I end up on the tab where it asks me to confirm I want to delete other people's posts many times per day
I should prolly play on una more to be safe

My phone just autosuggested the word mariposa and I have no idea how that happened but it's fucking awesome

[Isis]

Im drubk and has to click links like 22 times to confirm catboi filled up one of the zones

Why did s_s name fucking all 3 zones a thingy that I can hand an aoe2 worker 300 zone and the worker will go build it that's so mentally unsalient

[Isis]

If u ask s.s he will either admit that is what he did or lie

[Isis]

He will probably not lie bc he is an azelf

[Isis]

I freudsloppwd the word stone.to be zone a couple posts ago

[Isis]

Four Loko bad

[Isis]

When my BAC reachd .05 I realized in my pancreas that when I am on my deathbed I will wish that I played more mafia and played less pokemon and felt rly sad I'm only alive in this game but dialed back on like a lot of stuff for the dumb regional

And maybe could have been closer to 120% for this game

There was also some balancing with respect to my girlfriend but I think the calibration on that was okish in terms of bei g very focused on her and also habing other thjngs I'm into but mafia is like a lot more beautiful than flannerying a double turbo energy y'know

This has nothing to do with my alignment in this game really but of Ydrasse deletes it on that basis he has to post 9 volumes of Chara fanfic I demand it

[Isis]

Isis locktown!

Are you ou town

[Isis]

The sticker on the back of my phone is curling it's a sticker of bastet

[Isis]

Yes!

[Isis]

Woah w
Pagetop

[Isis]

I have little idea why that post reminds me of wario land 3 for game boy color but it is an incredible game and you should definitely pick it up or drive to my apartment and borrow it

I said "little" instead of "no" because my post has some instance of the letter "w' but I feel I've not connected all the dot

[Isis]

YOU CAN TURN INTO ABAT

[Isis]

I think mafia can certainly be beautiful, but it's okay to treat it like a delicacy. It can be easy to end up with too much of it.

It's hard to have this dialogue with a deep secret alt I'd rather have it with.. I think the entire rest of the lobby is open main?

:/

[Isis]

I'm 99% I would either have not said that or said it diff soberr

[Isis]

I just chugged a bottle of water

[Isis]

The millennial in 2022 experience is every hotel room having a TV and never using it

[Isis]

(the millennial in 2016 experience is every hotel room having a TV and going through the motions of "using it" but not being interested)

[Isis]

I think there was a weird time I the twenty naughts when hotel rooms would have snes games attached to the TV and a pay to play system and I'd always want to play Zelda II because I missed that one but you can't finish it in one hotel stay

[Isis]

I miss my girlfriend

[Isis]

Faker are you saying catboi can decide whether to be motivated and always chooses to be motivated as town so he's scum this game?

[Isis]

My dad texted me that Allstate is saying I never moved out of my parent's house in 2015 and that he should pay for an extra driver unless I dox out my current address to Allstate

This is annoying because they would 100% synthesize my deadname onto my address, I've seen it before

[Isis]

If you ask me a cool question about the game I will have four hours of hundreds of hairs being incinerated by electric probe to ponder that question as I stare at the ceiling and listen to whatever music my tech happens to like

Pedit: how do you remotivate as scum I can't remember ever winning scum except by starting motivated and staying motivated
This must be an anime boi power

[Isis]

VOTE: wall

[Isis]

I voted while the tech working on me had a short snack break.

I voted wall so Chara could also vote wall and we could talk for a while before the last slot fills. I was worried about carelessness as much as malice in terms of icing us out of slots; couldn't remember who was still unassigned.

Apparently we can't actually stall but also apparently the only unassigned person is Tammy and shes probably more collaborative than faker or catboi or whatever so all's goods

[Isis]

I think skitter's game state read is easier to get behind than a classic one because it's not based on x trying to kill y per SE and more about how manipulable the processes generally were.
I'd be really surprised if we get 0-0-3 for sure

[Isis]

I am drawing a roadmap for scum to swap demona with coral so I can play with all my favorite players pls

[Isis]

I like catboi but I feel like catboi doesn't really like me

[Isis]

demona is really cool I like demona

Pedit: same

[Isis]

I really enjoy playing scum with you but eurybia's curse was struggle. There's nothing objectively wrong with how you play I just had to like picking up my first indications of a town alignment on your 301st post. That shoe hasn't dropped this game. It seems like half your posts are like, trying to undermine nyao-slot and then not calm him scum after bricking his ability to interact with the game which makes me paranoid of the kind of pinky and brain stuff you'd come up with in scumsman

[Isis]

I like catboi but I feel like catboi doesn't really like me

:< I don't

dis

like you

Whoa I'm spot on

[Isis]

*call him scum

[Isis]

Ugh I kinda feel that feeling we shouldn't state reads before swaps? I guess it's ok to let Tammy post a little but I think she should give us the next phase

[Isis]

I like catboi but I feel like catboi doesn't really like me

:< I don't

dis

like you

Whoa I'm spot on

more relieving than not I guess

[Isis]

Yeah cat is definitely a player I'd rather have in the Keep, I'm selfish and trust no one but myself to avoid getting snowed by that motherfucker. It's one thing if I'm there in endgame with him but it's another if I exit early and leave him unsupervised.

This is ??? when you've commented on me being reserved and now outright unmotivated, like do you think I expect to snow people playing like this?

Yeah, this is definitely the only way you know how to play as scum for sure.

Being sarcastic about cat powerwolfing in a hypothetical later part of the game is weird, the rest of the same thread also was. It's especially weird when you've been super conscious about giving lots of other slots room to play and keep citing it as a mission statement. It makes it seem like catboi's slot is shiny to you, because of which players are scum or you're focused on winning your minigame because this game's not really about identifying 3 scum for you. It doesn't seem like you're sorting him though.

[Isis]

I also don't think it should come as a surprise that I think he can play much stronger as scum essentially whenever he feels like it, and am accordingly cautious.

If it's just BoP then bleh.
I expect skitter to be the bird of paradise but maybe I am out of touch

[Isis]

Skitter is now wild nacatl

[Isis]

Spoiler:

I parse the other stuff about on/off and tempo but even a small BoP component if it's there can smudge things a lot. More than that will have to be acknowledged to actually lim catboi for sure. If that minigame even has lims I don't remember.

[Isis]

I want to tap for all five colors of mana

[Isis]

Fingers is cross

-mv minigames

I feel carsic

[Isis]

a way to make me more confident i can read her.

I was trying to play in Daniel's lion den and scream "look I am playing in Daniel's lion den" as a funnee way to clear myself that also lets me with one of my favorite players. You're one of the ppl I wanted to know about the lion den, it's reasonable to forget reading me correctly before but it's predictive whether you forgot.

This bit is written like an accusation but I'm not sure I get how wanting you to feel confident is a scum!Isis thing can you expound any?

[Isis]

i am already at work, so playing mafia is technically less work.

a lot of it is town demona, if we were in Wall with Coral or something i'd be at a much lower confidence level, but in that scenario i think scum Isis's motivation would be to get me to vote with her rather than setting up a 1v1 between me and her.

i'd also like to point out that between Isis and demona at the wall vs. the configuration at the gate, does scum Chara choose to duke it out against Isis?

You love me

[Isis]

"defensive" wouldn't really be a word that comes to mind to describe Isis's play although I see your point about 236 I guess, will review it at some point. Had lingering suspicion of Isis for gut reasons but with the clarity of distributions things are coming into focus more so not as sure.

i'm using defensive to mean cautious, not to mean defending herself. like setting up defenses around oneself, not showing weak points or taking risks.

[Isis]

Why? I think my perspective is unique. I'd like to hear how to get the same answer a different way, if that's the case.

a way to make me more confident i can read her.

I was trying to play in Daniel's lion den and scream "look I am playing in Daniel's lion den" as a funnee way to clear myself that also lets me with one of my favorite players.

This was supposed to work how?

Every game is a lion's den and Wall is the highest EV game for scum. You also tried to get me to come to your game at one point.

The quoted post is when I committed to playing with Chara, not which minigame, it was earlier.
I tried to get you to play with me in addition to Chara, not instead of, I'm not following that part.

I think mostly everyone else in the game can read me an average amount

[Isis]

I prefer to be the voter, especially with what I've seen on the table.

Let me be clear: I will get you if you are scum, and I will make sure you lose the game as a bonus.

I have 0 intimidation level from this

Catboi's Own Tempo ability prevented the effects of Faker's Intimidate!

[Isis]

Faker please don't demand to be the voter that's like stupid and unfun
Idk how to parse that as something other than hubris over wincon.
Weird stuff like that is how you play mafia as both alignments but if you really came to this game wanting people to have more fun than usual please just win your minigame instead of [[making your minigame and the entire game about you, then win your minigame]].

[Isis]

I'm not bothering with this unless Tempest wants to make you the voter.

Reall

[Isis]

I would prefer on me since i know i'm town but eh

if a vote is placed on not you and you are town then town loses the keep

unless the ‘eh’ was like,

like ‘well we all lose sometimes’

in which case yes but also! i would rather not

Demona punctuation best punctuation

[Isis]

Which I don't really need to be here for, you all can just promise to periodically pretend that I've entered the thread and said something to that effect.

Chica so many games have been won and lost because remembering what the NK would have said and hearing them drone on are so different.

Confirming scum were swapped sounds useful though

[Isis]

Ok I have finally read up!

[Isis]

I liked Coral's overnight post. I think absinthe should be the elimination.
My minigame is still most likely scum!Chara when laid out flat but demona taking victory laps and not sorting is leaning me back. I've seen demona stop doing things when ahead as scum, I guess I've paid less attention to whether that's happened as town. I'd like it better if my demona townread was a cord of two or three strands instead of just being "demona's own arc putting self into a minigame" though I still view that as a strong strand.
Chara what kind of imminence do you have on voting me? In one breath you say you want finding demonascum together to be a real possibility but in another you keep speaking with enough finality that that wouldn't really be possible, not because I'm literally hammered but because town!you couldn't be keeping your mind all that open with a tinkaton hammer on your shoulder.
Pedit: ok yeah more finality, just discussing the next minigames instead of most of my ketchup Do you view our minigame as over? It feels like the nudge of difference between demona having a very good protown arc and being informed

[Isis]

maybe run at me if you’re town and you’re really worried about me do the thing until you’re not worried anymore instead of waiting for me to do the thing if the issue you’re having is mainly that i am not currently doing the thing

pedit: continuation of last post

Maybe I've been preoccupied by Chara but I also can't remember any of your posts about other minigames

[Isis]

maybe run at me if you’re town and you’re really worried about me do the thing until you’re not worried anymore instead of waiting for me to do the thing if the issue you’re having is mainly that i am not currently doing the thing

pedit: continuation of last post

Maybe I've been preoccupied by Chara but I also can't remember any of your posts about other minigames

haven’t really given extensive thoughts beyond that i thought it was probably 2-1-0 or 0-1-2 before the swap originally based on the swap but mostly just a feeling

haven’t spent much time trying to sort between coral/absinthe yet

don’t really understand skitter’s approach to keep but eh

hm

guess i kinda don’t understand what your expectation of me here is

I kind of expect needing to poke some for town!you or for your thoughts to develop slowly. Declaring yourself obvtown and asking to see a crossvote is the more divergent thing that in my mind is a lot more vivid with what scum!demona tries to do in games compared to town!demona. I'm maybe burying the lead or confusing the point a little in highlighting the former. The former is just the reason I'm gonna be saying nty to a fastcrossvote

[Isis]

Scum-skitter would probably like to not go up against Tammy in the Gate. Maybe she sees the keep as an easier win given how minigames shaped up.

No? That doesnt seem so bad at all tbh

You think you could beat Tammy at gate as mafia?

[Isis]

maybe run at me if you’re town and you’re really worried about me do the thing until you’re not worried anymore instead of waiting for me to do the thing if the issue you’re having is mainly that i am not currently doing the thing

pedit: continuation of last post

Maybe I've been preoccupied by Chara but I also can't remember any of your posts about other minigames

haven’t really given extensive thoughts beyond that i thought it was probably 2-1-0 or 0-1-2 before the swap originally based on the swap but mostly just a feeling

haven’t spent much time trying to sort between coral/absinthe yet

don’t really understand skitter’s approach to keep but eh

hm

guess i kinda don’t understand what your expectation of me here is

I kind of expect needing to poke some for town!you or for your thoughts to develop slowly. Declaring yourself obvtown and asking to see a crossvote is the more divergent thing that in my mind is a lot more vivid with what scum!demona tries to do in games compared to town!demona. I'm maybe burying the lead or confusing the point a little in highlighting the former. The former is just the reason I'm gonna be saying nty to a fastcrossvote

the crossvote and the ‘obvtown’ thing are just because of the setup

it doesn’t take me time to develop a read on myself nor do you need to poke me for that

can look at the trust fall prism moderated or the one faker and i were town in if you want to see similar changes in my play based on the setup

but…

if you think my approach is divergent towards scum!me, why were you townreading it?

not sure if i am misunderstanding here am definitely distracted but like

isn’t that very divergence the one cord you were talking about earlier?

You're literally doing the opposite of what you were getting townread for day1, instead of being confident you will later dayplay and always get townread for it, you're asking for things to get locked in [[perhaps in case you don't get townread for later dayplay?]]. They both use the word "town" but they are opposites.

[Isis]

Is the EV actually the same if Tempest isn't involved at all? Scum can't favorably or unfavorably vote for scum. Scum can express a preference to vote for themselves but it's symmetric to every townie's identical preference.
Tempest can't corrupt the game I guess it's just a question of what you would want from her? A direction to go or a direction not to go or nothing

[Isis]

1094 is still about the game plan of demona putting self in a game and demanding people pay attention to demona and townread demona later.

I'm super confused about "gotcha Isis you just said there's only one reason to townread demona" and then digging up a post with "Which is kind of like an expansion of <original reason>"


It's mostly par for course for demona to not bare soul immediately d2. I'm saying that demanding a crossvote after opaque play and demanding a crossvote after transparent play are different and since demona did the former I'm that much more wary. If you're getting townread as scum "x townreads me" becomes this mental shortcut assumption and you don't really think about whether your recent posts express your alignment or not in the same way.

[Isis]

Actually rereading today's posts i think coral looks a lot more townir than she did yesterday

Some of the hypotheticals contradicted by the nightswaps seem at minimum tedious to fake.

[Isis]

Ok yes the de-emphasized part of the post I agreed a couple posts she liked are more green than red. I don't remember what those posts said. I was earnest about liking them more than I disliked them
If that looks like read progression with jaunts and corners to you it didn't feel that way to me but you're not being logically inconsistent or anything

[Isis]

I can't 1v1 Chara unless and until I'm sure it's the wall scum, have mercy with the Isis ice queen fanfics T_T
(Joke/vent post I appreciate you thumbing through hypos)

[Isis]

I think Isis looks scummier than other people at the wall on review. The style is hard to parse but the signal to noise here is really low and I'm not seeign much commitment to calling people scum, some doubt expressed of faker but it's not really all-in. 1555 is really rough. Just "I liked the post", no elaboration. The lack of caution when previously having been fooled by Coral in another game is puzzling, would expect that read to get more diligence than it's shown. The reads on players in her game is fencesitting but also feels a bit like it's angled toward OMGUSing Chara. I'm not seeing a lot to convincingly call Isis town and whatever posts I felt in the moment yesterday don't hit me on a reread.

I elaborated later when skitter mentioned the post, you disliked my elaboration and thought I was townreading NAI. It's pretty awkward to feel things about a slot after previously getting snowed and feel like, should you develop this? based on record.
The way I read people walls of content that make sense and seem to sort people apart are something I tend to want to townbin if they hit tons and tons of character without slipping into a scummy thought process, usually I have confidence in seeing those slips and it feels like it's a way to read people. With her in a different minigame and a bad track record I guess I'm not on the front of the line to discuss that angle. Her volume is even higher than Eurybia though, same number of characters but more AI points covered.
I still think it's more likely Chara than not but I still want to pick Chara's mind.
I think it's absinthe in Coral's game and I can't remember anything ffery posts after she posts it so it's fine to let other people play.
I think your game is the second most interesting but I'm a little bit disengaged because of the rock throwing.
I think if I wave a wand and instagram filter out the sharp from your minigame I'd most want you to be voted because a lot of your takes at different steps of the game have made a little sense and moreso than their correctness don't really sound like you're working from 3 pieces of information (compared to like the tempo of how Coral's thoughts develp maybe)
i have a lot of chores and didn't want to post this long uck

[Isis]

Faker seems like the scummiest slot but I misread her in Eurybia etc. It'd be nice to correctly townread skitter. Skitter's dayplay has a more hammersitty situational context in a way that might not be her fault.

Or i might be prone to just be paranoid of whoever is closest to being hammered

[Isis]

I really like the wall progression of recognizing demona's town stature being a little bit circular but still kinda wanting to settle on the simplest thing after stressing out and worrying a little. Skitter did the same thing, I think the slots are kind of distinguished situationally.
He had similar posts on d1.
I really need step away from the pc

[Isis]

Pedit: ok yeah more finality, just discussing the next minigames instead of most of my ketchup Do you view our minigame as over? It feels like the nudge of difference between demona having a very good protown arc and being informed

actually i'd like to talk about this further. what part of your catch up should i have been responding to there? you didn't say anything new or interesting (as relating to my scumread on you). why is it scummy to you to throw out my thoughts on the other minigames after saying hello?

i didn't have any must-reply items in mind. 1536 is undeveloped and 1506 removes something I thought could give me understanding over your SR with nothing to replace it so it makes sense I remember feeling dissatisfied around the time of that post. I realize on a fact check that I didn't pass you the mic in any way but that was my ~feelings~

[Isis]

rereading chara's iso i'm getting a lot of happy townvibes
idk how much weight to put into that but yeah

Chara's d1 is pretty happyvibes yes
And its scumgame is more joyless, it's almost a watermark

[Isis]

Mm

It has nonzero ability to simulate contentedness, and demona and Chara can't both be town.

[Isis]

Chara why did you switch from not wanting to minigame with me early d1 to wanting to late d1? I am like 100% sure you told me but want to hear it again and you're welcome to take that admission and yell at me instead

[Isis]

that makes more sense for townChara than scumChara

Going in anyway would kind of give you a character to play into, I don't think you relish that

which reasons do you townread demona for?

[Isis]

I feel more and more like voting Chara is an EV play but Chara isn't playing like gladiated scum and demona is playing like scum in an endgame phase of a game of mafia.

[Isis]

Your thoughts on this, Isis?

I don't know enough about Chara's relationship with skitter and Coral to know how that A/B comparison works? Although I don't think Chara would know Coral at all so maybe that was supposed to be a game state thing I'm not getting

[Isis]

Catboi hood game?

[Isis]

But revealing the read beforehand doesn't fit quite right with the rest to me.

Is this a mechanical objection to the idea town!Chara revealed info that would let scum!Isis ship Chara away, or more of a flow objection that town!Chara would throw out and igmeoy with no force and just slunk into making good on the threat when the minigame started?

I think there's at least a little playstyle clash going on but I want to dig up the part that can make the most sense to me.
I'd probably like the EoD FoS better at if it was either fully developed, or completely holstered for this phase.

[Isis]

The swap also affects Tempest's game. I think Tempest's game should probably resolve first.
It's page 75 and I still can't remember the game nicknames.

[Isis]

You can't determine whether the gate-keep swap was t-t or s-t until after you resolve both minigames.

This makes me want to say "play normally instead" but individual minigames don't have informed minorities.

The whole game has informed minorities though, so whether people are egging eachother on into lims or mislims is readable.

[Isis]

If absinthe flips mafia it could mean that she had to be added to gate so that gate would have a mafia.
However it could also mean that gate and keep started with one mafia and absinthe was swapped with a scum!skitter for fun.
There's no information there.

[Isis]

I would say the biggest "wave" is Chara indicating 80% confidence in voting for me.
Catboi I don't get why "wall is the hardest game" is a statement immune to "why"s, it's true the game of mafia is hard by default, but you could at least say why the other two have more direction.

Gate has a clear in it, that's part of it

[Isis]

My excitement is pretty hollowed out by the double rep. I don't know how to convert that into "therefore we should do x" I just feel like saying it aloud I guess

[Isis]

Leashing the keep

target

a ton is very -MV +EV at this point. Faker repped out we don't have to follow her shit.

We need a flip and the paradox where if Tempest elects a scum voter the scum voter's optimal play is always to say they did not subscribe to the leash newsletter. It's stressing me out when this game is already a quagmire. Just elect someone to win and have at least 2/3 people follow that please.

Especially after the way the convos with Math have gone about mech I would love to simplify this flipless age of empires 2 larp

[Isis]

Tammy says someone is a good singer everyone votes that person

[Isis]

When I sing a Pokemon's defense decreases two stages

[Isis]

I'm gonna be very VLA starting tomorrow but I figure Xmas will affect lots of ppl

[Isis]

You could just have all 3 ppl in keep self vote and resolve the game by one person moving their self vote to another player.

Selfvoting in keep only increases "your risk of winning the game" for both alignments so is harmless

Isn't that how the game works?
It's not that complicated. It's just 3p trust fall

[Isis]

I also tr Coral; have a blank for absinthe.

Last time I played with fferyl she was kind of blank to me and I just read her predecessor because she was a replacement.
It's scum indicative that shes not making more of an impression.