Open 809: Charge Me Up! [Over]

[Lukewarm]

Day 1 begins. It will end in (expired on 2021-04-24 19:00:00). With 14 alive it takes 8 to eliminate.

***It is strictly forbidden to discuss N0 submissions. You may not discuss the role you chose or the player you chose to charge up***

Oh. I completely missed this rule, definitely have been thinking about how the N0 vote information could be used lol

I point ready to make as soon as Day1 started, but now I need to clear my comment with the mod before I post it

Anyways, RVS VOTE: DkKoba

[Lukewarm]

how serious is that vote ^

this is a pretty weird post to drop then just leave

it's weird that i have a life outside of mafiascum?

Yes. No one is allowed to have lives /s

i'm not the only one who has no clue what flow trap is trying to say, right?

I have no idea what they are trying to say either. I just decided it was not work digging any deeper to understand their mysterious system that apparently does not work on this site

[Lukewarm]

Hmmm. I don't particularly like that DK immeneately claimed to be a PR.

But I also really don't like VFP immediately taking Flow Trap's word that they were confirmed town - joking or not, still unclear but kind of irrelevant to me after they dodged the question the first time tbh

And I also dislike Jester/scum memeing from Not_Mafia. Like ewwww

VOTE: Not_Mafia

[Lukewarm]

Hmmm. I don't particularly like that DK immeneately claimed to be a PR.

But I also really don't like VFP immediately taking Flow Trap's word that they were confirmed town - joking or not, still unclear but kind of irrelevant to me after they dodged the question the first time tbh

And I also dislike Jester/scum memeing from Not_Mafia. Like ewwww

VOTE: Not_Mafia

That is NM's default entry to the game..

Oh for those not aware, E-1 is NM-Hammer.

I mean maybe it is his default entrance, it is still a play that I don't like lol. I'm still trying to form any real opinions on people, so I am in the RVS of this game. Might as well vote against things I dont like lol.

lukewarm, what's your mafia playing experience?

Very little on Mafiascum, I have not finished a game yet lol (I am in an ongoing newbie game right now),
I have played several games in a Mafia Discord channel, which were similarly a long form text based mafia games, but those games moved much faster then on here
I have played a lot of short form mafia games like Epicmafia and One Night Ultimate Werewolf.

But I also really don't like VFP immediately taking Flow Trap's word that they were confirmed town - joking or not, still unclear but kind of irrelevant to me after they dodged the question the first time tbh

what don't you like about it

what's irrelevant and why does that matter

I don't like it because Flow trap is definitely not confirmed town, so anyone taking their word for it is bad. That does not really seem like a scum thing to do, so I am not scum reading them for it, but I am pointing out that I don't like it lol

I was trying to say that it was irrelevant if they came back and said "I was just joking when I said that."

[Lukewarm]

oh you played on epicmafia?
yeah that solidifies my scumread here.

I played a lot on epic mafia when I was a teenager, but I have not played on there in at least 5 years lol

Unsure what that has to do with a scum read on me, but ¯\_(ツ)_/¯

[Lukewarm]

Setup

Wiki Page

Spoiler: Setup Information

Alignments

3 Mafia

11 Town

The alignments distribution was publicly announced by the mod, so not sure why its in question lol

I don't like it because Flow trap is definitely not confirmed town, so anyone taking their word for it is bad. That does not really seem like a scum thing to do, so I am not scum reading them for it, but I am pointing out that I don't like it lol

weird. i assume when people say "oh i don't like that player did x" that means they think it's suspicious.

are the other things you point out as not liking also you saying you think that it is just non-ai bad play? or just this one instance.

I don't like it, because even if it is a town player doing it, it makes it harder for town to win. That goes for DK claiming a PR (which I neutrally read), VFP agreeing with flow trap's claim (which I am more inclined to town read), and for anyone memeing as either Jester or Scum.

The last one is one of my least favorite things that a town player can do. That is not something I am using as a part of making my proper reads, but so far I don't have a strong enough scum read to pull me out of RVS, so I voted against that.

[Lukewarm]

I hardclaim pr -

I also hard claim a power role

[Lukewarm]

Why claim when you can just die?

I guess that works too

VOTE: Lukewarm

This thread is

wild

. The overall tone is way different then what I am used to lol

[Lukewarm]

I hardclaim pr -

I also hard claim a power role

Me three.

i'm sparticus

@vfp, if he isn't already on there, I think that this post should earn Save the Dragons a spot on the vfp block. Sparticus can only be town lol

[Lukewarm]

Why claim when you can just die?

I guess that works too

VOTE: Lukewarm

This thread is

wild

. The overall tone is way different then what I am used to lol

I don't like it, because even if it is a town player doing it, it makes it harder for town to win.

The response to my post 186 was a second person immediately memeing jester and a second person claiming a pr. It made me realize that maybe I should not be taking this thread as seriously, and just join in to the chaos

¯\_(ツ)_/¯

Like I said this thread is

wild

[Lukewarm]

lukewarm do you have any reads?

I am currently leaning towards Green Crayons, minivigro, and NDMath being town.

I am a little suspicious of Mozamis because so far they have made 3 posts with zero content.
VFP is not giving me good vibes either, but that is more of a feeling then something I can really point to a reason for.

I'm still trying to get a feel for everyone else.

[Lukewarm]

I was on the fence with Dark Magician Girl, because they have been engaging a lot with the thread, but then most of their posts were just single line questions, without adding much to the discussion themselves.

But their last post has changed that view a bit for me. Moving them to the "leaning town" category

[Lukewarm]

MiniVirgo - scum
DMG - scum

Both of your scum reads were in my town lean lol.

I would love to hear your reasoning for that

[Lukewarm]

The VFP block doesn't need explaining, just trusted.

I'm trying to convince you all that I'm town so the VFP block actually works.

Of course it does.
As I said, follow me and the game is a win.

If I'm wrong, give me 6 more shots to be right. If I'm still wrong, then we can review where I was wrong and why.

You know what, you have managed to sell me on the power of the VFP block. So who are we for voting for, boss?

And if you are going to say we should vote for me, I have good news, because that is already where my vote is !!

[Lukewarm]

"your play" is so vague a reason I cannot even attempt to understand where you're coming from. I can't explain why you're wrong on me without your thought process, merely that you are wrong because you ended up at the wrong destination.

If you're asking me to towncase myself (I don't think you are since that doesn't really make sense given it's day 1.): So far I've posted at a higher posting rate than usual for me as either alignment, and Scum!me probably(?) doesn't doubledown on a lukewarm townread when thread momentum is shifting the other way.

This post made me feel gross...

@VFP, where does this guy fall in reference to the VFP block, because if he is in it, I might start losing faith in the block as a whole

[Lukewarm]

@VFP, where does this guy fall in reference to the VFP block, because if he is in it, I might start losing faith in the block as a whole

I double checked myself.

VFP
Dk
Flow
Flea
Dragon
DMG
NM

Moz
Artemiana
Mini
Yessiree
Green

Lukewarm
ND

He is not on it, so my faith can hold firm.

[Lukewarm]

whats gross abt it

Him and I are in a similar position in reference to VFP. We are both being excluded from the town block, with out a clear explanation.

And his reaction feels very different them my reaction to receiving basically the same messages.

[Lukewarm]

Like, he seems really defensive, and wants to try really hard to defend himself, and appears to be adjitated that he isn't getting better reasoning from VFP so he can form a better defense. Seems fishy to me

[Lukewarm]

adjitated

agitated

[Lukewarm]

So far I've posted at a higher posting rate than usual for me as either alignment,

And here, he is fishing for a defensive argument, despite any of the suspicion logic coming from VFP.

And who is even thinking about their posting rate this early on Day 1 anyways? Maybe scum who has been actively trying to post more in order to avoid suspicion.

[Lukewarm]

So far I've posted at a higher posting rate than usual for me as either alignment,

And here, he is fishing for a defensive argument, despite any of the suspicion logic coming from VFP.

And who is even thinking about their posting rate this early on Day 1 anyways? Maybe scum who has been actively trying to post more in order to avoid suspicion, so they have been thinking about their posting rate since before the thread even opened up.

[Lukewarm]

Do people really think that I want to blindly follow VFP, when they are pushing for me to be the day 1 vote?

In post 94 I stated that I don't like when people:

• 1) claim a power role for no reason on day 1
  2) meme jester
  3) blindly believe other people saying they are clear

and further explained that in post 186. The response of 186 was for another person to meme jester, and another person to "hard claim pr".....

So I decided that maybe I needed to take the game a bit less seriously if I was gonna enjoy this game, and I claimed a power role for no reason day 1 (post 192), memed jester by voting myself (post 194), and then stated that I was going to blindly follow VFP (post 290).

And then multiple people took my took me 100% seriously.

[Lukewarm]

Furthermore, I am really glad that I choose VFP for the person when I chose someone to day I was going to blindly follow, because it appears to be the first thing to make them post a well reasoned post lol.

Look at mini trying to have a conversation with them. (a joint mini + vfp iso, starting with post 254 through post 283). No matter how hard mini tried to engage them, vfp gave nothing to work with.

Of vfp's post 323 in response to mozamis.

Everytime someone has tried to seriously engage with them, vfp has avoided proper engagement. But then when I said I was blindingly following them they made this :

so now that we have progressed a little - how do people feel about no limming so PRs can do their thing and investigatives can potentially give us some juicy info?

I love this idea.

On a side note. I actually liked ND's response there.
Lukewarm however, that was a bad response. Not only are they trying to push me off to another target by calling to my ego and complimenting my block but to act naive and to try and say that ND wasn't on the list when it's very clear I had them marked as red.
It's either Lukewarm not reading the game or trying to pull the wool over my eyes.
ND is the easier target for Lukewarm to push me towards given how my reads were.

Anything outside of a No lim should be Lukewarm.
But DK has spoken!

An actual post, with reasonings that can be analyze, huzzah

[Lukewarm]

Artemiana

: Null read, maybe the slightest hint of a lean towards scum. Has made absolutly zero posts with content. after 3 days, this starts to worry me. The longer that goes on, the more I start to feel like they are either scum trying to avoid slipping up, or they are a town player who is not actually going to help the town scum hunt.

DMG

: hmmm. DMG is hard to read so far. I am going back and forth on them.

DkKob

: Town lean. I am finding it hard to articulate why, but I liked reading through their iso.

Flea

: Null read, maybe very slight lean towards town

Flow Trap

: town lean. Looking at thier 3 votes, they all seem like town logic, and especially their second vote against Artemiana seems counter to how scum would choose a vote.

Green

: Town lean

Mini

- Town lean? They tried so hard to engage with VFP, and that seems more of a town thing to do . This is a weak lean

Mozamis

: Same as Artemiana, except post 322 came after I already called them out for it, and it stil has very minimal content, but more content then Artemiana has provided.

NDMath

: scum lean. Post 291 really rubs me the wrong way. They seemed too agitated and defensive over VFP's scum read on them, especially given that they have zero votes against them.

Not_Mafia

: Not enough content for me to read

Save the Dragon

: town lean. Seems to actually be scum hunting. For some reason, them asking for my mafia playing experience felt town.

VFP

: So many posts, but none of them feel serious at all, which makes it hard to read them. I am actually inclined to give them a town lean.

Yessiree

: having a hard time forming an opinion here

[Lukewarm]

Being scumread for no apparent reason is inherently agitating?

Maybe if it was not Day 1, when more reads have very little to go on anyways. And maybe if VFP's scum read on you was getting you close to being voted out.

It rubbed me the wrong way because it is Day 1, and you have zero votes on you, like VFP isn't even voting for you, but you still seem defensive.

[Lukewarm]

idk why people are calling green towny, most people saying so have no explanation and he just seems like obvious mafia to me

Post 156. Felt like he was trying to understand my positions, which is more important for town then for scum because scum already knows who is on which team.

Their post 246 / 250 made sense to me and has been part of why I have been back and forth on you.

Post 317 argued against a no-elim day 1, which seems like a town thing to do. No elim on Day 1 is almost always better for scum, but he made a good argument against it. I don't think scum would necessarily argue for it, but he could have stayed quiet and just wait to see if the no-elim train gained any steam.

[Lukewarm]

VOTE: Dark Magician Girl

[Lukewarm]

I already have my vote on DMG, but I am even more turned off of them by the fact that they have turned the majority of the last two pages of this thread into a discussion on the identities of their hydra. Both generating, and encouraging other people to generate, posts in the thread that cannot help us to find the mafia is anti-town.

[Lukewarm]

Not helpful#Anti-town

I am very purposefully saying that it is anti-town. Pulled from the mafiascum wiki.

"Anti-Town"

is a term used to describe play or players that hinder the Town's ability to achieve their Win Condition of hunting down the scum."

Diluting the pool of useful posts is not just unhelpful, it actively "hinders the Town's ability to achieve their win condition of hunting down the scum."

[Lukewarm]

koba what're your thoughts on lukewarm

just saw you're voting him still

Is your read on me dependent on if I am town or scum reading you?

You scum read me at first, then I gave you a town lean, and suddenly all of your posts about me were pretty positive building up to eventually trying to convince other people that I am town

Spoiler:

DMG: hmmm. DMG is hard to read so far. I am going back and forth on them.

reads like this usually come from town for anyone still thinking lukewarm is scum

But now that I am scum reading you / voting for you, you are reconsidering? Or at least that is how I read the quoted post.

[Lukewarm]

VOTE: MiniVirgo

[Lukewarm]

VOTE: MiniVirgo

Their response to koba was

insane

.

I have a scum lean on Mini at this point anyways, but even if they are not scum, I do not want to play a game with someone who is gonna talk to other players the way they just did.

So a vote for them is a win-win in my book.

[Lukewarm]

ok what is ur read there then

I refuse to state

????

[Lukewarm]

@Mini give yourself an unvote, give me 3 names and I'll tell you exactly where I have them and why.

I shouldn't have to push and prod this much for your reads at all

- JV

After all the work you put in to get VFP's reads, they finally offer to break down their reads on 3 players and you didn't take them up on it?

[Lukewarm]

After all the work you put in to get VFP's reads, they finally offer to break down their reads on 3 players and you didn't take them up on it?

How is asking the same question 3 or 4 times considered as all of that work?

I mean they at least dedicated a lot of posts towards it . Just did a quick scan of their ISO, and 14 of their first 29 posts were directed at you / your reads. So it seemed like they were pretty invested in trying to get reads from you lol

[Lukewarm]

@VFP have you played any games with either head of MiniVirgo?

[Lukewarm]

You have an interesting stance of [geting frustrated with you = Town].

You read NDMath as town when they got frustrated with you, and now you also read MiniVirgo as town for getting frustrated with you. I don't know that that reaction is necessarily indicative of town behavior.

My counter example: I am town, and decided to just embrace the tone you were bringing to the game lol

To be clear, I am suspicious of MiniVirgo, but I am not using MiniVirgo's reaction to you as being indicative of being scum. The way people react to how you have played this game just seems more like a personality thing, not an alignment thing, and so it probably should not be used to form a town read on them. I am taking that as a null read indicator.

[Lukewarm]

Don't get me wrong, they are probably town here and pushing me just makes their case stronger.

[Lukewarm]

It's the "makes their case stronger" part that gives me that impression

[Lukewarm]

Maybe we should re-kick start the discussion using the never before seen (and therefore never before wrong) Lukewarm Town Block™

Lukewarm
VFP
Dkkoba
Flow Trap
Save the Dragon
Green
Flea the Magician

Not Mafia
Moz
Artemiana
Mini
Yessiree

ND

OR

Dark Magician Girl

(but not both)

MiniVirgo

Spoiler:

Read logic not included

[Lukewarm]

My counter example: I am town, and decided to just embrace the tone you were bringing to the game lol

I object that's not a valid counter-example

Flow Trap

[Lukewarm]

All dogs are animals a cat being an animal does not disprove that all dogs are animals
A dog which is not an animal disproves all dogs are animals

Yeah, I don't really care to argue a point that has already been addressed by VFP. I don't think it will get us anywhere

Flow Trap

[Lukewarm]

Flow Trap

Before anyone gives me a stink eye for this, I am kidding with the color change. I have a null read on Flow Trap, with maybe a slight town lean.

[Lukewarm]

All dogs are animals a cat being an animal does not disprove that all dogs are animals
A dog which is not an animal disproves all dogs are animals

Yeah, I don't really care to argue a point that has already been addressed by VFP. I don't think it will get us anywhere

I don't like this response; Flow trap points out you're using a fallacy in your reasoning and your first response is to call it unimportant rather than either modify your reasoning or argue that you didn't use a fallacy.

First and foremost, VFP had already addressed my main point, and their response was enough for me to no longer believe the actual point I had been trying to make. My opinion had already been swayed, so why debate the logic behind a now-defunct-opinion. In my response I said my point "has already been addressed by VFP"

I was no longer trying to convince anyone of anything, so why does it even matter if my logic was faulty or not?

Spoiler:

secondly, I don't think I used a fallacy in the logic of my main point. It was just a bad choice to use that as counter point. At the time when I typed it, I thought using myself as a counter point was funny.

[Lukewarm]

Maybe we should re-kick start the discussion using the never before seen (and therefore never before wrong) Lukewarm Town Block™

Lukewarm
VFP
Dkkoba
Flow Trap
Save the Dragon
Green
Flea the Magician

Not Mafia
Moz
Artemiana
Mini
Yessiree

ND

OR

Dark Magician Girl

(but not both)

MiniVirgo

Spoiler:

Read logic not included

Why do you have our slot there twice?

- Mini

:oops:Because I literally copy and pasted VFP's town block to make sure I used the same formatting, but apparently messed up when I plugged my own reads in to it

[Lukewarm]

im actively posting more to avoid suspicion yeah

What was the need to say this

- Mini

Pretty sure this was a joke (at my expense) after I made this post lol

So far I've posted at a higher posting rate than usual for me as either alignment,

And here, he is fishing for a defensive argument, despite any of the suspicion logic coming from VFP.

And who is even thinking about their posting rate this early on Day 1 anyways? Maybe scum who has been actively trying to post more in order to avoid suspicion.

[Lukewarm]

i just recently played a game where i caught scum crayons fairly early and i dont get quite the same vibe here

Just because you dont get the same vibe in this gamer to other games about players doesnt really prove much anything could happen so dont get too caught up in the meta side of reading people

- Mini

Honestly, from my experience, there is very little to go on Day 1, except past experiences and general vibes. I generally view Day 1 as a chore to get through to get the to more fun parts of the game, when I can scum hunt using concrete information. Don't get me wrong, Day 1 conversations are vital later on, because you can think about those posts in light of the new information that you gained moving forward in the game, but DkKoba's reasonings for reading people on Day 1, when no one has concrete information, seems just as valid of a way to approach Day 1 as anything I am seeing from the other players in this game.

[Lukewarm]

i actually gave REASONS - for my mini scumread, did you like completely ignore that?

Yeah, I really liked the point you made in post 482. Mini was already moving to the lower end of my read list before you made that post, but that post did push him a bit lower still.

[Lukewarm]

i actually gave REASONS - for my mini scumread, did you like completely ignore that?

Yeah, I really liked the point you made in post 482. Mini was already moving to the lower end of my read list before you made that post, but that post did push him a bit lower still.

No you didn't.

Yeah, I really did. As I was reading through, I was wondering why they were taking being scum read on Day 1 so seriously/personally, and post 482 was better (and nicer) then any explanation that I could come up with

[Lukewarm]

Yeah, I really did. As I was reading through, I was wondering why they were taking being scum read on Day 1 so seriously/personally, and post 482 was better (and nicer) then any explanation that I could come up with

No you didn't.
516 sums up why they reacted to Dk calling them scum, regardless of alignment.

I mean you are welcome to town read them if you'd like, but I don't. And quite honestly, I don't think there is much that could be done today to get me to take my vote off of them before the day ends.

[Lukewarm]

I mean you are welcome to town read them if you'd like, but I don't. And quite honestly, I don't think there is much that could be done today to get me to take my vote off of them before the day ends.

This isn't about town reading or scum reading them.
You were talking about wondering why Mini reacted like that. I'm telling you why they reacted like that.

It could be scum frustration as much as town frustration. That's a geniune reason if I've ever seen one though.
482 does not explain the reaction, it explains the agenda from Dk's opinion.

You pointed to a post from mini, where they admitted to having lost twice to DkKoba. And that is supposed to completely explains why they it would be make sense that they were upset to have been scum read by koba?

That level of reaction simply does not make sense to me if they are town being scum read. That level of reaction feels more genuine if it is the reaction to thinking you are getting ready to lose to koba a 3rd time in a row. Which indicates to me that they are scum, upset by being scum read by koba.

I might be right, I might be wrong, but my vote isn't changing off of Mini until they are dead or I am. I am more then happy to keep scum hunting other people in the mean time tho.

[Lukewarm]

One thing I want to point out with the above, you have the scenerio of Mini scum losing to Dk town, but not Mini town losing to Dk scum?
If Mini flips town, is Dk scum for you?

I mean, maybe I would reconsider Koba in that scenario? But my hypothesis hinged on Mini knowing that they were on opposing teams. Scum Mini would know for sure, Town Mini would not have any extra information, so their read would carry the same weight as the reads of anyone else who flips town after day 1

[Lukewarm]

I mean, maybe I would reconsider Koba in that scenario? But my hypothesis hinged on Mini knowing that they were on opposing teams. Scum Mini would know for sure, Town Mini would not have any extra information, so their read would carry the same weight as the reads of anyone else who flips town after day 1

Isn't Dk pretty certain that they are on different teams?

This question made me pause.

I just went back through their iso, and I would say no, at least not until after Mini's blow up. Koba does not once mention being suspicious of Mini until post 456 where they say they "think JV might be scum here." Which is the post that trigger the exchange between the two of them. Through out their exchange, koba does not immediately jump to "they are definitely scum," they mainly just defended themselves until post 482 when they said that they caught scum slip. They do seem pretty set on it after that point, but to be honest, that is about the point that I became set on it too.

So no, I would say that at the start of the exchange, koba seems unsure that they are on different teams, and had only just recently floated it as even a possibility. They did however become convinced after seeing mini's reaction to them floating a scum read in their direction.

[Lukewarm]

VFP, you are really jumping through a lot of hoops to try and make this point.

You fail to add 463.
This post is clearly Dk calling them scum without sign of doubt.

No, I did not over look post 463. That post is clearly koba defending their own ability, and it does not say that Mini is scum in this game (it is talking about their previous game). I read this exchange as mini saying "the way you make reads does not work" and koba saying "it worked for me before in the game we just played." I just do not see "Dk calling them scum without sign of doubt" as you put it.

The other part is that I don't think Mini ever calls Dk scum here, so the argument that Mini knows that they aren't on the same team isn't exactly valid as there's no evidence that Mini thinks this.

I never once said that Mini called Dk scum?? And that does not matter for the logic I presented in post 605
My logic was: for their response to make any sense to me, they must know that they are on different teams, and think he is going to lose to koba a 3rd time in a row -> if they know they are on different teams, he must be scum

Scum Mini never has to call DkKoba scum for them to know that they are on opposite teams, because the scum knows the scum team. (Also, not that it mattered to me, but apparntly it affects your read of the situation?? Mini did later call Koba scum in post 601 )

[Lukewarm]

what gives you the impression that Mini is making this SvT over TvT?

I feel like I have been clear on this. Quite simply, I am trying to make Mini's reaction make

ANY

sense to me.

I went and hunted down the koba / virgo game that they played together, and you know how that game played out? Virgo, as mafia, getting voted out day 1 because Koba scum read them.

If it is a TvT interaction, then I cannot make Mini's reaction make any sense to me. If they are town, being scum read by koba, then what is the big deal, right? Town should not be that upset over a scum read on them on Day 1. I mean most games start with a town elimination on Day 1, can you imagine if that is how town reacts to that? Even in light of their prior game history, if koba is now misreading them, then Virgo can become self assured that koba's read on them in the prior game was a fluke.

If it is a SvT interaction, then Virgo's reaction makes more sense to me. Unlike Town, scum should be more upset at being scum read day 1 in general, because that means they are failing at their main goal. And then if you add in the game history, suddenly Virgo is thinking that there is a possibility of them being voted out Day 1, as scum, twice because of a Koba's read on them. Then suddenly, their reaction (while still unacceptable) make a little bit of sense.

So my options on how to read Virgo were as follows:
1) Despite being fairly experienced with Mafia, they are very upset by the idea of being scum read as town on Day 1
2) Their pride was wounded by being correctly scum read by Koba on day 1, two games in a row.

Option 2 is the only option that makes Virgo's eruption come anywhere close to making sense to me (and even then is unacceptable)

[Lukewarm]

To be quite honest, I did not really want to do a deep dive into analyzing their reaction. My plan was to leave my vote on them and hope they got voted out Day 1, and then pretend that that explosion never happened.

I am unclear why you kept bringing it back to the focus of the conversation VFP?

[Lukewarm]

That is the last I have to say on MiniVirgo. My vote is gonna stay there until either they are dead, or I am dead (

or I replace out of this game tbh

).

I would much rather spend the rest of Day 1, discussion the other players of the game.

[Lukewarm]

im gonna go back to bending and reread that game because i think scum me tried to pocket them that game while they scumread me early? let me see.

I saw the one where you were town and they were scum. Might not be the most recent of the two

[Lukewarm]

616 and 617 I'm going to stop engaging with because it's like hitting my head against a wall.

Yeah, I was feeling the same way. To be honest, I was not gonna move my vote off of Mini, no matter what, so trying to convince me they were town was futile.

Me assuming MiniVirgo is scum, is me trying to approach the situation they created as nicely as possible. Quiet honestly, Virgo is either scum (where their response makes some kind of sense) or someone I never want to play out a game with. I was trying to explain that, without being quite so explicit.

post 482 was better (and nicer) then any explanation that I could come up with

So either way, my vote was never gonna leave them. I am honestly surprised that the lobby isn't going to pass it as a policy vote. To be frank, I care more about getting Virgo out of this game, then I care about winning.

[Lukewarm]

@everyone, glad you guys could win without me. I feel bad, like I did not set town up for a win by drawing a lot of attention to myself, then replacing out.
(My slot even got miselimed Day 1 because of it)

So glad, yall could win despite that

[Lukewarm]

I can definitely forward these ideas on.

Any thoughts on the no pre-game discussion rule? It has to be in place because an honest mass claim would automatically solve the PRs and a dishonest mass claim would really narrow the pool down. But it would be nice if there was a way to make it more lenient so it doesn't fully take away that aspect of the game

What about saying that it can't be discussed Day 1? If 2 (or in this case 3) people are dead by the start of Day 2, then it keeps the thread from knowing every single charge, and leave a little more wiggle room for scum to lie and get a way with it.

[Lukewarm]

Over all, this was a really cool set-up, nice choice Raya! Thanks for modding

[Lukewarm]

I can definitely forward these ideas on.

Any thoughts on the no pre-game discussion rule? It has to be in place because an honest mass claim would automatically solve the PRs and a dishonest mass claim would really narrow the pool down. But it would be nice if there was a way to make it more lenient so it doesn't fully take away that aspect of the game

What about saying that it can't be discussed Day 1? If 2 (or in this case 3) people are dead by the start of Day 2, then it keeps the thread from knowing every single charge, and leave a little more wiggle room for scum to lie and get a way with it.

This could work although scum would have to be the last to claim to know how they should be claiming

Oh, I was thinking more like, since the thread will never know how the first few people who died voted, then any inconsistencies could potentially be covered by that lack of knowledge. I have not really sat down to think about how it would play out to know if it would work out that way or not