open 914: the coalition

[Aventurine]

Hello everyone! It's a pleasure to be playing with you all.

May, #4 made me laugh.

[Aventurine]

I realized just now I could make a witty comment about how you could put me in your pocket, but I didn't think to do that when I made my first post, unfortunately.

[Aventurine]

I won't nominate people who nominate themselves

What’s the purpose of this statement?

[Aventurine]

Or rather, what’s your thought process behind that idea? I’d like it if Moros could also answer this question.

[Aventurine]

Or rather, what’s your thought process behind that idea? I’d like it if Moros could also answer this question.

The better question would've been whether if we would nominate ourselves

Missed opportunities, gambler, missed opportunities

What I’m currently interested in is your thoughts on the theory of the setup, though you could answer that as well, if you like.

[Aventurine]

I might be overthinking it but I think it makes sense to nominate ourselves. A townie that doesn't nominate themselves has a much larger chance of nominating scum. If we all nominate ourselves then they all cancel out and we can each choose 4 other people

I agree with you; self-nomination is generally not going to be indicative of alignment, since it is advantageous for both parties to nominate themself.

[Aventurine]

And this compromise lies in not nominating yourself? Coalition-making is a different process from voting on coalitions.

[Aventurine]

Is choosing not to make that compromise towny or scummy, in your eyes?

[Aventurine]

And this compromise lies in not nominating yourself? Coalition-making is a different process from voting on coalitions.

This is also something to highlight in this setup; mechanically speaking, HEALs are 100% meaningless unless you heal 5 people. Voting for a coalition of 4 players will never actually mechanically contribute to a coalition forming because the day ends when 5 people have all voted for the same 5 people.

This is not to say we oughtn't vote because it's a good way to telegraph an opinion. But votes don't carry the mechanical weight that they do in a normal game of mafia, where voting for a player is putting them one step closer to being eliminated. Even voting for a full coalition doesn't have the same sort of weight because it own't matter unless 4 other people agree on the

exact

same coalition.

Yikes, I’ll see myself out. I

also

misunderstood the setup, since I didn’t really read it in detail; I assumed we were making coalitions first and then voting on several different coalitions. I guess they’re similar, through.

[Aventurine]

Going to take a gamble and say that Umlaut is likely to be town.

[Aventurine]

Going to take a gamble and say that Umlaut is likely to be town.

Why do you consider this a gamble?

I don’t. It’s just that the character thus account is themed after has a gambling addiction so I want to make as make as many references to gambling as possible

[Aventurine]

(He doesn’t actually) (it’s debatable)

[Aventurine]

i agree. i am finding umlaut to be just as or more suspicious than black in this

Do you think we're partnered?

Why do you ask this? Just curious.

[Aventurine]

I’m finding I have this gut feeling about Moros that is generally negative. It’s weird, because I’ve agreed with a lot of the ideas it’s been posting, but I can’t help but feel that there is something wrong here.

[Aventurine]

I'm curious about Moros's thought process

Interesting. Good to know, thanks.

[Aventurine]

I'm not liking Black or Implosion here so far.

[Aventurine]

HEAL: Aventurine, ceejayvinoya, Cutter B, May, Tsawwassen

[Aventurine]

HEAL: Aventurine, ceejayvinoya, Cutter B, May, Tsawwassen

Can you explain your choices

It's less about who I'm including, but rather who I'm excluding.

[Aventurine]

I'm not liking Black or Implosion here so far.

Also I'd like to hear more about this

In a bit.

[Aventurine]

words simply cannot express how voraciously i anticipate aventurine's takes. Each passing minute a torture.

ceejay, care to like, justify any of your takes or give us a sense of where you're at broadly?

Sorry for the wait. I have three tests tomorrow and a paper I need to complete. I'll type out the post sometime on Monday evening.

[Aventurine]

i mean as long as aventurine is nowhere near the coalition am okay

their approach to the game strikes me as unnatural compared to everyone else and I greatly dislike the lack of concrete thoughts coming from that direction

[Aventurine]

HURT: ceejayvinoya, for now

[Aventurine]

Might be misremembering something but I'll come back to that later. Anyway, I've come back to life. Those horrible exams thought they had me, but I'm an academic weapon so I stay on top. Post coming soon.

[Aventurine]

Oh, a pagetop. how pleasant

[Aventurine]

Ceejayvinoya, I made that post on page two.

[Aventurine]

Went to grab a bite and talked to a few friends, I'm back now.
Only two players on my coalition are included deliberately: May and Tsawwassen (spelled correctly?). I included May because she's generally given me good vibes. This is absolutely a read with zero basis behind it, but I'd bet that May is likely town. The inactivity(?) is a bit of a cause for concern on my end. Tsawwassen is a player I am less confident in. I came out of our interaction on page 2 feeling pretty good aside from the questions they literally didn't answer. They've been trying to actively solve, so I think that this is more likely town than not.

On the other hand, there are a few people excluded from my coalition. I'm feeling better about Moros after a day or so of observation, might consider adding it back into my coalition.
I think out of the other three, I'm more actively concerned about Black than Umlaut or Implosion. In fact, Implosion is the towniest of all of the people I excluded. I think Black is very interesting because I'm not quite sure how to read her, but her posts give me this bad gut feeling. For instance, a little while ago, she asked Moros if it thought Umlaut and her were partnered. I think on the surface this is an okay question to make, but when I asked why she asked that question she said that it was because she wanted to know Moros' thought process. This was strange to me initially, but I thought about it a bit more. Asking that is an interesting way to understand thought process. Instead of asking about why Moros felt that way, if she had really wanted to know about Moros' thought process, she instead asks a different question. And later on, she asks me what's wrong with Umlaut and why I didn't include them in my coalition. I think her questions act as a tool to help her surveil, for lack of a better term. I don't know if this is consistent across the board, but these are just two incidents that have stuck out to me.
I don't know if Black is town or not, but I think these posts are weird.
Oh, and also there's Umlaut white knighting Black on page six(?). Implosion is included because I think Umlaut and Black are likely to be paired and if they're not, I'd rather be safe than sorry.

[Aventurine]

thats more of a non answer than an answer

I guess I'll just have to set my expectations low when trying to get through to you

I was literally in the process of typing up a post about it, but okay. I didn't need to provide you an answer when I was already working on one.

[Aventurine]

I do remember a prior post where Moros remarked that someone was looking like they were intentionally trying to look like they didn't want to be townread and that was worrying, and the subject of the post responded to it with something along the lines of "I fail to see how that would be worrying"(?)
The reason why it's worrying is because not trying to be townread is a towntell, but intentionally not trying to be townread looks like you're trying to mimic this towntell and that more likely than not comes from scum

[Aventurine]

I’m finding I have this gut feeling about Moros that is generally negative. It’s weird, because I’ve agreed with a lot of the ideas it’s been posting, but I can’t help but feel that there is something wrong here.

tell me more about this post

Bad vibes

[Aventurine]

actually
HURT: Cutter B HEAL: Moros, ceejayvinoya

[Aventurine]

HURT: ceejayvinoya, for now

Can you explain your thought process when you did this

Was thinking about the post that Moros made and I was pretty sure the response was made by ceejayvinoya but I wasn't too sure so I removed them for now

[Aventurine]

actually
HURT: Cutter B HEAL: Moros, ceejayvinoya

Why didn't you mention ceejay at all in 282? And why are you putting him in over implosion?

Because I couldn't really be bothered to
And I talked about implosion in that post

[Aventurine]

HURT: ceejayvinoya, for now

Can you explain your thought process when you did this

Was thinking about the post that Moros made and I was pretty sure the response was made by ceejayvinoya but I wasn't too sure so I removed them for now

What was it about ceejay's response that you didn't like?

There wasn't a particular reason.

[Aventurine]

Because I couldn't really be bothered to

......? He's the only person you didn't mention

And yeah you talked about implosion but I want to know why you're putting ceejay in over him

Why do you want me to put implosion in my coalition so badly?

[Aventurine]

Wait I'm confused. You took him out of the coalition because you didn't like the response to Moros, but there isn't a particular reason why you don't like it?

There wasn't a particular reason as to why I took him out, but at the time I was thinking of Moros' post and I thought that was vaguely scummy. Upon re evaluation I decided that it wasn't really that bad and slotted him back in.

[Aventurine]

That's a weird interpretation of my question. All I want is for you to explain why you prefer ceejay over him

You've been questioning me about why I've decided to include or not include various people in my coalition or not for a while now. It seems like you think that they're townier or that you think they should be in the coalition for whatever reason.
There isn't an explanation. I just do.

[Aventurine]

for a while now

I feel the need to elaborate that this is hyperbole

[Aventurine]

Wait I'm confused. You took him out of the coalition because you didn't like the response to Moros, but there isn't a particular reason why you don't like it?

There wasn't a particular reason as to why I took him out, but at the time I was thinking of Moros' post and I thought that was vaguely scummy. Upon re evaluation I decided that it wasn't really that bad and slotted him back in.

This doesn't make any sense to me. Did you take ceejay out because he was vaguely scummy or was there no particular reason why you took him out? It can't be both

I think that a gutread counts as a non-concrete reason, for the record.

[Aventurine]

That's a weird interpretation of my question. All I want is for you to explain why you prefer ceejay over him

You've been questioning me about why I've decided to include or not include various people in my coalition or not for a while now. It seems like you think that they're townier or that you think they should be in the coalition for whatever reason.
There isn't an explanation. I just do.

You seem surprised that someone is asking you to explain your reasoning

And I'm not buying that you don't have one. Earlier you said you didn't like Implosion and then just recently you said he was townier than ceejay. Then you put ceejay in over him. If you can't see why that seems sus af idk what to tell you

I don't think I'm particularly surprised or behaving in such a manner.
Okay. Explain to me why my actions are scum-indicative, then. Tell me what I have to gain from these posts.

[Aventurine]

damn

[Aventurine]

I'm probably going about this game wrong. Sorry, Black.
HURT: ceejayvinoya, moros HEAL: black, implosion

[Aventurine]

I do remember a prior post where Moros remarked that someone was looking like they were intentionally trying to look like they didn't want to be townread and that was worrying, and the subject of the post responded to it with something along the lines of "I fail to see how that would be worrying"(?)
The reason why it's worrying is because not trying to be townread is a towntell, but intentionally not trying to be townread looks like you're trying to mimic this towntell and that more likely than not comes from scum

isn't it easier to just aim to get townread than to go through this? I don't get it but okay I guess

I'm literally answering the question that you posed

[Aventurine]

wait nvm I misunderstood it

[Aventurine]

my bad

[Aventurine]

I really wouldn't like to add Aventurine to the coalition. It would be annoying later if this doesn't work out and we have to figure out if he's scum or town

that's just me though

I agree with this, actually

[Aventurine]

Personally I would want to get an instawin but if it isn't the game would instnatly become really annoying

[Aventurine]

Not really sure that scum makes that sudden of a post here very frequently especially before I made my post clarifying that I don't scumread it.

Yes, but I'm likely wrong here. Generally I like to throw myself at anything at all and push that until I'm done tunnelling. Clearly it isn't the right approach for this game. I think you're just right here and I'm willing to trust your judgemetn

[Aventurine]

I'm probably going about this game wrong. Sorry, Black.
HURT: ceejayvinoya, moros HEAL: black, implosion

I don't think you need to apologize

I'm not sure what to make of this

I'm apologizing because it's lousy play on my end

[Aventurine]

My defense about the ceejay coalition thing is mostly just that I felt like it.

[Aventurine]

HURT: May HEAL: Moros

[Aventurine]

In my current coalition, I feel the worst about Tsawwassen. Not that I feel bad about Tsawwassen, I’m just the least confident on that end.

[Aventurine]

If ceejayvinoya is town I’m fairly certain the scum pair might be Cutter B and Tsawwassen but this has no basis, I was just looking at the current coalitions

[Aventurine]

In my current coalition, I feel the worst about Tsawwassen. Not that I feel bad about Tsawwassen, I’m just the least confident on that end.

Do you think Implosion and I are town now?

Yes

[Aventurine]

Wow!!!! I haven't messaged you all since last month!!!
Anyways, catch up soon. I saw this gif and I remembered that this game existed.

Spoiler:

[Aventurine]

wait I'm stupid, I literally posted yesterday.

[Aventurine]

Nevermind. Ignore me.

[Aventurine]

In my current coalition, I feel the worst about Tsawwassen. Not that I feel bad about Tsawwassen, I’m just the least confident on that end.

Do you think Implosion and I are town now?

Yes

Would you mind going into your thought process a little there

I'm convinced by Implosion's posts and I think I'm willing to believe that you're town here, and so by extension I'm willing to put implosion into the coalition because they have generally shown town traits, and was only excluded to begin with because I scumread you.

[Aventurine]

Also I don't think you and implosion are partnered anymore tbh

[Aventurine]

I'm pocketed. Sorry to anyone who wanted the spot in the coalition thats going to aventurine

[Aventurine]

HURT: Tsawwassen tbh

[Aventurine]

not feeling too good today. gonna be busy this weekend v/la until 5/6

[Aventurine]

HURT: All

[Aventurine]

Aventurine seems very appeasy

The double pivot looks bad. It's just less likely for two reads to organically flip compared to 1 but 2 slot changes isnt as coincidental for scum air traffic controlling pressure.

yeah tend to agree. I know it's not like super intuitive to pivot your reads as scum, but Aventurine has been coasting and posting spicy reads, couldn't explain said spicy reads, posted over-explaining uninteresting reads nobody had asked about, proved a lack of conviction in any of the original interesting reads, all while citing real life reasons for not playing the game DESPITE apparently being engaged enough to have fairly convoluted thoughts on fairly straightforward aspects of the game

the fallout from that conversation for me is that Ave doesn't have reads but is fairly happy to be whatever implo & Black pressured Ave to be

I feel bad for this but I just think Ave kind of got pressured past the point Ave expected to get pressured and floundered and that's what we're seeing

this is a pretty apt description of what happened, actually. generally i will have time to do a quick once-over of the game, but not enough to actually read & analyze it nor to post

[Aventurine]

HURT: ceejayvinoya, for now

Can you explain your thought process when you did this

Was thinking about the post that Moros made and I was pretty sure the response was made by ceejayvinoya but I wasn't too sure so I removed them for now

but the reaponse was by ceejay and then you put ceejay back in the coalition. why?

i genuinely do not remember

[Aventurine]

I don't have time to read. I'm okay if I'm not in coalition, I trust your (plural) judgement.

[Aventurine]

I don't have time to read. I'm okay if I'm not in coalition, I trust your (plural) judgement.

Having not read, have the opinions you've most recently expressed evolved over time at all?

Not really. I feel passive about most of the people in this game. If the coalition fails, I'll reread and reevaluate the game.

[Aventurine]

I have to head out for the evening but it looks like we have 1 day and 7 hours left on the deadline. It's crunch time. Everyone needs to start thinking about compromising a little

Moros, implosion and I seem to agree on: Black, May, tired person, Moros, implosion

worst is ok with it as well, which makes 4 supporters. We need one more supporter for this to go through. If we can't find one then we need to figure out what we should adjust

i gotchu

[Aventurine]

Aventurine turned into a fine mist when called out on slowly evaporating

real

[Aventurine]

Lovely. Are we playing normal mafia now?

[Aventurine]

VOTE: Moros, until I get caught up.

[Aventurine]

VOTE: Moros, until I get caught up.

Why vote before you're caught up?

Why not?

[Aventurine]

I just feel like it makes more sense to get caught up and then place a vote

Why Moros?

It is one of the five coalition members. Will "idk i felt like it" suffice as a response?

[Aventurine]

Aventurine's Moros vote makes perfect sense idc about what alignment it is rn

Why do you say this?

[Aventurine]

Aventurine's Moros vote makes perfect sense idc about what alignment it is rn

Why do you say this?

It's just a vanilla mafia game with public info know about groups of players' alignments. Voting in a group of players which is guaranteed to have scum is smart. Moros is a wagon which means voting there is a positive thing. Being caught up is nice but it's not necessary to place a vote.

Also much lower urgency around sorting u in this stage of the day. That's less salient though I just don't think you voting before catching up is either confusing or useful to talk about.

I like this post.