Open 779: Pick Your Power X/Y Game Over!

[Iconeum]

[Iconeum]

any claims so far?

[Iconeum]

VOTE: aldus
have you finally rolled scum you scumfuck?

I also think its low-key unlikely for there to be more than 1 scum in the 1's and 2's combined

skitter scum with 2 other people in 1's and 2's confirmed

was this a joke? because i read that and thought the same thing lol

[Iconeum]

yeah your slot claimed scum is that true

did it get counterclaimed yet?

[Iconeum]

Sorry, i only skimmed posts, didn't notice 42 anywhere and i didn't connect the thoughts processes.

I wouldn't think it's AI though, and i have reasons to think that the top 4 slots are all town, so i'm fine voting down below so far

-Farkran

pedit: i don't believe scum needs this kind of info

There's literally no way you can have this much info yet

Meh

VOTE: farkset hydra

Big +1 on I have no idea how you're calling the top 4 slots town, farkran.

@datisi, I strongly suspect that if skitter is scum that that statement was made as pure WIFOM. I personally disagree with her lowkey idea (I don't know why it's unlikely that scum would choose in both 1 and 2?) but agree that it's unlikely 2 scum would have picked the same number.

i like this from skitter tho

[Iconeum]

okay i'm not gonna do a full catchup like this

[Iconeum]

okay, in that case, icon can you tell me what you make of Datisi's slot when you get back please and specifically what you think of 208 and whether you think that's consistent with town!him

re:aldus yeah, I meant to write the other thing but I still like it as a take

meh, fees like early game datisi who's uninvested/lacking reads and it's in her meta to just take a step back until spicey stuff happens. Dats isn't one to ignite the action or kick the hornets nest.

[Iconeum]

I think you've been kind of soft-protecting dunn/alim/aldus and you've been hedgy on melody. as in on the first two I think you've been calling them town but softly, as in if they did go through you'd be in a position to get some cred for not being on them but you're not committed to a hard TR on either so you could backtrack quite easily if you need to. and the same on melody, I just feel like your towered-to-gut-scumping could quite easily be you leaving room around them so you can change your position up however you want

i wouldn't really say i'm soft-protecting aldu
or alim either really (but not as much)
melody is more that i changed my mind than anything else

VOTE: skitter

payback is coming

[Iconeum]

this gamestate is gross, like half the game isn't playing and i don't like the leading wagon

maybe we should lynch it anyways and if it flips scum we can lynch you next?

[Iconeum]

I'll leave Don be for today. Be careful with night actions targeting him, he could be scum pgo, as I've explained.

VOTE: brassherald

I'm not sure how I feel about aldus.

Poe read, kind of

This is quite a bad post for many reasons, Dunn.

Please take a stance on aldus.

-Farkran

Why?

I'm not convinced that he's scum

My very rough reads are something like Farkset, Melody, Skitter, JacksonVirgo, Datisi as towny people

gonna be honest haven't read everything, but especially skitter and datisi townreads can you expand on those? Really curious what exactly makes you townread them.

[Iconeum]

neum, is your skitter vote serious?

no, but i am genuinely interested in Dunn's townread there

[Iconeum]

i

want

skitter to be scum because i

want

to catch her this time around

[Iconeum]

there's a bit too many players for me to really be able to work with like i love to do

i'm sorry to say i don't really have any reads yet but i'm working on getting into this game

main angle i wanna persue right now is those townreads

[Iconeum]

I also disliked the clemency slot and iconeum hasn't done much to improve on that, the game isn't even that long and usually replacements go either A. hey guys i'll catchup and give my contribution; or B. hey guys i won't bother about catchup so i'll form reads while engaging in real time

And i have seen neither.

-Farkran

how about you make a conclusion about it? If you've never seen either, why are you trying to use it as an AI something?

[Iconeum]

this gamestate is gross, like half the game isn't playing and i don't like the leading wagon

maybe we should lynch it anyways and if it flips scum we can lynch you next?

And if your vote isnt serious what is this

Can you find a serious place to vote please? Its not like there's a dearth of content to interact with ...

my vote on you was made prior to this, and it was not serious

this quote wasn't a joke tho, i found it interesting that you go half-way to defend a slot without really diving into it

[Iconeum]

I agree that i rather dislike ico's engagement thus far

i x5'd Clement's total posts in like 24 hours or something

and while there aren't any major world-shattering reads or solves, i think i've done enough so far

what are you disliking exactly?

[Iconeum]

I also disliked the clemency slot and iconeum hasn't done much to improve on that, the game isn't even that long and usually replacements go either A. hey guys i'll catchup and give my contribution; or B. hey guys i won't bother about catchup so i'll form reads while engaging in real time

And i have seen neither.

-Farkran

let's see

i got my hello posts in
i think skitter was out of line that i engaged on, but also saw some good in there and i'm engaging with skitter to try and work this out
i talked to DonC about the datisi slot
i'm engaging dunnstral over some townreads that came a little easy, but no response yet

and this is in the first 2 rl days that i came into the game


vs clemency's 3 (three) posts that have a total of 0 content

How is that not improving the slot?

[Iconeum]

i've been pretty straightforward with my engagement here, seeing i just got here

don't expect me to wade thru the entire playlist in 48 hours, i probably won't even touch half the playerlist of this size if i got here from the start

i'm fine with where i am and what I did and I find it really odd that Farkset has the balls saying i didn't improve this slot

[Iconeum]

t

i just made a list, while i read back thru my own ISO, of what i've done/generated so far

not exactly like anyone had to drag information out of me?

[Iconeum]

oops

[Iconeum]

Ok and
- i wouldnt really call my townread/defense of aldu 'half-way' or that 'i'm not really diving into it' given that like half my posts in the past couple of days are about this and i've beem very consistent in complaining about the wagon as it's being pushed

Like what's half-way about it exactly?

i only remember reading 1 post about you not liking the main wagon and that was that
even went thru your iso and didn't really notice you fighting against it therefore what i call half way

[Iconeum]

like, i really don't see a problem with the answers i've given either?

i replied to everything when I logged in this morning? how's that pulling teeth?

[Iconeum]

VOTE: Aldus

Bad catch up is bad.

Well I have a crazy week until Friday with about 40 of my 100 monthly hearings being left. So probably semi VLA. Also got tested for the covid yesterday not because I'm sick but a person I know is working on the antibody tests. Not game related but I wanted everyone to know I do have a brain it's been a long standing question

please keep at least 1,5 meters distance from my posts thank you

[Iconeum]

i like cat scratch as my main townread here

thoughts?

[Iconeum]

okayy uhhhh

just finished reading aldus ISO

FOS everyone voting there

[Iconeum]

i read aldus ISO as someone trying to solve, not afraid of putting out thoughts and generally being active

lynching him is counter-productive and town is probably better off lynching a slot that's not playing - lurking - something in between (and no that's not me )

[Iconeum]

i'm aware of what i wrote and the conflict in it

not sure what to make of it

[Iconeum]

VOTE: dr drew

[Iconeum]

quickly went thru the wagon on aldus

drew is in that sweet scum spot where they can just hop on and he does have scum potential in his iso let me go quote it

[Iconeum]

VOTE: Farkset

Feels like alot of noise for early D1.

this is a terrible opening vote and not even a funny RVS one. since when is making noise scum-indicative?

Something about Melody's defense of me and their meta of Skitter is just, off putting?

Funny, Fark was thinking Melody was trying to pocket them, and I get vibes that the same is happening with Skitter and I.

My scum read on Fark is starting to waiver

Pre Edit: And now Jackson??

your scumread is wavering? you haven't interacted with him

once

, no effort in trying to solve it. Just shotgun statements.

Huh, Ald really wants everyone to be sure that he is top wagon.

VOTE: Ald

and this is just… lyncheable

[Iconeum]

choo choo lol

[Iconeum]

quickly went thru the wagon on aldus

drew is in that sweet scum spot where they can just hop on and he does have scum potential in his iso let me go quote it

Ico where are you at with your reads? What did you think of brass's vote on aldus esp in contrast to drew's?

i've provided what i had up until this point? you could ask for more but i already stated why there isn't so why are you asking for more if you haven't even engaged on what I did provide?

[Iconeum]

Iconeum slot is bad, i don't have experience with either of the players that filled it, but gameflaking is meh and when iconeum replaced in it was not improving, until he was prodded for it and (re)started the wagon on drew. Not a good position if drew is town, not a good position if aldus is scum. I am not voting towards ico because i want other flips first.

what's meh about it? I already spent time explaining exactly why it isn't meh and I don't believe you even touched that post so??

[Iconeum]

it's such a super easy discredit there, farkset, but if you just ignore my posts then yeah, this slot is meh.

super bad vibes from you here

[Iconeum]

quite the opposite, scumtisi would read it, while towntisi here saw walls and just skimmed past because i know i can just ask someone to give me a tldr of "should i unvote y/n"

VOTE: melody

uhhh if anyone has a case on why i should vote someone that's under 150 words i might read it

anyway drew's claim strikes me as town unless it's some weird gambit where one of his scumbuddies is the neighborizer (but that's super risky)

pedit: YES ABSOLUTELY CAN WE FINALLY GET THAT MELODY WAGON ROLLING FINALLY

VOTE: melody

not particularly fond of a melody wagon here
IIRC there's only a bunch of talk about setup spec and wifom wrt to the claim? Doesn't warrant this slot to be a D1 lynch imo

[Iconeum]

I didn't have time to debate them back then. Let's hear why you think that, skitts.

i dislike many of your takes, including but not limited to:

- scum!aldu
- town!jv
- townleaning dats early game
- dislike the alimida progression; it's one of the consensus-y reads; feels like you townbinned him once i shut down the push

furthermore a lot of your reads feel consensus-y to me

also some of your posts just feel kinda pingy (321 tone about drew; evening apologizing for switching off of aldu and onto cats 390

ah

[Iconeum]

I could do ico. Is anyone townreading ico?

are you… scumreading me? because then i'd be a good push.

otherwise, gtfo

[Iconeum]

I could do ico. Is anyone townreading ico?

brutal, he's TRing you

yep, and so Cat probably isn't scum here because of that

[Iconeum]

Why is ico town? I feel like he was a lot townier when I played with him before

ooh spicey we have met before?

can you tell me which game (sorry i don't remember)

[Iconeum]

I didn't have time to debate them back then. Let's hear why you think that, skitts.

i dislike many of your takes, including but not limited to:

- scum!aldu
- town!jv
- townleaning dats early game
- dislike the alimida progression; it's one of the consensus-y reads; feels like you townbinned him once i shut down the push

furthermore a lot of your reads feel consensus-y to me

also some of your posts just feel kinda pingy (321 tone about drew; evening apologizing for switching off of aldu and onto cats 390

ah

can't say i'm really feeling it, skitter

(inb4 that's what she said)

[Iconeum]

hey fark

talk to me about those posts i made you appear to be ignoring?

[Iconeum]

The drew wagon is dead, new highest wagons are aldus and melody

I can relate to the reasons why those two are counterwagons right now and i think we're in good wagonomics. I don't feel the need to flashwagon somewhere else. Can everyone take a stance on these two and finalize the day?

-Farkran

ok

VOTE: farkset

you didn't only completely ignore my posts, but of others who said why they think i'm town as well

like it doesn't fit your agenda to reconsider your stance on me

[Iconeum]

when did i get prodded for anything?

[Iconeum]

so what we got

-hardlurking: i'm not anything close to this. If my predecessor wasn't here, it isn't because he was scum that much is Obvious (to me :p )
-my opening: you can call it bad all you want, but you'll need to talk about *why* it's bad. It's impossible for me to say or defend it if you make blank shotgun statements like that
-getting prodded for content and not improving until this: i don't recall this and i'm just gonna call this a lie/misinformation

[Iconeum]

I really get the feeling you are deliberately taking all the bad stuff (over which i have no control over) and are ignoring what i'm *actually* doing here

that you don't townread me, sure fair enough there's enough points on the balance (but again, most of which are pre-Iconeum) but outright scumreading me seems… somewhere between a stretch and outright fake.

[Iconeum]

I mean in-game player prod, not mod prod. Post 720. Before then, very few people talked about your slot at all, which to me is a very weird thing to happen around a hardlurker slot.

-F

pedit:

1. No, you are not hardlurking. As i said i am referring to your pred Clemency.
2-3. I did. Post 720.

oh i see, pre-post 720

I don't think it was that bad honestly
wasn't fully caught up, there were some RVS related posts and semi RVS 'getting feels for the game' type of posts in there
I think there was at least some usefull content there where I questioned certain townreads IIRC

and afterwards I really don't think i've been slacking (to my own standards)

so yeah I think putting me all the way down there in your scumreads is bad mkay

[Iconeum]

Did a quick reread pre-720 and I think you should need to reread:

607
609
704
707
709

and 716 even explains i'm still getting into this game (which shouldn't be that much to ask for since I just got in)

Do you really think that isn't improving clemency slot?

[Iconeum]

What would be your impartial opinion of your slot, if you were an external spectator to this game, and why?

And, after you've expressed your opinion, what would you think about your slot if drdrew was conftown and aldus confscum?

I mean, i don't know how i could be more straightforward than this: i don't like your slot, i would use you as a compromise for today, but ideally i'd like to reassess after a different flip.

-Farkran

It's literally impossible to be impartial because i'm me. I disagree with your take that low-content slots (or in this case NO content) on D1 are more scum then town. I have a completely different experience there. It often flips town. And the flips don't advance the game one bit. OTOH it's necesarry to take those slots out if they aren't contributing later in the game.

Seeing how i'm obviously a contributing factor right now, that shouldn't be applicable anymore.

If I am to Judge my own content, then i'd say it does not in any way shape or form warrant a scumread on me.
I'd rather not reply to your question about my thoughts about my own slot pending certain flips, because that's a really dirty thing ask imo.

[Iconeum]

Fark, you didn't townread Clemency. Nobody is asking that from you. But you hammer me for not providing enough content to your liking (despite that I don't agree with that), and after your 'prod' I think I even picked up the pace but you still scumread me for it.

That's like:

'omg ico is scum he isn't doing anything'
ico picks up the pace and does things'
'omg guys look ico is still scum because he is only doing this after being pushed'

a really unfair way to treat a slot (tho not necesarilly scummy)

[Iconeum]

in other news i have a standard weekend vla so my vote is gonna stick where i leave it in a couple hours

[Iconeum]

hi Doc

sorry we hadn't had the chance to fight yet :p

perhaps another day

[Iconeum]

weekend vla

will be checking in if my vote is needed to not have a no lynch

[Iconeum]

VOTE: alimdia

[Iconeum]

Alimdia, claim which PR you got because I’m sceptical that you got something that low down in the draft

i'm not sure how natural it is for you to feel that way after claiming to have a PR from way down in the draft as well

[Iconeum]

*Sigh* goddamnit

VOTE: datisi

This may be better. I think he’s been actively avoiding producing content and is basically scum apathy telling. Stronger start followed by a tailing off due to lack of knowing what to say, and I think that him saying he has no reads may well be true but because he isn’t able to due to being informed.

datisi is a slot that will either improve over time, or be lynched later

probably a bad lynch for day 1

[Iconeum]

i was town with DonC in G&R, was vibing a lot more there with him

[Iconeum]

he had very sheepable reads and good takes

not getting that at all here

[Iconeum]

VOTE: aldus

[Iconeum]

alim's latest posting together with DonC having a really icky take about position in the draft makes me not wanna lynch alim

proximity to deadline forces my vote on aldus

[Iconeum]

Which is also one of the major reasons why i'm also concerned by the iconeum slot, like, from clemency's history (= none) that slot would probably have been the most viable alternative but there hasn't been any interest in lynching there for the entirety of the day.

Again, you CANNOT push me on inactivity when I'm clearly being active. Clemency not being here when he had the slot is NAI at best.

I'm getting more then annoyed by your insistent pushing of that (very bad) angle

[Iconeum]

Fark you are basing that push on me on the alternate timeline where I didn't rep in and clemency still didn't provide anything.
We are not on that timeline.

Your push on me is pinging me.

[Iconeum]

i was town with DonC in G&R, was vibing a lot more there with him

I’m pretty sure you were insistent on wanting to vig me on D1 because you thought my takes were terrible? This doesn’t sound like how you thought of me in GnR from my memory at all. In fact I think you only started treating me as not being someone you wanted dead because I was literally conftown

i don't remember day 1 at all

only late/end game

it's not about townreading you, but viiiibing

[Iconeum]

i was town with DonC in G&R, was vibing a lot more there with him

I’m pretty sure you were insistent on wanting to vig me on D1 because you thought my takes were terrible? This doesn’t sound like how you thought of me in GnR from my memory at all. In fact I think you only started treating me as not being someone you wanted dead because I was literally conftown

i don't remember day 1 at all

only late/end game

it's not about townreading you, but viiiibing

had to go reread

I actually townread you there early D1
I threatened to shoot anyone in the +200 post count during N1 (which was basicly you, but should have been read as semi-joking)
And then I went full OMGUS on you by the end of D1 because of your (according to myself ofcourse) shitpush on me

don't remember what happened next exactly but you are right that vibing with someone who is confirmed town is *easier* then with someone who isn't so it's probably not a fair take to Judge you on, indeed

[Iconeum]

oh hey ico is here

ico why am i a bad lynch day 1

because you are somewhat like me and only start to thrive once the numbers go down a bit
i don't like lynching people because they haven't produced enough (yet)

i think it's better to sort you on future content then a NAI lacking of content D1

[Iconeum]

You mean when my mechanical chances of hitting scum were 66%?I’ll be honest icon, it’s pretty easy to hit scum when you have a raw 2/3 chance. I think you should take a look back and consider how you were towards me on D1 because the main reason why I’m not scumreading you here is because I think you’re reminiscent of GnR only a bit more active

Ur right about the facts that I didn't take into account. We were both conftown when I vibed with you, despite not entirely agreeing on reads.

Tho I actually did townread you early D1 and I only went full retard when you were pushing me

[Iconeum]

lmao donc's comment annoys me so much i wanna vote him

Why, what’s inaccurate there?

it's funny

towngame after towngame i get shit like
> "datisi is lurking, scum"
> "datisi isn't invested in this game, scum"
> "datisi doesn't have reads, scum"
> "datisi doesn't know how to fake reads, scum"
> "datisi doesn't have progressions and trajectories, scum"
> "datisi isn't as towny as in micro 900, scum"

but

BUT

once i actually do roll scum, everyone townreads me

pedit: holy fuk chill

Iconeum, does this ring true to you?

I've never successfully caught scum!datisi. But i've managed to correctly townread her previously. There isn't anything for me to put her in either basket. Hence my insistence on sorting her when she actually provides.

[Iconeum]

literally the only thing saving jackson from eating rope is being first in draft and that's sad

soon even that won't be enough

If jackson in first in the draft, and he's town, don't you think there is a ++chance scum are gonna target him making him self-resolved?

[Iconeum]

literally the only thing saving jackson from eating rope is being first in draft and that's sad

soon even that won't be enough

Cool story bro, I just don't have wim in this game. That will change when there is less people, every now and then that's just how I play with newer people I've never played with. Apologies

I make jokes to try and gain wim but it doesn't work. I do still scum-read Melody and skitter though.

Hello I am Iconeum. You are gonna die tonight, probably. I am sorry.

[Iconeum]

datisi if JV is so prob!scum in your mind, do you think he is eager to help wagon Melody?

Like, are they scum together?

fp'd: i thought that was an actual vc

[Iconeum]

I change colors and title to avoid mixing up with the mod's

I also messed up almidia count, this is what i get for doing things in a hurry. Sorry.

-F

you may or may not believe me, but i run a completely colourless browser when i play mafia

[Iconeum]

Yes Aldus looks pretty towny here. I don't think Melody is a good lynch.

why exactly is melody a bad lynch for you?

[Iconeum]

Yes Aldus looks pretty towny here. I don't think Melody is a good lynch.

Actually I see where you're coming from.

Moving on: anyone else think 11 and 19 are scummy numbers?

VOTE: Doctor Pepper

okay now i'm really curious why you wanna lynch pepper based on number 1 and not melody who also picked 11?

[Iconeum]

that should be 11* twice, not 1*

[Iconeum]

if you wanna lynch DrP you'll have my support

let's see how serious you are about that solve then

that post was ugly

[Iconeum]

I counter claim cop

If you are the cop then you investigated DonC surely to determine if he's scum, in which case we get a good lynch today bringing scum down to 1. Otherwise you get certainty he is town trying to bait a NK away from the actual cop.

Outside of this the only reason you have to actually CC at this point, is a red check on someone else.

[Iconeum]

I counter claim cop

Oh, how nice, i sense another scum going down. Today it's dunn vs don i guess.

To be honest i thought DC claim was a joke, but since he went ahead with it, there's probably a high chance that he is the true cop. It doesn't make a lot of sense for DC to lock himself into a cop claim when he was nowhere near under pressure, on the other hand dunnstral is in a terrible position today and an attempt to wifom the true cop down seems a legit scum move.

I'm fine lynching dunnstral first. If you're town, you should claim your results.

-Farkran

Why aren't you thinking about implications about Dunn counterclaiming?

[Iconeum]

they need to lynch the cop now otherwise it's pretty much autoloss for them.

Then we can lynch outside of the claims & outside of the 1's and see what happens.

Exactly. If this does go to a 1V1 with neither claim backing down, we lynch outside of them and force scum to kill the cop or we lynch inside them tomorrow and prove which information was accurate.

[Iconeum]

Town fakeclaiming cop is gamethrowing, i'm not going to accept that.

Wrong. Town!DC fakeclaiming cop on D1 is perfectly acceptable as it might draw the scum NK on a VT.
IF DC doesn't retract his claim, we have 2 cop claims and we are NOT lynching in them today.

Both will produce a result tomorrow, or the real cop will die. If both alive tomorrow, we lynch in them and have a couple clears or a clear and a guilty.

The ONE thing that would be awfull here is that DC is actually the cop and Dunn is town who fake COUNTER claimed.

[Iconeum]

Fark if my vote on Alim was that awfull, how come you don't mention me being on the scum lynch? It's not a clear on me by a mile, but not mentioning it is at least bleh.

[Iconeum]

It's a terrible and inefficient strategy.

1) lying as town at this point in time will not prevent the nk, it attracts a lynch and screws all reasoning for the rest of the game
2) if both cops are left alive we invalidate the doctor

I'm never going for that and should never be considered as a viable option

-F

Pedit: no it isn't - DC claimed a result today. It's no longer an acceptable fakeclaim if you are luring out the true cop. Clearing players like that screws with the dayplay in a much worse way than losing the cop via nk. The counterclaims must be solved today.

1) it gives us a TON of information come tomorrow providing Dunn claims his result by the end of the day.
2) there isn't even confirmation we HAVE a doctor, and if we do it's not even sure he's town.

Like i said, everything depends on what Dunn did if he is actually the cop. If he has a green check on DonC, he played terrible by claiming now, which means I don't think that is what he did.

Dunn most likely CC'd because he has a red check.

[Iconeum]

Yeah I don't agree with your 1258.

Dunn just CC'd cop, and I was on the scum lynch. That's enough justification to lynch neither of us.
I do agree that Alim is probs town.

[Iconeum]

What does everyone think of the NK by itself? It's awfully low for scum to shoot in, and there was even a cop claim.

[Iconeum]

Maybe scum already tried killing DC via 1 shot vig, and so they have to force a 1v1. Either way this is why DC needs to either retract his claim or fully commit.

oh missed this.

Yeah there's a chance. Definitely agree that DC needs to take a stance before continuing this discussion

[Iconeum]

Dunn should out his result before anyone is lynched today, that's for sure. I agree that he could not have a green check on DC because that would be immensely stupid. A different green check should have been held until/if dunn was forced to claim. A red check should be outed immediately, but the lynch is still dunn to verify if the result is accountable, then -if it was- day 3 we lynch the red check and d4 we lynch DC.

Lynching elsewhere is a very bad strategy. If DC retracts the claim, i'll lynch DC. He shouldn't have forwarded a green result if he was fakeclaiming town.

-F

Well no. There's a few scenario, in neither one we are lynching DC.

DC retracts claim, Dunn has red check. We lynch red check.
DC retracts claim, Dunn has green check. We still don't lynch DC because he is probably town for the play in the first place.
DC doesn't retract claim, Dunn outs red check. We lynch red check.
DC doesn't retract claim, Dunn outs green check. We lynch neither claim and see where the NK goes. Probably mass claim next day. Next day, both claim results and we move off of that.

[Iconeum]

Ofcourse i'm ignoring a few Obvious elephants here, which are the fact that 2 players at the bottom are claiming cop. the claimed cop didn't get NK'd, and the fact that Melody got Nk'd for whatever reason and not the first pick (or 2nd, 3rd, or even 4th).

[Iconeum]

Two scummy counterwagons take more than the deadline timer and never reach more than 5 votes

A flashwagon starts and reaches L-3 over a single RL night

That's not where i am gonna vote, sorry. I agree with the general reasoning that most vocal players are usually town, but i think aldus also fits with the lurk-ish description and if scum is refusing to take a stance it's because there is at least one correct wagon in the two current highest, not because they are happy with the gamestate. This is not a peen contest, it's mafia logic.

Even not considering that, i don't feel alimdia scummy in a vacuum and i have seen town!him play similar to this in the undertale game.

-Farkran

UNVOTE:

i'm rereading the build up to the lynch and i don't think this comes from scum

[Iconeum]

Answering 1345 is a guide to what to do for scum so i won't answer that before DC answers, but the lynch is always between DC and Dunn today, there are zero alternatives about it.

Ok we'll just call it disagreeing on the matter, but i don't think your view on this is scummy.

[Iconeum]

datisi datisi datisi i summon thee

what are your thoughts on dunnstral and alimdia?

(also NM are you planning on actually doing something?)

i don't have any aaaaaaaaaa

alright good talk

alright

prooooobably not S/S interacting?

[Iconeum]

i'll give you a cookie if you vote melody

>

votes for me despite having 0 scum reads on me all game, maybe because I was scumreading him earlier? Instead of Melody, who has 3 votes, who he has actually actively scumread most of the day

yeah this is a good point, JV why did you move votes from Melody to Alimdia?

JV is looking like scum here actually
Also probably this is why Melody got Off'ed

[Iconeum]

dp's vote isn't great either

i feel like fark is probably town and i'm just head-butting with him a lot since we have very different ways of approaching the game

nm is gut-pinging me as town but i couldn't articulate this at all

this is pretty much what i'm feeling about Fark now

[Iconeum]

VOTE: melody

This came at a time where Alim and Aldus were both at L-3, with Skitter being on Alim. I don't see why scum!skitter would move away to another wagon that doesn't directly help scum!aldus out

[Iconeum]

I think massclaim on D3 is probably a good idea, and we need to sort JV.
Not willing to go there at this time because Things Need To Happen First.

[Iconeum]

I'm just a PL at this point, oof.

yes it's our policy to lynch scum

My vote is on you in spirit, so you are

technically

at L-1

I'm waiting for DC to pop in and comment first

[Iconeum]

i looked at the last vote count and saw '5' and my brain did a thing

[Iconeum]

nice one

[Iconeum]

weekend vla - extended to include Monday because holidy

[Iconeum]

The bad play may have been fake claiming cop and providing elaborate justifications for your night actions

If scum knew you were fake claiming there's no reason for you to continue fake claiming. People won't believe me if I try to cc on day 3

Also, you pushing me day 1 for doubting your claim is suspect considering you're not the role you said you were

But whatever, I'd probably need to out today regardless; I checked JacksonVirgo, he's town

Good clear

VOTE: donc

[Iconeum]

Haven't read past that and won't until Tuesday

[Iconeum]

you're all waiting on lil old me? lemme catch up 2 secs

this feels just faked and bad vibes overall

[Iconeum]

I think it's fairly apparent that I'm not the cop, and that scum probably figured that out based on the fact that IT WAS A MEME CLAIM that I then ran with

I was planning to out probably tomorrow but maybe the day after with the hope that the real cop would have more results. alternatively, scum has the cop role and that's why they let me fake claim this, or they have a counter to it like rb or jk (but I wouldn't know bc I have no NA)

I claimed CSF because that's actually my most confident TR now and I didn't want to fuck the game up by claiming a fake inno on someone who I thought could plausibly be scum (JV/NM). there was some stuff in CSF ISO that I thought was very, very clearing for them re:aldus!flip so I felt most comfortable putting them off the table for today.

now I know Dunn didn't investigate me, because if he had then he'd be staying shut the fuck up, so I hope he has a red elsewhere because if not then on top of him fishing yesterday this is the worst play in the history of bad plays

if it was a meme claim, you would have dropped it if you were town
they way you are going about this now is far away from using the +town angle and trying to bait the NK which is what I expected you were doing

[Iconeum]

Ok, now that both the "cops" have spoken up, i'll out my thoughts as well:

1) I reread the joint don/dunn ISO, with special regard to 39, 66, 39, 75, 83. It clearly suggests that Dunnstral is actually the real cop, which DonCorleone should have realized when discussing with him - however, he refused to consider the *obvious* possibility that the real cop would have crumbed at that point, instead went against the gamestate by insisting on lynching dunnstral. Today, he went ahead and claimed a inno on CSF and then retracted his cop claim. This is anti-town play from DonCorleone - especially if he's PGO because he doesn't show any concern for town powers that could have targeted him.
2) Dunnstral shouldn't have outed today with a green check, instead he should have tried to get JV to talk more and only later divert the wagon if it happened to be on JV or Dunn himself. There was no reason to believe Dunn would die N2 given the premises. This is also anti-town play from Dunn.
3) VCA (1238) is terrible for both the players involved, by which i assume at least one of them is scum, but i wouldn't rule out both.
4) Regardless of the truth behind these claims, i think both CSF and JV are plausibly conftown now, because a town cop wouldn't lie and scum probably wouldn't out their partner in a fakeclaim.

Conclusion:

we should never, EVER lynch outside of the two claims today. I'm much more inclined to lynch DonCorleone now, but seriously we should

NOT

let both players alive. It would lead to a terrible gamestate in the following days which i don't want to cope with. Dunnstral (the likely true cop) should be healed and produce results until lylo-1, then lynched to verify the results and proceed accordingly. If he happens to get both reds before lylo, even better.

There are two possible roleblockers and two possible protectives in effect (doctor/roleblocker and jailkeeper), although they cannot all exist at the same time. The jailkeeper slot should claim today, even if he picked tracker. The roleblocker is mutually exclusive to doctor, so if dunnstral dies tonight we will know where to lynch, otherwise we gain cop results. If the jailkeeper slot won't claim, we know it's likely scum.

Explanation:

if a doctor exists, dunnstral cannot die unless improbable shenanigans. If dunnstral claims blocked, we lynch the jailkeeper.

Math:

assuming we don't lynch scum until 5p lylo (or 6p mylo), we can afford 3 mislynches which is more than enough to test this theory. If this isn't autosolve, it's very close.

-Farkran

i'm right with this
and i'm not lynching dunn

[Iconeum]

Dc you really should not have done that. It sounded like a fake-claim, especially the checking csf bit
I think they're both town despite that tho

Fark i dont get the benefit of having jk claim but not the doc/rb slot

VOTE: datisi

if donC flips scum, we are lynching you next I think

[Iconeum]

Vote Count 1.Final

Alduskkel (8)

- Melody, Cat Scratch Fever, Not_Mafia (Brassherad), Iconeum, Skitter30, Farkset, Datisi, DoctorPepper

Melody (3)

- Alduskkel, Doctor Drew, JacksonVirgo

Alimdia (1)

- DonCorleone,

Not_mafia (1)

- Almidia

Doctor Pepper (1)

- Dunnstral

Not Voting (0):
With 14 Alive, 8 Votes To Lynch.

Deadline is in: (expired on 2020-05-27 08:00:00)

VCA anyone?

incredibly unlikely that ALL scum are gonna have bussed there.
that leaves a pool of (Drew, DonC, Alim)
with aldus flipping scum, JV being cleared, and dunn's claim.

In that pool I'm Always lynching DonC and i'd lynch it even if it was just for policy.

[Iconeum]

I'd still much rather lynch doncorleone today. I don't want him anywhere near lylo.

ok
dc is scum fake-claiming cop ... what does he think the real cop is going to do ... not check him? is he just gambling from like p2 that there isn't a cop?

walk me through what scum!dc is thinking all game

ehhhhhhh
hmmmmm

i mean, cop *didn't* check him but...
i see

[Iconeum]

DC retracts claim, Dunn has green check. We still don't lynch DC because he is probably town for the play in the first place.

The bad play may have been fake claiming cop and providing elaborate justifications for your night actions

If scum knew you were fake claiming there's no reason for you to continue fake claiming. People won't believe me if I try to cc on day 3

Also, you pushing me day 1 for doubting your claim is suspect considering you're not the role you said you were

But whatever, I'd probably need to out today regardless; I checked JacksonVirgo, he's town

Good clear

VOTE: donc

What happened here?

I said 'is probably town *for the play* in the first place'.
Had a completely different play then 'lOl iT waS a MemE' in mind

[Iconeum]

ok i'm caught up and i'm exactly nowhere with my reads

a lot more unsure about donC scum now then during my very quick weekend read

definitely see skitter's take about the 'why would scum do that'. there's a chance it's a scum gambit, but it's small i think

however if we decide donC is town, then the lynchbracket I just made gets smaller and stands imo

[Iconeum]

fark do you think the gamestate would improve if i was conftown or *extremely* close to it right now?

[Iconeum]

mea culpa just ignore that post plz

[Iconeum]

VOTE: pepper

[Iconeum]

UNVOTE:

[Iconeum]

Come to think of it, wouldn't scum DonC want to gladiator Dunn today for the real cop claim and demand the lynch be between you two?

not really

scum!donc would play it exactly like this. He gets away without being hard scumread for the claim, and scum have a nice and clean N2 cop kill pending protects. Gladiating means even if donc wins it today, he gets lynched on the spot tomorrow for the same benefit.

town!donc would also play it like this, which is why it's impossible to put him anywhere based on his actions. That meme claim is terrible for town because it forces out the cop claim, but it's just not *quite* scum indicative. Would definitely still policy lynch for fake claiming as town. Have done so in the past with 0 regrets.

[Iconeum]

i'm fine with lynching DonC here based on PoE, and give Pepper a night to try and perform his action. His claim isn't necesarilly town, but there's no harm in not lynching him today.

[Iconeum]

VOTE: donC

[Iconeum]

i know i've been flip flopping a lot even for my own standards, but it's just really hard putting donC on anything here.
lynching him will clear up the pool outside of the lynch, and give a pontential PR time to act.

[Iconeum]

I'd really rather not lynch Aldus and would swing for farm over melody

But hey, deadline

VOTE: Aldus

rereading his hammer on scum

actually this post alone is probably enough to give him at least another night combined with his claim

what scum is gonna say they rather not lynch their buddy and then proceed to hammer their buddy in the same post? that mindset mostly comes from town imo

[Iconeum]

I'd really rather not lynch Aldus and would swing for farm over melody

But hey, deadline

VOTE: Aldus

rereading his hammer on scum

actually this post alone is probably enough to give him at least another night combined with his claim

what scum is gonna say they rather not lynch their buddy and then proceed to hammer their buddy in the same post? that mindset mostly comes from town imo

Oh now you think that's a townie post??

i don't think i've ever said something about that post?

[Iconeum]

if datisi is scum it's probably not with either of pepper or DonC based on their interactions

and i think there's scum in pepper or DonC so… yay

[Iconeum]

if you wanna lynch DrP you'll have my support

let's see how serious you are about that solve then

that post was ugly

ok

[Iconeum]

I am the first in the draft and I'm cleared by the Cop. Does that mean I'll likely die tonight, and if so should I claim? uwu I'm cit

claiming would only make it easier for scum to decide if they wanna kill you are the claimed cop
unless you have a usefull result, withholding your claim is probably best today

if you die we'll know it and if ur alive you can claim tomorrow if it's beneficial

[Iconeum]

i would much rather flip donc and not have to deal with the wifom around his play anymore then lynch NM

[Iconeum]

I don't really love that so many people are being allowed to claim "a role" and then retract the next day

you mean like that 1 dude who claimed cop and then retracted it the next day?

[Iconeum]

cum!donc would play it exactly like this. He gets away without being hard scumread for the claim, and scum have a nice and clean N2 cop kill pending protects. Gladiating means even if donc wins it today, he gets lynched on the spot tomorrow for the same benefit.

only this disregards that scum!me would have to gamble on dunn not having investigated me (a likely outcome and what I was counting on happening from the real cop) in which case me NOT gladiating him as scum would lead to me getting auto-lynched without even buying an extra NK

either you are town who fakeclaimed cop, which is policy lynch worthy in itself

or you are scum with dunn
or you are a commuter (tho unlikely given the claim today), and if you are then it's a scum!commuter because town wouldn't do that lol
or you are a scum 1-shot PGO who was gambling to getting investigated by the actual cop

take your pick

[Iconeum]

To play Devil's Advocate, could equally be likely that it could be town trying to draw out scum.

Town PGO*

[Iconeum]

tho, if it's a town gambit you do risk drawing in a cop check a lot of the times, which probably makes it a terrible gambit anyways

[Iconeum]

man my ico tr has kinda dissipated and i think i tr dp now too

i really don't know where to vote

cool story and you've been slowly trying to get rid of your tr on me for a while now (is how i feel)

why don't you back it up with something?

[Iconeum]

can someone reference the actual game please?

i remember some shenanigans with menal but a game ref would be nice thx

[Iconeum]

Ico, care to refute the meta read?

i'd like to see actual source material first if that's ok

[Iconeum]

ok i've read that game in iso and a part with menal and i think my stance on policy lynch is EXTREMELY clear so I don't know why you bring that up against me?

[Iconeum]

i've had a huge shitfest with menal over his fakeclaim and hard pushed for his lynch. it took other players and a weekend brake to get me out of that tunnel and after that I townread menal

that doesn't mean I'm against policy lynching fake claims?

Tha

[Iconeum]

*that game proves that I'm strongly in favour of policy lynching fake claims

[Iconeum]

man my ico tr has kinda dissipated and i think i tr dp now too

i really don't know where to vote

cool story and you've been slowly trying to get rid of your tr on me for a while now (is how i feel)

why don't you back it up with something?

i mean:
- i've been rethinking the read in light of the flip + rereading the bits that made me townread you and realized that in light of a scumflip it's not good reasoning for a townread
- i don't think i can lynch you in the next 3 hours
- you've been co-opting my opinions for a while now so i'm nervous that if i'm wrong you're just using me to push your own agenda
- why are you shading me?

not actively trying to shade you, i get like this when people do to me what you are doing to me here

[Iconeum]

IIRC menalq repped out but his slot went to endgame

[Iconeum]

it's fairly easy for me to get a townread on people that i know/like even after such an ugly back and forth
i'm sure *stuff* happened in that game that helped me get there, and i'm obvioulsy not feeling like that here

if it were up to me, menal would have 100% been lynched on the spot in that referenced game which should be clear if you read it

[Iconeum]

menal repped out two hours before the game ended so like

it was his slot 95% of the time

and he was never lynched

wouldn't pro policy lynch state be "lynch him anyway despite TRing him"?

ok

i feel the core of this conversation is getting lost

anyone who is trying to use that game as a meta counter to me pushing DonC lynch here, read the game. It should be the exact opposite as it shows how strongly I pushed the lynch on menal

[Iconeum]

also i have a bout 5-10 more minutes today

[Iconeum]

hey DonC you should try and counter my counter to your crap meta argument

[Iconeum]

i'll be making my final statements now

Ya'll be damn sure you can townread DonC tomorrow if i'm the lynch. Because if this debate is to repeat itself, you better lynch him today. Either DonC is scum, or scum are here helping to push away from his lynch because they want him in LyLo now.

Going back and arguing about DonC should not be done tomorrow. And I know that if i'm alive and DonC was not the lynch, I will probably not trust him. So better lynch me today in that case.

[Iconeum]

Subject: Newbie 1989 (Game over!)

This sequence seems to me a strong indicator of town mentality.

i was liking his recent posts from 72off

how do you feel about about a current townblock consisting of clidd/ico/walrus/atari/72?

this is a strong basis

Subject: Newbie 1989 (Game over!)

oh and menal probably too

damn i have a lot of townreads

if this game is solved in doobie/lootz/Elmo this is pretty neat

you were calling mena part of your townbloc by the end of D1 despite him having CC'd a role you had rather than just having fakeclaimed a role in the game

so you're very much capable of re-evaluating, and you're not just not doing that here, you're not interested in doing that here. in that game, you checked yourself, said you'd see what other slots thought, and then looked again. here, you haven't done that at all and in fact you've been outright ignoring the two conf!town slots saying that they don't think I'm scum/don't want to Lynch me to pursue the policy argument

have you considered that maybe menal actually *did things* to make me reconsider? and that you havent?

[Iconeum]

you were calling mena part of your townbloc by the end of D1 despite him having CC'd a role you had rather than just having fakeclaimed a role in the gameso you're very much capable of re-evaluating, and you're not just not doing that here, you're not interested in doing that here. in that game, you checked yourself, said you'd see what other slots thought, and then looked again. here, you haven't done that at all and in fact you've been outright ignoring the two conf!town slots saying that they don't think I'm scum/don't want to Lynch me to pursue the policy argument

it's a very bad take to meta argue that i've pushed for a policy lynch once, and got around to townreading that person by the end of the day and therefore I HAVE to be doing the same here or i'm scum. Am I capable of reassessing? Sure I like to believe that.

have you given reasons to be called town by now? No i don't think so. Somehow it's proof that I'm scum to you

[Iconeum]

Ya'll be damn sure you can townread DonC tomorrow if i'm the lynch. Because if this debate is to repeat itself, you better lynch him today. Either DonC is scum, or scum are here helping to push away from his lynch because they want him in LyLo now.

this be the essence of where I will leave you all

If you don't think you can townread DonC tomorrow, lynch him.
If you think he's town, well don't lynch him and do what you will. Just don't start arguing about what he did and if he miiight be scum after all, after this. Now is your chance. Not tomorrow.

Does anyone want me claiming before I leave?

[Iconeum]

weekend vla

[Iconeum]

VOTE: not mafia

came into today with memes about datisi scum

and dunn might be scumm

but this works :p

[Iconeum]

VOTE: not mafia

thank you for believin in me on D2 x

[Iconeum]

Gg everyone, thanks elmo for modding

This was a fun game with a great pl!

ur always scary to play with/against

agreed very fun playerlist and great game and mod etc